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New Smash Bros for WiiU

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Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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Thats really freaking small minority thats wants him. That and over mach rider or takamaru as a retro character? Its not worth the effort of forcing a moveset for him either. Atleast not while those to are there. They just seem more deserving as a retro character.
That doesn't make him an impossible choice. Sure, it's doubtful, but he could get in. You know, I knew about DHD than well before Mach Rider or Takamaru. I still barely know a thing about the latter. The former, only very little. Any retro gamer would find DHD very easy to recognize, due to being an iconic annoyance in gaming.

I mean, why else would there be games on Newgrounds where you can kill him? He's more recognized than you think. Also, "deserving" is purely subjective. It's fine if you think he shouldn't get in, but we're allowed to think that he has a fair chance.
 

Arcadenik

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXT7thyvhcs - Duck Hunt Dog's mannerisms would be hyperactive and cartoony like these hunting dogs.... suits his trollish personality. Notice how the dogs are using different stuff? Imagine those things as items in Smash and the Duck Hunt Dog would use them in a silly manner. Oh, and in the end, the dogs are wrapped in bandages and are in crutches... just like Vs. Duck Hunt.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2eXHfumqU9A&feature=related - 1:40, Duck Hunt Dog would pounce and bite the opponent like that.

There's also the idea I suggested where the dog points a finger at the opponent... like he is telling the hunter (aka the person who is playing Duck Hunt) to shoot there. And there's that one idea Kuma suggested where he avoids getting shot as an attack.

I don't want to "see" the dog in Smash. I don't want to "fight" the dog in Smash. I want to "play" as the dog in Smash. Why do you think some people hated seeing Samurai Goroh, Isaac, Lyn, Little Mac, Ray MK III, Meowth, and Deoxys showing up as unplayable summons instead of as playable characters? I don't want to see Toad every time I played as Peach and pressed the B button - I want to play as Toad. HUGE DIFFERENCE! Were you satisfied with fighting Ridley twice in Brawl despite not able to play as him? If the dog is an Assist Trophy in SSB4, I would be disappointed, yes... but I will continue to support him for SSB5.
 

Sunnysunny

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You aren't in Japan,.
WHEN THE **** DID I MENTION JAPAN?!
I hear you say "its popular in japan" so much its painful. You arn't in japan. You have no clue whether they want DHD or not. Try talking about what you know dude! Do you think they want Duck hunt dog? Do you really think anyone wants duck hunt dog or duck hunt dog will be any more interesting, demanded, or represent anything more then the other retro characters that have been put into this series?

Why do you want him in so much?
 

Starphoenix

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Its not Sakurai who has planned on it, but rather Capcom. Many people at Capcom want Mega Man in Smash Bros. and think he would be a perfect fit for it.

I can't really explain it. Its sort of like how I feel Victini is more likely thanks to having a similar body shape as Pichu.

As I have said before, Mega Man is the only character that I am feeling absolutely confident in regards to them showing up as a newcomer.
I see. While a nice thought I'm pretty confident Megaman's, as of now, exclusion from Ultimate Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 has more to do with the development team behind that game and less with Capcom executives. If anything I've been of the opinion that Megaman is being saved as an enticement to draw in more money for either DLC or another installment. We already know more characters were planned for UMvC3 that were cut in order to release the game earlier. I am almost one hundred percent positive Megaman was in the group cut.

I think those two decisions are independent of one another.
 

Metal Overlord

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Do you really think anyone wants duck hunt dog or duck hunt dog will be any more interesting, demanded, or represent anything more then the other retro characters that have been put into this series?
This whole part of your argument goes awry because of that statement.

Too much bias.
 

OmegaXXII

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Game and watch had his own mini series and ROB was mostly put in for the plot of SSE. That and ya know, hes a robot. It was really easy for him to make a moveset for him.

DHD just seems boring as a retro character. His moveset could be made to be like an attack dog, but that just sounds boring compared to a motorcycle rider who can't be destroyed and survived in a post-apocalyptic world taking over my aliens. I'm not saying hes bad, but theres more deserving spots then him.
So? ROB didn't have his own game, the fact that he was added in SSE afterwards doesn't make a valid argument, that didn't decide his chances to be in since he had a "build" to go on.

I understand if you don't like him, but I wouldn'y necessarly say he's limited to very little moveset options, hell, for all we know he could have some kind of retro item like the super scope or something along those lines, i'm sure Sakurai could think of something if he showed interest.
 
