Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

Hadokeyblade

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Nintendo themselves aren't even giving this game a chance for a follow-up. They were wanting this to be as successful as Splatoon and it failed to reach that. They got initially invested and were actually willing to make a comic book series out of it with Dark Horse, but that series is in development hell and will mostly likely just be canceled. It was suppose to release in Fall 2018, then say that it will release in January 2019, and never said anything about at all for a whole year. This is a series that just doesn't look to have a future at all.
I'm kinda lost here which series are you complaining about this time?
 

wynn728

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I'm kinda lost here which series are you complaining about this time?
Saying how the ARMS series is dead with no real future, which is why it has zero chance on getting in the next Smash Bros games that's probably happening in another 5 to 7 years from now.
 

Rie Sonomura

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Didn’t Sakurai also apologize for Spring Man being an Assist Trophy like he did with Isaac, and Rex’s costume? If he can find a way to make Spring Man work for a future Smash game I don’t see why he can’t become a contender eventually
 

osby

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Saying how the ARMS series is dead with no real future, which is why it has zero chance on getting in the next Smash Bros games that's probably happening in another 5 to 7 years from now.
Judging a game's future from a licensed adaptation might not be the best argument.

Then again, none of your arguments make much sense and they're all variations of "me no like, stop having fun".
 
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D

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Those characters got a lot of hate
Yes. They were controversial, and your point was that Nintendo wanted to avoid controversy... but they knew full well these characters would get some hate. See my point?
 
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Supergeno

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So I've drawn a couple of mii costumes of some indie characters that I would like to see



In order:

- Robin (Iconoclasts) for Mii Swordfighter
- Mina (Iconoclasts) for Mii Gunner
- Madeline (Celeste) for Mii Brawler
- The Knight (Hollow Knight) fro Mii Swordfighter
- The Drifter (Hyper Light Drifter) for Mii Swordfighter
- Hat Kid (A Hat In Time) for Mii Swordfighter
 

TheShiningAbsol

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I wonder what Wynn was saying about Ridley or K. Rool before they were revealed?
“Metroid is dead so obviously they’re not going to put Ridley in and definitely not Dark Samus because it’s an assist and Sakurai doesn’t care about the fans. Plus Ridley is boss and Sakurai thinks that’s good enough. And K. Rool doesn’t even appear in DK games anymore. And he’s a Mii costume, so obviously he’s not going to get in. Plus neither of them are Fire Emblem. Also Sakurai doesn’t care about the fans.”
 
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Tora_Toad

Smash Rookie
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Mar 9, 2020
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So I've drawn a couple of mii costumes of some indie characters that I would like to see



In order:

- Robin (Iconoclasts) for Mii Swordfighter
- Mina (Iconoclasts) for Mii Gunner
- Madeline (Celeste) for Mii Brawler
- The Knight (Hollow Knight) fro Mii Swordfighter
- The Drifter (Hyper Light Drifter) for Mii Swordfighter
- Hat Kid (A Hat In Time) for Mii Swordfighter
that looks really cool!
 

osby

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Guys, let's just ignore the troll and move on. No point in feeding them.
 
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wynn728

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Judging a game's future from a licensed adaptation might not be the best argument.

Then again, none of your arguments make much sense and they're all variations of "me no like, stop having fun".
I'm judging it based on everything that been going on with ARMS and Nintendo. It didn't have the impact they were hoping for, it didn't grow when they kept adding new free content to the game, they put the face of the franchise in as an Assist Trophy in Smash Bros, didn't even bother including any of the songs to Smash, didn't even bother trying to get a playable rep when the Fighters Pass was originally going to be the last content added to Smash, and how after a decade or more Nintendo decided to actually reach out to make a western comic series for ARMS series is dead in the water and they don't even bother to update the status of the book until last month.

I would love to see ARMS continue and get a character, I went out of my way to get the first ARMS issue during Free Comic Book Day, there is so much writing on the wall that shows that the ARMS series doesn't have a future for itself.
 

