Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Gengar84]

The Echoes can at least allow for small differences.

Dixie could still have her hair stuff even as an Echo, it'll simply be less than if she were a full character, with things like carrying heavy items, potentially grabs and throws, maybe one special, etc. while the vast majority of her moveset would still remain Diddy's.

But as a Diddy alt, she would be forced to adhere to Diddy's moveset in its entirety, with no wiggle room for any of her more unique aspects.

There's a fundamental difference between Echo and alt and that's why people generally disagree with ARMS characters as alts but are fine with them as Echoes. Well, they aren't but that's because of how annoying it is to fight Min Min rather than any sense of game accuracy

Fair enough. My problem is that most echoes are essentially glorified alts with their own character select spot. Ken is the exception and not the rule. If you change too much, they end up becoming an Isabelle, Luigi, Falco style semiclone rather than an echo. Plus, Cloud showed that alts can have their own unique aesthetic animations since his AC outfit has a different Final Smash.

My problem with the Dixie echo is partially that I just don’t care much for Diddy’s moveset. Half of his specials are completely made up generic monkey attacks and he only has exactly one move (the peanut gun) that Dixie has ever done anything similar to (the bubble gum gun). I think she deserves more than that. No other Smash character uses their hair as a weapon or recovery so they could play more with that. Plus there’s always the animal buddy or Kiddy tag gimmick they could go with to differentiate her.

 

[ninjahmos]

I think Ken and this moveset of Shadow Mewtwo are both perfect examples of what Echo Fighters should be. They should be similar to the other character while having their own unique quirks and attacks.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

That said, while it's true that there's no Hunter in Teppen, I will mention Astro Bot as a weird case. We only have a Palico Bot in Astro Bot proper, but we do have a group of Bots with giant weapons around a campfire in Astro's Playroom, with no Palico in sight. I don't know why that's the case - Maybe the armor was giving the modeling team grief? - But it's worth noting.

It should be noted that even IF there were Hunter Bots that would still fall completely in line with everything else when it comes to collabs. Which is monsters (usually Rathalos) or armors worn by the other half of the collab, which in this case would be the Bots.


To this day, the only exception is Marvel vs. Capcom Infinite. And whether or not there's a valid source to the claim that it was against the MH devs' wishes, the fact such a claim can even exist and be completely believable regardless of official source with how this original Hunter has never returned since nor any other original Hunter had been used in crossovers is conspicuous as all hell.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I think Ken and this moveset of Shadow Mewtwo are both perfect examples of what Echo Fighters should be. They should be similar to the other character while having their own unique quirks and attacks.

Chrom and Lucina are also very much valid as Echo Fighters.

Making the power consistent rather than having tippers on every move is very major difference that affects every single attack (except down air but honestly, having the entire blade be a spike would be kinda ridiculous)

 

[Truth the Ceomasterz33]

Hello, our fellow members. I'm back. I've had been arrived at this threads. Before arriving at this threads, we has been busy with more focusing as my life at March. I'll explain as why less posts in March. In talks with less posts in March, I have few posts and less focusing at Smashboards in March due more focusing my life at March. On above are off-topic.

I've also before takes my notes from Google Keep's. As an Indonesians and Asia-Pacific/The Pacific representations, we recently as other fellow members been mentioned Genshin Impact at This threads. We speaking about The Pacific/Asia-Pacific reps and briefly talks about mobile MOBAs

We current play as HOK/KOG, AOV and MLBB with my mains as Alessio, Yun Ying, Agudo, Allain, Butterfly, Arthur and other KOG/HOK/AOV characters at playing KOG/HOK/AOV and Edith, Cici, Thamuz, Frederinn, Hanabi, Odette, Aulus, Minotaur and other MLBB chacters at playing as Mobile Legends. P.S. reminds our fellow members for HOK/KOG, Shadow is HOK/KOG and not Shadow from Sonic the Hedgehog!

As since MOBAs fans, we has installed as Mobile Legends, KOG/HOK and AOV at my phones (VIVO Y22). I saw HOK/KOG and AOV has collab with JJK, I also mobile MOBAs has many skins and other collabs with medias. I since KOG/HOK, AOV and Mobile Legends got popular with Southeast Asia and peoples of SEA, I recently mobile MOBAs games has esports at Most Popular SEA countries. In particularly to Philippines, Indonesia, Thailand, Vietnam, Singapore, Malaysia and other SEA countries. As an MOBAs Players, I have skilled MOBAs players with balanced wins and loss and keeps reporting scores.

