Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Deleted member]

Obviously Minecraft is more established than Fort.

They're both similarly viewed in the Smash community with a sense of, "ew wtf?"

Perrhaps the same could be said of all niche franchises the Smash community doesn't want.

 

[Garteam]

So let's take a look at some of the more notable candidates who are still alive before we get yet another surprise deconfirmation, in no particular order:

• Sora
• Sol Badguy
• Reimu
• Sakura
• Phoenix Wright
• Nintendo character (Three Houses/Astral Chain rep)
• Other

Out of anyone in this list, how would you guys rate them from most likely to least likely for the FP #5 spot?

Phoenix Wright - Probably the frontrunner of the list right now. Popular, has a lot of moveset potential, and is the most noteworthy candidate still in the running from a company that has been very generous when it comes to Smash. Ol' Nick is looking pretty good right now. The only thing I'm a little iffy on is the likelihood of getting another Capcom character when the company has already taken a number of causalities for Fighter #5. Was Phoenix really chosen over Leon, Jill, and Dante, or did Capcom never get that coveted invite all together?

Nintendo character - What once seemed extremely unlikely has now become a realistic option. It seemed that another third party was inevitable, but as more and more keep getting cut down, a Nintendo character grows simply from their absence. Byleth seems to be the most likely choice for a number of reasons, but there's plenty of potential options: Akira, Bandana Dee, another Three Houses character, and even Waluigi could possibly join at this point. Obviously, having the previous 4 fighters all be third party is still a pretty major roadblock, but it's far less of an uphill battle than many might have thought.

Sol Badguy - Well, he's third party and currently not deconfirmed, so he has that going for him. Other than that, however, I'm just not seeing it. Guilty Gear doesn't really have the pedigree of something like King of Fighters does. Plus, it might be weird to have two characters who utilize the "fighting game" playstyle right in a row. He's really cool, and being named after Freddie Mercury certainly helps, but I don't think Sol is guilty of being Fighter #5.

Sora and Sakura - I'm putting these two together because I have similar things to say about both of them. Both hail from prolific franchises with long histories and an iconography that would be perfect in Smash. However, they're also from companies which have already received fighters in the pass. There's nothing saying these companies couldn't double dip and get two characters in one pass, but it'd be kinda weird. You can kinda get around this by saying "Well Joker's not really a Sega character, he's an Atlus character" or "Sora's not really a Square character, he's Disney", but at the end of the day they're still owned by Sega and Square Enix respectively. Could happen, not gonna put money on.

Reimu - In my opinion, it's mainly clear that Sakurai just doesn't want Indies in a playable role. Shovel Knight, Shantae, and Undertale: all three franchises had massive requests for playable representation and all three times Sakurai thought they'd be better in a supporting role. Touhou has a little more legacy than those series, but they have international appeal that Touhou doesn't, so it more or less balances itself out. History just doesn't seem to paint a pretty picture for Reimu.

 

[Deleted member]

Everybody good boys and girls until Cat Pommy enters the scene.

Spoiler

And then she runs away when Bulzeeb walks into the room.

 

[Naoyatodo]

Should be noted that Vergeben's "leaks" in base roster none of them originated from himself, he just piggy backed less noisy leakers.
Everyone is here - Emily Rogers said it first.
Simon Belmont - _stealth on twitter said it first.
List goes on.
Also really enjoying all the minecraft content...

Vergeben never said "everyone is here." He said there would be no cuts from Smash 4 way back in April 2018.

 

[Kokiden]

Alright for fun let’s look at 2018 awards and nominations.

View attachment 249368
View attachment 249369

Lol looks like Jonsey could be a candidate if we go by game awards appearances.

John Marston or Arthur Morgan for Smash!

 

[Deleted member]

Was Phoenix really chosen over Leon, Jill, and Dante, or did Capcom never get that coveted invite all together?

If the former was the case, could be the work of the dedication this franchise has.

