Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Graizen]

I don't belive the ballot result leak myself but find it interesting that it stated Marvel heroes got some votes.
I was wondering why Sakurai suddenly mentioned Iron Man with Goku.


I think he was just joking.
His leak was something like this. But remember, this guy has zero credibility.

The lineup will be dissapointing. Each DLC characters has their themes.
Joker and Erdrick as new and old JRPG rep.
Steve and Reimu as the west and the east indies rep.
Agumon as last surprise WTF character from the vein of toy rep.

So , another Agumon leak?
Thats good!

 

[IsmaR]

does anyone expect a heavy as dlc?

Not just a heavy, THE Heavy.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

In all seriousness, I think they've done a good job diversifying playstyles among the current newcomers (the lightest being Isabelle/Joker/Inkling), and don't really think things like weight hold much... weight.

I expect more middle or lighter than feather weight, but not for any reason other than I don't imagine there's much popular/likely characters that fit such extreme ends.

I'd personally like more superheavy villains like Porky or Pig Ganon, but I don't expect them any time soon. Heavy or Doomguy (closer to Samus weight, imo) would be genuinely hilarious though.

 

[thisjustin2001]

GUYS, GUESS WHAT? E3 IS 2 WEEKS FROM TODAY!

 

[Megadoomer]

GUYS, GUESS WHAT? E3 IS 2 WEEKS FROM TODAY!

This month definitely went by quickly. Kind of weird that Sony won't be there (neither will EA, but all I expected from them are sports games that barely change from year to year and showing us how badly they're mishandling developers like BioWare), but I'm looking forward to Bethesda and Nintendo's presentations.

I'm cautiously optimistic about Microsoft's presentation - there will likely only be a handful of games that I'm interested in, but we got the announcements of Dragon Ball FighterZ and Devil May Cry 5 in previous years, and bare minimum, it seems likely that we'll see something on Battletoads since that's supposed to come out this year.

I just hope that Square-Enix has an actual presentation this year, as opposed to a collection of trailers that had been released long before E3.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Or maybe Sakura. She is at least aesthetically different from Ryu and Ken (different clothes) and is the most popular Street Fighter character, according to Capcom's recent poll (results here).

And we can have fun by saying Sakurai is in Smash.

The problem with Sakura is that she isn't 1 to 1 with Ryu and Ken proportion-wise. (Weeell, older Sakura might be.)

Imagine if they did Dan...

 

[Izanagi97]

The problem with Sakura is that she isn't 1 to 1 with Ryu and Ken proportion-wise. (Weeell, older Sakura might be.)

Imagine if they did Dan...

I can see Dan being 10% slower than Ryu like how Ken is 10% faster than Ryu.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I can see Dan being 10% slower than Ryu like how Ken is 10% faster than Ryu.

They could also make him not always face his opponent since he doesn't really know what he's doing. lol

 

[Izanagi97]

They could also make him not always face his opponent since he doesn't really know what he's doing. lol

Also, I just now realized that a 10% slower run speed than Ryu would result in a bottom 10 run speed

 

[tenworldsguy]

I'm kinda new here, but I these are my hot takes

we are for sure NOT getting a FE rep. Sakuri has almost certainly noted the negative reaction to Corrin (adding Chrom doesn't lock a FE char, he already had a model and they decided to make him an echo for eastern fans). It would be ridiculous to place in another FE char while the pot still boils.

we are probably not getting a Mario rep. The series has been half squeezed to death in terms of smash representation, and while I do understand that it's a moneymaker, there just simply isn't any remaining char (assuming Spirits deconfirm) that would make sense to add, especially as DLC. On a similar note, it's very unlikely that we will be getting any new LOZ chars, for a similar reason.

I considerably doubt mainstream Nintendo characters from already existing franchises will get any representation. This pains me to say as a Louie supporter, but there isn't any char that hasn't been deconfirmed that would make sense as a DLC.

