Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Guynamednelson]

Speaking of Rex, do you guys think Sakurai likes Nia more than Rex. He didn't make her Costume be behind a $25 paywall

He thought the main protagonist being the bonus FP costume would be more attractive.

 

[Shroob]

Picture this:

A character that is generally good and at the same time has a decently high skill ceiling. Pros pick him and the character can do really crazy **** in the highest competitive level. Since this is a Smash forum, I guess the best comparison in that sense is Melee Fox. Did you visualize it? Good.

Now picture that same character being used in a ranked ladder environment. Picture the stress and inevitable toxicity that comes with team esports.

Pair that up with him being hard to stop once he starts getting too many kills mid match, being able to dash, stun and block ALL projectiles for a few seconds (all things that can be annoying in League - even one at a time) and you have your answer.

Plus, some people dislike his personality in game too. I don't, but I've seen players who do. Generally speaking, though, it's more related to how he plays.

God

****

Yasuo


As someone who played League a long-ass time, there is no champion I despise more than Yasuo.


When he's on the opponent's team, he's going to ****stomp you into dirt.

When he's on your team, he may as well not even exist.

 

[osby]

God

****

Yasuo


As someone who played League a long-ass time, there is no champion I despise more than Yasuo.


When he's on the opponent's team, he's going to ****stomp you into dirt.

When he's on your team, he may as well not even exist.

Sounds like every Smash character I ever play.

 

[7NATOR]

He thought the main protagonist being the bonus FP costume would be more attractive.

I guess, I'm just saying there's a chance Sakurai may be one of those people that find Rex as a character meh. From what i read, that seems to be a popular opinion.

 

[DarthEnderX]

From what i read, that seems to be a popular opinion.

Popular opinion is that XBC2 is pretty mediocre in general.

 

[osby]

I guess, I'm just saying there's a chance Sakurai may be one of those people that find Rex as a character meh. From what i read, that seems to be a popular opinion.

I think it's a really really really bad idea to assume "Sakurai dislikes this character" just because they're not playable. We all saw how that turned out with K.Rool.

In the end, Sakurai is a proffessional and while he definitely draws a lot of creativity from his personal likes doesn't mean Smash is a just a reflection of his tastes. NPC characters also has a lot of thought and effort gone into them.

Also, he pretty much apologized for Rex's absence and most of the negativity about the character seems to be from western fans, so that makes your argjment even less likely.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Popular opinion is that XBC2 is pretty mediocre in general.

Yeah, if you look solely at this thread, the Elma thread, and nowhere else.

 

[7NATOR]

I think it's a really really really bad idea to assume "Sakurai dislikes this character" just because they're not playable. We all saw how that turned out with K.Rool.

In the end, Sakurai is a proffessional and while he definitely draws a lot of creativity from his personal likes doesn't mean Smash is a just a reflection of his tastes. NPC characters also has a lot of thought and effort gone into them.

Also, he pretty much apologized for Rex's absence and most of the negativity about the character seems to be from western fans, so that makes your argjment even less likely.

Oh I don't think Sakurai dislikes Rex because he's unplayable. I mean he said he finds Iori's Design brillant, and he's just background character

I was just saying that he might Prefer Nia, maybe he thinks Rex is meh, and that's why Nia's Costume is base game, while Rex's is behind $25 paywall

 

[Perkilator]

pic.twitter.com/KXMK880vdy

— 桜井 政博 / Masahiro Sakurai (@Sora_Sakurai) July 23, 2020

New POTD. I didn't think Sakurai could change the camera angle for the CREDITS GAME of all things.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Oh I don't think Sakurai dislikes Rex because he's unplayable. I mean he said he finds Iori's Design brillant, and he's just background character

I was just saying that he might Prefer Nia, maybe he thinks Rex is meh, and that's why Nia's Costume is base game, while Rex's is behind $25 paywall

You're coming up with too many theories now.

 

[osby]

Oh I don't think Sakurai dislikes Rex because he's unplayable. I mean he said he finds Iori's Design brillant, and he's just background character

I was just saying that he might Prefer Nia, maybe he thinks Rex is meh, and that's why Nia's Costume is base game, while Rex's is behind $25 paywall

I'm not sure if that makes sense. Rex's costume was used to encourage people to buy the first pass. I think it has more to do with his popularity, not Sakurai being petty and not allowing him to be on the base game.

