New Smash Bros for WiiU

[---]

Just added a couple that I felt would be more reflective of what might be selected.

Tracks:
Sonic Adventure 2 - City Escape
Sonic Adventure - Emerald Coast
Sonic Heroes - Metal Madness (Final Boss)
Sonic the Hedgehog ('06) - Crisis City
Sonic and The Black Knight - Knight of the Wind
Sonic Colors - Planet Wisp
Sonic Generations - City Escape ~ Classic
Sonic Generations - Stardust Speedway ~ Metal Sonic
Sonic & Knuckles - Doomsday Zone
Sonic Adventure 2 - Metal Harbor
Sonic Adventure - Open Your Heart (Brawl)

Oops. Sorry I left for a few minutes, sorry if I kept you waiting.

Anyway I did consider many of those tracks initially so I'll take your suggestions into consideration. Thanks for the help.

 

[Johnknight1]

More like call of duty:incomplete or call of duty:expensive

I nearly coughed out a lung laughing at this! Good stuff puff!

Halo 2 was awesome because after a certain date the maps were free Halo 3 was okay , reach/odst = full of fail.

Activision - Here guys buy guitar hero world tour , guitar hero 5 , guitar hero metallica , and band hero + most of their DLC songs weren't great.

CoD is just disgusting with their DLC. The maps aren't even that good. ( My brother caved in and bought em all) I even uninstalled them at one point because it was so annoying having to play on them.

I do praise EA though for what they did with rockband. I was very happy with every song being playable on each game. and transferring the entire library from rb1 to rb2 was extremely reasonable as well

Reach/ODST were just a new Halo 3 with expensive maps.

And for Activision, you forgot all those crazy in number handhelds, the Best of Guitar Hero game (like a real bands with best of/biggest hits albums!), Guitar Hero Van Failen, DJ Hero, Drum PSP Hero, Underwear Hero, and Guitar Hero V. Plus Rock Band DLC was way better.

Call of Duty DLC is insane. I would kill myself if I had to buy $40 of DLC for a game I spent $60 on. Activision is the biggest gaming w**** of all-time, along with Blizzard. It's ironic and yet funny that they formed Acitvision-Blizzard together. You gotta keep those two money hungry freaks together I guess!

And yes, EA treated Rock Band great (which is why the series isn't in a super long hiatus). They released 3 main games, two band-specific games (with DLC for both games), and transferable music from the older games to the newer games. Plus again, the DLC was great and varied. Fans of all kinds of rock 'n' roll, rockabilly, all kinds of folk, all kinds of pop, techno, all kinds of metal, all kinds of punk, all kinds of alternative, and even rap, hip-hop, jazz, etc have to be please.

@Johnknight1: We should expect that to tank quickly. I do think he'll score better then Toad and Waluigi, but I'm not really expecting anywhere above late 30's for him. But at least this will show that the Geno alliance is very much alive, just in a diminished form.

I dunno. He may tank in the polls, but I wouldn't be surprised if he was in the 50 percentile range. The Geno Alliance was huge here on Smash Boards, and very dedicated. Much of it is scattered, but hopefully we can return our long lost brethren!

Expect us supporters of ♪!? to again take our reign as one of the most dedicated to our character in all of smash boards, and for our number to be as large as an army! *get hyped*

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Mach Speed sections? Is that a single-player mode=??? Obviously you don't know that Captain Falcon's running speed isn't that fast. Double the top speed, force Sonic to accelerate to top speed (as in take about a second to get to top speed), and nobody is complaining except a few people who never played a Sonic game in their life.

He's reasonable in Melee. Anything more is too much. Play it on Fast Mode. He's almost uncontrollable. Not interested in another Mach Speed section, which was the only thing that was horrible about Sonic 2006.

Mods are no less for being made by me than Sakurai. Who is Sakurai to say that he can make his game his way, and I can't mod it my way, and both can be competitive=??? You are absolutely, 100% wrong on this. People have modded everything since the beginning of the PC gaming era dating back to Doom with user-made maps (which is still being done to this day on Doom). Counter-Strike has all kinds of Mods (zombie, zombie escape, RPG, surf, jail tons of custom maps). Does that make it less competitive=???

I don't know, who's to say that we should hack the game and call it Brawl? We're playing legal Brawl tournies. Let's not go into the fact that hacks on the Wii(specifically) are already illegal. Thus, none of that counts. We wouldn't be playing the actual Brawl game the second we modified anything outside of what's legally allowed within the game. Also, don't apply this to other games, as they have different rules.

Some companies actually PROMOTE THIS! SEGA actually promotes Total War series mods, and allows users to download them, and give them instructions on how to download/use them. People have modded things since the history forever. "Competitive" is a subjective word anyways. Who are we to tell people who want to competitively play a Brawl mod to make Brawl like Melee, a Brawl mod to balance out the tiers, or a Brawl mod to make the game more offensive-friendly that their game isn't competitive=??? That would be just plain elitist. They paid $50 for it, they can do whatever they want with it.

