New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[Anti Guy]

I would just like to point out to everyone down-voting characters based on the judgement that they're not bringing enough to the table... this is a clone engine we are talking about. Think realistically here for a moment, do you really think the PMBR want to make 5 completely new characters from scratch? That's completely ridiculous and it will never happen. Think of how many hours they would have to put in to do that, give them some slack.

If we look at other clones already within the game, there's Falco, Wolf, Ganondorf, Tink, Luigi, and Lucas. All of these character's have movesets that are similar to their counterparts. What sets them apart from one another are minor tweaks to some of their moves mechanics like Falco's Dair, slight changes to their movesets like all of Luigi's aerials in general, or stats/physics changes like their weight and fall speed. All of these combine to create a completely different experience when playing as one of these clones in place of their counterparts.

Now, let's look at the first two character's revealed for the clone engine, Roy and Mewtwo. We already know that these two are returning vets coming from Melee, but let's assume that this is what they are looking for when deciding possible clone engine candidates. Roy's moveset is extremely reminiscent of Marth's, with some minor tweaks to help diversify their playstyles, just like all of the others. Mewtwo on the other hand has a lot to differentiate himself from his counterpart, Lucario. But, you have to remember that he's a returning vet so they already had a moveset to go by when creating all of his animations. Even still, Mewtwo took a supposed 700 hours to make.

Taking all of this into consideration, it looks like they are searching for characters that they won't have too difficult of a time with. I'm sure they wouldn't like to work on anything substantially harder than Mewtwo, the PMBR have lives of their own too you know.

Now I'm going to try to list all of the character's we've brought up throughout this thread by how difficult it would be to create them:

- Dark Samus
- Ninten
- Shadow (If he remains extremely similar to Sonic, meaning no projectiles like guns or chaos magic)
- Knuckles
- Pichu
- Telda
- Micaiah
- Claus/Masked Man
- Liquid Snake
- Sami/Andy
- Bowser Jr.
- Hector
- Tetra (It depends on how they'd want to make this character. She could be one rank higher if she had an extremely similar moveset like Tink or Shiek, but I don't see that happening)
- Black Shadow/Ganondorf (Even though they'd just have to create a model for Black Shadow, creating Dorfs sword moveset could be a challenge)
- Lip (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Could possibly play like Lucas or Ness and go up one rank)
- Lyn (She could be higher on the list if she's more of a clone, but because of peoples expectations, I've decided to place her here)
- Tails (Flight animations and balancing a speedy character who can possibly float cancel, definitely a challenge)
- Dixie (The hair would be a challenge)
- Skull Kid (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Samurai Goroh (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Waluigi (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Krystal (First ever staff user, could be a challenge)
- Toad (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Tom Nook (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Kamek (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Mach Rider (Possible projectiles, bike riding, and whip/tethers would be a challenge)
- Sukapon (Even if the model would be simple, creating such a unique moveset would be a challenge. Also, unorthodox hit-boxes. Balancing a character like this might be extremely difficult)
- Pokemon Trainer/Red (Would require a creative moveset, and balancing a character who can possibly throw out random pokemon via pokeballs would be a nightmare)
- Boo (A character that is always floating... I expect this would be extremely challenging)
- Paper Mario (Since people seem to want his moveset have his party members come in to help him, I've decided to place him here because of all the extra modeling work that would require or if that's even possible to begin with)
- Pulse & Minun (See Ice Climbers)
- King K. Rool (With his only possible base being DDD, and even that is far stretched, he would be extremely challenging)
- Ridley (Animating winged character's is never easy, and creating a suitable model with fluid animations would be a challenge)
- Issac (Moveset would require a lot of creativity, his psyenergy would be a challenge)
- Saki (Possibly the hardest of them all. Would require a lot of work and projectile capabilities)

*change list*
- Black Shadow/Ganondorf moved up 1 tier due to possible challenges creating a decent sword moveset for Dorf

Alright, that was quite a challenge. If I've missed any characters or you really disagree on someones placement on the list please tell me.

If all of the characters you are up-voting are in the orange/red, there's a problem. That doesn't mean that all characters in the red aren't possible, but the chances of them making multiple characters that would take that amount of work is most likely extremely low. Please remember that the PMBR are just a group of people who are making this amazing mod in their free time. Be true to yourself and vote for who you want but be respectful and think about their limitations when creating these characters.

I can't believe you put Boo up there... haha.

