Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[TheBeastHimself]

It'd be cool if there was another Smash Ballot after FP2 for one last hurrah. Maybe the ballot would dictate two additional characters or something.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Goddammit we're still talking about Geno and we still have people unironically believing Cacomallow despite there being no argument to explain why the debug mode timer doesn't match up with the actual debug timer

 

[Perkilator]

Wrong sword wielder in general.
View attachment 282662

Wrong sword wielder gender

 

[EmperorCoal]

If you could cut either Toon Link or Young Link (not both) to be replaced with a unique Zelda character outside the Tri-Force trio, which would it be and why? I'd say Young Link. Even though OOT and MM are my favorite Zelda games, Toon Link represents a more abstract sub-series that has a unique artstyle, which isnt something I can say about Young Link (considering he looks like a child version of practically every Link in existence.)

If we aren't overhauling anyone's moveset and just want to hold onto a second link Toon should be the way to go. I don't play any of them much but Tink is super expressive and offers a better clash of design against regular link as well as representation of the more unique Zelda game styles. Only downside is no more Lon Lon Milk... Which may be a price to heavy to bear.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Goddammit we're still talking about Geno and we still have people unironically believing Cacomallow despite there being no argument to explain why the debug mode timer doesn't match up with the actual debug timer

I got an explanation!

It's

A Mod.

i literally cannot think of any other reason, let alone why they used the DQ stage instead of idk, showing off one of the post-Hero stages

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I got an explanation!

It's

A Mod.

i literally cannot think of any other reason, let alone why they used the DQ stage instead of idk, showing off one of the post-Hero stages

No, that makes too much sense so it can't be the right reason, they've just been holding off on finished content for NINE MONTHS

 

[chocolatejr9]

It'd be cool if there was another Smash Ballot after FP2 for one last hurrah. Maybe the ballot would dictate two additional characters or something.

I've thought about that, actually. They'd probably want to update a few things, though. Make it harder to spam meme characters, if you know what I mean.

 

[CannonStreak]

No, that makes too much sense so it can't be the right reason, they've just been holding off on finished content for NINE MONTHS

Good reason against CacoMallow. How could they wait that long to release that stuff? Plus, like I said some pages back, I doubt we'll get more Bethesda content or even Cacodemon since we have Vault Boy as a costume, already.

 

[7NATOR]

I've thought about that, actually. They'd probably want to update a few things, though. Make it harder to spam meme characters, if you know what I mean.

If they update that, this Ballot will actually be a better tool in determining the characters people want, than the previous ballot, along with the fact that


-All the Veterans all already in the game, so they aren't siphoning votes

-Smash Ultimate has a Way Bigger audience than Smash 4 did back in the voting days

-Thanks to Characters like Cloud and Joker, I don't think people will be afraid to vote for a character that "seems Impossible'

I just hope that if they ever did another one, they state that the Results "will also be used for future games", so Assist Characters like Waluigi, Shadow, and Isaac won't be held back by their NPC Positions

 

[Guynamednelson]

Thanks to Characters like Cloud and Joker, I don't think people will be afraid to vote for a character that "seems Impossible'

They will be afraid to vote for a character that "seems impossible" for different reasons: They won't have enough arbitrary hype points.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Good reason against CacoMallow. How could they wait that long to release that stuff? Plus, like I said some pages back, I doubt we'll get more Bethesda content or even Cacodemon since we have Vault Boy as a costume, already.

what if when Pete Hines said "Oh yeah" when asked about Nintendo contacting them for Smash, it was for the Vault Boy costume? would explain why he gave a "doesn't look good" response when asked specifically about Doom Slayer

 

[CannonStreak]

what if when Pete Hines said "Oh yeah" when asked about Nintendo contacting them for Smash, it was for the Vault Boy costume? would explain why he gave a "doesn't look good" response when asked specifically about Doom Slayer

Interesting take, Rie. With that, I doubt it would look good for a Cacodemon costume and thus, CacoMallow in general.

 

[StrangeKitten]

What do you expect them to do for a year? They can’t take a full year off lmao. It’s either continue working on Smash or start on their next jobs/project.

I just want them to get some darn rest already. Working on Smash for so many years has got to be draining. I guess it would be bad business to take a lot of time off between passes, but they certainly deserve it. If Ultimate is done when we end FP2, I disagree that they have to start on their project right away. I would hope some time could be spared for a nice vacation so that they could go into their next project refreshed.

