Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Cutie Gwen]

I feel like we are correlating shill pick=bad here, I have no problem with Hero being here even as one. Dragon Quest deserves to be in Smash, but that doesn't change the fact that Nintendo has waaaay more to gain having him here than anyone else in the pass. As for the alt's, that was more Sakurai's decisions than anything else, again all Nintendo really does it pitch the characters and nothing else. It's because of him that we got the other representation in the first place.

The thing with shill pick is that they exist to well, shill. They weren't added for fandemand, they were added to go "Hey go buy this". I just don't think Hero's inclusion was particularly chosen to shill the second Nintendo rerelease of a 2017 game and that calling it a shill pick doesn't fit, it's like saying Joker was shilling Persona 5 Strikers or that Cloud was shilling Final Fantasy Explorers

 

[Zero Suit Violet]

The same person who makes Isaac not use his combat abilities or Oshawott not use his Scalchop.

Yeah, it's sad to see that sometimes, some AT and Assist can just have the worse possible representation of themself you can possibly give them, and then people are like "Be happy with that !"

I'm at least glad my MW didn't suffer through that, Midna at least have her most iconic characteristic represented

 

[pinshadow]

The thing with shill pick is that they exist to well, shill. They weren't added for fandemand, they were added to go "Hey go buy this". I just don't think Hero's inclusion was particularly chosen to shill the second Nintendo rerelease of a 2017 game and that calling it a shill pick doesn't fit, it's like saying Joker was shilling Persona 5 Strikers or that Cloud was shilling Final Fantasy Explorers

Except the fact that Nintendo literally published Dragon Quest XI S on Switch. That's the difference. They aired the trailer for the game after his reveal, that's kinda the definition of shilling. Like, heres the character, now here's the definitive version of his game coming out in a few months exclusively on Nintendo Switch. They've been trying to promote the franchise as a big deal on Nintendo platforms.

 

[Proceleon]

.. To be honest, does Pokeball even MEAN anything since there are Thousands of them anyway ? Especially when we're talking about representing a Spin Off where Pokeballs doesn't even exist ?

Also while we're on the topic ... Who the hell put Reflect on a Gardevoir ?! She's a Glass Canon ! It's like the worse possible move you can give her ! What the heck Smash !

I would say so. One instance of a Pokemon is enough gameplay-wise. Not to mention if that happened the Assist fanbase would go nuclear.

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I don't really want Dante, Sora or Geno, I actually want Spyro over Crash and I unironically want an Endless Ocean Diver as a Fighter.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Except the fact that Nintendo literally published Dragon Quest XI S on Switch. That's the difference. They've been trying to promote the franchise as a big deal on Nintendo platforms.

It's the second rerelease of the game to be Nintendo exclusive but again, this is pretending that's the major reasom they were in and not literally everything else. Had the Switch port came out in 2017 like it was supposed to instead of going through development hell, would Hero still be a shill pick? After all, we know for a fact that Hero was planned for the baseroster when Ultimate was being planned back in 2015=2016

 

[IsmaR]

Isn't this the exact reason why Ivysaur got screwed in Brawl so they just removed Type effectiveness in its entirety in Ultimate?

I'd say it was more that the whole mechanic was just poorly implemented to begin with for all the characters.

Squirtle tanked fire moves better, but got combo'd easier by things like Flamethrower. Ivysaur did appreciate being pushed slightly less by Water Gun/F.L.U.D.D. as it had a horrible recovery in Brawl. Charizard got pushed more by the same water moves (really making no difference as it could glide anyway), and in the dumbest instance of the mechanic, had an even harder time with Ivysaur's Bullet Seed than any other character.

Ironically it later led to the same characters being at a disadvantage in Smash 4/Ultimate. Fighting Chandelure in Smash Run as any fired based character was pure suffering, and I'm not sure what "weakness to/resistance to fire/water" attributes really bring besides just being kinda cute quirks based on what Spirit got them.

-
Slightly unrelated, but I guess I'll go off of the on/off Pokémon tidbit going on in every other support thread.