And Nintendo and Sakurai do not. Anti-Competitive by nature. For Brawl, that is. And buddy, they CANNOT. We have to license to PLAY the ORIGINAL game, nothing more. Read the EULA sometime. We are paying for the right to actually play the game. You do understand how buying games work, right? That's how video games work. You are paying for the license to play the game the original way. Not every company has a problem with you using hacks or whatever(except online). They don't care. Nintendo does, and their EULA strictly state that any modification to their products is against their breach of policy. They can arrest and fine you. The second you pay for the game, you're immediately signing an unwritten contract that you will not modify the contents of the game or system in any way. They actually care, although others don't. This is exactly why they make updates to delete hacks. Because they legally can do that.

Let me put it another way: We own the disc, but none of the data. It's not ours to do with what we wish. We can rip the disc to threads legally because we payed for it. We cannot modify the contents of the disc because only the Company can legally do that. Not every Company cares about hacks. It's fine they don't. That does not apply to Nintendo, however.

Chain grabs require some skill, yes. However, chain grabs where your opponent cannot escape require minimal skill usually hurt a game's appeal, and usually requires new rules.

Can't do it up to 300%. And I disagree there as well. You have to get there first. No Chain Grab is easy to start either. We do not take away the only few options for combos because that's eliminating what makes the game playable. Once again, perfectly legit.

 

[Big-Cat]

That's great. Play Sonic. He's speedy and hard to predict. Likewise, the playstyles were a bit more defensive, but not only defensive. Speed =/= Good.

Except Sonic feels unnatural along with everyone else in the game. If he's not fun, I'm not gonna bother with him.

And a bit more defensive?

That's ALL Fighting Games. The engine will benefit certain characters more no matter what. That's how Tiers partially work. Some characters are better depending the engine itself. Nobody is going to be equal in any engine. Unless they're exactly the same character. Slower fighters will easily lose more often in high-paced games. Weaker but faster characters cannot do much if they cannot kill in a percentage-based game. Every rule benefits someone over another. Every engine does too. No engine is equal whatsoever for anyone.

I wasn't talking about engines here. I'm talking about the core design. Street Fighter's fundamental design isn't biased towards any particular character. Smash's tiers are almost based on who's got good aerials/speed. There are certain holes in the design that make it difficult for some characters to be viable. What's the difference between a command grab and a throw in Smash? Nothing.

I personally think the Smash games had an excellent and unique engine that didn't require ridiculous commands. It means you could concentrate more on the strategy and style of the character, and less on the memorization on buttons. This is great because not only is it easier to get into, the depth is more character-based, and not just buttons. That's the beauty of it being universal: Figuring out the character differences and applying them through battle. I like the train of thought. It's no different from playing any game with completely different cards. They all follow the same overall activation rules, but figuring out the best combos that aren't pre-programmed is part of the skill of playing.

*facepalm*

Is that all you look at in other fighting games? That it looks hard to you? Every character has their own specific advanced techniques.

 

[Metal Overlord]

What do y'all think of this: http://wiiuupdates.com/2011/11/wii-touch-screen-remote/

 

[pikmingrapeandrape]

How do you guys know that DLC was confirmed???

 

[Metal Overlord]

How do you guys know that DLC was confirmed???

You mean for the systems or the game?

If you mean the system, for the 3DS, DLC is coming in the next system update

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/326683/3ds-getting-dlc-functionality-via-november-update/

 

[Madame puff]

Dear nintendo,
You gave us a touch screen remote.I love you.
NOW LET'S SEE A FLAREON WITH FLARE BLITZ.

Yours truly,
Lunatic Princess (Madame Puff)

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Except Sonic feels unnatural along with everyone else in the game. If he's not fun, I'm not gonna bother with him.

And a bit more defensive?

They're not unnatural in the engine. They're fit to play in that exact style.

I wasn't talking about engines here. I'm talking about the core design. Street Fighter's fundamental design isn't biased towards any particular character. Smash's tiers are almost based on who's got good aerials/speed. There are certain holes in the design that make it difficult for some characters to be viable. What's the difference between a command grab and a throw in Smash? Nothing.

There are holes in Street Fighter's design too. If you have any long range projectile, you have an immediate advantage from the start. The only differences is how easy it is to pull off. No matter what, no game is beneficial to all characters. That doesn't work.

*facepalm*

Is that all you look at in other fighting games? That it looks hard to you? Every character has their own specific advanced techniques.