As for Geno, obviously he's my most wanted, and I'm proud to support him! I think he has a lot of weird stuff that might point to his inclusion - a couple song takedowns of tracks that fit him perfectly, Legacy XP takedown, Megasmilax reference in Palutena's guidance, SMRPG commercial reference in Piranha Plant's Classic Mode victory screen, a lot of references to Geno from Gamestop and Walmart Canada the past month or so, and probably other stuff I'm forgetting. It could all be a pile of coincidences, but I can't deny that it's juicy. As far as I'm aware, no other character has this many things that could, could hint at their inclusion.

Now, if you couldn't tell from my mights and coulds, I don't think he's a lock. I think his chances are very good, but are there also very good chances that he doesn't make it in? Of course. I think the only time we can really consider a character a lock is if we get another leak as damning as the SNK leak. That said, I've always felt a certain tongue-in-cheek vibe when people in the Geno thread say he's coming. When we got told to "hype responsibly" for the millionth time, everyone in that thread said they are well aware that we may not actually get Geno. I could be off-base, but it's always struck me as the people there having fun. And if they say he's coming and he doesn't and they get disappointed, so what? It's okay to get disappointed as long as you express your disappointment in a healthy way. And I don't think anyone in the thread intends to send nasty tweets to Sakurai over it or anything. We'll vent in the thread for a while, I'll continue to support Geno for the next game while others might stop, and life will go on.

As for how I feel about Fatman, he's a pretty cool guy and I respect him as a fellow Geno fan. I also enjoy his educated speculation, but don't agree with all of it. For example, I think the characters he thinks will get in are a too-good-to-be-true scenario. I think we're likely to get at least one, since the chances of us getting a popular request are very good. But his picks are all popular requests, and I doubt that'll happen. I'm willing to bet we'll get 2 or 3 characters that nobody is currently talking about.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Cacomallow just doesn't add up:

1) Unlike the ESRB leak which was removed nearly immediately by Nintendo, Cacomallow hasn't been shut down whatsoever...for several months

2) Given the fact that this would be considered finished content, it suggests that it's been held onto, finished content that is, for nearly a year prior to it being revealed. Why? It makes little sense.

3) The debug mode is different in the Cacomallow "leak", as opposed to the Ken leak, which doesn't make sense either. It's a debug mode, and given the fact that that leak was legitimate, there's no reasonable explanation as to why it would be different from a legitimate article.

4) Mod experts took to task on proving it could be done and, remarkably, create similar products of Mallow and Cacodemon Mii hats. This proves that it's plausible to create such mods. In other words, a huge point in favor of it (that being, "I-it's impossible to create such detailed mods!!!") was struck down.

5) Something that added credibility to the Ken leak was the faded Ken render, which eventually turned out to be incredibly similar to the actual render, thereby solidifying legitimacy. If the Cacomallow "leak" was supposed to hint at Geno and Doom Slayer, why would the leaker not just post proof of those specific characters, just like the Ken leak was? That's inconsistent as well, and it gives a logical explanation...legitimate looking renders are quite difficult. Even if you see fanmade renders on social media, few of them actually compare to the legitimate article. Just like actual character models, just like Geno and Doom Slayer, were avoided. Why? Because it would blatantly prove it's fake.

While I cannot blame anybody for wanting to believe information that suggests a desired outcome, I believe it is clear that Cacomallow is not a leak at all because it is fake. Among most, if not all, legitimate leaks of record, the characters in question are specifically shown or mentioned. There is little beating around the bush. There is no room for doubt.

A key question with Cacomallow: If the leaker were, for all intents and purposes, wanted to get credibility as a leaker and build hype, would they not just straight up show Geno or Doom Slayer? Logically, as the Ken leaker did, they would. But they didn't, which is why it casts doubt upon it. Cacomallow has little supporting it beyond conjecture and willful ignorance, and only serves to kneecap any argument that uses it to make a claim.

I would recommend avoiding it, because it really isn't useful. It's untrustworthy and has little reason to be seen as credible.

EDIT: Lastly, I would like to point out that I did not mention anything about Geno's overall potential for getting in as a playable character. Really, this "leak" has nothing to do with them, because it's not real. If the crux of your argument for a playable character is a fake leak...maybe one should consider how they're structuring their argument.

EDIT 2: Again, I would like to point out that I love SMRPG, and I think Geno is pretty cool. I'll be ok if he's not in Smash, but I think he'd be a pretty cool pick, so this isn't coming from the view of somebody who dislikes the character.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

If you could cut either Toon Link or Young Link (not both) to be replaced with a unique Zelda character outside the Tri-Force trio, which would it be and why? I'd say Young Link. Even though OOT and MM are my favorite Zelda games, Toon Link represents a more abstract sub-series that has a unique artstyle, which isnt something I can say about Young Link (considering he looks like a child version of practically every Link in existence.)

