New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Madame puff]

Yeah well the rest is speculation you can argue with logic. Tier discussion... well, while discussing where a character could be tier-wise isn't all that crazy based on their size or weaknesses, we don't know how long-range attacks will work for characters like Saki. Usually long-range characters tend to be good, minus Pit.



Ya got me. Also, Link. And Mario is always near the middle, albeit in Brawl he is a bit low (and Luigi is always worse than Mario or about as good as Mario).

Seriously, and Jiggz went from one extreme to the other... >.>

It just occured to me. In 64 jigglypuff is mid, in melee she is top, and in brawl she is bottom... Jigglypuff has been everywhere! O:

 

[Aurane]

Probably a good Pokemon character to be on SSB4-3DS is most certainly Victini.

 

[Roy-Kun]

I though Issac was more iconic that's why mentioned him over Matthew.

Even if this is the case, Matthew is the new hero. Adding Matthew as the Golden Sun representative for being the new Main Hero instead of Isaac shouldn't be much of a problem. I mean both look almost identical, and stat-wise in the games, they are the same.

People still prefer Isaac alright, but I prefer Matthew.

Spoiler

I like his clothes okay, those look awesome I would like to see him in HD.

 

[Metal Overlord]

I think I just thunk.

If Zoroark got in, would it be an antagonist for Smash? It is a Dark-type.

 

[Madame puff]

I think I just thunk.

If Zoroark got in, would it be an antagonist for Smash? It is a Dark-type.

In the movie zoroark was a good guy so prob not. :3

 

[Oasis_S]

I think I just thunk.

If Zoroark got in, would it be an antagonist for Smash? It is a Dark-type.

I could see it as such, actually.

In the story mode, it might ILLUSION itself as some good character and trick the heroes? A bit ridiculous, but this is Smash, lol.

 

[Aurane]

I think I just thunk.

If Zoroark got in, would it be an antagonist for Smash? It is a Dark-type.

Not exactly. Zoroark was actually a protagonist in her movie. Just because it's a dark-type doesn't mean it's a bad pkmn. >.>

 

[OmegaXXII]

Victini did have a movie out recently and is coming out in December so...

 

[Aurane]

Victini did have a movie out recently and is coming out in December so...

Not just that. He's the offical mascot of generation 5. He's the Victory pokemon, and never lost a battle. Plus he's got his own type-combanation (Zen-Mode Darmanitan doesn't count). It would be awesome!

 

[Madame puff]

I would like gardevoir instead or lilligant :D?
We need more fememine brawlers. I:

 

[Metal Overlord]

Just because it's a dark-type doesn't mean it's a bad pkmn. >.>

I knoweth that my dear, I just never saw the movie so I was merely speculating.

Genesect. That is all.

 

[Opelucid]

Zoroark wouldn't be an antagonist... being a dark type doesn't mean a Pokemon is evil in the movie she just wanted to protect her child but got framed by the villain. In the end Ash and Co reunite them and they return home... Mewtwo would make a good antagonist though

 

[OmegaXXII]

Even if this is the case, Matthew is the new hero. Adding Matthew as the Golden Sun representative for being the new Main Hero instead of Isaac shouldn't be much of a problem. I mean both look almost identical, and stat-wise in the games, they are the same.

People still prefer Isaac alright, but I prefer Matthew.

Spoiler

I like his clothes okay, those look awesome I would like to see him in HD.

Well if there isn't much of a difference besides looks then why are people complaining so much? It's kind off dumb actually, also Isaac is iconic alright but Matthew is more relevant which does help his chances, at this point I'm neutral on both.

 

[Aurane]

I knoweth that my dear, I just never saw the movie so I was merely speculating.

Genesect. That is all.

Genesect should get in too :D

 

[Opelucid]

Genesect should get in too :D

Genesect won't get in... I'm almost sure of it he probably won't get revealed until like after Smash comes out since Meloetta and Keldeo will get revealed before it

 

[OmegaXXII]

Not just that. He's the offical mascot of generation 5. He's the Victory pokemon, and never lost a battle. Plus he's got his own type-combanation (Zen-Mode Darmanitan doesn't count). It would be awesome!

