New Smash Bros for WiiU

[Deleted member]

The only major problem with a smash 3 - 4 years from now is, everything that is new right now will probably be irrelevant in roster terms by then. Skyward Sword is already being replaced by another Zelda sequel, that will probably involve Ganondorf. Goodbye SS character, hello SS level. Heck, Zoroark might not even be an option at that point.

The roster most certainly can not be decided on at the begining of production either, because the roster that they think of late 2011, or early 2012 still could be irrelevant by 1214. It's all just a big heap of confusing IMO. It's not that I don't think the game doesn't need 3-4 years of development because by god it does. I just see the roster being a pain in the developers side.

I don't think 5th gen will have ended by late 2014. Maybe late 2015, but let's remember that SSB4 starts development this October, only thirteen months from Black & White release in Japan. We should also note that Lucas, which I believe was the latest character to appear in Brawl (In chronological appearance of Nintendo characters), had his game on April 20, 2006, so requirements to get characters in may have ended at Mid-2006 (September, 2006 if they included Lucario late). They will mention games released later on after the cut-off date, but I doubt that anything game related that starts after development after SSB4 will seriously be taken into consideration as a relevance factor.

And beside, the roster is the first thing they hammer out, getting more in will be very difficult to do.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

You keep saying this but in the end if you can transfer the 3ds exclusives to the wiiu but not vice versa won't the wiiu version have the full roster and the 3ds version will appear lacking.

It's quite possible that the 3DS roster won't be as large as the Wii U roster. But again, I'm not sure how much a 3DS card can hold, but I highly doubt that it can hold over 4.37 GB.

 

[Deleted member]

It's quite possible that the 3DS roster won't be as large as the Wii U roster. But again, I'm not sure how much a 3DS card can hold, but I highly doubt that it can hold over 4.37 GB.

It can hold up to 8 GB. Whenever or not it's going to fill it all out remains to be seen.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

It can hold up to 8 GB. Whenever or not it's going to fill it all out remains to be seen.

Okay thanks for solving my 3DS question, since I don't own one right now.

 

[Shorts]

The Burned Tower
Game: Pokemon HeartGold/Soul Silver​

For my first level idea, prediction, er. . thing. I decided to take it back a generation and bring in some HeartGold and SoulSilver representation. Yes, I choose the burned tower. Before the fire the engulfed most of the tower 150 years prior the events that took place in Gold and Silver, Lugia resided here. When the fire broke out it fled to the whirl islands. Three Pokémon were casualties of the fire and by the grace of Ho-Oh they were brought back to life as, Suicune, Entei, and Rakou. So the way this level will play is, you start out in the first second floor of the tower in the middle of the night. The sky if filled with shiny stars, a pearly moon, and the occasional group of Zubat and flock of Hoothoot/Noctowl. Eventually the Pokémon start crawling out of the woodwork and the occasional Raticate, Magmar, and Ekans can be seen in the background minding their own towery business. At this point, you can be KO’ed via the sides of the screen, and the top of it. The wooden boards that the ground is made of has only a certain percentage of hits it can take before the burned boards break. Once they reach that maximum percentage, the ground collapses and the players fall. For the five/ten seconds of falling the players enter a stage where ther is no ground, you are just rushing towards the basement of the burned tower and you’re simply floating. You can of course battle while floating, and you can KO in all four directions. Eventually you hit the bottom of the Burned tower where you find Entei, Suicune, and Rakou. They will be battling against either Lyra, Silver, or Gold. Each of them use three different Pokémon during their battle. (One of each has a starter of course) You can be KO’ed through the sides, and the top of the level.

Heart Gold Soul Silver: Burned Tower
Heart Gold Soul Silver: Legendary Dog Medley, (Suicune)(Entei)(Raikou)
Heart Gold Soul silver: Kanto Battle Music(Wild Pokemon Battle Music)
Heart Gold Soul silver: Cave Medley
Heart Gold Soul Silver: Route 1 Medley(Pichu Encounter!)
Heart Gold Soul Silver: Lugia Battle Theme
Heart Gold Soul Silver: Goldenrod Town
Gold Silver Crystal: Lance Theme
Pokemon Colosseum:Cipher Admin Battle
Pokemon Ranger Gaurdian Signs: Faldera Island
Pokemon Blue Rescue Team: Town Square
Pokemon Fire Red Leaf Green and Emerald: Deoxys Battle Theme
Pokemon Red and Blue: Bike Theme
Pokemon Red and Blue: Lavender Town/Pokemon Tower Medley(Pokemon Tower)

 

[Deleted member]

Okay thanks for solving my 3DS question, since I don't own one right now.