As well. In me mentions at past my posts. I'll clarifiying as the Pacific games with Mobile MOBAs with most popular with peoples/fans of Asia-Pacific. We clarifies as peoples/fans of The Pacific/Asia-Pacific (In particularly to Indonesia, Thailand, Philippines, Singapore, Vietnam, Malaysia and other SEA countries, India and South Asia, Australia, China, South Korea, New Zealand and other Asia-Pacific countries) has popular Asia-Pacific games with Free Fire, Genshin Impact, HSR, HI3rd and other Honkai/Benghuai/Houkai series, PUBG, Jetpack Joyride, Fruit Ninja and other Halfbrick Games, NIKKE, Blue Archive, Ragnarok, Onmyoji and Netease games, Guardian Tales, Hollow Knights, Untitled Goose Games, Troublemaker, Bloons TD, Ty the Tasmanian Tiger, de Blob and other The Pacific/Asia-Pacific games. Also European, Japanese, American and LATAMs games outside Asia-Pacific games has popular with Asia-Pacific/The Pacific countries and same above but peoples of Europeans, Americans, LATAMs and Japanese has most popular games from The Pacific/Asia-Pacific games.

In regarding as drought of Asia-Pacific/The Pacific Smash fans. I since Smash has no appears an characters from Asia-Pacific/The Pacific games.

If could fans/peoples Asia-Pacific becomes broke internet or reaction at Asia-Pacific countries (In especially to Southeast Asia, China, South Korea, India and South Asia, Australia, New Zealand and other Asia-Pacific). When is Asia-Pacific reps or games appears at Smash or an characters from Asia-Pacific joins Smash.

In thoughts or opinions at this posts?

P.S. In off-topic. I since as have two languages (English and Bahasa Indonesia/Indonesian). I have multi-languages with Luxembourgish, French, German, Dutch, Koreans and Chinese languages. If you or other fellow members have native or learned languages outside English?

 

[BrawlX10]

How are we feeling about Bomberman?

He's an assist trophy and a Mii costume and I feel like he's pretty inoffensive / pleasing to everyone - feels like a major oversight to not have him in, but feel like he's rarely brought up actively. I personally would say he's top 5 / top 10 most likely third-party newcomers.

Decent chance for Base Game, Not-so-likely as DLC.

Bomberman feels like the type of character who would be added as a base game 3rd Party fighter. As DLC, however, I think his chances are not as good. He’s one of those few characters who seems more likely to be in the base game than as DLC to me. While some might disagree, that's just how I personally see it.

In many ways, he's in a similar situation to Shovel Knight in my opinion, (although I personally think Bomberman has a higher chance to be added as DLC than him) . He has a decent shot at being included in the base game, but his chances as DLC seem to decrease.

 

[BackseatSakurai]

Generally I’m kind of adverse to giving third party series more than one character, But come on, It’s Dragon Quest.

I wouldn't advocate for a 2nd rep necessarily, but Slime would be the natural choice for sure. Torneko would also be great just because of Mystery Dungeon - although Shiren the Wanderer would be a more proper MD rep.

 

[Lionfranky]

Yeah, I think they might be satisfied with Rathalos’ role in Smash currently as well as maybe a stage. I actually think Zero is more likely since he has such a long legacy in gaming and is also an Assist trophy and Mii outfit. I feel like the lack of a true character might cause Monster Hunter to be outprioritize from other Capcom games. I feel like Chun-Li is probably more likely as well.

A lot of people say that part of the reason why a League of Legends, WarCraft, or Genshin Impact character is unlikely is because there isn’t really a singular character that people can rally around since there are so many. Some say that the games maybe very popular but the individual characters aren’t really. Wouldn’t that also apply to Monster Hunter since the playable character is an avatar? Not saying they couldn’t add them anyways but I’d say it prevents Monster Hunter from being the only clear choice for the next Capcom character.

I am pretty sure Travelers are generally considered the main candidate for Genshin rep.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

As far as ARMS characters go I think Min Min was the best choice in terms of what they had to offer moveset wise. Min Min is the only character in ARMS who is able to kick, which was implemented into her moveset in Smash, giving her close range attack options which helped with their moveset diversity and balance.

I don’t think having a moveset consisting exclusively of long range punches would have turned out so great.

 

[Fa7oFuru]

How are we feeling about Bomberman?

He's an assist trophy and a Mii costume and I feel like he's pretty inoffensive / pleasing to everyone - feels like a major oversight to not have him in, but feel like he's rarely brought up actively. I personally would say he's top 5 / top 10 most likely third-party newcomers.

I think Bomberman is one of those characters most people look at and like/have positive thoughts on but the amount of people actively wanting him as their #1 pick or even top 5 decreases drastically. His chances depend on how they handle next Smash whether it's a semi-Reboot or business as usual. I think the former cuts his chances significantly due to prioritizing getting as many veterans back and updating them to modernity while the latter his chances are great. I could see him getting in both instances depending on even further specifics but the former would be like a ~20% chance while the latter a ~50-60% chance

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Yeah, I think they might be satisfied with Rathalos’ role in Smash currently as well as maybe a stage. I actually think Zero is more likely since he has such a long legacy in gaming and is also an Assist trophy and Mii outfit. I feel like the lack of a true character might cause Monster Hunter to be outprioritize from other Capcom games. I feel like Chun-Li is probably more likely as well.

