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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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N3ON

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I at least know Mewtwo has spent most of its Smash life being competitively mediocre, but not hated outside of that.
He was indeed competitively mediocre, but I think it went broader than that, because even from a more casual standpoint, his Melee incarnation just didn't click with people. Most people, at least. So the dislike managed to permeate past just the competitive circle into the more general online fanbase.

That's what I remember, at least.
 

SvartWolf

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I didn't liked Byleth reveal, but i'm not hating it either. Let's be honest here, we should have seen it coming. For me, the Joker reveal for MK 11 was the greatest thing that happened today, looks a quite fun character to play.
to be fair ... Byleth's reveal was... could been better...

For example, say that instead of announcing the sakurai's direct, they announced that there would be fire emblem news, and they dropped teh expansion trailer... AND then they did the smash byleth reveal, followed by the sakurai video a couple of days later.

At least there would have been some kind of surprise within the trailer.
 

Hadokeyblade

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Mewtwo was one of the more popular requests for Melee, then they put him in and everyone hated him, and some people even sent letters pushing for his removal (at least as Smash lore goes, the validity of that last part remains dubious - but they definitely didn't like him), and then he was gone in Brawl and immediately everyone missed him, and a game later he's the most popular request.

Nowadays people don't even remember there was a time he was one of, if not the, most unpopular character.
The way your wording this makes me think that the next smash game is gonna be a disaster once characters like Cloud, Hero and Cordon are removed.
 

Professor Pumpkaboo

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to be fair ... Byleth's reveal was... could been better...

For example, say that instead of announcing the sakurai's direct, they announced that there would be fire emblem news, and they dropped teh expansion trailer... AND then they did the smash byleth reveal, followed by the sakurai video a couple of days later.

At least there would have been some kind of surprise within the trailer.
there would still be the same amount of hate pff
 

N3ON

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to be fair ... Byleth's reveal was... could been better...

For example, say that instead of announcing the sakurai's direct, they announced that there would be fire emblem news, and they dropped teh expansion trailer... AND then they did the smash byleth reveal, followed by the sakurai video a couple of days later.

At least there would have been some kind of surprise within the trailer.
At least they didn't do it at TGA. Look at the Nintendo World Store. And those are Nintendo fans.

For as many people who claimed "people will hype over any character, anywhere", there may be truth to the deliberate decision to have a more limited reveal, at least when compared to an event like that. Were they planning a normal Direct or something, they easily could've tacked this on to it, sure.
 

♕Pretty Roger♕

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to be fair ... Byleth's reveal was... could been better...

For example, say that instead of announcing the sakurai's direct, they announced that there would be fire emblem news, and they dropped teh expansion trailer... AND then they did the smash byleth reveal, followed by the sakurai video a couple of days later.

At least there would have been some kind of surprise within the trailer.
That would have the worst possible marketing idea, they should try to sell Byleth to those who are not in love with Three Houses, not to the ones that already liked the game and franchise, also announcing it as "Sakurai Present, Smash News" brings way more people to, atleast, see the character before critizing it.
 
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PlumberBoy

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A sincere congrats to all the Fire Emblem and Byleth fans!

Y'know, some would say that Byleth's reveal was poorly written, poorly timed, underwhelming, unnecessary, and an overall a lackluster way to end the first pass.

Y'know what I say to those ppl?

Yes, I agree.
 

h2ogre

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I agree with 2B, but based on the fact that out of the entire roster there is only 1 western character it is unlikely that we will see doomguy. He will most likely be replaced by Bill Rizer a Japanese character. Also I am pretty certain that the whole spirit and assist trophy deconfirmation thing is true. So, no Isaac
 

Eldrake

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to be fair ... Byleth's reveal was... could been better...

For example, say that instead of announcing the sakurai's direct, they announced that there would be fire emblem news, and they dropped teh expansion trailer... AND then they did the smash byleth reveal, followed by the sakurai video a couple of days later.

At least there would have been some kind of surprise within the trailer.
The trailer definitely feels like it was made to be a bait-and-switch trailer in mind, given how it pretty much reveals who the fighter is in the first seconds. Makes me wonder if it was meant to be scheduled to be played at TGA before Nintendo pulled out.
 