Me neither, but I did at least know that the 3DS could handle that much.

@Shortiecanbrawl: I don't know how likely any of these stages are, but considering that we've always gotten two Pokemon stages since Melee, this is certainly possible, but I'm not exactly the best analyist on stage, so I can't really tell you how likely it is.

 

[ChronoBound]

On Sora's official website, it says that development for Smash 4 will begin October 2011, and that the expected development time for it will be 2 or 3 years. This means at the EARLIEST Smash 4 won't be released until late 2013, and the at latest late 2014. I am really curious about what Sakurai has planned for this game. I have a feeling this game is going to be the "revamp". I just hope we get at least 12 newcomers for this game.

 

[Deleted member]

On Sora's official website, it says that development for Smash 4 will begin October 2011, and that the expected development time for it will be 2 or 3 years. This means at the EARLIEST Smash 4 won't be released until late 2013, and the at latest late 2014. I am really curious about what Sakurai has planned for this game. I have a feeling this game is going to be the "revamp". I just hope we get at least 12 newcomers for this game.

With development phases slowly with each installment, I wouldn't be surprise if it lean the latter and possibly even beyond that. One thing for sure, Smash 4 needs a ton of development time and people need to be patience. Constantly complaining about it not being at launch is not going to make a good game suddenly come, especially considering that we could be seeing a Wii-U at our stores in less then a year from now.

I also find it ironic you're hoping for at least twelve newcomers when you've seem to be only expecting 40 characters at best, which is lower then what I'm hoping for, at nine/ten good newcomers. So I'm curious, aside from the character roster, how much are you really expecting out of this game?

 

[ChronoBound]

I also find it ironic you're hoping for at least twelve newcomers when you've seem to be only expecting 40 characters at best, which is lower then what I'm hoping for, at nine/ten slots. So I'm curious, aside from the character roster, how much are you really expecting out of this game?

I am HOPING for a 40+ roster (late 40's in total character count, transformations included).

At most I am only expecting 40 slots on the character selection screen. I think most of the room for newcomers will come from cuts.

I also think aside from a Pokemon newcomer, there are no guarantees for Smash 4's roster. Whereas Brawl had quite a few in which were "obvious" (Wario, Diddy Kong, Meta Knight, King Dedede, Olimar, and I guess Pit).

With Smash 4, there are no shoe-ins. I am very anxious to see whom Sakurai selects as the first newcomers he is going to unveil for Smash 4. I think the soonest we will be seeing these newcomers will be E3 2012. So basically, we have a whole year of basically no information and simply wild speculation.

 

[Big-Cat]

On Sora's official website, it says that development for Smash 4 will begin October 2011, and that the expected development time for it will be 2 or 3 years. This means at the EARLIEST Smash 4 won't be released until late 2013, and the at latest late 2014. I am really curious about what Sakurai has planned for this game. I have a feeling this game is going to be the "revamp". I just hope we get at least 12 newcomers for this game.

That's a very nice find. You got a link to it because I wanna see this with my own eyes.

And who knows, maybe development time might be even less depending how large of a team and the quality of it is (especially in the balancing area). As we've discussed, it wouldn't be surprising to see this game be the revamp. I'd love if they were to use Project M as a reference for some new ideas like Zelda's Din's Fire. As for the amount of newcomers, I think that's a grand question. In the past, we've had 5 newcomers announced at the very beginning for Melee and Brawl (if you count Zelda as the fifth character in Melee). I think we'll see a 40 character roster at least.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Tourney Mode could always have some new additions.

What if Tourney Mode featured a team tourney feature?! Basically, it would be a 2-on-2 tournament, and up to 64 different teams can be involved; this adds up to 128 participants.

In fact, 1 vs. 1 tourneys should return to having a 64 participant maximum.

1 vs. 1 vs. 1, up to 54 participants, as 27 was rather lackluster in Melee. Of course, a 54 participant tourney would end up with a final two matchup for the finals.

1 vs. 1 vs. 1 vs. 1 brings back the 64 participant maximum with the option of doing a final four or final two match for the finals.

