Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Will]

those blocks can screw with linear recovery (ESAM screamed out of anguish when he saw Pikachu fall victim to this)

man who says the rat is busted cries when the busted rat gets outbusted?

 

[TwiceEXE]

Word of advice: If you're going to laugh at Genobros, you'd be better served by screencapping images that actually talk about Geno rather than dunking on "MUH RELEVANCY" people, because I don't think anyone is going to understand the context of that comment at a glance unless you explain it to them.

I'm not laughing at Genobros. I'm laughing at you. Because you had to be petty and post an "I told you so" to dunk on people that wanted Travis.

 

[N3ON]

What are you talking about? I had already gotten everyone I ever wanted for Smash by the time Banjo was revealed. I mostly hang around the Geno thread because the speculation is fun. Well, at least more fun than the speculation in this thread.

People who aren't invested don't care about being right or wrong.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

If there is one good thing about Travis being costume’d

it’s that it proves HotGirlVideos69 fake once and for all

she said Travis as playable this month and Minecraft in Spring 2021

so uh Geno thread can stop believing her now lmao

 

[Garteam]

Tbh I hope the next PreMiiums with music are Brawlers or Swordfighters

quit letting Gunners hog all that glory

Wouldn't Bomberman's costume be a premium? I know it doesn't come with any music, but it is a full body costume and Sakurai did discuss it afterwards.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Tbh I don't think it will be that OP unless the Steve player has already built (heh) an advantage. The blocks break pretty quickly, even more so if you're far away from the stage. Plus, it probably won't be that good against recoveries with a hitbox-you'd have to predict their recovery time and risk getting punished.

I think it's just going to be polarizing. Recoveries without hitboxes like Launch Star and Grappling Hook probably can't do anything about it, but on the flip side, You're not stopping Blazer or Screw Attack with this. Ever.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I was confused about this too. Apparently the ESRB put rule changes after Joker that didn't want E10+ games promoting M rated games.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

That's why the franchise names are used in the EU versions.

I am irrationally bothered by the weirdass rule the ESRB has seemingly put in place that doesn't allow the title logos from M-rated games to be displayed in Smash Directs. What does this even accomplish? pic.twitter.com/S8dObZebgC

— Tomokocchi (@itsTomokocchi) October 3, 2020

 

[I.D.]

Something I am left wondering about is given how big Steve is via Minecraft if that played any factor in the significance of the rest of the pass. Does Nintendo consider him a big selling point and thus the rest can be riskier choices because the pass has been boosted by Steve, or is there a sense that the rest should be of some major status to avoid being a letdown in comparison to him?

I'm going by historical precedent here and say we're probably going down in status a lot after Minecraft

 

[Perkilator]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

I was confused about this too. Apparently the ESRB put rule changes after Joker that didn't want E10+ games promoting M rated games.

That's why the franchise names are used in the EU versions.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Wow…that’s just petty.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Wouldn't Bomberman's costume be a premium? I know it doesn't come with any music, but it is a full body costume and Sakurai did discuss it afterwards.

I mentioned I only count PreMiiums as those with music. I don’t count Bomberman or Vault Boy as premium

it doesn’t even have to be full body imo, just come with a song

 

[I.D.]

I'm just sitting here wondering how many other costumes will just directly use AT models.

SPRINGMA- wait a minute..

 

[SNEKeater]

Well, on the bright side, Travis becoming a mii costume basically confirms that M Theory is definitely a thing, seeing how there's nothing adult about "No More Heroes" as a title.

Only in USA. Here in Europe (Japan as well, I guess) it was Smash Ultimate x No More Heroes. I was surprised when I saw Travis, I thought he had a nice shot. Not because No More Heroes 3 exists, but of course it helps. He always had decent fan following and the franchise has strong ties with Nintendo. Travis would have felt like the Bayonetta of Ultimate, to put it in a way.

Sad for his supporters, but at least he's in the game in some form. I'll probably buy his costume and the one for Bomberman. Regardless of today I'm pretty much convinced Travis will make it eventually.