Which counts for something, I wouldn't be surprised if he got in over Zoroark, he does have alot going for him, even though the Japanese prefer Zoroark a bit more.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Zoroark wouldn't be an antagonist... being a dark type doesn't mean a Pokemon is evil in the movie.

As I said before, I know that, there are no inherently evil Pokemon in Smash (not even Mewtwo), I was just speculating 'cuz I never saw the movie.

@Oasis- A false hero in Smash would be awesome, actually.

 

[Aurane]

Which counts for something, I wouldn't be surprised if he got in over Zoroark, he does have alot going for him, even though the Japanese prefer Zoroark a bit more.

Zoroark was the first pkmn of the 5th generation to be revealed. That's a big boost. Lucario was the same.

 

[Opelucid]

As I said before, I know that, there are no inherently evil Pokemon in Smash (not even Mewtwo), I was just speculating 'cuz I never saw the movie.

Actually that mirage Mewtwo in that one special was evil

 

[OmegaXXII]

Genesect would be cool as well, I just don't see him happening just yet, maybe if he gets more exposure like a movie for example.

 

[Aurane]

Genesect would be cool as well, I just don't see him happening just yet, maybe if he gets more exposure like a movie for example.

I think Genesect is going to have a connection with Mellolata. I SO see it!

 

[Opelucid]

N should be a playable character he'd be pretty cool...

 

[Aurane]

N should be a playable character he'd be pretty cool...

I'm sorry, but you totally lost me there. Why?

 

[y.toonlink]

While I don't know the names but based on the new trailer there were different Bows, Hand Claws, Turrets, Swords, Etc.

So we may see Pit use them in a slightly altered moveset, while the remaining Sacred Treasures are used for Palutena and Medusa movesets.

But at the moment it all yet again depends on how Uprising turns out.

Well Pit already seems fine, but a Turret or another Arrow SideB wouldn't be too bad unless Palutena uses it. Then again the both of them might turn out to have a completely original moveset like Zelda.

Whats goin on?

 

[OmegaXXII]

Actually that mirage Mewtwo in that one special was evil

He was? That's news to me!! :O

 

[Metal Overlord]

Actually that mirage Mewtwo in that one special was evil

There you go.

@asage- Genesect and Meleotta connection? That sounds very plausible.

 

[Opelucid]

I'm sorry, but you totally lost me there. Why?

Uhm because he's popular and actually relevant right now unlike Genesect besides he has a Zoroark in game.

 

[Aurane]

Uhm because he's popular and actually relevant right now unlike Genesect besides he has a Zoroark in game.

Oh I c. Like Pkmn trainer? -_-' Sorry, but Pkmn Trainer failed big time in Brawl. If N failed, that would break my heart.

 

[Madame puff]

Hmmmm i like the idea of having meleotta in!
I kinda wanna c Gothitelle though o:

 

[Opelucid]

He was? That's news to me!! :O

It wasn't an actual Mewtwo but yeah it was

 

[Arcadenik]

Well if there isn't much of a difference besides looks then why are people complaining so much? It's kind off dumb actually, also Isaac is iconic alright but Matthew is more relevant which does help his chances, at this point I'm neutral on both.

Exactly. That's why I am neutral on Matthew/Isaac and Isa/Saki. To me, they are pretty much identical in terms of abilities but different in clothes and names. So I don't care which one gets in... I just want a Golden Sun character (if I wanted a specific character, I would go with Eoleo but that isn't happening) and a Sin & Punishment character.

 

[Deleted member]

If we get a new Sonic stage, it should be either City Escape or Casino Night Zone.

I kind of want six Pokemon reps that way we can have this

Pikachu
PT
Jiggz
Mewtwo
Lucario
Zoroark/Victini

This would keep the vast majority of Pokemons fans happy (except 2nd and 3rd gen fans). I for one would be very pleased.

Like a second rep for Sonic, there's not even a glimmer of hope this will happen.

I wouldn't say that a 2nd Sonic rep is out of the realm of possibility if Sonic return. Sega and Nintendo has a fantastic relationship with each other and are one of the few third-party developers that consistently support Nintendo. Because of such strong relationship and the potential for a 2nd Sonic rep to be popular if Sonic returns, I could see one happening. Unlikely? Definitely. Impossible? Not really.