New Nintendo series representation would be cool, but very unlikely. Most top Nintendo series are already in smash in some regard, and most lower Nintendo series potential reps have already been deconfirmed (see: Isaac, Spring Man, etc).

very unlikely we are getting any indie representation, which again pains me to say (Hat Kid supporter), but excluding Steve (whose peculiar movement might be a turn-off for Sakuri) and maybe Reimu (who is a literal who in the west), there isn't any char who has enough support to be noticed.

also, asking for another Square rep is just a waste of time. If square is this stingy with their poster boy, then there's no hope for Erdrick, Sora, etc.

those are my hot takes. maybe they cold takes. idk.

 

[Izanagi97]

I'm kinda new here, but I these are my hot takes

we are for sure NOT getting a FE rep. Sakuri has almost certainly noted the negative reaction to Corrin (adding Chrom doesn't lock a FE char, he already had a model and they decided to make him an echo for eastern fans). It would be ridiculous to place in another FE char while the pot still boils.

we are probably not getting a Mario rep. The series has been half squeezed to death in terms of smash representation, and while I do understand that it's a moneymaker, there just simply isn't any remaining char (assuming Spirits deconfirm) that would make sense to add, especially as DLC. On a similar note, it's very unlikely that we will be getting any new LOZ chars, for a similar reason.

I considerably doubt mainstream Nintendo characters from already existing franchises will get any representation. This pains me to say as a Louie supporter, but there isn't any char that hasn't been deconfirmed that would make sense as a DLC.

New Nintendo series representation would be cool, but very unlikely. Most top Nintendo series are already in smash in some regard, and most lower Nintendo series potential reps have already been deconfirmed (see: Isaac, Spring Man, etc).

very unlikely we are getting any indie representation, which again pains me to say (Hat Kid supporter), but excluding Steve (whose peculiar movement might be a turn-off for Sakuri) and maybe Reimu (who is a literal who in the west), there isn't any char who has enough support to be noticed.

also, asking for another Square rep is just a waste of time. If square is this stingy with their poster boy, then there's no hope for Erdrick, Sora, etc.

those are my hot takes. maybe they cold takes. idk.

Yeah they're not really hot takes, also welcome to Smashboards

 

[Megadoomer]

very unlikely we are getting any indie representation, which again pains me to say (Hat Kid supporter), but excluding Steve (whose peculiar movement might be a turn-off for Sakuri) and maybe Reimu (who is a literal who in the west), there isn't any char who has enough support to be noticed.

I can think of at least one...

Also, welcome to Smashboards!

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

I can think of at least one...

Also, welcome to Smashboards!

I just want to say, even though I'm not supporting Sans I'm glad he's been given the most push for being in Smash over the human.

Have there been any other franchises in a similar spot to Undertale in which the supporting cast is so beloved that they're pushed to be in Smash before the actual main character? Only one I can think of is Zero from MMX, but not sure if that counts as we already have Mega Man.

 

[Ridrool64]

I'm very much a pro-Frisk candidate, but I believe that Liu Kang is the nominal main character of Mortal Kombat. Yet everybody and their mother wants Scorpion if they want an MK character. I think Soul Calibur has somebody else as its main character too, but Nightmare is the big guy everybody wants. That's a few examples of a character in a Frisk/Sans situation.

Sans is helped out by Pikachu, but Frisk is helped out by Cloud and Joker. I feel like both are valid candidates, but because Frisk can have a mechanic that makes them represent one of Undertale's biggest features, while Sans cannot without breaking character, I lean towards them over him. I won't throw a fit if Sans gets in (he'd help a lot for a Skeleton T/Dapper Bones spirit battle if Arle got in) but I'd prefer Frisk.

 

[Raxxel]

I'm very much a pro-Frisk candidate, but I believe that Liu Kang is the nominal main character of Mortal Kombat. Yet everybody and their mother wants Scorpion if they want an MK character. I think Soul Calibur has somebody else as its main character too, but Nightmare is the big guy everybody wants. That's a few examples of a character in a Frisk/Sans situation.

