Monster Mafia - Game Over

[#HBC | Mac]

actually scratch that about gheb and cacti for now. I need to sit down and reread to see if I actually find them scummy.

 

[Omni]

I believe you bunbun!
i'd rather he not claim and that we switch to gheb or cacti

why do you believe BunBun so intently? and dont give me that gut feeling bullcrap

 

[Mediocre]

A Deadline Has Been Set:
11:59 PM EST November 12


As of post 282

7/12 votes to lynch

The Current Votecount:

BunBun: 5 (Matunas, Omni, KevinM, mentosman8, Marshy)
Junglefever: 3 (Macman, Cacti, Gheb_01)
cacti: 2 (Junglefever, Evil Eye)
Macman: 1 (BunBun)


Search Terms For Maximum Searchability:
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Activity

Nov 11
BunBun
Macman
Omni

Nov 10
mentosman8
Gheb_01
Evil Eye
Junglefever
Marshy
Matunas
Cacti
KevinM

Nov 9

Nov 8
Rockin

INACTIVE



Inactivity Count
BunBun: 1
Ignatius: 1
Cacti: 1
Marshy: 1
Rockin: 1
mentosman8: 1

 

[#HBC | Mac]

Yea I'm sorry to say it's gut.

 

[Rockin]

ayiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiie! so sorry! D: Didn't mean to like...drop off the face of the earth ><;;

P97: Rockin finally responds to Marshy's pointed question, and proceeds to attempt to derail the game with silliness a second time. Despite all the real discussion going on. Furthermore, Rockin says absolutely nothing else. You better believe that's a scumpoint.

You're gonna tell me my silliness actually derails discussion (let alone, something Macman usually do). All I was doing was asking a silly question, which is something I don't often do. May not do that ever again at this point >>

Rockin answers someone else's question for them and then tries to derail the thread into talking about the plot of Monster.

Rockin, what the ****. Seriously. Scumpoint, because every **** post he has made up to this point has contained in it an attempt to move the discussion away from scumhunting and productive questioning.


At this point Rockin has successfully derailed the discussion into talking about Monster and spoilers and how the two pertain to the game. Instead of, y'know, stuff in the actual game.

Okay, that question looked pretty general to me. I thought he was asking everyone in general, so I posted. I havn't even seen no one one, including Gheb, fault me on this.

About the spoilers stuff, again I just wanted to know what the game was simply about in terms of flavor. It's not like it was forced or constantly asking. I don't think I was pushing too hard. If my flavor thing was such an annoyance, everyone else could've just told me to stfu and I'd left it alone >>

2) Incidentally, in Megamafia you were town and did a whole bunch of flavor-discussion, including judging possible allignments for players by their character.

also keep in mind that the same smashman was diving too deep in the flavor territory, which I was afraid would make him mistake one thing after another. I do a bit of flavor as well, but I make sure not to dive too deep into the said flavor, as I need to make room for scum hunting. flavor doesn't always help. It just helps understand the said character/subject/setting in a better light.

As far as with everything else...wtf, Junglefever? I don't know why claimed...at all. No one told you to claim. Just because no one didn't say anything doesn't mean you should claim. Maybe others thought...you didn't need to claim. And, once more, you ROLECLAIMED as well. It probably wouldn't have been that bad if you just nameclaimed. Oy...

As such, I was skeptical of the claim cause of the timing and that he's known as a miller, but several pointed out that that it seems to be true (meaning that thing Omni said). I guess I can believe the claim, but this may already put town at a bad spot...

I'll agree that Bunbun hasn't really said much nor contributed (though I can say the same for Cacti and myself XD), so I'm fine with his lynch. I like the PBP Mentos did.

Vote: BunBun

 

[#HBC | marshy]

unvote bunbun

-2. ee should respond ugh **** deadlines

 

[Evil Eye]

Did that take him to -2 or from -2? Either way, good. I don't want quickhammering.


And yeah, school johns basically. However it should be all wrapped up now and I hope to get a post up tonight. Then I'm good for school nonsense until finals.

For right now my lynch pool is essentially the same, however Bunglefever Strikes Again has pretty much taken him out of it, at least. Definitely for D1. Beyond that exception, most of what I said is still how I feel about things. I'll have more specific things to say, but no defences in response to my big post have blown me out of the water with towntells, that's for sure. Might reprioritize when I reread, though.

