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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Mushroomguy12

Smash Hero
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Nov 23, 2018
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Nintendo Land Theme Parks, Incorporated
Never say never.

Also Rhythm Heaven isn't nearly as quotable.

It'd still be nice though.

Sire, you may choose what characters from X franchise get in. Which ones do you pick?
Um. All of them.
No sire.
Why not?
No sire.
...
Why not?


(Remind me to post a serious list later. I have to do homework first or I'll procrastinate for the rest of the day.)
When it comes to characters from Sony, I will say never. I’d sooner think we’d see Goku first.

Rhythm Heaven is Nintendo’s homegrown rhythm franchise. Why would they take from their direct competitor when they have one of their own? Who cares about “quotability”? It’s like saying Batman and Superman were more iconic pre-MCU so they should be in the Avengers over actual Marvel characters. The world doesn’t work that way.
 
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GoodGrief741

Smash Legend
Joined
Sep 22, 2012
Messages
10,169
Can confirm as a French Myself. We do say "Doomlike" just like people like to use "Metroidvania".
That's interesting. Do you call all FPSs that or just the ones that resemble the style/engine of OG Doom?
Are said franchises also allowed as ATs? Because hoo boy, Dota 2 would have tons of insane(ly fun) ATs. Think "Getting sucked into a black hole for 4 seconds straight while Duke Nukem's voice taunts you." tier (It's really obvious without the filter).

Other than that, I'd choose:

* ARMS, just to see how far you could push those characters and their respective abilities.
* Style Savvy, for similar reasons. How many mechanics and gimmicks could you push? Lets find out! While looking absolutely fabolous!
* Chibi-Robo. Dunno if you could make infinite newcomers out of this one, but why not?
* *Looks at the Spirit list* Famicom Mukashibanashi. It's the series Goku and Chao (the spirit) is from. Because now Goku can fight! Together with his friends!
* *Tempted to put the GBA Napoleon game in here too, but naah...* Instead, lets go with the Entire Warriors franchise. Dynasty, Hyrule, Fire Emblem Warriors. Wait, why is the character select screen flooded?

(Edit: I regret nothing!)
Finally someone else who cares about that Napoleon game!
 

Calamitas

Smash Champion
Joined
Aug 17, 2018
Messages
2,689
Location
Germany
Infinite Newcomer resources? That's gonna be a long list, so I'll just put this into a spoiler.

:ultmario: Waluigi, Fawful, Paper Mario, Captain Toad
:ultdk: Dixie Kong, Cranky Kong, Funky Kong, Lord Fredrick
:ultlink: Vaati, Wolf Link & Midna, Skull Kid, Ghirahim, Toon Zelda, Beast Ganon
:ultpikachu: Hoenn Pokémon Trainer (Blaziken, Grovyle, Mudkip), N & Zoroark, Meowth, Lycanroc, Scizor, Deoxys, Riolu, Minccino
:ultkirby: Bandana Waddle Dee
:ultsamus: Space Pirate, Sylux
:ultfox: Krystal
:ultness: Ninten, Porky
:ultfalcon: Black Shadow, Samurai Goroh
:ultmarth: Anna, Celica, Alm, Sigurd, Seliph, Leif, Roy is removed, Eliwood, Hector, Lyn, Eirika, Ephraim, Lyon, Micaiah, Kris, Azura, Byleth, Edelgard, Claude, Dimitri
:ultpit: Medusa, Hades, decloned Dark Pit with weapons not used by regular Pit, Magnus, Phosphora
:ultwario: Ashley
:ultolimar: Alph, Louie
:ultvillager: Tom Nook, Resetti
:ultshulk: Dunban, Riki, Melia, Fiora, Zanza, Elma, Cross, Ga Jiarg, Lao, L, Celica (just for the name overlap alone lmao), H.B., Zeke, Mòrag, Malos, Team Lora (Lora, Jin, Haze)
:ultsnake: Raiden
:ultsonic: Tails, Knuckles, Shadow, Blaze, Silver, Dr Eggman
:ultmegaman: Mega Man X, Zero, Mega Man Volnutt, Mega Man.exe, Mega Man Starforce, Dr Wily
:ultryu: Chun Li
:ultcloud: Tifa, Sephiroth
:ultbayonetta: Jeanna, Rodin, Masked Lumen Sage
:ultinkling: Octoling (using different weapon types from Inkling)

New Series:
Golden Sun - Isaac, Felix, Jenna
The Last Story - Zael (with Dagran alt)
Pandora's Tower - Aeron
Ace Attorney - Phoenix Wright, Miles Edgeworth, Apollo Justice, Athena Cykes,
Okami - Amaterasu, Chibiterasu, Susano, Waka, Oki
Bravely Default - Tiz, Agnés, Edea and Ringabel all in one slot (+ coming with Octopath Traveler music as well)
Dark Souls - The Chosen Undead
Warcraft - Thrall, Arthas (Lich King), Jaina, Illidan

. . .That's all I got.
 

ZeldaPlayer87

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 13, 2014
Messages
307
Location
Stockton, California
My prediction for the final pass character character is either Doom Slayer, Dante, Jill Valentine, Hayabusa or Arle.

Beyond that, I think we’ll get some or all of the above plus Geno, Crash and maybe some 1st party peeps like Dixie Kong and Sylux.
 

