New Characters for Project M Discussion Thread (Voting Closed)

[Hungry Headcrab]

However, that being said, Star Fox already has all the characters it needs already playable.

I don't know. For symmetry's sake I kind of want Leon playable, then Falco has his rival as well. Also, Team Star Fox vs. Team Star Wolf would be pretty hype.

I really have no reasoning aside from that though...

 

[arcticfox8]

The same could be said about Advance Wars

That's some serious shade tho

 

[ChronoBound]

The same could be said about Advance Wars

Advance Wars has at least six games (just counting the games developed by Intelligent Systems), and NO playable characters.

Star Fox has six games (counting the unreleased Star Fox 2), and THREE playable characters.

 

[trojanpooh]

Advance Wars has at least six games (just counting the games developed by Intelligent Systems), and NO playable characters.

Star Fox has six games (counting the unreleased Star Fox 2), and THREE playable characters.

Statistics are statistics. If you look at franchise history, impact on the industry, how recognizable the characters are, etc Star Fox has much more going for it in that people actually know what it is. Not to knock it, they're fun enough games, but it's hardly a Nintendo icon.

 

[ChronoBound]

Statistics are statistics. If you look at franchise history, impact on the industry, how recognizable the characters are, etc Star Fox has much more going for it in that people actually know what it is. Not to knock it, they're fun enough games, but it's hardly a Nintendo icon.

Its definitely the most notable Nintendo franchise lacking a playable character at this point aside from the Miis, Golden Sun, and Punch-Out.

The GBA/DS games also sold very well in the West.

 

[Saito]

Accuracy to the character? Yes! Every other character moveset has at least some basis in their canonical abilities, aside from those who didn't have attacks at all when they became Smash characters. Those, I'm fine with because the lack of material makes it necessary, and I'm also fine with moves being borrowed from their allies like Ness and Zelda. What I don't like is when characters with perfectly valid forms of attack have moves that neither they nor their allies ever used, like Ganondorf.

To be fair, Ganondorf in Melee was based off of his Ocarina of time appearance.

In Ocarina of time he had 3 moves.

#1, he punches the ground and causes a shockwave
#2, He fires a blast at you.
#3, He fires a volley of blasts at you.

That's it.

I mean they kept the accuracy to the character by giving him powerful attacks that were infused with magic. There was no projectiles in his moveset though and that is a definite possibility.

For Brawl Ganondorf though, I think they just wanted to keep him the same instead of giving him a new sword based moveset.


Technically Ganondorf from OoT has 4 moves though. He can reflect magic with his cape.
Ganon should have an auto reflect on any projectile that hits his cape from henceforth.

 

[trojanpooh]

Its definitely the most notable Nintendo franchise lacking a playable character at this point aside from the Miis and Punch-Out.

The GBA/DS games also sold very well in the West.

I can't tell if you're being serious or not right now.

 

[Fortress]

Its definitely the most notable Nintendo franchise

Punch Out

Which had two titles under its non-proverbial belt.

 

[arcticfox8]

I'd be all for Little Mac if he weren't so likely for Sm4sh

 

[ChronoBound]

Which had two titles under its non-proverbial belt.

Punch-Out has five games.

Punch-Out (Arcade) (very different game from Punch-Out NES)
Super Punch-Out (Arcade) (very different game from Punch-Out SNES)
Punch-Out
Super Punch-Out
Punch-Out (Wii)

 

[Shin F.]

Its definitely the most notable Nintendo franchise lacking a playable character at this point aside from the Miis and Punch-Out.

Except Golden Sun... but honestly, at this point I don't see how Isaac could be excluded unless PMBR decides he's too likely for Smash 4 or too much trouble to make.

Spoiler

 

[ChronoBound]

Except Golden Sun... but honestly, at this point I don't see how Isaac could be excluded unless PMBR decides he's too likely for Smash 4 or too much trouble to make.