A lot of people say that part of the reason why a League of Legends, WarCraft, or Genshin Impact character is unlikely is because there isn’t really a singular character that people can rally around since there are so many. Some say that the games maybe very popular but the individual characters aren’t really. Wouldn’t that also apply to Monster Hunter since the playable character is an avatar? Not saying they couldn’t add them anyways but I’d say it prevents Monster Hunter from being the only clear choice for the next Capcom character.

I am pretty sure Travelers are generally considered the main candidate for Genshin rep.

I'd also wager that Ahri is almost uncontestably the League rep.

There are other mascots and popular characters, but she is the mascot as far as I'm aware.

 

[Gengar84]

I'd also wager that Ahri is almost uncontestably the League rep.

There are other mascots and popular characters, but she is the mascot as far as I'm aware.

I think it’s between Ahri and Jinx. I could see either one of them. Ahri is definitely pushed a lot in the main games from what I’ve seen but Arcane made Jinx recognizeable to a lot more people beyond just those that played the games. Jinx and Vi were the two League characters chosen for the Fortnite crossover but Ahri was one of the first characters revealed for 2XKO. I’m leaning towards Jinx just because of how much promotion she’s been getting since Arcane.

 

[DemifiendEnjoyer]

I think it’s between Ahri and Jinx. I could see either one of them. Ahri is definitely pushed a lot in the main games from what I’ve seen but Arcane made Jinx recognizeable to a lot more people beyond just those that played the games. Jinx and Vi were the two League characters chosen for the Fortnite crossover but Ahri was one of the first characters revealed for 2XKO. I’m leaning towards Jinx just because of how much promotion she’s been getting since Arcane.

My only real exposure to League Of Legends is that Teemo is in Tails Gets Trolled. So if it was my decision I’d pick him lol.

 

[Gengar84]

My only real exposure to League Of Legends is that Teemo is in Tails Gets Trolled. So if it was my decision I’d pick him lol.

Lol that’s fair. My only exposure to the franchise is through Arcane, Ruined King, and Legends of Runeterra so I tend to favor characters I’m familiar with through those. Arcane is among my favorite shows ever so I have a particular bias towards Jinx but I think Ruined King is a really underrated RPG on the Switch and Ahri was really cool there.

 

[Will]

What would a MOBA character do in Smash?

I’m not being a smartass, I genuinely never played League like I was warned not to.

 

[DarthEnderX]

What do you mean "something they'd never tried before?"

The Booster Course Pass. Releasing a massive DLC for a game 5 years after development had ended is not something Nintendo, or anyone else really, had done before.

It happened once. With Mario Kart. Just because it can happen again (whether it's for this franchise or another) doesn't always mean it should happen again.

Okay.

And there are some games that still get DLC even after 5+ years.

But usually it's 5 years of continuous development. Not release > 5 year gap > DLC.

The BCP proved to Nintendo that DLC out of nowhere will still sell years later, if the game is big enough.

And Smash is big enough.

I mean the Monster Hunter appears in Marvel vs. Capcom: Infinite so it’s not unlikely for the character to be playable.

I recall the MvC dev saying something about wanting a MH character in MvC3, but the MH team didn't want it. I dunno if for MvCI the MH team lightened up, or if Capcom just made them allow it.

No, we don't.

It's not a Wii game.

So? Emio: The Smiling Man isn't a Famicom game. But it's still part of the Famicom Detective Club Franchise.

Nintendo Switch Sports is part of the Wii Sports franchise.

Just out of curiosity, is this a blanket hatred to the final smash type, or are you fine with the ones like Mega Lucario that just boost your numbers into the stratosphere, and just hate the limited ones like Landmaster and Super Dragon?

I prefer cinematic supers to install supers in general. But I especially dislike the supers that basically turn into playing 20 seconds of keep-away because you can't effectively fight back until it wears off. I think it ruins the flow and the pacing of a match.

How many times do we have to be proven wrong when we say “Smash would never do X.”? The truth is we have no inside knowledge of what goes through Sakurai’s and Nintendo’s heads when making decisions for Smash. Some things seem logical and we can make educated guesses based on patterns but we have no way of knowing for sure. That’s why I try to avoid definite statements like that like saying something will never happen or is guaranteed to happen.

Saying “Smash isn’t Mario Kart” is true but Mario Kart itself has never done anything like that either before 8 Deluxe. I feel like people would have written the Booster Course Pass and Deluxe port itself as highly unlikely before they happened. I know circumstances are different and Mario Kart was mainly ported because of the Wii U’s failure and the Booster Pass was easier thanks to the mobile game but it did still happened regardless despite the lack of precedent for anything like it before. Patterns are useful in helping make educated guesses but that’s still all they are.

 

[Gengar84]

What would a MOBA character do in Smash?

I’m not being a smartass, I genuinely never played League like I was warned not to.