SpectreJordan

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Even if a new Rhythm heaven is in development I doubt Nintendo would chose it as a promotional pick. RH felt more like a base game Sakurai pick.

Also a RH fighter was planned for Smash 4 and Megamix was released in 2015 on 3ds. Why didn't they add something at that moment for dlc? My guess is Sakurai wanted it but rhythm based fighter didn't work so he gave up the idea.
The common theory is that it was going to be the Chorus Kids, but the 3DS couldn’t handle them like with Icies.

Eh, I don't really get people when they say stuff like "We don't really have anything to go off of right now", when I feel we actually have plently of information to actually make some decently educated guesses on Pass 2, waaaaaay more than anything we had to go off of for pass 1.

  • A whole pass full of Nintendo-chosen picks to showcase Nintendo's choices and mindset. (Nintendo isn't completely tone deaf? western characters? Shill picks? Ect.)
  • Post-Pass Spirit events/Third Parties Working with Smash (Resident Evil Spirits? Arc-System Works Spirits? Ubisoft costumes? Warframe Spirits? Indie Costumes?)
  • Missing Mii Costumes? (Heihachi? Lloyd?,Geno?)
  • A metric ton of random misc. Information floating around (Koei Tecmo actually helped work on Byleth? Bethesda said no Doomguy in Smash? Pass decided throughout 2019? ECT.)
There is a bunch of stuff you can take away from all of this information. If I've learned anything throughout speculation it's that the only actually reliable way to make predictions is to base it off of things we actually know. The best way I've found to go about this is just to look at everything that has happened and ask "Ok, what does all this stuff mean?" I've got my own main takeaways from all this, which I won't post because I don't want this post to be extremely long, but everyone is free to make their own assumptions on this, and I think people should.
I agree that the Heihachi/Lloyd costumes missing is suspicious, but we all thought a Namco character was a lock for FP1 too. So I don’t really know what to think.

If Namco is trying to be modest, they should stop. A lot of people WANT another Namco character, who cares if some would think its a biased pick lol
 
D

Deleted member

Guest
So I've drawn a couple of mii costumes of some indie characters that I would like to see



In order:

- Robin (Iconoclasts) for Mii Swordfighter
- Mina (Iconoclasts) for Mii Gunner
- Madeline (Celeste) for Mii Brawler
- The Knight (Hollow Knight) fro Mii Swordfighter
- The Drifter (Hyper Light Drifter) for Mii Swordfighter
- Hat Kid (A Hat In Time) for Mii Swordfighter
Most of these look great, but man. Hollow Knight was not made to have human proportions.
 

Rie Sonomura

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The common theory is that it was going to be the Chorus Kids, but the 3DS couldn’t handle them like with Icies.



I agree that the Heihachi/Lloyd costumes missing is suspicious, but we all thought a Namco character was a lock for FP1 too. So I don’t really know what to think.

If Namco is trying to be modest, they should stop. A lot of people WANT another Namco character, who cares if some would think its a biased pick lol
dont forget the Gil costume

and yeah, I think the 3DS doomed Chorus Kids too, and the Wii U probably wouldn’t have been powerful enough for 8 player Chorus Kids/Icies
 

osby

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If Namco is trying to be modest, they should stop. A lot of people WANT another Namco character, who cares if some would think its a biased pick lol
I don't think it has anything to do with Namco.

Nintendo chooses the DLC newcomers and even if Namco develops the game, they don't seem to have any effect on this picks like Sakurai does.
 

Lamperouge

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Ring Fit is out of the running now, eh? Can't say that I particularly wanted them (hell, I was actually a little against their inclusion) but my condolences to their supporters nonetheless.
 

CapitaineCrash

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The common theory is that it was going to be the Chorus Kids, but the 3DS couldn’t handle them like with Icies.
Well, it was stated oficially by Sakurai that some characters that was planned early on got cut because they where considered "low priority":
"MS:At the very beginning I did that. This time our project-proposal is dated May 2012, at that time all characters were decided already. Then as production moves on we will say "We won't put that chracter in" and cut out low-priority-characters.

