Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Oracle Link]

I’m guessing the biggest reason there isn’t a plush of an actual Metroid is that they’re transparent. I’m not really sure what it would look like if you couldn’t see the nucleus inside its body.

I mean i saw a Metroid hat and it looked good!
Sure it simplified the inside to just 3 dots but i think it was very recognizable as a metroid TBH!

 

[Mamboo07]

you haven't played wii fit have you? as others have said there are a lot of mini games that offer a large variety of potential

My pick for a second Wii Fit rep would be straight up the Wii Balance Board itself.

Who would have a whole arsenal of stuff from the many mini games to fight with.

 

[Noipoi]

I’m guessing the biggest reason there isn’t a plush of an actual Metroid is that they’re transparent. I’m not really sure what it would look like if you couldn’t see the nucleus inside its body.

This was probably the same reason it took so long for Reuniclus to get a plush, but they eventually made it work.

Something like this could work for the Metroids.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I’m guessing the biggest reason there isn’t a plush of an actual Metroid is that they’re transparent. I’m not really sure what it would look like if you couldn’t see the nucleus inside its body.

I'm pretty sure I've seen a design that was solid green, but they are at the very least a translucent green so it wouldn't be that much of a leap. Not sure I'd want a plushie of a face hugger though.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Plushies can make any concept cute if done right; I've seen Metroids on Esty with yarn work that makes the idea palatable:

 

[Noipoi]

Plushies can make any concept cute if done right; I've seen Metroids on Esty with yarn work that makes the idea palatable:

Samus’ Wooly Galaxy when?

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Samus’ Wooly Galaxy when?

Honestly you could do a lot worse than having a Metroid game with the Good Feel arts and crafts motif for the entire aesthetic, but otherwise played dead straight.

A Mother Brain made out of clay with spikes replaced by knitting needles? I'd be down for it.

 

[fogbadge]

My pick for a second Wii Fit rep would be straight up the Wii Balance Board itself.

Who would have a whole arsenal of stuff from the many mini games to fight with.

i do agree with you but we were talking about stages

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I've just got my hands on Pikmin 4, and oh boy is this game fun. Naturally, this caused me to think about how to implement the new Pikmin types in Smash:

• Winged Pikmin: I'm pretending Olimar gets a new (and frankly, better) up special. As a normal Pikmin type, Winged Pikmin are absolute wet noodles. They don't even do extra pummel damage like White Pikmin. Instead, they make the opponent floatier when latched on, disrupting their movement.
• Rock Pikmin: Rock Pikmin are a fusion between Yellow and Purple Pikmin. They do average damage and have high health, but move slower, and don't latch on. Their X-factor is that they deal a higher amount of shield damage.
• Ice Pikmin: Ice Pikmin deal below average damage. Smash attacks with these Pikmin deal terrible knockback, but will always freeze opponents, allowing for combos.
• Glow Pikmin: These Pikmin are even more specialized than the others, so it would be a little weird to have these, but you could impliment them similarly to Ice Pikmin, with the difference between stun and freeze mechanics being what differentiates the two.

 

[Opossum]

I've just got my hands on Pikmin 4, and oh boy is this game fun. Naturally, this caused me to think about how to implement the new Pikmin types in Smash:

• Winged Pikmin: I'm pretending Olimar gets a new (and frankly, better) up special. As a normal Pikmin type, Winged Pikmin are absolute wet noodles. They don't even do extra pummel damage like White Pikmin. Instead, they make the opponent floatier when latched on, disrupting their movement.
• Rock Pikmin: Rock Pikmin are a fusion between Yellow and Purple Pikmin. They do average damage and have high health, but move slower, and don't latch on. Their X-factor is that they deal a higher amount of shield damage.
• Ice Pikmin: Ice Pikmin deal below average damage. Smash attacks with these Pikmin deal terrible knockback, but will always freeze opponents, allowing for combos.
• Glow Pikmin: These Pikmin are even more specialized than the others, so it would be a little weird to have these, but you could impliment them similarly to Ice Pikmin, with the difference between stun and freeze mechanics being what differentiates the two.

I can see the vision, but I definitely don't think Ice Pikmin should be a guaranteed Freeze on a Smash Attack.

Freeze is an incredibly powerful effect, and the very few moves in the game that have it always have major drawbacks. Ice Climbers' Blizzard has an incredibly short range and needs a consistent duration to take effect. Sora's Blizzaga has the same drawback but has the added one of being on a cycle. Mr. Game & Watch's Judge has a very short range AND is tied to a roulette. The only one that's semi-consistent is Lucas's PK Freeze, which is still a heavily telegraphed, slightly unruly, arching projectile. But again, it's heavily telegraphed and only really becomes a major problem when you're far off stage.