Spoiler

I actually editted my post to include Golden Sun. Aside from those three, (two of which are going to be getting a playable character in Smash 4 anyway due to the leak), Advance Wars and Golden Sun would be very good choices for the Project M team to give playable characters since Sakurai is probably going to overlook those series.

 

[Solbliminal]

Hey. If Paper Mario gets in, he should totally use the Brawl sticker book. He would be op as ****.

 

[ChronoBound]

Looking at some GBA sales for just the United States. Both GBA Golden Sun games sold extremely well. The first GBA Advance Wars sold slightly better than FE7, while Advance Wars 2 sold slightly worse.

This was their life-to-dates as of August 2005 according to the NPD:

GOLDEN SUN - 743,327
GOLDEN SUN 2: THE LOST AGE - 471,300
ADVANCE WARS - 401,147
FIRE EMBLEM - 389,974
ADVANCE WARS 2: BLACK HOLE RISING - 365,533

What is also interesting looking at NPD archives is that Melee's American sales were higher than that of every single GBA game in America, unless you combined Ruby and Sapphire together.

 

[red9rd]

considering how Ness/Lucas are far less popular characters than the likes of Falco/Fox both inside and outside the Smash Bros. fanbase.

Ha such a bold claim

 

[ChronoBound]

Ha such a bold claim

Star Fox is definitely a far more well known and popular series outside of Smash Bros. There has only been one game in the series released internationally for Mother. I would probably venture to say more people have played Star Fox 64 alone, than all the people who played the Mother trilogy combined.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Star Fox is definitely a far more well known and popular series outside of Smash Bros. There has only been one game in the series released internationally for Mother. I would probably venture to say more people have played Star Fox 64 alone, than all the people who played the Mother trilogy combined.

Broski, there's totally ways to substantiate that claim. I'm going to go look up some numbers now.

 

[Hungry Headcrab]

Are people as adverse to another Metal Gear character as they are to another Sonic character?

The more I think about it, the more I think Liquid Snake would a good addition to the roster. Most of it is just my love for Metal Gear, I'm sure, but I honestly see some potential in the idea.

Spoiler

Here's the way I see it:

Liquid would obviously be a clone of Snake. They are twins, after all. Moreover, I like the idea of a Snake clone as a part of the roster simply because Snake is an odd character, and if his physics, tools, and play-style are changed on a new character you get someone that feels entirely different. The same goes for the possibility of an Advance Wars based Snake clone as well, but I'm mostly indifferent to that idea whereas Liquid gets me hyped.

I would see Liquid as similar to Snake, but with the aerial mobility that Snake lacks. In addition, he would rely less on his tools and weapons than Snake does, and would be more based on physical attacks that didn't have as much knock-back as Snake's moves. This would give him a different kind of combo game altogether when compared to his twin. That's not to say that Liquid would not have tools of his own, but they would be made to assist his approach, an area in which Snake sorely lacks.

Also, his recovery has to be awesome, because this guy just refuses to die.

I could go into more detail and try to think up some specifics, but I don't expect this idea to pick up much traction. I just want to see what people think. Before you cast your judgement though, think of how hype-inducing the Snake vs. Liquid match-up would be...

Gah! The idea just gets me so excited!

Spoiler

 

[Fortress]

3.0 THERE WILL BE MULLETS.

Mulletmania aside, I can see where you're coming from with that. Mario and Luigi have such similar movesets, but they preform so very differently in terms of trajectories and personal physics, that they're indeed their own characters. It'd be very interesting to see the same thing applied to Snake.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Earthbound.

"The game sold 140,000 copies in North America and about twice that number in Japan." So 520,000 sold, cool.

Mother 3: Approx. 365,000 sales, and 100,000 downloads for the fan translation. 985,000-ish units grabbed so far.

Mother 1+2 pack: Around 300,000 sales if you include the 'vale selection' release in which it came with some other games. 1.3 million, whew, and that's not even counting Mother 1.