 

[Idon]

Obviously Minecraft is more established than Fort.

They're both similarly viewed in the Smash community with a sense of, "ew wtf?"

If you want a real answer then it's that very few people actually want those games in Smash.
Any combination of:
"I don't like this game"
"I don't like this game's community"
"I don't like this game's aesthetic"
"I don't like this game's characters"
"I don't like this game's mechanics that will be translated over unto smash"

Realistically, those games are very very possible (At least if you don't think Banjo deconfirms any other Microsoft rep) and stand a bigger shot than many of the characters here.

It's just... nobody really wants to talk about that.

 

[TheCJBrine]

If you want a real answer then it's that very few people actually want those games in Smash.
Any combination of:
"I don't like this game"
"I don't like this game's community"
"I don't like this game's aesthetic"
"I don't like this game's characters"
"I don't like this game's mechanics that will be translated over unto smash"

Realistically, those games are very very possible (At least if you don't think Banjo deconfirms any other Microsoft rep) and stand a bigger shot than many of the characters here.

It's just... nobody really wants to talk about that.

I don’t know about Fortnite, but there’s actually much more support for Steve/people whom at least like the idea of him than there are those who don’t based on what I’ve seen.

 

[GKMLTTSB]

Minecraft would definitely work well, the player base averages around age 24 and a lot of people would love to see Steve in Smash, based on twitter and over 150k video likes + over 1 million views for an animated Steve moveset on Youtube. There’s also tons of fan art for Steve and Alex, with some people using them in builds or building statues of them.

The thing about Minecraft is that while it's riduculously huge, a large part of its playerbase, especially when it was at the height of its growth, only played Minecraft. It was the nature of the game and the type of content it provided that sucked people in.
While I do believe you will get some of those players to transition (especially those who may have moved on, but have nostalgia for the game), I do not believe the proportion of Minecraft players you'd entice would be anywhere near the proportion you'd get from other properties.

If people are attracted to a series for its world-building and characters, they will typically follow where it leads and throw down money.
For Minecraft, I legitimately don't see that being the case and feel the general response from fans would be, "Steve's in Smash? OK...Back to Minecraft."

Now, would Steve in Smash get views on Youtube? Hell yes. Because any video with Minecraft in the title will likely get an asinine amount of views on Youtube. >_>

That said, I don't think Minecraft is necessarily unlikely. I just don't see it as being as big a "get" as it's made out to be. Aside from strengthening MS and Nintendo's relationship, at least.

The fact that you even have to DO that to begin with should tell you why people are "sleeping on Reimu" and why no one finds her likely to be announced at Mr. Keighley's Death Stranding Awards.

You... don't... You have to do that to use the fan-supplied patch that handles things differently than the official one. AFAIK, the official one is applied once you update to 1.10, at which point you toggle the language setting.

 

[cj.]

And then she runs away when Bulzeeb walks into the room.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

You start on the Battle Bus and then drop into a random point of the Fortnite map.

I actually love the idea, put it in the others section so we can have megalovania as the background music

 

[Deleted member]

[QUOTE = "Bolderousness, post: 23697149, member: 420510"] Y luego se escapa cuando Bulzeeb entra en la habitación.

[/CITAR]
Pretty Bomber, Mujoe and Mechadoc!

View attachment 249380View attachment 249381

Even if it's not in English, I underatand and agree with this post completely

 

[perfectchaos83]

People do realize that the line up for DLC was very likely decided a while before they even decided on revealing Joker at the VGAs last year right? Joker was already a proverbial last minute decision to reveal there. What makes anyone think that it has to be "VGA worthy"? If they plan a reveal there, they'll reveal whoever is left regardless of the venue.

 

[Nemuresu]

Ran into this: http://boards.4channel.org/v/thread/487337719

Some info for you.
>Next smash character is Morrigan Aensland.
>Looks virtually the same, only difference I could pick up is that her top covers her a bit more, think of the top part of palutena's dress.
>Will be revealed at game awards.
>Darkstalkers collection will be released on all platforms.
>The trailer has a small teaser at the end, lasts like 3 seconds.