And even if prefers Nia, what he'll even gain from her costume being on the game over Rex's?

 

[7NATOR]

I'm not sure if that makes sense. Rex's costume was used to encourage people to buy the first pass. I think it has more to do with his popularity, not Sakurai being petty and not allowing him to be on the base game.

And even if prefers Nia, what he'll even gain from her costume being on the game over Rex's?

Yeah, I guess. But it still feels kinda wrong that he made Rex's Costume behind $25, especially since Byleth was on the end of the pass, and considering the fact that Rex's Reasoning for not being considered for base roster was him being "too late" it feels like slap in the face. Sakurai did not make Nia $25 costume, only Rex.


And honestly, He only needed to sacrifice Rex. he didn't need to sacrifice Rex and Nia for Bonus costumes.

You're coming up with too many theories now.

I mean, What else am i supposed to do, this is the Newcomer DLC Speculation Discussion board

 

[Rie Sonomura]

remember also, Nintendo chooses the characters for DLC. Rex was too late for base, yes, and for all we know Sakurai may have asked Nintendo to have Rex be playable for DLC but Nintendo shot that request down, so the costume was a consolation prize

 

[Guynamednelson]

I mean, What else am i supposed to do, this is the Newcomer DLC Speculation Discussion board

It's not the "come up with random new theories every five seconds" thread.

 

[PLANTMAN]

remember also, Nintendo chooses the characters for DLC. Rex was too late for base, yes, and for all we know Sakurai may have asked Nintendo to have Rex be playable for DLC but Nintendo shot that request down, so the costume was a consolation prize

But this is pass 2 not pass 1 and I say his chances have, improved

 

[7NATOR]

remember also, Nintendo chooses the characters for DLC. Rex was too late for base, yes, and for all we know Sakurai may have asked Nintendo to have Rex be playable for DLC but Nintendo shot that request down, so the costume was a consolation prize

This was a Scenraio I was thinking of too. It's apart of my "Rex Deconfirm Theory" (even though I don't think Rex is Officially Deconfirmed or anything)

I do wonder if Nintendo turns down a Request, is it valid for only 1 Fighter Pass, or both. I could see Rex being turned down for the first one if there's not enough Space, but if we're going back and adding ARMS Characters (Min-Min), if Nintendo still would turn down Rex then I'm not sure what the reason is. I Don't know

It's not the "come up with random new theories every five seconds" thread.

I mean it's not against the rules, and plus one of these theories could come to fruition. I'm putting some ideas out there you know. Trying to figure out the Fighter Pass you know

 

[osby]

Yeah, I guess. But it still feels kinda wrong that he made Rex's Costume behind $25, especially since Byleth was on the end of the pass, and considering the fact that Rex's Reasoning for not being considered for base roster was him being "too late" it feels like slap in the face. Sakurai did not make Nia $25 costume, only Rex.


And honestly, He only needed to sacrifice Rex. he didn't need to sacrifice Rex and Nia for Bonus costumes.



I mean, What else am i supposed to do, this is the Newcomer DLC Speculation Discussion board

I think you're projecting a little here.

Rex was too late for the base game but Byleth had the right timing for DLC. They are two different things.
Sakurai didn't "sacrifice" anyone. He just made it so that people can dress their Miis up as popular costumes. If Nintendo wants Rex to be in the second pass, a Mii costume won't stop them.

 

[PLANTMAN]

Also why would sakurai request Rex to be playable if this was supposed to be all Nintendo’s decision? Doubt he would request him. He said that he couldn’t add Rex in base cuz bad timing so sakurai just Repped xc2 the best he can with no fighter like arms.

 

[osby]

remember also, Nintendo chooses the characters for DLC. Rex was too late for base, yes, and for all we know Sakurai may have asked Nintendo to have Rex be playable for DLC but Nintendo shot that request down, so the costume was a consolation prize

Why would Nintendo turn Rex down? They are usually more than happy with Smash getting their new characters.

