Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Swamp Sensei]

Here's a question: If you could ask Sakurai any single question about any one Smash game, what would you ask him?

I want to know what the heck happened with Rhythm Heaven during Smash 4.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

-Bring back the Smash Run map as a Battle Royal. (64 players teleport in. Players run around killing creeps and collecting upgrades. Map shrinks over time. Last 4 surviving players have a Smash match.)

This one actually sounds pretty fun as a mode.

I've wondered how the battle royals could fit into Smash considered it's technically a battle royale already just on a much smaller scale.

Wii U Classic Mode has something like this in mind as well. It should in return in some way shape or form like your idea

 

[Capybara Gaming]

Have you ever seen a , boxing match , with lots of jumping ?

again common sense.



feels like you are the troll.

no evidence.

claims which go against natural reasoning.

Lmao imagine calling Swamp a troll

Dawg you're surrounded by site veterans that have been speculating Smash since you were in diapers, mind your elders and take the L

 

[Wunderwaft]

Moving on from all the controversial stuff, how about a brand new topic.

Typically Smash has been Nintendo oriented, but Ultimate in particular added a ton of third party characters and franchises.

Do you think future Smash games will be more Nintendo oriented or do you think the series will become more third party oriented as it continues?

I think the next game will follow a similair trend like Ultimate, with the base game focusing more on first parties while the DLC will focus more on third parties. I expect like two or three third parties in the base game while the on the DLC side I'll expect the same amount for first parties.

 

[Momotsuki]

Speaking of Wii U Classic Mode, Master Core is one of my favorite video game bosses ever - certainly my favorite Smash boss - and I'd love to see it return.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

I think if EiH is not possible for fighters then at least do it for bosses.

I would most bosses from Brawl to Ult to return.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Speaking of Wii U Classic Mode, Master Core is one of my favorite video game bosses ever - certainly my favorite Smash boss - and I'd love to see it return.

I actually love how the different forms interact with Final Destination. Things like Master Giant lifting up the stage or Master Beast slamming the stage so hard that it tilts was amazing. I love it when bosses use the arena like that.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Here's a question: If you could ask Sakurai any single question about any one Smash game, what would you ask him?

Either:

what would Smash 4’s story have looked like?

or

Were you (him) planning to add spirits for Blast Corps and Jet Force Gemini at one point? (There is scrapped data for those series, likely for either music or spirits)

 

[Momotsuki]

I actually love how the different forms interact with Final Destination. Things like Master Giant lifting up the stage or Master Beast slamming the stage so hard that it tilts was amazing. I love it when bosses use the arena like that.

And thematically too, it's just so jarring in the best possible way. What even is it? Why is it inside Master Hand? The fact that Crazy Hand nopes out almost makes me think it was actually impersonating Master Hand, having even fooled his own brother up to that point. And from there, absolutely nothing is explained or elaborated upon, and you're left to survive the onslaught of Swarm and plunder deep into the abyssal organs of a being that seems to almost warp the very concept of being around itself.

Had Smash for had a coherent story I honestly think Master Core wouldn't have hit nearly as hard in terms of thematic punch. Its existence is inexplicable and unexplained, and that makes it so much cooler.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Here's a question: If you could ask Sakurai any single question about any one Smash game, what would you ask him?

Who was the most notable character you tried to get for Ultimate that didn't work out?

 

[chocolatejr9]

The FTC's request for injunctive relief has been denied.

After today, Microsoft are now free to close the deal and acquire Activision-Blizzard, as long as things go well between them and UK CMA. pic.twitter.com/ZIsKBVFSAB

— Xbox News (not affiliated with Microsoft) (@All_Xbox_news) July 14, 2023

Welp, guess the deal's as good as done then. Microsoft's about to get a LOT more reps in Smash talks...

 

[MasterCheef]

Lmao imagine calling Swamp a troll

Dawg you're surrounded by site veterans that have been speculating Smash since you were in diapers, mind your elders and take the L

LoL , i am probably older than you.

Also what does being a , veteran , have to with , common sense , or being a , troll , or even just being plain respectful ?

seeing as you are not being respectful.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Speaking of Wii U Classic Mode, Master Core is one of my favorite video game bosses ever - certainly my favorite Smash boss - and I'd love to see it return.

The Master Fortress section was really great, but it just made me wish we had a normal Adventure Mode with platforming like in Melee and Subspace Emissary in Brawl. On that note, I hope the spirit gimmick is ditched in the next game for something better, the single player in ult was servicable but it doesn't replace the single player modes we had in Melee and Brawl.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Were you (him) planning to add spirits for Blast Corps and Jet Force Gemini at one point? (There is scrapped data for those series, likely for either music or spirits)

If i remember right he wasnt in charge of picking spirits, so i doubt it.

