N64 Controllers discussion

[SheerMadness]

IF they really did fix the sensitivity problems (still not convinced until I've used one myself) this is pretty big news. It pretty much solves our joystick problems. GC style sticks without sensitivity issues > OEM sticks IMO.

I tried rusty's (with the PCB fix) at Apex and it was glorious.

 

[Cedricwa]

I bet within five years everyone competitive will be using them haha

 

[Fireblaster]

I bet within five years everyone competitive will be using them haha

I doubt it. Using different hardware requires different movements and therefore requires relearning the joystick. Players like boomfan won't even use a greased original stick in a tournament because he prefers the gritty ungreased joysticks.

 

[Cedricwa]

I doubt it. Using different hardware requires different movements and therefore requires relearning the joystick. Players like boomfan won't even use a greased original stick in a tournament because he prefers the gritty ungreased joysticks.

Aha that sounds awful, but I can understand that. It's all preference. Personally it doesn't take me long to adapt to a new joystick (analog stick, whatever), so I don't mind new sticks.

 

[Cedricwa]

It just seems more worth it to me to get used to a stick that plays well and won't wear out anytime soon, like these "GC style" ones, than to play with a controller that I can notice every once in a while has gotten worse.

 

[Derek Bancarz]

i got a repair box one and its a thumb workout to move it ..... freaking sucks. Gotta do circles with it with my palm for about a week before i could consider using it. For real though, that stick i linked is amazing, doesn't take that long to get used to it, and when u do, you wont go back. Everything is preference, i think the chubby is best, then the original, but i just like the fact i can DI better and harder without worrying of wear of the stick, I MIGHT be going to apex, dont know yet, if so ill bring all of mine. Dont get me wrong the original is amazing, feels like a fighters joystick, and is downright classic, but it will wear out.

 

[KnitePhox]

i suppose delay is a preference, ok

i wana try the same kind you have out of curiosity

 

[Derek Bancarz]

thats where i got it from, my email from purchase history

 

[SheerMadness]

So did anyone go buy one of derek's GC style sticks?

Marbles?

Tryphox?

 

[charlocharlie]

I'm going to buy a couple in a week or two and possibly a N64 to USB adapter to test the stepping issue specifically.

I'm really curious about this.

 

[KnitePhox]

i got 1 of them, its not here yet

i have a feeling it will lag, though i hope it doesn't

 

[SheerMadness]

Well hurry up and get it tryphox.

Need more testimonials on this thing being legit before I throw money towards it.

 

[Derek Bancarz]

i bought one of dereks sticks

 

[Derek Bancarz]

3 infact.
If u play with emulator make sure u configure it in control panel first, otherwise on console its already set

 

[KnitePhox]

thanks for the heads up, ill test on console first

 

[tehz]

Isn't the mysterious Derek stick just the new version of the GC-style replacement sticks?

According to this post, they don't blow ass like the original release of the GC-style sticks. You can do smash attacks! (lol) But, the actual stick mechanism is a 38° potentiometer, so there is a "deadzone" around the outside ring as you've already reached maximum activation before you hit the edge of the stick. It'll be easier to dash dance, but tilting/low stick jumps will be a *****.

Th derek sticks are probably the best replacement stick you can buy and install with no soldering. But, they're still inferior to micro's PCB fix for the GC style sticks (which comes with a 60° potentiometer and can be calibrated in the firmware to fit whatever size restrictor plate you have in your controller). And everything's still inferior to installing a GC stick and GC restrictor and a microchip into a 64 controller.

 

[SheerMadness]

Yup that has to be what it is tehz. Thanks for clearing it up.

Didn't know they had fixed them. Pretty exciting.

In derek's vid he had no problem tilting.

But yah I guess I'll probably go ahead and buy one or two now.

 

[tehz]

yeah, tilts should work fine, but the "tilting window" on the joystick will be physically smaller. Just some muscle memory you'd have to re-learn, I guess.

 

[Cedricwa]

Same experience I had. I used my friends and yeah sometimes when I meant to tilt it would dash. Nothing you can't get used to though. I've ordered mine. It's worth to get used to it to have a reliable controller that will always play well.

 

[Derek Bancarz]

Yea tilting isnt an issue, it'll just take a bit of getting used to, happy I could help.
If anyone wants to see the repair box stick
http://www.ebay.com/itm/251506836088?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
I can make a review video on that one as well

 

[Compatible]

I actually just got the "Derek stick" and a unopened n64 controller I ordered today.

Played on a CRT:
Derek stick seems to be more sensitive to register a full movement of the stick. Couldn't notice any delay between Smash attacks on the two controllers. Pivot's and pivot F Smash's are definitely easier on Derek's stick. It seems tilts require less movement. The biggest difference was trying FF uairs off DL top plat or pivot Utilts. It was almost impossible at first but I got used to it with Derek's stick in about 5 mins. Haven't tested much of anything else as I am hungry.