RoboFist

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
374
Oooooh, fun. Here's my Dream "Infinite Budget" DLC:

1. Shantae. Somehow, in Ultimate alone, we got Daisy, Simon, and Banjo, three of my most-wanted for ages. To make this perfect, I just need Shantae :sadeyes:

2. The Prince from Katamari Damacy. He would be a blast and you know it.

3. Amaterasu from Okami. I'm actually kind of blown away that she hasn't made it in. I know her game has never really sold all that well, but man, I feel like Sakurai would've had a field day with her moveset. I just want more quadrupedal fighters in this game so badly, guys. Speaking of...

4. Wolf Link/Midna. The fact that Midna, one of Legend of Zelda's greatest characters, is negated to an AT never sat right with me. Promote her to fighter.

5. Tetra from Wind Waker. Zelda needs more reps than just another Link, and as much as I'd love to see Skull Kid, I'd just change Young Link's Final Smash to Fierce Diety for that sweet, sweet Majora's Mask content.

6. Urbosa from Breath of the Wild...No, really, Zelda needs more reps.

7. Sceptile from Pokemon Ruby/Sapphire. I think it's something of a shame that we just kinda skipped over Gen 3 in terms of Smash representation.

8. Geno (I'm counting him as a Mario character, dang it!) Not for me, but for all of my buddies who are on pins and needles during every single damn Smash-related Direct. Just give the doll his due.

9. A Tetromino. No, I'm actually being dead serious. I desperately want to see what Sakurai and his team would do with it.

10. Leon Kennedy, complete with both Racoon City PD and RE4 Jacket costumes. It seems so obvious to have an RE character despite the fact that he would probably have a super boring moveset, but we need RE4 representation in this game somehow...wait...

10.5. The Merchant from RE4. Make it happen, Sakurai! I'll buy it at a high price!
Okay, here's 10 more for an even 20:

11. Paper Mario. Again, shocked that this hasn't happened yet, especially with the moveset potential.

12. King Boo. We have Bowser, so give Luigi his franchise's big bad. A big ol' ghost could be super fun to play as.

13. Dixie Kong. The Rare family really doesn't feel complete without one of the SNES's greatest heroines.

14. Chun-Li or Cammy, I'll take either to go with Ryu and Ken.

15. Lyn from Fire Emblem, aka Best Girl Without Exception.

16. Tron Bonne from Mega Man Legends. She kicked *** in Marvel vs Capcom so it stands to reason she'd do the same in Smash.

17. Ms. Pac-Man Why hasn't this happened yet it's so obvious.

18. Metal Sonic. Everyone wants Shadow. They're wrong.

19. Dr. Robotnik/Eggman, preferably in his little floating egg car thing with the ball and chain and whatnot.

20. A three-in-one Pokemon Trainer-Style Young Link with Deku Link, Goron Link, and Zora Link because that would be the best damn character in the entire damn game.

Hang on. I just thought of my 21st and final pick to round out my dream roster and make this my personal ultimate Smash Bros game:

Rocket.

Robot on Wheels.

Seeing Goemon's Mii costume got me all nostalgic for those random one-off N64 titles, and Rocket Robot on Wheels was my jam as a kid. Nobody else at school had ever heard of it, but my buddy and I would pour hours into it. It was Sucker Punch's first ever game (yes, that Sucker Punch), came in this snazzy red cartridge, and one of the minigames involved creating and then riding in your own rollercoaster. It was incredible.

If I really wanted to make the perfect Smash game with no limitations and complete disregard for any other audience except myself, this purple, spraypainting, omnipedal little robot would definitely be the final big reveal. And nobody would sob tears of joy except for me.
 

Us3inMN

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I just want my boi Karate Joe in Smash. Or at least a Rhythm Heaven rep.

Please Sakurai, show us some love.
 

RouffWestie

Smash Lord
Joined
Oct 27, 2013
Messages
1,239
Location
Georgia
So the takeaway I'm getting from a lot of comments here is:

First party Nintendo reps are pointless from now on, and we should just focus on whatever crazy third party rep we can get in here, because hype.
The beautiful irony about this idea being pushed that a third-party will be automatically be more, "hype," because nobody would believe that they'd be in a huge crossover of popular game characters, is that they're actually exactly what anybody could believe would be in a huge crossover of popular game characters.
 

Hadokeyblade

Smash Legend
Joined
Dec 5, 2018
Messages
10,821
Honestly smash bros is near perfect as is for me. There aren't many characters from franchise's already in that i truly want, so I'll list them: Shadow, Blaziken, Chun-Li and Tetra, Rock.

New franchises: Sora, Professor Layton, Kazuma Kiryu, Crash and Rachet.
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
I hope at some point we get an update that adds more assist trophies to the game, it feels really wrong to have so many newcomers from new franchise's with no assist to go along with them.
Hopefully, with HRC said to be the last new mode added to Smash, maybe we'll get to have some more additional content like ATs and items.

And while we're at it, we need Fan back in Smash dammit.
 

Rie Sonomura

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Hopefully, with HRC said to be the last new mode added to Smash, maybe we'll get to have some more additional content like ATs and items.

And while we're at it, we need Fan back in Smash dammit.
Home Run is the last offline mode. Weren’t some more online modes datamined?
 

Mushroomguy12

Smash Hero
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Nov 23, 2018
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Oh boy. Infinite DLC?

