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New Smash Bros for WiiU

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ChronoBound

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^ Nah, we've gotten a new Pokémon each of the last 3 smash bros games (or 2 if you don't count Smash 64) and I don't see this pattern stopping. Plus who else compares in terms of popularity to Pokémon=??? Just Ridley, K. Rool, and Dixie (and Mega Man, but he is a 3rd party character). After that, there is a lot of drop off.
The only Pokemon that is extremely popular and not (currently) in Smash Bros. is Mewtwo.

You are right though that there is a general sense of that we are scraping the bottom of the barrel. I am hearing it everywhere. Some have even gone to say that we need to open the floodgates to third-party characters because there are so few notable Nintendo characters left to put in.
 

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The 5th Gen is one of the most popular Generations ever. At worst, choosing who is the problem. But not getting one? Doubt it.
 

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The 5th Gen is one of the most popular Generations ever. At worst, choosing who is the problem. But not getting one? Doubt it.
Iunno.... it's maybe third popular at best, Fourth at worst.

I think that Zoroark and Victini are both much more popular than any other potential newcomer that isn't Ridley, K. Rool, Dixie Kong, Mega Man, Roy, or Mewtwo. Really, there is more than enough roster spots left for one of them to get in.
More popular than ALL of them, save Mewtwo and Megaman. Maybe Dixie. But popularity only goes so far.
 

Decemberist

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Actually, Zoroark seems more likely because looks like a better fit to play like Mewcario.

Neutral Special - Dark Pulse/Shadow Ball
Side Special - Leer/Scary Face
Down Special - Faint Attack
Up Special - Pursuit
 

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The only Pokemon that is extremely popular and not (currently) in Smash Bros. is Mewtwo.
Yes, but below that tier of Mega Man, Mewtwo, Ridley, Dixie, and K. Rool is the likes of Victini, Zoroark, Roy, Little Mac, and maybe another character or two.
You are right though that there is a general sense of that we are scraping the bottom of the barrel. I am hearing it everywhere.
That's why adding new Pokémon makes sense. It doesn't look desperate, it adds a new taste (Nintendo needs new faces in smash bros that are current to balance new /=/ retro), and it really shows some personality of the 5th Generation of Pokémon. Plus, like I said, not many other characters are in the same ball park in terms of popularity or relevance.
Some have even gone to say that we need to open the floodgates to third-party characters because there are so few notable Nintendo characters left to put in.
Well some of us kinda want that. Adding two 3rd party characters on top of Sonic and Snake (with either a rich history on Nintendo consoles or a rich and important history on gaming), while not opening up the floodgates, at least opens up a nice stream. Now if we're talking more than 5 total, then we are getting a little crazy in my opinion.
 
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^ Nah, we've gotten a new Pokémon each of the last 3 smash bros games (or 2 if you don't count Smash 64) and I don't see this pattern stopping. Plus who else compares in terms of popularity to Pokémon=??? Just Ridley, K. Rool, and Dixie (and Mega Man, but he is a 3rd party character). After that, there is a lot of drop off.
But consider why that was.
Pichu was only added as an afterthought to be a joke.
Lucario was added due to Pokemon Company "demanding" him. But at the same time, Lucario had more than just being a 4th Gen going for him. Much more than any 5th Gen currently has.
 

Johnknight1

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More popular than ALL of them, save Mewtwo and Megaman. Maybe Dixie. But popularity only goes so far.
Yes, but Sakurai will likely go to the Pokémon Company and Game Freak for who to add in smash bros. The Pokémon Company will also probably help pitch a potential moveset and fighting style for him (which I bet they did with Lucario, and what was done with Ike).

Regardless, those little furry animals are the most popular thing in the video game world on a consistent basis.
But consider why that was.
Pichu was only added as an afterthought to be a joke.
Yes, but Pichu was ridiculously popular. I remember then that girls wore Pichu backpacks because they thought Pichu was cute, and tons of people had Pichu stuff. It was like a mini version of the Pikachu crazy.
Lucario was added due to Pokemon Company "demanding" him. But at the same time, Lucario had more than just being a 4th Gen going for him. Much more than any 5th Gen currently has.
I am pretty sure Sakurai went to the Pokémon Company for a suggestion. Regardless, the 5th Generation so far is selling much faster than the 4th Generation by a pretty good margin (which says a lot, because the 4th Generation sold like crazy!).

Plus on top of the new retro characters we will undoubtedly get, Sakurai will try to balance them with newer characters. For every retro character (ie: Pit and R.O.B.), there is a newer characters (ie: Captain Olimar and a Ike). It may not be a 1:1 ratio, but it is fairly balanced. And who better than a new Pokémon addition=???
 