Personally I'd take either Medusa or Palutena just as long as we don't get Magnus. Although between the 2 of them you can probably tell who I perfer.

Me as well. Magnus is a very bad choice for SSB4; with it being not as important as Medusa or Palutena.

Mewtwo and Lucario are both awesomesauce. Can we all agree that?

I concur with this statement. Both earned their places when made playable. Hopefully one of them returns for SSB4.

Unlike Little Mac for obivious reasons and Ray who chances have gone down since TGS the other day.

Why Little Mac? He may not be popular in Japan, but that's really the only thing keeping him from getting in. Everything else I've seen going for his chances are for it. IMO, Little Mac is still the most likely new series newcomer.

For me, the chances go like this:

Little Mac > Isaac > Saki Amamiya > Starfy > Ray

It has?! How?!

Unfortunately, Ray never had a good chance to be playable. He from a series that is mostly irrelevant, not exactly mentioned much, and with us getting more spots, Ray is likely the first somewhat likely AT on the chopping blocks.

I would love Ray in Smash, but things are starting to look grim for him. The sad part that is if he remains an AT, since I don't anticipate a series revival, it will likely stay that way. Even in a 49 slots situation, it still doesn't look good.

At this rate, there are only four Assist Trophies that we can say have a good shot of getting in. Those are Little Mac, Isaac, Saki, and Starfy.

So can we all agree now that Miis should be playable so we can get each party?

As long as I get to have matches between W. Bush, Obama, Clinton, and Reagan.

Oh and I want to be able to play as Goku as well. If it can be done in Mii form, so be it.

You know, the Wii U is capable of video calling, so how about video chat in Smash 4?

Would be interesting. There is no excuse not to have at least voice chat.

It ain't dead yet, in fact it's just getting started. When it goes to evening, it becomes busy as a mofo in here, and SSBF and JavaCroc both usually make some pretty nice-sized posts when they arrive, so it might take a while for any posts to show up.

Yeah, the evening is usually the best time of the day to post.

K. Rool could be the Bowser or the Dedede of Smash. Now, who would be Meta Knight of Smash 4...

Perhaps Saki Amamiya or Mega Man?

I would like Isaac but I think Matthew is more likely due to him being the hero of the latest Golden Sun game. If Nintendo wants to sell more copies of Golden Sun: Dark Dawn, they would put Matthew in Smash.

What good would adding Isaac do? He wouldn't advertise Golden Sun: Dark Dawn... people who play SSB4 but not Dark Dawn would buy the game, expecting to play as Isaac only to get disappointed that Isaac isn't playable but Matthew is.

Put Matthew in SSB4, and people who played SSB4 but not Dark Dawn would buy the game, expecting to play as Matthew and their expectations are satisfied when they can play as Matthew in the game.

This is the same thing with Saki and Isa as well. That's why I put Isa in my roster instead of the more-popular Saki.

I don't think being the latest protagonist of the series magically makes you the most likely.

The only thing Isa Jo and Matthew has over their fathers is relevancy. In Matthew's case, that is kind of neutralized since Isaac is still relevant, is the most important character in the Golden Sun series, and is among the Top 5 most wanted potential newcomers. Saki may not be too relevant, but he is more important to the series and is much more wanted whereas Isa Jo get barely any requests.

There was a reason why Red got in over Lucas/Dawn as the Pokemon Trainer. That reason was because Red was the most important trainer to the series and one most people are familiar with.

So... who do y'all think are the most likely villains/antagonists to make it into Smash 4?

Ridley. One of the most wanted characters for SSB4, the 2nd more important Metroid characters (appearing in the majority of installments), continues to be relevant to the series to this date, and even had Sakurai confronted for no playable Ridley in Brawl.

King K. Rool is also very likely to show up. Other realistic candidates are Medusa, Bowser Jr., the return of Mewtwo, Black Shadow, and maybe Ghirahim. Also, Samurai Goroh is not a villain, he's Captain Falcon's rival. Two different things.