:ultmario:: Waluigi, Toad/Toadette, Paper Mario, Birdo, Pauline, Geno
:ultdk:: Dixie Kong, Funky Kong, Cranky Kong, Tiny Kong
:ultlink:: Impa, Hilda (:ultzelda: Echo), Midna, Linkle (:ultlink: Echo), Skull Kid, Toon Zelda/Tetra, Tingle, Lana
:ultpikachu:: Eevee, Meowth, Gardevoir
:ultwario:: Captain Syrup, Mona, Ashley
:ultfalcon:: Jody Summer, Black Shadow
:ultfox:: Krystal
:ultinkling:: Octoling (:ultinkling: Echo)
:ultkirby:: Bandanna Dee, Adeleine and Ribbon, Marx
:ultmarth:: Lyn, Anna, Byleth, Tiki
:ultness:: Ninten (:ultness: Echo), Kumatora (:ultlucas: Echo), Paula (:ultness: Echo)
:ultolimar:: :ultalph: (:ultolimar: Echo, his own separate character) Louie would become a costume for :ultolimar: and Brittany and Charlie would be costumes for :ultalph:.
:ultpit:: Viridi, Medusa (:ultpalutena: Echo)
:ultshulk:: (Rex & Pyra/Mythra)/Mecha-Fiora/Elma
:ultvillager:: Tom Nook
:ultwiifittrainer::ultyoshi::ulticeclimbers::ultgnw::ultrob::ultsamus::ultlittlemac::ultduckhunt:: Nothing. All of these are perfectly represented as is.
:ultsonic:: Tails, Shadow
:ultmegaman:: Protoman, Roll
:ultpacman:: Ms. Pac-Man (:ultpacman: Echo)
:ultbayonetta:: Jeanne (:ultbayonetta: Echo)
:ultryu:: Chun-Li, Cammy
:ultcloud:: Terra Branford, Cecil Harvey, Tifa Lockhart
:ultjoker:: Yu Narukami, Flynn
:ulthero:: Heroines (:ulthero: Echo)
:ultsnake::ultsimon::ultbanjokazooie:: Nothing
:ult_terry:: Mai Shiranui, Kyo Kusanagi, Nakoruru

New Franchises:
ARMS: Spring Man, Ribbon Girl, Min Min, Ninjara, Twintelle, Mechanica
Golden Sun: Isaac, Felix, Jenna
Astral Chain: Officer Howard
Advance Wars: Andy, Sami
Rhythm Heaven: Marshal
Panel de Pon: Lip
Famicom Detective Club: Ayumi Tachibana
The Legendary Starfy: Starfy
Mach Rider: Mach Rider
Style Savvy: Trendsetter
Sin and Punishment: Saki
Dillon's Rolling Western: Dillon
Chibi-Robo: Chibi-Robo
Custom Robo: Ray MK III
Ace Attorney: Phoenix Wright, Apollo Justice, Athena Cykes
Kingdom Hearts: Sora, Roxas (Sora Echo)
Resident Evil: Jill Valentine, Leon Kennedy
Darkstalkers: Morrigan Aensland
Professor Layton: Professor Layton, Katrielle Layton
Crash: Crash Bandicoot, Coco Bandicoot (Crash Echo)
Tales: Lloyd Irving, Yuri Lowell
Puyo Puyo: Arle Nadja
Chrono Trigger: Chrono
Bomberman: Bomberman
Tomb Raider: Lara Croft
Bravely Default: (Tiz, Agnes, Ringabel, Edea)
Perfect Dark: Joanna Dark
Shantae: Shantae
Rayman: Rayman
Touhou: Reimu
Ninja Gaiden: Ryu Hayabusa
Dead or Alive: Kasumi, Ayane
Spyro: Spyro the Dragon
A Hat in Time: Hat Kid
Shovel Knight: Shovel Knight
The World Ends With You: Neku
Minecraft: Steve/Alex
Overwatch: Tracer
Nights into Dreams: Nights
Xenosaga: KOS-MOS
Undertale: Frisk
Klonoa: Klonoa
Okami: Amateratsu
The Wonderful 101: Wonder Red
 
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DaybreakHorizon

Beauty in the Chaos
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So the takeaway I'm getting from a lot of comments here is:

First party Nintendo reps are pointless from now on, and we should just focus on whatever crazy third party rep we can get in here, because hype.

Unless it's a Xenoblade or Fire Emblem rep. Those should get in.

Also Officer Howard from Astral Chain, which came out about a week ago. Totally should be in.

And Geno and Waluigi because their fanbases won't stop bringing them up constantly, so they deserve to be in.

Did I get that right?
That's rather reductionist. The argument is that first parties can't compare to third parties in most aspects except for appealing to existing Smash fans.

It's only been stated a couple of times, but it's also worth noting we're pretty much at the bottom of the barrel in terms of first parties. Popularity and relevance are two important things right now, and characters like Rex & Pyra, Geno, Waluigi, Fire Emblem, etc. have that. Other first party characters don't.

You can disagree with or dislike the argument, but acting sarcastic and angry about it won't get anyone anywhere.
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

Smash Legend
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Snake Man's stage from Metal Blade Solid
When it comes to characters from Sony, I will say never. I’d sooner think we’d see Goku first.

Rhythm Heaven is Nintendo’s homegrown rhythm franchise. Who cares about “quotability”? It’s like saying Batman and Superman were more iconic pre-MCU so they should be in the Avengers. The world doesn’t work that way.
To be clear I wasn't saying (or at least didn't mean) that Parappa would be better. It was just a comment. A lot of Rhythm Heaven's tunes are bangers as well so I say let's add both if it's possible. Also there's no way we'll see a 4th party before a Sony rep. I'll eat a tomato if that happens.



And I hate tomatoes.
(Remind me to post a serious list later. I have to do homework first or I'll procrastinate for the rest of the day.)
I'm done.

I picked my favorites because "all of them" is a boring answer. Blue characters are ones that I believe would be all around good additions (though maybe not if added all at once). Red Characters are for funsies.

