New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Rosalina suporter]

I wish they would give peach her super mario sunshine costume all so who eles would like this costume?

 

[vVv Rapture]

Those rosters...are actually pretty reasonable. I saw Ridley and Mewtwo. I'm okay with it.

 

[Starphoenix]

The Wii U has "flash memory" that can be expanded via SD cards and flash drives. Know what that is marketing speak for? "The harddrive is tiny again but w/e".

This tells us that Nintendo's online plan is still complete crap (surprise surprise!) because how much DLC can you grab before the tiny HDD fills up? In a game that has entire 3D sprites at high resolution with a hundred+ voice files, how big do you think the download will be? Note that no other fighter (that I can recall) has had entire characters downloaded off the internet as there is always some base form that they leave on the disc so all they have to do is release a patch to "finish" the character. If Smash uses that strategy-which is the only chance of SSB4 having DLC-then it would be limited to DLC for characters that are already on the disc, meaning that there would be a finite number of characters added to the game.

Smash would easily make millions more for Nintendo if they had a decent DLC system like the PSN or XBLA. Unfortunately, Nintendo has no idea that we're in the year 2011, and they think that being "unique" is an excuse to not include aspects of console gaming that have become industry staples.

Technically a high capacity SD card can function just the same without some of the risks associated with standard hard drives. The question becomes, then, whether Nintendo will allow cards of those nature? Problem is most people look down upon the idea of using an SD card as a functional medium of storage. Even though we are at the point now where those tiny little chips can hold roughly the same amount of GBs as any low end hard drive. On the horizon we have SDXC (or whatever they are titled) that will hold even more data than SDHC's currently store at this time. Is Nintendo smart enough to fully explore this technology they continue supporting? I couldn't say. Even if they do it is up to developers to be on the ball and not pass it off as a cheap alternative to a hard drive when, for the most part, SDHC is actually the superior technology from a general consumer standpoint.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

I wish they would give peach her super mario sunshine costume all so who eles would like this costume?

Yeah I agree, Ithought it was pretty cool.

 

[vVv Rapture]

I assure you, Zoroark WILL be in SSB4 and Mewtwo will NOT be playable. There is no doubt in my mind.

What is this blasphemy.

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

What is this blasphemy.

My signature, it's just a gut feeling I have.

 

[Gallowglass]

Automated hazards would be a win.

Yeah like Bullet Bill Cannons, Zelda Wirlwinds, Invisible blocks, or Pirahana plants.

I want to make a Kaizo Mario Level.

 

[OmegaXXII]

I'd like it if they would add evil peach from paper mario!

The idea definetly is nice, an "evil" version of a smash character definitely needs to be considered, kind of like Evil Ryu for example, it adds hype and could add for an awesome storyline as well.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

I don't get it. If it has an SD it should be fine and dandy right?

For 3rd party developers, yes. But Nintendo isn't going to make a 1st party game that requires you to buy an SD card. Doing so would be admitting to consumers that even THEY can't effectively leverage their own substandard technology. Thats just not how business works.

My only hope is that Nintendo sees all the negative response that the Wii U has gotten (which is a very large amount for a new console) and alter the system to better fit what the industry wants. Otherwise the Wii U will be as bad of a console as its predecessor turned out to be. Hell, the Wii U is only slightly more powerful (debatable) than the PS3/360 that have been out for 5 years.

 

[vVv Rapture]

My only hope is that Nintendo sees all the negative response that the Wii U has gotten (which is a very large amount for a new console) and alter the system to better fit what the industry wants. Otherwise the Wii U will be as bad of a console as its predecessor turned out to be. Hell, the Wii U is only slightly more powerful (debatable) than the PS3/360 that have been out for 5 years.

Unfortunately, I don't see Nintendo making many changes considering they're already saying its close to the final product version.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Some possible 3rd party Assist Trophies...

Cactuar: It'll use 1000 Needles to stun opposing players. The opponents will be briefly stunned for up to 5 times, with each stun lasting only one second. The stun effect also inflicts 5% damage, so the damage total will be 25% when the effects completely wear off.