I think Dixie would actually be a tier lower because of her hair animations as mentioned a few pages back (by Xebenkeck I think).

Bowser Jr. would be a tier higher. He would literally have all the same moves except for the Down B probably.

Skapon would be a tier higher. His hit-boxes wouldn't be unorthodox because he doesn't actually stretch that much, and his moveset would be simple (kicks and punches that are easy to base off other characters)

Toad would also be higher if he's based off Mario.

Even though Plusle & Minun are in the bottom tier, I'd put them even lower. How would you manage things like an Up B without a Belay? The whole idea sounds like a coding nightmare.

 

[cmart]

Oh a difficulty tier list...? I can comment on that at least. Assuming balance has anything to do with difficulty is laughable - even if a character is a straight clone with physics/hitbox edits, they would still require extensive balancing work. Ranking someone higher or lower because they would be "harder to balance" is meaningless. On the other hand, I see difficulty to animate being downplayed significantly. I get the feeling you guys don't even know how many animations a character requires (there's a reason we quote 700 hours for Mewtwo), and if there is no animation base to work from, that's a huge black mark against a character - doesn't matter how "simple" the moveset might be. Finally, unique move properties aren't really much of a hinderance, but article availability is.

Aside from those observations, that difficulty list is more sensible than most things I see batted around here.

 

[Fortress]

Aside from those observations, that difficulty list is more sensible than most things I see batted around here.

Come on, mang... Skull Kid was sensible

 

[Saito]

Aside from those observations, that difficulty list is more sensible than most things I see batted around here.

I get the feeling that cmart is PMBR.

But basically what I've gathered from that post is that quite a few of these people need to be bumped down a few tiers.
Tom Nook, Krystal, Lip, and the Skull Kid are all probably getting thrown into the red zone. I'm sure that more could be added but I'm too tired to think about it right now.

 

[cmart]

I get the feeling that cmart is PMBR.

You would be correct

 

[Fortress]

You would be correct

See? I'm not the only one who didn't know that.

 

[cmart]

See? I'm not the only one who didn't know that.

You would also be correct : {

 

[Banjodorf]

Come on, mang... Skull Kid was sensible

Unless I missed something, I don't *think* he was talking about Skull Kid or even Claus. It's just a matter of acting like these things take zero amounts of time for almost total clone characters is a bit stupid, and I think I'm even guilty of that myself.

I was however under the impression that any new characters would probably be released on an individual Nash's, so as to allow as much time to integrate them and make them a unique fit as possible.

Hmm.

 

[Starcutter]

that list from a bit back is a bit misguided. Pokemon trainer should be in orange, not red

 

[shinhed-echi]

As Saito said, the character's are just placed into their respective tiers and are in no particular order. I would consider Saki to still be in the red because of an ability to rapid fire his projectile(s), increased sword range, fast falling, and speed. Do you even understands what that entails? That just sounds way to good, and would require a ton of playtesting and balancing, more so than any other character I would argue (expect possibly Sukapon). Animations like that aren't easy either, and they would have to touch up on his model in order for it to have the same quality of the others. "Might" not be as challenging as someone like King K. Rool, but it's still quite a difficult challenge.

Don't get me wrong, I gave the dude a half vote myself and would love to see him included, but the premise of his moveset is godly on top of everything else.

To me, the most logical step towards making Black Shadow/Ganondorf would be putting Black Shadow in Dorfs slot and putting Dorf in the clone slot. This means that the only thing they would have to do for Black Shadow is possibly adjust some hit boxes (they shouldn't have to, they can easily make a model that has the same proportions of Dorf) and replace all of Dorfs textures. Testing to make sure the texture hack doesn't glitch out is implied and isn't that difficult. Unless I'm missing a step, please tell me if I'm missing something important there.

1.- So... balancing the character. That doesn't sound significantly harder to do than say... Making Ridley work while looking professional, or Pokemon Trainer spawning pokemon or a bicycle. JUST balancing isn't nearly in the same league as either of those. Saki is (could be) just an alternatively balanced Pit, that could even be made much lighter to compensate. Heck, fast-falling itself brings a whole new array of disadvantages too. I still see Fox/Falco better than what I´m describing.

2.- Again, this isn't a Saki-exclusive excuse, this can be said for ANY character they come up with. Sure, they'd have to tweak some animations like when he fires (so that he doesn't look like he's holding a bow), but holding a gun staticly isn't THAT hard compared to other things they've done so far. A lot of the animations needed (except gun holding) could even be found inside Pit's own moveset animations.

