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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Swamp Sensei

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I mean... I just think there are better choices.

I don't dislike Geno, and I'd argue his popularity makes him worth it.

He just doesn't appeal to me too much.



Now that SMRPG music on the other hand.
 

cosmicB

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And that, my friend, is an oxymoron.


Also, "Geno is only popular because people like him" has got to be the dumbest take I have ever seen. Like, no crap Sherlock. It's not even a proper put down since in order for people to like a character, they have to have some sort of appeal. If a character is popular, even if it's just within a specific circle, then they have that appeal. Geno has many problems but this isn't one of them; It's just an observation.
I don't agree with the notion that Geno has no appeal, but bandwagoning is a very real psychological phenomenon, both the negative and the positive kind. Like, this is actually utilized in marketing to great effect. It's almost a form of tribalism. Things have gotten popular for no other reason than very vocal passionate people, with case studies of people looking back and not understanding why they cared in the first place.
 
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Shroob

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Well, I don't even expect a character tomorrow if it's going to entirely focus on Super Mario's 35th Anniversary.
But then you have to turn around and notice the missing Spirit/Tourney event

And realize the only times this happened in the past was when a new character was shown off.


This mini probably will have a Mario focus, but I highly doubt it'll be solely a Mario "Direct".
 

Karen6969

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This always happens: A character that isn't your most wanted seems to be likely, so it's time for a wave of "oh god oh **** please don't be them" posts.
Call me crazy but I genuinely don’t think he’s likely. He’s really popular among hardcore smash/speculation fans, so of course over time he will look more and more likely especially when most people start with the conclusion that he’s getting in and work backwards to find evidence from there. I get that that’s half the fun of smash dlc, but when there’s that many people doing it every thread for one character it gets overbearing.

When you step back and look at him as a character from Sakurai’s or Nintendo’s perspective, I see no reason that they’d pick him unless Sakurai ends up doing it for fan service. He said years ago that he liked the idea of Geno as a character because of his arm-gun or whatever, but guess what? We have Mii gunner now, which is exactly what he thought was cool about Geno. Geno should be a really well done deluxe Mii costume, in my opinion.

if he gets in, great. I’ll be happy for his fans. If he doesn’t, then that’s okay too but I do think they need to at least bring his costume back, and make it an actual geno render this time like the cuphead/sans/vault boy ones.
 

RileyXY1

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But then you have to turn around and notice the missing Spirit/Tourney event

And realize the only times this happened in the past was when a new character was shown off.


This mini probably will have a Mario focus, but I highly doubt it'll be solely a Mario "Direct".
There could be other reasons for the missing event.
 

AreJay25

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I mean... I just think there are better choices.

I don't dislike Geno, and I'd argue his popularity makes him worth it.

He just doesn't appeal to me too much.



Now that SMRPG music on the other hand.
If we still only get 2 unremixed tracks despite Yoko Shimomura literally working on both games then Square is really going to have to explain themselves.
 

RileyXY1

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Because we have hard evidence that every time it went missing in the past was because a character was going to be shown off the same week.
Well, that they want to do a special Mario 35th Anniversary Spirit Event but can't do it until after a supposed Direct where they announce the Super Mario 3D 3-Pack.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Paper Mario can represent the RPGs once he actually gets a game in that genre again.
The only Paper Mario game that isn't an RPG is Super Paper Mario. The titles after that are really odd fusions of the RPG and Adventure genres with more emphasis on the former even though it tries its hardest to get you to not care about it.

This is what bugs me. It's almost like cultural osmosis at this point more than any real connection with the character.

SMRPG was an incredibly important game to me growing up. I was constantly going back and forth on whether I liked Squaresoft games more or first party Nintendo games more back then, so getting a combination of the two was damn near perfection in my mind. Then not even a year later came the heartbreak of the two companies having a falling out, even if it did ultimately lead to my favorite game of all time (FF7). The majority of people asking for Geno never got to experience that. Which isn't to say that alone makes them undeserving of getting the puppet in obviously, the Ultimate fanbase in general skews younger than the early 30s demographic you'd have to be in to have such an experience, but so many just don't seem to even care to play the game. Hell, I've seen hardcore Geno fans go "eww, turn-based" when someone brought up the idea of them playing it.

