Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[3BitSaurus]

I see, its kinda funny. Dude knows the Mii costumes but from what I understand didn't knew either Sans or Terry were coming which would make me think that the info seems suspicious at best.

Dunno... I mean, even the most credible leaker around missed stuff too. Taking rumors with a grain of salt is a given, but it's still a step above our usual anonymous rumors.

Good thing we're close to the end of October. I hope we get at least some info for how the next DLC is going to work - not even characters, just a basic rundown.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Honestly I'm astonished Hayabusa keeps popping up in fake leaks. It's not consistent enough with other leaks to say "yeah this checks out" due to the nature of the fighter pass but for a character who doesn't seem to be mainstream alongside not being talked about too much in communities who look for potential leaks, he's been getting everywhere. It's pretty impressive

So has Doom Guy, to be fair. He really only stopped because of Shifty's leak and Terry being announced

 

[GoodGrief741]

Japanese casual gamers' reactions to Doomguy is hilarious. YouTube comments on this kind of videos are not from people like in 5chan so I think these are the actual genuine Japanese normies' impressions.
I want an another Japan/West double reveal.

Translating some of them.
"Not really sure how to say but I don't think this kind of character will never be in."
"This is from a western game or FPS right? I don't think so either."
"Yeah lol. From FPS lol."
"Looks like a character added Samus and Snake then divided by 2."
"If this one can make it in, then even a soldier from Earth Defence Force 5 has a chance. I don't think this will happen."
"Elementary kids might get interested in CERO Z games so no."
"Samus."
"Too Samus."
"I kinda heard of the name but don't know."
"Yeah, most western games are like that here."
"Is he from Pacific Rim?"
"Samus alternate."
"Wikipedia says it's a controversial game with extream violence and gore. I think it's difficult for him to get in."
"Seems Overwatch rep is more likely than this guy as characterization wise."
"HALO-ish character."
"I beat Switch version so personally I like his inclusion. Mii costume is good enough though."
"We already have Snake."
"I love FPS games but most of them are very violent so I think it's hard to get a representation. Even Rathalos' tail amputation mechanic was cut off in the game."
"I think HALO's Master Chief is much better choice than DOOM. It's not gory as DOOM and has actual stories."
"Samus."

The fact that Pacific Rim is a bigger deal than Doom over there gives me joy.

At least someone cares about Pacific Rim...

On the topic of Hayabusa, was there any particular reason people chose to gravitate towards the 5chan characters after that leak happened, especially Doomabusa in particular? From what I understand it was just another inconsequential fake text leak, but it seemed to have influenced the speculation community quite a bit. Even after that leak was disproven with Banjo making it in over Steve, people still held on to the idea that Doomguy and Hayabusa were totally gonna be next and latched onto any fake leak that mentioned one or both of them. The Google leak was basically just the 5chan leak but with Hero and Steve swapped with Banjo and Artorias, but people bought into that one and still tried to defend it with faulty reasoning after Hero and Banjo were both revealed. I'm just trying to figure out why people latched on to the idea of these two in particular despite no other evidence for their inclusion. Did people really like the idea of both of them that much? Was there something about the 5chan leak that I missed? This whole thing is such an anomaly to me and I'm not sure if I'll ever understand it.

Doom and Ninja Gaiden are two franchises that make an incredible amount of sense to be in Smash. That whole leak gained traction because everyone could see those characters getting in. Contrast to the recent leak with weird **** like Jonesy, Claire for RE, Scribblenauts et al. Making sense goes a long way for a leak and its characters. Add to that that they're two characters most people would like, with very little intra-company competition, and it becomes a circle.

 

[Sour Supreme]

To be fair, Toby Fox is just...Toby himself. Not a company full of people who can let things slip through the cracks.

Not to mention that Sans really seems like he came about organically when Toby and Sakurai were introduced. It's quite possible that these other costumes have been planned for the DLC cycle prior to the realization of Undertale content in the game. Sans really could have come out whenever, I'm sure it was just a matter of the costume and track being ready at the same time that Banjo and Kazooie dropped.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

So has Doom Guy, to be fair. He really only stopped because of Shifty's leak and Terry being announced

Ehhhhh there's a massive difference here, Ninja Gaiden's dormant and Doom 2016 happened with a Switch port later down the line and even a sequel which is highly anticipated

 

[Sour Supreme]

Ehhhhh there's a massive difference here, Ninja Gaiden's dormant and Doom 2016 happened with a Switch port later down the line and even a sequel which is highly anticipated

Don't fuhget that DOOM 64 is getting a full re-release on Switch.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Ehhhhh there's a massive difference here, Ninja Gaiden's dormant and Doom 2016 happened with a Switch port later down the line and even a sequel which is highly anticipated

I mean, they would both be getting in on legacy more than their most recent releases I feel like. So, they're birds of a different feather, but they still flock together haha.