Okay, simple answer is they can borrow from their 2XKO moveset like in this video:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

m.youtube.com

More complex answer is my custom moveset I made for Jinx borrowing mostly from Arcane but also League and 2XKO:

Spoiler

Jinx is a lightweight, glass cannon zoner style. She’s got really quick movement and melee attacks but some of her projectiles like the rocket (Fishbones) and chain gun (Pow Pow) have a slow startup.

Weak Attacks

Jab - a flurry of punches followed by a quick shot of her zap gun

Forward tilt - A pistol whip

Up tilt - a jumping knee strike

Down tilt - a spinning low kick

Smash Attacks

Forward smash - Fishbones - Similar to Samus’ power missile where Jinx pulls out her rocket launcher on her shoulder and fires a rocket forward. This is a bit stronger than the power missile but has a longer startup. She can also perform this in the air and the rocket fires diagonally downward.

Up Smash - Jinx loads her rocket launcher with fireworks and shoots it diagonally upwards. The fireworks are a multi hit attack with three explosions

Down smash - A melee attack with the barrel of her chain gun swinging it diagonally downward

Specials

Neutral special - Pow pow - Jinx fires her chain gun and can aim slightly upward or downward. The range is about the same as Mega Man’s jab and lasts about as long as Charizard’s flamethrower before it overheats and has to recharge. This acts a lot like Ivysaur’s bullet seed but aimed horizontally instead of vertically.

Forward special - Zap! - Jinx fires a quick shot from her energy pistol which causes a slight stun effect like Zero Suit Samus’ blaster

Back special - Zap! - Jinx fires two shots from her pistol backwards without looking. The first is straight back and the second is diagonally upwards.

Up special - Shimmer teleport - Similar to Lucario’s Extreme speed attack with a pink trail. Rather than the attack itself dealing damage, she is capable of performing an attack immediately afterwards

Down special - Flame Chompers - Jinx sets down a timed grenade that hops around for about five seconds before exploding. If an enemy touches them, it latches on to them. She can set three of these at once but each one placed increases the cooldown for the next one.

Aerials and Running Attack

Neutral air - Jinx pulls out her wrench and performs a quick spinning backhand attack with it

Forward air - a jumping axe kick which can spike

Back air - Jinx performs a spinning back kick

Up air - Jinx performs a somersault kick similar to Captain Falcon

Down aerial - Another move similar to Captain Falcon where Jinx performs a double foot stomp

Running attack - Jinx performs a running knee strike

Throws and Pummelt

Pummel - Jinx strikes her opponent with her knee

Forward throw - Jinx latches a flame chopper onto her opponent and kicks them forward

Back throw - Similar to Falco’s throw where she tosses her opponent backwards and fires two shots from her pistol

Up throw - Jinx performs a heavy uppercut launching her opponent upwards

Down throw where- Jinx tackles her opponent to the ground and hits them with a flurry of punches

Running attack - Jinx performs a running knee strike

Dodges

Jinx’s dodge roll is a pink shimmer infused teleport similar to Mewtwo’s

Her spot dodge has her mostly standing in place but shifting her head to the side

Final Smash

Final Smash - This is her super from 2XKO where she summons a giant pink monkey turret which fires a super mega death rocket that acts similarly to Olimar’s final smash

Taunts

Jinx says “Here I am, your big fat hero!” as she raises her arm in a heroic pose

Jinx has a mental breakdown and hunches over grabbing her head and says “Shut up, shut up, SHUT UP!!!” and scratched graffiti of haunting scenes from her past appearance around her

Jinx laughs maniacally

Victory Animations

The first victory animation shows Jinx surfing through the air on top of her Super Mega Death Rocket. This is a reference to the opening of her music video “Get Jinxed”.

The second victory animation shows Jinx pull over a huge chair with her name spray painted across the back and stares at the camera hauntingly.

A MOBA character would probably have at least one special with a cooldown. I used that for Jinx’s chain gun, Pow-pow, that overheats like Charizard’s flamethrower after so long and she has to wait a similar amount of time before she can fire it up again.

 

[Arcanir]

Guys. They're not doing Monster Hunter Stories as our fighter. That's ridiculous.

I don't want to be the insufferable curmudgeon today, but I keep seeing a Rider with a Monstie tossed around because of the assumption that you need a monster as a fighter somehow and it kinda irks me. Monster Hunter Stories is a spinoff with two games. The second game sold about one and a half million copies, maybe a bit more. Monster Hunter Rise, which released around the same time, has sold ten times that. The Sunbreak DLC alone sold 8 million copies. I'm sure the Stories games are good, but they are in no way series-defining, and the mainline games are far and away the defining image of the series. They're not tossing that away and going for a spinoff title specifically just because we need a monster.

I'm going to second this.

I like Monster Hunter Stories, it's a fun game that more should give a chance, but I find the idea that it's the best solution heavily flawed. Stories is still a spin-off title, one that just recently has only gotten notable success and it's still behind its mainline counterparts, it's nowhere close to the success of those games and not the one that drives support for it. Even tabling the sales argument, the Rider is not the character people ask for when asking for a MH character. They want the Hunter, or even the Palico, because those are the characters people are more familiar with and want to have playable for what they can do.

