N64 Controllers discussion

[EggSelent]

"Can't you buy regular 1st party controllers in newish condition for a manageable cost? I don't know if there exist 3rd party controllers that are superior for playing smash, but I strongly prefer the 1st party ones for general gaming. "

Newish condition controllers are actually pretty hard to find. As far as 3rd party controllers go, IMO there are a couple decent 3rd party alternitives, first the Hori Mini-pad is pretty solid, the only problem I had with it is that it is sooo small, I'm 5'8" and my hands aren't even very big and my hands feel pretty cramped and the R button is especially hard to hit for me, though I've found I'm a little more likely to find a controller uncomfortable than other folks though I know there are some people that have bigger hands than me and can use the mini-pad fine. The second option I would reccommend is one of the new "Yobo" brand controllers that has a PS style stick, not the old "Yobo" brand n64 controllers with the original style n64 joystick. The new PS style ones are actually pretty decent for high level smash, which i was suprised by, because the other ones are crap. Here are pictures for reference.

This is the one you want

This is the one you don't want

Note that on ebay/amazon I haven't seen sellers differentiate between the two, and the packaging Yobo uses makes it so you can't see what type of joystick the controller has, but just ask the seller what type of joystick the controller they are selling has. Some people Also recommend the "makopad" 64 but I personally haven't tried it so I can't say how it rates one way or another.

Interesting. I've never tried a Yobo before, but I've had 3rd party controllers that look pretty similar to the second pictured one you posted. Generally speaking, I've found that the 1st party controllers have a smoother feel for not only the joystick but also the A and B buttons. The act of pressing the A button for on these controllers is much less of a smooth / gradual process -- it feels like the button has only two states, pressed or not pressed. My hands are also monsters... I spend 9-10 hours a day writing programs, 2-3 a day playing my 5 string bass, and another 1-2 playing n64 recently. Unfortunately, consequently I can afford to pay a premium for a controller in great condition, but I probably won't be able to beat you with it.

 

[breakthrough]

Unfortunately, consequently I can afford to pay a premium for a controller in great condition, but I probably won't be able to beat you with it.

There's nothing unfortunate about being able to pay a premium for a good controller.

 

[Roboplodicus]

@EggSelent
Why couldn't you beat us/me? Because you're hands are tired from all the handiwork you do?

Edit: @EggSelent the A and B buttons indeed don't feel as good as on the first party ones on the Yobo ones.

 

[EggSelent]

@EggSelent
Why couldn't you beat us/me? Because you're hands are tired from all the handiwork you do?

Edit: @EggSelent the A and B buttons indeed don't feel as good as on the first party ones on the Yobo ones.

Truthfully, I'm just less skilled than a lot of people here haha. If I lose, it's not because my hands are tired. Usually when I lose it's because I'm less skilled than my opponent, though occasionally I'll lose due to lag, lack of sobriety, unbalanced character matchups, accidental deaths, etc. I've had the game since it came out, but I only recently started playing online. I've probably learned more about the game from playing for a few weeks online than I did playing with my friends for years.

Edit: Just reread my previous post, and wanted to clarify a bit. I was pretty ambiguous -- I meant to say that I can afford to pay a premium because I work all day at the computer, not that I lose because I'm busy or exhausted etc.

 

[BetaWolf]

For playing on console, I prefer using an original Nintendo brand controller with a replacement OEM-style pad (the GameCube-style ones lag). Although for competitive online play, I prefer a DualShock-esque controller like those Logitech ones.

 

[EggSelent]

For playing on console, I prefer using an original Nintendo brand controller with a replacement OEM-style pad (the GameCube-style ones lag). Although for competitive online play, I prefer a DualShock-esque controller like those Logitech ones.

I had never thought about doing that. How hard and time-consuming a process is it to swap out the analog sticks? I don't own a lot of tools like screwdrivers, etc. I'm something of a lazy, logic-driven ****.

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    }
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    Savings (in dollars):<br>
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        <option value="false">No</a>
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</form>

 

[Theftz22]

The Internet

 

[madrush21]

Can anyone who has played smash with a makopad/superpad give me their opinions on whether the controller is worth buying to play smash on?

I have a makopad. I used it as my main controller for smash for a while. The joystick was a lot tighter than the original but I was able to adjust to playing on it. Did you say you live in San Diego?

EDIT: actually it's a sharkpad I think. Similar to the mako but different joystick

 

[rjgbadger]

ive played on the yobo controller. a few of my friends have one. i still think my controller tier list is

1.xbox 360 controller
2.Hori Mini Pad
3.classic n64 controller
4. Yobo controller
5. mako pad

 

[Roboplodicus]

@madrush21
Yeah I live in Scripps Ranch and I play Smash with a couple guys semi regularly, one of whom lives in linda vista, the other in mira mesa, what part of town do you live in?