ChronoBound

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I wonder if Miyamoto's new IP will be a good fit for Smash

:phone:
I have been pondering this for a while. I know when Miyamoto talked about it, he said he realizes he has not created a new character based series since Pikmin. Interestingly enough, Sakurai also lamented that there were so few series since Pikmin that warranted a playable character.

I am certainly looking forward to seeing if it does have a character that would transition well to Smash Bros. I think if it does, this character will be among the most popularly requested characters for Smash 4.
 

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On the other hand, note that Sakurai still wanted Plusle & Minun in. So I doubt he'll skip the 5th Gen unless the 6th Gen comes out, then anything could happen.
 

GTA_Hater_331

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Yuiitusin, you and I don't forget: Pichu being in Melee was nothing but the result of a botched joke. Plusle and Minun would be too similar to Pichu, and would be too stark a reminder, which is why I'm hoping against them.

We may be scraping the bottom of the barrel, but if my wishlist only covers half the potential Smash 4 newcomers (the other half are the ones I don't necessarily want, but are popular with most of everyone else) then when the time comes to look to season 5 or 6, there will be solutions without a flood of 3rd party characters. I find the whole idea of adding strict PlayStation 3 and XBOX360 mascots... offensive, to put it bluntly. By then, many long-running Nintendo franchises will have introduced a lot of new characters, but if Nintendo doesn't step up the "series premieres", THEN we'll be in trouble.
 

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Can't we go ONE week without mentioning Mega Man? lol
No, because he is the most "polarizing" character left.
It's not that I have a problem with it lol, I just noticed that we mention him more than almost any other character
It's the fact that everyone knows him, most of us like him (at least us oldies), and he is such a unique character that he immediately draws in our attention.
For a Yoshi stage, since its a bit difficult to come up with much due to the series sort of being dead-ish, I'm partial to the idea of going with World 3 from Yoshi's Island.

Still for a specific spot from World 3, I'd say Nep-Enut's Domain. It'd be cool to see those things pop out of the water, wouldn't it?
I think the best choice for a Yoshi's stage at this point would be from Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island to be completely honest. I think you made a great level choice, though.

@ Chrono
I liked your Wario Land Virtual Boy reference. That was really the only good game for that console. Is there a port of it to a console that wouldn't give me a migraine=??? :laugh:
I wonder if Miyamoto's new IP will be a good fit for Smash
I honestly think even if the character is good, they will get a rain check this smash (because their game hasn't been revealed, and they probably won't be finished for years). I wouldn't be surprised to see it in the next smash bros game(s).

@ Hyper
If Sakurai really goes "bleah, I got no other options" he could just add all Pokémon, including Mewtwo wearing a Mega Man helmet and Victini wearing Waluigi's hat. :troll:
 

Shorts

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Just remember, Sakurai don't give a **** what you think. He doesn't feel like adding a 5th Gen, he won't. It aint mandatory. Toise says everyone exaggorates the whole Pokemon Co's role in the Pokemon choices.

I wonder if Miyamoto's new IP will be a good fit for Smash
Meh, maybe? AND all I know is, he gets what he ****ing wants. I read an article where he basically said "If I want a character in Smash, I put it in" So, his new IP may very well get into smash.
 

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Just remember, Sakurai don't give a **** what you think. He doesn't feel like adding a 5th Gen, he won't. It aint mandatory. Toise says everyone exaggorates the whole Pokemon Co's role in the Pokemon choices.
Yes, but Sakurai has patterns he tends to follow. Plus given the shortage of characters, who else is anywhere near as popular and also is potentially as unique that is Nintendo-owned that could get over him=??? You got Ridley, Little Mac, Dixie, and K. Rool. That's it. No one else that is Nintendo-owned even comes close as much as we may like that or not.
Meh, maybe? AND all I know is, he gets what he ****ing wants. I read an article where he basically said "If I want a character in Smash, I put it in" So, his new IP may very well get into smash.
You do realize that Miyamoto made several movesets in Smash 64 and Melee right=??? In both games, he was involved with all of the characters he made (plus one or two others). That is 7 out of 12 smash 64 characters (plus I think a Pokémon or Samus) and several more Melee characters.

Also add in that Sakurai is in many ways Miyamoto's pupil, and that Sakurai tends to bounce ideas back and forth between him and Miyamoto (that I think makes better games). Don't forget also that Miyamoto is probably also the 2nd most important person to the smash bros franchise. Heck, he basically help Sakurai's hand for all of Smash 64, and then helped shoulder the load in Melee.
 

Starphoenix

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It does not matter whether the new character fits or not. Everyone will be voting for it simply because they believe the character is inevitable due to being the by-prodcut of Miyamoto.
 