I think the data was there because the people in charge of picking spirits didnt know Nintendo doesnt own those anymore

 

[DarthEnderX]

Speaking of Wii U Classic Mode, Master Core is one of my favorite video game bosses ever - certainly my favorite Smash boss - and I'd love to see it return.

I dislike all of the Smash OC bosses. Give me the real bosses from actual video game series.

 

[Momotsuki]

I dislike all of the Smash OC bosses. Give me the real bosses from actual video game series.

That's cool. I like them, though.

 

[SPEN18]

Moving on from all the controversial stuff, how about a brand new topic.

Typically Smash has been Nintendo oriented, but Ultimate in particular added a ton of third party characters and franchises.

Do you think future Smash games will be more Nintendo oriented or do you think the series will become more third party oriented as it continues?

My answer is inevitably biased, but I find it hard to see it skewing even more third party than Ult.

Remember that in base 4, there were only 3 third parties in like a 50-character roster. Even Ult had only 8 uniques out of like 70 characters, and it may not have even been that many had EiH not been a top priority, or even doable to begin with. That's our precedent for a base game.

The history of the base game, even thru Ult, suggests that at least base will continue to be almost entirely first party newcomers. There will likely only be 1-2 spots for third party newcomers in base, consistent with what we've always had.

I don't see any reason why these trends would change, as we've already noted a marked difference in the way DLC reps are handled vs. base game spots.

They only have so much budget that can or should be realistically spent on licensing costs which can't be recouped from extra DLC purchases. It's not incidental that they have stuck to being relatively tame when it comes to third parties in the base game.

The numbers/resources game, the negotiation realities, and the points I brought up above suggest that some third party vets won't make it into the next base game, and so any DLC spots spent on third parties would likely be bringing the number of third parties closer to where it was rather than going beyond what it was.

 

[TheLamerGamer]

Moving on from all the controversial stuff, how about a brand new topic.

Typically Smash has been Nintendo oriented, but Ultimate in particular added a ton of third party characters and franchises.

Do you think future Smash games will be more Nintendo oriented or do you think the series will become more third party oriented as it continues?

I think there'll probably be more third-party newcomers, but a smaller percentage of them will consistently return than first party characters. So most of the major first parties will return in every game, but the third party cast will mostly change each game.

If the next game is an ultimate deluxe I could easily see it focusing more on third parties purely because of how much negotiation there would have to be to even get a straight port, and there's no way they wouldn't at least discuss new characters during that.

But maybe that's wishful thinking, since I definitely prefer third party newcomers for the most part.

 

[Wonder Smash]

Here's a question: If you could ask Sakurai any single question about any one Smash game, what would you ask him?

Since Nintendo works so closely with Koei Tecmo, were there any plans to get one of their characters in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate?

(Just want to say, I still don't believe that neither company tried to make that happen. Something must have fell through.)

 

[SPEN18]

I've typically found the Smash OC bosses to be inoffensive, though I'd much rather have bosses based on preexisting characters, yeah.

I kind of like the idea of the final boss being an OC tho. If for no reason other than it seeming weird to play favorites by declaring a preexisting character the unequivocal biggest bad of all Nintendodom.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

Moving on from all the controversial stuff, how about a brand new topic.

Typically Smash has been Nintendo oriented, but Ultimate in particular added a ton of third party characters and franchises.

Do you think future Smash games will be more Nintendo oriented or do you think the series will become more third party oriented as it continues?

I think purely for logistical reasons we will never end up with more than a 50/50 split for first and third parties.

I think DLC is always going to favor Third Parties and promotional picks for Nintendo when it comes to new characters. In both Smash 4 and Ultimate, third parties were in the majority when it came to newcomers. I think the base game is where first parties are just going to end up thriving. The rosters for the base game tend to put a focus on representing the last system and filling in the "holes" that came about as time went by. Think of how Smash 4 was a laundry list of Wii/DS/3DS success stories, or how almost every newcomer in Brawl was in the spotlight or slated to be by 2005, when development began.

If you wanted a list of first party picks I think would be on the shortlist for the Switch era, here you go. I'll also throw on a few fan favorites too.