Putting a guaranteed Freeze on Olimar's projectile Smash Attacks which are powerful and come out pretty quickly would make Olimar the most busted character in the game, and possibly the series, overnight.

 

[Mamboo07]

i do agree with you but we were talking about stages

Obstacle Course from Wii Fit would make a good stage idea.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I can see the vision, but I definitely don't think Ice Pikmin should be a guaranteed Freeze on a Smash Attack.

Freeze is an incredibly powerful effect, and the very few moves in the game that have it always have major drawbacks. Ice Climbers' Blizzard has an incredibly short range and needs a consistent duration to take effect. Sora's Freezaga has the same drawback but has the added one of being on a cycle. Mr. Game & Watch's Judge has a very short range AND is tied to a roulette. The only one that's semi-consistent is Lucas's PK Freeze, which is still a heavily telegraphed, slightly unruly, arching projectile. But again, it's heavily telegraphed and only really becomes a major problem when you're far off stage.

Putting a guaranteed Freeze on Olimar's projectile Smash Attacks which are powerful and come out pretty quickly would make Olimar the most busted character in the game, and possibly the series, overnight.

That's fair. I made it a guarantee because I didn't want to risk over-complicating it with a meter or "hit x times in rapid succession" mechanic, and I do think it will have to be a weaker implementation of it (kinda like the bury down throws) since giving a character like this reliable access to a stun mechanic could get out of hand very easily.

 

[toonito]

RE: ESRB & Smash updates

I am interested in how severe or not the recent ESRB age rating update will be for Smash 6. Will Smash be exempt (IMO most likely) and if they're not exempt would the Smash team up their rating to T? Would they decide to follow the ruling and add characters from T/M+ franchises but omit any mention (and possibly gameplay) of their home series or would they feel its not worth the effort to omit the franchise the character comes from and not include the character in Smash at all? interesting

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I've just got my hands on Pikmin 4, and oh boy is this game fun. Naturally, this caused me to think about how to implement the new Pikmin types in Smash:

• Winged Pikmin: I'm pretending Olimar gets a new (and frankly, better) up special. As a normal Pikmin type, Winged Pikmin are absolute wet noodles. They don't even do extra pummel damage like White Pikmin. Instead, they make the opponent floatier when latched on, disrupting their movement.
• Rock Pikmin: Rock Pikmin are a fusion between Yellow and Purple Pikmin. They do average damage and have high health, but move slower, and don't latch on. Their X-factor is that they deal a higher amount of shield damage.
• Ice Pikmin: Ice Pikmin deal below average damage. Smash attacks with these Pikmin deal terrible knockback, but will always freeze opponents, allowing for combos.
• Glow Pikmin: These Pikmin are even more specialized than the others, so it would be a little weird to have these, but you could impliment them similarly to Ice Pikmin, with the difference between stun and freeze mechanics being what differentiates the two.

I understand that Olimar needs some reworking, but I don't think stuffing more Pikmin types into his kit is the answer. His moveset is already complicated enough as it is. I'd rather have a second Pikmin character take over the other Pikmin types (like Oatchi or Louie).

That said, what's wrong with his Up B? It's a perfect use of the weaker Winged Piikmin.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I understand that Olimar needs some reworking, but I don't think stuffing more Pikmin types into his kit is the answer. His moveset is already complicated enough as it is. I'd rather have a second Pikmin character take over the other Pikmin types (like Oatchi or Louie).

That said, what's wrong with his Up B? It's a perfect use of the weaker Winged Piikmin.

In practice, yeah all of them, with the potential for more later is a bad idea, but it's still fun to think about.


Winged Pikmin is bad because it can require you to kill your Pikmin, which should never happen. You could argue that the way it works punishes you for playing poorly, but recoveries can apply to edge-guards too so it's not necceserilly going to be the case, and if that is the idea, it would be much better if it were tied more directly to keeping Pikmin out of harm's way. I think Pikmin Chain was a much better design for how it interacted with Pikmin, and while we can't go back to it, something that acts like it would be much better.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

EDIT: My internet decided it didn't like this page anymore and posted while showing that I didn't post, even on a refresh. PLS Delet.

 

[Shinuto]

Sakurai mentioned overseas ratings boards are the ones that care about guns and that kind of stuff - and while their stance may have shifted, they were probably why Snake was only implemented with explosives and missile launchers and such.

Regardless, in that statement, Sakurai acknowledged he is attuned to overseas rating board restrictions.