 

[ChronoBound]

That's a very nice find. You got a link to it because I wanna see this with my own eyes.

http://www.project-sora.co.jp/

Click on the "new" that is not Vol 2.

 

[OmegaXXII]

The Burned Tower
Game: Pokemon HeartGold/Soul Silver​

For my first level idea, prediction, er. . thing. I decided to take it back a generation and bring in some HeartGold and SoulSilver representation. Yes, I choose the burned tower. Before the fire the engulfed most of the tower 150 years prior the events that took place in Gold and Silver, Lugia resided here. When the fire broke out it fled to the whirl islands. Three Pokémon were casualties of the fire and by the grace of Ho-Oh they were brought back to life as, Suicune, Entei, and Rakou. So the way this level will play is, you start out in the first second floor of the tower in the middle of the night. The sky if filled with shiny stars, a pearly moon, and the occasional group of Zubat and flock of Hoothoot/Noctowl. Eventually the Pokémon start crawling out of the woodwork and the occasional Raticate, Magmar, and Ekans can be seen in the background minding their own towery business. At this point, you can be KO’ed via the sides of the screen, and the top of it. The wooden boards that the ground is made of has only a certain percentage of hits it can take before the burned boards break. Once they reach that maximum percentage, the ground collapses and the players fall. For the five/ten seconds of falling the players enter a stage where ther is no ground, you are just rushing towards the basement of the burned tower and you’re simply floating. You can of course battle while floating, and you can KO in all four directions. Eventually you hit the bottom of the Burned tower where you find Entei, Suicune, and Rakou. They will be battling against either Lyra, Silver, or Gold. Each of them use three different Pokémon during their battle. (One of each has a starter of course) You can be KO’ed through the sides, and the top of the level.

I love Gol and Silver even though it's second gen, both HeartGold/SoulSilver are rather new title, if anything they should at least include a Johto region, it would be much more appealing than the same old generic Pokemon Stadium.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Team Tournament mode would be incredible.

Hope it happens.

 

[Deleted member]

Ok, one thing I want to bring up, do you think that we're going to be seeing more newcomers with transformations? This is probably one of the few character topics not discussed to death.

Me personally, I can't really see any coming, but there is the slight chance of us getting a Female/Rival Pokemon Trainer.

At most I am only expecting 40 slots on the character selection screen. I think most of the room for newcomers will come from cuts.

I think in this case they won't really focus on newcomers that much. Granted, newcomers do get a lot of attention towards fans, but Sakurai must also be very careful with cutting characters to make room for newcomers. Cutting anyone but these character would cause a huge uproar in the community:
- Lucario (Replaced by Zoroark/Victini (latter is preferable to me)
- Lucas (Replaced by ???)
- Wolf (Replaced by ???)
- Toon Link (Replaced by Young Link/Fierce Diety Link)
- Sonic
- Snake (He and Sonic, it depends on whenever or not there are two new Nintendo newcomers in return. Add in three if no new third-party character shows up as well)

Those with ??? will just have newcomers fill in for them. So in a 40 slot roster, that pretty much gives us nine to eleven newcomers in the game if four to six cuts are made. Any other cuts would potentially be costly to Nintendo (You could argue the same for Sonic and Snake, but in the end, third-party characters really aren't that important, even if Mega Man is my most wanted character).

As for the amount of newcomers, I think that's a grand question. In the past, we've had 5 newcomers announced at the very beginning for Melee and Brawl (if you count Zelda as the fifth character in Melee).

As I said in the old thread, we should look at the amount of newcomers shown shown at the probable E3 2012 trailer. Considering that we ended up getting fourteen newcomers in Melee and seventeen newcomers in Brawl (Both including transformations), I would multiply it by three then subtract two and add two for the likely minimum and maximum amount of newcomers. So in this case, let's say that E3 2012 reveals to us Mega Man, Little Mac, Medusa, and Saki Amamiya, which is four newcomers. That means in this case, while not definitive, we can expect somewhere around ten to fourteen newcomers, transformations included (Only if more transformations are revealed, which I doubt will be the case). Remember, this said nothing about the total size of the roster.

 

[Pieman0920]

For a Gold/Silver/Gen 2 Pokemon level, the one place that I want the most is Lake of Rage, complete with Red Gyarados to cause shenanigans.

Smash 4 really does need more Gyarados. Melee had far too little, and while Brawl had slightly more, its still at critical levels.