Megadoomer

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how is it that sakurai has only given us 1 western character
Language barriers, Sakurai having ties/contacts to Japanese developers that he might not have with Western developers, and the fact that we didn't have many third party characters in Smash until very recently. (the number of third party characters doubled between this game and the previous ones - :ultsnake::ultsonic::ultmegaman::ultpacman::ultryu::ultcloud::ultbayonetta: before Smash Ultimate, :ultsimon::ultrichter::ultken::ultjoker::ulthero::ultbanjokazooie::ult_terry: during it)
 
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♕Pretty Roger♕

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At least they didn't do it at TGA. Look at the Nintendo World Store. And those are Nintendo fans.

For as many people who claimed "people will hype over any character, anywhere", there may be truth to the deliberate decision to have a more limited reveal, at least when compared to an event like that. Were they planning a normal Direct or something, they easily could've tacked this on to it, sure.
I think they should have, but probably Nintendo didn't expect FETH to win fan favorite game of the year.
 

NurpNurp

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good to see everyone is still arguing. Just like Terry discourse, evidently

So now that we all know the characters of our first pass. How would you rate it and the characters?
:ultjoker: - 10/10 absolutely blew my mind, and came out of nowhere. The only Smash reveal that I had honest, genuine emotional reaction to. The months up to his reveal and release were agony, but it was so worth it to see Joker represented so well, and he plays so great that it would feel criminal of me to not give him a 10/10

:ulthero: - 6 or 7/10 I have very little connection to DQ as a series so I really had no interest in Hero at first, and his gameplay was kinda... meh when I got my hands on him. That being said, his gimmick of mana and Command List was really cool and he was jam-packed with references that reminded me of all the JRPG tropes and I did really love that, even if I'm not his biggest fan

:ultbanjokazooie: - 5/10 I don't hate Banjo-Kazooie, but I have even less of a connection to them then I do Hero, and I was very underwhelmed by their gameplay, unfortunately, but they did have one of the best trailers, and it was heartwarming seeing people's genuine reactions to him being in the game, so that definitely gets points from me

:ult_terry: - 9/10 oh **** yeah, Terry is awesome! he's one of the most satifying characters to play with so many mechanics from his home game, much like Hero, showing such genuine love and creativity that he easily outclasses the Shotos for traditional fighting game representation. On top of that, his trailer was an amazing celebration of SNK history, and how deserved his entrance was.

:ultByleth: - 7 or 8/10 weak trailer, and I knew they were coming, but I'm still totally thrilled at their inclusion in the game, it's so great to finally see the whole weapon triangle adapted after all these years. I can't speak to their gameplay completely, of course, but from what I've seen their going to be sort of like a cross between Robin and Belmont which is great because I really liked those characters at their initial launches, so yay!
 

N3ON

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The way your wording this makes me think that the next smash game is gonna be a disaster once characters like Cloud, Hero and Cordon are removed.
Well, it's Smash - it's not going to be a disaster. But it is going to be rough when the bandaid does get ripped off that perhaps a good chunk of the cast will not be returning. I mean, Sakurai is even trying to get people to acclimate to the idea now, presumably years before whatever the follow-up is.

That said, it's likely that enough characters get cut that they can't all remain popular requests after the fact. It'll probably just be the big-names and those that were around the longest. And maybe they can rectify some of that with DLC.

But if I were Sakurai I would just bounce after this title, I mean it really is the ultimate mic drop.
 
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h2ogre

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Challenger pack 2 ( based on how sakurai's mind seems to work)

Dante
Akira
2B
Bill Rizer
Travis
Lloyd
 

SvartWolf

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The trailer definitely feels like it was made to be a bait-and-switch trailer in mind, given how it pretty much reveals who the fighter is in the first seconds. Makes me wonder if it was meant to be scheduled to be played at TGA before Nintendo pulled out.
they could even tried to misled teh public making them think that it was a trailer for FE3H DLC... saying as "now we are presenting some interesting video regarding FE3H with some details about DLC" or something. (I never said it was FE3H's DLC.)

But then again, it would have had a very similar structure to the joker's reveal trailer.
 

True Blue Warrior

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Well, it's Smash - it's not going to be a disaster. But it is going to be rough when the bandaid does get ripped off that perhaps a good chunk of the cast will not be returning. I mean, Sakurai is even trying to get people to acclimate to the idea now, presumably years before whatever the follow-up is.

That said, it's likely that enough characters get cut that they can't all remain popular requests after the fact. It'll probably just be the big-names and those that were around the longest. And maybe they can rectify some of that with DLC.