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Also, if the restrictions are going to fundamentally limit how series are labelled in game, and result in some series otherwise just having blank spots where their titles should go in a major region, creating a confusing lack of uniformity in the menus, that's significant enough that it's going to be something the development team has to factor in when designing the game.

And in theory they could release heavily edited Sakurai showcases for the NA audience that scrubs out all mention of the series or gameplay from it. But given how drastically that would alter each presentation, that is something Japan is going to be cognizant of, and factor into their decisions.

If it was just trophy descriptions, changing "Smash Bros x [series]" to "Smash Bros x [character]" for Mii costumes, and general PR, sure, that's something they'd potentially just leave to localization. But these new restrictions, ostensibly, go deeper than that.

North America is the game's biggest market - they're not an afterthought in crafting the game.

I think the Ratings people in BOTH America and Japan need to just get their heads out of their ass and stop acting like they know anything about anything.

 

[Oracle Link]

I'm pretty sure I've seen a design that was solid green, but they are at the very least a translucent green so it wouldn't be that much of a leap. Not sure I'd want a plushie of a face hugger though.

Ive Looked at them and as i suspected the Earlier Stages of metorid are far cuter than their alien Counterparts! (Now the last couple of stages are literally xenomorphs tho)

Plushies can make any concept cute if done right; I've seen Metroids on Esty with yarn work that makes the idea palatable:

AWWWWWW Look at him AWWWW hes so cute!
Yeah i think a mix of this simple cute design and the real design is the sweet spot they should hit! Just get the general shape and feel across with 90% Less veins!

 

[Sucumbio]

Paper Boy. I want Paper Boy in Smash as an AT he can bike around and throw The Daily Sun at you.

 

[HyperSomari64]

Paper Boy. I want Paper Boy in Smash as an AT he can bike around and throw The Daily Sun at you.

I like to see him in Multiversus.
He's from Warner.

 

[Gorgonzales]

we are never getting another subspace ever

 

[Noipoi]

View attachment 392394

we are never getting another subspace ever

The Brawl cutscenes being dropped on YouTube really traumatized Sakurai, huh?

Damn.

 

[RileyXY1]

We could get something like NASB2's Campaign Mode next time.

 

[Slime Scholar]

I realize I probably sound like a hater saying this but SSE felt very fanfictiony and not in a good way. It just seems like a complete waste of resources and I’d rather the single player content be something fun and repeatable rather than see that time and budget put into awkward cutscenes and stages you’re only going to play once.

Many people have suggested a roguelite mode, and that sounds like it could be really cool if done well.

 

[superprincess]

I realize I probably sound like a hater saying this but SSE felt very fanfictiony and not in a good way. It just seems like a complete waste of resources and I’d rather the single player content be something fun and repeatable rather than see that time and budget put into awkward cutscenes and stages you’re only going to play once.

Many people have suggested a roguelite mode, and that sounds like it could be really cool if done well.

Y'all just didn't experience SSE the right way. If you weren't 7 years old playing through it with your siblings, you haven't lived your life to the fullest. /s

On a serious note, the cutscenes weren't awkward, the ones that were meant to make you gag really did their job well! SSE has its problems, but the whole narrative still holds up as a Smash Bros story. The awkwardness is just a product of its time I think.

 

[chocolatejr9]

View attachment 392394

we are never getting another subspace ever

Hot take: World of Light was better anyways.

 

[Sucumbio]

I loved sse but it was kinda long

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Y'all just didn't experience SSE the right way. If you weren't 7 years old playing through it with your siblings, you haven't lived your life to the fullest. /s

On a serious note, the cutscenes weren't awkward, the ones that were meant to make you gag really did their job well! SSE has its problems, but the whole narrative still holds up as a Smash Bros story. The awkwardness is just a product of its time I think.

The narrative was non existent. It was mostly just characters existing in certain areas while none of them got to act like themselves.

The occasional reference or funny moment wasn't worth characters being completely mute. I much prefer the character trailers because they allow each character and series to shine.

 

[Noipoi]

So what do you guys think the adventure mode will look like in the next game?

At least I hope there’s an adventure mode. Wii U/3DS not having a significant single player campaign was disappointing.

 

[Perkilator]

So what do you guys think the adventure mode will look like in the next game?

At least I hope there’s an adventure mode. Wii U/3DS not having a significant single player campaign was disappointing.

Possibly a NASB2-style roguelite like other people (mostly me) have been suggesting.