That applies to all Smashes too. I'm sorry that I find memorization of controls less important than actual character combos. I concentrate more on the character, not the controls. I do not need to wrestle with them to get good at the game. It's the matter of figuring out what you can do directly. Let's take a game that uses the same controls for everyone: Sonic Battle. Want to know what makes it great? Every character's strengths and weaknesses are due to statistics, and certain moves. Not because of controls. Controls should never be an issue. Memorizing them is not interesting to me whatsoever. All I care about is actually the fighting itself. I want to concentrate on the character, and be unique by figuring out my own combos. If they're all purposely telegraphed, then I didn't design it myself. That's how character depth works in Smash. Being unique from both a player and character standpoint.

 

[pikmingrapeandrape]

You mean for the systems or the game?

If you mean the system, for the 3DS, DLC is coming in the next system update

Is DLC coming for ssb4 on Wii U?

 

[Starphoenix]

What do y'all think of this: http://wiiuupdates.com/2011/11/wii-touch-screen-remote/

Chances are it was an early prototype for the Wii U tablet. Could be mistaken, but I would not take it to mean much at this time.

How do you guys know that DLC was confirmed???

Nintendo, Iwata specifically, has commented recently about how they are opening up more options for developers for downloadable content with the 3DS and in the future with the Wii U.

 

[Metal Overlord]

Is DLC coming for ssb4 on Wii U?

That in particular isn't confirmed or deconfirmed yet, but DLC will be possible on the Wii U in general:

http://andriasang.com/comxc5/

CORRECTION 8/1: A previous version of this story miswrote that Iwata had said the e-Shop has a 5% usage rate. Iwata did not make any comment about the e-Shops's current usage rate, but only said that Nintendo hopes that over the next three years digital business has a dramatic increase over current levels. Additionally, Iwata's comments about Nintendo not doing paid download content was in reference to certain types of low quality content. He did not rule out Nintendo releasing paid download content in general, and even expressed interest in this area.

 

[Big-Cat]

I give up. There's no getting through to you.

 

[---]

Well if they're allowing for DLC I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo has some DLC planned for at least some of the upcoming titles.

That way they can make a demonstration for the public about the Wii U and to help appeal to more 3rd Parties by offering less restrictions and more options when developing titles.

This is just me guessing, of course, I know nothing about running a business.

 

[Johnknight1]

He's reasonable in Melee. Anything more is too much. Play it on Fast Mode. He's almost uncontrollable. Not interesting in another Mach Speed section, which was the only thing that was horrible about Sonic 2006.

Fast mode in Brawl is about 3 to 5 times faster, which would be faster than what I'm projecting Sonic to be. Again, that is discounting his base starting speed and acceleration.

I don't know, who's to say that we should hack the game and call it Brawl? We're playing legal Brawl tournies. Let's not go into the fact that hacks on the Wii(specifically) are already illegal. Thus, none of that counts. We wouldn't be playing the actual Brawl game the second we modified anything outside of what's legally allowed within the game. Also, don't apply this to other games, as they have different rules.

People who do this don't pretend the game is regular Brawl. They play Brawl+, Brawl-, Balanced Brawl, and other such mods, and call it that. They don't act like it's the same game; they treat it as a mod. At a tournament I went to for Brawl Brawl+ was a side event. Is there anything wrong with that=???

Also, I have never seen anything that says modding a video game is illegal (except for online play, leader board-related things, and when you sell it). Unless Nintendo has a contract that is really lame for that, they should allow local modding like Sony, Microsoft, and all other 3rd party companies once you buy the game. You can legally change your Blu-Ray copy of Star Wars that you bought and replace all the music with music from Lord of the Rings that you bought. There is nothing illegal about it, as long as you aren't making a profit on it, or you aren't overriding Nintendo console security. There is nothing I can find that comes anywhere near to stating modding a game you already bought and own is illegal. The only thing downloading mods such as the Homebrew Channel is erase your Wii's warranty. That's it.

And Nintendo and Sakurai do not. Anti-Competitive by nature. For Brawl, that is. And buddy, they CANNOT. We have to license to PLAY the ORIGINAL game, nothing more. Read the EULA sometime. We are paying for the right to actually play the game. You do understand how buying games work, right? That's how video games work. You are paying for the license to play the game the original way. Not every company has a problem with you using hacks or whatever(except online). They don't care. Nintendo does, and their EULA strictly state that any modification to their products is against their breach of policy. They can arrest and fine you. The second you pay for the game, you're immediately signing an unwritten contract that you will not modify the contents of the game or system in any way. They actually care, although others don't. This is exactly why they make updates to delete hacks. Because they legally can do that.

If you have links to prove that it is illegal, then you are right that it is illegal. However, if is impossible to enforce.

Your attempt to call modded variations Brawl anti-competitive is laughable at best (especially since "competitive" is completely subjective to our individual opinions). You do realize that even Sakurai edited Brawl, right=??? There are noticeable differences in the NTSC, PAL/SECAM, and Japanese version of each smash bros. game, right=???

 

[Metal Overlord]

Any of you guys got Super Mario 3D Land yet? If not, does anyone at least want it?