Super Mario-Paper Mario, Chain Chomp, Captain Toad, Hammer Bros, Goomba
Pokémon-Arceus, Gladio & Silvally, Growlithe, Vanilluxe, Sceptile, Blaziken
Mega Man-Proto Man, Bass, X, Zero, Dr. Wily, Sigma, Centaur Man, Roll
Xenoblade Chronicles-Team Elma, Rex, Pyra & Mythra, Rikki
Rhythm Heaven-Rhythm Choir
A Boy and His Blob-Boy & Blob
Okami-Amaterasu, Chibiterasu
Darkstalkers-Morrigan, John Talbain, B. B. Hood
Final Fantasy-Black Mage
ZanZarah: The Hidden Portal-Amy
 

RoboFist

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 10, 2018
Messages
374
Honestly smash bros is near perfect as is for me. There aren't many characters from franchise's already in that i truly want, so I'll list them: Shadow, Blaziken, Chun-Li and Tetra, Rock.

New franchises: Sora, Professor Layton, Kazuma Kiryu, Crash and Rachet.
Being 1,000% honest, I'm right there with you. I managed to come up with 20 newcomers I'd like to see added, but even with those I know I'm just being greedy. The roster could be done after this fighter's pass and I would absolutely be satisfied and still in awe of it.
 

OrpheusTelos

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 9, 2018
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Portland, OR
One thing I'd like to know is that if we had an infinite budge meaning infinite newcomers, who would people here add? Only rule is only 5 new franchises, but those can have as many newcomers as you want
Ooooh this sounds fun! Be warned, I'm gonna go all out on this because infinite budget = infinite possibilities. I'm gonna spoiler tag this because this ended up being way longer than I expected.

New Franchises:

Undertale: Frisk, Sans & Papyrus tag-team, Undyne, and Kris

Resident Evil: RE1/RE2 Jill, Leon, Chris, and Claire as alts of each other, Albert Wesker, and RE5 Chris as a Charizard semi-clone for ****s and giggles

Yakuza: Kazuma Kiryu and Goro Majima

Kingdom Hearts: Sora with Roxas as an echo

Devil May Cry: Dante and maybe Vergil. Just make the "Featuring Dante from the Devil May Cry series" meme real

Current Franchises:

Mario: Waluigi, Geno, Paper Mario, and Toad

Donkey Kong: Dixie, Cranky, and Lanky Kong

Zelda: Impa, King Harkinian from the CDi games, Tingle, Decloned Ganondorf, and change Young Ling into a 3-in-1 fighter utilizing the different masks

Kirby: Bandana Dee and Adeline

Pokemon: PMD Grovyle, Mimikyu, and Magikarp as an obligatory joke character

Earthbound: Ninten

Fire Emblem: Byleth, Lyn, Ana, Edelgard, basically every character from Three Houses so Ferdinand von Aegir can be a top tier

Kid Icarus: Viridi and Medusa

Metal Gear: Big Boss and Raiden

Sonic: Eggman, Tails, & Knuckles

Animal Crossing: Tom Nook

Mega Man: Zero

Xenoblade: Elma and (I guess) Rex

Street Fighter: Chun-Li

Final Fantasy: Terra, Zidane, Tidus, and Sephiroth

Bayonetta: Jeanne

Castlevania: Alucard

Persona: Yu and Aigis. If SMT counts, throw in Demi-Fiend and Jack Frost

Fatal Fury/King of Fighters (Terry's stage is KOF so I'm counting it): Kyo and Geese
 
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cothero

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 29, 2014
Messages
1,194
Location
Campo Grande, MS - Brazil
Honestly smash bros is near perfect as is for me. There aren't many characters from franchise's already in that i truly want, so I'll list them: Shadow, Blaziken, Chun-Li and Tetra, Rock.

New franchises: Sora, Professor Layton, Kazuma Kiryu, Crash and Rachet.
I saw this video some years ago where someone modded Blaziken into Captain Falcon in Smash 4 and it blew my mind. It just fits so perfectly that it could work as an echo.

 
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SpectreJordan

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PERSONAL OPINION

I think this current Fighter’s Pass we’re in was tailored to appeal to as global a demographic as possible, and it kind of shows: Hero seemed tailored to Japanese audiences, Banjo & Kazooie for US audiences, and Terry for the Latin American audiences (Joker, I think, acted as the bombshell to got people hyped for the Pass). Remember, Nintendo picked these characters, so it makes sense to assume that there was a financial and business-savvy reason as to why.

If we’re looking for some kind of trend to predict the final DLC fighter in this Pass (which, again, is impossible, but I’ll humor this thread anyway), I think we need to look at what’s popular in China.

Now, I’m super ignorant on global video gaming trends, but a quick Google search tells me that home consoles and arcade cabinets were actually banned from China in 2000, and the ban was only lifted in 2015. Because of this, PC games and eSports exploded in popularity. So if Nintendo really wants to appeal to a Chinese audience with this 5th fighter, we probably need to look at MMOs, MOBAs, hero shooters, and other PC-centric titles. Which will probably make a large chunk of the Smash Bros fanbase extremely unhappy.

But humor me here. If we were going to get a character that represented PC gaming, who could it be?

Minecraft’s Steve is the most obvious choice to me. He has global appeal, represents indie gaming, and – again – hails from what may be the biggest game of the 21st century so far (whether we want to admit it or not). Of all the characters in the Fighter’s Pass so far, a Minecraft rep would be the first truly recognizable character to Chinese audiences (except maybe Terry?). Again, between the Shovel Knight AT and the Sans Mii Costume, I really think that Sakurai's been prepping us for a legitimate indie rep, and Steve could be it.