Can't believe it, but the idea of having a Capcom character with not much discussion would be rather astonishing.

 

[Idon]

You... don't... You have to do that to use the fan-supplied patch that handles things differently than the official one. AFAIK, the official one is applied once you update to 1.10, at which point you toggle the language setting.

Well that's fine and good, but again you'd already have to own that to know about it.
As far as I know, any official release of the game still has it be Japanese only on the storefront.

Which goes back to my point again my point is, A PATCH FOR A FIGHTING GAME OF A JAPANESE ONLY INDIE SHMUP SERIES SHOULD INDICATE THAT THE SERIES DOESN'T HAVE THE WIDESPREAD WESTERN APPEAL TO BE ANNOUNCED AT THE ****ING VGAS.

 

[TheCJBrine]

The thing about Minecraft is that while it's riduculously huge, a large part of its playerbase, especially when it was at the height of its growth, only played Minecraft. It was the nature of the game and the type of content it provided that sucked people in.
While I do believe you will get some of those players to transition (especially those who may have moved on, but have nostalgia for the game), I do not believe the proportion of Minecraft players you'd entice would be anywhere near the proportion you'd get from other properties.

If people are attracted to a series for its world-building and characters, they will typically follow where it leads and throw down money.
For Minecraft, I legitimately don't see that being the case and feel the general response from fans would be, "Steve's in Smash? OK...Back to Minecraft."

Now, would Steve in Smash get views on Youtube. Hell yes. Because any video with Minecraft in the title will likely get an asinine amount of views on Youtube. >_>

It’s still a game they love, and Nintendo could still attract a good amount of people; I mean, it’s fricking huge, thinking they would attract less than they’d like is silly. I mean, by your logic, Fortnite wouldn’t be very good either, because it doesn’t really have worldbuilding for characters outside of maybe a few in Save the World, and people play it for shooting other dudes in a battle royale game.

And the video I was referring to didn’t have Minecraft in the title, just Steve’s name; just searching up Minecraft stuff alone would require a lot of digging and digging for it to the point where you wouldn’t find it:

 

[Thewafflemaker2000]

Steve is a big icon of this era’s gaming for kids and adults being in the ranks of mario sonic and pacman in thier hayday. Hes easily identified by his square shape. People who don’t even play video games even know what game hes from or familiar with it. I think he’s eventually gonna get into smash without a doubt either this one or a future installment

 

[Deleted member]

Ran into this: http://boards.4channel.org/v/thread/487337719

Can't believe it, but the idea of having a Capcom character with not much discussion would be rather astonishing.

I decided to humor it but then I saw this

****in
L U L

 

[cj.]

Even if it's not in English, I underatand and agree with this post completely

And of course let's not forget Professor Bagura!

 

[Night Gale]

View attachment 249355

Ngl that gave me a jump scare when I scrolled down.

I know this is probably just wishful thinking through rose tinted glasses, but I really think that people are sleeping on the possibility for Monokuma (or any Danganronpa rep)

My reasoning is explained here.

I'm not sleeping on it and your reasoning is sound.

I've heard nothing but good **** about Danganronpa. Borderline Persona-level of hype, at least that's how I see it; I could be wrong.

That's a good reasoning there.,

I am rather fond of its bats*** anime craziness and sometimes I want a little gameplay mixed in with my visual novels. lol It is very enjoyable.

I also recommend 428: Shibuya Scramble to those who've never played it.

 

[Deleted member]

Well that's fine and good, but again you'd already have to own that to know about it.
As far as I know, any official release of the game still has it be Japanese only on the storefront.