Star Fox 64 sales?
4.03 million global

...

Well, ****, that's not even counting Star Fox 64 3D. ChronoBound is right! I'm not going to bother looking up sales figures for Mother, but I do know it cracked at least 300,000. Not enough to beat Fox. /toptier

Edit Trivia: Mother trilogy doesn't even beat Star Fox 64 sales in North America. Seriously where the **** did this go wrong

 

[Fortress]

Star Fox 64 sales?
4.03 global

Come on, man. They had to have sold like, at least fifty.

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

Come on, man. They had to have sold like, at least fifty.

-_-

I edited

 

[PsionicSabreur]

Star Fox is definitely a far more well known and popular series outside of Smash Bros. There has only been one game in the series released internationally for Mother. I would probably venture to say more people have played Star Fox 64 alone, than all the people who played the Mother trilogy combined.

That certainly doesn't prove that the Mother trilogy is unpopular. Earthbound is doing extremely well on the Wii U Virtual Console.

 

[ChronoBound]

That certainly doesn't prove that the Mother trilogy is unpopular. Earthbound is doing extremely well on the Wii U Virtual Console.

Wii U is also the worst selling Nintendo home console ever. Its tracking below even the GameCube for example. So to say its "doing well" on the Wii U's Virtual Console is useless without hard numbers or context.

 

[red9rd]

And the popularity of Mothers fan base is one Nintendos biggest.

 

[ChronoBound]

And the popularity of Mothers fan base is one Nintendos biggest.

Nope.

Bigger than Mario: Nope
Bigger than DK: Nope
Bigger than Zelda: Nope
Bigger than Metroid: Nope
Bigger than Kirby: Nope
Bigger than Star Fox: Nope
Bigger than Pokemon: Nope
Bigger than Fire Emblem: Nope
Bigger than Animal Crossing: Nope
Bigger than Wario: Nope

 

[Hungry Headcrab]

Nuh uh.

Big the Cat's fanbase am the biggest.

This argument is silly.

 

[red9rd]

Bigger than Mario:
Bigger than DK:
Bigger than Zelda:
Bigger than Metroid:
Bigger than Kirby:
Bigger than Star Fox:
Bigger than Pokemon:
Bigger than Fire Emblem:
Bigger than Animal Crossing:
Bigger than Wario:

I fixed it for you.

 

[ChronoBound]

I fixed it for you.

You would have to be in the most deluded and fanatical league of fanboy to believe an utterly niche series like Mother is even in the same league as console pushing series like Mario, Zelda, or Pokemon.

 

[Hungry Headcrab]

I fixed it for you.

Stop. Just, stop.

Mother isn't as big as other franchises. That's not a slight against the series, that's just a fact. It's nothing to get angry about.

 

[ChronoBound]

Stop. Just, stop.

Mother isn't as big as other franchises. That's not a slight against the series, that's just a fact. It's nothing to get angry about.

Its only the Mother fanboys that are getting angry with that reality.

Note, I am a big fan of EarthBound (see my username), however, I can't stand the fanboys for that series, but then again, I find fanboys to be obnoxious in general.

 

[Fortress]

We're arguing over which game is more popular now? The **** is this ****, GameFAQs?

 

[ChronoBound]

We're arguing over which game is more popular now? The **** is this ****, GameFAQs?

And its over something that should not even be debatable which makes it even more hilarious.

 

[red9rd]

^ Butthurt

Stop. Just, stop.

Mother isn't as big as other franchises. That's not a slight against the series, that's just a fact. It's nothing to get angry about.

Do you ever really hear about any other Nintendo fan base doing anything? It's usually Mother/Earthbound this and Starmen.net that

 

[Thane of Blue Flames]

^ Butthurt

Do you ever really hear about any other Nintendo fan base doing anything? It's usually Mother/Earthbound this and Starmen.net that

...

