Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Hydreigonfan01]

Speculation regarding Pac-Man as a newcomer in Smash 4 is by far the worst thing I've ever come across when discussing said topic. The whole "He isn't iconic enough" and/or "He has no history with Nintendo" being reasons he shouldn't be included infuriates me even to this day. And it wasn't just exclusive to this site either. This came up in places like gamefaqs and 4chan. The fact that this was even debated is the real mind blowing thing to me. It's almost like Pac-Man was a joke to these people. The amount of disrespect they gave him is just unreal to me.

Wait, people said Pac-Man isn't iconic enough? I am now very confused, he's the most iconic character on the roster alongside Mario, Pikachu and Sonic.

 

[Shroob]

Wait, people said Pac-Man isn't iconic enough? I am now very confused, he's the most iconic character on the roster alongside Mario, Pikachu and Sonic.

People reeeeeeeeeeally didn't want him because "he has no moves/he's boring", so they made up any excuse they could.

 

[osby]

Wait, people said Pac-Man isn't iconic enough? I am now very confused, he's the most iconic character on the roster alongside Mario, Pikachu and Sonic.

He's not iconic to people who only ever played SNES/N64/GameCube games

 

[N3ON]

The difference is that KOS-MOS has a reputation built on this, in part because of her comparatively-limited number of main games + their overall lukewarm reception. Yes, that will first and foremost come off as me insulting Xenosaga, but it's a testament to KOS-MOS's achievement as a mascot and a reason why her joining the Smash roster would be appropriate.

Okay, but Valkyrie, for example, has also shown up in every Namco crossover KOS-MOS has, plus two others, plus has been referenced in SoulCalibur and Tales as KOS-MOS has, plus some other titles (because there are a lot of cameos within Namco).

And her native games are even less known than KOS-MOS'. If anyone is the queen of crossovers in Namco, it'd probably be her.

 

[Barrubo]

No?

Mii costumes are cheap to make and they're basically free money to put out, especially porting over old ones.


Pretty sure that Sans, despite only being .75 cents, raked in a huge profit comparative to what it took to make.

Oh thank you. Probably remembered it wrong.

 

[Hurricane Rush]

Spoiler: I censored KOS-MOS

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Speculation regarding Pac-Man as a newcomer in Smash 4 is by far the worst thing I've ever come across when discussing said topic. The whole "He isn't iconic enough" and/or "He has no history with Nintendo" being reasons he shouldn't be included infuriates me even to this day. And it wasn't just exclusive to this site either. This came up in places like gamefaqs and 4chan. The fact that this was even debated is the real mind blowing thing to me. It's almost like Pac-Man was a joke to these people. The amount of disrespect they gave him is just unreal to me.

****ing what I only really stayed in the Ridley thread then but people said THAT? I know people were against Pacman out of fear they'd use the cartoon's redesign but PACMAN? Who were these people were they Geno fans or something?

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

Wait, people said Pac-Man isn't iconic enough? I am now very confused, he's the most iconic character on the roster alongside Mario, Pikachu and Sonic.

Exactly! How could anyone even think of saying that about freakin' Pac-Man of all things. Man... those were dark times.

 

[Shroob]

Spoiler: I censored KOS-MOS

Yeah, this looks good.

She didn't even need that much to begin with if it was the XB2 design so this is what I had in mind.

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Just saw Stonehenge!

Any more news?

 

[Kokiden]

I think it’s safe to say people will say anything to discount a character that they think “isn’t worthy.”

It’s just their bias trying to justify their dislike for a character, and to push up their most wanted.

Nothing new.

One look at the roster and anyone with at least 2 functional brain cells can see that it’s possible to create interesting movesets for any character.

 

[Deleted member]

Spoiler: I censored KOS-MOS

That's...amazing. It doesn't detract from the character, and it still keeps the good vibe. I would consider this her likely Smash appearance, SHOULD KOS-MOS' presentation be restricted to Xenoblade content. Though, depending on the developers...they can go with how they please.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

He's not iconic to people who only ever played SNES/N64/GameCube games

This doesn't make any goddamn sense, even that crowd knows Pacman. This fanbase is proof that god is not real

 

[BlackInk]

No?

Mii costumes are cheap to make and they're basically free money to put out, especially porting over old ones.


Pretty sure that Sans, despite only being .75 cents, raked in a huge profit comparative to what it took to make.