This reminds me of the Sylux argument in some respects from before Ultimate. We can't get Ridley (or Dark Samus), so let's settle for Sylux and support them to get a new Metroid rep, but people didn't want Sylux as much as they wanted Ridley so their support never took off to the levels of the dragon. The Rider is being positioned similarly to that case, and similar to Sylux the Rider is just not going to scratch the itch that MH fans want scratched.

To this day, the only exception is Marvel vs. Capcom Infinite. And whether or not there's a valid source to the claim that it was against the MH devs' wishes, the fact such a claim can even exist and be completely believable regardless of official source with how this original Hunter has never returned since nor any other original Hunter had been used in crossovers is conspicuous as all hell.

Just because a claim exists doesn't mean it's accurate. We all said and/or agreed Spyro was hated in Japan because his localization was bad, but someone posted a video last week showing that no, it was not hated, indifferent probably, but it was not hated and the localization likely had nothing to do with its lack of success. The only thing that claim has is fan speculation based on what changed between MVC3 and Infinite, but it's just that: Speculation. We have no data, interviews, or anything otherwise to say that the claim has any meaningful merit and it shouldn't be treated as a valued claim without some sort of backing to it.

That's not to say there can't be or still isn't hesitation from the MH team as that can still be true, but let's not apply rumors and hearsay and pass them off as correct.

 

[BrawlX10]

I've also before takes my notes from Google Keep's. As an Indonesians and Asia-Pacific/The Pacific representations, we recently as other fellow members been mentioned Genshin Impact at This threads. We speaking about The Pacific/Asia-Pacific reps and briefly talks about mobile MOBAs

Sorry if I misunderstood your post, but if you’re asking about my opinion on the chances of a Genshin Impact character in Smash, here’s what I think:

I’ve mentioned a Genshin rep several times before, and I do think it’s possible. I wouldn’t say it's likely in the same way that characters like Sans, Crash, Chun-Li, or Dante are, but it definitely makes sense to add a Genshin character. The game is hugely popular and has proven to have staying power, with Genshin nearing its 5th anniversary and still going strong. A Genshin character could definitely help bring new players to Smash.

That said, there are some potential roadblocks. One is that Genshin is a live-service game, and while this isn't necessarily a huge issue, we don't know if Sakurai or Nintendo would be interested in adding characters from those types of games. The other roadblock could be the language barrier, but I think that’s a minor issue that could be solved by contracting a translator.

I wouldn't advocate for a 2nd rep necessarily, but Slime would be the natural choice for sure. Torneko would also be great just because of Mystery Dungeon - although Shiren the Wanderer would be a more proper MD rep.

As a Dragon Quest fan, I feel like the options for a playable rep are either Slime or Dragonlord. I don't think they’ll add a party member as a playable character in Smash. As cool as it would be to have characters like Alena, Torneko, or Erik in the roster, I just don’t see it happening. However, I do think Zoma has a decent chance of being a boss if Dragon Quest is included in the base game, especially considering how iconic that fight is.

As for a second Dragon Quest rep, I think it’s possible, but not as likely as a Sonic or Street Fighter rep. A second DQ character is probably on the same level as Zero from Mega Man—something that could happen, but isn’t extremely likely. Honestly, I’d say Zero has a better chance, to be honest.

Tifa has also been discussed as a potential third FF rep, but I think she’s more likely to be an Assist Trophy next time. If they do add a third FF character, I think they’d probably pick someone from a different game, or perhaps Zack as an Echo fighter.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Not the Dixie Echo argument again...

Just WHY would one actively want that? There's no good reason. If they wanted her as one, she'd be one. I'll stand by that forever.

Reason being, they clearly had no objection adding a long requested hot shot and a secondary popular character who's a Echo in with Ultimate. The proof lies with Ridley and Dark Samus. Even with little tweaks, a Isabelle situation wouldn't be too much out of the question then for Dixie either.

They didn't do this, cause it wouldn't do Dixie justice. Even in the SNES platfomers she had her own different physics and stats from Diddy. She doesn't share much with him at all, except body size and weight. Diddy is faster, and jumps higher. Dixie has her Helicopter Spin and grabs everything with her hair. This is enough to differentiate her from Diddy.

Now Tropical Freeze gave her a Bubble Gum Popgun. Sure use that. There's room for her to be a semi clone at most maybe. But to throw away a whole concept basically given to her as a light weight grappler type of character is just a waste. It's who she was meant to be. And she'd be implemented like that in Smash too. Most definitely.