 

[Deleted member]

For a Gold/Silver/Gen 2 Pokemon level, the one place that I want the most is Lake of Rage, complete with Red Gyarados to cause shenanigans.

Smash 4 really does need more Gyarados. Melee had far too little, and while Brawl had slightly more, its still at critical levels.

Red Gyarado's boss battl anyone?

 

[OmegaXXII]

I honestly expect to see at least 42 to 45 character tops, I'm just not going to set up my expectations too high for now.

I believe that if we do end up getting a 2012 trailer, we'll most likely see 5 to 6 newcomers revealed plus a 3rd party rep. which will set it to 7 newcomers revealed plus of course the vets like Mario, Link, Kirby, Pit etc..

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

For a Gold/Silver/Gen 2 Pokemon level, the one place that I want the most is Lake of Rage, complete with Red Gyarados to cause shenanigans.

Smash 4 really does need more Gyarados. Melee had far too little, and while Brawl had slightly more, its still at critical levels.

Lake of Rage would be a Gyarados hot spot. You fight while watching out for Gyarados' Hyper Beams.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I like your sig Mario_and_Sonic_Guy. Hope you don't mind I steal it sometime, and replace it with my wishlist. :D

 

[Deleted member]

My expectation is only at 44-45 slots. This can go down to as low as 42 under the condition that Victini is playable and that Diddy Kong and Dixie team up (43 if only one of these conditions are fulfill).

I honestly expect to see at least 42 to 45 character tops, I'm just not going to set up my expectations too high for now.

I believe that if we do end up getting a 2012 trailer, we'll most likely see 5 to 6 newcomers revealed plus a 3rd party rep. which will set it to 7 newcomers revealed plus of course the vets like Mario, Link, Kirby, Pit etc..

I'm only really expecting four reveals at E3 2012 tops. What I'm hoping that the team does is reveal only those four plus maybe one reveal for a starting character and the other four or more newcomers are unlockable characters. Meanwhile, the rest of the starters will be from Brawl's roster plus original twelve. Everyone else is revealed a day or two before the Japanese release (Or maybe not at all and for gamers to figure it out). Sakurai will never reveal how many characters are getting in before the final roster is revealed, so it's going to take a long time before we know how many will be getting in.

 

[OmegaXXII]

For a Gold/Silver/Gen 2 Pokemon level, the one place that I want the most is Lake of Rage, complete with Red Gyarados to cause shenanigans.

Smash 4 really does need more Gyarados. Melee had far too little, and while Brawl had slightly more, its still at critical levels.

Ah yes!!I completly forgot about that place it would be awesome.

I just thought up an idea, what if they included Mt. Silver, y'know the pitch black cave from the Johto/Kanto region, it would be so awesome to have a dark based stage where players are surrounded by darkness but Pokemon such as Lanturn are there to provide lighting but as a stage hazard they would occasionaly leave and darkness would take over for a couple of second.

Just a thought.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I like your sig Mario_and_Sonic_Guy. Hope you don't mind I steal it sometime, and replace it with my wishlist. :D

I basically went back to my roster image to make it. Though it does exclude the two filler characters that I've mentioned.

You can use the signature as a base if you want to. The white boxes are 64x64 pixels each.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

Just thought this was interesting, some of yall might want to read it

[COLLAPSE="RDK's reason why bomberman should be in Brawl"]

Anti-Bomberman Arguments Countered​

1. All he does is throw bombs.​

What else do you want him to do? Conduct an army of ants? Use an axe? His name is Bomberman. To say that Bomberman won't be in Brawl because all he would use are bombs is sheer ignorance. That's who he is, bombs are his being. Of course, if he's going to be in Brawl he's going to use bombs, and if he didn't use bombs, it wouldn't feel right because that wouldn't be Bomberman. Who would be stupid enough to include Bomberman, then deprive him of his bombs? That would be the most illogical move in the history of the world. In fact, using bombs sets him apart from the other characters and would therefore add more variety to the Brawl roster, something everyone wants.

And it’s hardly like the confirmed characters have the most eclectic movesets ever. It’s not like Sonic only uses his spindash…..