9/10 only because it took time to get used to. (nothing will ever be like the original) Looking forward to Knitephox's review as well. WIll more than likely order a couple more for my other three controllers for when friends come over. Gonna also test it with Mario Party at the GF's tonight

 

[Derek Bancarz]

Awesome to hear man!, yea it takes some getting used to, pivot tilts did take me some time, FF uaris will come shortly as well. Dont got that original feel but I would say its the best replacement, and it will last for ever, cheaper than a hori pad to

 

[KnitePhox]

ON EMULATORlat drop uair jumps if i use the same movement as a normal stick, gotta be more sensitive than gc/360 or hori(iirc); i was only able to do yoshi edge to edge joystick test with range at 100, 75 and 80 didnt do it, didn't try other ranges. deadzone is pretty ok, went to 1 down from 5

raphnet 2.2 with pj64kve 1.4, 0.13 and N-Rage Input Plugin V2 2.3c

haven't tried on console cuz the last CRT i have in my home is dead, time to call in that one loaner


feels SO LOOSE, i love OG's

i wouldn't say to buy yet, but looks like it may be good alternative for people who are new kids hate og64 stick

VERDICT: could still lag, i play online all the time (i'm "used" to 1-3 frame delay) and the tests i did were all on emu, thus, unverified, no CRT/TRUE console = no final say FROM ME. once i get a CRT i'll update this post

 

[firo]

Just got one of these from amazon, and I'm impressed. It's definitely more sensitive, and tilts are harder, similarly to hori, but it works well. I'm running when I sometimes intend to walk but I'm getting used to it. Some things are easier than the hori like pivot utilts since the nub is smaller and I can control it better using more of the tip of my thumb. I'm also not getting any of the snapback issues that you sometimes get with a hori, where the stick bounces in the opposite direction before centering. I will probably order more.


Raphnet is showing that the stick is outputting square values, that is, everywhere from the top-left to the bottom-left notch in the octagon is acting as the same x value at the edge, and same for the right side, and the top and bottom for the y values. This is in contrast to an authentic stick, or a hori, that never reaches the ends of the square, and acts as a circle. This is disappointing however the stick is fairly smooth throughout and I am able to get every x and y value in the raw data with some careful movement. This can explain some of the difference in feel.

 

[MrMarbles]

just ordered 2 i hope this is the real deal and feels natural for me.

 

[M.C.Jeducation]

Wow I guess I've been really lucky with my N64 controllers. I've had them for like 15 years and I've never had to change any parts on them

 

[Cobrevolution]

how floppy are your sticks

 

[Cedricwa]

fifteen years.. do you use them?

 

[M.C.Jeducation]

Yep There would have been a period of 4-5 years where I wasn't using them though. Still I use them all the time now to play smash. I hold them together with my love.

 

[charlocharlie]

I'm curious if these new "Derek" sticks have the skipping issue of past GC style sticks as seen in this video:
(can't post links yet, wow)
www .youtube. com/watch?v=o0VO46SWo2M

If anyone with the "Derek" stick and a USB adapter could test this, that would be great.

 

[Derek Bancarz]

I have the usb adapter as well for online emulation, i could make a video regarding that if need be, it works well though, but more than one opinion is always best i like how i hold the title of that stick now haha, the derek stick, lets keep that goin'

 

[Fireblaster]

nintendude DI
fireblaster's stupid pause rule
megavolt kick
the wizzrobe
LD laser

we tend to do that apparently

 

[GlowingOrangeOoze]

I'm about to order a Derek stick, cause I don't play competitive 64 but I still play my N64 now and then and my controller is beyond use in even the most casual capacity. But I still know and can perform most necessary Smash64 ATs, so I'll be able to provide another opinion in about a week's time if that's of any value.

 

[charlocharlie]

Okay, I bought the "Derek Stick". To recap:
It's a GameCube style stick sold by lukiegames on ebay.

I did some testing on the N64 Thumbstick Test Program (find it on zetaboards; I still can't post links lololol) on the MESS emulator and got these results using a Mayflash adapter with no Windows calibration:

I found that it is very important that you do NOT use Windows Game Controller Calibration when doing these tests. The calibration sets the max of the analog stick to a value of 127, not 94 as shown here. It also created value skipping issues as the input is scaled. It kind of breaks the test ROM:

I can confirm that the sticks I received do not skip values like shown in the video I posted earlier. Quickspins in OoT (which were impossible according to early reports of the GC style sticks) are now possible on real console hardware.

I have found that the stick clicks in kind of like the L3/R3 buttons on a DualShock controller, but it is actually barely noticeable and does not effect gameplay at all. The square shape of input doesn't seem to effect anything I play, but I'll test anything someone asks of me.

I'll mention that I did not play N64 much before I got these sticks due to the extremely poor condition of my OEM sticks:

I know I will get used to the stick eventually, but I think for me it's important that I get the general feel of the N64 console controls first. I've been playing on a Logitech F510 and a Classic Controller Pro way more than N64 and it takes getting used to.

 

[breakthrough]

just ordered 2 i hope this is the real deal and feels natural for me.

How'd they work for you Marbles?

 

[Cedricwa]

I got mine a couple weeks ago around christmas and I've used it on both console and online. I don't know all the fancy numbers and angles and ****, but in short it feels great and tight. It doesn't take long to get used to at all, except for side tilts. They're hard to do at first because the window for them is so small. Also, maybe it's just me or because I use them more but uptilts I got used to faster, along with up airs before second jump. Although side tilts take a little longer to get used to, dash dancing and pivots are way easier and feel great.

Basically I do think it is more worth it to get used to this stick rather than finding and buying a new n64 controller every 6-12 months, this one will feel the same all the time

 

[Derek Bancarz]

one thing that doesn't get mentioned is that due to the small window and no deadzone, your DI is absolutely retarted, i had one guy pause the game cause i could smash di so good with it, he paused an asked how i did it. The tilts will come, but the di is better on these analogs, both in console and online.

 

[anonymouschris01]

I've been playing with the GameCube style stick for a while now and like it, doesn't seem to hamper my abilities at all. But just ordered two Derek sticks for my worn out controllers, so I guess I'll see which is better.

 

[Cedricwa]

Guys no the best controller to use is to custom make wii motion controllers. Then your whole family can play as well

 

[Derek Bancarz]

boys, just save yourselves the trouble and buy one of these
http://i.ytimg.com/vi/fF4h-RxDF70/hqdefault.jpg