 

[DragonRobotKing26]

I am pretty sure Travelers are generally considered the main candidate for Genshin rep.

i think it wouldn't happen, Genshin isn't a Switch,the traveler is a typical Avatar Protagonist, same from Robin,Corrin,Byleth,Hero,Pokémon Trainer and Miis,and Genshin is popular because it's a trend game

 

[Truth the Ceomasterz33]

Sorry if I misunderstood your post, but if you’re asking about my opinion on the chances of a Genshin Impact character in Smash, here’s what I think:

I’ve mentioned a Genshin rep several times before, and I do think it’s possible. I wouldn’t say it's likely in the same way that characters like Sans, Crash, Chun-Li, or Dante are, but it definitely makes sense to add a Genshin character. The game is hugely popular and has proven to have staying power, with Genshin nearing its 5th anniversary and still going strong. A Genshin character could definitely help bring new players to Smash.

That said, there are some potential roadblocks. One is that Genshin is a live-service game, and while this isn't necessarily a huge issue, we don't know if Sakurai or Nintendo would be interested in adding characters from those types of games. The other roadblock could be the language barrier, but I think that’s a minor issue that could be solved by contracting a translator.

Hey, BrawlX10 . Yes, sorry spelling. In speaking as Genshin Impact with an certain issues. I concern about voice acting, preferring Genshin Impact over other Hoyoverse games and other issues. Genshin Impact in Smash considered as roadblock?

 

[Gengar84]

Not the Dixie Echo argument again...

Just WHY would one actively want that? There's no good reason. If they wanted her as one, she'd be one. I'll stand by that forever.

Reason being, they clearly had no objection adding a long requested hot shot and a secondary popular character who's a Echo in with Ultimate. The proof lies with Ridley and Dark Samus. Even with little tweaks, a Isabelle situation wouldn't be too much out of the question then for Dixie either.

They didn't do this, cause it wouldn't do Dixie justice. Even in the SNES platfomers she had her own different physics and stats from Diddy. She doesn't share much with him at all, except body size and weight. Diddy is faster, and jumps higher. Dixie has her Helicopter Spin and grabs everything with her hair. This is enough to differentiate her from Diddy.

Now Tropical Freeze gave her a Bubble Gum Popgun. Sure use that. There's room for her to be a semi clone at most maybe. But to throw away a whole concept basically given to her as a light weight grappler type of character is just a waste. It's who she was meant to be. And she'd be implemented like that in Smash too. Most definitely.

Sorry, that was me that brought Dixie up. I saw people arguing how an ARMS composite character would be a terrible idea because the characters had unique movesets in ARMS but that made me think of how they don’t have the same objections for Dixie or Impa as echoes despite being different themselves. I feel like it’s mostly people that don’t care much about the characters or games that suggest them as echoes in both cases. People that don’t play ARMS see the characters and likely think “These characters are like Dhalsim and Luffy. They’re probably similar enough that you could make them work as alts”. People that don’t play DKC see Dixie and likely think “She’s a monkey with the same basic body shape as Diddy. I bet she could work as an echo.” and it doesn’t go much beyond that. It just kind of bugs me.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Just because a claim exists doesn't mean it's accurate. We all said and/or agreed Spyro was hated in Japan because his localization was bad, but someone posted a video last week showing that no, it was not hated, indifferent probably, but it was not hated and the localization likely had nothing to do with its lack of success. The only thing that claim has is fan speculation based on what changed between MVC3 and Infinite, but it's just that: Speculation. We have no data, interviews, or anything otherwise to say that the claim has any meaningful merit and it shouldn't be treated as a valued claim without some sort of backing to it.

That's not to say there can't be or still isn't hesitation from the MH team as that can still be true, but let's not apply rumors and hearsay and pass them off as correct.

Never said it was correct. Just that is believable given what we've seen thus far, which is not the same thing as stating it as fact.

 

[DarthEnderX]

They're not in Teppen at all actually. The primary rep there was Rathelos.

There was another monster that was added later but I don't know what it is. I wanna say Deviljo but I dunno.

Nergigante.

Ironically, Hunters are not heroes in Teppen, but Felyne is.

What if the Smash rep was just a Palico?

Generally I’m kind of adverse to giving third party series more than one character, But come on, It’s Dragon Quest.

I generally prefer to get a new franchise over an additional rep. But if the rep is an iconic character in their own right, like Sephiroth, Zero, Chun-Li or Alucard, then I'm fine with it.

 

[Arcanir]

Never said it was correct. Just that is believable given what we've seen thus far, which is not the same thing as stating it as fact.

I would contest whether it's even believable as I doubt Capcom's going to go against the wishes of the team of what is one of their most successful franchises in the company for one game.

 

[dezeray112]

How are we feeling about Bomberman?

He's an assist trophy and a Mii costume and I feel like he's pretty inoffensive / pleasing to everyone - feels like a major oversight to not have him in, but feel like he's rarely brought up actively. I personally would say he's top 5 / top 10 most likely third-party newcomers.

I'd say Bomberman may have a decent chance to be promoted from AT to being as a playable character and remains as the only other recognisable Konami character along with Snake and Simon.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Fair enough. My problem is that most echoes are essentially glorified alts with their own character select spot.