 

[Evil Eye]

Ignore the stupid question, there's a votecount like right above your post. Good call.

 

[KevinM]

Marshy I'm not so sure why you're acting so crazy about the deadline we still have 24 hours, normally I can understand the frustration but we still have a fair bit of time left.

Doesn't sit well with me.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

what's not to be sure about? ee doesn't post often

 

[#HBC | Mac]

hey, EE. are you permanently replacing iggy?

 

[Omni]

marshy u never stated why u were for a bunbun lynch. you just hopped on the wagon

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Unvote

I don't know anything about monster so I voted him because of the WIFOM we'll have to deal with if he's alive toMorrow. Seems like his claim makes too much sense to do this though. I'll vote later today and do a reread too.

 

[KevinM]

Are we just going to let this game deadline lynch.

I'd really like Bunbun to come in and make some sort of case besides giving up.

Also don't take make a case as, you have to claim. Point us in some kind of direction.

Who do you feel is scum?
Do you have some kind of evidence?
Any connections you feel have been made?


Hell anyone that's on here before 12 should answer these, if we can't accomplish anything today we can at least have more of a base then we have now.

I would answer them but there's no sense in diluting the question before its asked.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Are we just going to let this game deadline lynch.

No majority = no lynch.

Vote BunBun.

I probably won't be here "before 12" as I'm living in a completely different time zone. When I get here next time the lynch has already happened (or not) so I'd rather vote Bun to minimize the chances of a NL. I don't really think he's scum but I'd prefer a lynch either way.

Who do you feel is scum?
Do you have some kind of evidence?
Any connections you feel have been made?

Hell anyone that's on here before 12 should answer these, if we can't accomplish anything today we can at least have more of a base then we have now.

I would answer them but there's no sense in diluting the question before its asked.

I will answer those questions in my next post.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

extension please

we could really use one...

 

[#HBC | Mac]

fos: anyone whose online and doesn't request a deadline extension even though we don't deserve it at all.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Request Deadline Extension

Spoiler

even though we totally don't deserve it <_<

Who do you feel is scum?

Rockin and Omni

Do you have some kind of evidence?

Rockin has not posted anything of substance and not contributed anything in terms of scumhunting. His 200 was the only post that somehow shows some kind of opinion but it's fluffed with a soft parrot. I'm surprised that he hasn't gotten more negative attention.

Omni I'm less sure about but I feel like he's been nudging BunBun earlier but voted him only later to bring him closer to a lynch. This is very vague I guess so I'm not sure on this one. In fact I'm not sure about any of my scumtells after Simpsons Mafia <_<
Plus I'm always suspicious of Omni...

Any connections you feel have been made?

Too vague to make such conclusions IMO. I'd rather wait for the flips and think about this toMorrow. Many people have not showed a lot of commitment for this game - Matunas, Rockin, Cacti and Scumfever all leave a lot to be desired and should step it up. If they're town they have no reason to play so blatantly unhelpful.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

OK, to be fair Matunas hasn't been "blatantly unhelpful". I'd still appreciate if he could be more active. Same for EE.

 

[Omni]

so basically you're telling us to ignore your suspicions because of your past performance and because "you dont know for sure". ok.

request deadline extension

i cant answer the questions at the moment. leaving campus in a few minutes

 

[~ Gheb ~]

so Basically You're Telling Us To Ignore Your Suspicions ...

???

 

[Evil Eye]

Surprise case study given out today due tonight/tomorrow so I'd love a deadline extension and am requesting it and stuff.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

request deadline extension

more later

 

[BunBun]

Alrighty, time for case-making then. The feeling I have that Macman is scum is definitely still present, though I am seeing more and more that that is just how he plays. As much as I appreciate it, I sort of see it as suspicious that you are on my side and are trying to convince others I'm not scum. It's the sort of 'well, I'm not in any danger, and he'll probably be lynched, so when I defend him and he flips townie, it makes me look good'. That, in addition to wanting 'the real' doctor to counterclaim. Scum would want the read doc to counterclaim.