3.- Sure, everybody jumps immediately to the part where Black Shadow is taking over Gdorf's moveset... What about Ganondorf? Where's he being cloned from? How will his animations adapt there? He's not magically getting a unique moveset either. He's going to be given someone else's moveset, and the ammount of tweaking done to him will have to be significant to keep him in character. Will he gain Samus' charged shot? Then the animation must be tweaked so that it doesn't look like her. Will he be another Link clone? Then he can't have bow+arrow animations. Will he be a heavier Zelda clone? Then he has to be tweaked to not look feminine while executing moves. Or will he fire electrical shocks a´la Pikachu from his cheeks? Etc.

 

[Banjodorf]

I'm thinking Ike would be a good base for Canondorf. With some Samus or Pikachu thrown in it could work.

If only he could have something like Mewtwo's levitate skill. Hah!

 

[OrangeSodaGuy]

I'm thinking Ike would be a good base for Canondorf. With some Samus or Pikachu thrown in it could work.

If only he could have something like Mewtwo's levitate skill. Hah!

I was thinking that a move similar to Ike's F-smash would work well as a new Ganon Utilt. Maybe give him a Nair similar to Ike's that uses a sword as well. Changing him TOO much might alienate old-school Ganon players, but it would still be neat to see some canon moves to replace the moves no one really used.

I would also suggest an "energy ball" attack reminiscent of his OoT fireballs as a new Neutral B. Assuming that articles are still impossible to add, they could try making it a close-range move similar to the rasengan out of Naruto, maybe.

 

[Arteen]

As far as JCOnyx's list goes, I'm surprised that Isaac is nearly at the bottom of the red zone, even after Ridley, who I figure would be an animation nightmare.

At a basic level, he can be cloned from someone like Link. He has a similar body shape and weapon, so he can borrow a lot of animations from him. He can borrow not just basic attacks, but other miscellaneous animations such as getting up from ledges. Many of his basic attacks such as sword strikes and kicks can be the same, allowing the Project M team to pick and choose which of those moves to replace with custom ones.

Incorporating all his psynergy abilities would take a sizable effort, but he doesn't need a 100% unique moveset.

 

[Banjodorf]

Incorporating all his psynergy abilities would take a sizable effort, but he doesn't need a 100% unique moveset.

Agreed. I'd put him in Orange, because as far as the list goes he'd only need a few unique ones. I mean, it's a sizable effort, but not as much as Rids. (I'm of course still arguing for a Bowser-fied K. Rool, but I'll work on that later.)

Push and Quake are the only necessities in terms of specials, and as far as I know they both have a basis in the game. Sword moves can be tweaked versions of Links and Roy or Marth's attacks. Maybe?

 

[HamsterPants]

Time to toss my vote in.

+1 Vote:
-Saki (all of my yes)
-Ridley
-Dark Samus (a faster Samus with some visual Mewtwo quirks? sure!)
-Paper Mario
-Black Shadow (he'd be nice to have for people who liked playing the original clone Ganon anyway)

1/2 Vote:
K. Rool (he'd be hard to pull off, but very awesome.)

-1 Vote:
-Dixie (I hate monkeys - they're humiliating to lose against. Also, her hair defies all logic and reason. Yes that's actually my reason, monkeys really do annoy me, so I'd prefer to see something else in the slot.)

 

[QQQQQQQ7777777]

-1 Vote:
-Dixie (I hate monkeys - they're humiliating to lose against. Also, her hair defies all logic and reason. Yes that's actually my reason, monkeys really do annoy me, so I'd prefer to see something else in the slot.)

I know right? and don`t even get me started at the improbability of Sonic actually moving at the speed of sound. If that were true then the fastest speedrun for the entire first sonic game would be less then 10 seconds. What about the fact that Mario`s fire balls can actually bounce off surfaces?

 

[Malion]

I think someone holds a grudge because they had poo flung at them

 

[andalsoandy]

I would just like to point out to everyone down-voting characters based on the judgement that they're not bringing enough to the table... this is a clone engine we are talking about. Think realistically here for a moment, do you really think the PMBR want to make 5 completely new characters from scratch? That's completely ridiculous and it will never happen. Think of how many hours they would have to put in to do that, give them some slack.