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@Shortiecanbrawl: Nice list there. I would add Kyurem to the list and Keldeo. Magikarp would be a nice successor to Goldeen as well.
HyperFalcon said:
And the problem with Victini is that it's yet another mouse. The whole "body-type" argument applies to him with Pikachu and Pichu as well.
They are rodent-like Pokemons, but I only really see a big similarity among Pichu and Victini (perhaps this is a reason why Masuda considers Victini its favorite). But I don't see how being a rodent-like Pokemon is going to affect its chances in a negative way.

@Starphoenix: Mega Man X was highly considered for UMvC3. But with him hinted as being Zero's alt, I don't think he's going to be in MvC3.
 

christianizcool

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Alright, here is my roster:

Returning characters:
Mario
Luigi
Peach
Bowser
Wario
Yoshi

Link
Ganondorf
Zelda/Sheik

Diddy King
Donkey King

Capt. Falcon

Falco
Fox
Wolf

Ice Climbers
Pit
Mr Game and Watch

Jigglypuff
Pikachu
Pokemon Trainer (with different gen of Pokemon)
Lucario (or Mewtwo, or whatever the equivalent Pokemon of the newest gen is)

King Dedede
Kirby
Meta Knight

Lucas (only if they make him more different than Ness)
Ness

Marth
Ike (or Roy)

Olimar

Samus
Zero Suit Smaus

Snake
Sonic

Explanations:
- ROB probably should be included since he has a unique play style, but doesn't matter either way to me
- Pokemon Trainer could keep same Pokemon, but probably will be mixed up
- Lucario, Mewtwo, another Pokemon, doesn't matter to me
- Keep Lucas but make him more different than Ness
- Ike or Roy should be in the game, but not both. And if they have Roy, he should have a similar moveset to Ike, and not the Marth clone moveset from Melee.
- ZSS should be visible on the character select screen like Zelda/Shiek. Not a big deal, but would be better
- Cut Toon Link/Young Link. I don't like clones, sorry

Added characters:
- King K Rool - need more DK representation, would be a new, unique character
- Dixie Kong - less realistic, but could be cool. She was in just as many DKC games as Donkey and Diddy, and has a unique moveset
- At least one more F-Zero character: most realistic choices are Black Shadow or Samurai Goroh, or both. Both Assist Trophies in Brawl
- Krystal could be added and could be unique, but I am doubtful. Nintendo has kind of left behind things relating to Star Fox Adventures.
- Ridley for sure. There definitely needs to be more Metroid representation. People have debated to death whether he is too big, but his size has varied in nearly every Metroid game. Also, him being in Brawl's story mode is a potential sign.

Now for some maybe not so obvious characters:
- Isaac. Make some sense. He was an Assist Trophy in Brawl. They just came out with a third GS. Makes sense to me.
- Knuckes. Alright, not too realistic, but would be cool
- Geno, I can wish
- Little Mac, was an assist trophy. Nintendo has shown they like bringing back old characters (Pit, Ice Climbers). Also, there was just the new Knock-Out game one Wii within the past couple years. The only thing is Little Mac is kind of nondescript (sorry!)

That is all I got. What do you guys think?
 

Sunnysunny

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This whole part of your argument goes awry because of that statement.
No, actually thats particular what sakurai mentioned is one of the only 2 requirements for putting in a character.

He said the only two requirments are
1. Having an interesting moveset potential.
and 2. People want to play as them.
 

OmegaXXII

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Sakurai doesn't add obscure characters for the sake of their obscurity. We have Pit, Ice Climbers, R.O.B., and G&W because they are interesting fighters. That's why he looks back at old characters. To find hidden gems that could offer a nice moveset. KIND OF. Pit was already popular, and ROB and G&W are also celebrations of Nintendo history.

INCIDENTALLY, I wonder if Takamaru would count as the "ROB and G&W" of retro choices. Perhaps a better representative of the FDS? WAY better than Diskun.
Again, moveset potential exists within any character, it may not seem interesting to YOU, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be given one if Sakurai and it's developers thought of one.
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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They are rodent-like Pokemons, but I only really see a big similarity among Pichu and Victini (perhaps this is a reason why Masuda considers Victini its favorite). But I don't see how being a rodent-like Pokemon is going to affect its chances in a negative way.
What I meant was that the "same" body-type argument shouldn't be used for Zoroark any more than it should for Victini. It applies in combination for both, that's all.

I still think Genesect would be a great choice, however.
 

OmegaXXII

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No, actually thats particular what sakurai mentioned is one of the only 2 requirements for putting in a character.

