Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Hadokeyblade]

I still want Gardevoir and Deoxys. As for a Gen 3 stage, I like the idea of Battle Frontier.

I'd take sky pillar as the hoeen stage

 

[Megadoomer]

What the heck is Metabots?

It's a video game series about battling customizable robots by Natsume (who also did the Harvest Moon series) that later became an anime.

I remember watching the anime along with Digimon Tamers, and I had video games for the Game Boy Advance, though I wasn't aware that Medabots games were still being made for the 3DS.

This is the series mascot (at least, as far as I know), Metabee:

 

[Arcadenik]

I'd take sky pillar as the hoeen stage

That could work. Rayquaza could be a stage boss and it does the same thing it did in Brawl.

 

[Proceleon]

Point taken. Thank you for refreshing my memory.

Yes, Lucina and Dark Pit did receive criticism and backlash during SSB4. The marketing team called them Echo Fighters and Daisy received praise and joy and people suddenly wanted more Echo Fighters.

Ahh yes, their pointless creations are fully justified now that clones have a name. The power of branding.

 

[Guynamednelson]

pointless creations

Quickly appealing to certain characters' fanbases. Very pointless.

 

[Proceleon]

Quickly appealing to certain characters' fanbases. Very pointless.

Literally just give them the Alph treatment. It's that simple.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

It's a video game series about battling customizable robots by Natsume (who also did the Harvest Moon series) that later became an anime.

I remember watching the anime along with Digimon Tamers, and I had video games for the Game Boy Advance, though I wasn't aware that Medabots games were still being made for the 3DS.

This is the series mascot (at least, as far as I know), Metabee:

The anime is incredible

They got actual famous animators to work on the show so almost every episode is just animators constantly flexing

https://www.sakugabooru.com/post/show/11016

https://www.sakugabooru.com/post/show/10999

https://www.sakugabooru.com/post/show/72953

https://www.sakugabooru.com/post/show/87260

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Literally just give them the Alph treatment. It's that simple.

People that like Alph wish he was an Echo Fighter. That extra bit of characterization can go a long way. Bonus points if there is a reason to choose them over their original counterpart.

 

[Arcadenik]

Literally just give them the Alph treatment. It's that simple.

You are right. Let’s just give Luigi and Dr. Mario the Alph treatment.

Luigi is literally just green Mario and he started out as a Mario recolor in the arcade. Dr. Mario is literally just Mario in a lab coat.

Oh, and don’t get me started on Young Link and Toon Link.

 

[Guynamednelson]

You are right. Let’s just give Luigi and Dr. Mario the Alph treatment.

Luigi is literally just green Mario and he started out as a Mario recolor in the arcade. Dr. Mario is literally just Mario in a lab coat.

Oh, and don’t get me started on Young Link and Toon Link.

Zelda and Palutena's special moves minus Phantom are based on abilities Link and Pit can use in their games but not Smash. Therefore they should be Link/Pit alts.

 

[Arcadenik]

People that like Alph wish he was an Echo Fighter. That extra bit of characterization can go a long way. Bonus points if there is a reason to choose them over their original counterpart.

Pikmin fan here.

I really would like Alph to be an Olimar Echo with Rock Pikmin. The Rock Pikmin could function like Purple Pikmin. So Alph could be like Olimar with nothing but Purple Pikmin.

That or keep Olimar and Alph together and give the Olimar Echo with Rock Pikmin idea to Louie and Brittany... so there would be technically four Pikmin characters to choose from.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Then Falco becomes SSF2 Crystal. lol

True but...she ain't here, so someone should use that rifle. And he's the one what's got artwork.

Krystal gets the gatling gun.

Giving Wolf a machine gun would make him more like Fox though.

How so? Fox uses a blaster. Wolf currently uses a...spikey blaster. A machine gun would be more different from a blaster than a spikey blaster.

Miltank I'll allow under the condition that we don't get the cursed image of it using Milk Drink on itself...

*Young Link fills his bottle at Miltank*

 

[Guynamednelson]

How so? Fox uses a Blaster. Wolf currently uses a...spikey Blaster. A Machine Gun would be more different from a Blaster than a spikey Blaster.

I think the point is that Fox can fire his Blaster rapidly, like a machine gun, while Wolf can't.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I think the point is that Fox can fire his Blaster rapidly, like a machine gun, while Wolf can't.

Ah, I see. I would hope that the machine gun would function differently than just a faster blaster though. Different ranges, different firing angles, etc.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Pikmin fan here.

I really would like Alph to be an Olimar Echo with Rock Pikmin. The Rock Pikmin could function like Purple Pikmin. So Alph could be like Olimar with nothing but Purple Pikmin.

That or keep Olimar and Alph together and give the Olimar Echo with Rock Pikmin idea to Louie and Brittany... so there would be technically four Pikmin characters to choose from.