If we look at other clones already within the game, there's Falco, Wolf, Ganondorf, Tink, Luigi, and Lucas. All of these character's have movesets that are similar to their counterparts. What sets them apart from one another are minor tweaks to some of their moves mechanics like Falco's Dair, slight changes to their movesets like all of Luigi's aerials in general, or stats/physics changes like their weight and fall speed. All of these combine to create a completely different experience when playing as one of these clones in place of their counterparts.

Now, let's look at the first two character's revealed for the clone engine, Roy and Mewtwo. We already know that these two are returning vets coming from Melee, but let's assume that this is what they are looking for when deciding possible clone engine candidates. Roy's moveset is extremely reminiscent of Marth's, with some minor tweaks to help diversify their playstyles, just like all of the others. Mewtwo on the other hand has a lot to differentiate himself from his counterpart, Lucario. But, you have to remember that he's a returning vet so they already had a moveset to go by when creating all of his animations. Even still, Mewtwo took a supposed 700 hours to make.

Taking all of this into consideration, it looks like they are searching for characters that they won't have too difficult of a time with. I'm sure they wouldn't like to work on anything substantially harder than Mewtwo, the PMBR have lives of their own too you know.

Now I'm going to try to list all of the character's we've brought up throughout this thread by how difficult it would be to create them:

- Dark Samus
- Ninten
- Shadow (If he remains extremely similar to Sonic, meaning no projectiles like guns or chaos magic)
- Knuckles
- Pichu
- Telda
- Micaiah
- Claus/Masked Man
- Liquid Snake
- Sami/Andy
- Bowser Jr.
- Hector
- Tetra (It depends on how they'd want to make this character. She could be one rank higher if she had an extremely similar moveset like Tink or Shiek, but I don't see that happening)
- Black Shadow/Ganondorf (Even though they'd just have to create a model for Black Shadow, creating Dorfs sword moveset could be a challenge)
- Lip (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge. Could possibly play like Lucas or Ness and go up one rank)
- Lyn (She could be higher on the list if she's more of a clone, but because of peoples expectations, I've decided to place her here)
- Tails (Flight animations and balancing a speedy character who can possibly float cancel, definitely a challenge)
- Dixie (The hair would be a challenge)
- Skull Kid (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Samurai Goroh (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Waluigi (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Krystal (First ever staff user, could be a challenge)
- Toad (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Tom Nook (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Kamek (Would require a creative moveset, could be a challenge)
- Mach Rider (Possible projectiles, bike riding, and whip/tethers would be a challenge)
- Sukapon (Even if the model would be simple, creating such a unique moveset would be a challenge. Also, unorthodox hit-boxes. Balancing a character like this might be extremely difficult)
- Pokemon Trainer/Red (Would require a creative moveset, and balancing a character who can possibly throw out random pokemon via pokeballs would be a nightmare)
- Boo (A character that is always floating... I expect this would be extremely challenging)
- Paper Mario (Since people seem to want his moveset have his party members come in to help him, I've decided to place him here because of all the extra modeling work that would require or if that's even possible to begin with)
- Pulse & Minun (See Ice Climbers)
- King K. Rool (With his only possible base being DDD, and even that is far stretched, he would be extremely challenging)
- Ridley (Animating winged character's is never easy, and creating a suitable model with fluid animations would be a challenge)
- Issac (Moveset would require a lot of creativity, his psyenergy would be a challenge)
- Saki (Possibly the hardest of them all. Would require a lot of work and projectile capabilities)

*change list*
- Black Shadow/Ganondorf moved up 1 tier due to possible challenges creating a decent sword moveset for Dorf

Alright, that was quite a challenge. If I've missed any characters or you really disagree on someones placement on the list please tell me.

If all of the characters you are up-voting are in the orange/red, there's a problem. That doesn't mean that all characters in the red aren't possible, but the chances of them making multiple characters that would take that amount of work is most likely extremely low. Please remember that the PMBR are just a group of people who are making this amazing mod in their free time. Be true to yourself and vote for who you want but be respectful and think about their limitations when creating these characters.

-Sukapon's moveset involves punches and kicks with optional projectiles. Even if you wanted to use projectiles in the moveset, just clone a character with a lot of projectiles. Their bone structures do not have to be similar. Also, the model would be fairly easy to animate in BrawlBox. I'd say Sukapon would be the easiest character to make.
-K. Rool could copy Dedede's animations but be cloned off of another character with projectiles.
-Ridley's animations could be copied off of Charizard for the most part. He's probably a lot easier to make than half of the other characters in the orange tier.
-Dixie's hair is literally like three or four more bones to animate. It's no reason to bring her down at all.