 

[Steam]

Those are more the combos than actual thought. I've played them too. I don't have to think while playing those because it's simply a case of memory when inputting a command. Not the case in Brawl. There's strategies to remember, not only button presses. Brawl requires more literal thought. Having a great memory does not mean you put thought into your actions. It can, but it's not automatic. Not when you can spam fireballs all day. It won't win you games anywhere in Brawl. If you don't actually do an attack that sends them flying, you're not going to win. It's two completely different scenarios.

goddammit no. just stop. you have no idea what you're talking about. there's more to games that aren't brawl than muscle memory. you have to think in every fighting game. some require you to think in different ways.

@kuma- smash tiers are not based on who's the fastest/has good aerials. jigglypuff has amaaazing aerials and aerial mobility/speed and she's garb in brawl... same with yoshi. ike has great aerials... sonic is stupid fast.

MK is strongest on the ground since he has **** airspeed, Diddy is stage control, Snake is stage control, Falco has bad aerials and airspeed... ICs aren't fast or aerials based... Olimar is a grounded fortress, etc. etc.

 

[Big-Cat]

goddammit no. just stop. you have no idea what you're talking about. there's more to games that aren't brawl than muscle memory. you have to think in every fighting game. some require you to think in different ways.

I think I like you now.

 

[Shorts]

I don't see Nntendo doing much DLC. I swear I've herd them say something along the lines of "We like to release a game when it's fully finished."

*looks at Capcom*

The ONLY DLC SSB4 needs IS PATCHES.

Kuma, which fighting game is best fo beginiers to learn the ropes? I'm not ready for Blazblue.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Fast mode in Brawl is about 3 to 5 times faster, which would be faster than what I'm projecting Sonic to be. Again, that is discounting his base starting speed and acceleration.

Alright.

People who do this don't pretend the game is regular Brawl. They play Brawl+, Brawl-, Balanced Brawl, and other such mods, and call it that. They don't act like it's the same game; they treat it as a mod. At a tournament I went to for Brawl Brawl+ was a side event. Is there anything wrong with that=???

And the tournament, if it was made mainstream, would be brought down because Nintendo hates hacks. As well as possibly Smashboards for allowing it. Bad idea to even try to do illegal stuff in the first place.

Also, I have never seen anything that says modding a video game is illegal (except for online play, leader board-related things, and when you sell it). Unless Nintendo has a contract that is really lame for that, they should allow local modding like Sony, Microsoft, and all other 3rd party companies once you buy the game. You can legally change your Blu-Ray copy of Star Wars that you bought and replace all the music with music from Lord of the Rings that you bought. There is nothing illegal about it, as long as you aren't making a profit on it, or you aren't overriding Nintendo console security. There is nothing I can find that comes anywhere near to stating modding a game you already bought and own is illegal. The only thing downloading mods such as the Homebrew Channel is erase your Wii's warranty. That's it.

You never could do any of that. You really don't understand how it actually works, do you? Any modifications to it outside of what they specifically say is allowed can be called out, and is consider illegal. If I use hacks on Sonic 2006, they indeed can arrest me for doing that. Of course, they may not care, because eh, they knew they screwed up. Likewise, it's also messing with their IP. They have every right to protect their IP. The thing is, they just don't care enough to put it in their EULA, so they can't enforce it anymore. Nintendo can because of their EULA.

If you have links to prove that it is illegal, then you are right that it is illegal. However, if is impossible to enforce.

http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/systems/wii/en_na/gi_system.jsp?menu=documents&submenu=doc-eula Read the second major paragraph, specifically Chapter II. Nintendo does not ever authorize cheat devices, which hacks are pretty much the same thing.

Your attempt to call modding Brawl anti-competitive is laughable at best. You do realize that even Sakurai edited Brawl, right=??? There are noticeable differences in the NTSC, PAL/SECAM, and Japanese version of each smash bros. game, right=???

None actually affect competitive gameplay. Also, as the OWNER AND CREATOR of the game, he LEGALLY can do what he wants with it. He actually does have that right.

Want to know why's it's anti-competitive? Because hackers will never stop trying to change the insides. It also means that we'll never have a truly solid game to play. Because it's literally impossible.

 

[---]

I don't see Nntendo doing much DLC. I swear I've herd them say something along the lines of "We like to release a game when it's fully finished."

*looks at Capcom*

The ONLY DLC SSB4 needs IS PATCHES.

This.

I totally agree, and I hope Nintendo does stick to their current policy of actually finishing games. You don't see many companies doing that that anymore.

 

[Metal Overlord]

I don't see Nntendo doing much DLC. I swear I've herd them say something along the lines of "We like to release a game when it's fully finished."

*looks at Capcom*

The ONLY DLC SSB4 needs IS PATCHES.

I agree, but not because of what you said. I think they're gonna be conservative with DLC simply because it's their first foray into the field and I highly doubt they'd wanna go overboard with it...