Is this about Elma again?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This was a Scenraio I was thinking of too. It's apart of my "Rex Deconfirm Theory" (even though I don't think Rex is Officially Deconfirmed or anything)

I do wonder if Nintendo turns down a Request, is it valid for only 1 Fighter Pass, or both. I could see Rex being turned down for the first one if there's not enough Space, but if we're going back and adding ARMS Characters (Min-Min), if Nintendo still would turn down Rex then I'm not sure what the reason is. I Don't know



I mean it's not against the rules, and plus one of these theories could come to fruition. I'm putting some ideas out there you know. Trying to figure out the Fighter Pass you know

to be fair, I think Rex is for sure out, otherwise we'd have gotten Spring Man or Ribbon Girl instead of Min Min. The former's an Assist Trophy and the latter's a costume just like Rex. as for why Rex would still be turned down, notice that Xenoblade 2 isn't prominently featured in advertising anymore. its time has come and gone, and Xenoblade 1 Definitive Edition is currently in the spotlight

 

[7NATOR]

I think you're projecting a little here.

Rex was too late for the base game but Byleth had the right timing for DLC. They are two different things.
Sakurai didn't "sacrifice" anyone. He just made it so that people can dress their Miis up as popular costumes. If Nintendo wants Rex to be in the second pass, a Mii costume won't stop them.

I get the reasoning why Byleth is here

But i think for more casual viewers, if they watched the final direct, Sakurai states that Rex was too late to be on the roster (well at least base roster). Seeing Byleth make it in, who's game comes out over a year later make it in, and it doesn't feel too good, even if the reasoning is more complex and everything.

Plus Byleth themselves are very Controvisial newcomers. I know people that don't buy entire passes for characters they don't care about, and Byleth is that sort of character that would pose those strong reactions, so making Rex Costume by buying an entire $25 Season pass, that includes Byleth might not sit well with people.

And yeah i don't think Rex being a Mii Costume will automatically stop him from being playable...maybe. If he's not playable though, I do think they should make his Costume Purchasable desperately

 

[Lamperouge]

to be fair, I think Rex is for sure out, otherwise we'd have gotten Spring Man or Ribbon Girl instead of Min Min. The former's an Assist Trophy and the latter's a costume just like Rex. as for why Rex would still be turned down, notice that Xenoblade 2 isn't prominently featured in advertising anymore. its time has come and gone, and Xenoblade 1 Definitive Edition is currently in the spotlight

We got Min Min because Yabuki wanted Min Min.

If his favorite character was Spring Man/Ribbon Girl and he wanted them in Smash, I don't think the Mii costumes would've stopped him.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

We got Min Min because Yabuki wanted Min Min.

If his favorite character was Spring Man/Ribbon Girl and he wanted them in Smash, I don't think the Mii costumes would've stopped him.

Fair enough

 

[Schnee117]

The Rex costume is only a part of the pass because Nintendo mandated it.

If Sakurai had his way it'd have been in the base game.

 

[Perkilator]

The Rex costume is only a part of the pass because Nintendo mandated it.

If Sakurai had his way it'd have been in the base game.

Excpet he would've been in the same situation as ; intended for the base game, but made a DLC character outside the Fighter's Pass due to time constraints (and probably Spring Man too, regardless of whether or not becomes DLC).

 

[osby]

to be fair, I think Rex is for sure out, otherwise we'd have gotten Spring Man or Ribbon Girl instead of Min Min. The former's an Assist Trophy and the latter's a costume just like Rex. as for why Rex would still be turned down, notice that Xenoblade 2 isn't prominently featured in advertising anymore. its time has come and gone, and Xenoblade 1 Definitive Edition is currently in the spotlight

Min Min was chosen because the director of ARMS wanted her, not because Spring Man and Ribbon Girl had Mii costumes.

Also, "if this three year old game is irrelevant now" was a good enough reason to turn down a character, we wouldn't got Min Min. And XCDE is only a remake of a game that already has a character in Smash.

 

[PLANTMAN]

The Rex costume is only a part of the pass because Nintendo mandated it.

If Sakurai had his way it'd have been in the base game.