I have about four months of experience using BrawlBox. It's definitely time-consuming to make character animations, but for some characters like Dixie and K. Rool, it's a matter of modifying currently existing animations enough to make them unique.

 

[Beckstat]

Ninten would be super easy to redesign and be different from Ness
Moveset
Standard Special - PK Beam - Readies a fast and bouncing beam, which can be angled in any of the 8 directions (gets stronger when charged).
Side Special - PK Brainshock - Casts a slow pulse forth, which can induce Confusion (causes dizzyness).
Up Special - 4th-Dimension Slip - Teleports to the desired location. This gives Ninten a 100% chance of escaping.
Down Special - PSI Power-Shield - Engulfs himself in a protective shield for a little bit. This protects him from all attacks such as physical and energy based attacks. However, using too much will wear Ninten out. Final Smash - PK Techno - Ninten jumps in the air then fires intense blasts of PSI all over the stage. The attacks direction can be controlled If you do not press the attack button, Ninten will again shout "PK Techno!" and shoot a powerful beam (similar to Lucario's Aura Storm).

 

[TopTierPichu]

I don't think it would be possible for him to say PK Techno

 

[Shin F.]

Ninten would be super easy to redesign and be different from Ness
Moveset
Standard Special - PK Beam - Readies a fast and bouncing beam, which can be angled in any of the 8 directions (gets stronger when charged).
Side Special - PK Brainshock - Casts a slow pulse forth, which can induce Confusion (causes dizzyness).
Up Special - 4th-Dimension Slip - Teleports to the desired location. This gives Ninten a 100% chance of escaping.
Down Special - PSI Power-Shield - Engulfs himself in a protective shield for a little bit. This protects him from all attacks such as physical and energy based attacks. However, using too much will wear Ninten out. Final Smash - PK Techno - Ninten jumps in the air then fires intense blasts of PSI all over the stage. The attacks direction can be controlled If you do not press the attack button, Ninten will again shout "PK Techno!" and shoot a powerful beam (similar to Lucario's Aura Storm).

PK Brainshock is one I didn't think of. That's a good alternative to PK Hypnosis. 4th-D Slip is the one I had for his recovery, but the 100% escape rate shouldn't translate to Smash. Power Shield is way too overpowered the way you described it. We had some discussion over good ideas for it and agreed that it could be like G&W's Bucket with a PK Beam firing from it when full. PK Techno isn't even a thing, which is why I instead had the strongest version of PK Beam as his best bet for a FS and Quick Up as Ninten's answer to Lucas' Offense Up.

Actually, though, if one of his normal specials is PK Hypnosis, then another FS possibility could be a suped-up PK Brainshock that could work like a larger scale version of ZSS' Final Smash.

Not sure if you saw them, so here were my main posts about him.
http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...ts-updated-11-13.341479/page-57#post-16015925
http://smashboards.com/threads/clon...ts-updated-11-13.341479/page-63#post-16019693

 

[HamsterPants]

I know right? and don`t even get me started at the improbability of Sonic actually moving at the speed of sound. If that were true then the fastest speedrun for the entire first sonic game would be less then 10 seconds. What about the fact that Mario`s fire balls can actually bounce off surfaces?

Oh man I know! You'd think people would notice these glaring flaws. lol

I think someone holds a grudge because they had poo flung at them

Yeah pretty much. I've had a phobia of monkeys since early childhood (though it doesn't persist anymore, now I just don't like them). Take it or leave it, that's just my opinion. I figured it was a worthy vote on the grounds that I'd be dishonest otherwise.

 

[andalsoandy]

I don't think it would be possible for him to say PK Techno

Sound splicing. I made some Melee announcer calls for Brawl characters a while ago.
Then again you could record a new voice all together.

 

[Shin F.]

Sound splicing. I made some Melee announcer calls for Brawl characters a while ago.
Then again you could record a new voice all together.

I'd rather just have him not say his attacks and use Ness' 64 or Melee voice clips for the rest. They could try to sound splice PK Beam or Hypnosis, but I don't think they should bother. I mean, Lucas doesn't say anything for Offense Up and it's fine.