Spoiler

Ifrit: Ifrit will use his Hellfire move to damage opposing players.

Spoiler

E-123 Omega: Omega will fire various missiles and other kinds of artillery weapons at his targets. Damage can range from low to high, depending on his weapon choices.

Spoiler

Silver the Hedgehog: Silver will use his PSI abilities to hurl various objects at opponents. The objects can either be helpful or harmful to opposing players.

Spoiler

 

[L-a-t-e-r-a-l-u-s]

Unfortunately, I don't see Nintendo making many changes considering they're already saying its close to the final product version.

I think the WiiU looks pretty cool to me, I'm going to be sure to buy one.

 

[Starphoenix]

My only hope is that Nintendo sees all the negative response that the Wii U has gotten (which is a very large amount for a new console) and alter the system to better fit what the industry wants. Otherwise the Wii U will be as bad of a console as its predecessor turned out to be. Hell, the Wii U is only slightly more powerful (debatable) than the PS3/360 that have been out for 5 years.

The Wii U is still in active development, if anything the E3 conference and subsequent round tables proved how much of a work in process this console still is. In fact the only reason Nintendo showed what they have is from the pressure of it having been announced early similarly to the 3DS. It is amazing to contrast how last year they unveiled a console successfully, but this year unveiled a console unsuccessfully. With E3 2010 I walked away knowing what a 3DS was, this year I sat there for 10 minutes thinking this was a new controller before I realized (to my relief) it was the new system.

In a rather long winded way I think the confusion surrounding the system is solely Nintendo's horrible presentation. There is still time for these issues to be corrected.

Unfortunately, I don't see Nintendo making many changes considering they're already saying its close to the final product version.

You sure? I've been hearing other reports that much of the system is still in development, and Nintendo is in the process of getting feedback from developers and fans at E3.

 

[kackamee]

I don't understand how people can have negative comments on a console that hasn't even really shown anything except it's basic functionality.

 

[Starphoenix]

I don't understand how people can have negative comments on a console that hasn't even really shown anything except it's basic functionality.

To be honest, if it were anyone other than Nintendo there might be a little less criticism. Nintendo hasn't quite lived up to some of the expectations they have placed upon themselves. It's that whole "once burned you learn to fear the fire" routine. Nintendo has a lot to prove with this console if they are serious on tapping back into the PS3/360 community. Unfortunately the lack of communication and information is raising more skepticism when there was enough from the beginning.

 

[•Col•]

To be honest, if it were anyone other than Nintendo there might be a little less criticism. Nintendo hasn't quite lived up to some of the expectations they have placed upon themselves. It's that whole "once burned you learn to fear the fire" routine. Nintendo has a lot to prove with this console if they are serious on tapping back into the PS3/360 community. Unfortunately the lack of communication and information is raising more skepticism when there was enough from the beginning.

^Pretty much this.

Rumors of low memory storage, only 1 Wii U controller per console, high cost, and the return of friend codes doesn't sound too good to me.

EDIT: Turns out the friend codes was a statement about the 3DS that was misconstrued to be about the Wii U.

 

[reserk]

The Wii U is still in active development, if anything the E3 conference and subsequent round tables proved how much of a work in process this console still is. In fact the only reason Nintendo showed what they have is from the pressure of it having been announced early similarly to the 3DS. It is amazing to contrast how last year they unveiled a console successfully, but this year unveiled a console unsuccessfully. With E3 2010 I walked away knowing what a 3DS was, this year I sat there for 10 minutes thinking this was a new controller before I realized (to my relief) it was the new system.

In a rather long winded way I think the confusion surrounding the system is solely Nintendo's horrible presentation. There is still time for these issues to be corrected.



You sure? I've been hearing other reports that much of the system is still in development, and Nintendo is in the process of getting feedback from developers and fans at E3.

if thats the case, the system may be delayed, which im perfectly fine with if they improve their system to be at least on par with the PS3. honestly, i want nintendo to step it up and face their competition head on.

 

[Starphoenix]

if thats the case, the system may be delayed, which im perfectly fine with if they improve their system to be at least on par with the PS3. honestly, i want nintendo to step it up and face their competition head on.

