Melee Will Return For CEO 2015, Project M Dropped, Smash 4 Likely

[EmptySky00]

Dropping P:M for Smash 4trocity for any reason is a travesty.

 

[LancerStaff]

Dropping P:M for Smash 4trocity for any reason is a travesty.

And you wonder why people post spiteful things towards PM.

 

[KOkingpin]

Oh hey look. Another major event running an inferior competitive game that I won't be attending.

 

[EmptySky00]

And you wonder why people post spiteful things towards PM.

Nothing I said should have incited anything spiteful unless you're a child who can't take a differing opinion. I merely see it as a downgrade. People are free to enjoy whatever they want, but it's annoying when people on the obviously losing side (Brawl defenders when/if they still exist) act like their side has equal merit. I'm willing to accept other points of view, but I'm not willing to accept blatantly wrong opinions being pushed as fact. All Smash games are not created equal. I'm sorry that our Dearest Sakurai keeps artificially gimping these games for the sake of his childish idealism, but that's just not my problem.

 

[LancerStaff]

Nothing I said should have incited anything spiteful unless you're a child who can't take a differing opinion. I merely see it as a downgrade. People are free to enjoy whatever they want, but it's annoying when people on the obviously losing side (Brawl defenders when/if they still exist) act like their side has equal merit. I'm willing to accept other points of view, but I'm not willing to accept blatantly wrong opinions being pushed as fact. All Smash games are not created equal. I'm sorry that our Dearest Sakurai keeps artificially gimping these games for the sake of his childish idealism, but that's just not my problem.

Lololol. Trying to defend your silly name calling. I'm afraid to say that you're actively making people hate PM. Do you WANT that or something?

 

[Sleeplost]

I like PM and all, but it's a Mod. That's the bottom line. It was an extremely dedicated mod, but I think we should've left it at that. The PM fanbase already dug a splinter through Smash, we don't need to pour salt into the wound.

 

[MegaMissingno]

If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. Just stick to talking about how much we do like PM.

On the flipside though, anyone who's about to hate an entire game just because some players are rude isn't really any better. Take a long hard look in the mirror, because you're being exactly what you complain about.

 

[ToadsterOven]

Dropping P:M for Smash 4trocity for any reason is a travesty.

Aaaaannnnnndddddd we don't need garbage comments like these taking up space here in the comments section. By all means you ARE welcome to your opinion on smash 4, but do realize that saying things like "smash 4trocity" is basically like putting out bait to try and tempt other posters into typing something ill mannered. In other words, your comment I'm quoting and replying to is just asking for trouble.

Again, you are welcome to have your opinion on smash 4, but do try to avoid baiting your posts like you did just now in the future.

 

[byebye]

But melee is still around so..... I dunno

again, just like I said earlier, melee is the exception, not the rule.
and how sure are you melee will be around for long? ask Mr. Wizard.
after several years, broodwar still lost foothold. just like any other competitive game.

 

[byebye]

Seems mostly irrelevant as far as the competitive scene goes. You played "football" but you didn't play in the NFL. And likewise, if the newer smash games don't appeal to actual competitors, it doesn't matter what game the majority of people are playing if they don't go to tournaments or support streams. And going even further, I'd say this is just plain wrong. For example Melee is doing great as far as a scene goes. Even when compared to newer games of the same genre. I imagine quite a few Melee players in todays era didn't grow up with the game. And that's a good thing. Something shouldn't be respected just because it's new. But because it's good.

when I meant football, I meant soccer, sorry.
and no I did not play in NFL, still didn't change the fact that kids will watch NFL now, kids will play football in Unis in the future. but kids won't watch and play SF3 now. They'll be exposed to SF5 instead. They'll grow up and compete in SF5 or maybe SF6.

 

[IIWaveII]

Come now everyone. Just play the game that you enjoy most. I don't understand why we're all at war with each other because our games are different. In the end, it IS Smash no matter how you look at it. If we cannot gain peace with each other, then we will NEVER be a community like we desire.