But if I were Sakurai I would just bounce after this title, I mean it really is the ultimate mic drop.
Let's be real though, 90% of the big fan requests for future games will inevitably be cut veterans. Newcomers that didn't make it into the base roster of the next game won't stand a chance.
 

h2ogre

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how did banjo manage to be the only western rep to get in to smash? Popularity? I thought sakurai only listened to the japanese
 

Megadoomer

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Challenger pack 2 ( based on how sakurai's mind seems to work)

Dante
Akira
2B
Bill Rizer
Travis
Lloyd
By Akira, do you mean the player character from Astral Chain, or somebody else?

I'd be fine with that line-up either way. Not sure what they'd have to work with for Bill Rizer when it comes to melee combat, but Travis (assuming you mean Travis Touchdown), 2B, and Dante would be amazing picks in my eyes, and Akira (assuming it's the Astral Chain Akira) should be fun. (I've only just started Astral Chain)
 

N3ON

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Let's be real though, 90% of the big fan requests for future games will inevitably be cut veterans. Newcomers that didn't make it into the base roster of the next game won't stand a chance.
That's true, especially since remaining "fan-favourites" make up an incredibly small pool. And like I said, they can rectify some of that with DLC. But, you know, that won't spare the initial backlash, nor will they be able to bring everyone back.

I think if they frame it the right way, much like they did with the echoes, they can probably mitigate too much blowback. Giving people a heads up would be a start, and the seeds of that are already being planted now.
 

True Blue Warrior

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That's true, especially since remaining "fan-favourites" make up an incredibly small pool. And like I said, they can rectify some of that with DLC. But, you know, that won't spare the initial backlash, nor will they be able to bring everyone back.

I think if they frame it the right way, much like they did with the echoes, they can probably mitigate too much blowback. Giving people a heads up would be a start, and the seeds of that are already being planted now.
I suppose the biggest thing they can do is introduce gameplay changes on par with Smash 64 to Melee and innovative modes. Or something like that, because they will never be able to top a roster like this ever again.
 
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MFW Smash Ultimate ends and Smash 6 reveals its fighter roster.

 
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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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I suppose the biggest thing they can do is introduce gameplay changes on par with Smash 64 to Melee and innovative modes. Or something like that.
Or at least bring back other modes. We don't have issues getting spirits(the very long credits gets a bit tedious without a turbo controller, though) as is, so anything like Trophy Rush/Grab is pointless. Boss Mode would be great, same with any expansions on WoL.

I'd still love some way to redo Target Test/Smash/Blast, since those were fun things. Too many characters so it'd get repetitive, unless they were unique. Easy to see why it's dropped. On the other hand, it could still earn you coins and Spirit Points? That'd make it worth it, since it's faster than Classic and all.
 

♕Pretty Roger♕

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:ultjoker: - 7.5/10 I love the Persona series, however i am attached to characters that are not the protagonist most of the time and even then, i think 5 is the game i am the least attached to compared to Persona 3 and 4, happy about the music selection and Mii costumes.

:ulthero: - 7/10 I like the alt skins and music, not really into Dragon Quest but the MP mechanic with random spells is unique and fun.

:ultbanjokazooie: - 4/10 I am sorry, i have no attachment to Banjo and Kazooie and animal characters are not my cup of tea, i liked what they symbolized to gaming industry and Nintendo, but that is it, easily my least liked moveset out of the fighters pass, nothing really remarkable in it.

:ult_terry: - 5/10 I am not into masculine characters with muscles, so the moment i saw him (specially after seeing all the potential characters SNK had) i was not really into it, i am Mexican, but i had never heard of Terry before the Nintendo leak. Even if he had a different gimmick, the traditional fighting game style felt old because of the Street Fighter characters to me.

:ultByleth: - 10/10 Probably my favorite Smash trailer to this date, FETH was one of my top 2 games of 2019 and i like female Byleth's design a lot, even if i was rooting for Edelgard, i felt this was the correct choice with the path Sakurai decided to take with the characters and it's multiple weapons, it would be sad not to have Sothis in any capacity as well, TH and Heroes demonstrated that FE is now a major franchise for Nintendo and it will be difficult to top Three Houses anytime soon.
 
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Animegamingnerd

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For the next Smash, I expect some sort of shake up especially if we get a new director like I can see a lot of characters especially the ones since 64 and Melee having complete move overhauls.
 