For it to be delayed would assume a date has been set for release. All we have been given is a time frame. I don't expect it to be too far out beyond Summer.

 

[UberMario]

From what they've announced, the main thing that I want to see changed is the tablet limit. 1 per system is total b*******.

 

[Bassoonist]

^Pretty much this.

Rumors of low memory storage, only 1 Wii U controller per console, high cost, and the return of friend codes doesn't sound too good to me.

EDIT: Turns out the friend codes was a statement about the 3DS that was misconstrued to be about the Wii U.

I know the statement you are talking about. It was definitely talking about the 3DS in that specific part, but it was misconstrued by an article writer to the point that they titled it "Wii U to feature refined friend code system" or something like that.

It gave me a real scare.

I wish Nintendo would be upfront with this. It is getting very annoying. A couple of sources have said no friend codes, but I really need to hear it straight from Nintendo

 

[Impmacaque]

if thats the case, the system may be delayed, which im perfectly fine with if they improve their system to be at least on par with the PS3. honestly, i want nintendo to step it up and face their competition head on.

http://gematsu.com/2011/06/report-wii-u-50-more-powerful-than-ps3?

According to developer sources, the WiiU appears to be 50% more powerful than the PS3/360. Of course, we don't have official specs... but really, the 360/PS3 hardware is considered very dated when compared to affordable hardware on the market now. Nintendo could put together a budget console with 2011 hardware which would easily surpass the current gen processing power.

50% stronger is more than enough for me. I'm not a graphics *****, but HD games and 3rd party titles are essential if I'm gonna blow ~$400+ on this system. Since I don't expect the PS4 or Xbox 720 (lol) to release before 2014, the WiiU will probably feature the best graphics on a home console for at least 1.5-2 years.

Which means that devs will both get comfortable programming for the WiiU and have a great library built up by the time the PS4/New Xbox hit the market. Those consoles will undoubtedly be stronger than the WiiU, but I have my doubts as to how much more powerful graphics can get before we hit a glass ceiling.

 

[Starphoenix]

http://gematsu.com/2011/06/report-wii-u-50-more-powerful-than-ps3?

According to developer sources, the WiiU appears to be 50% more powerful than the PS3/360. Of course, we don't have official specs... but really, the 360/PS3 hardware is considered very dated when compared to affordable hardware on the market now. Nintendo could put together a budget console with 2011 hardware which would easily surpass the current gen processing power.

50% stronger is more than enough for me. I'm not a graphics *****, but HD games and 3rd party titles are essential if I'm gonna blow ~$400+ on this system. Since I don't expect the PS4 or Xbox 720 (lol) to release before 2014, the WiiU will probably feature the best graphics on a home console for at least 1.5-2 years.

Which means that devs will both get comfortable programming for the WiiU and have a great library built up by the time the PS4/New Xbox hit the market. Those consoles will undoubtedly be stronger than the WiiU, but I have my doubts as to how much more powerful graphics can get before we hit a glass ceiling.

I highly doubt it will only be 50% more powerful. Just from the chip Nintendo is using alone is significantly more powerful than the outdated hardware inside the other two systems. Based upon the custom Radeon chip provided by AMD.

Why is it everytime I get into these technical discussions people leave?

To make this relevant to Smash Bros. Given the horsepower of the system and the space on the discs, if Sakurai maintains his priorities we could see quite a bit of content. This is what I envision is going to happen. The 3DS version will have the comprehensive single player modes; large adventure mode similar to Subspace Emissary, events, all star, classic, break the targets and more modes. The game probably won't feature a robust online mode instead opting for some utilization of StreetPass connection. This will free the Wii U version to focus on all of the multiplayer content. Characters, stages, collectibles, WiFi, all of that. Not to say that the 3DS version won't have any content, but the focus will be tailored around a more personal experience.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

I highly doubt it will only be 50% more powerful. Just from the chip Nintendo is using alone is significantly more powerful than the outdated hardware inside the other two systems. Based upon the custom Radeon chip provided by AMD.