 

[8-peacock-8]

All the DOOM games, except for a few ports, just appearing on the Switch too.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Don't fuhget that DOOM 64 is getting a full re-release on Switch.

Ehhhhhh that's really not as big of a factor as the others I mentioned but sure

 

[Playstation Guy 1000]

I going to be honest here,when we do get a 2nd western character,who do you think goes to Smash Bros first, Crash Bandicoot or Doomslayer.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I mean, they would both be getting in on legacy more than their most recent releases I feel like. So, they're birds of a different feather, but they still flock together haha.

Not my argument, Doom 2016 was met with huge praise and success, meaning there was a lot of buzz when it turned out to be an excellent game. This in turn revived the franchise as people forget how nobody was looking forward to it until it actually came out and that Doom was dormant for a while. The freshly revitalized fanbase ended up wanting more too as the DLC was only for the multiplayer and hey, a new Smash game! Wouldn't it be cool to see Doom Slayer in it right after seeing such amazing footage of Eternaĺ?

TLDR new game means more people paying attention and wanting Doom in Smash

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I going to be honest here,when we do get a 2nd western character,who do you think goes to Smash Bros first, Crash Bandicoot or Doomslayer.

Honestly, Crash. He’s been a big name since the 90’s, was suspiciously absent from PlayStation All Stars, and has a fair amount of popularity in Japan.

Also HOT TAKE INCOMING - Doom Slayer is better off as a Mii costume. Sure, there’s a legacy behind the character, but his games aren’t exactly “popular” in Japan; the goriness being one of those factors.

 

[Sour Supreme]

Not my argument, Doom 2016 was met with huge praise and success, meaning there was a lot of buzz when it turned out to be an excellent game. This in turn revived the franchise as people forget how nobody was looking forward to it until it actually came out and that Doom was dormant for a while. The freshly revitalized fanbase ended up wanting more too as the DLC was only for the multiplayer and hey, a new Smash game! Wouldn't it be cool to see Doom Slayer in it right after seeing such amazing footage of Eternaĺ?

TLDR new game means more people paying attention and wanting Doom in Smash

I don't know about that. I personally had a couple of friends who have always loved DOOM, and yapped about Doom 2016 for months to me about its release.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I don't know about that. I personally had a couple of friends who have always loved DOOM, and yapped about Doom 2016 for months to me about its release.

Huh. I remember people being super pessimistic as it had all the signs that it'd be bad as seen with the awful boxart, almost exclusive multiplayer focus for the marketing and review embargoes until the game actually came out

 

[Sour Supreme]

Huh. I remember people being super pessimistic as it had all the signs that it'd be bad as seen with the awful boxart, almost exclusive multiplayer focus for the marketing and review embargoes until the game actually came out

I see where you're coming from regardless. The general demographic of people who buy video games definitely didn't have DOOM on the mind, and I can definitely see how people would have foreseen it being a poorly done reboot with the staples of most redundant FPS games that get **** out these days. (Especially back in 2016)

 

[GoodGrief741]

I going to be honest here,when we do get a 2nd western character,who do you think goes to Smash Bros first, Crash Bandicoot or Doomslayer.

Crash for sure.

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Ehhhhhh that's really not as big of a factor as the others I mentioned but sure

Agreed, especially since the 64 port isn't even Switch-exclusive. A lot of the Doom stuff the Switch has been getting are multiplatform releases.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

I going to be honest here,when we do get a 2nd western character,who do you think goes to Smash Bros first, Crash Bandicoot or Doomslayer.

From the papagenos' source, Crash Bandicoot is most likely coming first unless they pull a fast one on us.

Also HOT TAKE INCOMING - Doom Slayer is better off as a Mii costume. Sure, there’s a legacy behind the character, but his games aren’t exactly “popular” in Japan; the goriness being one of those factors.

S T R O N G D I S A G R E E !

Doom Guy should definitely be a fighter! Sakurai has catered to the Western fanbase from time to time with Little Mac and Ridley (Banjo & Kazooie still had good Japanese support so I don't count them). The game needs another western catered character to coincide with an eastern catered character.

So I guess the question now is, who would be a super popular Japanese character that isn't well known in the west that could coincide with Doom Guy?