I get the desire for balancing the trio with non PT Pokémon characters, but I'd have to agree on the "Grass for the sake of Grass" novelty not being nearly as enticing as it used to be. I chose Grookey, loved both Decidueye/Rillaboom and even the idea of Zarude (being whip based/basically spidermanmonkeything), but still acknowledge their could be better/more unique options out there (which I believe they'd get in on their own "because GF/TPC said so" and "Sakurai thought it'd be neat" merits anyway). Let alone being just limited to being an "obligatory Pokémon."

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Hero seems like a “best of both worlds” pick for Nintendo and Square Enix. Nintendo gets one of the best games of the generation on their console with plenty of additional content, which is also advertised as the “definitive edition”, Square gets more publicity for their newest game in a series that struggles in the West historically...

Smash has usually done wonders for series that cross over with it, and there you have it...a deal that turns into a win-win for both sides.

 

[HansShotFirst20]

All five DLC characters have a Fire attack.

Joker's side-b
Hero's neutral-b plus sizz and sizzle
Banjo has firey grenades
Terry's power wave looks like fire
Byleth has the crest of flames, which powers his sword.

Honestly, screw punchy characters and sword fighters. There's too much fire in Smash.

If Pokemon Trainer's weakness mechanic was still in smash, Ivysaur would be a lot less good.


On another note, the fact that Platnium games is advertising Wonderful 101 via Kickstarter means they're probably not pushing the character for Smash.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I don’t really want Ryu Hayabusa, much as how likely he probably is. I’m just very disappointed with Tecmo’s business practices as of late and wouldn’t want them to be associated with Smash any more than they already are (the Yuri Kozukata Assist Trophy, FYI)

I do want Elma, Neku, KOS-MOS and Octoling and apparently quite a lot of people disagree (at least for Elma and KOS-MOS, for the other two it seems others just don’t care)

 

[Zero Suit Violet]

I would say so. One instance of a Pokemon is enough gameplay-wise. Not to mention if that happened the Assist fanbase would go nuclear.

Eh, well, it's kinda weird, because on one hand, it's a Gardevoir being there in a role in Smash, on the other hand ... Mario wearing overalls and Mario wearing a Coat is counted as two different characters, or worse, Donkey Kong with Bongis, is counted as a different entity, than Donkey Kong without Bongos, so the lines is pretty unclear

Especially when, once again, we're talking about a different character, with her own story and personality, who is from the same species than the one in the Pokeball, I dunno it's just too tin to really say if we can't cross this line haha

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Btw how does Gardevoir having Reflect seem so awful, it protects it's trainers in canon, getting rid of projectiles is indeed protecting

 

[pinshadow]

It's the second rerelease of the game to be Nintendo exclusive but again, this is pretending that's the major reasom they were in and not literally everything else. Had the Switch port came out in 2017 like it was supposed to instead of going through development hell, would Hero still be a shill pick? After all, we know for a fact that Hero was planned for the baseroster when Ultimate was being planned back in 2015=2016

I mean the 3DS version was released on the same day as the PS4, it's not like it was ported later. And the fact that Hero was delayed from base-game yet still ended up being the 2nd pass character instead of the first, which just so happens to make him release way closer to the release of his game on Switch, still raises questions.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I mean the 3DS version was released on the same day as the PS4, it's not like it was ported later. And the fact that Hero was delayed from base-game yet still ended up being the 2nd pass character instead of the first, which just so happens to make him release way closer to the release of his game on Switch, still raises questions.

That still doesn't make Hero a shill pick. Remember what was a major influence for the Ultimate? The ballot. This is the same **** as saying Ridley was shilling Samus Returns

 

[Trevenant]

Believe what ever you want. You want to ignore everything from Smash 64 to Ultimate in how Pokemon characters are decided then go right ahead. Believe that everything is totally possible and that they would chose whoever-the-crap Pokemon as the Gen 8 rep instead of one of the Starters. And while you at it how about you believe that they would represent a brand new series by putting in a side character in first instead of the main characters. Just set your expectation up super high and believe that their are no limits in Smash Bros, just don't be upset when reality comes into play.