Sans is helped out by Pikachu, but Frisk is helped out by Cloud and Joker. I feel like both are valid candidates, but because Frisk can have a mechanic that makes them represent one of Undertale's biggest features, while Sans cannot without breaking character, I lean towards them over him. I won't throw a fit if Sans gets in (he'd help a lot for a Skeleton T/Dapper Bones spirit battle if Arle got in) but I'd prefer Frisk.

Tbh I never understood Sans as the Undertale rep. He's a popular character, but he's not the game's mascot, nor is he the protagonist. I feel as if either role would justify him being the Undertale rep, but he's neither. As an example, Robin is the main protagonist of Awakening, and Chrom is the mascot. Both have their own justifications for being included. Meanwhile Tharja, while popular, is neither, and therefor doesn't have much going for her. In the same vein, Sans has nothing going for him. I'd honestly argue that Flowey would be a better rep than him.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Tbh I never understood Sans as the Undertale rep. He's a popular character, but he's not the game's mascot, nor is he the protagonist. I feel as if either role would justify him being the Undertale rep, but he's neither. As an example, Robin is the main protagonist of Awakening, and Chrom is the mascot. Both have their own justifications for being included. Meanwhile Tharja, while popular, is neither, and therefor doesn't have much going for her. In the same vein, Sans has nothing going for him. I'd honestly argue that Flowey would be a better rep than him.

I think Sans and Papyrus are sort-of mascots; they were used in the Switch port's announcement trailer, and the trailer theme is just Bonetrousle but with stuff added to it.

 

[FancySmash]

Can we all take a minute to realize that the only way Sans could work in the game is if he had almost unreal response times and always played on a 1% Stamina match?

 

[UtopianPoyzin]

For no reason at all, could somebody give me a moderate reason why Ezio Auditore is disconfirmed? I feel that he is, but I haven't been able to prove it yet.

 

[Opossum]

Tbh I never understood Sans as the Undertale rep. He's a popular character, but he's not the game's mascot, nor is he the protagonist. I feel as if either role would justify him being the Undertale rep, but he's neither. As an example, Robin is the main protagonist of Awakening, and Chrom is the mascot. Both have their own justifications for being included. Meanwhile Tharja, while popular, is neither, and therefor doesn't have much going for her. In the same vein, Sans has nothing going for him. I'd honestly argue that Flowey would be a better rep than him.

Nitpick, but Chrom's billed as Awakening's main protagonist. The last act is more about Robin, but the first two and half of the third are almost exclusively about Chrom's journey as a character. He's also the only character that's forced to be deployed in every chapter.

 

[Robdelia]

I think Sans would work more as an assist or something. Like he's just Resetti from Brawl in that he comes on stage and tells bad jokes while standing in place. If someone hits him, his eye goes blue and he shrugs before the screen goes black and the person who hit him immediately takes 999% percent and dies.

 

[GoodGrief741]

For no reason at all, could somebody give me a moderate reason why Ezio Auditore is disconfirmed? I feel that he is, but I haven't been able to prove it yet.

Hot take: not only isn't Ezio disconfirmed, but he is, and always was, the most likely Ubisoft rep.

 

[Leotsune]

Hot take: not only isn't Ezio disconfirmed, but he is, and always was, the most likely Ubisoft rep.

Many people would get angry if Ezio gets in before Rayman, I'd be totally OK with either of those characters tho.
Ezio is cool let him in.

 

[ZagarTulip]

If Blizzard Entertainment got a Smash character, I would be beyond happy

 

[ProfPeanut]

Sans (and Papyrus; I'm hoping for them to show up as duo, personally) represent Undertale better than Frisk because they're more emblematic of Undertale's weirdness. Whereas Frisk could show up in an Earthbound game without batting an eye, the skelebros are a definite example of the kind of monsters that populate Undertale, with their casually modern personalities.

If Blizzard Entertainment got a Smash character, I would be beyond happy

I'd have agreed with you maybe two or three years ago. These days, though, things seem to be taking a turn for the worse with them.