N3ON

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I suppose the biggest thing they can do is introduce gameplay changes on par with Smash 64 to Melee and innovative modes. Or something like that.
I think that would satiate the competitive crowd (should the changes be well-received), but tbh they seem a bit less character focused anyway than the rabid hungry heap that constitutes the rest of the fanbase.

I think being upfront while simultaneously distracting people with something shiny (aka whatever popular new additions they can get their hands on) would be the best bet. Maybe reveal all the vets who do return in base right off the bat like with Ultimate so you don't have to drag out expectations.
 
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Megadoomer

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MFW Smash Ultimate ends and Smash 6 reveals its fighter roster.

...Your face is a hand?

If there are massive cuts in the next game, I'd probably stick with Ultimate. Losing five or six characters in past games cost me two of my mains (Mewtwo and Snake). I can't imagine how bad the situation would be if we lost a third or half of the roster, let alone if the roster was chopped down to Melee size like some people inexplicably seem to want.
 
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TheFVguy

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Gotta say this was pretty disappointing.
It's the same situation with Incinaroar, why announce a character that's possibly the least exciting one while there are others that will clearly get people even more excited?
Wouldn't have been interesting if they replaced Banjo's announcement with Terry, then later announce Byleth, giving everyone the impression that this DLC pack only includes Japanese/anime-like characters, and then blow their ****ing minds with the Banjo reveal!
I think it's a more marketing problem than anything. Sure, there are characters that deserve a spot way more than another bloody FE rep (There are more FE reps than Zelda, let that sink in), but at the end of the day, it's Sakurai game, so what else can you do.
Even though, his decision was a stupid one in my book.
 

SvartWolf

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I suppose the biggest thing they can do is introduce gameplay changes on par with Smash 64 to Melee and innovative modes. Or something like that, because they will never be able to top a roster like this ever again.
Honestly i really don't know how the gonna do it if is not Smash Ultimate Deluxe, or arcade edition, or something. (not that i wouldn't want that an updated version that introduce better singleplayer and stuff that is not fighters or stages is still pretty exciting)

But if not... i can only see them going for a more party casual game with a biggest push for great singleplayer content... basically brawl 2.0, whith a smaller cast, while Ultimate becomes Melee 2.0
 

h2ogre

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By Akira, do you mean the player character from Astral Chain, or somebody else?

I'd be fine with that line-up either way. Not sure what they'd have to work with for Bill Rizer when it comes to melee combat, but Travis (assuming you mean Travis Touchdown), 2B, and Dante would be amazing picks in my eyes, and Akira (assuming it's the Astral Chain Akira) should be fun. (I've only just started Astral Chain)
yes astral chain
 

True Blue Warrior

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I think that would satiate the competitive crowd (should the changes be well-received), but tbh they seem a bit less character focused anyway than the rabid hungry heap that constitutes the rest of the fanbase.

I think being upfront while simultaneously distracting people with something shiny (aka whatever popular new additions they can get their hands on) would be the best bet. Maybe reveal all the vets who do return in base right off the bat like with Ultimate so you don't have to drag out expectations.
So a bunch of third-party characters in the vein of Lara Croft or Master Chief?
 

♕Pretty Roger♕

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I don't think that would've spared the reveal from a negative reaction. The Smash fanbase is so much more than those who voted for a FE game.

Oh, i totally know that, but i feel at least some haters would have thought "well it won an award so it can't be THAT bad", still the overall response would have been pretty toxic.
 

Megadoomer

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yes astral chain
Okay; I just wanted to make sure since Akira seems to be a pretty common name. We already have Akira from Virtua Fighter in Smash as an assist trophy, for example.
 

h2ogre

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Perhaps the reason that we are getting characters as late as DEC 2021 is because of two things.

1. Sakurai needs a break
2. He needs to make a smash friendly outfit for 2b
 
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...Your face is a hand?

If there are massive cuts in the next game, I'd probably stick with Ultimate. Losing five or six characters in past games cost me two of my mains (Mewtwo and Snake). I can't imagine how bad the situation would be if we lost a third or half of the roster, let alone if the roster was chopped down to Melee size like some people inexplicably seem to want.
Your face can be anything, but it can be a hand.




Also yeah. Hero and Banjo-Kazooie are my favorite characters in the game and they're not coming back. I don't know if I'd want a Smash game where they're not there.
 
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