He said the only two requirments are
1. Having an interesting moveset.
and 2. People want to play as them.
Source where he mentioned this??
 

Metal Overlord

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No, actually thats particular what sakurai mentioned is one of the only 2 requirements for putting in a character.

He said the only two requirments are
1. Having an interesting moveset.
and 2. People want to play as them.
"Interesting" is subjective. You have no idea what Sakurai thinks of DHD and whether he finds him "interesting" enough to warrant a spot on the roster or not, and it isn't wise to assume so.
 

Arcadenik

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No, actually thats particular what sakurai mentioned is one of the only 2 requirements for putting in a character.

He said the only two requirments are
1. Having an interesting moveset.
and 2. People want to play as them.
And "interesting" is a subjective word. Case in point, Phoenix Wright. A lot of people did not think he would be interesting as a fighter because he is just a boring lawyer. Well, now that we have seen him in action... is he still not interesting?
 

Sunnysunny

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Phoenix wright was put in do to his retardly popularity. Thats the only reason they went the extra mile to take a boring character and make him "interesting."

Laughing dog doesn't have that.

So tell me guys.
Just let me no what you think.
How is laughing dog interesting?

I personally find him just to be a generic dog and he'll play as a generic dog.
 

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For the DHD debaters: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=146816

1. The character's inclusion must make people want to play the game.

2. The character must be unique.

The character must have identifying features and abilities that would make them different from existing characters, so that they add something to the game.

3. The character must fit into the style of Super Smash Bros.

The character obviously has to be able to fit into the framework of how smash works.

4. They must contribute to the game balance.

Everyone has to fit together. Every new character must counter some characters and be countered by others, and they must fit in one giant contiguous mesh.

I swear on that Pokemon list I would have been Professor Oak or Mewtwo at this point. :p
 

OmegaXXII

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So tell me guys.
Just let me no what you think.
How is laughing dog interesting?

I personally find him just to be a generic dog and he'll play as a generic dog.
You aren't thinking outside the box, you are assuming something that you don't know, it may be "boring" to you but it doesn't mean it will be boring to Sakurai.
 

Opossum

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Well, he could do pretty cool things such as shooting people with a Zapper, Throwing clay pigeons, Recovery via Ducks, and other semi-interesting things, such as perhaps fighting without fighting (dodging a bullet to attack).

Plus he's pretty iconic, and the fact that you couldn't shoot the dog in the original pissed quite a few people off. Imagine their joy when the could beat up that hated dog with Nintendo All-Stars!

Plus, he has a nice simplistic design IMO.

For the record, I for one am not a huge supporter of Dog Hunt Dog, seeing as he may stand in the way of Muddy Mole. Other than that, I have nothing against him.
 

Sunnysunny

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You aren't thinking outside the box, you are assuming something that you don't know, it may be "boring" to you but it doesn't mean it will be boring to Sakurai.
Then prove to me hes not boring. You've just been saying i'm close minded, but you have yet to suggest anything that makes him interesting.

Tell me what you think is interesting about him? Gimme your point of view on why he's interesting.
 

Shorts

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I picked bill because idk if you're Oak status yet, BUT you're definitely knowledgable and useful (You can speak Japanese), just like Bill is. He's smart, and helpful.
 

Oasis_S

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Again, moveset potential exists within any character, it may not seem interesting to YOU, but it doesn't mean he couldn't be given one if Sakurai and it's developers thought of one.
Some characters have more potential than others. :troll:

Do we regard all characters equally? Should we put a Goomba on the same level as Ridley? Goombas are more recognizable! Probably even more popular to the general audience!

I don't know where you get off telling people to consider every little thing. Then our speculation would go no where. IT'S OKAY TO SAY "THIS CHARACTERS CHOICE IS STUPID AND HAS NO CHANCE" EVERY NOW AND THEN.


Also Phoenix Wright is the worst thing to happen to Smash speculation.
 

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I picked bill because idk if you're Oak status yet, BUT you're definitely knowledgable and useful (You can speak Japanese), just like Bill is. He's smart, and helpful.
???

O.K. I didn't see I was Bill. But sure that works.
 
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What I meant was that the "same" body-type argument shouldn't be used for Zoroark any more than it should for Victini. It applies in combination for both, that's all.

I still think Genesect would be a great choice, however.
I just think that having a humanoid Pokemon is a lot more redundant then another very small, cute rodent-like Pokemon. But at this rate, this discussion is getting nowhere. To end this, I'll say that it benefits both Zoroark and Victini.

As for Genesect, I'd like to see him in as well.
 