 

[madrush21]

I live in Chula vista, there's one other player I play with who lives near me. We should play sometime, I'll let you try out my sharkpad

 

[Roboplodicus]

http://s9.zetaboards.com/Nintendo_64_Forever/topic/7360571/1/

Here is a link to a thread about different options for dealing with worn out n64 controller joysticks, I thought you guys might find it helpful.

 

[madrush21]

So Japan has a lot of controllers if you know where to look. Josuke advised me to check second hand stores in the "Junk" sections. Top two controllers I brought with me, everything else I got for about 3400 yen(~$34). #grizzpost. I've also seen some 3rd party controllers that I have never seen in the US, some of which are licensed by nintendo

 

[Karajan]

So Japan has a lot of controllers if you know where to look. Josuke advised me to check second hand stores in the "Junk" sections. Top two controllers I brought with me, everything else I got for about 3400 yen(~$34). #grizzpost. I've also seen some 3rd party controllers that I have never seen in the US, some of which are licensed by nintendo

If you find any clear orange hori pads i will pay you $120 for one

 

[madrush21]

I looked for horis everywhere I went, no luck, but I won't leave Japan without at least one. Still hoping I find a motherlode of them

 

[bloodpeach]

Questions:

1) Has anybody ever tried using a playstation style analog stick for competetive play? It's seems like some modders have had success using those sticks, but I doubt they have any TECHSKILL.

2) Does anybody know what type of plastic the bowl and elbows are made out of? Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to be covered in the patent

 

[Yobolight]

LMAO @ Yobo controller.

Might just have to get myself one.

 

[KoRoBeNiKi]

ive played on the yobo controller. a few of my friends have one. i still think my controller tier list is

1.Hori Mini Pad
2.xbox 360 controller
3.classic n64 controller
4. Yobo controller
5. mako pad

You forgot the keyboard controller

 

[Grizzmeister]

Here's a really cool video showing a complete Nintendo 64 controller collection.

Some people still play the original Smash with an N64 controller so I thought this video might be interesting.

 

[MrMarbles]

Grizzmeister don't ever change

 

[B Link]

So recently I did a mod of this method (http://gbatemp.net/threads/how-to-fix-a-nintendo-64-controllers-loose-analogue-stick.349662/) and it worked out pretty well. Basically I put special types of adhesive tape to the bottom of the bowl + a lubricant. This essentially increased the inside height of the bowl, which was worn out over time. Made my stick go from a 6.5 to maybe a 7.5/8. Still was a bit loose sadly (even when I maximally increased the inside bowl height), so I'm guessing that other parts contribute to looseness as well. Letting people know in case they're interested.

 

[KnitePhox]

when greased, the only parts that wear are the insides of the black elbows and SOME of the inside tip of the stick, aka NON-BOWL parts

 

[Skrlx]

Some people still play the original Smash with an N64 controller so I thought this video might be interesting.

LMFAO. This is almost as good as your post of the bio of a girl in a picture.

 

[Grizzmeister]

Here's a very detailed and informative video that may help some of you hardcore Super Smash Bros. enthusiasts spruce up your tired worn out N64 thumb-stick.

Don't forget to use ceramic grease to lubricate the parts before you put everything back together.

 

[T Brett]

I bought 3 of these and installed them all in my 3 worst controllers
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B009MRZAUC/ref=pd_aw_sims_1?pi=SS115&simLd=1
I love em. Check them out if you haven't already

 

[iheartqueso]

I bought 3 of these and installed them all in my 3 worst controllers
http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B009MRZAUC/ref=pd_aw_sims_1?pi=SS115&simLd=1
I love em. Check them out if you haven't already

I was interested in getting one but I always read they were bad for playing Smash with. Do you still prefer a standard stick to one of these?

 

[Fireblaster]

Here's a very detailed and informative video that may help some of you hardcore Super Smash Bros. enthusiasts spruce up your tired worn out N64 thumb-stick.

Don't forget to use ceramic grease to lubricate the parts before you put everything back together.

http://store.kitsch-bent.com/product/n64-joystick-gears

This is the page where you can buy those parts. Instead of the usual custom parts you can buy that are 3D printed, these are done through injection molding so they seem a lot more stable and durable. I will order several of these and test them out. The guy in the video acted like the parts made the joystick "a bit loose" but if you watch the video he's talking about something that we'd consider basically a perfect joystick.

 

[Derek Bancarz]

If you're playing online the gamecube style stick is perfect. Just calibrate it in the control panel first. I use the GC stick as my repair box analog stick no longer works.

lol says im smash rookie

 

[T Brett]

I was interested in getting one but I always read they were bad for playing Smash with. Do you still prefer a standard stick to one of these?