As for Master Chief's absence... I don't think it means a lot. While it isn't a rule I don't see at all a company double dipping in the same pass. If there's a third Fighter Pass, I could totally see Chief happening. But I don't think we're getting more DLC beyond Pass 2, unfortunately.

Steve looks very interesting... and somewhat confusing? To play. For me it will be one of these characters I'll have to try to know if I like it or not. They definitely did a great job with the character and all the new content.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

(ESAM screamed out of anguish when he saw Pikachu fall victim to this)

Oh Pikachu will be fine. lol

You'd have to make a pretty hard read in order to stop Quick Attack like that.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

Another funny thing from the "relevancy point" is the mental gymnastics required to argue about Travis' relevancy relative to adding Minecraft, the literally highest selling singular game of all time that is one of the most popular releases for 10 years and has retained relevancy for that entire time. The only things more relevant than Minecraft are like Fortnite and Legaue of Legends.

 

[Shroob]

Man, it's gonna be odd if we do get a character from an M rated game and it's just


Smash x MASTER CHIEF!

Smash x DOOMGUY

or my favorite

Smash x Dantefromthedevilmaycryseries

 

[SNEKeater]

Grasshopper seems to think Travis deserved more as well.

Even @Grasshopper_EN is getting in on it pic.twitter.com/hGC0HVqiWe

— Will (PushDustIn) (@PushDustIn) October 3, 2020

 

[Schnee117]

Wouldn't Bomberman's costume be a premium? I know it doesn't come with any music, but it is a full body costume and Sakurai did discuss it afterwards.

It has the different colours too

 

[3BitSaurus]

That said, I do think Steve has the potential to be high tier. Like Dr. Yatagarasu said, those blocks can screw with linear recovery (ESAM screamed out of anguish when he saw Pikachu fall victim to this), and the main point is that Steve can choose when to place those blocks. The fact they decay quickly doesn't really matter much when the block itself can impede or even stop recoveries in their tracks. Hell, characters like , and don't have many options to break through blocks safely (and depending on how the block interacts with Grenades it can screw over Banjo really hard). That's not getting into the fact that Steve can choose to use ground moves a la Rivals of Aether's Cragg (IIRC) or go for aerials and contest recoveries like crazy.

Steve's biggest drawback is going to be likely early game neutral vs. swordies and disadvantage, but I'll write in depth once this thread has cooled down.

Pretty much. Steve has poor base stats as a way to balance his utility - like Hero on steroids. It remains to be seen, of course, but I think that characters who can string combos really fast, close gaps easily and/or zone Steve out will probably have an advantage against him depending on the situation. I'd argue that heavies and characters with poor range and/or recovery are the ones who will struggle the most against Steve.

I think it's just going to be polarizing. Recoveries without hitboxes like Launch Star and Grappling Hook probably can't do anything about it, but on the flip side, You're not stopping Blazer or Screw Attack with this. Ever.

Especially if you're coming from below the block, like with Screw Attack. It pretty much denies the whole setup, even against grounded moves, methinks.

 

[LiveStudioAudience]

Man, it's gonna be odd if we do get a character from an M rated game and it's just


Smash x MASTER CHIEF!

Smash x DOOMGUY

or my favorite

Smash x Dantefromthedevilmaycryseries

Smash x SCORPION is admittedly an odd image to think about.

 

[MBRedboy31]

The real question is, what kind of blocks do you get if you stand on the Bulborb in Distant Planet and mine it?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Another funny thing from the "relevancy point" is the mental gymnastics required to argue about Travis' relevancy relative to adding Minecraft, the literally highest selling singular game of all time that is one of the most popular releases for 10 years and has retained relevancy for that entire time. The only things more relevant than Minecraft are like Fortnite and Legaue of Legends.