• Pauline
• King Boo
• Captain Toad
• Waluigi
• Dixie Kong
• Ashley
• Tears of the Kingdom Ganondorf
• Skull Kid
• Impa
• Raven Beak
• Bandana Dee
• A Gen IX Pokemon
• A Gen VIII Pokemon
• Alear
• Noah
• Mio
• Tom Nook
• Octolings
• Andy
• Ring Fit Trainee
• Dragaux
• Officer Howard
• Takamaru
• A Rhythm Heaven Rep
• Isaac

It's not going to be hard to choose less than a dozen first party characters to represent the switch, even if you have one or two spots in there for fan favorites. I think the base roster will mainly have characters like that, regardless of whether its Ultimate Deluxe or Smash 6. You can easily make a Smash newcomer roster picking names from a list like this (mine is a bit on the conservative side, keep that in mind). If you wanted a guess of how many first party newcoemr sI would guess, somewhere between 6 and 12 for the base game.

As for third parties, you will probably see at least one popular one in the base game, although I would not rule out two. I think depending on the number of characters we would see 1 to 3 third parties in the base game. I would expect DLC to have a 2/3 bend toward third parties, similar to what Ultimate had.

 

[Momotsuki]

I could gush about Giga Bowser's execution as a boss in Melee, and sooner or later I'm going to (TL;DR he's an absolutely brilliant combination of familiar, esoteric and an almost childlike blank-filling imagination, like a childhood nightmare come to life) but I'm curious about how the people that don't like "Smash OCs" feel about him or potentially future bosses in the same vein as him.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

I feel that OC bosses work better than OC enemies. With the former, them as the unnatural disruption to the worlds of the Nintendo multiverse can work.

But if I'm battling various enemies consistently, than yeah they should be those from various first or third party series.

 

[Wunderwaft]

While I absolutely want TotK Ganondorf to be added as our Ganondorf for the next game, part of me is conflicted on the fact that the Zelda series will continue to only have the triforce wielders as playable fighters. I really doubt we will get a second Zelda character except for maybe Zelda getting a TotK revamp, as that will be the game that the representation for Zelda will focus on the most for new content, so it's looking grim for characters like Midna and Skull Kid who are undoubtly popular within the Zelda fandom.

 

[HyperSomari64]

I could gush about Giga Bowser's execution as a boss in Melee, and sooner or later I'm going to (TL;DR he's an absolutely brilliant combination of familiar, esoteric and an almost childlike blank-filling imagination, like a childhood nightmare come to life) but I'm curious about how the people that don't like "Smash OCs" feel about him or potentially future bosses in the same vein as him.

Replace Giga with Fury Bowser and Nintendo says that the former is a literal product of our imagination rather then Sakurai's own childhood.

 

[TCT~Phantom]

While I absolutely want TotK Ganondorf to be added as our Ganondorf for the next game, part of me is conflicted on the fact that the Zelda series will continue to only have the triforce wielders as playable fighters. I really doubt we will get a second Zelda character except for maybe Zelda getting a TotK revamp, so it's looking grim for characters like Midna and Skull Kid who are undoubtly popular within the Zelda fandom.

Would I like something like Skull Kid or Midna? Sure, but right now it does feel that the development team is prioritizing recurring characters, which are predominantly Triforce wielders. I could easily see them keeping our Ganondorf, as divisive as he is, and just adding "Demon King Ganondorf" as his own character to let people have their cake and eat it too.

I'd love to be wrong and get Skull Kid. He would be a ton of fun and super unique. But I feel Demon King Ganon is the path of least resistance.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Would I like something like Skull Kid or Midna? Sure, but right now it does feel that the development team is prioritizing recurring characters, which are predominantly Triforce wielders. I could easily see them keeping our Ganondorf, as divisive as he is, and just adding "Demon King Ganondorf" as his own character to let people have their cake and eat it too.

I'd love to be wrong and get Skull Kid. He would be a ton of fun and super unique. But I feel Demon King Ganon is the path of least resistance.

I mean of course, I legitimately see no way that TotK Ganondorf will get outpriotized by any other Zelda newcomer. I still strongly think it's gonna be a revamp rather than putting in both Ganons, especially since falcondorf has been one of the most criticized implementations of any character in Smash history. Considering how limited the time and resources will be for the next game with how gargantuan Ultimate's roster already is, I will be questioning the logic of the Smash team if there are any notable cuts and we end up with two Ganondorfs.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Ive probably pissed off many of the biggest Zelda diehards on the planet with my opiion on newcomers.

I will piss them off more by saying i dont mind Ganondorf staying the same, i never saw that big of a problem with him

 

[SPEN18]

Speaking of Skull Kid, how aware of his popularity do we think they are?

So far we have (1) likely a strong ballot performance but probably not on, say, Isaac levels; and (2) an explosion during the leadup to base Ult, which unfortunately culminated in the return of his AT (and probably not as strong a reaction to the AT as Isaac or Waluigi illicited).

I am certainly rooting for Skull Kid. I think he and Impa are the most overdue Zelda newcomers.