 

[Madame puff]

Nintendo actually finishes their games.
EVERYONE ELSE: PFFFTTTT WHO FINISHES GAMES ANYMORE?

 

[Metal Overlord]

Nintendo actually finishes their games.
EVERYONE ELSE: PFFFTTTT WHO FINISHES GAMES ANYMORE?

lol

I could so imagine Bobby Kotick (the Activision CEO) saying that

 

[SmashChu]

I wasn't talking about engines here. I'm talking about the core design. Street Fighter's fundamental design isn't biased towards any particular character. Smash's tiers are almost based on who's got good aerials/speed. There are certain holes in the design that make it difficult for some characters to be viable. What's the difference between a command grab and a throw in Smash? Nothing.

Yeah, or maybe that's because your looking at a style of play the strips everything else and puts it though a funnel effect and not how the game is normally played or designed.

Otherwise, please continue.

 

[Johnknight1]

And the tournament, if it was made mainstream, would be brought down because Nintendo hates hacks. As well as possibly Smashboards for allowing it. Bad idea to even try to do illegal stuff in the first place.

Over 300 people attended this tournament. Again, you can prove nothing that it is illegal!

You never could do any of that. You really don't understand how it actually works, do you? Any modifications to it outside of what they specifically say is allowed can be called out, and is consider illegal. If I use hacks on Sonic 2006, they indeed can arrest me for doing that. Of course, they may not care, because eh, they knew they screwed up. Likewise, it's also messing with their IP. They have every right to protect their IP. The thing is, they just don't care enough to put it in their EULA, so they can't enforce it anymore. Nintendo can because of their EULA.

Nintendo actually filled a lawsuit against Game Genie for legality back in the 80's for unlicensed hacking Game Genie won the lawsuit, and it was deemed legal, and still is today.. The same ruling goes for Game Genie, Game Shark, and Action Replay, which is why hacking a game is again, LEGAL! Just because Nintendo doesn't approve of it doesn't mean crap. If Obama disapproves abortion, who cares=??? It is still legal! (let's not start an abortion debate)

Correction to your above statement.: Any modification that the law doesn't protect (like the previously mentioned Game Genie lawsuit) that a company "bans" in a contract is still legal regardless.

If you have links to prove that it is illegal, then you are right that it is illegal. However, if is impossible to enforce.

http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/systems/wii/en_na/gi_system.jsp?menu=documents&submenu=doc-eula Read the second major paragraph, specifically Chapter II. Nintendo does not ever authorize cheat devices, which hacks are pretty much the same thing.

This is the Wii Network section, and mostly covers online detail and warranty. Obviously hacking a console or using it in ways that are breach the warranty contract make the warrant contract nullified. Let me get Chapter II of this contract up...

Chapter II: Unauthorized Software, Services, or Devices or Unlicensed Accessories
Your Wii Console and the Wii Network Service are not designed for use with unauthorized software, services, or devices or non-licensed accessories, and you may not use any of these with your Wii Console or the Wii Network Service. Such use may be illegal, voids any warranty, and is a breach of this agreement. Such use may also lead to injury to you or others or cause performance issues or damage to your Wii Console or the Wii Network Service. We (and our licensees and distributors) are not responsible for damage or loss caused by unauthorized software, services or devices or non-licensed accessories. We may take steps to disable or delete any unauthorized software, services or device installed in your Wii Console, for example, by detecting and disabling them through the Wii Network Service and/or game software. If we detect unauthorized software, services, or devices, your access to the Wii Network Service may be disabled and/or the Wii Console or games may be unplayable.

Again, it says "such uses may be illegal, void any warranty, and is a breach of this agreement." It does not give specifics as to what is legal or illegal. It does make clear, however, that hacking or modding your Wii definitely voids and nullifies your previous warranty contract (if you still have it), and that Nintendo and all involved parties are not responsible for your Wii console, games, software, hardware, etc once you use mods or hacks.

The end merely states that if they detect any mods or hacks on your Wii console through the Wii Network Service (the Wii's online) that Nintendo has the right to disable your online connection to your Wii, and that a result of that may end in your Wii Console or games becoming unplayable.

None actually affect competitive gameplay.

You obviously have never played PAL/Japanese versions of any of the three smash bros. games. In the Japanese version of smash 64, there are different sound effects, the tiers are different, and many moves have noticeable damage % and knock back difference, and combos are a lot easier. The Japanese and NTSC version of Melee are about the same, but the PAL version made Fox and Falco a tad weaker, and took away some chain grab potential, specifically with Sheik.

Want to know why's it's anti-competitive? Because hackers will never stop trying to change the insides. It also means that we'll never have a truly solid game to play. Because it's literally impossible.

Actually, the game Counter-Strike is a mod of Half-Life. Valve (the company that made Half-Life) actually bought the rights to Counter-Strike and hired their creators. Together, they made millions of dollars, and brought us one of the best multiplayer games ever! Counter-Strike sure as heck is competitively stable, and has various modes, many of which are also very competitive and competitively stable.