Which is why it’ll be hilarious for me if the fighter isn’t Kosmos. Like, wtf they were thinking when they locked Rex’s costume behind 25$?

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

****ing what I only really stayed in the Ridley thread then but people said THAT? I know people were against Pacman out of fear they'd use the cartoon's redesign but PACMAN? Who were these people were they Geno fans or something?

I don't even remember honestly. I do remember this one guy on here (I don't remember his username, but I know he had some red guy/thing as a profile pic) who made a massive thread that was meant to be against Pac-Man's chances and that whole thread spiraled out of control. I don't think I can name anyone else who shared such hatred for the character. That guy was seriously mental and it didn't help that he had people on his side.

 

[Shroob]

This doesn't make any goddamn sense, even that crowd knows Pacman. This fanbase is proof that god is not real

Gwen you knooooooooooow why.

Because PAC MAN, despite being THE arcade character alongside Jumpman/DK, wasn't wanted by the community. Not a character that's been pined for for aeons? fogeddaboutit.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Which is why it’ll be hilarious for me if the fighter isn’t Kosmos. Like, wtf they were thinking when they locked Rex’s costume behind 25$?

They were thinking "Let's piss off this one person in particular, nobody cares about Rex that much outside of future Smashboards user BlackInk". My cat and Sakurai's cat go to the same litter box

 

[Deleted member]

I think it’s safe to say people will say anything to discount a character that they think “isn’t worthy.”

It’s just their bias trying to justify their dislike for a character, and to push up their most wanted.

Nothing new.

One look at the roster and anyone with at least 2 functional brain cells can see that it’s possible to create interesting movesets for any character.

THIS is honestly the biggest problem with the Smash speculation community. They're just aiming for what they believe is what they want and when it's not what they want, they rebuke them. I've suffered this before.

They should probably know that Sakurai, though he listens to what fans want, isn't this genie that grants them ALL their wishes. Wishes are magic, and ALL magic comes with a price. Sakurai may have wanted BK Mii costumes, yet somehow found it difficult to negotiate with Western developers, though this IS possible. IT's just that Sakurai has these rules set up by the companies even we don't know of.

 

[Shroob]

I don't even remember honestly. I do remember this one guy on here (I don't remember his username, but I know he had some red guy/thing as a profile pic) who made a massive thread that was meant to be against Pac-Man's chances and that whole thread spiraled out of control. I don't think I can name anyone else who shared such hatred for the character. That guy was seriously mental and it didn't help that he had people on his side.

Could be worse.


Could be that one dude who acted like 3rd parties were "Ruining the purity of Smash and needed to be kept out." and took an almost racist view on them(Because he was a huge white supremacist as others found out)


I'm not even kidding.

 

[Deleted member]

Do you guys think we’ll get a release date for seven sirens today or naw?

i doubt it because I think they tend to reveal them on their own

also not a single wayforward game was shown in any indie direct.

I really want a release but I don’t think it’s there

 

[I.D.]

I censored KOS-MOS

How many hours days of MS Paint work did this take?

 

[Metal Shop X]

Which is why it’ll be hilarious for me if the fighter isn’t Kosmos. Like, wtf they were thinking when they locked Rex’s costume behind 25$?

They thought he was just a nice bonus that you could get by buying the pass.

Nothing more, nothing less.

You don't need to go into conspirator mode to find that out, and I like Rex, but your theory just doesn't make sense.

 

[BlackInk]

They were thinking "Let's piss off this one person in particular, nobody cares about Rex that much outside of future Smashboards user BlackInk". My cat and Sakurai's cat go to the same litter box

I prefer Zeke and Malos over him. Rex is boring as slice bread.

 

[PSIGuy]

People reeeeeeeeeeally didn't want him because "he has no moves/he's boring", so they made up any excuse they could.

To be fair, half his moveset being punches and kicks and a remaining quarter being random arcade pulls doesn't exactly scream creativity. Especially when he's had other games where he's done stuff like Pacman World that they could've pulled from.

Hence why KOS-MOS would ideally represent more than just Xenosaga, which after Terry I see as a possibility.