I’m not believing anything. I’m just not claiming that others don’t have a shot when they do. Maybe you need to take a break or something because it seems your behaviour has gotten you a name for yourself.

 

[HansShotFirst20]

I mean the 3DS version was released on the same day as the PS4, it's not like it was ported later. And the fact that Hero was delayed from base-game yet still ended up being the 2nd pass character instead of the first, which just so happens to make him release way closer to the release of his game on Switch, still raises questions.

A character being pushed to a later DLC release because of their home game's delayed release?

really makes you wonder... doom

 

[Guynamednelson]

Yeah, it's sad to see that sometimes, some AT and Assist can just have the worse possible representation of themself you can possibly give them, and then people are like "Be happy with that !"

I'm at least glad my MW didn't suffer through that, Midna at least have her most iconic characteristic represented

The newer ATs seem to generally be better at depicting what the character's about. Must be from not having to deal with Wii/3DS RAM limitations, as I can't imagine they'd be able to handle Zero's.

 

[Opossum]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I have zero interest whatsoever in Skull Kid and Bandana Dee but at the same time have a laundry list of Fire Emblem characters I'd still like to hypothetically see.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

Lloyd for me because i personally think Yuri would be more fun
and Sora because man I love Sora

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I have zero interest whatsoever in Skull Kid and Bandana Dee but at the same time have a laundry list of Fire Emblem characters I'd still like to hypothetically see.

Opo's gonna use the Infinity Gauntlet to replace every character in Smash, including V2, with FE characters. Just like MCU Thanos, people will hotly debate this 'morally grey' action despite it being clear as day if it was good or not, though unlike MCU Thanos, this was a good call good job Opo, show me that list and make me proud

 

[Evil Trapezium]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I really don't care for 2B at all but if she gets in, i'd be like whatever. She's just another sword fighter to me, even when I made a moveset for her I was still not convinced she's anything special.
Here it is below in response to an interesting game someone presented so you can see I actually did some research before coming to the conclusion that I don't like her so I'm automatically immune to criticism now. Yay!

Spoiler: 2B moveset

Neutral special: Pod Shot - Tap the button to fire a ranged laser shot, hold the button down to lock on to enemies for it to fire multiple missiles.

Side Special: Charge Slash - Hold down the button to charge up a slash that changes depending on the direction you hold (e.g. Diagonally upwards/downwards or straight ahead, controls like dancing blade).
If straight ahead: 2B will throw her sword that will slash horizontally and spin in place in front of her.
If Diagonally upwards: 2B will jump flip and slash around herself.
If Diagonally downwards: 2B will flip slash and then does a forward thrust motion with her sword.

Up Special: Pod lift - 2B grabs onto pod 042 and they fly up into the air but she can swing around on the pod to do a quick horizontal slash to end it early to give her some horizontal distance.

Down Special: Counter/Self Destruct - Like other characters, it counters moves but if she uses it too often, she will self destruct much like Hero. The first time deals 50 damage to her but the next time she will be KO'd, However it will also deal massive damage towards any opponents in proximity of the blast.

Final Smash: YoRHa Flight Unit Type-B - A trapping final smash just like every other DLC character where the flight unit flies toward 2B and any opponent in the way gets pulled into a cinematic final smash where it just shoots a bunch of missiles and then 2B jumps out of it to do a devastating slash through her opponents where they all get sent flying.

Overall I've probably done this really badly but this is as good as I can make it for being really unfamiliar with the series. 2B to me is still kind of boring but she isn't as bad as I initially thought. I wouldn't mind if she got into Smash Ultimate and I think she has a really good chance of being one of the Fighters Pass volume 2 characters.