Which goes back to my point again my point is, A PATCH FOR A FIGHTING GAME OF A JAPANESE ONLY INDIE SHMUP SERIES SHOULD INDICATE THAT THE SERIES DOESN'T HAVE THE WIDESPREAD WESTERN APPEAL TO BE ANNOUNCED AT THE ****ING VGAS.

I think you’ve went a bit too far

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Ran into this: http://boards.4channel.org/v/thread/487337719

Can't believe it, but the idea of having a Capcom character with not much discussion would be rather astonishing.

>Darkstalkers collection will be released on all platforms.

Assuming this 4chan text leak is even true, I want to be excited for this... but this could just end up being another Darkstalkers Resurrection case, where Capcom tries rereleasing the old games, they don't sell well, and then Capcom uses that as an excuse to not make a new game.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

It’s still a game they love, and Nintendo could still attract a good amount of people; I mean, it’s fricking huge, thinking they would attract less than they’d like is silly. I mean, by your logic, Fortnite wouldn’t be very good either, because it doesn’t really have worldbuilding for characters outside of maybe a few in Save the World, and people play it for shooting other dudes in a battle royale game.

And the video I was referring to didn’t have Minecraft in the title, just Steve’s name; just searching up Minecraft stuff alone would require a lot of digging and digging for it to the point where you wouldn’t find it:

That looks really bad. Maybe it could be improved while keeping the aesthetic, but if I were Sakurai, I would be embarrassed to put that in my game.

 

[GoodGrief741]

People do realize that the line up for DLC was very likely decided a while before they even decided on revealing Joker at the VGAs last year right? Joker was already a proverbial last minute decision to reveal there. What makes anyone think that it has to be "VGA worthy"? If they plan a reveal there, they'll reveal whoever is left regardless of the venue.

You have it backwards. The logic is that given the character they already chose, they would pick a specific venue that fits the character.

For example, if a year ago they'd picked Reimu, I doubt they would choose now to announce her at TGA, they'd be more likely to show her off at another time.

Ran into this: http://boards.4channel.org/v/thread/487337719

Can't believe it, but the idea of having a Capcom character with not much discussion would be rather astonishing.

Yeah right.

 

[Deleted member]

And of course let's not forget Professor Bagura!
View attachment 249382

Wouldn't mind some Bomberman Hero while we're at it.

 

[BernkastelWitch]

People do realize that the line up for DLC was very likely decided a while before they even decided on revealing Joker at the VGAs last year right? Joker was already a proverbial last minute decision to reveal there. What makes anyone think that it has to be "VGA worthy"? If they plan a reveal there, they'll reveal whoever is left regardless of the venue.

The only way #5 is "VGA Worthy" is if Nintendo both planned the development order and either somehow knew which games would be GOTY worthy or planned so far ahead for #5 that they had to do it just for an extra reaction.

It sounds a bit silly. I'm just saying if we get a TGA announcement, it'll probably still be a lesser known/niche character simply because I doubt Sakurai would have sixth senses for one game show and wouldn't care who it is as long as he shows the announcement.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Assuming this 4chan text leak is even true, I want to be excited for this... but this could just end up being another Darkstalkers Resurrection case, where Capcom tries rereleasing the old games, they don't sell well, and then Capcom uses that as an excuse to not make a new game.

Yeah. Darkstalkers is old enough that if you wanted to re-release it, you'll need to repaint it Wonder Boy: Dragon's Trap style in order to entice people.

 

[Droodle]

So let's take a look at some of the more notable candidates who are still alive before we get yet another surprise deconfirmation, in no particular order:

• Sora
• Sol Badguy
• Reimu
• Sakura
• Phoenix Wright
• Nintendo character (Three Houses/Astral Chain rep)
• Other

Out of anyone in this list, how would you guys rate them from most likely to least likely for the FP #5 spot?

1. Other: Sakurai likes surprises, and there are tons of big characters that are flying right under our noses. I think Dovahkiin actually has a good shot, and may even come with the Cacodemon costume. Other is the safest bet.

