Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[dream1ng]

View attachment 392438

Resists urge to break out my chart on why Gen 10 could be 2026 for the fifteenth time

I just like speculating about Pokemon you guys!

This is why I’m single

There are a lot of variables based on when the two games release, and when Smash 6 started development. Gen 10 could release in 2026. That may not be so bad, for the sake of that series. I'm just going by the fairly fixed Pokemon schedule, and the likeliest timeframe I believe Smash 6 will take.

Except we know Pokemon gets a placeholder. Every single time.
XBC doesn't.

It literally cannot be compared.

Now instead of asking whether Pokemon gets a placeholder, ask yourself why Pokemon gets a placeholder instead of just being chosen with the other characters.

So they can promote it with a Pokemon from the newest gen, who isn't ready yet.

But if the newest gen is too far away for that placeholder to be filled in time for base releasing, you can put that placeholder into the DLC lineup, if you know you're doing DLC, which the Smash team would, and you know when such a character will be useable by, which TPC presumably would.

Saying Pokemon gets a placeholder doesn't make them able to use a character that is simply too far away to use. What it would do is allocate that placeholder for when the character can be used.

 

[RileyXY1]

There are a lot of variables based on when the two games release, and when Smash 6 started development. Gen 10 could release in 2026. That may not be so bad, for the sake of that series. I'm just going by the fairly fixed Pokemon schedule, and the likeliest timeframe I believe Smash 6 will take.


Now instead of asking whether Pokemon gets a placeholder, ask yourself why Pokemon gets a placeholder instead of just being chosen with the other characters.

So they can promote it with a Pokemon from the newest gen, who isn't ready yet.

But if the newest gen is too far away for that placeholder to be filled in time for base releasing, you can put that placeholder into the DLC lineup, if you know you're doing DLC, which the Smash team would, and you know when such a character will be useable by, which TPC presumably would.

Saying Pokemon gets a placeholder doesn't make them able to use a character that is simply too far away to use. What it would do is allocate that placeholder for when the character can be used.

Yeah. That's why I think that the Pokémon newcomer might be DLC this time instead of being in the base roster.

 

[SpecterFlower]

I was thinking, if a guilty gear character were to get in the next smash game, it would 90% be bridget and 10% be sin

sin is being set up as the next main character after sol, bridget is leaps and bounds more popular than the entire franchise herself, and ky was always the second protag and now idk, his son is being setup for much more now that hes kidna just, a dad now.

baiken sued to be super popular but nowadays she, really isnt, at least not as much as she used to be plus boobs.


sol is not the main character anymore, not the most popular character, and despite being a spicy shoto he is still a shoto which ken and ryu cover, i would like to see someone like bridget who would be very unique (toxic) to fight against.

idk just my thoughts.

though that would also make bridget im pretty sure the first canonically lgbt character in smash? that would also be very cool.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

• Super Smash Bros. (1999)
  • Pikachu (1996), Jigglypuff (1996)
• Super Smash Bros. Melee (2001)
  • Pichu (1999)
• Super Smash Bros. Brawl (2008)
  • Pokémon Trainer (1996), Lucario (2006)
• Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3Ds (2014)
  • Greninja (2013)
• Super Smash Bros. Ultimate (2018)
  • Incineroar (2016)

So...Every Pokémon newcomer aside from Pikachu, Jigglypuff, and Pokémon Trainer (Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard) had their games come out 1-2 years before their debut in Super Smash Bros., and two of these exceptions were because they were a foundational part of the series. Jigglypuff just kinda got lucky, but also it was the first game and Pokémon Gold/Silver came out within the same year so their eligibility is questionable at a glance. No character appeared in Smash before their debut in their home series.

Pokémon Scarlet/Violet came out in 2022, and Gen 10 is being predicted to come in 2025 or 2026. Assuming the next Super Smash Bros. game is also coming out in 2025 or 2026, that would leave a 3->4 year gap between Gen 9 and it's newcomer or a -1->1 year gap between Gen 10 and next Smash.

If Gen 10 is 2025, and SSBNext is 2026, then Gen 10 is a lock. No doubt about it. It's a bit less certain if they release the same year, and a lot less certain if Gen 10 releases a year afterward. Given that Melee went with Gen 2 and not 3, and Ultimate went with Gen 7 and not 8, my guess would be that they wouldn't pull that far in advance though.

If Gen 10 isn't elligable I'm not sure what they'll do. They could go back and get someone from Gen 9, but that seems a bit farfetch'd because it's no longer in that promo window. They could go back for a popular pick, or someone they find very important like Eevee or Cynthia (not that either pick wouldn't be both) which we don't have too much of a precedent for. Or the next newcomer is Gen 10, but as DLC, which we also don't have a precedant for, and given that they set aside spots on the base roster, seems unlikely.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

So what do you guys think the adventure mode will look like in the next game?

At least I hope there’s an adventure mode. Wii U/3DS not having a significant single player campaign was disappointing.

A World of Light Sequel with some of the fat-trimmed with FighterZ/ Kid Icarus-style cutscenes and interactions, new bosses and worlds.