 

[TopTierPichu]

they could just make him say PK

 

[andalsoandy]

I'd rather just have him not say his attacks and use Ness' 64 or Melee voice clips for the rest. They could try to sound splice PK Beam or Hypnosis, but I don't think they should bother. I mean, Lucas doesn't say anything for Offense Up and it's fine.

They could totally splice Ness' 64 voice into him saying PK Beam or PK Techno. Heck, if they even needed to, they could use parts of Kirby's voice.

 

[Xebenkeck]

Blatently ripping SFX from different games is an easy way to get a C+D.

Honestly the biggest worry I have about Mewtwo and Roy is they use Melee's SFX. Which legally I think would be enough for a C+D as those would be licensed to Nintendo. That IS copyright infringement.

 

[CardiganBoy]

Ninten would be super easy to redesign and be different from Ness
Moveset
Standard Special - PK Beam - Readies a fast and bouncing beam, which can be angled in any of the 8 directions (gets stronger when charged).
Side Special - PK Brainshock - Casts a slow pulse forth, which can induce Confusion (causes dizzyness).
Up Special - 4th-Dimension Slip - Teleports to the desired location. This gives Ninten a 100% chance of escaping.
Down Special - PSI Power-Shield - Engulfs himself in a protective shield for a little bit. This protects him from all attacks such as physical and energy based attacks. However, using too much will wear Ninten out. Final Smash - PK Techno - Ninten jumps in the air then fires intense blasts of PSI all over the stage. The attacks direction can be controlled If you do not press the attack button, Ninten will again shout "PK Techno!" and shoot a powerful beam (similar to Lucario's Aura Storm).

Great moveset right there but i think he should use a blue, red and white striped shirt, and his model should be like his official clay model (just like that picture)
He also should be able to use a slingshot, bottle rockets.

 

[andalsoandy]

Blatently ripping SFX from different games is an easy way to get a C+D.

Honestly the biggest worry I have about Mewtwo and Roy is they use Melee's SFX. Which legally I think would be enough for a C+D as those would be licensed to Nintendo. That IS copyright infringement.

Didn't quite think about that.

Then again, there still is the option to just record new voices for Ninten, but if Mewtwo and Roy already take SFX from Melee then what's the point of hesitating using 64s SFX?

By the way, just a quick A move idea, but what if his forward air was a bat swing that acted like Marth's f-air?

 

[Shin F.]

Didn't quite think about that.

Then again, there still is the option to just record new voices for Ninten, but if Mewtwo and Roy already take SFX from Melee then what's the point of hesitating using 64s SFX?

Besides that, if you think about it, the entire mod uses Brawl resources. If Nintendo really wanted to send a C+D, they wouldn't need the Melee and 64 sounds as an excuse.

 

[Xebenkeck]

Using the stuff on Brawl wouldn't be an issue because we BOUGHT the game.

Using stuff from melee IN brawl could be seen as blatent Copyright Infringement.

But Nintendo hasn't C+D yet so w/e.

 

[andalsoandy]

Using the stuff on Brawl wouldn't be an issue because we BOUGHT the game.

Using stuff from melee IN brawl could be seen as blatent Copyright Infringement.

But Nintendo hasn't C+D yet so w/e.

Don't say 'yet'...

now I'm nervous.

 

[CardiganBoy]

Why just dont use sweet 8-Bits SFX for his respective PK, i mean they are using Mewtwos battle cry from older Pokemon games for his entrance animation....

 

[Sanity's_Theif]

...Yes? I took engineering-level statistics. And I've worked in medical clinical studies, so I know all about power and interpreting data based on a small pool. Judging by the way you're pulling numbers out of your ***, you're the one making asinine statements. We currently have ~150, not just "50+". Also, it's an on-going poll, or is that too complicated for you? Finally, yes, the proportions are currently smaller than what you'd want, but they still have power to make estimates, or did you never learn what confidence intervals are in your stats class?

50+ is a good guess for this thread considering I don't follow it, and 40,000+ was the download count last I checked for P:M, I didn't pull them out of my ass

150 is still WAY too small

You HAVE to be lying that you took statistics, if you did you must not have been paying attention because you forgot one of the most important rules of applying a survey to the general population, THE SAMPLE SURVEYED HAS TO BE RANDOM

This isn't random, this is a board for competitive smash players that represents a very specific group of people, that alone makes this "poll" as a representation of what the majority wants, invalid

If you wanted to make this more official, as I've said before, find people who download the game but aren't competitive or go on competitive forums and take poll samples from them as well, don't forget that these people matter too. Or better yet overall, just the PMBR put a poll on their download site, that is if they actually cared to even do such a thing in the first place which it seems like they don't which is fine, but that also makes this thread pointless.