 

[thisjustin2001]

Tbh I never understood Sans as the Undertale rep. He's a popular character, but he's not the game's mascot, nor is he the protagonist. I feel as if either role would justify him being the Undertale rep, but he's neither. As an example, Robin is the main protagonist of Awakening, and Chrom is the mascot. Both have their own justifications for being included. Meanwhile Tharja, while popular, is neither, and therefor doesn't have much going for her. In the same vein, Sans has nothing going for him. I'd honestly argue that Flowey would be a better rep than him.

Sans is most definitely the mascot of Undertale. He's used for trailers, his battle is the most well known (some would even say imfamous) out of all the battles in Undertale. Heck, it's one of the most iconic boss battles this decade! His theme song is the most well known song in the Undertale OST, he's on the journey with the human through the underground almost all the way, unlike most of the characters.

I do agree that Flowey is the main character of Undertale, though. If you think about it, the entire overarching plot in the Neutral and Pacifist routes is all about telling Flowey's story. Even the genocide route shows you how even though you thought Flowey was a monster and terrible for what he's done, when you're out in the same situation as him, you do the exact same thing he did.

That begs the question though, would anyone actually want Flower over Sans? Smash doesn't always go with the main character. For example, Pikachu was chosen to represent Pokemon over Red, and Robin and Lucina were chosen before Chrom. Sans would definitely make the biggest splash out of any Undertale character. He's loved, he's iconic, most would recognize him over any Undertale character. Some even know Undertale for being the game Sans came from, so I'd hope Sakurai would pick Sans over anyone else.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I just want to say, even though I'm not supporting Sans I'm glad he's been given the most push for being in Smash over the human.

Have there been any other franchises in a similar spot to Undertale in which the supporting cast is so beloved that they're pushed to be in Smash before the actual main character? Only one I can think of is Zero from MMX, but not sure if that counts as we already have Mega Man.

Zero was meant to be the original main character, but since it was related to MegaMan, X was forced into the game for more familiarity.

--------------

As for Ubisoft picks, Rabbids are my personal favorite.

 

[Nquoid]

The main thing holding Sans back is how infrequently the first character picked from a series is not the protagonist/first playable character.

Yoshi, Wario and Donkey Kong exist in between where they debuted as side characters in Mario games but then went on to long running series.

Game & Watch, Duck Hunt, R.O.B. and Wii Fit Trainer all represent series without on screen playable characters or just the idea of a series.

In fact the only time the first playable character is more of a mascot than the protagonist was Pikachu. And I don't think Sans will star in a $300 million grossing movie voiced by Ryan Reynolds any time soon.

 

[Knight Dude]

Zero was meant to be the original main character, but since it was related to MegaMan, X was forced into the game for more familiarity.

--------------

As for Ubisoft picks, Rabbids are my personal favorite.

That's not quite it. At first Mega Man X and Zero were the same character.

I can't find the English version of this page, I think it even said he wasn't quite Mega Man X or Zero yet. It's pretty obvious Mega Man X was inspired by Cassern, same with Simga being like it's main villain.

The higher ups at Capcom didn't think the new Mega Man (likely was still gonna be named Mega Man X) looked enough like the OG. So they separated the design into what became both Mega Man X and Zero. It's just that Inafune finished the Zero design, while the Mega Man X design was finished by Hayato Kaji, who would later design Bass for MM7 (And he worked on the Classic series already).

Kaji and Inafune would work together on designing Mega Man X's Light Armor though. So Inafune still had a huge influence on MMX.

Either way, they both got their own series in the long run, so it just means Capcom got two protags to work with down the line.

 

[Idon]

Japan really loves their "son of bad guy is actually good guy" characters...

 

[Staarih]

His theme song is the most well known song in the Undertale OST.