Another character I'm against is the Dragonborn and by extension, any create a character. I just don't see how Dragonborn would be any fun at all or be anything different compared to hero. I don't like his realistic design because it makes it hard to imagine him in a goofy fantasy game like this. He would be another Swordfighter who would use a Sword and Shield for all of his attacks except maybe for his special moves. To top it all off, he and the world he comes from is just uninteresting. I would much rather prefer Doom Guy

Reimu is another character that I don't like. I don't like the look of her or the series she comes from. Too cutesy on the outside for me to even consider giving it any kind of go, even if the inside of the series is much darker than it looks. I just see cute anime girl and write her off without giving the series a fair chance.

As for characters that I want that everyone else is against, The obvious one is Geno. I'm not too fussed if he doesn't get in but he just looks cool and he can shoot with his fingers. I also like his design like the hat and cape is nice to look at.

Crono might be another one but people just don't consider him a threat to Sora or 2B's chances. That goes twofold for poor old Ark who hasn't even had his game re-released.

Lucky for my most wanted, I have yet to find someone who would actively be against Cortez' inclusion in Smash so that must mean everyone must agree with me that he should be in Super Smash Bros Ultimate as a Playable Character! No surprise though because he would be a great character with the most interesting moveset of any DLC character!

Yeah! Time to Split!

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I'm pretty open to any character getting in, but I just don't see the appeal of Ashley from WarioWare. I wouldn't complain about her inclusion, but I'd be indifferent.

As for your second question, my most-wanted character to put in Smash at this point is Ganon. I'm hoping that someday, he'll get a Ridley-style promotion and finally move on from boss to playable character.

 

[P.Kat]

You people keep bandwagoning grass starters when we clearly need more water types to put out these fires smh.

Well I wanted Primarina for Ultimate Instead of Incineroar, but nooooooooooo "Moving quickly with flippers isn't possible." You all cause this upon yourselves.

 

[Zero Suit Violet]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

Mmm... Doomguy and Master Chief would most likely count for the first one, no offense to fans of those characters... I just don't personally see the appeal for them in Smash, nor do I see their moveset being very fun, even after researching and being linked to a lot of different moveset when I shared that opinion online

And well, for the second one, she's far from being unpopular, but my Most Wanted, Midna, is an Assist Trophy, so I had to deal with a lot of people shooting her down on that sole fact, even when I was just talking about being passionate about her, and not about Ultimate itself
And BWD, is a very popular character too, but I know that the "Hat Gomba LOL" people still exist, so there's that

 

[Garteam]

While I don't think your franchise has to be synonymous with Nintendo like Mega Man or Dragon Quest to get a playable chaaracter, I do think you need some sort of working relationship with the Big N and some kind of release on a Nintendo system to be eligible for Smash:
's impetus was Kojima going to Sakurai during Melee's development, but even then Metal Gear was not completely foreign to Nintendo. There was the NES port of Metal Gear 1, the America-only Metal Gear 2 for NES (although, I doubt this changed much), and Metal Gear: Ghost Babel on the GBC. Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes would also release a Gamecube exclusive between Snake's proposal in Melee and his release in Brawl.
is largely an arcade icon, but he still had a few games on Nintendo systems. The NES port of the original Pac-Man, Pac-Attack for the SNES, Pac-Man 2: The New Adventures for the SNES, and the Gamecube ports of Pac-Man World 2 and 3 are all clear examples of this. Pac-Man had also crossed-over with Mario twice, once with Mario being the announcer in Pac-Man Vs. and Pac-Man being playable in Mario Kart GP.
is a lot like Pac-Man, he's mostly known for the arcades but still has a good number of Nintendo appearances. There were numerous SNES ports of Street Fighter II on the SNES and Game Boy, plus Super Street Fighter IV arguably being the 3DS' killer app on launch day.
is a tricky example. While's the face of Final Fantasy on Playstation, the fact Sakurai considered adding the Nintendo centric Bartz or Terra to Smash instead possibly suggests Cloud's Playstation affiliation may've been considered a hurdle to his inclusion. Final Fantasy still ultimately has strong ties to Nintendo, with the NES and SNES being the home of the first 6 entries and Nintendo handhelds seeing semi-frequent rereleases after that. It's likely this strong history with Nintendo was the basis for the inclusion of a FF character, rather than just a desire to see Cloud.
is another tricky example. Not counting Shin Megami Tensei, Persona's been Playstation exclusive since day 1. However, both Persona Q games did see a release on the 3DS and Atlus considers first one canon (no idea if the second one is though). Likewise, you can also turn to somewhat grey example of Shin Megami Tensei If, a SNES game that is technically part of the Shin Megami Tensei series that laid down the foundation for Persona, with many considering it a technical "Persona 0". There's also the Switch port of 5S: Strikers, although it's tough to tell if that had an influence.
is another arcade juggernaut that saw some ports on the SNES, but I think Terry's main connection to Nintendo was SNK's all-in approach to supporting the Switch early in its life. SNK's Neo Geo ports were a massive help in filling the Switch's e-shop for the first few months of the console's life and this strong support to the Switch helped spur the talks that would get Terry in Smash.