As for the people who are blaming the Smash 4 community and the game itself, please elaborate on what we did wrong? I'm really confused on how we got the finger pointed at us. Just like you guys, all we want to do is play the game and have fun just like you guys. But it's not as fun when people **** on you for playing the game. That's not cool. The same goes for the people who poop on melee or PM. We gotta work on this guys. we need to stop fighting each other before we just destroy ourselves and then no one is happy. Please guys, let's kill the negativity in the smash community and bring some positive things in, because I'll be damned before I let this community die.

 

[LancerStaff]

If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. Just stick to talking about how much we do like PM.

On the flipside though, anyone who's about to hate an entire game just because some players are rude isn't really any better. Take a long hard look in the mirror, because you're being exactly what you complain about.

So people actually want to be associated with pathetic fanbases? Riiiiiight.

Hate is bad. Haha, you're not winning this argument.

 

[standardtoaster]

I just know to keep PM alive for the fans, streaming it or hosting it at any big event could cause issues such as having the game taken down for good. Not trying to stir things up but I just want to clear the air that the decision isn't really ours to make otherwise I'd be up for hosting it. Although I was honest when I said hosting 3 different Smash Games at an event with more than just Smash would definitely be a challenge.

I'm still honestly surprised that this is supposedly a thing. Project M has been streamed at hundreds of tournaments every week and Twitch does not seem to have a problem with it. VGBootCamp almost always streams Project M both at Xanadu and any event they travel to. Why would Twitch all of a sudden have an issue with Project M being streamed at a prominent tournament (lots of exposure and entrants)?

 

[jtm94]

Project M is a mod

This only makes me stronger!!!!

 

[MegaMissingno]

So people actually want to be associated with pathetic fanbases? Riiiiiight.

Hate is bad. Haha, you're not winning this argument.

I think you've completely misread what I'm trying to say here. Hate is bad, yes, which is exactly why you shouldn't go hating the game or calling the entire fanbase "pathetic" just because of a small minority of jerks. Two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[Narpas_sword]

http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2939
Pretty much how these threads go.

Mods should just stomp through here and infraction anyone making derogatory comments towards other players/games.

Opinions are fine, but say them politely.

 

[PillsBuryDopeBoy]

This was brought up awhile ago so I can't really be angry, plus this is a FGC event featuring many games so it does make sense that all 3 games can't be played.

Just kinda sad to see P:M slowly disappear....

 

[JagoTheTiger]

I guess no one respects or care for us Project M players.Not alot of big tourneys are hosting us this year.

 

[Banjodorf]

We'll either see PM come back to the big stages as people stop watching Smash 4 tourneys, or if it's Nintendo stopping it behind the scenes see an increase in PM tourneys in small venues.

I just don't expect Smash 4 to have a long and fulfilling competitive scene, or at least one filled with hype, as I've yet to find Smash 4 matches I enjoy really watching. Maybe once people figure out the game more...I guess? or something, but there's something about the speed of PM and the wider range of characters used than Melee that makes it a big draw for me.

 

[KMAL]

We'll either see PM come back to the big stages as people stop watching Smash 4 tourneys, or if it's Nintendo stopping it behind the scenes see an increase in PM tourneys in small venues.

I just don't expect Smash 4 to have a long and fulfilling competitive scene, or at least one filled with hype, as I've yet to find Smash 4 matches I enjoy really watching. Maybe once people figure out the game more...I guess? or something, but there's something about the speed of PM and the wider range of characters used than Melee that makes it a big draw for me.

I fully agree with you. I wish we could have a legitimate answer as to why PM is being cut out.

 

[byebye]

I fully agree with you. I wish we could have a legitimate answer as to why PM is being cut out.

ceo stated so already. even posted in this very forum. pm needs to be cut so pm could live.