Also i think you guys are a bit harsh on SSE's story, make no mistake, SSE wasn't that great of a mode but it's story and cut-scenes are its highlight. It being like "Nintendo Toys" coming together is part of the charm personally. Nintendo themselves were a Toy company and in some ways kinda are today makes more cathartic

I'm probably the only one interested in Smash Lore. The Isle of Anicents, The Subspace Army, the so-called "deities" etc. Wish we get lore like that next game. Bring back Nojima to write this time.

 

[SharkLord]

I was thinking, if a guilty gear character were to get in the next smash game, it would 90% be bridget and 10% be sin

sin is being set up as the next main character after sol, bridget is leaps and bounds more popular than the entire franchise herself, and ky was always the second protag and now idk, his son is being setup for much more now that hes kidna just, a dad now.

baiken sued to be super popular but nowadays she, really isnt, at least not as much as she used to be plus boobs.


sol is not the main character anymore, not the most popular character, and despite being a spicy shoto he is still a shoto which ken and ryu cover, i would like to see someone like bridget who would be very unique (toxic) to fight against.

idk just my thoughts.

I dunno, Sol's still far away the face of the series. He's been the face of the series this whole time, and we haven't moved on to the next Guilty Gear, either. The most recent game is still Strive, which still has Sol as the main character. Outside of games, the new anime also still has Sol as a major focus, even though his big character arc technically concluded

He's also not really a shoto, as far as I remember. The shoto archetype is specifically Fireball + Forward-moving attack and/or spinning attack + Rising uppercut. Last I checked, Sol doesn't even have a projectile, and it's Ky who's the designated (relatively) simple shoto character. Sol's a rushdown fighter.

though that would also make bridget im pretty sure the first canonically lgbt character in smash? that would also be very cool.

and have had gay romance options for a while now. Depending on how far the umbrella goes, and have also been given gender-neutral customization options as of their most recent installments. Though, I think Bridget would be our first trans fighter, which would be pretty neat in it's own right.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I was thinking, if a guilty gear character were to get in the next smash game, it would 90% be bridget and 10% be sin

sin is being set up as the next main character after sol, bridget is leaps and bounds more popular than the entire franchise herself, and ky was always the second protag and now idk, his son is being setup for much more now that hes kidna just, a dad now.

baiken sued to be super popular but nowadays she, really isnt, at least not as much as she used to be plus boobs.


sol is not the main character anymore, not the most popular character, and despite being a spicy shoto he is still a shoto which ken and ryu cover, i would like to see someone like bridget who would be very unique (toxic) to fight against.

idk just my thoughts.

though that would also make bridget im pretty sure the first canonically lgbt character in smash? that would also be very cool.

As far as I know:

• Sol is still the current main protagonist. The anime may change that, but I dunno how much it will sway character selections.
• When Guilty Gear characters crossover it's usually Sol, Baiken, and/or Ramelethal, with Baiken seeming to appear a lot by herself.
• Sol and Ky have the highest legacy as mascots within the series.
• Sol is constantly described as a rush down character, which would definitley be way different than Ryu, Ken, and Terry, who are more neutral focused, and even barring that, Guilty Gear's mechanics will make him stand out no matter what.
  • That last part is relevant to the more neutral focused Ky when it comes to considering him as a playable character.

EDIT: My guess would still be that Sol's the most likely.

EDIT EDIT:

He's also not really a shoto, as far as I remember. The shoto archetype is specifically Fireball + Forward-moving attack and/or spinning attack + Rising uppercut. Last I checked, Sol doesn't even have a projectile, and it's Ky who's the designated (relatively) simple shoto character. Sol's a rushdown fighter.

He has a projectile in Gunflame, but IIRC it's a more niche tool on him, and in Super Smash Bros. it would be genuinely terrible without modifications.

 

[SpecterFlower]

I dunno, Sol's still far away the face of the series. He's been the face of the series this whole time, and we haven't moved on to the next Guilty Gear, either. The most recent game is still Strive, which still has Sol as the main character. Outside of games, the new anime also still has Sol as a major focus, even though his big character arc technically concluded
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He's also not really a shoto, as far as I remember. The shoto archetype is specifically Fireball + Forward-moving attack and/or spinning attack + Rising uppercut. Last I checked, Sol doesn't even have a projectile, and it's Ky who's the designated (relatively) simple shoto character. Sol's a rushdown fighter.


and have had gay romance options for a while now. Depending on how far the umbrella goes, and have also been given gender-neutral customization options as of their most recent installments. Though, I think Bridget would be our first trans fighter, which would be pretty neat in it's own right.

when regardless of main character idk that’s msolty my argument for sin.

min regards to Bridget I think it’ll be the min min situation, but exasterbated.

There’s a reason the gutter gear community is getting really ankoiyed that only Bridget merch is being spammed.

she’s the most poplar character and arguing otherwise is delusional.