Decemberist

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But, who says Smash HAS to be just Nintendo guys?

Okay, I know the answer to that question. But I wanted to ask it anyway because I really feel like the spirit of Smash can go beyond Nintendo now. Gaming as a whole is moving toward a new golden age of sorts for franchises and characters. Commander Shepherd may be no Samus Aran but people know who he is. The popularity of this characters is already starting to cross over (Master Chief in DoA 4, Altair in SCV, etc.). It would be wise to capitalize on characters like Drake, the robots from Portal 2, the Big Daddy from BioShock, and others.

Games are moving toward memorable characters again and Smash stands to gain A LOT from realizing this.

Not to say every character would fit, though.

Also I realize that the Spartan in DoA 4 is not John. I just don't remember what her name was.
 

Johnknight1

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Drake is owned by Sony, and hasn't appeared on a Nintendo console game (because he is owned by Sony), therefore is ineligible. Plus technically he is either 4th or 5th party, which also further makes him ineligible.

The robot from Portal 2 hasn't appeared on a Nintendo console, therefore is ineligible.

Also, who the hell is Commander Shepherd=???

If you want characters who aren't Nintendo-owned with a chance, bring up Solid Snake, Sonic the Hedgehog, Mega Man, Tails, Pac-Man, Slime, the Black Mage (from Final Fantasy), Geno, Bomberman, Ryu (from Ninja Gaiden), etc. You know, characters that are either very important to gaming (Sonic, Tails, Pac-Man), had their roots on Nintendo consoles (the Black Mage, Solid Snake, the Blakc Mage, Geno), or are important to Nintendo's history (Bomberman, Mega Man, Ryu, Slime).
 
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@Decemberist: But that would break the quality of the game being called "Nintendo all stars".

I'd love Drake, Master Chief and Banjo to be in the game but let's remember that this is a STRICTLY Nintendo

Oh and that spartan's name is Nicole

@John : I don't know you anymore D:
 

Decemberist

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That guy from Mass Effect, right? Commander Shepherd?

This criteria of appearing on a Nintendo console is REALLY fickle, though. It's not much of a connection to Nintendo because a game doesn't have to have anything to do with Nintendo to be on the DS or something.

(What MGS game was on a Nintendo console, by the way? Peace Walker, maybe?)

Also, yes, Nicole. Thank you.

edit: MGS started on the NES? Didn't know that.
 

Starphoenix

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That guy from Mass Effect, right? Commander Shepherd?

This criteria of appearing on a Nintendo console is REALLY fickle, though. It's not much of a connection to Nintendo because a game doesn't have to have anything to do with Nintendo to be on the DS or something.

(What MGS game was on a Nintendo console, by the way? Peace Walker, maybe?)

Also, yes, Nicole. Thank you.

edit: MGS started on the NES? Didn't know that.
It is really fickle because it was never the intention to stuff the game full of third party series. Sakurai has enough trouble trying to get all the Nintendo series to fit cohesively together as it is let alone third party series.
 

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Wait.

When did you read that article?
I read it a month or two ago. I forget WHERE though. But I most definitely read that somewhere. I recall Star commenting on it. I bundled it with a bunch of other quotes.

If anyone doubts, I can throw out a few links. I know he said it, so, I don't need to justify it FOR MY SAKE.


Sonic, Snake, Megaman, MAYBE a SE/Nam character. That's the most you're getting. Sakurai has basically said how badly adding third party characters sucks. It's hard, and while he aknowledges the benefits (NOT ABOUT THE MONEY EITHER), he also realizes some people (Both fans and Nintendo employees) don't like the idea. Suck it third party characters.
 

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That guy from Mass Effect, right? Commander Shepherd?
I haven't gotten around to playing that game yet, sorry.
This criteria of appearing on a Nintendo console is REALLY fickle, though. It's not much of a connection to Nintendo because a game doesn't have to have anything to do with Nintendo to be on the DS or something.
Yes, but nearly every important video game character has appeared on a Nintendo console. Most of those characters I mentioned are huge names in gaming.
(What MGS game was on a Nintendo console, by the way? Peace Walker, maybe?)
Metal Gear, Snake's Revenge (an American spin-off mad without Hideo Kojima's permission that sold well), Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes, and Metal Gear Solid 3D: Snake Eater.
edit: MGS started on the NES? Didn't know that.
The original Metal Gear was on the MSX1 (which sold okay), ported to the NES, sold over a million units, and is how the series first became popular. As I previously mentioned, Snake's Revenge came out as a NES exclusive, and a North American/European exclusive title (oddly enough, Metal Gear 2: Solid Snake was released on the MSX1&2 only title, and was only released in Japan).
 