However, no good situation exists that you would be scum, AND jungle would be scum. Him claiming and living to the next day only further puts suspicion on him. I don't think you both would willingly sacrifice one of your own this early on. Also (small metagaming here) after reading some of the other mafia threads, it seems like the scummy feeling I got from you, you give in every game you play. Combining that with you supporting an extension, I'm pulling my vote from you.

unvote

Now, my current case.
For all this talk about how much coasting Jungle and I've done, everyone pretty much overlooked Marshy.
He's done a good job of staying completely under the radar until yesterday and today. I didn't really notice anything until Omni pointed out that you jumped on my wagon.

Let's start.
10/27

jungle sup brah?

gheb i vaguely recall you saying that you've played mafia before playing on this site. where when and for how long?

matunas! what got you interested in playing again?

rockin are you a scumbag?

iggy do you care for policy lynches? is there anyone in this game you'd be interested in policy lynching?

omni what WAS your reason for voting cacti in 71?

macman what are your thoughts on random voting?

cacti how many scumbuddies do you have?

bunbun i remember you playing chaco's marathon game. where else have you played mafia?

mentos what do you want out of this day 1? is there a certain amount of pages that'd make you comfortable with 40 posts per page?

kevin do you like being scum or town more?

Alrighty, starting out on a pretty normal note. Nothing really unusual, just trying to start discussion.

11/01

i like policy lynches. mostly lurkers. no one here i want to policy lynch

vote cacti

11/01

also in response to tuna's question: i'm convinced that whichever side has more VI's will lose. it's true in most if not all swfmafia games. if someone's doing village idiot actions (doing scummy stuff then calling people who question their scumbaggery scum, self voting, can't explain the simplest thought processes and such) that end up being hard to determine whether or not they're just a VI or scum then they should be lynched

5 days and almost 60 posts later, he shows back up to help start the Cacti bandwagon (of which I, admittedly, joined) with no reasoning for it. In addition, he answers a question. This is about the high point of his activity. A vote and an answer, that's about it.

Mentosman calls all 5 of the people who voted on Cacti out, and Marshy never responds to him.

11/03

unvote cacti vote scumfever

he's a bg

O...k...? 2 days and 23 posts later, he pops back in, takes his vote off Cacti and hits up Jungle, also with no reasoning.
He has not yet defended either of his votes.

11/06

you think it is in the context of early d1?

ehh. i'm down for ee getting replaced since he was a bad choice

looks like someone's defending their lurking scumbuddy

>: (

macman what's your response to bunbun's 196?

3 days go by and Marshy pops in to contribute to the discussion. Sort of. What exactly does he do here? He points to Tuna for not wanting to lynch inactives on D1 and prods Macman into responding to me.
He has yet to add anything himself, or provide with any of his own opinions, at all.


11/06

god thats a longass post

After EE's massive, and awesomely analytic, post, that's it? I mean, I know he didn't mention Marshy at all, but I would have expected Marshy, at this point, to have at least given his opinion on something that's been said.

11/09

please prod ee

i'm okay with scumbagfever dying. i need to reread but i want ee's response to the fallout from his big post

You want EE's response to everyone defending themselves? How about your opinions on anything at all?

11/10

deadline's in 2 days

As the deadline draws near...we get a reminder.

11/10

unvote junglefever vote bunbun

Jumps on me. No mention of why or any opinions on it, just does it.

11/11

unvote bunbun

-2. ee should respond ugh **** deadlines

Alright.... Taking your vote off me so I don't get quick hammered. Appreciative, but how about some input? Stop just worrying about deadlines and what EE says.

11/11

what's not to be sure about? ee doesn't post often

After being queried about his interest in the deadline, only responds that he is worried about EE's activity.



So, exactly what has Marshy added to the discussion?
Nothing that I can see. He's voted and unvoted 3 times, with absolutely no reasoning to any of them.

It feels pretty scummy to me. If this is the case, and Marshy is scum, I would look towards EE for a major partner. If you look at it in terms that he and EE are a team and discuss their suspicions with each other, then EE may just be unwittingly doing the posting for both of them, and Marshy is just following along, and voting/unvoting for fun along the way.



So yeah, vote Marshy. Let's get some info, man.



