Momentum: We need a decision

[shanus]

Since we should post 3.3 sometime reasonable soon, we need to come to a consensus on momentum.

We have v10 and v3, each with its own pros & cons.

v10 we can make every character have unique momentum gains which is nice. However, the momentum is not dynamic and applies a constant value such that there is top speed dash or walking and no inbetween. It also does have less cases of over b's gaining momentum which is nice. A main trade off is its line count. Still plays very very well.

v3: Bases off dash speed perfectly, acts exactly as it should. For some reason, a large portion of the cast is unaffected by this code when set to 100% momentum capture. However, only a few chars of the unaffected cast actually benefit much from it: Namely ZSS & Sonic. Only is 11 lines too which is nice. However, ganondorfs over+b done sliding over a ledge gives ridiculous momentum.

Here is a link to the latest 3.3Beta:
http://shanemulliganphotography.blogsite.org:6111/~shane/Smashcodes/2-28-2009/Beta3.3 test stuff/

 

[kupo15]

You forgot some stuff.

V11 gives foxtrot momentum (momentum when you don't hold the stick?, v3 doesn't.
V3 has RAR momentum, v11 doesn't
V11 gives momentum the frame after dash attacks and sliding usmashes from a standing jump, v3 doesn't

I would go for v3. The smooth application and usage of v3 is unmatched by v11. I wouldn't call v3 not affecting everyone a con though. Melee's system didn't affect everyone and worked out very well so we should at least give this a try and let tourneys dictate who "deserves" momentum that didn't get it.

I actually like ganon's side b getting momentum. I find it less "broken" than before to be quite honest

v3

 

[Dark Sonic]

You forgot some stuff.
I wouldn't call v3 not affecting everyone a con though

I disagree completely. There are some characters that really would benefit from momentum that are left out (namely Sonic and ZSS), and it's unfair that Falcon gets the momentum boost while Sonic doesn't (despite both of them being positively effected by having some sort of momentum applied).

Momentum on specials is also a problem for some characters (once again, Sonic.) Sonic's spindash jump retains momentum, making it literally impossible to combo from (even fair doesn't work if they DI towards you, since only the first part will hit). This is a problem because even in brawl+ spindash was a good option for punishing whiffed attacks. It was by no means spammable, but there are entire guides explaining the different phases of Sonic's spins and all of their properties (for instance, he can shield cancel his aerial down B upon landing, and can shield cancel his Side B at any point before full charge).

Really, I want to see these things fixed. If I have to vote for one or the other, then I'll have to reluctantly vote for v3 since it uses an overall better system, but these are some serious flaws and I don't like how some people just shrug them off.

 

[shanus]

Well I would say I vote for v3, but if we can gt a character specific version of v3 so we can effect sonic and ZSS (if we go over 100% capture they are effected by it, but get a bug from walking momentum). I think a fixed version would be ideal!

 

[leafgreen386]

V3 is clearly the superior choice, however it isn't a perfect code. A fixed v3 would be ideal, I think.

 

[The Cape]

Still against it.

Have you guys considered the possibilities from it other than just combos?

Its not good with the engine and makes the game have more problems. I can go into more specifics if you guys want, but basically it helps to facilitate camping.

 

[shanus]

Still against it.

Have you guys considered the possibilities from it other than just combos?

Its not good with the engine and makes the game have more problems. I can go into more specifics if you guys want, but basically it helps to facilitate camping.

As much as it facilitates camping, it also facilitates approaching. Its easy to pick CP for both sides. I'm for a fixed version of v3 as well.

 

[CT Chia]

iv never actually tried the momentum code nor have i heard much of what it does exactly. anyone mind filling me in on this?

 

[kupo15]

As much as it facilitates camping, it also facilitates approaching. Its easy to pick CP for both sides. I'm for a fixed version of v3 as well.

I'll agree to this. Don't forget, we can make air dodging stop all momentum

iv never actually tried the momentum code nor have i heard much of what it does exactly. anyone mind filling me in on this?

Yea. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=222578 test it yourself because we need opinions of people who actually try it out.

 

[CT Chia]

k il test it out later. im sure il notice whats differ right away, but could u tell me what should be differ lol, so i kno exactly what things to test?

 

[shanus]

k il test it out later. im sure il notice whats differ right away, but could u tell me what should be differ lol, so i kno exactly what things to test?

Like in melee, it transfers momentum from dash speed to entering an aerial. Later tonight I'll be posting a set with optimized momentum courtesy of cape, yeroc & others.

 

[The Cape]

Yeroc Muba and I are working on the char specific one.

Also, if you just make ADing stop all momentum, then you help screw over recoveries. There are no easy fixes to this stuff.

 

[kupo15]

Yeroc Muba and I are working on the char specific one.

Also, if you just make ADing stop all momentum, then you help screw over recoveries. There are no easy fixes to this stuff.

Cape what are you talking about. You lose all momentum....not DI. Try this code out and see what we mean.

Old momentum to prove a point
048668AC 60000000
C28669D8 00000008
C04283D8 FC011040
41820030 C0020008
40A00008 FC000050
807D007C 80630038
2C03000B 40A2000C
C03B0018 FC210032
2C030022 40800008
D03B0008 00000000
045A9328 3F4CCCCD

 

[Dark Sonic]

Yeroc Muba and I are working on the char specific one.

Also, if you just make ADing stop all momentum, then you help screw over recoveries. There are no easy fixes to this stuff.

By "stop all momentum" he doesn't mean litterally halt your momentum. He means remove any extra momentum that you've acquired (in other words, reset to the character's default air speed.)