Why is it everytime I get into these technical discussions people leave?

By the time developers can properly leverage the new technology (if they even care to do more than match current gen consoles) the new Xbox console will be released and Nintendo's hardware will be a joke yet again. Nintendo is doing too little, too late, and doing it poorly at that.

They have TIME to come back. Will they? I don't think so. Japanese game development is spiralling downward as they continue to fail to transition to "next gen" gaming (exceptions like Platinum games and Capcom do exist though). Nintendo is the EPITOME of Japanese game development, and they may not have that much longer to figure out what they're doing wrong before they bring the Japanese gaming industry to rock bottom.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

By the time developers can properly leverage the new technology (if they even care to do more than match current gen consoles) the new Xbox console will be released and Nintendo's hardware will be a joke yet again. Nintendo is doing too little, too late, and doing it poorly at that.

They have TIME to come back. Will they? I don't think so. Japanese game development is spiralling downward as they continue to fail to transition to "next gen" gaming (exceptions like Platinum games and Capcom do exist though). Nintendo is the EPITOME of Japanese game development, and they may not have that much longer to figure out what they're doing wrong before they bring the Japanese gaming industry to rock bottom.

So that's why the market was experiencing major shrinkage in 2009/2010 in Japan?

It shrunk so much, it warranted people making references to that Seinfeld episode.

Also, they're still bad with third-party relations, though they seem to be getting a bit better about it.

 

[Dark Paladin X]

@Dark Paladin X: Just how many third-party characters are you expecting?

A hell freaking lot. I really want Nintendo to work more with the third party companies for Super Smash Bros. game. They have tendency to be bitter on having their own characters appearing in other third party video games (particularly if the game happens to be not in the Nintendo consoles).

To make things shorter, I'll be more likely to buy the next Super Smash Bros. game if one of the following third party characters were to appear as playable characters: Marona (Phantom Brave), Ash (Phantom Brave again), Etna, Flonne, Laharl (Disgaea), Deadpool, Dante (Devil May Cry), Zero (Megaman Zero), Wolverine (X-Men), Cloud (FFVII), Squall (FFVIII), Amaterasu (Ookami), Spiderman, Klonoa, Chris Redfield, Albert Wesker (Resident Evil), Asagi (most of Nippon Ichi games).

Now, will 20-30 additional third party characters be enough here?

 

[Shorts]

All I can say is stop whining about a system that:

A. Isn't out yet.
B. Isn't done yet.

You don't hear anyone talking about the PSPVelvita. Or how Microsoft pulled a Wii for part of their show. Some people just hold a grudge against Nintendo. For various reasons. Some justifyable, while others not so much. . .

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Lower your expectations.
I expect at least 6 of them, including Snake and Sonic.

 

[Dark Paladin X]

Lower your expectations.
I expect at least 6 of them, including Snake and Sonic.

Okay, as long as Marona from Phantom Brave or Deadpool is in it, then I'm okay.

Capcom character, I pretty don't care much, but I would love to have either Zero or Chris Redfield.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Deadpool is a 4th party character.

 

[Dark Paladin X]

Marona and Deadpool are 4th party characters.

What do you mean "fourth party"? And since Marvel had work with Capcom in the past, I think it's possible for Marvel to get some of their characters in the next Super Smash Bros game if Nintendo were to work with Capcom there. Besides, many of the Marvel video games did appear in the Nintendo consoles in the past.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

4th party = characters that did not debut in a video game and aren't owned by video game companies.

Stay away from 4th parties as they have a habit of making licensing messy.

 

[Shorts]

4th party = characters that did not debut in a video game and aren't owned by video game companies.

Stay away from 4th parties as they have a habit of making licensing messy.

That, and Sakurai says no characters not stemming from a video game is allowed to be in smash.

 

[Dark Paladin X]

That, and Sakurai says no characters not stemming from a video game is allowed to be in smash.

Marona comes from Phantom Brave, which IS from a video game. There is even a Wii remake for Phantom Brave.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

I already corrected my post.

Doesn't excuse Deadpool though.