If arcsys had a say they would pick Bridgette, if daisuke had a day hoenslty idk he might just say Potemkin cause it’s funny or smth, or sol because sol is his sef insert, or I-no cause he thinks she’s the hottest character.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

This is just my read, but I think if GG were to get a main character it'd be Sol, but if its active status in Smash was limited to something like an assist trophy, I could see Bridget getting the nod. Within the latter context there's a certain sense to taking advantage of that popularity in a very specific manner while the former seems similar to Terry and Fatal Fury/KoF; paying tribute to an entire series via the fighter that's always been there.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Ignoring Sol for a moment since everyone and their grandmother would already see him as a valid candidate from GG, there is a rather strong case to be made for Baiken as an alternative option.

Bridget has become a reasonable option as well due to her spike in popularity with Strive, but prior to that, Baiken's own popularity over the course of the entire series can't be understated.

 

[Wonder Smash]

Sol is way more likely than Bridget. He's like the mascot of the series. He's made numerous guest appearances in other games like Code Shifter, King of Fighters All-Stars, Lords of Vermillion 3, and River City Girls 2. Certainly way more than Bridget. He's a much more obvious rep for the series than Bridget.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Being the Mascot is helpful, but not always the way things go. Popularity can also go a massively long way. Bridget is one of the most iconic characters for many reasons. I could easily see her possible.

We know for a fact being a Mascot doesn't inherently make you the hard choice; Tom Nook is the first proof of that(he was the original mascot. We got Villager instead, and then Isabelle dwarfed him quite a bit). And then Spring Man and Ribbon Girl were ignored in favor of Min Min, for more than one reason. However, it's worth noting that Sakurai also considered Ninjara, while there's no hints he considered both mascots of ARMS for a playable slot. We at best know he explained the reasoning why Spring Man wasn't as obvious as thought as, and that he was a clearly reasonable choice for an AT(which isn't the same thing).

Likewise, the core protagonist isn't always the perfect option. Besides, as noted with Spring Man(who is treated as one by many, and was going to have a Manga with that factor but it was cancelled for unknown reasons), you also have Red/Pokemon Trainer, who easily was treated as "not as important" as Pikachu. And it's not just a Smash 64 thing. When it came to any issues, he and two Pokemon couldn't hold a candle to Charizard alone, no less the main mascot(Pokemon has various mascots per game. But also things like, as I said, Pichu being one for Baby Pokemon).

Essentially? Being the mascot or the core protagonist isn't a guarantee you'll get chosen. They are helpful, but there can always be factors that deny them a spot. Also, Chrom is a pretty good example of why being a core protagonist isn't enough alone(he in fact only got in due to being a later moveset clone option. Without that, he was out of luck). Sure, he isn't of the franchise as a whole either, but the point is there's always more to look at than just one factor.

 

[toonito]

Sol's the face of the franchise no way would Bridget get in as the 1st GG character for Smash.

it'd be like Juri getting in Smash 4 before Ryu.

If GG got multiple characters in Smash I can see Bridget getting in but not as the inaugural pick.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

 

[Gorgonzales]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

Why is this even a question? Of course I'd want more significant one-shot characters like Skull Kid, Raven Beak, and even more out-there picks like Chunky Kong. I don't think they should be held back due to the fact they only had one major appearance; that doesn't matter, since if they ended up memorable and have a lot of unique fighting game potential then that's more than enough reason to put them in.

 

[Louie G.]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

True of course, and Zelda really should have been the blueprint for this. I don't have to explain how Skull Kid, Midna, even Ghirahim would have made great additions to the series that would have become similarly beloved. Anytime from Brawl to Ultimate would have felt justified.

Beyond Zelda, the mind wanders to Kirby. Marx, Magolor, Susie, Daroach, Gooey, Adeleine... No limit to the potential in this series, but between Smash's tendency to stick with the more consistent faces and Sakurai's own weirdness with Kirby this one seems fairly unlikely outside of Bandana Dee. And I can't help but think of Metroid Dread's introduction of both EMMI and Raven Beak, who would both make for super compelling fighters in their own right but are unlikely to make any further appearances in the series.

I would argue this has actually happened one other time, although some people may disagree. But Rosalina is absolutely in this ballpark, since the project plan predates any further prominence in 3D World and even cites Rosalina as being from "Super Mario Galaxy" and not the Mario series on the whole. For her, it just took one standout appearance to make a difference and inspire Sakurai to build a unique moveset. So maybe it's not so far fetched for this to happen again, but the timing and the inspiration just needs to be there.

Most recently, although I can see him becoming a staple in his own series, but I think Oatchi applies. I suppose he'd be in a similar position to Sheik when Melee rolled around, having a really prominent supporting role in the latest, notably very successful entry in his series. If we got another character like this next time around independent of like, fan campaigns or whatnot (Skull Kid, Geno etc) I see it being Oatchi.

 

[Gengar84]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

True. I think it’s basically an inevitability at some point anyways since there’s a limit to recurring first party characters that show up in every game in a series. I think one off characters like Midna or Raven Beak could make for some really interesting fighters.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

True. It helps bolster the roster with interesting options alone~

It's good to be more than just pure long-running characters.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Being the Mascot is helpful, but not always the way things go. Popularity can also go a massively long way. Bridget is one of the most iconic characters for many reasons. I could easily see her possible.