Oh, wait…

2. Megaman, Geno, etc. are more deserving of the last 3rd-party slot.​

Bomberman deserves to occupy a third party slot. A gaming icon with a long history on Nintendo consoles, he would be a perfect third party inclusion. The thing that benefits Bomberman the most is that Hudson and Nintendo have a great relationship. Their relationship is tighter then Captain Falcon’s attire. Hudson are trusted by Nintendo to the level that Nintendo allowed them to develop the Mario Party series. If that’s not a good relationship, tell me what is. The fact that Nintendo and Hudson work so closely together means that Bomberman could easily be given permission to be in Brawl without any major difficulties. It would not only benefit Brawl and Nintendo, but increase awareness of upcoming Bomberman and Hudson titles. Bomberman also appeals to all markets, with several Japanese only releases. Acquiring Bomberman from Hudson would be easier for Nintendo then adding other third party characters.

Bomberman is a logical third party inclusion. He has SSB-style gaming experience after appearing in DreamMix TV World Fighters for the GameCube. No other third party character other then Bomberman has appeared on a SSB style game on a Nintendo console except for Snake, and look where he is now.

‘But Megaman is more popular.’​

Popularity is not the only influencing factor when it comes to character inclusion. When it comes to third party characters company relationships must be taken into account. Nintendo have a very good relationship with Hudson. Therefore to get their consent to use Bomberman in Brawl would not be a laborious task. However, getting Megaman from Capcom would be significantly harder to carry out. Therefore Bomberman has every chance of being included, due to the ease with which he could be acquired. Furthermore, who says there will only be one more third party character? Both Bomberman and Megaman could get in.

‘Geno was in a Mario game.’​

Bomberman also appeared in a Nintendo game, namely Wario Blast: Featuring Bomberman! which was released in 1994 on Game Boy. In the game, Wario one day stumbles upon Bomberman's world, and, being the greedy sort he is, decides to loot it for his own gain. Bomberman is the only one that stands between Wario and the complete decimation of his world.

He’s appeared in titles with Nintendo characters, has SSB style experience and his company have an excellent relationship with Nintendo. He would be perfect as one of the third party inclusions.

BOMBERMAN APPEARANCES ON NINTENDO CONSOLES​

Bomberman, 1987, NES​

Atomic Punk, 1991, Game Boy​

Bomberman II, 1992, NES​

Super Bomberman, 1993, SNES​

Super Bomberman 2, 1994, SNES​

Wario Blast: Featuring Bomberman!, 1994, Game Boy
[Known as Bomberman GB in Japan]​

Super Bomberman, 1995, Super Famicom​

Panic Bomber, 1995, Virtual Boy​

Super Bomberman 3, 1995, SNES​

Bomberman GB 2, 1995, Game Boy
[Known as Bomberman GB in North America]​

Bomberman GB 3, 1996, Game Boy (Japan Only)​

Super Bomberman 4, 1996, Super Famicom (Japan Only)​

Bomberman 64, 1997, N64​

Super Bomberman 5, 1997, Super Famicom (Japan Only)​

Bomberman Hero, 1998, N64​

Pocket Bomberman, 1998, Game Boy / Game Boy Color​

Bomberman Quest, 1999, Game Boy Color​

Bomberman 64: The Second Attack, 2000, N64​

Bomberman Max, 2000, Game Boy Color​

Bomberman 64, 2001, N64 (Japan only)
[Not related to 1997 release]​

Bomberman Tournament, 2001, Game Boy Advance​

Bomberman Jetters, 2002, Gamecube​

Bomberman Max 2, 2002, Game Boy Advance​

Bomberman Jetters, 2002, Game Boy Advance (Japan Only)​

DreamMix TV: World Fighters, 2003, Gamecube + PS2 (Japan Only)​

Bomberman Generation, 2003, Gamecube​

Bomberman Land 2, 2003, GameCube (Japan Only)​

Bomberman DS, 2005, Nintendo DS​

Hudson Best Collection Vol. 1 - Bomberman Collection, 2005, Game Boy Advance (Japan Only)​

Bomberman Land Touch!, 2006, Nintendo DS​

Bomberman Story DS, 2007, Nintendo DS​

Bomberman Land Wii, 2007, Wii​

Bomberman Land Touch! 2, Jan. 2008, Nintendo DS​

Bomberman (Wii), TBA, Wii (WiiWare)​

[/COLLAPSE]

 

[Deleted member]

@OmegaXVII: What about Dark Cave? I much prefer the music from that then Mt. Silver.