Cut: Toon Link.
Replaced With: Toon Link, but his moveset is more unique to him.

Uh..... does the Wii U, like, not exist?

Eh, it still doesn't really disprove my argument. The SNES is incredibly old, the SNES Mini incredibly rare, the Wii version is unobtainable, and the Wii U is something I'd imagine a lot of people skipped.

Wrong sword wielder in general.

Wrong era.

Fun Fact: Zero's Z-Sabre is actually it's canonical color in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. I don't have enough information to say that this is a first, but it does seem to be quite rare.

 

[The Rhythm Theif]

Wrong era.
View attachment 282664

Fun Fact: Zero's Z-Sabre is actually it's canonical color in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. I don't have enough information to say that this is a first, but it does seem to be quite rare.

Mega Man X and Zero take place in the same era (with Reploids and all), but the timeskip which splits the two games pretty much spans an entire century. And MMZ Zero is pretty much X Zero but with a different body and new techniques.

Also, about the fun fact, I didn't know that!

 

[NintenRob]

Cut: Toon Link.
Replaced With: Toon Link, but his moveset is more unique to him.


Eh, it still doesn't really disprove my argument. The SNES is incredibly old, the SNES Mini incredibly rare, the Wii version is unobtainable, and the Wii U is something I'd imagine a lot of people skipped.


Wrong era.
View attachment 282664

Fun Fact: Zero's Z-Sabre is actually it's canonical color in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. I don't have enough information to say that this is a first, but it does seem to be quite rare.

What do mean it's Canonical colour? Are you telling me capcom has never gotten the colour of their sword right in game?

 

[cashregister9]

Wrong sword wielder gender

Wrong sword wielder Right Gender though

(Wait I also want Sakura too)

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Wrong sword wielder Right Gender though

(Wait I also want Sakura too)

Actually you're both wrong

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

What do mean it's Canonical colour? Are you telling me capcom has never gotten the colour of their sword right in game?

The Z-Saber is canonically blue, but it's often green in-game, likely because it's more visible against the sky.

Spoiler: For example, this is his is his official MvC3 artwork:

But the sabre is green in-game.

 

[DanganZilla5]

I just saw the indie direct. Pretty good all things considered. Subnautica and Goose were pleasant surprises and the highlight of this direct. But there were other memorable games too like the retro PC game and some of the games at the end which looked like gameboy games. Torchlight and Hades looked sick. So overall I was actually impressed a couple times. It's one of the better indie presentations in recent memory.

Good on Nintendo for making these Indie World directs. You can tell that these games have genuine love and effort put into them.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

If you could cut either Toon Link or Young Link (not both) to be replaced with a unique Zelda character outside the Tri-Force trio, which would it be and why? I'd say Young Link. Even though OOT and MM are my favorite Zelda games, Toon Link represents a more abstract sub-series that has a unique artstyle, which isnt something I can say about Young Link (considering he looks like a child version of practically every Link in existence.)

I'd cut Toon Link because compared to the rest of the Zelda cast, he looks totally out of place. In fact, I think the Legend of Zelda is the only series in Smash Bros to represent a character that comes from a game to use a different art style than what is normally used in the series, unless I'm mistaken.

Anyway, Toon Link just seemed redundant ever since he was first added to Super Smash Bros Brawl and feels more redundant now in Smash Ultimate since Young Link is back...

... I'd replace him with Ocarina of Time Adult Link.

 

[CapitaineCrash]

If you could cut either Toon Link or Young Link (not both) to be replaced with a unique Zelda character outside the Tri-Force trio, which would it be and why? I'd say Young Link. Even though OOT and MM are my favorite Zelda games, Toon Link represents a more abstract sub-series that has a unique artstyle, which isnt something I can say about Young Link (considering he looks like a child version of practically every Link in existence.)

I would cut Young link because he's meant to represent Ocarina of time and Majora's mask and the first game is already represented by Sheik and Ganondorf. Toon link represent more games (Wind waker, Four swords, Minish cap, Phantom hourglass, Spirit tracks and Triforce heroes). I know a lot of people want Young link to use the mask transformation, but I think that with so many games to pull references from Toon link have more potential to be different (or at least having different special and final smash). Also I just love how much he's expressive and overall I think that Toon link is a more lovable character.

For the replacement I'll choose Skull kid. Not only he's my most wanted Zelda character, but hecould represent Majora's mask that Young link was representing.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I'd cut Toon Link because compared to the rest of the Zelda cast, he looks totally out of place. In fact, I think the Legend of Zelda is the only series in Smash Bros to represent a character that comes from a game to use a different art style than what is normally used in the series, unless I'm mistaken.