League, id definitely agree. It started the same year as Minecraft and actually helped establish the esports scene

Fortnite...ehhhhhh... not so much

 

[blackghost]

People on Geno thread are claiming right now that since Steve was in development talks for 5 years that proves that they can still be "saving" Cacomallow for later.

thats assuming geno or cacomallow is worth discussing for 5 years to get in.

 

[GillyGrime]

Being a Geno supporter, I'm sick to death of seeing infantile attacks on other fanbases and strawmaning from both supporters and detractors. It's so exhausting and it's only gotten worse with time.

On the bright side, the Bomberman Mii Costume and the fact it basically has alts is absolutely dope.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

My friends brought up something interesting.


We got Heihachi back with Min Min.

We just got Gil back with Steve.

Lloyd's probably coming back with the next fighter too.

 

[7NATOR]

Wait, is Bomberman's Costume really just using his AT Model? I thought that AT have less Polygons than Playable characters (Including Miis), so they actually have to make a new model to fit into a Mii Costume (which is why Black Knight has different Models for Both AT and Mii)

Also Just a reminder, Bomberman isn't the First new AT to get a Mii Costume, that were the Squid Sisters. He is the first to be a New 3rd party Assist to Mii Promotion.

 

[Goombaic]

Sure, but it's fallacious to act like it's a set in stone rule for speculation going forward, just as it is to assume that Spirits disconfirm characters.

Fair enough I guess.

Simple: Most people in the Geno thread don't believe it's 100% happening. The rumors is there, but that's all they are. People who acted like Dante was coming as FP5 because new DmC info was dropping on the same day as the reveal were convinced that it was happening, despite all past precedent telling them that it most likely wouldn't.

I mean, Steve was announced to coincide with Minecraft Live, so I don't think it's fair to say the people that were expecting Dante should have known better. It's not gonna be the same case for every character, definitely, but still.

 

[N3ON]

Man, it's gonna be odd if we do get a character from an M rated game and it's just


Smash x MASTER CHIEF!

Smash x DOOMGUY

or my favorite

Smash x Dantefromthedevilmaycryseries

Maybe if and when we actually get a character from an M-rated series, they'll bite the bullet and let that presentation be E10-M. They just don't think it'd be worth it for a costume.

I would hope, at least. Otherwise it'd be very awkward to dance around the series of the character like that.

 

[NotGenerico]

Three of my most wanted characters have been Travis, Dante and Sol Badguy for a while. The thing is that I always knew that it'd be impossible for all of them to be in the same Fighter Pass. They're 3 anime swordsmen wearing red clothing. Might as well add Lloyd Irving and Adol Christin, too.

But anyway, I'm feeling Dante's chances are looking pretty good. Let's take a look.

-Monster Hunter costumes haven't returned yet. I feel like they're saving them up for a Capcom character.
-Itsuno said that Dante should have games on the Switch before getting into Smash. He said this knowing the Switch was going to get DMC ports in just a few months.
-The definitive version of DMC3 is only on the Switch with many features like weapon switching that fans have asked for years. Kinda gives me Dragon Quest vibes, where the best version is on the Switch.

I have to say though, it will be very jarring if Dante gets in as a playable character and the trailer ends with "SMASH BROS X DANTE".

 

[Tree Gelbman]

If there is one good thing about Travis being costume’d

it’s that it proves HotGirlVideos69 fake once and for all

she said Travis as playable this month and Minecraft in Spring 2021

so uh Geno thread can stop believing her now lmao

They don't though? They pretty much think she's a joke too. They post her stuff and then laugh it off.

These are the type of comments that bug me most, because unless you go in the thread you're just not gonna get the real facts yourself. I'm not talking about any evidence, are they blind supporters sometimes? Yes, but so is every fanbase, but they know when something is a joke of a leaker.

 

[BernkastelWitch]

I think Steve will be very interesting to see in competitive tournaments. I don't expect him to be used too often since he seems to have a bit of a learning curve on him but the people who may pick him up will be absolutely deadly.

I do imagine he may be divisive in the competitive scene due to his toolkit, though.

