Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Will]

In that case, I would go on to say Ryu Hayabusa is the new "Erdrick".

Last time I brought this up I was told this wasn't the case because Ryu has no real competition.

 

[7NATOR]

I have a theory about this pack. It's only based on the 2 characters released thus far, but what if this pack is going to be focused on characters with unique mechanics? So far we have two of the most unique characters to ever be released in Super Smash Bros, Min Min who has no specials but attacks with an arm depending on what button you press. Now we have Steve with his mining and crafting mechanics. That would eliminate simple characters like Crash, Dixie, Bandana Dee, etc, but would leave room for more complicated characters like Rex, HWAoC Impa, and others. How would everyone feel about this? And who would you like to see if this was the style Nintendo was going for?

I could/would like to see:
Rex: Blade switching, move cancelling, and special level meter.
Impa: Clones and Sheikah slate runes.
Rillaboom: Drum beat combos
Tracer: Time travel moves

Well unlike other theories, This one has an actual Confirmation, Since Sakurai said himself that Unique Gameplay styles are the way to go

With that being said, I don't know if Characters like Crash would be Automatically eliminated. I mean yeah Crash is kinda basic in Moveset, but there is still stuff you can do With him I guess...He would definitly be the most simple DLC character (Probably even more than Banjo) in FP2 though

Spoiler: Also

I Rather Shadow Use them Time Travel Moves, I don't want Tracer to take his Function

 

[SharkLord]

I’m going to genuinely roll around the floor laughing if he winds up as another Mii. There’s just something hilariously cathartic to me about these characters people are sure about being locks only for a silly mascot costume to throw their chances over the edge of a dam. That being said, I have no bad words to those who actively want said character, and I hope you guys keep up holding onto hope.

I just like the big shakeups. Helps liven up the speculation scene. Besides, my most wanteds aren't considered frontrunners very often beyond their specific contexts, so it's not like I'm putting them in danger or anything.

 

[RileyXY1]

Last time I brought this up I was told this wasn't the case because Ryu has no real competition.

Dynasty Warriors is competition, even if it's debatable as the characters there are based on real life people.

 

[Will]

I think that we might get a simpler fighter next.

Hayabusa is pretty simple to make, he's more flashy substance than a ****ing coding nightmare.

 

[PLANTMAN]

Honestly? I'm kind of doubtful, I don't think there's many standout options from Nintendo right now, as I'm personally not sold on any Mario characters or Zelda characters really fitting what we've gotten from DLC so far. Doesn't mean there can't be one, of course, it's just that I'm not really expecting it myself.

I meant for both xenoblade & Pokémon at the same time(however I have very big doubts for Pokémon)

 

[Will]

Dynasty Warriors is competition, even if it's debatable as the characters there are based on real life people.

Really, Dynasty Warriors is contesting with Koei Tecmo's biggest, nostalgic, and historic game series that innovated the industry? This is like pitting Final Fantasy 7 against SMRPG, we know who's winning the contest.

 

[BlondeLombax]

I just like the big shakeups. Helps liven up the speculation scene. Besides, my most wanteds aren't considered frontrunners very often beyond their specific contexts, so it's not like I'm putting them in danger or anything.

True dat. My big pipe dream isn’t very likely because bewbs, plus Steve was the biggest surprise so far, so I’m not necessarily counting any chickens anymore.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Dynasty Warriors may be the bigger franchise, but I feel like Hayabusa is the much bigger character overall

We're talking about the video game ninja and essentially Koei Tecmo's mascot. Dude's transcended beyond his own series and has appeared in other KT franchises like in a couple Warriors games, and is even a Dead or Alive mainstay.

If KT's ever getting a character, it's absolutely going to be Hayabusa imho

 

[OmegaRS]

Well unlike other theories, This one has an actual Confirmation, Since Sakurai said himself that Unique Gameplay styles are the way to go

With that being said, I don't know if Characters like Crash would be Automatically eliminated. I mean yeah Crash is kinda basic in Moveset, but there is still stuff you can do With him I guess...He would definitly be the most simple DLC character (Probably even more than Banjo) in FP2 though

Spoiler: Also

I Rather Shadow Use them Time Travel Moves, I don't want Tracer to take his Function

I can agree with Shadow. I would take either of the two honestly.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I mean, Steve was clearly hideously complex, and it'll "only" have been around 3 and a half months since Min Min released...