This could also be the best time to get a genuine Blizzard or Valve rep. A lot of people are terrified of getting an Overwatch character (which, as someone who loves Overwatch, I completely understand and even agree with), but what about someone from World of Warcraft? I’ve never played the game, but I always considered it the game that brought MMOs into the mainstream, and the characters (especially the…orcs? Are they orcs? I dunno, whatever) have a pretty distinct and visually appealing art style. If we go the Steam route, I could honestly see someone like Chell getting in (leave her portal-centric moveset up to Sakurai, and I’d love to see a stage featuring GLaDOS).

Again though, I am hilariously ignorant when it comes to PC games, but I’m sure there are plenty of franchises and characters that could fit into a Smash game.
King of Fighters is actually really popular in China, so Terry could cover China as well. The most views for a fighting game tourney ever was a Chinese KOF tournament.

One thing I'd like to know is that if we had an infinite budge meaning infinite newcomers, who would people here add? Only rule is only 5 new franchises, but those can have as many newcomers as you want
Master Chief
Sora
Doom Slayer
Crash
Jill Valentine/Leon Kennedy/Chris Redfield/Claire Redfield (
Like Bowser Jr & Hero)

Waluigi
Captain Toad
Captain Syrup
Dixie Kong
Impa
Skull Kid
Magolor
Lyn
Edelgard
Sceptile
Sword/Shield Pokemon
Black Shadow
Porky
Medusa
Hades
Octoling
Raiden
Dr Eggman
Knuckles
Zero
Sigma
Chun-Li
M Bison
Tifa
Terra (Final Fantasy VI)
Alucard
Yu (Persona 4)
Gruntilda
Mai
The Arbiter
Riku
Coco Bandicoot
Dr Cortex
Wesker
 
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Rie Sonomura

fly octo fly
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I should probably add Nakoruru, Lip, and Ayumi Tachibana to my list... idk
 

merchantofsalt

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Mar 18, 2018
Messages
117
I don't think it makes a lot of sense to have an "infinite budget" for newcomers but for some arbitrary reason it's limited to five franchises. If they have an infinite budget... ?

Anyway, I'm going to go for a best-case scenario and assume those sixteen "dummy" slots really are getting filled by three fighter passes (plus Piranha Plant). In which case, I'd love to end up with something like this:

01. Piranha Plant (Super Mario)
02. Joker (Persona)
03. Hero (Dragon Quest)
04. Banjo & Kazooie (Banjo-Kazooie)
05. Terry (Fatal Fury)
06. Lara (Tomb Raider)
07. Arle (Madou Monogatari / Puyo Puyo)
08. Geno (Super Mario RPG)
09. Leon (Resident Evil)
10. Rhythm Girl (Rhythm Heaven)
11. Heihachi (Tekken)
12. Chosen Undead (Dark Souls)
13. Bub & Bob (Bubble Bobble / Bust-a-Move)
14. Kunio / Riki (Kunio-kun / River City)
15. Hayabusa (Ninja Gaiden / Dead or Alive)
16. Crash (Crash Bandicoot)

But as others have said, the Smash roster is already so huge that asking for more seems almost improper...
 
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CardStealer1

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New Series (First Party)
  1. Mr G&W style Rhythm Heaven character
  2. Isaac (Golden Sun)
  3. Saki Amamiya (Sin & Punishment)
  4. Ray Mk (Custom Robo)
  5. Min Min/Springman (Arms)
  6. Astral Chain character
New Series (Third Party)
  1. Phoenix Wright
  2. Rayman
  3. Doomguy
  4. Sora
  5. Ezio
  6. Ryu Hayabusa
  7. Shantae

Already Repped Series
  1. Waluigi, Geno, E.Gadd
  2. Dixie Kong
  3. Skull Kid, Midna and Wolf, Ghirahim
  4. Blaziken (Echo of Cap), Sceptile, Gengar
  5. Ephraim, Byleth
  6. Bandana Dee, Marx
  7. Porky
  8. Don’t wanna think more rn
 

Al-kīmiyā'

Smash the State
Premium
Joined
Apr 22, 2010
Messages
2,582
I hope at some point we get an update that adds more assist trophies to the game, it feels really wrong to have so many newcomers from new franchise's with no assist to go along with them.
I wish they would add the ability to pick one or more assist trophies and use them like assists in other games. I don't understand why they would put so much work into them and not add this feature.
 

EricTheGamerman

Smash Master
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Messages
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I wish they would add the ability to pick one or more assist trophies and use them like assists in other games. I don't understand why they would put so much work into them and not add this feature.
That doesn't really work all that well when a significant number of them do stage wide effects and even the ones that exist have hugely varying degrees of effectiveness. You'd have to actually try to balance assist trophies and their powers for such a mode, and that's honestly a **** ton of effort for probably not a big enough payoff. Especially considering how few of them actually have pronounced and quick effects, like you'd be spawning a character for 15 seconds of craziness and a Rathalos would destroy you while a Waluigi could be easily dealt with...

I just don't know if that mechanic works with assist trophies at all, it seems like it would need to be built from the ground up to be such a thing.
 

Al-kīmiyā'

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That doesn't really work all that well when a significant number of them do stage wide effects and even the ones that exist have hugely varying degrees of effectiveness. You'd have to actually try to balance assist trophies and their powers for such a mode, and that's honestly a **** ton of effort for probably not a big enough payoff. Especially considering how few of them actually have pronounced and quick effects, like you'd be spawning a character for 15 seconds of craziness and a Rathalos would destroy you while a Waluigi could be easily dealt with...