Decemberist

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It is really fickle because it was never the intention to stuff the game full of third party series. Sakurai has enough trouble trying to get all the Nintendo series to fit cohesively together as it is let alone third party series.
You don't have to be super rigid on the whole Nintendo thing, though. Even if you do add a couple more third-party properties, you're still upholding the soul of Smash: shoving a bunch of characters from different universes and canons into a box and waiting for all hell to break loose.
 

Starphoenix

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You don't have to be super rigid on the whole Nintendo thing, though. Even if you do add a couple more third-party properties, you're still upholding the soul of Smash: shoving a bunch of characters from different universes and canons into a box and waiting for all hell to break loose.
I'm just going by what Sakurai has said.
 

Decemberist

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I read it a month or two ago. I forget WHERE though. But I most definitely read that somewhere. I recall Star commenting on it. I bundled it with a bunch of other quotes.

If anyone doubts, I can throw out a few links. I know he said it, so, I don't need to justify it FOR MY SAKE.
I see...

Nope. I don't need a link. I trust you anyway
 

Shorts

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It's kind of silly how people think Sakurai JUST HAS TO ADD NEW GENERATIONS, when really, he could have added Meowth, instead of Lucario and people would have been just as happy. Not to mention it's freaking Meowth. Trumps cario in almost every way.

It's a blessing we got Lucario, and it will be a blessing if we get Zoroark. For all of us Generation lovers.

Pichu is a different story IMO, Pichu is probably closer to being uber popular like Char, Mew, Pika, Jiggs, and Meowth. But that's just because of who he is and when he was released. Plus how much promotion he got in the Anime/games/movies
 

ChronoBound

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I can't really think of any Pokemon that had long-staying popularity aside from those that originated in the first generation. I only think Mewtwo is needed for Smash 4 and simply keep all of the playable Pokemon from Brawl. However, I don't know what the Pokemon Company has planned, and Sakurai has lamented that its difficult working with them since they also help determine the Pokemon content.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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You know it was only called "Nintendo All-Stars" for the just the 64 version, right?

I don't mind 3rd Parties, but they need to HAVE a Nintendo appearance first. Preferrably a key appearance, but that's not needed. This also means that those who hate Cloud and Sephiroth cannot complain(about the Nintendo appearance), as they appeared in Chain of Memories. Now, you can complain how much of a poor choice they are. I totally agree. :p
 

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Semantics people. Roy hardly qualified as an "all star" when he was introduced in Melee.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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The Melee introduction also used the phrase "Nintendo's All-Stars in.."
But not on the box. Meaning it could've been added in later.

However, regardless, as soon as Sonic and Snake got in, that title became irrelevant.

I agree that the main focus is the Nintendo All-Stars, but that's not the final say anymore. :p
 

Decemberist

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You know it was only called "Nintendo All-Stars" for the just the 64 version, right?
..? Super Smash Bros.? In Japan?

I don't mind 3rd Parties, but they need to HAVE a Nintendo appearance first. Preferrably a key appearance, but that's not needed. This also means that those who hate Cloud and Sephiroth cannot complain(about the Nintendo appearance), as they appeared in Chain of Memories. Now, you can complain how much of a poor choice they are. I totally agree. :p
They don't HAVE to appear anywhere (though appearing in a video game would be nice). Sakurai (or whomever) makes the rules and he can change them at his leisure. I'm not saying he would even consider such a thing. I'm just putting that out there. The game's developers can make or break precedents whenever they want.
 

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It's kind of silly how people think Sakurai JUST HAS TO ADD NEW GENERATIONS, when really, he could have added Meowth, instead of Lucario and people would have been just as happy. Not to mention it's freaking Meowth. Trumps cario in almost every way.
Meowth would make a boring moveset, though, with all slashing and money-based stuff. Really there is so much that cat can do. I would much rather have Lucario as a playable character because of the moves he can do. The same goes with why I would rather have Victini over my favorite Pokémon (Blastoise).
It's a blessing we got Lucario, and it will be a blessing if we get Zoroark. For all of us Generation lovers.
Every character so far has been a good character. Yes, even Pichu and Doc.
Pichu is a different story IMO, Pichu is probably closer to being uber popular like Char, Mew, Pika, Jiggs, and Meowth. But that's just because of who he is and when he was released. Plus how much promotion he got in the Anime/games/movies
Yes, but not many people want Pichu in smash, for better or worse. That is what we're judging "popularity" by. Otherwise, that uber powerful chandelier Pokémon would be the top candidate for smash-bar none.

And also, I think Melee's back cover says "The Greatest Nintendo Fighting Game" or something along those lines. I think it is right. Any ways, night y'all!!! :cool:
 
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