Isnt that the point?

Generally I’m kind of adverse to giving third party series more than one character, But come on, It’s Dragon Quest.

Counterpoint, they kinda already gave Dragon Quest multiple reps by using multiple protagonists as alts, i thought that was a better way of handling it.

 

[Gengar84]

I generally prefer to get a new franchise over an additional rep. But if the rep is an iconic character in their own right, like Sephiroth, Zero, Chun-Li or Alucard, then I'm fine with it.

I pretty much agree with this. For me, my own personal bias factors in too. Even if the character isn’t exactly iconic, if they’re one of my favorite characters from the game or series, I’ll still be hyped with their inclusion in Smash even if there are already playable characters in Smash. If I like two characters about equally, I’ll tend to favor the one from a new series but my personal preference impacts my reaction the most.

Isnt that the point?

It is. Which is why I feel echoes should be reserved for more minor characters who would never get in otherwise or characters with little to no unique moveset potential. I think both Dixie and Impa are too important to their series to be relegated to echoes.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I wouldn't advocate for a 2nd rep necessarily, but Slime would be the natural choice for sure.

I think Psaro is a better choice. It adds a popular DQ villain, but also serves as a DQ Monsters rep.

Slimes/King Slime should be an AT.

I'd also wager that Ahri is almost uncontestably the League rep.

There are other mascots and popular characters, but she is the mascot as far as I'm aware.

I feel like, after Arcane, she's been supplanted by Jynx.

Just WHY would one actively want that? There's no good reason.

Because I want her enough for her to be playable, but not enough for her to cost us another unique Fighter.

An Echo is...good enough.

 

[NotGenerico]

The other roadblock could be the language barrier, but I think that’s a minor issue that could be solved by contracting a translator.

Honkai Star Rail, another Hoyoverse property, is collaborating with Fate, a Japanese IP, later this year. I don't think the language barrier would be an issue if Nintendo ever decided to add a Genshin rep.

Genshin is an interesting case for me because I don't think it's as likely as let's say Dante or Master Chief, but if it actually happened my reaction would be something like "Yeah, I guess that makes sense." It's popular and a Switch port was seemingly planned. That Switch port probably got cancelled because they couldn't get it to run on a Switch. I do think it's very possible it'll get a Switch 2 Port alongside Honkai Star Rail and Zenless Zone Zero.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

Half of his specials are completely made up generic monkey attacks

Heard there was some DK moveset discussion, and felt like I'd pop by since it's a bit of a hot-button for me:

Please explain what Diddy Kong can do that is not generic made-up monkey attacks. To my knowledge, almost every single canon Diddy Kong ability - with the exception of the spring tail - is somewhere in his moveset. Diddy Kong is - at his core - a funny little monkey, it's unreasonable to expect him to not act like a funny little monkey.

EDIT to acknowledge Guitar Gazump... a screen-wipe move with theming more closely tied to Dixie. I don't think it counts, but it's acknowledged

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I would contest whether it's even believable as I doubt Capcom's going to go against the wishes of the team of what is one of their most successful franchises in the company for one game.

MvCI is nothing short of controversy and backdoor shenanigans, so I'm not completely willing to deny the possibility.

We have for example Dante's VA claiming eight years ago that the McCI team never consulted with Hideaki Itsuno about Dante's representation in the game and he was disappointed with the turnout that he never gave approval for.
Which, YMMV how trustworthy Langdon is there, would set a precedence for the developers for the series represented not being considered at all.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

As far as ARMS characters go I think Min Min was the best choice in terms of what they had to offer moveset wise. Min Min is the only character in ARMS who is able to kick, which was implemented into her moveset in Smash, giving her close range attack options which helped with their moveset diversity and balance.

I don’t think having a moveset consisting exclusively of long range punches would have turned out so great.

Well, a lot of them could still realistically have kicks fill gaps in a Smash moveset. People like Ribbon Girl and Ninjara immediately come to mind for that but Max Brass, Master Mummy or Mechanica getting a Ganon stomp for a dair also works really well.

The difference is that Min Min is the only one who could have a gameplay feature tied with kicks since that's the reason why her dodges in ARMS could block attacks and, as a result, the reason why her up smash is a reflector in Ultimate.

Heck, I'd even go as fair as to say Spring Man (and by extension Springtron) is the only one who COULDN'T pull off using kicks since he seems firmly set to be a boxer in terms of overall vibes, so he'd be a no-kicks-whatsoever kind of character like Little Mac or, for non-Smash examples, the boxer trio in Street Fighter (Balrog, Dudley, SF6 Ed)

 

[BrawlX10]

I feel like, after Arcane, she's been supplanted by Jynx.

Honestly, I think they'll go for Jinx. While Ahri is technically the mascot of League of Legends, Jinx is definitely more popular these days.