We know for a fact being a Mascot doesn't inherently make you the hard choice; Tom Nook is the first proof of that(he was the original mascot. We got Villager instead, and then Isabelle dwarfed him quite a bit). And then Spring Man and Ribbon Girl were ignored in favor of Min Min, for more than one reason. However, it's worth noting that Sakurai also considered Ninjara, while there's no hints he considered both mascots of ARMS for a playable slot. We at best know he explained the reasoning why Spring Man wasn't as obvious as thought as, and that he was a clearly reasonable choice for an AT(which isn't the same thing).

Likewise, the core protagonist isn't always the perfect option. Besides, as noted with Spring Man(who is treated as one by many, and was going to have a Manga with that factor but it was cancelled for unknown reasons), you also have Red/Pokemon Trainer, who easily was treated as "not as important" as Pikachu. And it's not just a Smash 64 thing. When it came to any issues, he and two Pokemon couldn't hold a candle to Charizard alone, no less the main mascot(Pokemon has various mascots per game. But also things like, as I said, Pichu being one for Baby Pokemon).

Essentially? Being the mascot or the core protagonist isn't a guarantee you'll get chosen. They are helpful, but there can always be factors that deny them a spot. Also, Chrom is a pretty good example of why being a core protagonist isn't enough alone(he in fact only got in due to being a later moveset clone option. Without that, he was out of luck). Sure, he isn't of the franchise as a whole either, but the point is there's always more to look at than just one factor.

Thinking about it like that, I think it would be fair to say that while being a mascot/protagonist doesn't make you an insta-pick, all but 1 character picked to represent a game or franchise are core to said game/franchise's identity. Using your examples, Villager may not have been the mascot, but as the player's character with a charming design, they are pretty darn important when it comes to Animal Crossing's identity. The same is true for the Pokémon Trainer, but in their case, they do kind of play second fiddle to Pikachu since it's more the idea of the trainer that's important than the trainer itself. That and the concept probably wasn't feasible until Brawl anyway. Chrom is pretty core to Fire Emblem: Awakening, but so was Robin, as he shared the role as protagonist and played a pivital role for a lot of the game's major themes. The fact that he stood out more was just a bonus.

As far as I see it, Min Min is the sole exception, and she's a bit of a special case. ARMS is a very new IP that designs all of its major characters off of its incredibly unique gimmick, and treats them as about equal. In theory, any one of its characters could have represented the core of that game (though I probably wouldn't have picked a technical character like Helix or Byte & Barq). Even then Spring Man and Ribbon Girl did make the most sense, but Spring Man was already an assist trophy, and regardless of whether or not that mattered, Min Min was selected upon request. Personally, I don't see this kind of thing getting repeated any time soon, especially not for a series that has very much established itself, and the characters that are core to it.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Maybe if Sakurai would just go the route of dialogue bubbles with no voice acting involved we would have some kind of proper story mode.


Even with tons of characters you could make something like that work.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

One offs? EW! We need less of those.


Get these guys outta here!
/

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Thinking about it like that, I think it would be fair to say that while being a mascot/protagonist doesn't make you an insta-pick, all but 1 character picked to represent a game or franchise are core to said game/franchise's identity. Using your examples, Villager may not have been the mascot, but as the player's character with a charming design, they are pretty darn important when it comes to Animal Crossing's identity. The same is true for the Pokémon Trainer, but in their case, they do kind of play second fiddle to Pikachu since it's more the idea of the trainer that's important than the trainer itself. That and the concept probably wasn't feasible until Brawl anyway. Chrom is pretty core to Fire Emblem: Awakening, but so was Robin, as he shared the role as protagonist and played a pivital role for a lot of the game's major themes. The fact that he stood out more was just a bonus.

As far as I see it, Min Min is the sole exception, and she's a bit of a special case. ARMS is a very new IP that designs all of its major characters off of its incredibly unique gimmick, and treats them as about equal. In theory, any one of its characters could have represented the core of that game (though I probably wouldn't have picked a technical character like Helix or Byte & Barq). Even then Spring Man and Ribbon Girl did make the most sense, but Spring Man was already an assist trophy, and regardless of whether or not that mattered, Min Min was selected upon request. Personally, I don't see this kind of thing getting repeated any time soon, especially not for a series that has very much established itself, and the characters that are core to it.

Being an AT wouldn't have mattered for Spring Man. The fact of the matter is, he wasn't knowingly considered as playable on its own. Sakurai only spoke of Ninjara and Min Min, who are neither the core mascots or even had a protagonist role in the story in some "official" capacity. He in fact made it clear he wasn't aware of the actual story. We aren't clear on why, but it was probably something like rule of cool or most interesting(he likes ninjas, as we're already aware).