 

[ScrubReborn]

Since the freeze mechanic came up, I would like it to be mildly reworked. I love freeze moves aesthetically but the way freeze works limits how much you can use it for fighter's attacks since you can't just give a character the ability to freeze a bih with half their moveset. I'd give the freeze effect two variants:

• Freeze Level 1: Characters that get hit just flash blue instead of turning into ice (maybe with accompanying snow trails too), like how the flame and darkness effects work.
• Freeze Level 2: The current freeze effect. Victims would now stay in place without knockback at low knockback thresholds, in the last pose they were in pre-freeze. They'll still take full knockback after a certain threshold is reached, at which point it works more like the normal freeze. Think of it as a cross between the paralyze effect and the current "Freeze". Crappy mockup below:

I can see the concept of stuff like Ice Pikmin being much more bearable with Freeze Level 1 being made a thing.

The Brawl cutscenes being dropped on YouTube really traumatized Sakurai, huh? Damn.

Evil Sakurai be like: Let them leak the cutscenes, we goin' viral

 

[Arcanir]

The SSE narrative was... not good, it felt more like a strung together sequence of events that (potentially due to limitations both in and out of the developer's hands) didn't really make good use of the crossover elements or the characters present outside of maybe a couple things. It also had plot and character points that were not properly conveyed or even flat out not present in a story, with Sakurai even having to make a blog post about them.

I personally agree with Swamp that the character trailers are stronger means of showcasing the characters and integrating them into the world of Smash. They don't have to try to force an entire bloated cast of characters into a story, they can use the smaller scope of the trailers to their advantage and focus on a select few that best shows you what the focal character is about.

 

[Noipoi]

The plot of Subspace Emissary is like a kid trying to craft a narrative by playing with his Nintendo toys.

 

[Ivander]

The plot of Subspace Emissary is like a kid trying to craft a narrative by playing with his Nintendo toys.

So about as good as the stories that the majority of this site's users did with their Nintendo toys.

 

[Laniv]

To me, SSE had plenty of character interaction and I will always treasure that.

That said, the story was almost incomprehensible without the Dojo. And that was without those four

 

[Gorgonzales]

The plot of Subspace Emissary is like a kid trying to craft a narrative by playing with his Nintendo toys.

To be fair though... approaching Subspace's plot in this way does actually have some merit.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

The plot of Subspace Emissary is like a kid trying to craft a narrative by playing with his Nintendo toys.

Actually...Yeah! It's not something I've thought about before, but it's pretty evident from even the first level.

"OK so there's this biiiiiig floating stadium in the sky. Zelda and Peach are in the stands, and then Mario and Kirby trophies fall from the sky and turn into the real Mario and Kirby. And then they fight! Just like in Super Smash Bros. Melee! Oh! and Pit's watching too from Skyworld. After the battle one of them revives the other, and they shake hands.

Then the Halberd appears and turns the sky red with evil clouds! It drops these little purple balls called Shadow Bugs that turn into little evil guys called Primids. Peach and Zelda jump into action to support Mario and Kirby in the fight against them. Then a spooky floaty guy called the Ancient Minister drops a bomb that'll explode in 3 Minutes. Mario runs to disarm it, but before he can do anything Petey Piranha appears and kidnaps Peach and Zelda, then fires a cannon ball at Mario, blasting him out of the stadium. Then Wario appears with a gun! He instakills one of the princesses with it, refuses to elaborate, and leaves. Kirby and the other princess give chase, but before they can get anywhere the bomb explodes and they have to use a Warp Star!"

Cue Roundabout.

 

[ninjahmos]

So what do you guys think the adventure mode will look like in the next game?

At least I hope there’s an adventure mode. Wii U/3DS not having a significant single player campaign was disappointing.

This may be similar to the rougelite idea, but I'm kinda thinking a Metroidvania-style Adventure Mode would be pretty cool.

 

[chocolatejr9]

So about as good as the stories that the majority of this site's users did with their Nintendo toys.

Can confirm, most of mine were just self-insert fanfics at the end of the day (and not even the good kind). Still try, though: the benefit of fan writing is that the only limit is my imagination. Not that I've given such thing much thought anyways, aside from trying to flesh out my "Dragon Ball Heroes but it's Nintendo" idea from awhile back.

In unrelated news, I got into that Zenless Zone Zero game. As part of my newfound obsession, I would like to request permission to discuss hypothetical Smash content from the game.

 

[Stratos]

I like the adventure mode, but for a better scenario in my opinion at least, it would be if the characters have their own universes and something happens and portals are created between those universes. Also for the final boss I'm thinking (though exaggerated) to be something between organic and mechanical on a cellular level, to be something between magic and science, and to be an entity of light and dark.