Terry was still his Fatal Fury self and the SNK stuff added on top of that. Adding a character and basing on their content on all the games they're in other than their actual series is mastubatory even for Mr. "i made a plant into a fighter because i could" Sakurai. Doing that would be incredibly ****ty and insulting to the character. Gives me flashbacks of a 4chan poster claiming KOS-MOS would get in but be based entirely on her XB2 appearance and that Pyra would be an Echo, as if any of that made sense in the same game where Mega Man, Simon Belmont, Ryu and Terry play so accurately to their original appearances you could pass them off as remakes.

It just seems like a weird inclusion for a fighter pack - a character generally only liked for their design but also has to come with a stage, music and spirits. If her own world isn't interesting or well-received then you might as well make her a post-pass character and not have a stage. It's like a Geno situation, you just need the character. No-one would be upset if Geno was added without a Forest's Mushrooms stage and spirits based on random SMRPG enemies. Save FP#5 for John Darksouls or Jack DoomGuy.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

I'd say the darkest times was the Brawl Speculation. The Smash community was younger and had WAY unrealistic expectations of what was possible.
As a whole we figured if Melee more than doubled the character amount of 64 then we were due at least 50 character roster.

 

[Shroob]

To be fair, half his moveset being punches and kicks and a remaining quarter being random arcade pulls doesn't exactly scream creativity. Especially when he's had other games where he's done stuff like Pacman World that they could've pulled from.


Terry was still his Fatal Fury self and the SNK stuff added on top of that. Adding a character and basing on their content on all the games they're in other than their actual series is mastubatory even for Mr. "i made a plant into a fighter because i could" Sakurai. Doing that would be incredibly ****ty and insulting to the character. Gives me flashbacks of a 4chan poster claiming KOS-MOS would get in but be based entirely on her XB2 appearance and that Pyra would be an Echo, as if any of that made sense in the same game where Mega Man, Simon Belmont, Ryu and Terry play so accurately to their original appearances you could pass them off as remakes.

It just seems like a weird inclusion for a fighter pack - a character generally only liked for their design but also has to come with a stage, music and spirits. If her own world isn't interesting or well-received then you might as well make her a post-pass character and not have a stage. It's like a Geno situation, you just need the character. No-one would be upset if Geno was added without a Forest's Mushrooms stage and spirits based on random SMRPG enemies. Save FP#5 for John Darksouls or Jack DoomGuy.

I mean, to be fair, we have zero idea if post past characters are getting a stage or not.

We don't know anything about this supposed 2nd pass yet other than we're getting more.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Could be worse.


Could be that one dude who acted like 3rd parties were "Ruining the purity of Smash and needed to be kept out." and took an almost racist view on them(Because he was a huge white supremacist as others found out)


I'm not even kidding.

This reminds me of how someone said how the major backlash Hero got from some people was an indicator of racism from a bunch of those individuals and I laughed it off but I also think about how the only useenames I can think of which had people genuinely pissed off were also pretty racist so I'm not sure if I should treat it as a joke

 

[BlackInk]

They thought he was just a nice bonus that you could get by buying the pass.

Nothing more, nothing less.

You don't need to go into conspirator mode to find that out, and I like Rex, but your theory just doesn't make sense.

My theory makes sense because the idiots didn’t consider to make the costume a separate purchase. This means Rex is not purchasable without 25$. There has to be some dumb logic to do that dumb idea.

 

[Deleted member]

I'd say the darkest times was the Brawl Speculation. The Smash community was younger and had WAY unrealistic expectations of what was possible.
As a whole we figured if Melee more than doubled the character amount of 64 then we were due at least 50 character roster.

To be fair I was still in 2nd Grade and barely got the opportunity to explore more Fighting Games...and now here I am.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

My theory makes sense because the idiots didn’t consider to make the costume a separate purchase. This means Rex is not purchasable without 25$. There has to be some dumb logic to do that dumb idea.

We went over this, it's basic capitalism as seen with how common it is in the gaming industry

 

[Shroob]

I'd say the darkest times was the Brawl Speculation. The Smash community was younger and had WAY unrealistic expectations of what was possible.
As a whole we figured if Melee more than doubled the character amount of 64 then we were due at least 50 character roster.

Even if Brawl was full of unkept checks on speculation, it was fun.

Smash 4 was the beginning of all this leak ****. Brawl and Melee had leaks, but back during those times, no one believed them, and they were also partial leaks at best.

Smash 4 started with Gematsu, middle-grounded with Ninkarose, ESRB leak happened, and then datamined DLC.