Probably a good Pokemon character to be on SSB4-3DS is most certainly Victini.

I agree, Victini is the best choice for a 5th gen rep.

If Zoroark got in, would it be an antagonist for Smash? It is a Dark-type.

No it wouldn't.

 

[Johnknight1]

How about instead of focusing on where characters will be on tiers, I focus on fixing their balancing issues=???

I'll start first with the Original Twelve from Super Smash Bros 64!

Mario is always around the middle, often higher than the middle. I think he could use more strength and knock back with all of his smash attacks, and each should have some ability to get a kill. I think his fireballs need to stun opponents more, and come out quicker. I also think the FLUDD needs to do (a little) damage and actually do a ton of knock back. Mario also needs to jump higher with all of his jumps, specifically his up B. Mario's up tilt, down tilt, up air, back air, and neutral air needs to be able to combo more. His forward tilt needs to do a bit more damage and quite a bit more knock back (although it shouldn't be able to kill) Mario's down air needs to have more knock back, his forward air needs to spike harder. I think these changes would keep Mario as a constant threat at every aspect, making him the perfect well-rounded character.

Luigi is usually under Mario, and below or around the middle. He needs a better running attack (that or it needs to do more damage), he needs to jump higher, needs faster fireballs, and really needs more speed. He could also use a few more combo-able attacks. His down B also needs to rack up damage like Mario's in SSB64, yet it needs to suck in foe somewhat like a tornado (within like 5 feet in any direction or so), especially if they aren't on the ground. It also should be able to make Luigi rise up if you held B (just like if you rapidly pressed B when using Mario and Luigi's down B in SSB64), thus working as a recovery move as well. I also think he should jump higher with his first two jumps, and that he should have the ability to slowly rise and remain in air like he did in Super Mario Bros 2 (go look it up). All these changes would allow Luigi to remain somewhat well-balanced all around, although lacking strength, but having a tad more speed and a better ability to recover than his brother Mario, as well as a ton of zaniness added.

Donkey Kong was slightly below average in 64 and Melee until he got fixed up nicely by Sakurai in Brawl. However, Donkey Kong could use more powerful tilts. Donkey Kong's down tilt should cover more range, and his forward tilt needs to have more knock back. Donkey Kong has several spikes, but all of them need to spike harder than in Brawl. Donkey Kong's neutral B (super punch) should charger faster, do more damage and kill somewhat earlier, thus turning it truly into a super move that, when you have fully charged. The other major change Donkey Kong needs is recovery. His first two jumps need to jump higher, and his up B needs to rise as well as go sideways, and it could also do more damage. Donkey Kong's forward B also needs to stun more at higher damage, setting up moves like his forward smash and neutral B (super punch) to land a final, devasting blow. These changes would allow Donkey Kong users to strike fear into the hearts of their foes.

Samus went from bottom in 64 to slightly above average in Melee to low tier in Brawl. Samus is fundamentally flawed in Brawl. She isn't heavy, she's slow, and she isn't strong.
Samus needs to be able to jump very high, have multiple jumps that look like her second jump (her down B infinite wouldn't return though), needs to run very quickly, and needs to have floaty DI that can fast fall with proper DI'ing. Samus' smash attacks should all be kill moves (minus her up smash, which should rack up a ton of damage), and her neutral B needs to charge quicker, and kill at low percentages. Some of Samus' Melee strengths should return, such as her ability to combo, although I think unlike in Melee, her tilts need more priority, and should be able to combo a tad more. Her down B bombs needs to cover more range, do slightly more damage, come out quicker and explode quicker, and recover quicker. These changes would make Samus a serious threat in any future smash bros game, specifically in close-ranged combat.

Yoshi has generally been a bottom feeder in smash, although he went up a bit from each game to game. He needs better specials, probably more jumps, more combos, and to be much quicker. All of special attacks need to be more useful, and his up B needs to actually make him jump further. His down B should freeze nearby foes that aren't shielded or dodging, and Yoshi should be invincible during his forward B. However, after 2 hits in it, it breaks, and for the rest of Yoshi's stock after 1 hit it breaks. Yoshi's up B should fire eggs faster, and his neutral B should leave opponents as eggs at higher percentage longer, and allow Yoshi to time out when to land a devastating blow. Yoshi's forward air also needs to become a real full on spike, instead of just a semi-spike. The rest of Yoshi's aerials should come out quicker. These changes would allow Yoshi to be dominant on offense from anywhere on the stage, and change the joke into a smoking fast and deadly character.