And yes, the first part makes the most sense. They need to be important to the game's identity(which in the context of this conversation, Bridget is definitely an important one too). Which while Pokemon Trainer, to go back to that one, is quite important, Pikachu was more important to the franchise as a whole. ARMS is somewhat of a special case, true, but not as much as being led to believe. Neither mascot were told to us as considered, as I noted a bit before, but also, the only two were not in a truly special role either. Being reasonably popular isn't that special of a role. Especially when majorly popular characters otherwise were actually big characters for their franchise and/or game. Dark Samus and Ridley are major Villains, Daisy is an iconic character alone, Chrom is the main protagonist of his game, King K. Rool is the main villain. Simon and Richter are the first two protagonists of their series. And of course, we had major Veteran votes on the Poll(mainly what made it so obvious that everyone should return at least once), along with others who got a costume like Isabelle(not that it's the main reason she's in, but she damn well got a lot of votes either way). Min Min was simply just popular, but the particular contest she won was also wayyyyyy later on. Sakurai's words aren't even that clear if he was considered Ninjara and Min Min first during the DLC or the base game. So said contest was probably not all that relevant either. But for that matter, it wasn't the Smash Poll either, which got tons of characters in.

 

[Wonder Smash]

Sol's the face of the franchise no way would Bridget get in as the 1st GG character for Smash.

it'd be like Juri getting in Smash 4 before Ryu.

If GG got multiple characters in Smash I can see Bridget getting in but not as the inaugural pick.

Exactly! Sol as the rep is pretty much a no brainer.

Not sure what the heck was that other post before you was about. Looked very pointless. Sol is one of the main characters, the mascot, and has always represented the series. That's a lot for a minor character to go up against and somebody could still "easily" see one like Bridget as possible? Please! Sounds crazy to me.

 

[Borskaboska]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

While I'm not too much a fan of sheik, I think a good smash roster should have a balance between the obvious series faces and the weirdos nobody thinks about. Like ever MvC needs a Shuma Gorath. If I had to pick some characters that only show up in one game that I think would be neat, I'd go with:
Eve from Mother 1
Guardian from Breath of the Wild
Vivian from Thousand Year Door
Duo from Megaman (he looks cool)

 

[Ivander]

Maybe if Sakurai would just go the route of dialogue bubbles with no voice acting involved we would have some kind of proper story mode.

Mario: "Let's a-go!"
Kirby: "Poyo Poyo!"
Mario: "Okie Dokie?"
Kirby: "Poyo Poyo! Poyo!"
Mario: "Here we go!"

10/10! On par with Shakespeare!

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Mario: "Let's a-go!"
Kirby: "Poyo Poyo!"
Mario: "Okie Dokie?"
Kirby: "Poyo Poyo! Poyo!"
Mario: "Here we go!"

10/10! On par with Shakespeare!

I mean, obviously not everyone is going to contribute a whole lot of dialogue to it but most of the smash roster (Including the Mario characters actually) CAN speak just fine.

Maybe i just have brain rot from playing too many Bandai Namco crossover titles but those games tend to have big rosters and relatively coherent albeit simple plots where all the characters realize there's a big threat brewing so they band together to try to stop it.

Just try to have enemy mooks from the individual franchises instead of generic enemies all over the place and it's already better than subspace.

 

[CannonStreak]

Based on the thing about Sakurai's stance on in-game cutscenes earlier, here is what I have to say about it...

About Sakurai disliking in-game cutscenes being uploaded onto the internet, and those saying he may never do in-game cutscenes in Smash again, I have a semi-counter to that...

...Sakurai also said he disliked the idea of DLC, in fact, Mewtwo was supposed to be the only DLC character in Smash 4, was he not? Then Sakurai made more DLC for that game.

Also, he was not doing Adventure mode in Smash 4, but he did it in Ultimate. Thing is, he may not have had time to make it bigger, due to the focus of "Everyone is Here" and all characters being brought back. Also, as I read on here, I think the Subspace Emissary adventure mode in Brawl helped get characters cut from that game due to how big that adventure mode was.

Also, Sakurai has said before that games like Brawl would be his last Smash Bros. game, when that was not the case.

I am not saying Sakurai will change his mind on in-game cutscenes, hence why this is only a semi-counter and all, but I just wanted to point those things out.

 

[Pupp135]

Re: New Stages for Wii Fit, Punch Out!!, and Duck Hunt.

So... some franchises like Duck Hunt, Wii Fit and Punch Out!! only have one stage. Franchises like Splatoon, ARMS, and a variety of third party franchises only have one stage, but they can clearly come up with more.

I bring Duck Hunt, Wii Fit and Punch Out!! up because I'm wondering how they can be expanded upon in a new game. Can there be more than one stage from these franchises or do their stages cover everything the franchise can provide? Ice Climber managed to have two stages in the franchise, but Icicle Mountain hasn't been seen since Melee and in Ultimate, Summit is the only Ice Climber stage,

Also, obligatory R.O.B. got robbed.

While these franchises could receive new stages, I assume that new stages for these franchises will probably be a lower priority, and if Wii Fit Trainer and/or Duck Hunt return, I’m sure they’d just have their franchise represented by their current stage. In the case of Little Mac, I could see them maybe adding a new stage like the training dojo.

I think Gyromite/Stack Up is a case where there isn’t a layout that interested Sakurai related to these games.

Whether or not they end up managing a character, unrepped franchises are still a relatively untapped vein for stage materials. For example, an Advance Wars stage, Dolphin Park from Wave Race, Venus Lighthouse from Golden Sun, Excitebike Arena, and so on.