That's to keep licensing clean. If it gets to messy, the game will end up not being released in many regions. Case in Point.

 

[Starphoenix]

By the time developers can properly leverage the new technology (if they even care to do more than match current gen consoles) the new Xbox console will be released and Nintendo's hardware will be a joke yet again. Nintendo is doing too little, too late, and doing it poorly at that.

They have TIME to come back. Will they? I don't think so. Japanese game development is spiraling downward as they continue to fail to transition to "next gen" gaming (exceptions like Platinum games and Capcom do exist though). Nintendo is the EPITOME of Japanese game development, and they may not have that much longer to figure out what they're doing wrong before they bring the Japanese gaming industry to rock bottom.

Sony and Microsoft seem to be content on extending the life of their current systems for another 3-4 years. Microsoft is investing so heavily into Kinect that I doubt they are going to suddenly drop it unless something financially catastrophic happens where it absolutely bombs. Working in retail, sometimes in an electronics department, I can tell you it is actually selling quite well. Much of the "Wii" crowd is becoming the "Kinect" crowd.

This leaves Sony. Sony is more liable to make a move before Microsoft. They remain in damage control mode ever since the hacking nightmare that befell the PSN. The Move is not taking off like the Kinect, even though technically it is superior to both motion systems. As far as I am aware Sony is still losing money on each PS3 sold and if not is barely making a profit. Despite all of this they seem to be extending the life of the PS3 with the Vita. The Vita really could breathe "life" into their gaming sector and keep them from imploding anymore than they already have.

Sure, rumours persist of new Playstation/Xbox consoles in development, but that doesn't mean we are at the point yet where they are going to play their hand. That will ultimately depend upon how much of a threat they view the Wii U as. If the Wii U has a good 2-3 year head start ahead of a successor from either company, that will give Nintendo enough time to secure exclusives and establish a better in-group reputation. So even if the new generation is released, it will only be another 2-4 years before the next Nintendo console is released and we go through this leapfrog game again.

I don't exactly share the view that Nintendo is a sinking ship, but I do think they have the potential to get there, but not just yet. Get back with me after TGS.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

All I can say is stop whining about a system that

Not whining, but discussing the future and potential implications of Nintendo's business strategy on the industry as a whole. Learn to read, dawg.

So that's why the market was experiencing major shrinkage in 2009/2010 in Japan?

It shrunk so much, it warranted people making references to that Seinfeld episode.

Also, they're still bad with third-party relations, though they seem to be getting a bit better about it.

Yep. Even Japanese devs are saying that Japanese gaming is dead now. Thats a popular thing to say there apparently. And its pretty much true if you objectively look at it. Take Nintendo for example. The Zelda series on the console is one of the most unevolved series ever created. Jumped to 3D with Ocarina of Time then every subsequent Zelda was the exact same formula over and over again. What about Mario? Has Mario truly seen evolution since Mario 64? Has the core structure ever been changed? He's still grabbing stars at the end of every level; even if the levels have gotten more orginal, the core game hasn't changed since N64.

If Nintendo took their name off of the product, changed the main character's model, and just released their games as new IPs, those games would fail miserably. There are NO successful platformers anymore because the genre evolved into 3rd person action adventure, but Mario is an exception somehow. Zelda-style action RPGs that provide an experience far more grossing and in-depth, like Mass Effect for example, have redefined the genre but Zelda games just ignore these evolutions and tries to make a game as good as OoT again (which will never happen because OoT was good because of the circumstances more than anything else).

The time that Nintendo is able to ride their nostalgia train and ignore the industry's evolution is going to end soon. They can't keep going on the way they have and expect to succeed, because Japanese gaming is crumbling all around them. Its only a matter of time until people realize that they don't need Nintendo's new console when they're enjoying Bioshock on their current console. Gaming is becoming MORE hardcore with time, not less.

And as much as it pains me to say it, Sakurai is probably their best game developer right now. He's honestly the only one who has shaken up the Nintendo formula since he created the concept behind Smash, and now he's doing stuff like bringing back Kid Icarus in a way that actually looks fun to play. Nintendo is literally AFRAID to make a Smash game without Sakurai attached to it and have said so several times in the past. Sakurai is probably going to end up being the next Miyamoto of Nintendo once the master retires, because he's really the only guy with a fresh idea in the whole damn company.