2. Phoenix Wright: Popular, and has significant Nintendo history. As a character he fits right in with the general cast as well. Has a good bit of fan demand too, and makes a good bit of sense as a game awards reveal.

3. Sora: Really popular and tons of fan demand, along with some decent Nintendo history. Fits well with the cast too, and has tons of moveset potential. The most "hype" pick for a game awards reveal besides potentially other. However, he has a iffy chance of getting in due to Disney; but could still happen.

4. Sol Badguy: Pretty well known in the FGC, and has a new game coming out next year. That said, I don't know if Game Awards will be a good place to show him off. More likely post-pass.

5. Nintendo character: A ton of popular characters are still missing, but have been present in other forms. I don't think Akira Howard and FE:TH are happening in this pass, due to them coming after Rex. Doesn't make a ton of sense for a Game Awards level reveal, due to them not being seen as exciting.

6. Reimu/Sakura: They're not going to reveal a Japan centric character at the game awards, when 99% of the GA audience won't know them at all.

 

[TheCJBrine]

That looks really bad. Maybe it could be improved while keeping the aesthetic, but if I were Sakurai, I would be embarrassed to put that in my game.

That’s one fanmade moveset, Sakurai could keep the blocky aesthetic and use Mojang’s official trailer animations (which use emotions, as do some other official things, and Bedrock Edition has them blinking and lets you change their face + they’re planning emotes), make him closer to the official promotional art style for Minecraft with lighting and all, and he’d fit right in. Seriously though, everyone who argues against him because “muh animations lol he ugly” needs to understand what an opinion is and if they’re gonna pretend it’s objective, they’re frickin ignorant for not considering the other official animations at least.

Personally, though, I thought it looked fine anyway. If you don’t like it that much, just ignore the post -_-

 

[N3ON]

People do realize that the line up for DLC was very likely decided a while before they even decided on revealing Joker at the VGAs last year right? Joker was already a proverbial last minute decision to reveal there. What makes anyone think that it has to be "VGA worthy"? If they plan a reveal there, they'll reveal whoever is left regardless of the venue.

It's a little simplistic to say "if they plan the reveal, they'll do the reveal". Obviously.

You have to take a step backwards and consider that planning the reveal could be informed by the character. If they feel reception at this particular event will be lacklustre, they may instead choose to reveal the character in a different way.

That said, I agree that many people are too conservative about who they consider "VGA worthy", with the only potential reveals that may indeed prove questionable to be few and far between, mostly made up of characters who are themselves unlikely to be added in general.

 

[Thewafflemaker2000]

The one thing I'll give Fortnite is that I believe you actually could attract some of its playerbase just using a guest character, while I don't believe it would work nearly as well for Minecraft.

If kids can do that stupid dance as a taunt, you'll get their money.



Joke or not, he's no Chrom.
While I specifically don't want Derplander, as I dislike the prospect of protagonist stand-ins, he could potentially be unique as all Hell.

Even just going from the classes and jobs he's displayed in the trailer, you've got Archer, Warrior, Dragoon, Monk, Samurai, and Dark Knight. If you go with the logic that he can be all classes, that opens the door more.

But I'd still prefer to stick with a more discreet, named, canon individual.

I give up xD

Vergeben’s source knows who the fifth DLC character is but his source can’t say it or it’ll blow his cover.

They have to essentially play a game of guess who at this point to at least have a broad idea of who it might be.

Ok ill buy the cover thing but he was still wrong sometimes

 

[perfectchaos83]

You have it backwards. The logic is that given the character they already chose, they would pick a specific venue that fits the character.

For example, if a year ago they'd picked Reimu, I doubt they would choose now to announce her at TGA, they'd be more likely to show her off at another time.