I just don't know if that mechanic works with assist trophies at all, it seems like it would need to be built from the ground up to be such a thing.
Why would they try to balance it? It's not for competitive play.
 

DaybreakHorizon

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Since I have 0 knowledge about either Earthbound and Pokemon from what we got who should be added according to the general consensus ?
People think a Gen 8 Pokémon is kinda likely, but it's not like anyone is actively supporting one.

Earthbound is agreed upon by most to be well represented as is, but some people want Porky.
 

ROBnWatch

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Since I have 0 knowledge about either Earthbound and Pokemon from what we got who should be added according to the general consensus ?
From Pokemon, there’s a whole bunch of possibilities. Individual Pokemon (Sceptile, Decidueye, a Gen 8 rep) as well as Trainers who represent other regions (for instance, a Gen 3 or Gen 5 Trainer with 3 starter Pokemon from that region).

EarthBound has far less to choose from (comparatively, being a smaller franchise). Main party characters (each game in the series has 4 in the main party) or a main antagonist (Porky or Masked Man would likely work better than Giygas) would be the best options. Though Ninten could easily be made into an Echo for Ness.

These are all just general ideas if another character from either series were to get in.

Geez that was a lot of parenthesis...
 
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SMAASH! Puppy

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Why would they try to balance it? It's not for competitive play.
Game balance is required in all aspects of a game. It's why bad characters like King K. Rool are nerfed anyway because in the hands of a casual against other casuals they can feel cheap or unfun. With the Assist Trophy example, if your favorite assist trophy is Riki you're going to have a bad time against players that use The Moon. One is situationally helpful RNG, the other is Magic Burst, but no RNG and you get to keep using your special attacks.
 

TheCJBrine

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Y’know, Pikmin is kinda poorly represented imo, but the moves, item and stages are nice. It’s just:

> Olimar and Alph don’t have their voices

> Alph isn’t even an echo, and he could’ve used Rock Pikmin and maybe something different with the Winged Pikmin. The poor lad currently always has his eyes watering in pain unless he takes more pain from someone’s attack so he can close his eyes

> Why the heck do we only have two music tracks from actual areas (three only if you count Garden of Hope also getting a remix along with the original track); don’t get me wrong, the main theme, end of day, and menu music are all very nice, but seriously? The only area music tracks aside from Forest/Garden of Hope are all from Hey! Pikmin (which seems like a nice spinoff tbh (haven’t played it) but c’mon, not even Wistful Wilds...?)

Honestly, it feels like they didn’t put all that much work into the captains themselves, even though they’re just as much a part of the game as the Pikmin are.

Maybe they’ll add Bulborb and remedy all of this.
 
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Prince777

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I should probably add Nakoruru, Lip, and Ayumi Tachibana to my list... idk
Interesting choices, but I feel that Nakoruru won't be playable in this game, unfortunately. I'm hoping that Terry's playstyle implements a Pokemon Trainer esque, where two other FF or KoF characters team with Terry and you'll be able to choose one of the three before a match. This would distinguish him from Ken and make him a lot more interesting to play.

The likeliest candidates to team with him include Mai and Atheena since they're some of the most popular SNK characters who didn't appear in the trailer.
 

Al-kīmiyā'

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Game balance is required in all aspects of a game. It's why bad characters like King K. Rool are nerfed anyway because in the hands of a casual against other casuals they can feel cheap or unfun. With the Assist Trophy example, if your favorite assist trophy is Riki you're going to have a bad time against players that use The Moon. One is situationally helpful RNG, the other is Magic Burst, but no RNG and you get to keep using your special attacks.
I don't think developers should feel guilty for "friends" not willing to play with a semblance of fairness.
 

Hadokeyblade

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I saw this video some years ago where someone modded Blaziken into Captain Falcon in Smash 4 and it blew my mind. It just fits so perfectly that it could work as an echo.

I know right? There was probably some rule that echoes could only be from the franchise they were cloned from but this feels so perfect.
 

Llort A. Ton

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Infintie budget for DLC?
A dlc that permanently cuts every other character in the game forever including the ones you already bought
Thwomp (He is immune to the previous DLC and has a Blue Thwomp echo)
 

MorbidMiraj

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That's rather reductionist. The argument is that first parties can't compare to third parties in most aspects except for appealing to existing Smash fans.

It's only been stated a couple of times, but it's also worth noting we're pretty much at the bottom of the barrel in terms of first parties. Popularity and relevance are two important things right now, and characters like Rex & Pyra, Geno, Waluigi, Fire Emblem, etc. have that. Other first party characters don't.

You can disagree with or dislike the argument, but acting sarcastic and angry about it won't get anyone anywhere.
I was being more cynical than anything else, but I'll better explain what my concerns are.

I'd say my issues tie more into how people are saying Smash should only focus on third party or recently popular IPs from now on. Are we going to get Fortnite girl, Clash of Clans angry warrior guy, and Call of Duty bro because they're super popular third party gaming IPs? (Probably not because they're Western IPs, but still...) I doubt many people here would like that, but the general audience might be interested. I mean, Sega & All-Stars Racing Transformed had Danica Patrick and Wreck-It-Ralph of all things in there, so who knows what we'd get with a mega popular game like Smash Ultimate that every company wants to be a part of. All those joke rosters featuring Mickey Mouse or Sailor Moon from the Melee/Brawl days may become a reality by the time Smash 7 comes around.