I prefer these new ones, but only because I've never tried playing smash with a nice tight original N64 stick.
I played smash recently with this guy (not boom) and he used my controllers. He said he loved the stick, and that it felt great. So that means something I guess.
Anyways, for the price, why not install one and try it out?
Tristan

 

[MrMarbles]

lol says im smash rookie

is this derek that i played online?

 

[Grizzmeister]

http://store.kitsch-bent.com/product/n64-joystick-gears

This is the page where you can buy those parts. Instead of the usual custom parts you can buy that are 3D printed, these are done through injection molding so they seem a lot more stable and durable. I will order several of these and test them out. The guy in the video acted like the parts made the joystick "a bit loose" but if you watch the video he's talking about something that we'd consider basically a perfect joystick.

I look forward to getting your impressions of these parts with respect to Super Smash Bros. play. The guy who made the video I posted, sadly, doesn't own a copy of the game.

 

[Fireblaster]

REPORT:

I put these gears into my oldest and most worn out joystick that literally wobbled from edge to edge. It didn't feel like a brand new joystick with 0% deadzone like described in the video and even ignoring the small deadzone that it has after the fix, the stick doesn't feel as "strong" as a brand new stick. However, it felt much better and with the current state that most of my joysticks are in right now, whatever stick I put these gears into will become the best stick I have. The way this currently is, I'd feel more comfortable just using these replacement gears in any of my joysticks as my tournament controller than any of the joysticks with original gears that I already have.

HYPOTHESIS:

Several reasons could be contributing to the stick still not feeling 100% new:

- The spring is worn out/old. Perhaps there is a way to restore the power to these springs or obtain identical new ones? I dunno. I also haven't tested this enough so maybe the spring is just fine.
- The stick plastic itself may be slightly worn out. Very unlikely since it is one of the hardest materials in a joystick
- The bowl

It doesn't make sense to me why the bowl being worn out would contribute to the stick being slightly more wobbly. But when I pull up on the joystick (and this matters because on sticks with newer bowls, the stick cannot get pulled up as far), the deadzone almost disappears and it almost feels like a newer stick. I will attempt bowl repair techniques to see if doing so will make the sticks perform and feel better. First I'll use the method used by the japanese 64 community that was linked by jouske:

http://www31.atpages.jp/kiyo64/#_=_
http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/aw/d/B000TGFR1M#_=_

And if that doesn't work I'll try other methods from youtube and such.

TL;DR - For those of us that can't simply keep buying brand new/great quality sticks from other people (which is not a consistent or long term solution), these replacement gears are the best solutions for fixing worn out sticks IMO. Greasing is still recommended of course, no reason not to.

 

[Derek Bancarz]

is this derek that i played online?

yea it is

 

[Derek Bancarz]

is this derek that i played online?

as u can tell i dont go on the boards often

 

[MrMarbles]

as u can tell i dont go on the boards often

you should come out to apex 2015 dude. This guy has a legit pika and has apparently never been to a tourney

 

[Derek Bancarz]

you should come out to apex 2015 dude. This guy has a legit pika and has apparently never been to a tourney

thanks brother, that would be a steep hike for me though. Playing online is fun but I would like the chance that apex would give me to play the best players.

 

[jinyung2]

REPORT:

I put these gears into my oldest and most worn out joystick that literally wobbled from edge to edge. It didn't feel like a brand new joystick with 0% deadzone like described in the video and even ignoring the small deadzone that it has after the fix, the stick doesn't feel as "strong" as a brand new stick. However, it felt much better and with the current state that most of my joysticks are in right now, whatever stick I put these gears into will become the best stick I have. The way this currently is, I'd feel more comfortable just using these replacement gears in any of my joysticks as my tournament controller than any of the joysticks with original gears that I already have.

HYPOTHESIS:

Several reasons could be contributing to the stick still not feeling 100% new:

- The spring is worn out/old. Perhaps there is a way to restore the power to these springs or obtain identical new ones? I dunno. I also haven't tested this enough so maybe the spring is just fine.
- The stick plastic itself may be slightly worn out. Very unlikely since it is one of the hardest materials in a joystick
- The bowl

It doesn't make sense to me why the bowl being worn out would contribute to the stick being slightly more wobbly. But when I pull up on the joystick (and this matters because on sticks with newer bowls, the stick cannot get pulled up as far), the deadzone almost disappears and it almost feels like a newer stick. I will attempt bowl repair techniques to see if doing so will make the sticks perform and feel better. First I'll use the method used by the japanese 64 community that was linked by jouske:

http://www31.atpages.jp/kiyo64/#_=_
http://www.amazon.co.jp/gp/aw/d/B000TGFR1M#_=_

And if that doesn't work I'll try other methods from youtube and such.