 

[Ivander]

Moving on from all the controversial stuff, how about a brand new topic.

Typically Smash has been Nintendo oriented, but Ultimate in particular added a ton of third party characters and franchises.

Do you think future Smash games will be more Nintendo oriented or do you think the series will become more third party oriented as it continues?

I think future Smash games will be more third party oriented compared to Brawl, but probably nowhere near as oriented as Ultimate, since part of Ultimate's focus on third parties was trying to get in choices from the Ballot that people wanted, like Sora, Banjo-Kazooie and Castlevania, you have another part where Nintendo(and Iwata) wanted Minecraft and Dragon Quest and Terry was probably wanted by Sakurai since Fatal Fury was a big deal for Sakurai and a huge influence for Smash Bros.
Kazuya is a bit of an outlier, but has some situations on why he could've been added:

• Could've been a favor and thank-you for Namco who was developing the game.
• Sakurai's love for fighting games, which is quite possible when you remember Akira Yuki is an Assist Trophy and one of the very few 3rd Party Assist Trophies from a 3rd Party series not in Smash with a playable character.
• Possibly a request by Harada, much like Nintendo and Iwata with Minecraft and Dragon Quest.
• Sakurai did consider Heihachi for a player character for Smash 4/5 alongside Pac-Man. So maybe either that was the next Namco series Sakurai wanted or maybe he wanted to try again on making a Tekken character playable.
• Maybe a mix of all of the above.

So, I think future Smash Bros. games will be more 3rd Party oriented on the scale of Smash 4/5. More than Brawl, less than Ultimate. Some I think will stay without much issue, like Capcom, Namco, SNK and Sega. Which leaves Konami, Square Enix, Microsoft and Disney.

• If Microsoft keeps a good relationship with Nintendo, I could see Banjo-Kazooie and Steve staying with little issues.
• Square's in the case where it looks like they want to be part of Smash, but even they have issues with their IPs' copyrights. Because if you read Sakurai's comments regarding their stuff, Square appears quite supportive with Sakurai, like how they helped him with getting Eight and Solo alongside Erdrick and Luminary and helped get him more music for DQ. The big issue just seems to be those copyright issues that even Square seems to have trouble with.
• Konami appears supportive, but we don't exactly know why they passed on Smash 4/5. Castlevania looks like it could stay without much issue. Don't know about Metal Gear.
• Disney is basically a case of, "If Sora comes back, great! If Sora doesn't, it's kinda understandable why."

So it's going to be a tough day when we need to learn which ones come back and which ones don't. But I'm not all too bothered. Not only will I still have Ultimate, but there are still plenty of notable 3rd Parties yet to join Smash, like Monster Hunter, Nier, Phantasy Star, Tales of, Dark Souls/Elden Ring, Undertale, Shantae, etc.
---
It's not a bad thing if the next Smash isn't as 3rd Party oriented as Ultimate. Besides some pretty cool recent Nintendo characters, as well as some older ones still being greatly requested like Isaac, Waluigi, Bandana Dee, etc, I honestly hope they remain open to adding in new Nintendo IPs for characters and stages, as not only do I love learning about them, but also seeing how they are remade and done in Smash Bros.
And Nintendo has a remarkable and colorful cast of characters capable of fitting any visual role and archetype, both from their big IPs and small IPs. But it's so fascinating watching an older and/or unique character get remade for Smash Bros. And I'm still hoping that some like Takamaru, Mach Rider, Dillon, Golden Sun, Astral Chain, Custom Robo, Rhythm Heaven, etc, will one day be able to interact with the cast of Smash Bros. we have now.

 

[Wonder Smash]

alright. I’m sorry for upsetting people

Maybe you should go back and edit your post. Just typing Kazuya shouldn't be a problem, especially at this point.

 

[SPEN18]

Feel like I should add there's no reason we can't get updated Ganondorf and Zelda newcomers.
Like, of all the series to complain about significant resources being poured into...it wouldn't be Zelda.

 

[Geno Boost]

Moving on from all the controversial stuff, how about a brand new topic.

Typically Smash has been Nintendo oriented, but Ultimate in particular added a ton of third party characters and franchises.

Do you think future Smash games will be more Nintendo oriented or do you think the series will become more third party oriented as it continues?

currently ultimate newcomers are this
nintendo reps:
3rd part reps:
55% nintendo reps and 45% 3rd party reps

i think we will get more 3rd party newcomers than nintendo newcomers by the next game especially now that most of nintendo all stars are already playable and smash now seems to shift to gaming all stars instead of Nintendo all stars
but i hope nintendo newcomers are not just forced advertisement picks we are so lucky that we got and sadly we didnt get a new retro rep like

The FTC's request for injunctive relief has been denied.