Also, Deadline extension please

 

[Mediocre]

The Deadline Has Been Extended:
11:59 PM EST November 17


As of post 304

7/12 votes to lynch

The Current Votecount:

BunBun: 6 (Matunas, Omni, KevinM, mentosman8, Rockin, Gheb_01)
Junglefever: 2 (Macman, Cacti)
cacti: 2 (Junglefever, Evil Eye)
Marshy: 1 (BunBun)


Search Terms For Maximum Searchability:
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Activity

Nov 12
Gheb_01
KevinM
Macman
Omni
Evil Eye
Marshy
BunBun

Nov 11
Rockin

Nov 10
mentosman8
Junglefever
Matunas
Cacti

Nov 9

INACTIVE



Inactivity Count
BunBun: 1
Ignatius: 1
Cacti: 1
Marshy: 1
Rockin: 1
mentosman8: 1

 

[Cacti]

Lol BunBun, you keep on voting people because of their playstyles.

 

[BunBun]

That's a shame, then. I'm not familiar with this group yet, so it seems like wolf behaviour to me.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Time to elaborate more on my 298:

Almost everybody has been suspicious of BunBun at some point toDay. That doesn't really clear him but at the same time it's very easy for scum to advocate his lynch while blending in with the town. Of the people on his wagon I find Rockin and Omni the most suspicious. Rockin hasn't done anything in terms of scumhunting and he has been coasting all the time with some occasional "check-in" post. I feel Omni has been nudging BunBun more than anybody else but it's very vague.

Unvote Vote Rockin

via my reasoning from 298.

And Omni, just to make sure: I never told anybody to ignore me. Don't twist words in my mouth.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

sorry for these retro quotes

Yes, you did state it: The next day. At first your vote was just placed with no reasoning at all, then a day later you posted a reason. It looks almost as if you wanted to get your vote on the BW, but didn't have a solid reason to join it, so you placed it anyway and explained it when you came up with something. Why DIDN'T you explain your vote right away instead of waiting until a different post to do so.

Do you honesty believe that this could be the case?

just to make this clear

inactivity didn't become an issue for me until inactivity actually occured whereas you were on

2 days into the game you complained about inactivity. i didnt start complaining until much much later. don't group me with your EE scumpoints k ty

You do realize that EE's point still included you. He was saying that pushing for a lynch of inactives was an easy way for him to try to lynch a ML with little to no effort but still not be seen as scummy when he was scum in Megamaf. This pertains to you way more than it pertains to gheb who was just trying to get inactive people to speak up whereas you wanted to lynch them.

Do you agree with that particular scumpoint on Gheb? Do you think it would pertain to you as well? Is there a reason why you felt the need to make this post distancing yurself from a possible EE scumpoint?

Lol BunBun, you keep on voting people because of their playstyles.

Let him continue doing what he's doing. If he sees something antitown or scummy, he shouldn't dismiss it because it's done be someone whose notorious for doing scummy stuff. [unless it's me cuz im always town]

 

[Omni]

Omni I'm less sure about but I feel like he's been nudging BunBun earlier but voted him only later to bring him closer to a lynch. This is very vague I guess so I'm not sure on this one. In fact I'm not sure about any of my scumtells after Simpsons Mafia <_<
Plus I'm always suspicious of Omni...

Too vague to make such conclusions IMO.

so basically you're telling us to ignore your suspicions because of your past performance and because "you dont know for sure". ok.

that's where my comment came form gheb. why would you reach so hard on my case when you're completely unsure of your own feelings towards the subject? i take that post in a way to say, "dont listen to me. my scumtells have been off and my suspicions are vague enough as it is."

also, what are u talking about in regards to me "nudging" BunBun? explain this in detail cuz i have no clue what you're referring to even after my reread.

And Omni, just to make sure: I never told anybody to ignore me. Don't twist words in my mouth.

it was a summary paraphrase. everyone knows you didnt state those exact words because i didnt quote you at all. stop making me explain things in more detail than is really necessary and catch onto these things more quicker.

You do realize that EE's point still included you. He was saying that pushing for a lynch of inactives was an easy way for him to try to lynch a ML with little to no effort but still not be seen as scummy when he was scum in Megamaf. This pertains to you way more than it pertains to gheb who was just trying to get inactive people to speak up whereas you wanted to lynch them.

