Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[LiveStudioAudience]

ANYWAY, I'm happy to report that Nintendo has finally added the SNES Online game we've all been waiting for:

Side Pocket.

Are we certain Nintendo just didn't buy up the assets of Data East and no one noticed?

Ah, and of course Xevious; in Japan known as as the beloved mega popular arcade shooter that influenced countless others and whose eventual port on the Famicom helped take that console to new heights. And in the US known as the subject in the often repeated sentence: "What the hell is Xevious?"

 

[Will]

Idk why y’all are arguing Marth isn’t relevant enough and that’s enough to axe him when he’s like, the base for so many other fighters. He’s the original anime swordfighter. It doesn’t matter if his last non remake game was in 1994. He’s ****ing Marth, Melee’s #1 menace, his gameplay and tipper mechanic is such a pivotal and important piece of Smash as a game.

And y’all wanna toss Yuri Lowenthal in the trash.

yes exactly.

David weeps in his grave like he didn’t carry the first half just to be brushed off as a side character

 

[Isaac: Venus Adept]

It's bad enough that fan requested characters that haven't been relevant for a while are thrown under the bus but what's even worse is actively seeing people wanting to throw out beloved Smash mainstays like Marth and Captain Falcon because 'they aren't relevant anymore'.

Representing legacy franchises and games isn't a bad thing guys....
I feel like Smash works best when it's like a museum for a wide variety of different eras, not just serving as a piece of promotion for just the stuff that's relevant

 

[chocolatejr9]

Are we certain Nintendo just didn't buy up the assets of Data East and no one noticed?

I know you're joking, but at this point I wouldn't blame anybody for thinking that...

Though, is Data East still around? I'm not even sure about that.

 

[Will]

I know you're joking, but at this point I wouldn't blame anybody for thinking that...

Though, is Data East still around? I'm not even sure about that.

They went bankrupt like 20 years ago. Not sure about if any rights were distributed or given to anyone else though

 

[SPEN18]

Idk why y’all are arguing Marth isn’t relevant enough and that’s enough to axe him

what's even worse is actively seeing people wanting to throw out beloved Smash mainstays like Marth

In fairness, the initial context was judging this hypothetical roster someone made with the scenario being "what if the first Smash game was being made today with only 12 characters." I can't speak for anyone else, but the debate wasn't about whether Marth would be retained in a roster with 50+ characters.

 

[chocolatejr9]

They went bankrupt like 20 years ago. Not sure about if any rights were distributed or given to anyone else though

According to Wikipedia, it's... a bit complicated:

• Most stuff went to a mobile game company named G-Mode, who also got the rights to the name "Data East".
• Paon Corporation got some notable stuff, specifically Karnov, Chelnov, Windjammers, Glory of Heracles, and Kuuga.
• Kadokawa Games got Metal Max.
• Arc System Works got Jake Hunter.
• D4 Enterprise got the rights to Data East's Robocop games.
• Everything else went to Tactron Corporation, the asset management company for Data East's founder's family.

So... yeah, just gotta figure out which is which.

 

[Will]

In fairness, the initial context was judging this hypothetical roster someone made with the scenario being "what if the first Smash game was being made today with only 12 characters." I can't speak for anyone else, but the debate wasn't about whether Marth would be retained in a roster with 50+ characters.

If Fire Emblem were to be picked, Marth still, imo. Twelve characters, still gotta have the barebones anime swordsman to set the groundwork for others after him. It isn’t just about characters, but setting them and balancing them in the game.

Id start with a basic tipper man versus a summoner swordsman. However, this is also considering the base game of Smash itself doesn’t change in mechanics.

 

[Guynamednelson]

What the hell is Xevious

The red and green Ferraris in Ridge Racer. Duh?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

very hard to be a main character when they are not alive. no ?

A character being alive or dead has nothing to do with them being a main character or not.

Like... Crono is the main character of Chrono Trigger. He ****ing dies. You don't even have to revive him.

Regardless, MARTH ISN'T DEAD. Emblems are literally spirits living in a ring. He's walking, talking and fighting with the rest of the main cast. He's not a corpse.

 

[Ivander]

David weeps in his grave like he didn’t carry the first half just to be brushed off as a side character

Fits Moses more than David, since Moses was a pretty prominent main with four books compared to David's one and a half and became a side character for a moment in the New Testament.

 

[Sucumbio]

Sir Daniel Fortesque

very hard to be a main character when they are not alive. no ?

Fin.

 

[MasterCheef]

A character being alive or dead has nothing to do with them being a main character or not.

Like... Crono is the main character of Chrono Trigger. He ****ing dies. You don't even have to revive him.

Regardless, MARTH ISN'T DEAD. Emblems are literally spirits living in a ring. He's walking, talking and fighting with the rest of the main cast. He's not a corpse.

ok. buddy. not having a body is literally the definition of dead for a human. this would smell a lot more like magic to me even if the developers don't want to recognize it as such.

 

[SPEN18]

If Fire Emblem were to be picked, Marth still, imo. Twelve characters, still gotta have the barebones anime swordsman to set the groundwork for others after him. It isn’t just about characters, but setting them and balancing them in the game.