Stop treating your opinions as facts. They aren't.

 

[Aurane]

Well, seens how the 3 mirage PKMN are IMPOSSIBLE to get in (...), I've decided that voting for JUST Victini, which I've been doing forever (hint, hint), is more healthier... for everyone Lol

Anyways, here's my impressions of Keldeo and Meloetta in Pokeballs:

Name: Keldeo
Rarity: Rare
Effect:
When sent out, he neighs/cries loudly, and then uses Secret Sword, which is a Rotating blue blade, about 3 character spaces long, going forward. Much like Issac from SSBB, but this draws opponents into the middle. He fires only two, which the other is on the other side. After they are both fired, he shakes his body a little bit, then leaps to the top of the screen, and disappears.
Chance of death: If hit, 100%, unless he hits a wall of some sort.
Timer: 15 Seconds
~
Name: Meloetta
Rarity: Rare
Effect:
When sent out, she starts singing and twirling. Anyone who approaches her goes to sleep and takes 3% DMG every second. After 15 seconds of singing, she then disappears, ending the song, known as Relic Song.
Chance of Death: If high in DMG as is, using a Smash attack may kill them, so the chance varies.
Timer: 18 seconds.
~~

I am very tired, but I can't sleep.

 

[Conviction]

Melee has baiting and reading just as well as tech skill (aka doing what you want to do). The difference is in Brawl, there's usually so many defensive options (especially in recovery), with low-risks and high-rewards that dominates offense. In Melee, offense faces defense with about equal risks (ie: high-risk, high-reward, low-risk, low-reward).

I dunno about you, but I want defense to have more risk in any future smash bros. games than in Brawl. It doesn't have to be as belittled by offense as in Melee or smash 64, but good offense should beat good defense. Also, where did I say one game is better than the other outside of an obvious opinion=???

Good for them. If people have fun playing Brawl and like competing in Brawl tournaments, they should. Brawl has good aspects, but for me, the game bores me. Deal with it.

Camping/stalling/spamming/planking/edge spamming is so bad that there are several very specific rules against it, and a character was ban. That's how little faith the competitively people have in Brawl. That style of dominate play and those strict of rules sadly won't attract many people to tournaments who don't already play Brawl competitive.

My problem with Brawl are these are tons of low-risk, high-reward defensive "strategies" (much of which is slow and tedious) that the best characters can do better than the rest.

MLG dropped Melee because Microsoft is one of their biggest sponsor. Brawl is not on the MLG Pro Circuit as of this year due to several reasons. On another note, most of the hype/promotion/attention of Genesis centered around Melee, not Brawl. A few nationals don't even have Brawl. The big New York smash TOs exclude Brawl often.

And this (below) is why you should read all of what you are quoting:

You skipped my latter part of my post. I stated I feel nearly all of the top characters are boring to watch. I don't want the next smash. bros game to be like that.

Did I say I was speaking "facts"=??? NO! If I was speaking facts, I would say it was a "fact." When have I made something up=??? Please don't respond emotionally. Keep it civil.

Everything is civil. The way you read my post and how you react to it I guess is your fault if you feel anger from it.

I've said multiple times in this thread I'm not a very "nice" poster when it comes to debates.

Since I'm tired I'm going to keep this short.

1) Most of top tier is boring depending on what country's metagame your in
2) Yes they've dropped brawl, I'm not going to names those at fault though Either way, there are brawl nationals that excluded Melee. It happens quite often.
3) I read all of what I quote, I didn't expect to have to give multiple examples of top tier gameplay or something when you give broad statements like that
4) I never said I had a problem with you disliking brawl, it's been dealt with LOL
5) As of recent I'm trying to stay neutral on most topics until I get to one I like "Melee vs. Brawl" gets old, very fast. I do agree with hoping there is more of offensive-defensive balance.
6) Data has shown that more players have joining brawl with the MK ban. Soooo.....
7) I'm pretty sure I covered everything. I hope. XD

I didn't sense any of that in your post either, Star.

I was mostly referring to Johnknight and Iblis (mostly Iblis)

Nah homes, I've always been fine. You should know by now.

I think I like you now.

I'm glad people are starting to see why I wanted Steam in the BR now.

EDIT: Wow looks like every time I skip pages I make the right choice. I see Kuma and Chu going at it again and now John and HF. Next time I'm going to be apart those.

EDIT2: @John: There are no gameplay differences in any of the brawl games.

EDIT3: @Kuma&Hyper: I think I caught the gist of your debate. Please tell me I'm wrong about what I'm skimming. Are you guys arguing about what game has more holes or something? Every game has holes or else every MU in fighting games would be 50/50.