Anyone wanna rate Dark Samus' chances of being cloned? I might actually prefer her to Ridley, who just never seemed ... 'smashworthy' to me, ya know?

 

[ChronoBound]

...

Anyone wanna rate Dark Samus' chances of being cloned? I might actually prefer her to Ridley, who just never seemed ... 'smashworthy' to me, ya know?

If you understand the Metroid series mythos. I don't think you could say Ridley is less important by Dark Samus. Dark Samus was basically killed off for good at the end of the Prime trilogy anyway.

Ridley is the leader of the Space Pirates, and has been in every Metroid game except three (II, Prime 2, and Hunters). By comparison, Dark Samus has only been in two Metroid games (Prime 2 and Prime 3), and maybe you could stretch it to three if you include her alterego from the first Prime.

Ridley also is the reason why Samus even became a bounty hunter in the first place (his attack on her colony is what orphaned her).

For those familiar with the Zelda series:

Ridley is to Ganondorf as Vaati is to Dark Samus. Dark Samus and Vaati both don't make any appearances outside of the storyline they are allocated to (the Prime/Phazon trilogy for Dark Samus, and the Four Swords trilogy for Vaati).

^ Butthurt
t

I sure hope you were referring to yourself on that.

 

[Fortress]

...

Anyone wanna rate Dark Samus' chances of being cloned? I might actually prefer her to Ridley, who just never seemed ... 'smashworthy' to me, ya know?

I'll support you there. Ridley has some huge hype appeal, but, I have preferred Dark Samus in every way, shape and form since her first appearance. Even her music I find to be more enjoyable than Ridley's.

Christ, take it to a ****ing private message, you two.

 

[ChronoBound]

Christ, take it to a ****ing private message, you two.

What on earth am I doing wrong?

 

[Shin F.]

^ Butthurt

Do you ever really hear about any other Nintendo fan base doing anything?

Yes.

I love Earthbound - just look at my avatar and votes here to see that, but - it's not nearly as big as other series. I mean, it technically outsold Donkey Kong for a while on Wii U's VC when it was like $0.30 vs EB's $10, and it's one of the overall top sellers there so it clearly has a fairly large fanbase, but you really can't compare it to Mario, Zelda or Pokemon. Without Smash introducing so many people to it, it would probably be a footnote at best. Maybe it would be different if there were more games in the series, or if they were all international, but I feel like it would lose its charm if it was squeezed dry like some other games I could mention.

If you understand the Metroid series mythos. I don't think you could say Ridley is less important by Dark Samus. Dark Samus was basically killed off for good at the end of the Prime trilogy anyway.

Ridley is the leader of the Space Pirates, and has been in every Metroid game except three (II, Prime 2, and Hunters). By comparison, Dark Samus has only been in two Metroid games (Prime 2 and Prime 3), and maybe you could stretch it to three if you include her alterego from the first Prime.

Ridley also is the reason why Samus even became a bounty hunter in the first place (his attack on her colony is what orphaned her).

For those familiar with the Zelda series:

Ridley is to Ganondorf as Vaati is to Dark Samus. Dark Samus and Vaati both don't make any appearances outside of the storyline they are allocated to (the Prime/Phazon trilogy for Dark Samus, and the Four Swords trilogy for Vaati).




I sure hope you were referring to yourself on that.

This is all true, of course. The only reason I support Dark Samus over Ridley is because she seems more feasible from a gameplay perspective and less overall work. If I knew Ridley could be done well and seem natural, I would support him over Dark Samus in a heartbeat. I just have a hard time picturing it.

 

[Banjodorf]

Dark Samus over Ridley?

I mean, I can see it, if the PMBR really just wanted to use that clone slot and didn't want to put forth the effort for the fan favorite with a few difficulties.

However, I think they'd go with Ridley for oh-so-many reasons. I mean, there's PSAs to work with, lots of potential, and they've been shown to go above and beyond before. The only possible reason I can't see them putting in the effort for Ridley, is if he's in Smash 4.