The divisions that worked on Steve and Min Min were separate. There weren't programmers simultaneously tagging various surfaces as wood, stone etc. while trying to make sure Min Min can use both her left and right attacks simultaneously.

 

[MooMew64]

I meant for both xenoblade & Pokémon at the same time(however I have very big doubts for Pokémon)

Honestly, I'm really doubtful of Xenoblade, personally. ARMS and Pokemon both have an evergreen nature to them that makes them easier to sell over time; Xenoblade 2 and other more niche JRPGs usually sell what they're gonna sell in around a month or two and then fall off, and they don't really get revived in the same way games like ARMS and Pokemon do twith their marketing. I'm not sure Nintendo will want to try and bring it back when most people who were interested most likely bought it and Xenoblade Chronicles Remastered has taken the Xenoblade spotlight ATM.

ARMS is a Nintendo mutltiplayer game, and those always keep their staying power thanks to people just really liking Nintendo's multiplayer. Sure, it's not a huge mega seller, but despite what a lot of people say, it did alright for itself and was always poised for a comeback. I think Min Min in Smash will definitely help in making ARMS 2 a reality at some point down the road, probably on the Switch's successor.

Pokemon is...Well, Pokemon. It breaks a lot of our precedents and patterns however it well dang pleases 'cause most of the time it gets a character, it's because Nintendo and TPC did it just to flaunt it some more. It in my personal opinion is probably the best shot out of any Nintendo newcomer right now because it'd be an easy get, and promotes a product that will keep selling throughout the Switch's life. I could easily see a Gen 8 'Mon sneaking in come CP10 or 11.

 

[Guynamednelson]

I don't think unique movesets are a necessity. They just come naturally for Sakurai. he sees stuff that some might see as simple or impossible, and goes "How can I make this character unique and fun?" It's character decided, then the unique moveset, not the other way around.

Indeed, Nintendo isn't choosing characters for their moveset potential, but Sakurai wants DLC characters to really stick out in some way.

 

[Dr. Yatagarasu]

The divisions that worked on Steve and Min Min were separate. There weren't programmers simultaneously tagging various surfaces as wood, stone etc. while trying to make sure Min Min can use both her left and right attacks simultaneously.

Well that makes sense, but that just proves my point - we aren't going to be waiting for 6 entire months (or around that timeframe) for the next fighter to be released. December or January seem like the time to release the next fighter.

 

[Shroob]

Well that makes sense, but that just proves my point - we aren't going to be waiting for 6 entire months (or around that timeframe) for the next fighter to be released. December or January seem like the time to release the next fighter.

And at the very latest, February. March is just, not 'impossible', but that's a massive ****ing gap.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Honestly, I think it's a safe bet that we'll at least know who Fighter 8 is by the end of the year. Even if they're not releasing until next year, I think that at least a reveal this year (likely in December) is still feasible.

 

[DarthEnderX]

If the rest of the pass was...

Geno
Lloyd
Monster Hunter
Ryu Hayabusa

How would you react?

Pretty dang positively. I get my most wanted in Ryu AND I don't have to listen to the Geno crowd anymore? And I have nothing against Lloyd or MH. Solid win all around.

I don't think Hayabusa will be a mechanically easy character to play as, since I think he'll be a very fast, very hacky-slashy kinda character, but I don't think he'll be akin to someone like Steve in terms of complexity.

I want to hope so, because NES icon, but...the modern NG games are some of the most complicated CAGs in existence.

 

[Shroob]

Honestly, I think it's a safe bet that we'll at least know who Fighter 8 is by the end of the year. Even if they're not releasing until next year, I think that at least a reveal this year (likely in December) is still feasible.

Question then is When

There's only two options for this if we stick to the "Directs are still dead" mentality.

A) Game Awards reveal, which, while possible, I'm not banking on it

B) Reveal ala Steve/Min Min near the end of the year with a release early January


I do not expect just a random "BOOM Trailer!" shadowdrop, so it has to be one or the other if one's coming in December.

 

[Droodle]

Bruh,
Talk about a sleeper pick, it beats FF and has earned twice as much as Dragon Quest. The only franchise that's earned more than it, and hasn't gotten into Smash is freaking CoD.

EDIT:

AND Sakurai likes it? That's it, Space Invaders is IN. Prepare to meet your alien overlords.

 

[StrangeKitten]

Well that makes sense, but that just proves my point - we aren't going to be waiting for 6 entire months (or around that timeframe) for the next fighter to be released. December or January seem like the time to release the next fighter.