 

[Will]

Something I am left wondering about is given how big Steve is via Minecraft if that played any factor in the significance of the rest of the pass. Does Nintendo consider him a big selling point and thus the rest can be riskier choices because the pass has been boosted by Steve, or is there a sense that the rest should be of some major status to avoid being a letdown in comparison to him?

Where do you go once you reach the top? Nowhere to go but back down.

 

[MooMew64]

As someone who wanted Bomberman back before E3 2018, this costume is amazing and I'm so thankful for it, ha ha. He looks so good! And he gets color swaps like an actual character. You can tell Sakurai wants to use Mii costumes like Bomberman, Vault Boy, Cuphead, and Sans as a way to introduce more characters to the crossover with resources that are available, and it's a super nice touch.

 

[mynameisBlade]

Seeing Travis get the boot was tough.....but Bomberman looks awesome! I hope we get a Shovel Knight Mii Swordfighter somewhere down the line.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Man, it's gonna be odd if we do get a character from an M rated game and it's just


Smash x MASTER CHIEF!

Smash x DOOMGUY

or my favorite

Smash x Dantefromthedevilmaycryseries

I've always wanted Resident Evil Mii Costumes if they couldn't be playable. Now I'm thinking how weird it would be if they had multiple characters and had to change the title card after every new costume.

Smash x CHRIS REDFIELD!
Smash x CLAIRE REDFIELD!
Smash x LEON KENNEDY!
Smash x JILL VALENTINE!
Smash x ADA WONG!
Smash x ALBERT WESKER!

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Grasshopper seems to think Travis deserved more as well.

Even @Grasshopper_EN is getting in on it pic.twitter.com/hGC0HVqiWe

— Will (PushDustIn) (@PushDustIn) October 3, 2020

Nintendo, yall ****ed up big time

 

[SirBillyBob]

You know, the fact that the Minecraft costumes have detached limbs does make it weird that Rayman never got a mii costume. Not saying he's getting in as a fighter, but I do find it fishy. Though, knowing my luck, they'll just put him in as a costume next fighter pack.

 

[Shroob]

Three of my most wanted characters have been Travis, Dante and Sol Badguy for a while. The thing is that I always knew that it'd be impossible for all of them to be in the same Fighter Pass. They're 3 anime swordsmen wearing red clothing. Might as well add Lloyd Irving and Adol Christin, too.

But anyway, I'm feeling Dante's chances are looking pretty good. Let's take a look.

-Monster Hunter costumes haven't returned yet. I feel like they're saving them up for a Capcom character.
-Itsuno said that Dante should have games on the Switch before getting into Smash. He said this knowing the Switch was going to get DMC ports in just a few months.
-The definitive version of DMC3 is only on the Switch with many features like weapon switching that fans have asked for years. Kinda gives me Dragon Quest vibes, where the best version is on the Switch.

I have to say though, it will be very jarring if Dante gets in as a playable character and the trailer ends with "SMASH BROS X DANTE".

Jarring, sure, but we'd unironically be allowed to stick this onto our copies of Ultimate

 

[TwiceEXE]

I'm not talking about any evidence, are they blind supporters sometimes? Yes, but so is every fanbase, but they know when something is a joke of a leaker.

I'm sorry, ignore this message if it's going to cause problems, but how can you say this when a bunch of users in that thread hang on Fatman's every word?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Especially if you're coming from below the block, like with Screw Attack. It pretty much denies the whole setup, even against grounded moves, methinks.

Now that I think about it, Steve is probably more likely to use the offstage blocks to edgeguard characters with hitboxes on their recoveries like Roy.

Why?

'Cuz why would you consume resources when you could just go "lol Down Tilt"?

That move is going to get people really annoyed as well.

 

[N3ON]

Bomberman's role in Ultimate will always be bittersweet but hopefully this pseudo-promotion means Sakurai is at least acknowledging that Bomberman is suitable for bigger things.

Or maybe it's just easy asset reuse making them a quick buck lol.