 

[Metal Overlord]

@Iblis- I truly didn't know this time, son! Sometimes it's hard to discern emotions from just text on in the interwebs

 

[Conviction]

It's all good. If I ever got mad in this thread I'd probably post something about everyone, it would be full of images and videos.

I actually think it would be pretty funny. It might take up a whole page though

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

Create The SSB4 Roster Day Twenty-Two is up for Geno and Bowser. How much can his legacy live up?

Even I would not sign up for Gamefaqs to defend Geno...Seriously, that site is a lost hope for decency

Nintendo actually finishes their games.
EVERYONE ELSE: PFFFTTTT WHO FINISHES GAMES ANYMORE?

I've heard this response from fans before

"Why bother finishing the game, no one else is doing it these days"

 

[Johnknight1]

Everything is civil. The way you read my post and how you react to it I guess is your fault if you feel anger from it.

You told me I make "s*** up." That's why my reaction was so negative.

I've said multiple times in this thread I'm not a very "nice" poster when it comes to debates.

I used to do the same thing. Just talk without emotion, cut out the anger, or talk in third person like Johnknight1.

Since I'm tired I'm going to keep this short.

1) Most of top tier is boring depending on what country's metagame your in
2) Yes they've dropped brawl, I'm not going to names those at fault though Either way, there are brawl nationals that excluded Melee. It happens quite often.
3) I read all of what I quote, I didn't expect to have to give multiple examples of top tier gameplay or something when you give broad statements like that
4) Data has shown that more players have joining brawl with the MK ban. Soooo.....

1. It also depends on how said country plays the game, and how well the players in said country/state/region know each meta game.

If there was more action and less "let's walk or stand around the stage" Brawl would draw more hype. Basically, if Melee had Brawl's game play but the same Melee characters and pre release hype, and Brawl had Melee's game play but the same characters and pre release hype, I think Brawl tournament attendance would be off the charts. (although some would definitely prefer the Brawl version of Melee, of course)

2. There are some nationals that exclude Melee but with MLG dropping Brawl there are still more Melee centered and Brawl excluded tournaments, namely the divide in New York.

3. I was stating that I felt most of the Brawl competitive community has troubles "trusting" Brawl competitively without a lot of rules. I fear where all these rules may lead to.

4. The Meta Knight ban may still be a temporary fix. Let us hope this never happens again in smash (except Pikachu in Smash 64).

 

[Conviction]

More or less I agree with most of what you said.

Plus even there was anything to really argue about I'm too tired to do it now LOL.

Well that was fun. We need more debates like that.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Over 300 people attended this tournament. Again, you can prove nothing that it is illegal!

Oh, really? So they can't take the Wii away, and check for hacks? Oh, wait, they can. Nice try, though.

Nintendo actually filled a lawsuit against Game Genie for legality back in the 80's for unlicensed hacking Game Genie won the lawsuit, and it was deemed legal, and still is today.. The same ruling goes for Game Genie, Game Shark, and Action Replay, which is why hacking a game is again, LEGAL! Just because Nintendo doesn't approve of it doesn't mean crap. If Obama disapproves abortion, who cares=??? It is still legal! (let's not start an abortion debate)

Only because their old systems did not have the EULA that the Wii does. The Wii's EULA protects against third-party modifications.

Correction to your above statement.: Any modification that the law doesn't protect (like the previously mentioned Game Genie lawsuit) that a company "bans" in a contract is still legal regardless.

That settlement does not apply to the Wii's EULA.

This is the Wii Network section, and mostly covers online detail and warranty. Obviously hacking a console or using it in ways that are breach the warranty contract make the warrant contract nullified. Let me get Chapter II of this contract up...

They aren't just talking about the online.

Again, it says "such uses may be illegal, void any warranty, and is a breach of this agreement." It does not give specifics as to what is legal or illegal. It does make clear, however, that hacking or modding your Wii definitely voids and nullifies your previous warranty contract (if you still have it), and that Nintendo and all involved parties are not responsible for your Wii console, games, software, hardware, etc once you use mods or hacks.

They agreement is to allow you to play their system and games. If you breach it, they have every right to take it away. You're breaking the law. It's not the warranty it breaches, it's the allowing to play the system and games. All hacks are third-party modifications. Which they deem illegal and a breach of the contract. They do not approve of it. Note with Homebrew, they have updates that remove it, which they can do legally. This is the same reason that Datel cannot make a Cheat Device for the Wii. Because they do not approve of it. Every product you use MUST be approved by Nintendo. End of story.

The end merely states that if they detect any mods or hacks on your Wii console through the Wii Network Service (the Wii's online) that Nintendo has the right to disable your online connection to your Wii, and that a result of that may end in your Wii Console or games becoming unplayable.

Yeah, that means you have to buy a new one. You broke their contract and the law. You really need to pay attention better to the wording. It's not the ONLINE that their disabling, they can disable your ability to play that Wii and all games at their own discretion. And you can't do a thing about it because you agreed to it the second you bought the system and games.