ChronoBound

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I am curious how much Palutena and Medusa's fanbases will grow once Kid Icarus Uprising is finally released. Sakurai has spent more development on that game than he did on Brawl, so at the very least I expect it to be one of the biggest name titles for the console and for Nintendo to give it a massive push.

Also, the OVAs might also boost the popularity for those two characters.
 

Arcadenik

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What is Duck Hunt Dog? He is a generic dog, yes. But the fact he is bipedal and appears to have opposable thumbs (because he is holding ducks in his paws instead of with his mouth)... tells me that he is a cartoon dog. That alone makes him more interesting than a generic dog like a Nintendog. But how do we make a cartoon dog more interesting? Why, we add elements of Duck Hunt to his moveset! Ducks, clay pigeons (the white frisbees), and the hunter using the Zapper to shoot at the screen. And add in his trademark laugh as a taunt to troll the other players every time you KO them... And presto! A great troll character to rival the likes of MODOK! :troll:
 

Sunnysunny

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There's a difference between simply having bias and actually letting it show through and affect your arguments...
When in doubt throw the word "biased" about.

You really can't back up why he should be in so you start calling opinions biased? Everything in this thread is an oppinion. Everything. Thinking hes deserving in is an opinion. In that case..

This whole arguement is the definition of biased. You guys have been forcing the idea of DHD threw out the duration of this entiiiiiire thread. Just admit it. It won't happen. Its comparable to the fanboys who want cloud strife in.
 

OmegaXXII

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Then prove to me hes not boring. You've just been saying i'm close minded, but you have yet to suggest anything that makes him interesting.

Tell me what you think is interesting about him? Gimme your point of view on why he's interesting.
I'm writing a mini-essay and a moveset i thought up as we speak, this should fill your mind up, expect it later on.

Some characters have more potential than others. :troll:

Do we regard all characters equally? Should we put a Goomba on the same level as Ridley? Goombas are more recognizable! Probably even more popular to the general audience!

I don't know where you get off telling people to consider every little thing. Then our speculation would go no where. IT'S OKAY TO SAY "THIS CHARACTERS CHOICE IS STUPID AND HAS NO CHANCE" EVERY NOW AND THEN.


Also Phoenix Wright is the worst thing to happen to Smash speculation.

OKAAAAAY, so what is your point? DHD isn't insignificant as say a goomba or a redead, he's quite iconic and isn't on the same level.
 

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I am curious how much Palutena and Medusa's fanbases will grow once Kid Icarus Uprising is finally released. Sakurai has spent more development on that game than he did on Brawl, so at the very least I expect it to be one of the biggest name titles for the console and for Nintendo to give it a massive push.

Also, the OVAs might also boost the popularity for those two characters.
Good point. Although we can't forget Magnus just yet unfortunetly.

I didn't know he spent more time on it then Brawl. When did development begin?

Also out of curiosity, at this point who do you think is most likely out of the 3 possible KI reps?
 

Verde Coeden Scalesworth

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I just think that having a humanoid Pokemon is a lot more redundant then another very small, cute rodent-like Pokemon. But at this rate, this discussion is getting nowhere. To end this, I'll say that it benefits both Zoroark and Victini.

As for Genesect, I'd like to see him in as well.
Fair enough. Rattata for SSB4. :p

"It won't happen" only applies if the actual character or idea is 100% impossible or goes against the entire game. Since neither of those apply, DHD is clearly possible. Unlikely as hell, I'll give it that much.
 

Metal Overlord

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Thanks Arcade for the assistance. :)

Sunny, well everyone here debating DHD really, this debate is really getting nowhere, let's just agree to disagree here and call it a day, k? I'll give you a lap dance if you do.

Now how about some Event Mode ideas? I dunno, at least something other than DHD and Pokemon atm...
 

Aurane

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Victini: (B) Moveset List

I decided to make a list of possible (B) moves for Victini. Here they are, starting with regular (B):

Searing Shot: Victini's V forehead begins to glow, and his fists are clenched. Once charge is complete, Victini has the power to unleash it whenever he wants to. When unleashed on the ground, he'll blow up 1 1/2 character spaces in front of him, behind him, and above him. Now, if done in the sky, Victini halts in the sky, and 1 1/2 Characters spaces all around him will blow. After a 2 second recovery after explosion, Victini can perform action.