Sure, but that just goes back to this bull**** about "VGA Worthy". A VGA reveal is not a foregone conclusion, assuming it is is pretty ****ing stupid, if I say so myself. I'll also say that trying to predict Nintendo or Sakurai is a fool's errand. Especially when one of their VGA reveals was Cranky Kong in Tropical Freeze. Again, If they have a planned VGA reveal, it'll be what they have left. I personally doubt it for a plethora of reasons.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

That’s one fanmade moveset, Sakurai could keep the blocky aesthetic and use Mojang’s official trailer animations (which use emotions, as do some other official things, and Bedrock Edition has them blinking and lets you change their face + they’re planning emotes), make him closer to the official promotional art style for Minecraft with lighting and all, and he’d fit right in.

Personally, though, I thought it looked fine anyway. If you don’t like it that much, just ignore the post -_-

I mean the animations. The jumping looks god awful.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Yeah. Darkstalkers is old enough that if you wanted to re-release it, you'll need to repaint it Wonder Boy: Dragon's Trap style in order to entice people.

Eh... not really. As far as old fighting games go, Darkstalkers has actually aged really well. I wouldn't mind a rerelease with a new coat of paint, but the original character designs and sprite animations still hold up.

What Darkstalkers really needs is its own equivalent to Street Fighter IV. A brand new game that's polished, well-made, and overall amazing enough to breathe new life back into its own dormant franchise.

... of course, a guest character in Smash also wouldn't hurt.

 

[cj.]

Wouldn't mind some Bomberman Hero while we're at it.

Miss Honey too and a bit unlikely but Atomic Bomberman would be cool too!
Bomberman has a great repertoire of interesting characters

 

[Wrathful_Scythe]

It's a little simplistic to say "if they plan the reveal, they'll do the reveal". Obviously.

You have to take a step backwards and consider that planning the reveal could be informed by the character. If they feel reception at this particular event will be lacklustre, they may instead choose to reveal the character in a different way.

That said, I agree that many people are too conservative about who they consider "VGA worthy", with the only potential reveals that may indeed prove questionable to be few and far between, mostly made up of characters who are themselves unlikely to be added in general.

One of the problems might also be Jokers reveal setting a prescedent. His reveal was a bomb and people are now expecting a similar mind blowing act. I wouldn't be so sure about that. Especially as we might even see no smash content at all only to have Nintendo announce the next Nintendo direct on twitter in a few days or something.

 

[cosmicB]

Think again buddy
View attachment 249353
and judging by your wording sakurai would have chosen steve over banjo & kazooie.

I'm not sure how that puts Shantae over Reimu. Both would be pretty fun to play as, so I imagine the one that has a stronger connection to Sakurai (based on circumstantial evidence) would win out. I said absolutely nothing about recognizability. Also there's no precedent over whether spirits deconfirm characters or not, so the jury's still out there.

And what indication is there Sakurai would rather have Steve over Banjo? Has he talked about Minecraft before, and if so, in a way that suggested he cared about it more than Banjo.

 

[ErenJager]

Here's my speculation, it's pretty feeble.
However, I think we're getting a Bandai Namco rep.
I think during Sakurai's little Smash demonstration there, he poked some fun at Pac-Man.
Referring to him as "their character" since they only have one.
I'm baseless in my suspicion but I think this might have been some sort of precursor or nod/ hint to another Bamco character joining the roster.

 

[Icedragonadam]

I hate to drag up a previous discussion, but about Grant Kirkhope's response previously to Banjo which has been used to advocate for Sora. Kirkhope's exact words were "Don't Hold your breath". Looking back, that statement is pretty vague enough to not break NDA since it's more of saying "maybe, but I doubt it." instead of saying "Nope he's not in." So yeah I definitely think Travis, Master Chief, and Sora are out as FP5 with that in mind since if they were in, they wouldn't have said no directly.

 

[Thewafflemaker2000]

Steve could either be in the Minecraft story mode art direction with more movement, emotions and bendable arms and legs or the stiff classic minecraft style. I think Sakurai would go with the classic style with humor