And I'm sure you know since you've taken statistics, that your margin of error for your (and may I remind you, biased) sample population is 8% doing the math. 8% is considered a laughable margin of error, and of course you won't believe me but just google this since you obviously forgot everything about statistics:

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Govern...s-headline-out-of-poll-with-8-margin-of-error
http://transformetrics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10901

You can do some more research in this specific regard

You can see on this page the download count for P:M is close to 90,000 now actually:
http://projectmgame.com/en/download

Even if you wanted the standard confidence level for this population, you would need closer to 400 votes here, but a good confidence level would require closer to 700. Of course you won't believe me again, and since just reading from my statistics books wouldn't help, here's some basic googling to help you out:

https://www.surveymonkey.com/mp/sample-size/
http://www.robertniles.com/stats/margin.shtml
http://www.isixsigma.com/tools-temp...rgin-error-and-confidence-levels-made-simple/

**** Even Wikipedia can be used here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sampling_(statistics)#Sampling_frame

It doesn't even matter if you calculate your confidence level because what you have here is a perfect example of "Accident Sampling" the definition of this being: " a type of nonprobability sampling which involves the sample being drawn from that part of the population which is close to hand. That is, a population is selected because it is readily available and convenient." Which is exactly what this is, taking polls on the smashboards is just close to hand, convenient and readily available. But right in the definition is this, "The researcher using such a sample cannot scientifically make generalizations about the total population from this sample because it would not be representative enough."

So there you have it, this thread is a farce at best

 

[shinhed-echi]

Why just dont use sweet 8-Bits SFX for his respective PK, i mean they are using Mewtwos battle cry from older Pokemon games for his entrance animation....

Genius!
I like this idea!

Although can't anyone just... you know... record and tweak the voice so that it sounds like a Mother character (in SSB)? All I'd need is a Microphone (which I have) and Audacity (which I have) and I'd recreate any of those PK voices myself.

But if all else fails, I think having the 8-bit sound font for Ninten is a great idea.

 

[MLGF]

The audience for Project M IS competitive Smashers, making the survey audience in the topic actually perfect. I don't see the backroom should appeal to demographics that aren't the target audience for this mod anyways. Your argument about random surveys doesn't work, it's just inherently flawed.

 

[KingOfNothing]

I'll go ahead and vote.

+1
Ganondorf/Black Shadow
Ridley
King K. Rool
Masked Man (honestly, just want the addition of another Mother character)
Isaac

1/2
Shadow
Dark Samus
Lyn
Sukapon

-1
Pichu
Reason:
I think we really don't need another pokemon in PM.

Toad
I also think we don't need another Mario character, especially one I don't think is significant enough, or will have an interesting moveset.

Bowser Jr.
Same reason as Toad, though could possibly have an ok moveset.

Dixie Kong
I just don't like the character, nor do I think she will add much. I support K. Rool as the 3rd DK rep.

Also, a bit curious on something. So, we aren't allowed adding a character that wasn't referenced in Brawl (in some way), yet we have a Castlevania stage (yet, not Castlevania character allowed?). Why is that?

 

[andalsoandy]

Also, a bit curious on something. So, we aren't allowed adding a character that wasn't referenced in Brawl (in some way), yet we have a Castlevania stage (yet, not Castlevania character allowed?). Why is that?

C+D. It has to do with the licensing of the characters in Brawl.

Also, I hear a lot of people are wanting Luigi's Mansion back.

 

[CardiganBoy]

Genius!
I like this idea!

Although can't anyone just... you know... record and tweak the voice so that it sounds like a Mother character (in SSB)? All I'd need is a Microphone (which I have) and Audacity (which I have) and I'd recreate any of those PK voices myself.

But if all else fails, I think having the 8-bit sound font for Ninten is a great idea.

Haha thanks.

And recording voices wouldnt be too hard i guess, i think it would be great to have voices for smash attacks and taunts and 8-bit sounds for his specials.

 

[trojanpooh]

The audience for Project M IS competitive Smashers, making the survey audience in the topic actually perfect. I don't see the backroom should appeal to demographics that aren't the target audience for this mod anyways. Your argument about random surveys doesn't work, it's just inherently flawed.

https://plus.google.com/105828946404202947372/posts/QwcYSjKcXXx