DMG: 19%
Charge: Can only be fired once fully charged. Takes 1/2 a second less than Lucario's ASC.
Range: 1 1/2 Character spaces.
~
Fusion Flare: Victini tightens his fists and his body becomes hot. Anyone near him will take knockback and damage when executed. When released after some time, it'll let off a 1 character space counterer in order to keep guard hogs away. Relate to (If you played Halo: Reach) Armor Lock ability.

DMG: First knockback DMG: 5%. Second hit:: 17%
Charge: It protects Victini from all attacks, however will still take dmg from them, but nvr knockback. After 4 seconds of charge, he'll let loose all around him a 2 character spaced pulse that has huge knockback.
Range: Close up at first, then after the charge he'll let loose all around him a 2 character spaced pulse that has huge knockback.
~
Stored Power: Victini levitates on the spot. Any projectiles that hit him become uselesz and the power of the item is stored inside Victini. After three successes, Victini can let loose a powerful blast of kenetic energy that can result in serious damage. Refer to G&W's (B)v.

DMG: If all of the projectiles are of different weapons, 25%. However, if they are the same, 40%.
Charge: After being hit by projectiles three times in this phase, press the (B) button again and let loose the power.
Range: 1 1/2 Character spaces in front of him.
~~~
So that's regular (B), so let's take a look at (B)^:
~~~
Reversal: Victini does a backflip straight upwards, going 2x his body legnth, aka character space. If someone attacks or is in contact with him, Victini will grab them, then jump off them, while smashing them downwards. He can perform it again if he succeeds.
DMG: 13%
Charge: None, but Victini loses action if he doesn't hit anyone.
Range: Depending on the opponent Victini jumps off of, the second recovery jump will be higher or lower. The heavier they are, the more jump. The lightest of them gives Victini a small jump.
~
Fusion Bolt: Victini's body becomes an intense, electric ball. He is then 1.5x faster and can fly like ROB, but legnth wise, his (B)^ move last half 75% of what ROB's time is for flying. If you press (B), he'll drop straight down, crashing into everything in the path. Enemies who touch him take some dmg. It also auto clings to cliffs.
DMG: Counter: 3%. Impact Drop: 24%.
Charge: None, but Victini becomes inactive if Fusion bolt doesn't land thoughout the time he's in this mode.
Range: Anywhere, as long as you have time to get there.
~~~
Let's hit those (B)> moves:
~~~
Zen Headbutt: Victini dashes foward in quick succession. If opponent is near, he'll grab them, then headbutt them foward. Like Lucario's Force Palm, but does fire damage and has different recovery tactics. CANNOT REUSE AS WELL AS LUCARIO!
DMG: Hit without grab: 11%. Hit with Grab: 16%
Charge: Super Fast attack.
Range: When he darts foward, he goes 2 Character spaces foward.
~
Flame Burst: He spits a bullet-like fireball at the opponent. This move is fast and goes straight foward and won't stop until it hits something. If something is hit, it'll explode, hitting anyone nearby as well.
DMG: Actual Hit: 16%. After Effect: 4%
Charge: Shot very fast from Victini's mouth. Can be successivly used 3 times, then Victini will stop, shake his head in exhaustion, then continue the fight.
Range: Straight foward and goes through until it hits someone.
~~~
Last one would be (B)v. Let's do it.
~~~
Inferno: Victini's body becomes cloaked in a fire armor, while he floats in midair as he's executing it. If someone hits him physically, they take dmg and knockback.

DMG: They take as much dmg as their attack would of made to Victini, along with knockback. Awesome Combo Breaker.
Charge: This move works as fast as Fox's (B)v move.
Range: Countering attack.
~
Incinerate: Victini's hands jet to both sides, then let loose a stream of fire going upwards. The opponent(s) will be stuck in a mini Bullet Seed lock, as you might say.

DMG: Every 1 1/2 seconds will deal 4% damage.
Charge: Takes 1/2 a second long than Ivysaur's Bullet Seed move, and takes 1/2 a second longer recovery after letting go.
Range: Both sides of Victini
~~~
Surprise! FS!
~~~
V-Create: If an opponent is nearby, he'll dart through them at sonic speed, tossing them into the air, then like Captain Falcon, will go into an awesome movie cut, showing Victini from a distance charging at them, flying, with a flaming V on his forehead. He rips through the opponent, doing exactly 180% dmg (as much as the dmg ratio of the actual move) and do a OHKO. Then Victini lands.
DMG: 180%
Charge: None
Range: He can dart 2 character spaces foward, but if he misses, then he failed the FS. Rips through Super Armor in this sense.


Anyone like these moves? I'm making a vote to see which ones are going into the moveset I'm making. SSBF, I hope ur online ;)
 
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