Do you agree with that particular scumpoint on Gheb? Do you think it would pertain to you as well? Is there a reason why you felt the need to make this post distancing yurself from a possible EE scumpoint?

reread, mac. gheb questioned me earlier. i explained that my intention was not to actually lynch the inactives, but send a threat in order to get the inactives to begin talking more. so yea it doesnt pertain to me at all considering i explained the intentions of my "request to lynch inactives". if it did, i wouldnt agree with it based on what i just said.

your questions are strange here. you seem to be psuedo-scumhunting a bit. why wouldnt i distance myself from a scumpoint?

 

[#HBC | Mac]

Do you agree with that particular scumpoint on Gheb? Do you think it would pertain to you as well?

answer?

and that distancing question was a little bit weird, I was having trouble wording it. I just don't get why you felt the need to make that post. gheb wasn't even attacking you in his post and was also not directly referring to you. He just brought you up to prove a point to EE. The way you said "don't group me in with that scumpoint"[/paraphrase] just bothered me.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

that's where my comment came form gheb. why would you reach so hard on my case when you're completely unsure of your own feelings towards the subject?

I'm not more unsure about this particular subject that any other.
It's not that I'm "reaching hard in this case despite being unsure", it's more "I feel like I'm reaching hard but I probably wouldn't feel that way if I wasn't so unsure about my scumtells."

i take that post in a way to say, "dont listen to me. my scumtells have been off and my suspicions are vague enough as it is."

That's silly. Why would you take my point that way when I didn't even say that? I said my point about you is vague because that's how I think it is. If I wanted people to ignore me on the other hand then I would've chosen to not respond to Kevin's question in the first place. I did it though because this day has been fairly unproductie so far so I thought it would be better to bring something to the table to see if people can agree with what I post. Why would I want people to ingore that? And even if I wanted people to ignore me, why would I post it then?

also, what are u talking about in regards to me "nudging" BunBun? explain this in detail cuz i have no clue what you're referring to even after my reread.

Your 159 clearly showed that you have a problem with BunBun's play but you voted him only in post 215 IIRC. In between those two posts there were 2 other people voting for him (Macman and Matunas) and another one (EE) has explained his suspicions on him in great detail. I just find it strange of you to do that because your reasoning for voting BunBun looked a lot stronger to me than your reasons for voting Cacti or Jungle. The course of these events is very curious to me: You point out something potentially scummy from BunBun but you prefer to vote Cacti/Jungle either way. After being voted by 2 different people and being frowned upon by another one you're back on him, which ensured the subsequent BW on him and unless something major happens he will be our lynch toDay.

it was a summary paraphrase. everyone knows you didnt state those exact words because i didnt quote you at all. stop making me explain things in more detail than is really necessary and catch onto these things more quicker.

No, that's only the logical consequence of your response. There was no way for me to tell the intention of your post so I took it the way that suggests itself: the way you wrote it. And the way you wrote it cleary speaks of me wanting to be ignored, something I never said. If things are getting moer complicated for you then you have to take the responsibility for it as it was you, who decided to be unclear/inaccurate, not me.

 

[Omni]

answer?

and that distancing question was a little bit weird, I was having trouble wording it. I just don't get why you felt the need to make that post. gheb wasn't even attacking you in his post and was also not directly referring to you. He just brought you up to prove a point to EE. The way you said "don't group me in with that scumpoint"[/paraphrase] just bothered me.

it sounded to me in Gheb's post that he was trying to put us both in the same category of whatever scumpoint factor EE gave him. i dont understand what bothers you when a person says, "i dont want to be grouped with a scumpoint" but thats for you to determine how you're going to express that.

i already answered that it doesn't pertain to me because of our separate cases. i wouldn't give Gheb a "scum point" like EE did on that issue.

--------------

@Gheb: i dont think you're quite grasping the argument i made. you're arguing over minor semantics which is beyond the point.

2nd paragraph: regardless if the day is unproductive or not, i find it completely counterproductive to make a claim that barely even has your own support under it. it's useless information when you say I'm one of your candidates for being scum but cant draw up a proper case to solidify it.

3rd paragraph: my #159 was an obvious scumhunt tactic. i can't believe you're trying to make a case out of this. bunbun was coasting at that point so in order to get him talking (since he only responded when someone asked him a question at that time) i began applying pressure and questioning his thinking. both macman can matanus jumped on it since they agreed, but i had my vote elsewhere. there's nothing off about applying pressure on a person without voting the ESPECIALLY if i'm in the process of asking questions and waiting for their (and others) response.