Of course, for most of these, their best chance of getting a stage is to get the character to begin with

More stages from franchises without fighters would be nice to see. At the moment, I could see Excitebike Arena having a decent chance of making it. While I liked Project +’s Venus Lighthouse, I feel like its presence will rely on Isaac making it next game unfortunately.

So what do you guys think the adventure mode will look like in the next game?

At least I hope there’s an adventure mode. Wii U/3DS not having a significant single player campaign was disappointing.

Given that Subspace is to taxing from a game development perspective, here are my alternative suggestions:

A slightly expanded version of World of Light may work where get a few (let’s say 5) platforming stages sprinkled in between the battles, and each stage would take place in a separate universe. Effectively, this is kind of like a cross between Melee’s Adventure Mode and World of Light where there is a small number of platforming stages, a decent number of battles, and an interactive map.

My second alternative is a new version of the Great Maze where the player starters a small number of fighters (4-8), and they recruit new fighters as corrupted fighters are defeated. Like with the Great Maze, there will be save state areas. Platforming between fights would take place in different universes.

For both modes, the number of cutscenes would be minimal, where there’s one for the opening, one for the final boss fight, and one for the end.

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

With Sheik being one of my favorites to play as, I’m open to more one-shot characters. Besides Legend of Zelda, I think that Paper Mario would lend itself well with one-shots, and Vivian is the one that I would support from these games.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Being an AT wouldn't have mattered for Spring Man. The fact of the matter is, he wasn't knowingly considered as playable on its own. Sakurai only spoke of Ninjara and Min Min, who are neither the core mascots or even had a protagonist role in the story in some "official" capacity. He in fact made it clear he wasn't aware of the actual story. We aren't clear on why, but it was probably something like rule of cool or most interesting(he likes ninjas, as we're already aware).

And yes, the first part makes the most sense. They need to be important to the game's identity(which in the context of this conversation, Bridget is definitely an important one too). Which while Pokemon Trainer, to go back to that one, is quite important, Pikachu was more important to the franchise as a whole. ARMS is somewhat of a special case, true, but not as much as being led to believe. Neither mascot were told to us as considered, as I noted a bit before, but also, the only two were not in a truly special role either. Being reasonably popular isn't that special of a role. Especially when majorly popular characters otherwise were actually big characters for their franchise and/or game. Dark Samus and Ridley are major Villains, Daisy is an iconic character alone, Chrom is the main protagonist of his game, King K. Rool is the main villain. Simon and Richter are the first two protagonists of their series. And of course, we had major Veteran votes on the Poll(mainly what made it so obvious that everyone should return at least once), along with others who got a costume like Isabelle(not that it's the main reason she's in, but she damn well got a lot of votes either way). Min Min was simply just popular, but the particular contest she won was also wayyyyyy later on. Sakurai's words aren't even that clear if he was considered Ninjara and Min Min first during the DLC or the base game. So said contest was probably not all that relevant either. But for that matter, it wasn't the Smash Poll either, which got tons of characters in.

Erm...You state that Min Min wasn't as special a case as I stated, but then seem to go on about just how different the decision was from other picks. I'm probably missing something here.

At the risk of sounding pedantic, my stance is that:

• ARMS's core identity is it's central mechanic, and since all of its fighters interact with it, they could all represent it in theory.
• This is compounded by the fact that it's a new IP with no story, so even its mascots aren't quite as instantiated as core to the game as most mascots are.
• The deciding factor for Min Min was that the game's director requested her specifically.

As far as what Sakurai said on the matter, he didn't really say that he was only considering Min Min and Ninjara. In fact, he implies that he did consider Spring Man when citing that looking up his name gets you a completely different character. Honestly everything he said seems to support my second point.

Though, I suppose that does contradict the point of my...erm, point. If all of ARMS's fighters could represent its core, and none of the characters were strongly instantiated as a more important part of that core than the others, then Min Min isn't really an exception at all; She does represent a core part of ARMS's identity.

 

[Arcanir]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

True.

There is still a benefit to having characters like Sheik in the roster as they can be very fun additions to the game that bring something unique that many other characters cannot. Additionally, as we've seen even in this very thread, there are many one-shot characters that have proven that they can stand the test of time despite their limited appearances, such as the aforementioned Skull Kid, Magolor, or Midna, or despite their recency leave a huge mark that has people gather around them as a major fan favorite and request like Raven Beak or Oatchi. These characters definitely have an audience and potential that fans would latch onto, and Smash can afford exploring them more often.

 

[SpecterFlower]

As far as I know:

• Sol is still the current main protagonist. The anime may change that, but I dunno how much it will sway character selections.
• When Guilty Gear characters crossover it's usually Sol, Baiken, and/or Ramelethal, with Baiken seeming to appear a lot by herself.
• Sol and Ky have the highest legacy as mascots within the series.
• Sol is constantly described as a rush down character, which would definitley be way different than Ryu, Ken, and Terry, who are more neutral focused, and even barring that, Guilty Gear's mechanics will make him stand out no matter what.
  • That last part is relevant to the more neutral focused Ky when it comes to considering him as a playable character.

EDIT: My guess would still be that Sol's the most likely.