After today, Microsoft are now free to close the deal and acquire Activision-Blizzard, as long as things go well between them and UK CMA. pic.twitter.com/ZIsKBVFSAB

— Xbox News (not affiliated with Microsoft) (@All_Xbox_news) July 14, 2023

Welp, guess the deal's as good as done then. Microsoft's about to get a LOT more reps in Smash talks...

there is gonna be a lot of wars in the smash community in the next smash game lol
its gonna be steve vs banjo fans all over again

 

[Nabbitfan730]

I could gush about Giga Bowser's execution as a boss in Melee, and sooner or later I'm going to (TL;DR he's an absolutely brilliant combination of familiar, esoteric and an almost childlike blank-filling imagination, like a childhood nightmare come to life) but I'm curious about how the people that don't like "Smash OCs" feel about him or potentially future bosses in the same vein as him.

Yeah, i don't get the contention against Smash's OC. They have great design, give the series bit of mystery whilst fitting of themes of Smash being a world of Imagination. Also there is no bias towards a specific franchises

I feel that OC bosses work better than OC enemies. With the former, them as the unnatural disruption to the worlds of the Nintendo multiverse can work.

But if I'm battling various enemies consistently, than yeah they should be those from various first or third party series.

My thoughts exactly though i do like the designs of the Subspace Army.

 

[Wunderwaft]

Feel like I should add there's no reason we can't get updated Ganondorf and Zelda newcomers.
Like, of all the series to complain about significant resources being poured into...it wouldn't be Zelda.

Realistically there shouldn't be any reason at all, but bizarrely it hasn't happened yet and I think I can suspect why. I love Midna and Skull Kid and would love to see them in Smash, but I can't help but think that the triforce wielders being the only playable fighters is by design from Sakurai and not due to other circumstances. It's been over 20 years since Melee and Smash has skipped over the addition of popular Zelda characters that came with every release even when the game releases were perfectly timed, we've had three Smash releases since then and the only newcomer was Toon Link (another triforce wielder) back in Brawl. If a new director takes control for the next game I'll be hopeful for more Zelda newcomers, but if it's Sakurai again the best I'll expect is a revamped Ganondorf.

 

[MasterCheef]

Realistically there shouldn't be any reason at all, but bizarrely it hasn't happened yet and I think I can suspect why. I love Midna and Skull Kid and would love to see them in Smash, but I can't help but think that the triforce wielders being the only playable fighters is by design from Sakurai and not due to other circumstances. It's been over 20 years since Melee and Smash has skipped over the addition of popular Zelda characters that came with every release even when the game releases were perfectly timed, we've had three Smash releases since then and the only newcomer was Toon Link (another triforce wielder) back in Brawl. If a new director takes control for the next game I'll be hopeful for more Zelda newcomers, but if it's Sakurai again the best I'll expect is a revamped Ganondorf.

I think you are right.
Really want
AoC , Impa
or some combination of the sages. Preferably ; Yunobo & Riju

 

[fogbadge]

Ive probably pissed off many of the biggest Zelda diehards on the planet with my opiion on newcomers.

I will piss them off more by saying i dont mind Ganondorf staying the same, i never saw that big of a problem with him

as THE biggest zelda diehard i can tell you i am not pissed off by this

Maybe you should go back and edit your post. Just typing Kazuya shouldn't be a problem, especially at this point.

Done

 

[Geno Boost]

i dont think falcondorf should be removed just give it to blood falcon and black shadow is better than removing it entirely at least it would make f-zero fans happy

 

[DarthEnderX]

Yeah, i don't get the contention against Smash's OC. They have great design

Is that a joke? WHAT design? The Hands are a pair of plain white gloves. Tabuu is just a generic human model with no features. Master Core is literally just the series logo. All 3 of them feel like they were leftover develpment assets that just got tossed into the game.

Galleem and Dharkon have a LITTLE design to them. But not much. They're both just orbs with some accessories.

i dont think falcondorf should be removed just give it to blood falcon and black shadow is better than removing it entirely at least it would make f-zero fans happy

Give Falcondorf moveset to Black Shadow, then give Ganondorf his own, unique, fitting moveset. Getting rid of the only cross-franchise clone character in Smash.

 

[Stratos]

Takamaru has been put in Super Smash Bros. Brawl as a sticker and in the latter games of Super Smash Bros. as Assist Trophy and Mii costume. I think it's time for him to come to the next Super Smash Bros. game as a new character, besides his own game The Mysterious Murasame Castle, he was also a playable character in Samurai Warriors 3.