That said, one thing Ahri has over Jinx is that her default LoL outfit is a bit more tame, making it easier to censor her if needed. On the other hand, Jinx’s default outfit might be not as easy to censor—unless they opt for her Arcane outfit instead of her original LoL design. That wouldn’t be totally out of the question, given that they used Cloud's Advent Children look as an alternate costume.

 

[MBRedboy31]

Min Min is the only character in ARMS who is able to kick

Just to be clear, this isn’t accurate: a few other characters like Helix, Kid Cobra, and Lola Pop kick the opponent as part of their grab animation.

Besides, a bunch of Min Min’s animations are already made-up for Smash, the other characters could kick if they had to.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I’ve been thinking more about Sakurai’s desire to make Diddy and Dixie a tag team character, but couldn’t make it work on the Wii due to technical limitations. I’m sure creating this type of tag team character on the Switch 2 would be possible, and I wonder if Sakurai would want to go back to that idea again. I think if anything it would be Dixie and Kiddy, since Diddy has cemented himself as a standalone character.

Some might ask why he wouldn’t have returned to that idea sooner, but it also wouldn’t have been possible on 3DS, and whether or not it was possible on Switch, the newcomer selection for Ultimate was limited, with more popular requests like King K. Rool being prioritized, and two unique DK characters was probably not in the cards. Also them not being a 3rd party character or from a newer Switch game without a character, meant they basically had no chance as DLC for Ultimate.

This might be the best time for Sakurai to implement this character archetype, and I’m thinking Dixie & Kiddy since Dixie was part of the initial idea and in Ultimate Dixie Kong’s spirit can be enhanced to the 4 star “Dixie Kong & Kiddy Kong”, showing that they are seen as a noteworthy duo.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Honestly, I think they'll go for Jinx. While Ahri is technically the mascot of League of Legends, Jinx is definitely more popular these days.

That said, one thing Ahri has over Jinx is that her default LoL outfit is a bit more tame, making it easier to censor her if needed. On the other hand, Jinx’s default outfit might be not as easy to censor—unless they opt for her Arcane outfit instead of her original LoL design. That wouldn’t be totally out of the question, given that they used Cloud's Advent Children look as an alternate costume.

Chinese servers as well as Wild Rift have already censored Jinx by wrapping her chest in bandage under her top. They don't need the Arcane design.

 

[Gengar84]

I feel like, after Arcane, she's been supplanted by Jynx.

Heard there was some DK moveset discussion, and felt like I'd pop by since it's a bit of a hot-button for me:

Please explain what Diddy Kong can do that is not generic made-up monkey attacks. To my knowledge, almost every single canon Diddy Kong ability - with the exception of the spring tail - is somewhere in his moveset. Diddy Kong is - at his core - a funny little monkey, it's unreasonable to expect him to not act like a funny little monkey.

EDIT to acknowledge Guitar Gazump... a screen-wipe move with theming more closely tied to Dixie. I don't think it counts, but it's acknowledged

Sure, I would have made Diddy and Dixie a tag duo where the inactive Kong runs alongside the main one but can’t be interacted with. Diddy and Dixie would be able to pick each other up and throw their partner either as recovery or as a projectile. Now that Diddy is in on his own, that idea could go to Dixie with Kiddy Kong. She could also use her animal buddies as specials as an alternate idea. To me, what made those games so fun mechanically were the tag mechanics and rideable animal buddies. Neither of these is referenced in Smash at all. Diddy should have also had his boom box and sunglasses for a victory screen.

 

[Opossum]

I posted this in the Unpopular Opinions thread without knowing it was accidentally on-topic here lmao.

--------------

Honestly I always felt it was a bit weird that people suggested that Dixie couldn't even possibly be a semi-clone. Like not even "she can't be an echo," but "she HAS to be fully unique."

A lot of the movesets I see proposed for her that don't get the "too similar to Diddy" or "just a generic animal" complaints tend to focus strictly on her hair, making her fight more like Guilty Gear's Millia Rage or Marvel's Medusa, but like...her hair is absolutely not long enough to feasibly be used like how those characters do, to the point where that also feels off and out-of-character. Most of Diddy's moves could 100% be kept and make total sense.

I'll go even further: I think the biggest, most functional difference you can make doesn't even involve her hair, but the Bubblegum Gun. Make it explode on impact and become a sort of sticky trap that holds foes to the ground for a bit, letting her run up and grapple with her hair. That single, almost all-encompassing change would require...one altered special and a new set of grabs. And then the obligatory ponytail twirl up special. Maybe if you're feeling it you can even give her a new command grab special to replace the infamously-problematic banana that acts like Patrick's Star Slam in NASB, giving her two command grab specials (this and Monkey Flip) and a new set of grabs, firmly setting her apart as a grappler when compared to Diddy.

And such a change would require, at most, two new specials, one altered special, and a new set of grabs. To put that into perspective, that's what Pit got in the transition from Brawl to 4 if you ignore the new grabs. The rest, minus the multi-hit jab which isn't even here anymore IIRC, could literally be lifted from Diddy with no problems at all.