EDIT EDIT:

He has a projectile in Gunflame, but IIRC it's a more niche tool on him, and in Super Smash Bros. it would be genuinely terrible without modifications.

its also worth mentioning that daisuke himself said strive was the end of sols story.


sol himself is a spicy shoto.

he isn't the very basics like ken and ryu, he still has a reversal uppercut that can function as an anti air

a projectile that can go halfscreen, not full screen but considering how sol is played a fullscreen one wouldn't be super interesting on him

and a funky tatsu, ky is the much more traditional shoto whereas sol is a shoto who specs into rushdown and big damage if that makes sense?

hes also just blatantly overtuned rn.

either way i don't think it matters, if theres a guilty gear character i dont see how it wont be bridget. thats just a giant pile of money no other character would make. and we're at a transitional point where sin is taking overthe mantle from sol really.

may as well go to the most popular character from the series.


EDIT: TERRY ISNT A SSHOTO

sol is like terry on steroids, where hes a semi shotoclone rushdown however the actual shoto parts are much more relvant on sol than terry.

half of sols game plan is vicisous viper.'


and also kazuya and min min already set the stage for the main character not being the palybale character at least from a fighting game

EDIT: shes a character that escaped the frnachise and blew up into mainstream interent in a way very few characters ever can.

theres a reason theres so much pushback in the community against bridget merch, it sells so well a lot of companies dont find any value in even producing as much merch for the other characters ,as a fan of the series for years i just dont see any future that arcsys doenst ask sakurai for bridgette to be the character he adds becuase she'll make more money, 100% and by a big margin.

theres a reason theres a meme that bridget fans dont play the game.

i'll be happy to be wrong on this and get sin or maybe even ramlethal or may smth. the next smashgame will probably come out after the next guilty gear game anyway.


also thats not touching on the moveset potential.... imagine min min, but also with a projectile that can act like a boomerand and is activated whenever she wants, and she could banjo dash into you, or she can just, fly away and do kazuya combos.

bridges kits were very weird and unique, especially the plus R one

there are whole graphs to describe her game plan and her unique yo yo throwing and flying gameplay ( you can fly to your yo yo while it is in motion)

it'd be something basically unseen in smash, a true mix up character that has everything but good damage and ko potential,

bridgets offensive pressure is some of the best in the series but the actual damage is pretty garbage if that makes sense


tho the topic of guilty gear does make me question hwo they will handle the music.


I would also like to clarify not much precendece exists for birdget, becuase while she was alwasy a big fan fave amongst the community she only exploded in 2022 after it was revealed she was trans bassically, and added to strive, she went viral after that bassically. so this is only post 2022 so there hasnt been much time for crossovers and gg has alwasy been prettyy corssover averse.

from my memory

Sol in kof mobile and river city girls
baiken in samsho
dizzy in kof mobile
and Jam kuradoberi in river city girls

 

[RileyXY1]

• Super Smash Bros. (1999)
  • Pikachu (1996), Jigglypuff (1996)
• Super Smash Bros. Melee (2001)
  • Pichu (1999)
• Super Smash Bros. Brawl (2008)
  • Pokémon Trainer (1996), Lucario (2006)
• Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3Ds (2014)
  • Greninja (2013)
• Super Smash Bros. Ultimate (2018)
  • Incineroar (2016)

So...Every Pokémon newcomer aside from Pikachu, Jigglypuff, and Pokémon Trainer (Squirtle/Ivysaur/Charizard) had their games come out 1-2 years before their debut in Super Smash Bros., and two of these exceptions were because they were a foundational part of the series. Jigglypuff just kinda got lucky, but also it was the first game and Pokémon Gold/Silver came out within the same year so their eligibility is questionable at a glance. No character appeared in Smash before their debut in their home series.

Pokémon Scarlet/Violet came out in 2022, and Gen 10 is being predicted to come in 2025 or 2026. Assuming the next Super Smash Bros. game is also coming out in 2025 or 2026, that would leave a 3->4 year gap between Gen 9 and it's newcomer or a -1->1 year gap between Gen 10 and next Smash.

If Gen 10 is 2025, and SSBNext is 2026, then Gen 10 is a lock. No doubt about it. It's a bit less certain if they release the same year, and a lot less certain if Gen 10 releases a year afterward. Given that Melee went with Gen 2 and not 3, and Ultimate went with Gen 7 and not 8, my guess would be that they wouldn't pull that far in advance though.

If Gen 10 isn't elligable I'm not sure what they'll do. They could go back and get someone from Gen 9, but that seems a bit farfetch'd because it's no longer in that promo window. They could go back for a popular pick, or someone they find very important like Eevee or Cynthia (not that either pick wouldn't be both) which we don't have too much of a precedent for. Or the next newcomer is Gen 10, but as DLC, which we also don't have a precedant for, and given that they set aside spots on the base roster, seems unlikely.