ND: That means in your project-proposal there are more characters than ended up in the game?

MS: Yes, but I won't tell which of course."
Source: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/saku...-jr-almost-didnt-make-in-smash-4-more.962896/

Also even if the "cut for 3ds because of limitations" theory is true, it doesn't explain why he didn't reuse the idea for Ultimate base game, like he did with Chrom and he brought back Ice climbers. Ultimate base game was the perfect moment to bring Rhythm heaven on the table, but they prioritize Splatoon (because it's huge) and franchise that was already represented (Metroid, DK, Animal crossing, Pokémon and Fire emblem). Rhythm heaven was considered a low priority newcomers in Smash 4, too low to even make a come back in Ultimate, so I don't see why suddenly it would come back as DLC in Ultimate.
 

Hadokeyblade

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If Namco is trying to be modest, they should stop. A lot of people WANT another Namco character, who cares if some would think its a biased pick lol
I'm not even a Namco fan and I look at them like:
All of the previous third party companies got new characters, they should get one too.
 

Guynamednelson

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“Metroid is dead so obviously they’re not going to put Ridley in and definitely not Dark Samus because it’s an assist and Sakurai doesn’t care about the fans. Plus Ridley is boss and Sakurai thinks that’s good enough. And K. Rool doesn’t even appear in DK games anymore. And he’s a Mii costume, so obviously he’s not going to get in. Plus neither of them are Fire Emblem. Also Sakurai doesn’t care about the fans.”
"Inklings are a Mii Costume and only FE gets new game privileges because Sakurai doesn't care about the fans. Chrom is a Final Smash and a Mii Costume and Sakurai thinks that's good enough and also he's not a shill FE rep so he can't get in."
 

TheCJBrine

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It’s sad knowing the Chorus Kids likely got killed by the 3DS and Rhythm Heaven’s lower success probably caused them to be on the chopping block for Ultimate too.

I remember seeing their minigame during Smash 4 speculation, I really liked it and wanted them in the game, even though I never played Rhythm Heaven. I still haven’t played RH, but I’d still like to see them.
 
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Guynamednelson

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It’s sad knowing the Chorus Kids likely got killed by the 3DS and Rhythm Heaven’s lower success probably caused them to be on the chopping block for Ultimate too.

I remember seeing their minigame during Smash 4 speculation, I really liked it and wanted them in the game, even though I never played Rhythm Heaven. I still haven’t played RH, but I’d still like to see them.
I came up with this idea that Duck Hunt is supposed to be insert-RH-rep-here's replacement. They weren't on the project plan, and just like an RH rep, they're a very unique character from an unrepresented Nintendo IP.

Also RH games were decent sellers, Smash fans nowadays just don't like knowing that Nintendo games without fighters/characters that aren't fighters can still have more than 10000 fans.
 

Curious Villager

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I don't think Namco themselves are the ones choosing whether or not they want any of their characters in the game out of their own modesty or anything.
The choice in the end is all up to Sakurai and Nintendo and whether or not they want to include any additional characters from the company.

I suppose he probably didn't want to make it seem like they would get any special treatment just because they are working on the game or anything.

An additional Namco character will happen when it happens, just like every other third party, more or less.
 
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Xenoblade2_Rex_Tora

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I don't think Namco themselves are the ones choosing whether or not they want any of their characters in the game out of their own modesty or anything.
The choice in the end is all up to Sakurai and Nintendo and whether or not they want to include any additional characters from the company.

I suppose he probably didn't want to make it seem like they would get any special treatment just because they are working on the game or anything.

An additional Namco character will happen when it happens, just like every other third party, more or less.
Hi :D
 

Cutie Gwen

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Pretty sure the reason Chorus Kids got scrapped is because Sakurai realized that timed hits are an objectively bad mechanic for fighting games. There's a reason the only timed hit attack is a command grab that starts the timing thing after you land the grab
 
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