@disfunkshunal: One major problem with your argument, I highly doubt Konami is going to let Bomberman get in when they're probably going to put Snake in to represent Konami, especially considering that Hudson Soft is dead. If Hudson Soft was still alive, that argument might be more relevant. Now his chances are very low.

Also, according to that, Bomberman would only have slightly more titles then Mega Man. A few game difference doesn't say much, especially since Nintendo is trying to get Capcom characters in over Hudson Soft.

 

[Pieman0920]

If apperances on Nintendo consoles meant anything, Snake, and probably Sonic too, wouldn't have been near Brawl. Heck, the reason people wanted Sonic is because of how much he used to be Anti-Nintendo back in the day.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

i know it is unlikely that bomberman will get in over snake and like you said currently the hudson-nintendo relationship no longer applies but there is still a chance that bomberman could be included as well as snake.
another point is sakurai never said capcom had priority as far as filling the 3rd 3rd party slot that part is all speculation. And like RDK pointed out if for a moment the hudson-nintendo(past) relationship is considered bomberman would be alot easier to get than megaman.

with that being said, given all current evidence i do believe megaman has a better chance

@pieman appearances on nintendo consoles wouldn't hurt

 

[Deleted member]

If apperances on Nintendo consoles meant anything, Snake, and probably Sonic too, wouldn't have been near Brawl. Heck, the reason people wanted Sonic is because of how much he used to be Anti-Nintendo back in the day.

To be fair, Snake got in because Kojima practically begged for Sakurai to put him in the game and Sonic got in due to sheer popularity. This time, when considering new third-party characters (1 or 2 new ones at the most), they're going to take relationship with the company and history the character has much more seriously along with popularity and importance to video game universe and especially Nintendo.

The only one that perfectly fits the popularity, importance, relevance, and history to Nintendo criteria perfectly is Mega Man.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

If apperances on Nintendo consoles meant anything, Snake, and probably Sonic too, wouldn't have been near Brawl. Heck, the reason people wanted Sonic is because of how much he used to be Anti-Nintendo back in the day.

To be fair, Snake got in because Kojima practically begged for Sakurai to put him in the game and Sonic got in due to sheer popularity. This time, when considering new third-party characters (1 or 2 new ones at the most), they're going to take relationship with the company and history the character has much more seriously along with popularity and importance to video game universe and especially Nintendo.

The only one that perfectly fits the popularity, importance, relevance, and history to Nintendo criteria perfectly is Mega Man.

If we're talking about Nintendo's relationship with 3rd parties, Sega and Square Enix have been involved with at least one Mario crossover. At least you can see why I've been targeting those two companies as possible 3rd parties for Smash Bros. Wii U.

For most other 3rd parties, I'm at a neutral position.

 

[Disfunkshunal]

@smashbrosfan

i just noticed you ignored this part:

Bomberman is a logical third party inclusion. He has SSB-style gaming experience after appearing in DreamMix TV World Fighters for the GameCube. No other third party character other then Bomberman has appeared on a SSB style game on a Nintendo console except for Snake, and look where he is now.

=P


from wikipedia

Hudson became Nintendo's first third-party software vendor for its Family Computer.

apparently hudson's had a stronger tie than we thought


something else interesting to note: toad got a trophy in brawl but bowser jr didn't. i know it means little but meh

 

[Arcadenik]

On Sora's official website, it says that development for Smash 4 will begin October 2011, and that the expected development time for it will be 2 or 3 years. This means at the EARLIEST Smash 4 won't be released until late 2013, and the at latest late 2014. I am really curious about what Sakurai has planned for this game. I have a feeling this game is going to be the "revamp". I just hope we get at least 12 newcomers for this game.

I am pretty sure we will get at least 12 newcomers. I THINK the 12 most likely newcomers would probably be:

1. new retro rep #1 (Takamaru seems the most likely)
2. new retro rep #2 (who knows? I am hoping for Muddy Mole and/or Duck Hunt Dog)
3. new Pokemon rep #1 (most likely a 5th gen rep like Zoroark, Victini, or a new Pokemon Trainer)
4. new Pokemon rep #2 (probably a new 1st gen rep like Meowth and/or Mewtwo, even though Mewtwo isn't new to Smash)
5. new Donkey Kong rep (Dixie Kong and/or King K. Rool)
6. new Mario rep (Toad and/or Bowser Jr.)
7. new Kid Icarus rep (Palutena and/or Medusa)
8. new Zelda rep (Tingle and/or Toon Zelda)
9. new series rep #1 (Little Mac is the obvious pick)
10. new series rep #2 (hopefully Starfy from Starfy series)
11. new series rep #3 (hopefully Matthew or Isaac from Golden Sun series)
12. new series rep #4 (hopefully Isa or Saki from Sin & Punishment series)

 

[augustoflores]

Snake got in because Kojima practically begged for Sakurai to put him in the game and Sonic got in due to sheer popularity.

everyone knows this, why do we keep on mentioning it? even the context of what someone states wouldn't verify that this one person doesn't know already.