At the very least give Alph his voice. That would help a lot regardless of Echo status.

 

[Guynamednelson]

At the very least give Alph his voice. That would help a lot regardless of Echo status.

Give both of them their voice.

 

[DarthEnderX]

All this Pokemon talk has finally got me thinking of a decent game.

If there was a fighters pass that had six Pokemon, who would you want them to be?

Charizard
Beedrill
Garchomp
Decidueye
Lycanroc
Mr. Rime

 

[N3ON]

I don't see your point. I don't think anyone's saying Gen 1 doesn't have unique options or that it's bad. People just notice when a roster has a lot of the same. We said the same thing when we noticed all the StarFox crew had the same moves... which they still do!

Yes, and when people remark how the Smash roster has a lot of FE in any context other than jovially, people around here don't take that very well. My point is that there's a double standard in regards to what the target of this argument is.

I think it's perfectly valid to raise concerns with disproportionate representation, whether in Pokemon, Smash, or whatever the case may be. In a civil manner, of course. I won't defend those who just go "FE bad, Sakurai biased, hur dur dur" or whatever. But, if it's somehow an impropriety to raise how one is overabundant, using the same arguments to decry another should garner the same reception. Otherwise it's blatant partisanship.

Eh, call me biased but I'd say this is more comparable to the criticism of Awakening getting 3 characters when other installments only got 1, the criticism is that one installment of a franchise gets a significantly larger slice of the pie when compared to the rest, the rest in this case being the other Pokemon/FE games

Ok, but if you imagine every series in Smash as its own Pokemon Gen, you can again apply the very same concern you raised to that. I know people then might raise how Mario and Pokemon have more, but imagine those two are Gens that have, like, 500 Pokemon each. So they just get more. Fire Emblem has as many as, like, Donkey Kong, Kirby, Metroid - it's at that rough level.

Shouldn't all those Gens get similar representation if in they have the feasibility for it? Any point you can raise for one will apply elsewhere (this gen is successful - well so is the other, this gen is good - well, the same can be said about the other, the characters from this gen could make for quality additions - and the others couldn't?). There are people who like all those gens, there are characters from all who could be interesting. But one just keeps getting the attention. And that's without even mentioning some of the smaller Gens like Xenoblade, which only get scraps.

I mean, I totally get those earlier Pokemon complaints. I understand why they do it, but I would never invalidate the argument that it's unfair to all those other gens and fans thereof. However, I think it's as unfair within Smash as it is within Pokemon, because at the end of the day it's just people complaining about inequality among equals, which is a pretty valid thing to complain about.

 

[Cosmic77]

Different generations of fans grow up with different Pokemon games, and now I'm at the age where I get to see myself in younger fans when a new Pokemon Gen gets revealed.

Yeah, you could probably add any notable Gen I Pokemon, and those people just getting in to Pokemon would still likely recognize it, just as they would with the newer ones in their first Pokemon game. Still, the attachment isn't the same. There's no memory of seeing new Pokemon first revealed, going to school and talking about the game with your friends, or trading Pokemon with your siblings.

Even if it's not through a character, I'd like to see each Gen get a decent amount of love, or at least something better than Gen III. It sucks when your favorite Gen gets mostly ignored while others get a character, a stage, and several Pokeball Pokemon. I still wish Gen V got a little more.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Different generations of fans grow up with different Pokemon games, and now I'm at the age where I get to see myself in younger fans when a new Pokemon Gen gets revealed.

Yeah, you could probably add any notable Gen I Pokemon, and those people just getting in to Pokemon would still likely recognize it, just as they would with the newer ones in their first Pokemon game. Still, the attachment isn't the same. There's no memory of seeing new Pokemon first revealed, going to school and talking about the game with your friends, or trading Pokemon with your siblings.

Even if it's not through a character, I'd like to see each Gen get a decent amount of love, or at least something better than Gen III. It sucks when your favorite Gen gets mostly ignored while others get a character, a stage, and several Pokeball Pokemon. I still wish Gen V got a little more.

It really does annoy me that Gen 3 is the odd one out here, at least gen 5 has one of the better stages but Gen 3 gets nothing.

 

[Proceleon]

Different generations of fans grow up with different Pokemon games, and now I'm at the age where I get to see myself in younger fans when a new Pokemon Gen gets revealed.

Yeah, you could probably add any notable Gen I Pokemon, and those people just getting in to Pokemon would still likely recognize it, just as they would with the newer ones in their first Pokemon game. Still, the attachment isn't the same. There's no memory of seeing new Pokemon first revealed, going to school and talking about the game with your friends, or trading Pokemon with your siblings.