If Geno gets in, I'll be happy for the fans that want him in earnest, and hope the ones that don't will one day actually play the game he's from.
Missed opportunity to put emphasis on the fact that not playing a character's game doesn't automatically make your wishes toward them invalid. Like, I've yet to get my hands on Ōkami but that doesn't mean I'm not a "true fan" of Amaterasu or whatever.

Well, I don't even expect a character tomorrow if it's going to entirely focus on Super Mario's 35th Anniversary.
It could be if it's a Super Mario character that's being revealed. Would make sense if they wanted to go all out.
 

TwiceEXE

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Because we have hard evidence that every time it went missing in the past was because a character was going to be shown off the same week.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the other times when a character was released? Not revealed?
 

RileyXY1

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The only Paper Mario game that isn't an RPG is Super Paper Mario. The titles after that are really odd fusions of the RPG and Adventure genres with more emphasis on the former even though it tries its hardest to get you to not care about it.


Missed opportunity to put emphasis on the fact that not playing a character's game doesn't automatically make your wishes toward them invalid. Like, I've yet to get my hands on Ōkami but that doesn't mean I'm not a "true fan" of Amaterasu or whatever.


It could be if it's a Super Mario character that's being revealed. Would make sense if they wanted to go all out.
But still, it would be a distraction. There's a reason why Smash characters were never revealed in other franchise-focused Directs.
 

Shroob

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the other times when a character was released? Not revealed?
Who said they won't be an after Direct drop?

Like, we already know this game's going to be patched sometime this month as is due to the Amiibo functionality update.
 

TheBeastHimself

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I’m not trying to poke fun here or be annoying, but I want to hear what does Geno bring to the table? He isn’t representing a new series or a new 3rd party. He wouldn’t have a unique playstyle; from what we know at least he’d be very similar to Mii gunner or Mega man unless Sakurai takes some really big creative liberties. Visually he’s cool looking I suppose but I’m not sure that that counts as something new
If I'm being honest, with almost 100 characters, it's hard for a new character not to resemble a pre-existing one in some way, but I get your point. His moves can be similar to Mii Gunner and Mega Man, you're absolutely right no doubt about it. I just trust that Sakurai can take Geno's moves from SMRPG and make something unique from it, because he can do that. If he can turn Fox and Captain Falcon into unique characters, he can do it with just about anyone.

-----------

This isn't targeted towards anyone in particular, but I feel like Geno is just an easy target. If I were to bring up my criticisms or opinions on Fire Emblem, I would likely be lambasted out of the thread. Everyone's got their own tastes in characters and everyone's opinions should be welcome, I'm not saying end Geno criticism because that's stupid. But I never see any character get like a page of criticism aside from Geno.

I'm also not saying that stating "I don't find Geno likely" is a bad thing at all, because everyone finds characters to be unlikely. But there's always just posts talking about how stupid Geno would be, but c'mon now, when people say stuff like that about other characters it becomes a problem.
 

Karen6969

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>When people are unironically saying that a long-requested character who will make a lot of fans happy is a "wasted slot"...
View attachment 284306
Well, when that character would function very similarly as a playable character vs a rendered deluxe Mii costume it kind of does feel like a waste.
Him and Waluigi would function much better as bonus fighters tbh. Waluigi is my #1 pick but even I know that if he were in the pass itself he would be a waste to pretty much anyone who didn’t want him previously.
 

cosmicB

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Missed opportunity to put emphasis on the fact that not playing a character's game doesn't automatically make your wishes toward them invalid. Like, I've yet to get my hands on Ōkami but that doesn't mean I'm not a "true fan" of Amaterasu or whatever.
If someone says they want Ammy, but then goes "ew, why would I play Okami, I don't like action adventure games!", then I have no problem calling them a fake fan. People can obviously do what they want and there are several pros that have never played the games of their mains or desired characters, but it's not a mindset I can personally wrap my head around. Fighting game characters are more than just a moveset.
 