 

[Shorts]

Megaman is the smart choice, I get it. He is pretty much the most boring choice as well. I just hope he doesn't end up a snorefest when it comes to his moveset. As weird as this may sound, I would prefer Jill Valintine over Megaman when it comes to Capcom characters. I hope Square Enix gets their hands into the SSB4 jar. They are only company I would be excited to see (almost) any of their characters get in.

12. new series rep #4 (hopefully Isa or Saki from Sin & Punishment series)

By the time SSB4 comes out, I'm sure The Last Story and Xenoblade will be available everywhere. So I hope for Kanan(The Last Story) or Shulk?(Xenoblade). I'm not a big fan of the main protagonist of the last story. I think Kanan is much more interesting/the face of the game.

If we're talking about Nintendo's relationship with 3rd parties, Sega and Square Enix have been involved with at least one Mario crossover. At least you can see why I've been targeting those two companies as possible 3rd parties for Smash Bros. Wii U.

Ever heard of Wario Blast: Featuring Bomberman?

 

[vVv Rapture]

Nintendo needs more crossovers.

Samus Aran and Master Chief vs. the Universe

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Ever heard of Wario Blast: Featuring Bomberman?

Mario Party probably would not have existed without Hudson Soft. However, I am surprised that Bomberman never ever appeared in any of the Mario Party titles.

Of course, Mario Party was exclusively for Mario Universe characters. Ironically, Mario Hoops 3-on-3 had Final Fantasy characters.

 

[OmegaXXII]

My expectation is only at 44-45 slots. This can go down to as low as 42 under the condition that Victini is playable and that Diddy Kong and Dixie team up (43 if only one of these conditions are fulfill).I'm only really expecting four reveals at E3 2012 tops. What I'm hoping that the team does is reveal only those four plus maybe one reveal for a starting character and the other four or more newcomers are unlockable characters. Meanwhile, the rest of the starters will be from Brawl's roster plus original twelve. Everyone else is revealed a day or two before the Japanese release (Or maybe not at all and for gamers to figure it out). Sakurai will never reveal how many characters are getting in before the final roster is revealed, so it's going to take a long time before we know how many will be getting in.

Well if you put it that way then I guess it makes sense not to reveal too much, I guess saying maybe about 5 newcomers plus Brawl vets would simply work in Sora's favor as it would undeniably create hype.

 

[Arcadenik]

@smashbrosfan

i just noticed you ignored this part:

=P

something else interesting to note: toad got a trophy in brawl but bowser jr didn't. i know it means little but meh

Bowser Jr. did get a trophy in Brawl. All it talked about is how Bowser Jr. felt about Peach, how he is selfish, and how he tries to look scary with his bib with the fangs drawn on it.

Toad's trophy talked about THE Toad's job as Peach's servant, how generic Toads are peaceful and comes in different colors, and how unusually strong THE Toad was in Super Mario Bros. 2.

P.S. Bomberman isn't the only character to appear in a SSB-style game. Simon Belmont was also in DreamMix TV World Fighters.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Nintendo needs more crossovers.

Samus Aran and Master Chief vs. the Universe

An impossible dream, considering the fact that Master Chief is owned by Microsoft.

 

[Arcadenik]

You do know movesets can be made from scratch. Like Wario, only Wario bike and waft are from the Wario series. The others are new moves that he never did in the wario series.

Ridley's moves can be heavily based from Other M and Prime.

I hate Wario's moveset in Brawl. I wanted him to have a moveset based on his abilities in the Wario Land games, not based on his WarioWare personality.

 

[Jaklub]

About that Bomberman argument. I actually thought "death" of Hudson improved his chances.

Relevance to Nintendo is no argument anyway. Snake is in Brawl. His most popular games are on other platforms than Nintendo.

However, no third party will win with Megaman in terms of popularity.