 

[Llumys]

I've put quite a bit of consideration into this, so it's just just some fanboy's ridiculous wishlist. Would anyone have any major critiques for this roster if it ended up being final?

King K. Rool*

 

[SamuraiPanda]

Sony and Microsoft seem to be content on extending the life of their current systems for another 3-4 years. Microsoft is investing so heavily into Kinect that I doubt they are going to suddenly drop it unless something financially catastrophic happens where it absolutely bombs. Working in retail, sometimes in an electronics department, I can tell you it is actually selling quite well. Much of the "Wii" crowd is becoming the "Kinect" crowd.

This leaves Sony. Sony is more liable to make a move before Microsoft. They remain in damage control mode ever since the hacking nightmare of the PSN. The Move is not taking off like the Kinect, even though technically it is better than both motion systems. As far as I am aware Sony is still losing money on each PS3 sold and if not is barely making a profit. Despite all of this they seem to be extending the life of the PS3 with the Vita. The Vita really could breathe "life" into their gaming sector and keep them from imploding anymore than they already have.

Sure rumours persist of a new Playstation/Xbox in development, but that doesn't mean we are at the point yet where they are going to play their hand. That will ultimately depend upon how much of a threat they view the Wii U as. If the Wii U has a good 2-3 year head start ahead of a successor from either company that will give Nintendo enough time to secure exclusives and establish a better reputation. So even if the new generation is released, it will only be another 2-3 before the next Nintendo console is released and we go through this leapfrog game again.

I don't exactly share the view that Nintendo is a sinking ship, but I do think they have the potential to get there, but not just yet. Get back with me after TGS.

Sony's going to stay with the PS3 for awhile. MS, no. Kinect just has to be compatible with the next Xbox, like the Wii peripherals are with the Wii U.

The PS3 is an incredibly solid gaming system that has been steadily improving over time, and their customer install base yields profits from both video games AND Blu-Rays which is a market that Sony owns. They're making a profit on each PS3 sold (have been since year 2 of the PS3 I believe) and have pushed their "10 year console" concept over and over again. The PSN debacle is over and people don't care that much anymore. Even if they do care, they certainly didn't tell Sony that with their wallets. Besides, Sony has said they aren't making a PS4, and with all the **** that went down with the profits they lost from the earthquake (something like $3billion IIRC) they definitely won't be spending the money on a brand new console this early.

For Nintendo, if they stay their current course, I can see them going the way of Sega (rather Sega + handhelds) in 2 more consoles if they don't shape up. And I don't necessarily think that would be a bad thing for them. I actually think it would allow them to focus on developing to produce some extremely high quality games in the future. Think about it; Microsoft and Sony make a couple in-house big hits (Halo, God of War, etc.) but nothing NEARLY to the level of Nintendo. Ninty is at the same time a prolific developer AND have their own console. I give them a lot of crap for their business plans, but to be honest its impressive that they're able to do as much as they have been for so long.

Also, I'm heading to bed now :X

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

The presence of Krystal as she is seemingly responsible for killing that franchise, giving her a hatedom, ESPECIALLY in Japan.
Also, Tingle's hatedom in North America means he wouldn't make it in unless he was a joke character.

Ryu has a better chance than Phoenix Wright honestly.

Yeah. Ninty brought out a new console before the long-term effects of the Wii plan can hit them(and it is showing signs of showing in slowing sales).

 

[Llumys]

Personally, I'm no fan of Krystal. It seem as though people would rather have her included instead of Falco or even Wolf, which is totally ridiculous, but shouldn't be completely ignored. Also, Marth and Roy were completely unknown in America prior to Melee's release, so I doubt including a character disliked by Americans but adored by the Japanese would be a problem.

As for Phoenix Wright, doesn't he seem like a characeter that Sakurai would include? Ryu would be boring and inappropriate, while Wright would be unexpected and potentially hilarious.