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TwiceEXE

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Who said they won't be an after Direct drop?

Like, we already know this game's going to be patched sometime this month as is due to the Amiibo functionality update.
I don't know, if we are talking patterns we would expect a Sakurai presents or something to show off the character instead of a shadowdrop on twitter.
 

Cosmic77

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At this point, we have three likely outcomes left.

1. The 3D Mario collection is shadowdropped.
2. A Direct Mini is shadowdropped.
3. Nothing happens and Emily was wrong about the date.

I guess if we're including all possibilities, Friday and Saturday is on the table, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

And that, my friend, is an oxymoron.
Not sure I follow.
 

Shroob

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Well, that they want to do a special Mario 35th Anniversary Spirit Event but can't do it until after a supposed Direct where they announce the Super Mario 3D 3-Pack.
That would be a first.


The saying goes there's a first for everything, but this pattern's held strong for almost 2 years now, and breaking due to an anniversary would be the first time they've done it.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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But still, it would be a distraction. There's a reason why Smash characters were never revealed in other franchise-focused Directs.
Not really. If it was just the trailer it would fit in seamlessly, and the focus wouldn't be taken off Super Mario for very long (and technically wouldn't even fully be taken away since the character in question hails from the series) It would be especially effective if they did what they did for Isabelle and immaterially revealed a game this character appears in right after such as Mario Kart 9 for Waluigi, Super Mario RPG (port or remaster) for Geno, or something completely new for someone completely new.
 

RileyXY1

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I don't know, if we are talking patterns we would expect a Sakurai presents or something to show off the character instead of a shadowdrop on twitter.
Yeah. I don't expect a completely shadowdropped fighter reveal.
 

Shroob

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I don't know, if we are talking patterns we would expect a Sakurai presents or something to show off the character instead of a shadowdrop on twitter.
Why would they be shadow dropped on Twitter?


If we're getting a character, it'd be via a Direct Mini ShadowDrop on YouTube, and if we DO get a character reveal, I either expect:


A) A date for a "Mr.Sakurai presents"

or

B) "Stay tuned for after the program for a "Mr.Sakurai presents".
 

Guynamednelson

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current timing is awful
It's much better than Scorbunny's and it's your newest obsession of the week. Why would it be involved in an event spirit battle if they were planning to make it a fighter?
 
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AceAttorney9000

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Well, when that character would function very similarly as a playable character vs a rendered deluxe Mii costume it kind of does feel like a waste.
Him and Waluigi would function much better as bonus fighters tbh. Waluigi is my #1 pick but even I know that if he were in the pass itself he would be a waste to pretty much anyone who didn’t want him previously.
By this logic, every character in the first Fighters Pass, even Banjo, would be a "waste" because at least one person didn't want them. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and it's okay to not like certain characters, but that doesn't mean said characters are a "waste" if they get in.

Also, I guess it's a good thing that Heihachi and Isaac were given the Mii Fighter costume treatment, because everyone knows they totally would've played exactly like Mii Brawler and Swordfighter, just like how Geno will play exactly like Mii Gunner. :4pacman:
 

PLATINUM7

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Well...

At least the stage will be neat.
Bless you for constantly finding the positives in this.

I've always wanted to see Bowser's Castle with Exor sticking through it but just about anywhere from SMRPG would make a cool stage.
 

cashregister9

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Maybe there was no event because it was a Spirit Event themed after the 35th anniversary games and announcing it a the normal time would be a spoiler for the announcement of the 35th anniversary collection?
 

TwiceEXE

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Why would they be shadow dropped on Twitter?