Is there even any proof of that?

 

[Schnee117]

Excpet he would've been in the same situation as ; intended for the base game, but made a DLC character outside the Fighter's Pass due to time constraints (and probably Spring Man too, regardless of whether or not becomes DLC).

It's a Mii costume and you could get it at launch.

Not even remotely close to being like Plant.

 

[7NATOR]

Actually though the Rex situation made me think about the Decision of FP2, and the characters in it

A part of me theorize that While FP2 wasn't actually in the Planning stages until sometime into FP1's devlopment, i do think an idea of what type of characters would be in the 2nd Fighter Pass could have existed much earlier, perhaps even before the Roster of FP1 was finalized.

If that is the case, it's something to think about. In the case of Rex, because Mii costumes are supposed to give you an impression that you are playing that character (something Spirits nor Mii Costumes do), In this case it could be bad for Rex if the idea of what charcaters would be in DLC past FP1 was circulating.

It might also explain why Sakurai only said he was considering Min-Min and Ninjara.

 

[N3ON]

We obviously got Min Min due to popularity. It's fortunate and serendipitous that she's also Yabuki's favourite, that was probably the cherry on top, but like I've said before, were his favourite the least popular ARMS character, there's no way that's the one they would've included.

You guys are taking that statement at face value far too readily.

 

[osby]

The Rex costume is only a part of the pass because Nintendo mandated it.

If Sakurai had his way it'd have been in the base game.

Not sure if this was stated anywhere but it makes a lot of sense. Sakurai has made it clear that he's against selling existing content as DLC.

 

[Lamperouge]

Anywho, the whole "Rex is out for sure because irrelevance, stan Elma!!!" argument is pretty hypocritical since XCX is also "irrelevant" and nothing seems to hint at the next Xenoblade game being a follow-up to it or XCX:DE being released anytime soon.

 

[PLANTMAN]

Not sure if this was stated anywhere but it makes a lot of sense. Sakurai has made it clear that he's against selling existing content as DLC.

But didn’t we just get Min Min?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

But didn’t we just get Min Min?

Spirits don't give the impression of "playing as someone" that Costumes do, and Min Min doesn't have a costume

 

[osby]

But didn’t we just get Min Min?

Yes. And almost all of the content in her pack was developed after the release of Ultimate, unless you count a few Spirits which pales in comparison to a fully unique fighter, a completely new stage and multiple new tracks.

 

[PSIGuy]

Considering that Fighter Pass 2's bonus is a boring Ancient Armor costume they probably acknowledge that putting a super desired newcomer in as a DLC-only costume was not a nice thing to do. The Rex costume should've been base-game.

That said, I don't think just because XB2 and Arms are both games that missed the base roster that they have equal reason to get in now. ARMS compared to XB2
-is an entirely new IP rather than a sequel
-sold more copies in a more niche genre
-is the original IP brainchild of someone responsible for many of Nintendo's best hits (Yabuki directed Mario Kart 8, which is still selling millions)

As a favor to Yabuki, as promotion of something totally new that did very well ARMS is very justified in a fighter pack. The inclusion of Shulk in Smash -at all- did huge things for Monolith Soft in a very similar way - except it did all this before Xenoblade reached even a fraction of the height ARMS did.

 

[PLANTMAN]

notice that Xenoblade 2 isn't prominently featured in advertising anymore.

And neither is xenoblade chronicles X

 

[Perkilator]

It's a Mii costume and you could get it at launch.

Not even remotely close to being like Plant.

Wha...? That's not what I meant. What I meant is that if Sakurai had his way, Rex and Spring Man likely would've been in a situation due to time constraints; full-fledged characters who are DLC outside the Fighters Pass.

EDIT: Oh wait, you were talking about the Mii Costume and not Rex as a fighter...my mistake.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Spirits don't give the impression of "playing as someone" that Costumes do, and Min Min doesn't have a costume

They gave the impression that you were playing AGAINST an imitation of someone.

 

[osby]

Spirits don't give the impression of "playing as someone" that Costumes do, and Min Min doesn't have a costume

Multiple playable characters have Mii costumes so I don't think which impression they gave is relevant to the newcomers.