You obviously have never played PAL/Japanese versions of any of the three smash bros. games. In the Japanese version of smash 64, there are different sound effects, the tiers are different, and many moves have noticeable damage % and knock back difference, and combos are a lot easier. The Japanese and NTSC version of Melee are about the same, but the PAL version made Fox and Falco a tad weaker, and took away some chain grab potential, specifically with Sheik.

Brawl has the same gameplay outside of the 2 unlockable Masterpieces. Everyting is the same. The other 2 games are different. Brawl has online and must have consistency. There is no gameplay differences in the competitive scene outside of illegal hacks.

Actually, the game Counter-Strike is a mod of Half-Life. Valve (the company that made Half-Life) actually bought the rights to Counter-Strike and hired their creators. Together, they made millions of dollars, and brought us one of the best multiplayer games ever! Counter-Strike sure as heck is competitively stable, and has various modes, many of which are also very competitive and competitively stable.

That's great. And doesn't mean crap to Nintendo at all. They have different rules, and you must follow them, or they can punish you legally.

Stop treating your opinions as facts. They aren't.

None of what I said was an opinion. Except that I believe hacks are non-competitive. And I'll explain why:

1) You are no longer playing the official game itself.
2) There is nothing stopping anyone from making huge changes that affect gameplay.
3) People can bring memory cards to cheat, immediately making it uncompetitive by default.
4) Consistency. Not every person has played Hacks, and thus, cannot realistic train for it. Likewise, because of Hacks having hundreds of different versions, you may be playing the wrong version and are training the wrong way. This is not fair to anyone.
5) This is a pain in the butt for Tourney Runners to take care of. If the Wii resets, everything has to be done all over again. This is a waste of time. Likewise, many will refuse to play hacks, causing arguments and strife. If there is one indefinite ruleset, this won't happen.
6) You aren't really allowed to do this anyway. Nothing's stopping you from smoking underage, but that doesn't make it not illegal.

Likewise, I could easily get a person in here who can 100% explain why hacking the Wii is entirely illegal. I'm sure you know that us putting anything that is not approved by Nintendo is already third-party, and modifications that they have a problem with, specifically stated by the EULA. You need to read it word for word. All Cheat Devices are considered illegal no matter what you live when it comes to the Wii. This does not apply to their other systems as of yet.(possibly 3DS too)

It's fine if you want to break the law. I won't stop you at all. But when you get in trouble for it, you have nobody but to blame but yourself.

 

[Big-Cat]

Yeah, or maybe that's because your looking at a style of play the strips everything else and puts it though a funnel effect and not how the game is normally played or designed.

Otherwise, please continue.

So how do the "intended rules" eliminate these holes? What are the intended rules? Why do you consider them intended when the game allows one of many options to play?

And you never answered my questions from earlier. What are Smash and fighting game logic? What are the differences?

E
EDIT3: @Kuma&Hyper: I think I caught the gist of your debate. Please tell me I'm wrong about what I'm skimming. Are you guys arguing about what game has more holes or something? Every game has holes or else every MU in fighting games would be 50/50.

No. It's more of Hyper can't see that high speed doesn't take away the strategic aspect of the game. Not only that, but he seems completely unaware that every other fighting game has character specific techniques, strategies, etc. like Smash.

 

[Johnknight1]

You mean debates that end in me everyone winning=???

I know an debate we all want to win: CUSTOM MUSIC!

Basically, we all want it, we want to play any song on any stage, and we want unlimited songs until we use up all the memory of a SD card, memory card, USB port, or hard drive.

If we get all that, WE ALL WIN!!!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

@Kuma: Sorry, but I consider Brawl a great game. Don't even try to say a game is crap when it's not. That's purely your opinion, and frankly, I have absolutely no problems with Brawl's main gameplay. The bad decisions are purely single player, and NOT multiplayer, where it really counts. Don't you even dare to try to tell me I'm wrong because I enjoy a game I find perfectly solid. You know what I found ****ty? Sonic Unleashed. Does that mean people shouldn't like it? Hell no.

 

[Conviction]

@Kuma: Ignoring the Brawl being ****ty. Yes other fighters do have that like Smash. What is there to argue? LOL

@John: Custom music would make everyone happy, with a sped up gameplay, more characters, and more technicality. That seems to be the general thought process I've seen around here.

@HF: Sonic Unleashed is ****ty though, so is Sonic '0glitch. It's fact

 

[Metal Overlord]

You mean debates that end in me everyone winning=???

I know an debate we all want to win: CUSTOM MUSIC!

Basically, we all want it, we want to play any song on any stage, and we want unlimited songs until we use up all the memory of a SD card, memory card, USB port, or hard drive.

If we get all that, WE ALL WIN!!!

I'd do anything to get Future Trunks' and Goku's Super Saiyan theme in Smash

 

[Conviction]

Idk if I'd do anything....