 

[AntagonisticGalaxyCetacea]

Also HOT TAKE INCOMING - Doom Slayer is better off as a Mii costume. Sure, there’s a legacy behind the character, but his games aren’t exactly “popular” in Japan; the goriness being one of those factors.

This could be said about a lot of representation already in the game though. Especially when we got a whining ****storm with Hero

The Japanese community's comments about Doom Slayer is proof enough to me that the DLC is not going to roll over 100% with everyone, which is the entire point. Not everything is going to satisfy everyone, some character additions open new doors to people unfamiliar with certain franchises.

 

[Deleted member]

I going to be honest here,when we do get a 2nd western character,who do you think goes to Smash Bros first, Crash Bandicoot or Doomslayer.

I'm going out on a limb and saying neither, but who'd be the next Western character in Smash will remain a mystery to me.

I'm also sitting here thinking how hilarious it'd be if Harada actually did tell Sakurai not to include the characters on those For Smash accounts (which included Crash twice and Doom Slayer), but then again, after the Snake incident at Evo, is he actually joking?

 

[OrpheusTelos]

From the papagenos' source, Crash Bandicoot is most likely coming first unless they pull a fast one on us.



S T R O N G D I S A G R E E !

Doom Guy should definitely be a fighter! Sakurai has catered to the Western fanbase from time to time with Little Mac and Ridley (Banjo & Kazooie still had good Japanese support so I don't count them). The game needs another western catered character to coincide with an eastern catered character.

So I guess the question now is, who would be a super popular Japanese character that isn't well known in the west that could coincide with Doom Guy?

I know they're not necessarily unknown in the west, but I could totally see Doomguy being revealed alongside someone like Byleth at E3 to shut up the anti-Fire Emblem crowd, kinda like what Banjo did for Hero.

 

[Will]

Honestly, Crash. He’s been a big name since the 90’s, was suspiciously absent from PlayStation All Stars, and has a fair amount of popularity in Japan.

Also HOT TAKE INCOMING - Doom Slayer is better off as a Mii costume. Sure, there’s a legacy behind the character, but his games aren’t exactly “popular” in Japan; the goriness being one of those factors.

you really hate to see it

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I know they're not necessarily unknown in the west, but I could totally see Doomguy being revealed alongside someone like Byleth at E3 to shut up the anti-Fire Emblem crowd, kinda like what Banjo did for Hero.

Oh no those assholes will never shut up and blame Fire Emblem for a bird ****ting on their car or dropping their 2 euro banana milkshake at KFC, making a fool of themselves in front of everyone making you too embarassed to ask for a new one

 

[Deleted member]

I know they're not necessarily unknown in the west, but I could totally see Doomguy being revealed alongside someone like Byleth at E3 to shut up the anti-Fire Emblem crowd, kinda like what Banjo did for Hero.

The trailer starts with Doom Guy shooting up Garreg Mach

 

[KatKit]

Here's my take on a 2B moveset. Her unique character gimmick is that her side special is simply a dash (called Agression Shift in Soul Calibur) that allows various follow-up attacks by inputting the A or B buttons and directional inputs (neutral, up, down, or side). Thus, her side B dash gives her 8 additional attack follow-ups. Overall, she is a highly fun yet technical character with various attacks for many situations. I'm throwing in the entire kitchen sink. This is as true to character as it gets; there are references galore!


Neutral Special: Pod fire. By pressing the B button, 2B uses her pod to fire three weak pellets across the screen. They have no knockback. If you continue to press the button, the pellets continue to fire. However, when you hold down the button instead of pressing it, 2B charges and fires an aimable laser beam instead.

Side special: Aggression Shift. In Nier Automata, it's the move where she zips around after holding the dodge button. In Smash, it's a dash that allows her to perform various follow-up special attacks. On it's own, it's good for maneuvering around the stage. After using two follow-ups, there's a 25 second cooldown. Below is each follow-up attack. It's a lot, so I'll put it in a spoiler tag:

Spoiler

Wire (Side-B follow-up)

By pressing side B again, 2B shoots out a wire that pulls her closer to the opponent. Doubles as a tether recovery.


Bomb (Neutral B follow-up)

By pressing neutral B after side special, 2B throws out two explosive projectiles from her pod.


Missile (Up-B follow-up)

2B quickly launches herself upwards with her pod. Can be angled. Can be used as a stage recovery.


Slow Field (Down-B follow-up)

2B shoots a gravity field in front of her that lasts 8 seconds. It slows down players in its range. Deals no damage.