Although the difference between the project plans and the actual release might be longer than last time. The project plan might have been decided last year, and if Gen 10 is 2026 that would mean that the game is three years out from its actual release at the time the project plan was decided. In the case of Smash 4 the project plan was decided in 2012, immediately after development on Kid Icarus: Uprising wrapped up which is only one year out from XY's release, and Ultimate's project plan was decided in 2016, which was the exact same year Sun and Moon came out. And Gen 10 could potentially be delayed to even further out in case of unforeseen incidents that could happen during production. It might be safer at this point to push the Gen 10 rep to DLC.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Agreed, I'd even argue Diddy is characterized better in Subspace than in in his moveset lol

I like the creative liberty on his Smash attacks, and Side B. I kind of dislike how Peanut Popgun was handled. It needed the dual popguns, and Up B kinda should've worked like R.O.B's / Fox's. Banana Peel is also creative liberty and maybe kinda lazy as it was an item in Brawl, but I excuse it cause it's effective, competitively.

I'd personally want a sort of super charged cartwheel for a Down B, and tail based attacks as in DK64 as Diddy was clearly inspired by that game a lot, or they make it seem so. In general I love the aerials and Smash attacks, so am about 75-80% satisfied but I'd make him far more of a rush down character than he is right now. Probably doesn't help his entry game was Brawl, and defense was most important for any character except Meta Knight.

 

[Kirbeh]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

Trick question, that's an opinion. One I agree with wholeheartedly though.


Re: Guilty Gear

While Bridget has enjoyed a nice surge in popularity since her addition in S2 of Strive, claiming she's the most popular GG character in the franchise overall or the most likely candidate for representation in Smash feels like a huge overestimation of said newfound popularity.

Leaving popularity aside, she also seems like a poor representative of Guilty Gear as a franchise, at least as the sole representative. Casting Sol and Ky aside to push Bridget is basically ignoring the two flagship faces and entire series history in favor of a side character.

I don't think ARMS makes for a good comparison as it's a franchise with a single game under its belt, with no "main" protagonist or proper storyline. Guilty Gear has always had a heavier emphasis on its story and from inception to modern day, it's been focused primarily on characters like Sol, Ky and I-no.

Even if GG were to somehow get multiple reps, Sol and Ky would still likely get first dibs with other legacy/story relevant characters like I-no, Ram and May likely taking priority afterward. I don't really see Bridget getting in unless GG reached a 4th or maybe 5th character. (And even then, she'd still be competing longtime favorites like Pot, Zato and Milia. Plus, new blood like Sin and Nago if they wanted to push for a newer character.)

I like Bridget (she's my Accent Core main,) but I don't think she should get top billing for the wider popularity she's only just begun to get.

 

[SharkLord]

As far as I know:

• Sol is still the current main protagonist. The anime may change that, but I dunno how much it will sway character selections.
• When Guilty Gear characters crossover it's usually Sol, Baiken, and/or Ramelethal, with Baiken seeming to appear a lot by herself.
• Sol and Ky have the highest legacy as mascots within the series.
• Sol is constantly described as a rush down character, which would definitley be way different than Ryu, Ken, and Terry, who are more neutral focused, and even barring that, Guilty Gear's mechanics will make him stand out no matter what.
  • That last part is relevant to the more neutral focused Ky when it comes to considering him as a playable character.

EDIT: My guess would still be that Sol's the most likely.

EDIT EDIT:

He has a projectile in Gunflame, but IIRC it's a more niche tool on him, and in Super Smash Bros. it would be genuinely terrible without modifications.

Is Gunflame a projectile? I seem to remember it's just a mid-range attack that doesn't really go far. More like Terry's aerial Power Wave, I think, and that isn't really a projectile

 

[Kirbeh]

Is Gunflame a projectile? I seem to remember it's just a mid-range attack that doesn't really go far. More like Terry's aerial Power Wave, I think, and that isn't really a projectile

Gunflame in the old games was like Terry's Power Wave.

 

[RouffWestie]

Maybe if Sakurai would just go the route of dialogue bubbles with no voice acting involved we would have some kind of proper story mode.


Even with tons of characters you could make something like that work.

Some of the dojo spirits in WoL have short in-character lines, Timmy and Tommy even have their little text at the end exactly like it's written in Animal crossing, then you have stuff like Kraid's which is out of nowhere actually kind of funny the first time you see it,. They feel like a nice sampler platter for this concept, so I'd be down for it.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Bridget is one of the most iconic characters for many reasons.

Is she? In a franchise with, like, 7 entries, she's only been in 2 of them. And she doesn't really have anything to do with the main plot.

 

[fogbadge]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

of course we should have more of them especially if we're gonna be stuck with a pointless one off like pitoo arbitrarily restricting the roster to exclude them has never made sense to me. then again the roster doesn't exactly make sense anyway

10/10! On par with Shakespeare!

so here 10/10 means overrated

 

[Diddy Kong]

Okay guys.

True or False.

We need more characters like Sheik. A fan favorite that while a one shot, is beloved by their fanbase and is a key part of a monumental game.

Maybe.

Only if said character would have long lasting impact in the series and doesn't hinder same series characters with long-lasting roles. And in a way I really feel just cause we have Sheik for Zelda, that gatekeeps a lot of other one-offs.

So in some cases I'd say yes. Actually the Xenoblade, Mother and in most cases Fire Emblem cast serve as good examples here. But I really don't know. I wouldn't personally want say Skull Kid or Midna above the likes of Impa and Ganon. Or any other Kirby character before Bandana Dee.