Even if it's not through a character, I'd like to see each Gen get a decent amount of love, or at least something better than Gen III. It sucks when your favorite Gen gets mostly ignored while others get a character, a stage, and several Pokeball Pokemon. I still wish Gen V got a little more.

Gens 3 and 5 have it rough. Timing was just a little off for them, even though they COULD have added Sceptile or Registeel or someone from Gen 3 when ORAS came around!!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

It really does annoy me that Gen 3 is the odd one out here, at least gen 5 has one of the better stages but Gen 3 gets nothing.

The only thing Gen 3 got at best was that Pokemon Trainer's design is specifically the Gen 1 remakes during Gen 3's time. So at best a technicality.

But really, it does feel pretty shafted. Though hey, we got a boss for it, I guess? Honestly, the area Rayquaza is at(I forget its name) is a great stage to have. Can even have Rayquaza show up here and there as a stage boss or just a more regular hazard like Ultimate Chimera is.

 

[Proceleon]

The only thing Gen 3 got at best was that Pokemon Trainer's design is specifically the Gen 1 remakes during Gen 3's time. So at best a technicality.

But really, it does feel pretty shafted. Though hey, we got a boss for it, I guess? Honestly, the area Rayquaza is at(I forget its name) is a great stage to have. Can even have Rayquaza show up here and there as a stage boss or just a more regular hazard like Ultimate Chimera is.

That is something, Rayquaza was in Subspace. But that's kinda it.

 

[Kokiden]

Some of you don't seem to realize that if you just swap out a few key words regarding Gen 1 vs. other Gens in you guys are voicing the exact arguments you decry when people use the very same rhetoric for FE vs. other series.

I mean, it's all there: "we'd like more variety", "it's oversaturated", "people don't hate it, but they're tired of getting the same thing", "it's successful but so are other options", "if you disagree you're biased".

So I guess the response in kind is to call you haters? Either that or to restate how "but Gen 1 is good". I could mention "but Gen 1 has unique/popular characters!" as if the others don't as well. Or I guess I could just make some "drinking tears" jokes. A bit reductionist, as obviously the other side makes valid points, but it's what seems to be accepted in the other example.

I'm just following along what's being said and I noticed this as well.

It seems they know what it feels like, but they'll still push it aside and make up excuses for FE when the time comes.

I don't think newer generation Pokemon, and new protagonists for FE games, coming on board Smash every time a new game comes out is a good thing at all.

It's pretty much saying there can be an unlimited number of Pokemon and FE characters coming on board Smash down the line, because they're from a new game, with new characters, story, etc.

When does it stop if that's the argument? What about other series and characters?

 

[P.Kat]

All this Pokemon talk has finally got me thinking of a decent game.

If there was a fighters pass that had six Pokemon, who would you want them to be?

1. Decidueye
2. Salamence
3. Swampert
4. Bisharp
5. Gliscor
6. Darmanitan

1. Gardevoir
2. Garchomp (With Cynthia in background)
3. Zacian
4. Lopunny
5. Meowstic (switching mechanic)
6. Gengar

 

[Cosmic77]

I'm just following along what's being said and I noticed this as well.

It seems they know what it feels like, but they'll still push it aside and make up excuses for FE when the time comes.

I don't think newer generation Pokemon, and new protagonists for FE games, coming on board Smash every time a new game comes out is a good thing at all.

It's pretty much saying there can be an unlimited number of Pokemon and FE characters coming on board Smash down the line, because they're from a new game, with new characters, story, etc.

When does it stop if that's the argument? What about other series and characters?

To be fair, Pokemon and FE have a new cast in each game. Most of Nintendo's other properties don't do that.

Besides, even if it didn't, I still think Pokemon would keep getting characters. We've almost exhausted all of our options for Mario, but that hasn't stopped Sakurai from tapping into enemies now. Extremely popular and active franchises are more likely to get new characters.

 

[andree123]

Spoiler: Papagenos has this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/657498848968704001/683144160706166785/papapapa.png

I rather not say that this is fake.

 

[PeridotGX]

All this Pokemon talk has finally got me thinking of a decent game.

If there was a fighters pass that had six Pokemon, who would you want them to be?

1. Decidueye
2. Salamence
3. Swampert
4. Bisharp
5. Gliscor
6. Darmanitan

One thing I really like about Pokemon is that there are a ton of wacky options you can't get anywhere else (hence my dissapointment with a relatively standard wrestler). If I had to limit it to six...

1. Ledian (It's a superhero bug. It's one of my favorite Pokemon, and if Game Freak won't give it love I will)
2. Deoxys (a sentient strand of mutated DNA. It could provide the stance changing moveset many want)
3. Aegislash (Generic anime Swordsmen? Lame. Ghostly anime sword? cool)
4. Decidueye (It's a ghost owl with a bow. That's cool.)
5. Lycanroc (Terraforming dog. Has the added perk of being Ash's actual main Pokemon during the Alola ark)
6. Mr. Rime (It's Charlie Chaplin, if he also had ice powers. He'd be very unique and fun)

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Spoiler: Papagenos has this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/657498848968704001/683144160706166785/papapapa.png

I rather not say that this is fake.