Blade (Neutral A follow-up)

By pressing neutral A after side special, 2B uses a spinning blade attack that first hits behind her, then rotates around and hits in front of her. Time the hit rotation for combo extensions.


Hammer (side-A Follow-up)

By pressing side-A after side special, 2B throws out a slow yet powerful hammer attack with great range. It can meteor-smash opponents by the ledge.


Spear (Down-A follow-up)

By pressing down-A after side special, 2B uses a spear attack that hits in both directions. The top of the spear has a sweetspot that briefly pins down enemies, so it's best to use on airborne opponents.


Wave (up-A follow-up)

While performed on the ground, 2B jumps in the air and throws out a projectile with a shockwave. The further away from the center of the projectile, the less damage it deals to opponents. While performing the move in the air, 2B only leaps in the air diagonally and doesn't throw out the projectile.

Down special: Angler Stance (Aww, yeeeah!): Press it to make 2B sit down on a holographic chair. Doubles as a taunt. Press B again to throw out the pod and wrangle up some poor fool. Basically, you throw opponents with your futuristic fishing rod, Isabelle style.

Up-special: 2B uses her longsword to thrust herself in the air. Like Witch Twist, the ground version sends her in the air, and let's her continue her assault from there. Unlike Witch Twitch, it can't be used again in the air if it was performed on the ground.

Final Smash: Yorha flight unit. 2B uses her Volt pod program. If it hits, she then throws out this attack and vanishes. Cue cinematic cutscene of 2B flying around and blasting the place in her mecha.


Up taunt: Flashlight. 2B flickers her pod's lights on/off. If used repeatedly on AI opponents under level 9, it aggros them.

Side Taunt: Scanner.

2B's pod scans the ground. There's a 1/42 chance he'll find a weak recovery item you can pull (that heals %1) or leave for your opponent, and he'll say "Item detected" (Did I not say the entire kitchen sink?!)

Down taunt: She pets her pod and he says "affinity increased".

Walking animation:

Idle animations:

Changes depending on if she's unarmed or not. If she's not holding any weapons, she'll simply stretch/yawn.

Otherwise, she'll twirl those puppies around:

Dash attack

Spoiler

Forward Tilt: 2B pokes the opponent with her spear. Can be chained up to three times. Each time slightly propels 2B forward.

Up Tilt: 2B slashes the opponent with her katana in an upward motion. At low percentages, she can usually follow-up with a jump into an aerial attack.

Down Tilt: When held, 2B gets on her knees and spins around with her katana like so. The held version hits in both directions but isn't very fast. When pressed, she throws out a rapid crouching kick forward on the ground.

Jab: The rapid jab version (holding the A button) involves 2B pummeling with her combat bracers. Conversely, pressing the A button 3 times is her standard katana slash combo.

Smash attack:

Although very stylish, 2B impractically spins around with her longsword. Very slow but has good range. For balancing purposes, it only hits in front of her. Pressing it again gives her a second spin like so. Pray you don't get hit by it. When fully charged, 2B also throws the sword at you.

Up Smash: 2B twirls her spear around a couple of times kinda fast. Like Link and Metaknight's up-smash, it's a multi-hitting attack. It'll look like this except she doesn't glide forward.

D-Smash: 2B spins with her longsword in a circular motion. I'm noticing a pattern here... Obviously, PlatinumGames knows that spinning is awesome lol. When fully charged, 2B throws the sword at you.


Neutral Air: Pod spin kick. 2B holds onto her pod and performs a spin kick. I can't find an image of this, but it's very reminiscent of Jak and Daxter. If you continue to hold down the A button after the attack, 2B grabs the pod and slowly descends to the ground. It slightly elevates her midair, so it doubles as a third jump.

Back Air: She lunges at you with her combat bracers kinda like at the end of this combo.

Forward Air: She slashes forward with her katana. Can be used up to three times consecutively.

Up Air: 2B stabs directly above her with her spear.

Down air: This downward sword thrust. Or maybe this, but her skirt defies gravity this time.


Forward Throw: This

Back Throw: 2B throws the opponent behind her and fires a missile from her pod.

Down Throw: Mirage.

2B briefly vanishes while rapidly slashing the opponent. Briefly has i-frames on start-up.

Up throw: Yeet heel.

2B kicks opponents upward into the stratosphere. Is a kill throw when opponents are at high percentages.


Miscellaneous: Perfect Dodge

If timed properly, 2B has an after-image dodge that functions similarly to Bayonetta's 'Bat Within'.