Kirby went from towards the top in 64 to near the bottom in Melee to still somewhere on the bottom in Brawl. He needs to have more combos like in 64 (but not as deadly combos), more speed, and his up B and down B need to be more useful. I think his down B should push foes back foes about 10 feet whenever the down B lands from just about anywhere within 25 feet on either side (although not doing damage), and maybe stun the foe for a quick third of a second, preventing them from harming Kirby immediately. These changes would make Kirby more of a threat in any match, and would turn Kirby into a recovery GOD!!!!

Fox has always been higher on the tiers in each smash game. All he needs is his fAir to combo well (like up to 12%) on its' own, and his blaster to have less range and not come out as quickly (these would be done to counter camping). I think his tilts could use some more knock back or speed, specifically his forward tilt. Fox's down B would do much more knock back (it wouldn't kill anybody, but it would give Fox space), and would allow Fox to be the pursuer. With these changes, Fox would remain as powerful and useful as ever, with his A-class speed, combo skills, and overall offense allowing him to remain a "contender."

Pikachu in Brawl had a broken as heck quick attack (up B). If you eliminated the ability to attack out of the quick attack, however, Pikachu isn't that great. That needs to change, along with more useful tilts, and a better forward B. I think Pikachu could use some good short early combos too. I like the fast up B and how Pikachu has little lag frames after it, and I think that should stay (to allow Pikachu to remain a recovery God in exchange for weight and easy KO-ability), but attacking while doing it I think is a little too much. Pikachu's down air also needs to serve as a semi-spike and stun more (specifically at higher damage %), allowing Pikachu to pursue a foe down from the air or off the stage. If Pikachu made those changes Pikachu would be a very balanced recovery God lightning fast speed.

Captain Falcon in 64 and Melee was near the top, but in Brawl he was a joke. The physics hurt him some, and so did the lack of combos, but he just didn't have any strong moves. He needs to be much faster, have faster moves, have combo-able moves, and have his ability to kill early and often more. His recovery skills in Brawl sucked, and in general he has a terrible recovery in smash. To counter that, allow him to jump higher, and give him his down B infinite again like in Melee. His up B also needs to go higher, and probably be less predictable. In smash, Captain Falcon's greatest weakness was his recovery. So, while with these changes Captain Falcon would be good yet predictable at recovering, he would be a beast at every other aspect of game play, and would return to his truly dominate form.

Ness has been towards the bottom in each Smash game. His PK Thunder (up B) as a projectile needs to be faster, when it lands it needs to do more (yes more) when he launches himself into foes, as well as send Ness much farther. His regular jumps need to jump higher, his tilts need to be more useful, his PK Fire (forward B) needs to have more range. His PK Flash (neutral B) needs to come out faster and be a legitimate off the stage kill move that goes farther. On top of that, his down B needs to be able to push back foes when he uses it, as well as recover from projectiles. Ness' smash attacks need to be stronger, and his tilts need to be much more useful. Ness needs more combos with both aerials and tilts. If Ness made these adjustments, he would truly be a PSI GOD!

 

[Aurane]

Don't believe in whats happening now. The date it comes out , latest is 2013. We got time to see who will take the spotlight.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Wailord should be playable in Smash 4.

 

[Aurane]

Wailord should be playable in Smash 4.

Who knows nowadays? The intro of olimar, pkmn trainer, Rob, and even snake shakes things up alot.

 

[Opelucid]

Wailord should be playable in Smash 4.

We'd need Skitty in the game HSOW

 

[Madame puff]

Wailord should be playable in Smash 4.

If you could play 8 player in ssb4.... Oh my lord....

 

[Aurane]

If you could play 8 player in ssb4.... Oh my lord....

"Wail" Lord to be exact :D

 

[Madame puff]

"Wail" Lord to be exact :D

I wouldnt be able to see the stage.