Id start with a basic tipper man versus a summoner swordsman. However, this is also considering the base game of Smash itself doesn’t change in mechanics.

I agree that Marth would still be the choice if there was exactly 1 FE slot in a 12-character roster (though for different reasons than him ostensibly working best as a more basic character gameplay-wise). But at least it's more of a debate in the dramatic 12-character scenario, and the folks arguing against me weren't, in my interpretation, saying that they actively want Marth to be cut.

 

[chocolatejr9]

According to Wikipedia, it's... a bit complicated:

• Most stuff went to a mobile game company named G-Mode, who also got the rights to the name "Data East".
• Paon Corporation got some notable stuff, specifically Karnov, Chelnov, Windjammers, Glory of Heracles, and Kuuga.
• Kadokawa Games got Metal Max.
• Arc System Works got Jake Hunter.
• D4 Enterprise got the rights to Data East's Robocop games.
• Everything else went to Tactron Corporation, the asset management company for Data East's founder's family.

So... yeah, just gotta figure out which is which.

Okay, slight update: it turns out Kadokawa sold the rights to Metal Max to CyGames last year, so THEY'RE the ones in charge of that one...

 

[Swamp Sensei]

this would smell a lot more like magic to me even if the developers don't want to recognize it as such.

It is magic?

It's literally a magic ring?

What?

 

[Aaayei]

So once you get a game over in a game 80% of the time, does that mean the game retroactively has no main character now?

 

[Will]

Fits Moses more than David, since Moses was a pretty prominent main with four books compared to David's one and a half and became a side character for a moment in the New Testament.

Joshua is equally part of Moses’s expedition. Can’t forget no one would even be where they were if Ruth didn’t marry Boaz. Underrated book and in general a good story even if you aren’t religious.

**** it, they’re all main characters. Because that’s how the book works.

It is magic?

It's literally a magic ring?

What?

Ignorance is one hell of a drug.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

So once you get a game over in a game 80% of the time, does that mean the game retroactively has no main character now?

Does that mean games where its impossible to die have a main character?

I don't think I've been interpreting Tetris correctly.

 

[Wonder Smash]

I really don't consider any character to be a main one if they are dead. Jesus being one of the few exceptions.

It really doesn't matter what you consider. If a character is the protagonist of the story, then he or she is the main character, dead or not.

 

[osby]

This already stopped being a sensible argument when someone brought up Jesus in a video game debate (that isn't about Xenosaga) unprompted and then never elaborated.

 

[Will]

Does that mean games where its impossible to die have a main character?

I don't think I've been interpreting Tetris correctly.

Do you ”die” if you hit the top of the board in Tetris?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Do you ”die” if you hit the top of the board in Tetris?

Losing does not mean dying.

 

[Will]

I feel like this already stopped being a sensible argument when someone brought up Jesus in a video game debate unprompted and then never elaborated.

I was gonna make a stupid joke about Castlevania or notorious censored Christian imagery for Jesus in Smash and then I got sucked into this rabbit hole over Enix of Square Enix making a Famicom game literally named JESUS in all caps.

JESUS is a space station, shaped like a sword described from the Book of Revelation. Gotta love wacky Japanese computer games. They made a SEQUEL for this btw.

Losing does not mean dying.

What about that one Tetris game that actually has a plot with the pieces?

EDIT: It’s Tetris Worlds that has the plot

 

[Wonder Smash]

This already stopped being a sensible argument when someone brought up Jesus in a video game debate (that isn't about Xenosaga) unprompted and then never elaborated.

It's this MasterCheef dude. He tends to bring up things that has no business being brought up in a video game discussion. He really needs to chill out with that.

 

[Noipoi]

Hey Smashboards

 

[osby]

I was gonna make a stupid joke about Castlevania or notorious censored Christian imagery for Jesus in Smash and then I got sucked into this rabbit hole over Enix of Square Enix making a Famicom game literally named JESUS in all caps.

View attachment 369442

JESUS is a space station, shaped like a sword described from the Book of Revelation. Gotta love wacky Japanese computer games. They made a SEQUEL for this btw.

smh, people should play a real Shin Megami Tensei game if they thought Jesus dies too easily and they want to take their chances with his father.

 

[Perkilator]

I was gonna make a stupid joke about Castlevania or notorious censored Christian imagery for Jesus in Smash and then I got sucked into this rabbit hole over Enix of Square Enix making a Famicom game literally named JESUS in all caps.

View attachment 369442

JESUS is a space station, shaped like a sword described from the Book of Revelation. Gotta love wacky Japanese computer games. They made a SEQUEL for this btw.

I remember Caddy getting confused over this in his Jesus games video, where he mostly played the MSX version.

 

[Wonder Smash]

smh, people should play a real Shin Megami Tensei game if they thought Jesus dies too easily and they want to take their chances with his father.

I was just thinking about Shin Megami Tensei.

I just keep looking at the spirits in Ultimate and I see the Final Fantasy series with its Moogles and Chocobos and then I look at the Dragon Quest series with its Slime.