I agree, maybe February at the latest. The fact that we only went a few months before getting Steve has me thinking the gaps between the rest of the characters will be similarly short. I'd be surprised if they add anyone who is as complex as Steve; not that characters won't have their complexities but holy mother of cubical sheep is Steve complex.

 

[Super Devon]

here's a fun fact that definitely won't be used in the long-run.... or at least I hope not
almost every reveal up to this point (with the exception of the launch of , , and the launch of ) were revealed in a set amount of days between each other, with the wait of Fighters Pass vol 2 fighters being a bit longer

these are the days of waiting for the base reveals and most of Fighters Pass vol 1: either 36 days, 49 days, 55-57 days, or 70-75 days
and the days of waiting for Fighters Pass vol 2 thus far: 58 days or 70 days

trying to predict the date of the next reveal based on math means next to nothing, it's more of a guessing game than anything

but for history and future reference(?), I calculated the days between each and every reveal/release starting from the game's reveal at E3 2018 to Steve's reveal.
I use this to guess when the next reveal is and I've had it for quite some time.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Question then is When

There's only two options for this if we stick to the "Directs are still dead" mentality.

A) Game Awards reveal, which, while possible, I'm not banking on it

B) Reveal ala Steve/Min Min near the end of the year with a release early January


I do not expect just a random "BOOM Trailer!" shadowdrop, so it has to be one or the other if one's coming in December.

Option B is the one I'm expecting. I certainly wouldn't complain if Nintendo decided to actually be smart and bring back the regular Direct format for their first-party stuff like Smash, or they could go with Option A and reveal Fighter 8 at an event with lots of eyes on it and this get lots of attention, but considering how they handled almost everything else this year...

 

[Shroob]

I will say, by December 10th, The Game Awards, just using this as a point of reference, it'll have been roughly 58 days since Steve came out, and by the end of December, it'll have been 79.

For comparison:

The time between the Arms Guessing Game and Min Min's reveal was 88 days

And the time between Min Min's reveal and Steve's reveal was 101 days


I feel like sometime in January is a very safe guess, because after January, we'll be breaking a record here.

 

[MooMew64]

I will say, by December 10th, The Game Awards, just using this as a point of reference, it'll have been roughly 58 days since Steve came out, and by the end of December, it'll have been 79.

For comparison:

The time between the Arms Guessing Game and Min Min's reveal was 88 days

And the time between Min Min's reveal and Steve's reveal was 101 days


I feel like sometime in January is a very safe guess, because after January, we'll be breaking a record here.

And while there's no guarantee they'll do it exactly the same way, Byleth was a January reveal, so a Smash reveal then isn't unheard of.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

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[chocolatejr9]

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Kids these days and their reckless behavior...

 

[Deleted member]

Really, Dynasty Warriors is contesting with Koei Tecmo's biggest, nostalgic, and historic game series that innovated the industry? This is like pitting Final Fantasy 7 against SMRPG, we know who's winning the contest.

My God dude that comparison is nowhere near what you think it is, especially since Dynasty Warriors is the series that created the Musou genre with 9 mainline titles and 20+ spinoff titles including the Xtreme Legends and Empires expansions spanning over the last 2 decades and ongoing, and I haven't even brought up the non-DW Musou games. The franchise even outsold Ninja Gaiden in total sales figures if you could believe it.

For the record, I'm in favor of both [Koei-Tecmo] franchises being added to Smash, but comparing Dynasty Warriors to SMRPG is too baffling to see. If any comparison were to be made, it's far more comparable to go with Ninja Gaiden being Mega-Man and Dynasty Warriors being Street Fighter or Monster Hunter in that regard.

 

[SneakyLink]

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Lucas in the Big City

 

[ROBnWatch]

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Lucas in the Big City

Spoiler: Mother 3 Spoilers Kinda

Last time Lucas was in a big city, he overthrew it’s government. Wonder what will happen this time.

 

[SharkLord]

My God dude that comparison is nowhere near what you think it is, especially since Dynasty Warriors is the series that created the Musou genre with 9 mainline titles and 20+ spinoff titles including the Xtreme Legends and Empires expansions spanning over the last 2 decades and ongoing, and I haven't even brought up the non-DW Musou games. The franchise even outsold Ninja Gaiden in total sales figures if you could believe it.