Yeah, this video of Megalovania just hit 100mil views on YouTube which is a crazy number, like, everyone probably knows it.
(though the video will apparently be taken down soon by the uploader)

But then again, a popular song doesn't necessarily equate to getting in Smash haha. However, if Undertale does get a rep, I personally do think it'll be Sans still, even if he isn't the main character. An exception of the "rule", just because of his sheer popularity and recognition. Though honestly, any Undertale content in Smash would make me satisfied.

 

[osby]

Japan really loves their "son of bad guy is actually good guy" characters...

Something something insert Star Wars joke in here.

 

[ProfPeanut]

The main thing holding Sans back is how infrequently the first character picked from a series is not the protagonist/first playable character.

Yoshi, Wario and Donkey Kong exist in between where they debuted as side characters in Mario games but then went on to long running series.

Game & Watch, Duck Hunt, R.O.B. and Wii Fit Trainer all represent series without on screen playable characters or just the idea of a series.

In fact the only time the first playable character is more of a mascot than the protagonist was Pikachu. And I don't think Sans will star in a $300 million grossing movie voiced by Ryan Reynolds any time soon.

Really tempting fate there with that movie thing, huh?

The very reason you see protagonists chosen is because most of the time, they're the ones who're emblematic of the game they're from. But other times, you see cases where Rathalos gets in before the Monster Hunter does, or Pikachu and company before the Pokemon Trainer. Smash isn't a stranger to this kind of thing at all.

 

[Knight Dude]

Japan really loves their "son of bad guy is actually good guy" characters...

Alucard, Nero, Lotor, Lars, Jin at first, Trunks, Zero, even Spider-Man 2099.

It checks out fam.

EDIT: Kinda Piccolo, N and Android 16 too.

 

[Zinith]

Something something insert Star Wars joke in here.

I was about to say that

 

[Nquoid]

Really tempting fate there with that movie thing, huh?

The very reason you see protagonists chosen is because most of the time, they're the ones who're emblematic of the game they're from. But other times, you see cases where Rathalos gets in before the Monster Hunter does, or Pikachu and company before the Pokemon Trainer. Smash isn't a stranger to this kind of thing at all.

But even when looking at assist trophies, Rathalos is an exception. Every other assist is from a represented series or the protagonist of that series. Or the host/mascot/face. And if Monster Hunter gets a playable character, it would be the Monster Hunter (probably in Rathalos armour).

I love Undertale, and would love some representation. But I imagine it would be more in the form of an assist trophy rather than playable; just because the obvious choices are secondary characters and there isn't precedent for secondary characters being the first reps from a series.

 

[random rendum]

Can't wait until E3 deconfirms some crappy leaks.

I’ve seen that too. YouTuber WhoIsThisGit made tons of videos going over all of TTYD’s flaws to show how 64 was the better Paper Mario and that TTYD is overrated. Honestly, there seems to be a 3 way tie for the first 3 entries as many prefer the original now, TTYD is usually still held up as the general consensus best game, and Super is this weird title that many find underrated and like due to the very different feel of the title, not to mention the story and characters.

It depends on what is valued. If it's the RPG gameplay, many will choose TTYD, if it's story, then many will choose Super... But everyone mostly wants the RPG gameplay and a good story.

 

[Flyboy]

Hot take: not only isn't Ezio disconfirmed, but he is, and always was, the most likely Ubisoft rep.

Thank you. I've felt this way too.

World-wide popularity, check. Iconic design, check. Unique moveset and stage potential, check. Music, check. Crossover appeal, check. Sales, check.

If we're getting any Ubisoft rep, it has to be Ezio especially since the Rabbids are spirits. And to be honest, he's a better choice than Rayman if we're going for a general gaming crossover that aims to get new demographics interested in Smash as seems to be the MO of the DLC.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Also, I just now realized that a 10% slower run speed than Ryu would result in a bottom 10 run speed

I would laugh if he runs slower than PP.

The main thing holding Sans back is how infrequently the first character picked from a series is not the protagonist/first playable character.

Yoshi, Wario and Donkey Kong exist in between where they debuted as side characters in Mario games but then went on to long running series.