 

[ARandomFruit]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I'm alright with a lot of choices I think the only one I'd have a lesser opinion of is Crash out of the more popular choices and out of my most wanteds I think Agumon and Laharl would be the most likely to be "shot down" by others and maybe also Reimu but probably less then the other 2.

 

[Llort A. Ton]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I dont want Sora. I really tried to into KH1 but it didnt catch my interest at all, and I'm not big enough into Disney to want to keep on slugging through it. Also tried to into Shantae but the game just felt pretty meh so I dont care for her. Oh and no Arle please. And as the one Thwomp bro on here I feel like he is a bit underrated here.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I could probably provide a working list of characters that I'm not the least bit enticed by, but even then, if a character on that list did get into Smash, I would probably be won over shortly afterward.

There's also the fact that any time I've played a game containing a character like that, I develop a relationship with that character and then usually become fine with them getting into Smash. That's likely why I have a better relationship with Rex than I do Elma, for example.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I dont want any cereal mascot unless it Klonoa nor do I want any character from a recent game or western

Classic japanese characters only.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

What would Soras final smash be if he got intonl smash

 

[Wunderwaft]

What would Soras final smash be if he got intonl smash

It should be him summoning Donald and Goofy, but unfortunately we don't live in the right timeline, so Sora won't get the final smash he deserves.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

It should be him summoning Donald and Goofy, but unfortunately we don't live in the right timeline, so Sora won't get the final smash he deserves.

yo, but the shotlocks exsist tho. They can do tons of stuff with those

 

[DarthEnderX]

Lucario and Mewtwo uses like psychic fire.

Aura and Psi. Expressly NOT Fire by Smash's own ruleset.

 

[Calamitas]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

I don't want Rex. A badly written mess of a protagonist like him shouldn't make it into Smash, as far as I'm concerned. Let him and anatomical nightmare of a shallow love interest fade into the inevitable obscurity that's gonna come once the next Xenoblade game releases.

As for wants, well, there's Amaterasu. But Capcom's got a couple of other horses in the race, as far as speculation is concerned.

 

[Droodle]

What are some characters you don't want in Smash that other people fiercly do, and some that you want that others would disagree or shoot down? Unpopular opinions time

For the first: I've been on and off for Geno for a bit, but ultimately I don't think he should get in (at least for DLC, base game is entirely different). Yeah, I know there are a bunch of dedicated Geno fan's that have wanted him in for a long time, but in terms of the overall gaming landscape Geno isn't anyone special. To me, the reason why a lot of people want him is because he was a lot of people's "first" JRPG "cool, strong character"; but other then that he's pretty dang forgettable (Mallow is way more interesting in terms of development). Geno is pretty much exposition most of the time. A lot of people equate him to Banjo (in terms of fan demand), but I feel as though Geno is WAY MORE divisive then Banjo in the Smash fanbase. If he gets in, I wouldn't be that upset and be genuinely happy for his fans (EXCEPT the ones that are annoying, I don't like a good portion of Geno's fanbase). The music from SMRPG would be pretty cool to get (Yoko Shimomura is one of the best composers in the industry).