For the record, I'm in favor of both [Koei-Tecmo] franchises being added to Smash, but comparing Dynasty Warriors to SMRPG is too baffling to see. If any comparison were to be made, it's far more comparable to go with Ninja Gaiden being Mega-Man and Dynasty Warriors being Street Fighter or Monster Hunter in that regard.

Actually, I think Dynasty Warriors would be, uh...

No, no, the Street Fighter comparisons are accurate. At least, they are if we're doing Capcom fighters as a whole. Same basic template with some extra tidbits to make it stand out, overlaid with basically any theme you can think of. Bam, new game.

 

[Spongeboob]

I was typing something, but I'll post it another time because it's long. It's something about Smash's Echo Chamber.

Is there any other Koei Tecmo rep that could feasibly get in before Ryu?

To put it simply: Yes. You can apply the same question to any company in Smash (particularly SNK, Microsoft, and (f)ATLUS).

Question then is When

There's only two options for this if we stick to the "Directs are still dead" mentality.

A) Game Awards reveal, which, while possible, I'm not banking on it

B) Reveal ala Steve/Min Min near the end of the year with a release early January


I do not expect just a random "BOOM Trailer!" shadowdrop, so it has to be one or the other if one's coming in December.

Considering what happened last time, I'd stick with B... although I think we'd get a reveal closer to February or March.

 

[Will]

My God dude that comparison is nowhere near what you think it is, especially since Dynasty Warriors is the series that created the Musou genre with 9 mainline titles and 20+ spinoff titles including the Xtreme Legends and Empires expansions spanning over the last 2 decades and ongoing, and I haven't even brought up the non-DW Musou games. The franchise even outsold Ninja Gaiden in total sales figures if you could believe it.

For the record, I'm in favor of both [Koei-Tecmo] franchises being added to Smash, but comparing Dynasty Warriors to SMRPG is too baffling to see. If any comparison were to be made, it's far more comparable to go with Ninja Gaiden being Mega-Man and Dynasty Warriors being Street Fighter or Monster Hunter in that regard.

Nah, my gut's telling me there's a wide margin still between the two, my example was just an analogy, I'm not calling Dynasty Warriors a niche series lol. It's at least a very good game for template spamming lol

The point of the comparison in the first place is just to signify that Hayabusa is definitely #1 100% the character choice first when choosing Koei Tecmo.

 

[ZelDan]

Yeah, I could see a December reveal happening, perhaps during TGA.

perhaps a Dec/ reveal and January showcase/release.

 

[Will]

Yeah, I could see a December reveal happening, perhaps during TGA.

I don't know man, maybe that Joker reveal was a one-time thing?

 

[cashregister9]

I'm thinking if we got a character revealed in December we would then get a Joker situation where they won't be released for another couple months (but not nearly as long as Joker, like February/March not late April)

 

[Shroob]

I was typing something, but I'll post it another time because it's long. It's something about Smash's Echo Chamber.

To put it simply: Yes. You can apply the same question to any company in Smash (particularly SNK, Microsoft, and (f)ATLUS).

Considering what happened last time, I'd stick with B... although I think we'd get a reveal closer to February or March.

I mean, if we do it in February or March, then we'll be well over 100 days since Steve came out is the thing. Between Min Min and Steve, that was only 101 days, which was our longest wait to date, and I think Steve at least has the excuse of needing a lot of time in the over.

 

[RileyXY1]

The only problem I see with Dynasty Warriors is that the characters are based on real life people.

 

[ZelDan]

I don't know man, maybe that Joker reveal was a one-time thing?

It could have been sure. Not saying a TGA reveal is guaranteed.

 

[Shroob]

I feel like people get too caught up on the December 31st, 2021 date.


It's a placeholder date and nothing more, no different than any game where they know what year it'll come out, but not the exact date. Honestly, outside my belief that they may want to stretch the pass to Ultimate's 3rd anniversary, which historically they've never cared a rat's ass in the past about it, the 2nd pass could honestly end before December, they're just giving themselves the out of December in case something goes fubar in development, and so far, outside of COVID, everything seems on track.

 

[cashregister9]

The only problem I see with Dynasty Warriors is that the characters are based on real life people.

Dynasty Warriors falls into the same category as Fate, The characters are so heavily fictionalized that the only thing the real people have in common is the name, Also any character they would add have been dead for decades or centuries and most likely don't have an estate.

(Specifically for Fate, No one knows if King Arthur was even a real person)