Game & Watch, Duck Hunt, R.O.B. and Wii Fit Trainer all represent series without on screen playable characters or just the idea of a series.

In fact the only time the first playable character is more of a mascot than the protagonist was Pikachu. And I don't think Sans will star in a $300 million grossing movie voiced by Ryan Reynolds any time soon.

Yeah, this video of Megalovania just hit 100mil views on YouTube which is a crazy number, like, everyone probably knows it.
(though the video will apparently be taken down soon by the uploader)

But then again, a popular song doesn't necessarily equate to getting in Smash haha. However, if Undertale does get a rep, I personally do think it'll be Sans still, even if he isn't the main character. An exception of the "rule", just because of his sheer popularity and recognition. Though honestly, any Undertale content in Smash would make me satisfied.

On the plus side, he does show up in Deltarune iirc, albeit in a minor role.

Thank you. I've felt this way too.

World-wide popularity, check. Iconic design, check. Unique moveset and stage potential, check. Music, check. Crossover appeal, check. Sales, check.

If we're getting any Ubisoft rep, it has to be Ezio especially since the Rabbids are spirits. And to be honest, he's a better choice than Rayman if we're going for a general gaming crossover that aims to get new demographics interested in Smash as seems to be the MO of the DLC.

Well, Xander DID announce his name at one point, during anti-leak measures that were taken for voice recording...

The only thing getting in his way is whether Nintendo takes the big step in regards to letting playable Western third parties.

 

[Robdelia]

The only thing getting in his way is whether Nintendo takes the big step in regards to letting playable Western third parties.

Hot take but the only reason we doubt Western third parties being playable is because we just don't have one yet. The same way that people doubted the same third-party publisher getting two reps, or third party echoes. I'm sure it's not as much of an issue as we make it out to be.
Just as an aside I find it funny that the "Western third party" issue isn't brought up whenever Steve's chances in Smash are discussed.

 

[Knight Dude]

Thank you. I've felt this way too.

World-wide popularity, check. Iconic design, check. Unique moveset and stage potential, check. Music, check. Crossover appeal, check. Sales, check.

If we're getting any Ubisoft rep, it has to be Ezio especially since the Rabbids are spirits. And to be honest, he's a better choice than Rayman if we're going for a general gaming crossover that aims to get new demographics interested in Smash as seems to be the MO of the DLC.

I've seen a couple of other people bring up Ezio from time to time. I think my only worry with him is whether or not Ubisoft would want to focus on a character that's no longer being used. It likely isn't a huge issue since Ezio's the most popular assassin. Even Simon and Richter were still in pretty recent CV titles that multiplayer one and Judgement.

Hot take but the only reason we doubt Western third parties being playable is because we just don't have one yet. The same way that people doubted the same third-party publisher getting two reps, or third party echoes. I'm sure it's not as much of an issue as we make it out to be.
Just as an aside I find it funny that the "Western third party" issue isn't brought up whenever Steve's chances in Smash are discussed.

Probably because Minecraft has a huge following in Japan or whatever. And that's what has people doubt western franchises in the first place, how much Japan even cares about them.

You bring up a decent point though.

 

[thisjustin2001]

Hot take but the only reason we doubt Western third parties being playable is because we just don't have one yet. The same way that people doubted the same third-party publisher getting two reps, or third party echoes. I'm sure it's not as much of an issue as we make it out to be.
Just as an aside I find it funny that the "Western third party" issue isn't brought up whenever Steve's chances in Smash are discussed.

Probably because if any character were to be the first Western character, it should be the face of the biggest game in the entire world.

But even when looking at assist trophies, Rathalos is an exception. Every other assist is from a represented series or the protagonist of that series. Or the host/mascot/face. And if Monster Hunter gets a playable character, it would be the Monster Hunter (probably in Rathalos armour).

I love Undertale, and would love some representation. But I imagine it would be more in the form of an assist trophy rather than playable; just because the obvious choices are secondary characters and there isn't precedent for secondary characters being the first reps from a series.

Yet another fan rule that still stands to some people, I guess.