 

[Gionni]

Man what a coincidence, 2015 seems like the anti PM year

 

[Gionni]

The problem is that so many people see us as the "Smash community," and TO's don't want to only run games for the "Smash community." We aren't a community anymore. Smash 4 made sure of that. Smash 4 is hurting both PM and Melee as a game, and plenty of the members of the Smash 4 community and Melee/PM community are arguing over their games.
If Nintendo had released Smash 4 with the same type of promotion they've done for their past games, this wouldn't be a problem. Instead, they pretending to listen to our complaints about Brawl and the early versions of Smash 4. They invited primarily top level Melee players to the Smash 4 invitational at E3. They implied this game would be the middle ground we wanted, and while that would create tension among Smash fans, it would be fine.
But that isn't what happened. Smash 4 is not the middle ground, but the blatant exposure Smash 4 has gotten has made people believe it is. I legitimately believe that if Smash 4 had been released without pretending to care about the competitive community, it would've gone the same path as Brawl, but much, much sooner. I've seen far to many people say it has "fixed all of Brawl's problems," but never once have a seen any of them bother to elaborate.
Ever since Smash 4 came out, we haven't been the "Smash community" anymore, just like what happened with Brawl. In the last couple of years, when Melee and PM were the 2 main games for Smash by far, we were a community. The games coexisted, and as one grew, the other grew. Sure, there were some tensions between fans of the two games, but nothing serious. On the other hand, Smash 4 is clearly hurting the growth of PM, and even Melee fans are lashing out at it.
I'm glad CEO is giving a reason for their decision, and it's certainly understandable given that Smash 4 is the new game. However, exactly how long is it going to stay 'new?' This isn't a one time thing. Smash 4 is hurting the community because Nintendo couldn't stick by their word. They've already decided to stop doing balance patches in a metagame that you don't need to a research team to help you realize one character is dominating the rest of the cast.

Sorry for my admittedly biased rant. I could go back and make it seem neutral, but I simply don't want to. I'm legitimately upset, and I'd like that to be known. I'm already fighting the urge to explain each and every thing I dislike about Smash 4 as a competitive game. All bias aside though, it's hard to argue against the statement that the "Smash community" is no longer one community, and that Smash 4 has dealt a serious blow to it rather than helping it.

I disagree, nothing has really changed since the release of smash 4, and that game is not why apex and ceo dropped PM, it could be but because Nintendo wants to see their game being played and not something they didn't create, and I'm one of those people that played the **** out of brawl and I think that smash 4 is really better and I love(d) brawl, in the end we must understand that PM is something that shouldn't exist in a legal way and I think that we are lucky that nintendo didn't shut PM down years ago

 

[Kati]

If Sm4sh is actually worth it, then no problem. If not, then the love for PM will allow the game to endure after Sm4sh stops making Nintendo money and they promptly stop caring.

 

[RanserSSF4]

Seeing PM getting dropped from CEO sucks, but at least they explained why it was dropped!

To most of the people who say "PM is disappearing/dying," it's NOT! The scene for it will still be strong and keep going strong just like Melee. I understand due to nintendo giving out support for smash 4 (i'm a big nintendo fan and LIKE smash 4 more than brawl competively), but we still make PM grow.

I do also want to mention this: it's fine if people don't like smash 4, melee, brawl, smash64, or even PM, but don't s*** on other people who have different opinions. Going at each others throats isn't going to help or solve the problem. Remember what happened during the Brawl Era? Most of the melee community who didn't like Brawl just because it's not melee or not as competive as melee or just different than melee insulted the brawl players and it's scene. This is one of the reasons the community was divided. If no one did this back than, brawl and melee could've coexisted together despite how different they are!

I will agree with this though; from a competitive perspective, Brawl is definitly not as hype to watch and not as competitive as Melee, simply because brawl is too defensive. IMO, having defensive options isn't a bad thing in a smash game, but i think many need to realize that Melee to can be campy as well (although i personally think aggressive play is much more rewarding in melee than playing defensively). Even footsies/spacing is a key part of every smash game (This is shouting out to the guy who said "boring footsies and spacing."). Marth is the best example of this in melee, brawl, and smash 4.