Her shield break animation mirrors her self-destruct recovery animation (except her skirt doesn't blow up):

Victory animation: Glory to Mankind.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Also HOT TAKE INCOMING - Doom Slayer is better off as a Mii costume. Sure, there’s a legacy behind the character, but his games aren’t exactly “popular” in Japan; the goriness being one of those factors.

Lack of popularity in one large region shouldn't stop a character from becoming a fighter if it has a ton of popularity elsewhere.

The trailer starts with Doom Guy shooting up Garreg Mach

*stifles laughter* That's so awful.

...

At least get it ravaged by demons first.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

you really hate to see it

TO BE FAIR THOUGH!

Ridley and Dark Samus are from Metroid, an already represented franchise since the first Smash and was a series born in Japan

and Banjo himself is pretty popular in Japan too. Not AS popular as Minecraft or Crash, but moreso than most other Microsoft exclusive franchises like Halo. Also keep in mind the first two BK games were originally on N64.


BAM.

 

[Will]

TO BE FAIR THOUGH!

Ridley and Dark Samus are from Metroid, an already represented franchise since the first Smash and was a series born in Japan

and Banjo himself is pretty popular in Japan too. Not AS popular as Minecraft or Crash, but moreso than most other Microsoft exclusive franchises like Halo. Also keep in mind the first two BK games were originally on N64.


BAM.

DOOM was on SNES, N64 (as an exclusive no less), and now on Switch. Sakurai made in-person comments that compliment the developers of DOOM and DOOM's legacy on FPS games in general.

 

[AntagonisticGalaxyCetacea]

I know they're not necessarily unknown in the west, but I could totally see Doomguy being revealed alongside someone like Byleth at E3 to shut up the anti-Fire Emblem crowd, kinda like what Banjo did for Hero.

Brave of Sakurai to announce Samus and Marth echos as DLC

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

TO BE FAIR THOUGH!

Ridley and Dark Samus are from Metroid, an already represented franchise since the first Smash and was a series born in Japan

and Banjo himself is pretty popular in Japan too. Not AS popular as Minecraft or Crash, but moreso than most other Microsoft exclusive franchises like Halo. Also keep in mind the first two BK games were originally on N64.


BAM.

While these things are true, they're only tangentially related to your original argument; Characters not popular in Japan shouldn't be playable. Unless you're suggesting that this rule should only apply to 3rd party characters, in which case it sounds a bit more like you're trying to justify not wanting Doom's protagonist. It's fine if you don't want it (I'm indifferent myself) but this reasoning doesn't really make much sense as in the end, it doesn't matter who buys the character so long as Nintendo turns a profit.

 

[NoBS]

man, does japan think all shooters are samus like how people over here think all jrpg characters with a sword are the same?

Japan is not into guns and shooting like here, it’s a complete cultural difference.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

OK so Ryce, an insider who leaked almost everything about MVCI, says he believes this. He isn't backing it but he thinks it's legit. ****, now I'm inclined to somewhat trust it more now

 

[Deleted member]

OK so Ryce, an insider who leaked almost everything about MVCI, says he believes this. He isn't backing it but he thinks it's legit. ****, now I'm inclined to somewhat trust it more now

Backing what? Hayabusa or Crash?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Backing what? Hayabusa or Crash?

Backing what? Hayabusa or Crash?

Crash. Fwiw Ryce was pushing against Grinch back then too

 

[Deleted member]

Crash. Fwiw Ryce was pushing against Grinch back then too

O ho ho ho ho ho ho. He also backed Shinobi's claim to Banjo. I'm feeling very optimistic suddenly.

 

[krokotopia101]

Dat's allot of likes I so randomly received on alert.

 

[SNEKeater]

Between Crash and Doomslayer, Crash without a doubt is more popular and probably more likely to happen first. We will have to wait and see.

This buzz about Crash, hoo boy, I hope it is true. Crash is my childhood and one of my most wanteds for Smash.

For next E3 I bet that the double reveal will be Doomslayer and Reimu. At least the contrast between the two characters would be funny and a great source of memes.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Smash fandom right now: **** yeah Crash is cool

Smash fandom in a month: Ugh I hate Crash I'm so tired about talking about him all the time I hope literally anyone else gets in

 

[perfectchaos83]

OK so Ryce, an insider who leaked almost everything about MVCI, says he believes this. He isn't backing it but he thinks it's legit. ****, now I'm inclined to somewhat trust it more now

Imagine not posting a source.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Imagine not posting a source.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/su...d-6-hungry-like-the-wolf.142560/post-25605136
Again, he isn't backing it specifically