Tbf giving her shorts is something I can totally see them doing

something seems... off about the overall render though

 

[Proceleon]

1. Gardevoir
2. Garchomp (With Cynthia in background)
3. Zacian
4. Lopunny
5. Meowstic (switching mechanic)
6. Gengar

Good choices, but in what universe does Meowstic switch anything? It literally doesn't.

To be fair, Pokemon and FE have a new cast in each game. Most of Nintendo's other properties don't do that.

Besides, even if it didn't, I still think Pokemon would keep getting characters. We've almost exhausted all of our options for Mario, but that hasn't stopped Sakurai from tapping into enemies now. Extremely popular and active franchises are more likely to get new characters.

Yeah, with FE and Pokemon we're talking about a series that gets at least, what, 50-60 characters a game?

 

[CureParfait]

All this Pokemon talk has finally got me thinking of a decent game.

If there was a fighters pass that had six Pokemon, who would you want them to be?

1. Decidueye
2. Salamence
3. Swampert
4. Bisharp
5. Gliscor
6. Darmanitan

1. Darkrai
2. Tapu Lele
3. Arceus
4. Alcremie
5. Tsareena
6. Hawlucha

 

[Kokiden]

To be fair, Pokemon and FE have a new cast in each game. Most of Nintendo's other properties don't do that.

Besides, even if it didn't, I still think Pokemon would keep getting characters. We've almost exhausted all of our options for Mario, but that hasn't stopped Sakurai from tapping into enemies now. Extremely popular and active franchises are more likely to get new characters.

That's exactly what I mean: the argument of Pokemon and FE having a new cast each game, and this alone is enough reason for it to be justification for them to be added, that it's acceptable.

If that's enough reason to just keep adding them... when does it stop? Until more than half the roster is made up of them?

So many great series and character out there, yet some would rather see them continuously dipping into the same pot?

 

[Goombaic]

Spoiler: Papagenos has this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/657498848968704001/683144160706166785/papapapa.png

I rather not say that this is fake.

Sakurai added Sheik a year after Ocarina of Time so adding a 10 year old spoiler like this wouldn't be too bad. The render for her is ugly and fake though and they'd choose the protagonists over her.

 

[Idon]

That's exactly what I mean: the argument of Pokemon and FE having a new cast each game, and this alone is enough reason for it to be justification for them to be added, that it's acceptable.

If that's enough reason to just keep adding them... when does it stop? Until more than half the roster is made up of them?

So many great series and character out there, yet some would rather see them continuously dipping into the same pot?

It stops when Sakurai stops loving both character roster retention and adding characters from new games.

So... pretty soon probably.

 

[Proceleon]

That's exactly what I mean: the argument of Pokemon and FE having a new cast each game, and this alone is enough reason for it to be justification for them to be added, that it's acceptable.

If that's enough reason to just keep adding them... when does it stop? Until more than half the roster is made up of them?

You act like it'll just be Pokemon and FE eventually. I'm sure they'll limit themselves to like, 8-ish.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Spoiler: Papagenos has this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/657498848968704001/683144160706166785/papapapa.png

I rather not say that this is fake.

I know literally nothing about danganronpa can anyone give me an idea for moveset put of curiosity?

 

[Kokiden]

You act like it'll just be Pokemon and FE eventually. I'm sure they'll limit themselves to like, 8-ish.

I was exaggerating if that wasn't obvious, but judging by your response, I guess not.

No guarantee they'll limit themselves to 8 down the line as I said originally, not necessarily in this game.

FE seems to be in a business deal with smash, to the point where I think every new FE will get into Smash no issue.

It stops when Sakurai stops loving both character roster retention and adding characters from new games.

So... pretty soon probably.

Not just talking about Ultimate. I'm pretty sure I said down the line, so I was suggesting possible future Smash games.

 

[PeridotGX]

Spoiler: Papagenos has this

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/657498848968704001/683144160706166785/papapapa.png

I rather not say that this is fake.

The render doesn't look bad, it just doesn't look much like the Smash renders. Interesting choice though. It breaks up the monotony of "Crash! Dante! Geno!".

 

[Proceleon]

I know literally nothing about danganronpa can anyone give me an idea for moveset put of curiosity?

That render's to spoilery to be real. Sakurai wouldn't do that.

 

[Aerospherology]

That render's to spoilery to be real. Sakurai wouldn't do that.

Sheik
Mecha-Fiora
etc.

Sakurai eats spoilers for breakfast.