Personally, I wish Smash would focus on Nintendo IPs, particularly ones that aren't currently mega popular, because there's still plenty left to mine. And sometimes their inclusion in Smash gives them new life and they become hits. For instance, back in the original Smash 64 days, most people had never heard of Earthbound/Mother. Ness's inclusion made people curious, and now it's well-known franchise, and we finally got the first game brought over. Now people want a Mother 3 rep. If one got in, you bet we'd finally see that game translated, too.

In Melee, we got Marth and Roy. Nobody in the West knew what Fire Emblem was. Because of Smash, we started to get the games brought over here, and now Fire Emblem is a super popular Nintendo IP and has more reps in Smash than even Zelda. Most other Nintendo franchises get 1 -3 reps, max.

In Brawl, we got Pit. Very few people knew of Kid Icarus. People were curious about him, and Sakurai even made a new game himself to celebrate the revival of a dormant IP, and then put multiple playable characters and assist trophies into subsequent games.

In Smash 4, Mega Man came back in his classic form after a really rough period of ups and downs. Since then, we've had a revival in interest and got Mega Man 11, plus a plethora of collections, and possibly more new games coming. Also a new anime series but let's not talk about that.

Just look at how people are reacting to Terry. "What's SNK?". Yikes. Also I'm sure that now Banjo is back, his games may get a re-release of some sort. Maybe even another new game, since interest in him is the highest it's been in years.

Also, Sakurai likes to throw in curveballs like ROB, Wii Fit Trainer, Duck Hunt, Piranha Plant, etc. They were not popular demands. He likely put those in to mix things up and be experimental, while also honoring Nintendo's history. I'm glad he does this because it keeps things from being so predictably trendy.

So, what I'm trying to say is that people are pushing for the latest Fire Emblem game's protags, or whatever current popular third party game is out there are kind of missing the notion that Smash revives dormant or forgotten IPs, and sometimes makes your current favorite franchise a reality. Why not spread the love and give some other franchises a chance instead of just putting in an 8th Fire Emblem or a 9th Pokemon rep, or try to grab characters from franchises that have no history with Nintendo at all?
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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I don't think developers should feel guilty for "friends" not willing to play with a semblance of fairness.
No but they should have a situation where one player can't use most of the options in the game because one of them is basically a win button. It's disheartening to the player and pointless to develop (unless it was some silly really hard to get unlockable in which case breaking the balance is the point. Even then it's not something that would be fun for long).

Now people want a Mother 3 rep. If one got in, you bet we'd finally see that game translated, too.
:ultlucas:"Joining Smash didn't bring back my game..." *cries*
 

MorbidMiraj

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No but they should have a situation where one player can't use most of the options in the game because one of them is basically a win button. It's disheartening to the player and pointless to develop (unless it was some silly really hard to get unlockable in which case breaking the balance is the point. Even then it's not something that would be fun for long).


:ultlucas:"Joining Smash didn't bring back my game..." *cries*
It's so weird that Mother 3 hasn't been localized yet. I heard there were some issues with music licensing, but I'm sure they could've worked that out by now.
 

Hadokeyblade

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I was being more cynical than anything else, but I'll better explain what my concerns are.

I'd say my issues tie more into how people are saying Smash should only focus on third party or recently popular IPs from now on. Are we going to get Fortnite girl, Clash of Clans angry warrior guy, and Call of Duty bro because they're super popular third party gaming IPs? (Probably not because they're Western IPs, but still...) I doubt many people here would like that, but the general audience might be interested. I mean, Sega & All-Stars Racing Transformed had Danica Patrick and Wreck-It-Ralph of all things in there, so who knows what we'd get with a mega popular game like Smash Ultimate that every company wants to be a part of. All those joke rosters featuring Mickey Mouse or Sailor Moon from the Melee/Brawl days may become a reality by the time Smash 7 comes around.

Personally, I wish Smash would focus on Nintendo IPs, particularly ones that aren't currently mega popular, because there's still plenty left to mine. And sometimes their inclusion in Smash gives them new life and they become hits. For instance, back in the original Smash 64 days, most people had never heard of Earthbound/Mother. Ness's inclusion made people curious, and now it's well-known franchise, and we finally got the first game brought over. Now people want a Mother 3 rep. If one got in, you bet we'd finally see that game translated, too.

In Melee, we got Marth and Roy. Nobody in the West knew what Fire Emblem was. Because of Smash, we started to get the games brought over here, and now Fire Emblem is a super popular Nintendo IP and has more reps in Smash than even Zelda. Most other Nintendo franchises get 1 -3 reps, max.

In Brawl, we got Pit. Very few people knew of Kid Icarus. People were curious about him, and Sakurai even made a new game himself to celebrate the revival of a dormant IP, and then put multiple playable characters and assist trophies into subsequent games.

In Smash 4, Mega Man came back in his classic form after a really rough period of ups and downs. Since then, we've had a revival in interest and got Mega Man 11, plus a plethora of collections, and possibly more new games coming. Also a new anime series but let's not talk about that.

Just look at how people are reacting to Terry. "What's SNK?". Yikes. Also I'm sure that now Banjo is back, his games may get a re-release of some sort. Maybe even another new game, since interest in him is the highest it's been in years.

Also, Sakurai likes to throw in curveballs like ROB, Wii Fit Trainer, Duck Hunt, Piranha Plant, etc. They were not popular demands. He likely put those in to mix things up and be experimental, while also honoring Nintendo's history. I'm glad he does this because it keeps things from being so predictably trendy.