If I was to choose a Square character over him; my top two picks would be Neku (TWEWY) and Fei (Xenogears). Both of them are amazing characters and would be extremely unique. Fei is a master of martial arts, ON TOP OF THAT he has a giant robot. He would be so unique! That said, his Xenogears would probably just be saved for his final smash.

But Neku in particular is probably one of Square's best characters both in terms of depth/development as well as moveset potential. To me he just seems like a better Geno, in that he would be mostly projectile focused. He could summon his partners during his combos for his special attacks. His regular attacks could be him summoning different projectiles (like fireballs, ice shards, swords, lasers, etc); his UP B could be Vulcan Uppercut. I mean Neku's entire gimmick is just IMAGINATION, so there's tons of things they could do for him. To me, Neku just seems like a better version of what Geno could provide as a fighter.

Also both games have 10/10 music too. Too bad that both of them have near a 0% chance to get in (Neku may get in ONLY if TWEWY 2 is announced this year.)

There's a bunch more I'd like over popular requests (Yuri would be more fun then Lloyd, fight me). But I'll save that for later.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

For the first: I've been on and off for Geno for a bit, but ultimately I don't think he should get in (at least for DLC, base game is entirely different). Yeah, I know there are a bunch of dedicated Geno fan's that have wanted him in for a long time, but in terms of the overall gaming landscape Geno isn't anyone special. To me, the reason why a lot of people want him is because he was a lot of people's "first" JRPG "cool, strong character"; but other then that he's pretty dang forgettable (Mallow is way more interesting in terms of development). Geno is pretty much exposition most of the time. A lot of people equate him to Banjo (in terms of fan demand), but I feel as though Geno is WAY MORE divisive then Banjo in the Smash fanbase. If he gets in, I wouldn't be that upset and be genuinely happy for his fans (EXCEPT the ones that are annoying, I don't like a good portion of Geno's fanbase). The music from SMRPG would be pretty cool to get (Yoko Shimomura is one of the best composers in the industry).

If I was to choose a Square character over him; my top two picks would be Neku (TWEWY) and Fei (Xenogears). Both of them are amazing characters and would be extremely unique. Fei is a master of martial arts, ON TOP OF THAT he has a giant robot. He would be so unique! That said, his Xenogears would probably just be saved for his final smash.

But Neku in particular is probably one of Square's best characters both in terms of depth/development as well as moveset potential. To me he just seems like a better Geno, in that he would be mostly projectile focused. He could summon his partners during his combos for his special attacks. His regular attacks could be him summoning different projectiles (like fireballs, ice shards, swords, lasers, etc); his UP B could be Vulcan Uppercut. I mean Neku's entire gimmick is just IMAGINATION, so there's tons of things they could do for him. To me, Neku just seems like a better version of what Geno could provide as a fighter.

Also both games have 10/10 music too. Too bad that both of them have near a 0% chance to get in (Neku may get in ONLY if TWEWY 2 is announced this year.)

There's a bunch more I'd like over popular requests (Yuri would be more fun then Lloyd, fight me). But I'll save that for later.

This is where Sakurai reveals Neku as the true ballot winner when he gets confirmed as FP11

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This is where Sakurai reveals Neku as the true ballot winner when he gets confirmed as FP11

I just legit want Neku to be in FPV2 period. I heckin love TWEWY

 

[Cosmic77]

Aura and Psi. Expressly NOT Fire by Smash's own ruleset.

Some of the attacks have a flame-like animation, but grouping them with other characters who use fire seems forced.

I also think bombs are kind of a stretch too.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Some of the attacks have a flame-like animation, but grouping them with other characters who use fire seems forced.

I also think bombs are kind of a stretch too.

Bombs are fire according to the game as seen with Fire/Explosion Resist

 

[Will]

I also think bombs are kind of a stretch too.

Bombs combust when they explode, which is fire ignition.

It makes total sense, it's why Simon's fire messes with Link's rune bombs.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

What would Soras final smash be if he got intonl smash

Probably Ragnarok/King of Hearts, since that's his go to ultimate attack.

If Sakurai goes above and beyond and gets Disney content, then it's gotta be KH2's Trinity Limit.