4th paragraph: u mad. that's how im going to interpreted it. if u dont like it, that sounds like a personal problem but stop trying to make it seem like im trying to misquote you in the process

 

[Matunas]

Sorry for being away, school johns.

I'm still comfortable with a BunBun lynch for now. I'll be looking over things to make sure I want to keep it this way since I am not at all comfortable with Cacti so far in this game. Others have stated it as well, but he has put forth no real content and when called out on it has had no real defense.

@Kevin -

Who do you feel is scum?
BunBun (as stated above), others are purely suspicion at this point.

Do you have some kind of evidence?
Post I made earlier, along with mentos' argument.

Any connections you feel have been made?
Again, suspicions.

@BunBun - With Marshy I have to recommend reading his other games to get a feel for how he plays. I'm not denying that he could be scum, just that his playstyle tends to be vague and difficult to read, especially in the early stages of the game.

@Jungle - You've been pretty quiet overall since your claim. Depending on what happens tonight you're probably going to be in the spotlight tomorrow so what are your thoughts on the current state of the game?


I'm in Chicago until Sunday, and then next week I have a ton of homework. I'll be reading and putting in my 2 cents as much as possible.

 

[DtJ Jungle]

To be honest, I'm confused as to why we called for an extension. Everyone seemed pretty comfortable with a Bunbun lynch, and I dont see the opinion changing at all.

 

[#HBC | marshy]

i hopped on the bunbun wagon for the sake of a lynch earlier

Let him continue doing what he's doing. If he sees something antitown or scummy, he shouldn't dismiss it because it's done be someone whose notorious for doing scummy stuff. [unless it's me cuz im always town]

agree with this

down for a rockin wagon. vacuous posts need to stop preferably with death unvote bunbun vote rockin

 

[KevinM]

Rockin's flavor derail was ridiculously scummy.

Actually I'm 100 percent ok with killing Rockin at this point.

Unvote
Vote Rockin

The deadline lets town shift. And if we're going to lynch someone, and have a little more time to discuss it should be you.

You've derailed the game into flavor and when you were called out on it, you said there was no discussion to begin with.

Scumkin.

 

[mentosman8]

Kevin, I don't think the flavor de-rail was that massive of a scummy thing. Yeah, it was a very unnecessary topic of discussion, but I don't see it as a purposeful derailment, moreso as an accident. Not to say Rockin can't be scum because of that, but I don't think that reason alone is a strong reason to go for him.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

mentos i asked yu a question in my 309

 

[Rockin]

Rockin has not posted anything of substance and not contributed anything in terms of scumhunting. His 200 was the only post that somehow shows some kind of opinion but it's fluffed with a soft parrot. I'm surprised that he hasn't gotten more negative attention.

Yeah, I know I've been total fail with keeping up with the thread. Earlier after the big post EE made, I wanted to tell my opinion about it, but I got sidetracked one time after another, and didn't post it till later on as well as what I thought of what was going on at the time.

Rockin's flavor derail was ridiculously scummy.

Actually I'm 100 percent ok with killing Rockin at this point.

Unvote
Vote Rockin

The deadline lets town shift. And if we're going to lynch someone, and have a little more time to discuss it should be you.

You've derailed the game into flavor and when you were called out on it, you said there was no discussion to begin with.

Scumkin.

Ugh, seriously KevinM?

You make it seem like I talked a whole bunch of flavors. Like what the main character did, our possible enemies, replaying scenarios, breaking the mechanics of Medi's game, all of it.

Instead. All I did was asked one question. Not about the characters. Just the outline story.

And as far as discussion went early D1, there were really no discussions. Even now after looking back, all I saw were either one person answering another person's question(s) or two people having a conflict with one another. There was no discussion.

In post 101, Gheb was asking how do we move discussion. It was apparant I wasn't the only one thinking this, and I posted 102 (which was also the same post where I asked that toxic flavor question). In post 123, Matunas asked me a question about spoilers, one where EE gave me a scumpoint (which pretty much meant I didn't deserve that point since I was asking a question).

It's irritating that you're still holding a grudge off of the flavor 'de-rail,' KevinM. It looked completely harmless.