If we're getting a character, it'd be via a Direct Mini ShadowDrop on YouTube, and if we DO get a character reveal, I either expect:


A) A date for a "Mr.Sakurai presents"

or

B) "Stay tuned for after the program for a "Mr.Sakurai presents".
I thought you were suggesting the character was going to be released tomorrow, after the supposed Direct. To keep the pattern of the "no event" thing going. Wasn't that the entire point of nothing happening this week being a hint? Because when it happened before, characters were released that week?
 

Karen6969

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By this logic, every character in the first Fighters Pass, even Banjo, would be a "waste" because at least one person didn't want them. Everyone's entitled to their opinion and it's okay to not like certain characters, but that doesn't mean said characters are a "waste" if they get in.

Also, I guess it's a good thing that Heihachi and Isaac were given the Mii Fighter costume treatment, because everyone knows they totally would've played exactly like Mii Brawler and Swordfighter, just like how Geno will play exactly like Mii Gunner. :4pacman:
I guess what I meant was characters that don’t bring much new outside of fan service would be a waste to those who don’t want them. The first pass all brought something new along with them be it playstyle, the game they are from, etc..

those 2 come from games that give much more to work with on a moveset than Geno, let alone the fact that I didn’t bring either of them up.. I’m talking about Geno here. If you think Heihachi/Isaac are as similar to brawler/sword fighter as Geno is to gunner, then more power to you I guess.

I really don’t dislike Geno, I love the Mario RPGs. I just don’t understand why Geno specifically should be in smash and I also think that he has one of the most defensive and biased fan bases out there.. though we can all be that way with our favorites I suppose.
 

SharkLord

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I'm personally neutral on Geno, but it gets irritating when everyone keeps singing praises about him and insists that he's a lock. He's a supporting character from a single spinoff of an already heavily-represented game, and I feel like some people forget about that. That's something he has against him that Ridley, King K. Rool, and Banjo & Kazooie didn't have, especially given the higher standards of the DLC. Obviously, he's not impossible, and I've seen some moveset concepts for him that are honestly pretty cool. Just don't force-feed me him; That's how you turn people away from your character. You're supposed to get us on your side, not make us your enemy.

But we've already talked about Geno many times over. Let's try something different.
Well, I can see people are starting to get annoyed at Geno talk...

So let's talk about Lloyd!


I made a poll about Lloyd. Please take some time to take it.


EDIT: Try this one instead. I fixed one problem.

LLOYD HIJACK GO!
I'm honestly surprised Lloyd hasn't been discussed much. He's fairly popular and Tales is pretty darn big. I know the Mii Costume is a threat hanging above his head, but c'mon. The mere possibility of a Mii won't make his pros evaporate overnight unless it actually happens, which it hasn't yet. Let's squeeze out some hope for him while we still can.
 

Shroob

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I thought you were suggesting the character was going to be released tomorrow, after the supposed Direct. To keep the pattern of the "no event" thing going. Wasn't that the entire point of nothing happening this week being a hint? Because when it happened before, characters were released that week?
Others have already pointed out that on weeks where we've gotten new characters that the events have come out after them.
 

RileyXY1

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Not really. If it was just the trailer it would fit in seamlessly, and the focus wouldn't be taken off Super Mario for very long (and technically wouldn't even fully be taken away since the character in question hails from the series) It would be especially effective if they did what they did for Isabelle and immaterially revealed a game this character appears in right after such as Mario Kart 9 for Waluigi, Super Mario RPG (port or remaster) for Geno, or something completely new for someone completely new.
This could be true for every other series.
 

TwiceEXE

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I suppose there is no real point in debating the merits of a possible character reveal in the next 12 hours or so. It's close enough that we can just wait and see what happens.

If I had to place a bet right now I'd put it on a Twitter announcement of the Mario 3D All-Stars, ala Pikmin and Paper Mario. I haven't heard anything to indicate a Direct at this point in time.
 
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