TL;DR - For those of us that can't simply keep buying brand new/great quality sticks from other people (which is not a consistent or long term solution), these replacement gears are the best solutions for fixing worn out sticks IMO. Greasing is still recommended of course, no reason not to.

I've been trying to repair my most wobbly stick on one of my 3 controllers using a method I saw on youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEJmSQjONRg

For me it was the bowl being worn down and the space between the bottom of the stick and the bowl creating a bigger and bigger gap contributing to the looseness so I've filled the bowl with epoxy like the video instructs me to do. I'll get back with the results once it dries and I sand it down to fit it properly.

My gears are also rather worn on this controller though. How are the quality of the gears sold on http://store.kitsch-bent.com/product/n64-joystick-gears ?

 

[jinyung2]

FInally finished joystick repair! Deadzone went from roughly 9~10mm to 2~3mm. I ordered some kitsch-bent parts for the gears since mine were quite old.

I took a slightly different approach than the guy in the video and I overfilled on purpose and after 24 hours I sanded it down with a dremel using a tip that was convex. The kitsch-bent pieces took a bit of sanding too and it was mentioned in the product description how there would be a bit excess (from the site: you may need to remove a slight bit of 'flash' on the parts, which is typical for plastics parts to ensure a smoother operation. this is very easily done with a common razor edge, if even required). Compared to the original part, the kitsch-bent pieces didn't have that "dip" that made it glides smoothly in the bowl and there would be some extra friction. So I used the dremel using a tip that was angled to file down the part that touches the bowl to make a more bowl shape. Used mineral oil as a lubricant because apparently it's safe on plastic.

Just tested out on smash and it works AMAZING.

 

[Fireblaster]

FInally finished joystick repair! Deadzone went from roughly 9~10mm to 2~3mm. I ordered some kitsch-bent parts for the gears since mine were quite old.

I took a slightly different approach than the guy in the video and I overfilled on purpose and after 24 hours I sanded it down with a dremel using a tip that was convex. The kitsch-bent pieces took a bit of sanding too and it was mentioned in the product description how there would be a bit excess (from the site: you may need to remove a slight bit of 'flash' on the parts, which is typical for plastics parts to ensure a smoother operation. this is very easily done with a common razor edge, if even required). Compared to the original part, the kitsch-bent pieces didn't have that "dip" that made it glides smoothly in the bowl and there would be some extra friction. So I used the dremel using a tip that was angled to file down the part that touches the bowl to make a more bowl shape. Used mineral oil as a lubricant because apparently it's safe on plastic.

Just tested out on smash and it works AMAZING.

That's good to know. I'm going to release a video showing what I tested but this is the conclusion from the video:

- These gears are pretty much perfect and better than any used or worn gears. They will always improve your joystick over anything that doesn't have perfect gears

- Having a better bowl improves deadzone. Putting these gears in the worst stick made it good. Putting these gears in a great stick made it perfect.

- Through the same mechanic as above, having a better joystick shaft will improve deadzone. Having the ball at the end of the joystick wear out is roughly equivalent to the bowl wearing out.

It seems that we have a solution for the gears and the bowls (most easily repaired part). Only thing left is for us to get new joystick shafts and we're golden.

 

[jinyung2]

The three controllers I have are all from around.. 1997 when I first bought the n64 and I've never before greased controllers in the past prior to this repair. I've noticed for ungreased controllers the part that wears the most is the bowl (when i first opened up these controllers more than a decade of wear could be seen in white powder residue from the bowl wearing down) and then the gears on the openings where the joystick bottom grinds up against it.

The joystick bottom the little bump, after almost 15 years of mario party controller stick rotation (for those of you who've tried you know how intense tug of war can be lol), still retained it's little shape so it's safe to say its the most durable part of the joystick compartment.

The gears are amazing. Injection molded parts and quality control is pretty well done I think. For me, I had to grind the bottom of the gear parts where it touches the bowl just tiny but I think that has more to do with me refilling my bowl with epoxy. Chances are if you've been taking good care of your controllers and regularly lubricated the parts, just changing the gear with no extra fitting might do the trick.

Update: I noticed the new kitsch-bent gears were having a bit of trouble when trying to do f-tilts and would occasionally get stuck very slightly to the left or right and the character would walk very slowly. I found out the reason this was happening was because the plastic that sits on the top of the bowl had some excess that make it rock very unsmoothly. Took a knife and cut off a bit of excess plastic on the sides and it felt a lot smoother.