So, what I'm trying to say is that people are pushing for the latest Fire Emblem game's protags, or whatever current popular third party game is out there are kind of missing the notion that Smash revives dormant or forgotten IPs, and sometimes makes your current favorite franchise a reality. Why not spread the love and give some other franchises a chance instead of just putting in an 8th Fire Emblem or a 9th Pokemon rep, or try to grab characters from franchises that have no history with Nintendo at all?
To be fair, while Smash has a habit of giving dying or dead Nintendo franchise's a chance in the spot light, so far Ultimate has more or less been doing to same thing with its third party inclusion, Castlevania, Fatal fury and Banjo Kazzoie might just get the resurgence they need thanks to this, and one could say Dragon quest needed this as well outside of Japan.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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It's so weird that Mother 3 hasn't been localized yet. I heard there were some issues with music licensing, but I'm sure they could've worked that out by now.
I dunno. Pretty much every battle them in the game (of which there are a lot of) would need to be licensed. If just one of them asks for too much money the entire project has to be called off (or replaced with something new which is a pretty big gamble considering how good these songs are). Some are based off of classical music which I believe is in the public domain but others are owned by DC and who knows what else. Top it with some really hard to translate dialogue (they're not going to use the fan translation) and potential content issues I could see why this could be an impossible task.
 

TheCJBrine

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It's so weird that Mother 3 hasn't been localized yet. I heard there were some issues with music licensing, but I'm sure they could've worked that out by now.
EarthBound has some music stuffs, too. I think samples fall under fair use if they’re short enough/aren’t directly the original (which is what the composer did, make short tunes based off of other things i.e. Batman while making the rest of a track completely original), but idk. I fear they may be reluctant to localize it due to people possibly getting political about it it’s not like there aren’t similar or much worse games

I dunno. Pretty much every battle them in the game (of which there are a lot of) would need to be licensed. If just one of them asks for too much money the entire project has to be called off (or replaced with something new which is a pretty big gamble considering how good these songs are). Some are based off of classical music which I believe is in the public domain but others are owned by DC and who knows what else. Top it with some really hard to translate dialogue (they're not going to use the fan translation) and potential content issues I could see why this could be an impossible task.
Mother 3 has battle themes that are 100% original, really I think most of the themes are either original or take from the public domain save for a short Batman thing and maybe Beatles or whatever. Whenever a theme takes something, though, it’s usually a short sample in the game’s own soundfont (one theme may completely take something but I’m sure it was one of the classical compositions in the public domain).
 
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D

Deleted member

Guest
I was being more cynical than anything else, but I'll better explain what my concerns are.

I'd say my issues tie more into how people are saying Smash should only focus on third party or recently popular IPs from now on. Are we going to get Fortnite girl, Clash of Clans angry warrior guy, and Call of Duty bro because they're super popular third party gaming IPs? (Probably not because they're Western IPs, but still...) I doubt many people here would like that, but the general audience might be interested. I mean, Sega & All-Stars Racing Transformed had Danica Patrick and Wreck-It-Ralph of all things in there, so who knows what we'd get with a mega popular game like Smash Ultimate that every company wants to be a part of. All those joke rosters featuring Mickey Mouse or Sailor Moon from the Melee/Brawl days may become a reality by the time Smash 7 comes around.

Personally, I wish Smash would focus on Nintendo IPs, particularly ones that aren't currently mega popular, because there's still plenty left to mine. And sometimes their inclusion in Smash gives them new life and they become hits. For instance, back in the original Smash 64 days, most people had never heard of Earthbound/Mother. Ness's inclusion made people curious, and now it's well-known franchise, and we finally got the first game brought over. Now people want a Mother 3 rep. If one got in, you bet we'd finally see that game translated, too.

In Melee, we got Marth and Roy. Nobody in the West knew what Fire Emblem was. Because of Smash, we started to get the games brought over here, and now Fire Emblem is a super popular Nintendo IP and has more reps in Smash than even Zelda. Most other Nintendo franchises get 1 -3 reps, max.

In Brawl, we got Pit. Very few people knew of Kid Icarus. People were curious about him, and Sakurai even made a new game himself to celebrate the revival of a dormant IP, and then put multiple playable characters and assist trophies into subsequent games.

In Smash 4, Mega Man came back in his classic form after a really rough period of ups and downs. Since then, we've had a revival in interest and got Mega Man 11, plus a plethora of collections, and possibly more new games coming. Also a new anime series but let's not talk about that.

Just look at how people are reacting to Terry. "What's SNK?". Yikes. Also I'm sure that now Banjo is back, his games may get a re-release of some sort. Maybe even another new game, since interest in him is the highest it's been in years.

Also, Sakurai likes to throw in curveballs like ROB, Wii Fit Trainer, Duck Hunt, Piranha Plant, etc. They were not popular demands. He likely put those in to mix things up and be experimental, while also honoring Nintendo's history. I'm glad he does this because it keeps things from being so predictably trendy.

So, what I'm trying to say is that people are pushing for the latest Fire Emblem game's protags, or whatever current popular third party game is out there are kind of missing the notion that Smash revives dormant or forgotten IPs, and sometimes makes your current favorite franchise a reality. Why not spread the love and give some other franchises a chance instead of just putting in an 8th Fire Emblem or a 9th Pokemon rep, or try to grab characters from franchises that have no history with Nintendo at all?
If I'm being honest, I don't feel its wrong to like that newcomers are from first parties or third parties and its just really a matter of preference. For me, I personally prefer third parties due the crossover factor that a lot of the third parties bring given that they cover a lot of genres that Nintendo doesn't do at all.

(Also, regarding Mother 3 rep. Doesn't Lucas counts as one already?)
 
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