As popular as Persona is, it's just too bad it can't represent the Shin Megami Tensei series as a whole and therefore, can't bring over its own mascot or recurring characters like Jack Frost and Pixie to Ultimate in some way.

 

[osby]

I was just thinking about Shin Megami Tensei.

I just keep looking at the spirits in Ultimate and I see the Final Fantasy series with its Moogles and Chocobos and then I look at the Dragon Quest series with its Slime.

As popular as Persona is, it's just too bad it can't represent the Shin Megami Tensei series as a whole and therefore, can't bring over it's own mascot or recurring characters like Jack Frost and Pixie to Ultimate in some way.

A small price to pay for people to stop insisting Persona is just an SMT spin-off.

 

[Oracle Link]

IDK what happened, but I hadn't gotten any notifications for this place since Friday. Did I miss anything?

Yes Hilarity everyone TAlked about smash with no fighter and stages!

 

[Oracle Link]

What does that have to do with anything? Plenty of games have dead main characters in them.

That gives me the drive to make this List:
Its of Characters who are dead or just gone at the most current point of their respective game series Timeline!

Spoiler: Spoliers Obviously

Alive
Alive
???
Alive but died Before
Alive
Dead?
Alive?
Dead
Dead?
Alive
Alive
Alive
Alive (Dog) Dead (duck)
Alive
Alive
Dead or atleast Undead
Depends
???
???
Dead
???
Alive
Dead?
Depends
Depends
Alive
Depends
???
Alive could die in tekken 8
Alive
Probably Alive but diffrent persona
Alive
Alive (For Now)
Alive
Depends
Hes Fine i dont know what that means but hes Fine!
Alive
Alive
Dead?
Dead?
Alive
Dead i think?
Depends
Depends
Alive?
Depends
Dead or Fine (You are allowed to think hes Flint by the Creator of Mother/Earthbound)
Alive (Dies in the Bad Ending)
Alive
Alive
Alive
Alive
Depends
Depends
Depends
Alive
Alive
Alive But Older
Alive but Older
Depends
Depends
Depends
Merged with Mythra
Merged With Pyra
Dead i think?
Depends
Dead?
Alive
Dead?
Dead?
Alive but older
Alive but Older
Dead UGH Fine (I hate you tetsuya) Alive in another Timeline Dead in the Og one
Dead?
Alive?
??? (Smash Design of Sheik doesnt exist)OG Sheik Dead
Alive but older
Dead
Dead
Dead?
Alive
Depends
Alive?
Undead
???
Alive
all current Toon Links are Dead but could reapear
Alive
Alive
Alive
Alive
Depends
Dead
Dead
Alive?
Oh Boy That was Difficult
BTW Im not familiar with all franchises i mentioned

 

[Soy_Man]

Never played Fire Emblem, but ever since I vaguely knew about it, I had the impression that Marth WAS Fire Emblem. As in he's the series' biggest and most recognizable character. At least Nintendo seems to prop him up as that. If he's so irrelevant, why do I constantly see him in marketing for modern games like Engage or FE Warriors or Code Name Steam?

 

[fogbadge]

what an odd conversation to stumble into this morning. also all this talk about dead characters and no one brings up auron? or spiritfarer?

 

[Diddy Kong]

Marth is not "relevant" yet he is on the cover of the latest Fire Emblem game... heavily marketed as well. Every other Engage trailer had Marth show up.

Sure, completely irrelevant.

Edit: also if Jesus Christ is considered "dead" in the Bible to some of you, you obviously didn't get the message.

I wanna ram my forehead into my phonescreen cause of this thread. A normal facepalm isn't gonna do it.

FOR THE LOVE OF CHRIST....

 

[Aligo]

Marth is not "relevant" yet he is on the cover of the latest Fire Emblem game... heavily marketed as well. Every other Engage trailer had Marth show up.

Sure, completely irrelevant.

Edit: also if Jesus Christ is considered "dead" in the Bible to some of you, you obviously didn't get the message.

I wanna ram my forehead into my phonescreen cause of this thread. A normal facepalm isn't gonna do it.

FOR THE LOVE OF CHRIST....

Isn't Marth heavily involved in the plot of engage too? (I am pretty sure it is a sequel of shadow dragon or at least uses its continuity correct me if I am wrong).

Also if we use the character can't be dead thing for fighters it means

Spoiler: XC3 ending

Noah is the only eligible character from 3s cast, the rest are deader than doornails they can't nonsense their way out of death like shulk and pythra can due to being ERASED FROM REALITY .

Also the can't be dead thing would exclude like 90% of villains so no. Bad rule.

 

[Sucumbio]

Someone need to checks his controller this is obviously tas.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Let’s get to brass tax, is Marth turning water into wine going to be his main skill in the next Fire Emblem or not?

 

[Aligo]

Let’s get to brass tax, is Marth turning water into wine going to be his main skill in the next Fire Emblem or not?

Marth will counter pick to pirate ship, delfino plaza and tortimer island in the next smash. Make sure to ban these stages if you face him In bracket.

 

[Laniv]

Let’s get to brass tax, is Marth turning water into wine going to be his main skill in the next Fire Emblem or not?

The Greninja matchup is going to be very unbalanced very soon.