You're technically incorrect, as Fire Emblem's artstyle varies from game to game, but the difference between Fire Emblem: Shadow Dragon and Fire Emblem: Three Houses is much smaller than the difference between The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker and The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild.

But if we're being fair, the current incarnations of every single The Legend of Zelda character in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate except Sheik come from games with wildly different artstyles, not just Toon Link.

 

[Miles of SmashWiki]

Plus, like I said some pages back, I doubt we'll get more Bethesda content or even Cacodemon since we have Vault Boy as a costume, already.

I don't think we're getting a playable Bethesda character, but I wouldn't be surprised by more Mii costumes. While I'm sure some folks would be disappointed by Doomguy being "just" a Gunner costume, I think it's a reasonably likely outcome. Dragonborn Swordfighter's also plausible.

 

[7NATOR]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

 

[Idon]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

Starts with d- and ends in -isappointment.
Also come on now it's obviously not real.

 

[SharkLord]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

A generally inconsequential villain before series mainstays like Tails, Knuckles, Shadow, and THE Sonic villain Eggman? That won't be received well at all, including by myself.

 

[CannonStreak]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

Even as a Sonic fan, well, mixed, considering I am not even sure if he would be welcomed by fans, and I am also mixed on the character.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

Apparently I don't care about the Sonic the Hedgehog series as much as I thought I did because I love this idea for the sheer ridiculousness of it.

Also, I really like Zavok's character design.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

Pretty sure that was fanmade

 

[SharkLord]

Even as a Sonic fan, well, mixed, considering I am not even sure if he would be welcomed by fans, and I am also mixed on the character.

One of of the sites I go to, someone's making a crossover of hated characters, Zavok included. His tagline is probably the best description of what the fandom thinks of him, and I quote:

ZAVOK ZAVOKS INTO BATTLE OR SONETHING I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT HE DOES

He's just kinda there, except now he's starting to be there all the time. Understandably, the fans are getting tired of seeing him everywhere when there's no real reason they'd want to see him.

 

[CannonStreak]

One of of the sites I go to, someone's making a crossover of hated characters, Zavok included. His tagline is probably the best description of what the fandom thinks of him, and I quote:

ZAVOK ZAVOKS INTO BATTLE OR SONETHING I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT HE DOES

He's just kinda there, except now he's starting to be there all the time. Understandably, the fans are getting tired of seeing him everywhere when there's no real reason they'd want to see him.

I can imagine. I don’t hate him, personally, I just don’t care for him much.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

One of of the sites I go to, someone's making a crossover of hated characters, Zavok included. His tagline is probably the best description of what the fandom thinks of him, and I quote:

ZAVOK ZAVOKS INTO BATTLE OR SONETHING I DON'T REMEMBER WHAT HE DOES

He's just kinda there, except now he's starting to be there all the time. Understandably, the fans are getting tired of seeing him everywhere when there's no real reason they'd want to see him.

le gasp

The Deadly...6? are Sonic's version of the Koopalings!

 

[TheBeastHimself]

In terms of Smash leaks, how did this change things up?

 

[Megadoomer]

le gasp

The Deadly...6? are Sonic's version of the Koopalings!

No; people wanted the Koopalings to return. (at least during the Gamecube era)

 

[cashregister9]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

Zavok has only been appearing to rep the deadly six in sonic games no more no less. Plus Zavok is a meme saying Zavok in smash has the same weight as saying Goku will get into smash, its for funny haha's

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

well you see

 

[cosmicB]

So I just wanted to ask you guys, because Gamefaqs had a Topic about this "Leak" but

How would you guys feel about Zavok being a Character in Smash Bros?

There would be more salt than Byleth. There's a part of me that wants to see this happen despite being against everything I want out of Smash DLC.

But yeah, there is no universe where this will happen.

 

[7NATOR]

Pretty sure that was fanmade

I believe it's just his render from the Olympic edited. in either case I only bring this up because I just wanted to see what people would think of this scenraio happening

Zavok has only been appearing to rep the deadly six in sonic games no more no less. Plus Zavok is a meme saying Zavok in smash has the same weight as saying Goku will get into smash, its for funny haha's

True, but at the same time, at least from what i can tell, people actually want Goku to be in (Me Included), Zavok is the opposite mostly (though there are people that don't mind, which is cool for them.

In terms of Smash leaks, how did this change things up?

It made people be much more suspicious of Leaks I would say, Because i think this is the first Video fake Leak for Smash.

Actually Though, I wasn't here for the Rayman leak, but while the Rayman render looks good, did you guys not discuss how Mewtwo's render looks here? it's quality is no where neat to par of other characters