 

[BlackInk]

We went over this, it's basic capitalism as seen with how common it is in the gaming industry

We’re talking about Nintendo. They have a different mindset to consider. If it was something like EA, I would say “that’s a good point.”

 

[Metal Shop X]

My theory makes sense because the idiots didn’t consider to make the costume a separate purchase. This means Rex is not purchasable without 25$. There has to be some dumb logic to do that dumb idea.

You really have a....special way of thinking about this topic.

Especially for a character you're not even passionate about, if that "as boring as a slice of bread" comment is anything to go by.

Again, he is just a bonus for the road, he doesn't mean anything special about the pass, and if you continue to think there is more to it, all you're going to find is dissapointement.

 

[DarkFoxTeam]

Could be worse.


Could be that one dude who acted like 3rd parties were "Ruining the purity of Smash and needed to be kept out." and took an almost racist view on them(Because he was a huge white supremacist as others found out)


I'm not even kidding.

Holy **** that is worse. Just when you think you've seen it all...

 

[BlackInk]

View attachment 251849
You really have a....special way of thinking thought this.

Especially for a character you're not even passionate about, if that "as boring as a slice of bread" comment is anything to go by.

Again, he is just a bonus for the road, he doesn't mean anything special about the pass, and if you continue to think there is more to it, all you're going to find is dissapointement.

Special? Not exactly. We’re talking about Nintendo. With them, it’s going to be weird.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

We’re talking about Nintendo. They have a different mindset to consider.

*looks at all the bull**** they pulled with f2p games like the Pokemon candy crush games, MKTour, artificial scarcity with literally every collector's item they made, the dripfeed of VC including taking 5 years for the Wii U VC to get N64 games while the Wii had them, etc*


Are you sure about that?

 

[Shroob]

*looks at all the bull**** they pulled with f2p games like the Pokemon candy crush games, MKTour, artificial scarcity with literally every collector's item they made, the dripfeed of VC including taking 5 years for the Wii U VC to get N64 games while the Wii had them, etc*


Are you sure about that?

"B-b-b-b-ut Gwen! Nintendo isn't a big corporation that wants my money! They're my FRIEND! They would NEVER use shady and underhanded business practices! We have something special because Nintendo can do no wrong!"


/s

 

[BlackInk]

*looks at all the bull**** they pulled with f2p games like the Pokemon candy crush games, MKTour, artificial scarcity with literally every collector's item they made, the dripfeed of VC including taking 5 years for the Wii U VC to get N64 games while the Wii had them, etc*


Are you sure about that?

****ing finally, someone tries to point this out.

In my counter argument, they treat mobile differently from Switch games. I don’t recall any Nintendo switch titles that have pulled some stupid BS. It’s quite the opposite, like the dlc for Breath of the Wild, Splatoon 2, and Xenoblade 2.

 

[SKX31]

I'd say the darkest times was the Brawl Speculation. The Smash community was younger and had WAY unrealistic expectations of what was possible.
As a whole we figured if Melee more than doubled the character amount of 64 then we were due at least 50 character roster.

Oh dear...

I know right? I was 15 (E3 2006) to 17 (Brawl's release) - It could be really difficult to sift through the community's reactions to the Dojo posts when people really wanted character upon character. While also having the massive Subspace adventure, etc.

Part of the reason might be that the E3 trailer blew everyones' minds.

*looks at all the bull**** they pulled with f2p games like the Pokemon candy crush games, MKTour, artificial scarcity with literally every collector's item they made, the dripfeed of VC including taking 5 years for the Wii U VC to get N64 games while the Wii had them, etc*


Are you sure about that?

And that's not getting into stuff like Nintendo's harsh exclusivity contracts with third parties during the NES / SNES days, the behind-the-back dealings with Phillips while Sony wasn't even aware etc.

Oh and both those things directly contributed to the PlayStation family becoming Nintendo's fiercest rivals (the latter outright lead to the PS1 becoming a bonafide console, the former lead companies like Square to jump ship to the PS1). Whoops.

 

[Metal Shop X]

"B-b-b-b-ut Gwen! Nintendo isn't a big corporation that wants my money! They're my FRIEND! They would NEVER use shady and underhanded business practices! We have something special because Nintendo can do no wrong!"


/s

That, or

"They think like idiots, so I have to use idiots logic to get them! Which make me smart!"