Although i do like smash 4 from a competitive standpoint and i do think it's competitively better than brawl and more hyped to watch, i still prefer melee and PM, and i will admit; even though Smash 4's aggressive play is buffed, it's still very difficult to pull off and the defensive options are still stronger options, even though the defensive options IMO are nerfed, but as i mentioned before, having defensive options isn't a bad thing. is playing defensively enjoyable to watch? Too most, DEFINITLY NOT! is it a viable option? Yes!

NOTE: i have also played Injustice competively and i know playing defensive isn't enjoyable to watch most of the time, i did eventually get used to it, so that's also why i'm used to the defensive play. I'm also more of an aggressive type player, which is why i main falcon in smash 4!

 

[Da Man]

The downfall of Project M begins it seems.

 

[ZomBiehn]

That's what everyone needs to understand, project M is a Mod simply put, I can see why they would drop it for Sm4sh, Still going anyway

 

[TreK]

Seeing Project M being dropped out really makes my day.

Seeing a behavior like this from someone out of the Melee subcommunity is both surprising and upsetting.
I hope you're having a bad day.

Dropping P:M for Smash 4trocity for any reason is a travesty.

Seeing this kind of behavior from someone out of the Melee subcommunity is both surprising and upsetting.
I hope you're having a bad day.

 

[GHNeko]

oh look

people from various communities **** slinging and other people (for some UNGODLY REASON) attribute said people's ****slinging to the whole community of which ****slingers stem from.

when the **** will people learn that the actions of few do not represent the actions of many, even if the many are not reprimanding the few? christ.


that being said.

PM isnt dying. it was dropped from 2 tourneys within a short period of time for each other. that's no where near enough evidence to rationally support that sort of outlook.

just like based jebailey said, PM lovers need to wait it out and take the moral highroad.

and people who talk **** about other games need to get a grip. it's okay to dislike a game and state that you dislike it, but there is no reason to insult other games.

this community man jeez.

 

[ChikoLad]

now I wouldn't say that. I'm sure most big tourneys are gonna push PM aside for 4, but as soon as the hype dies it'll go back to Melee+PM.

Why should Smash 4 ever be pushed out? As it stands, it's a fine game with it's own scene. Diddy is a problem right now, but he won't be forever, people just aren't willing to practice against him which is why he dominates.

I love Project M, but even in the future, I'd love to see Smash 4 over it, if I had to choose. It's a much more different game to Melee than Project M is, meaning it has it's own flavour and it's own fans.

Project M is not identical to Melee by any stretch, but it was made with Melee fans in mind, and Melee fans will always have Melee. While it has it's own fans that don't play Melee, I think the Smash 4 fans in that situation will always outweigh them, since Smash 4 is much more different to Melee than Project M is.

 

[NotAnAdmin]

And Is a mod also while Smash 4 is an official game sooo..

So?
It may not be official, but it's still the fast paced game we all know and love. PM is absolutely stellar, and throwing it away because of such an irrelevant cause makes no sense to me.
I'm not saying PM HAS to take presence over Smash 4, but for all the hard work everyone has put in, between the devs and the people who try to become the best at the game, it should get some kind of recognition in tournaments, even as a smaller side tourney.

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

The problem is that so many people see us as the "Smash community," and TO's don't want to only run games for the "Smash community." We aren't a community anymore. Smash 4 made sure of that. Smash 4 is hurting both PM and Melee as a game, and plenty of the members of the Smash 4 community and Melee/PM community are arguing over their games.
If Nintendo had released Smash 4 with the same type of promotion they've done for their past games, this wouldn't be a problem. Instead, they pretending to listen to our complaints about Brawl and the early versions of Smash 4. They invited primarily top level Melee players to the Smash 4 invitational at E3. They implied this game would be the middle ground we wanted, and while that would create tension among Smash fans, it would be fine.
But that isn't what happened. Smash 4 is not the middle ground, but the blatant exposure Smash 4 has gotten has made people believe it is. I legitimately believe that if Smash 4 had been released without pretending to care about the competitive community, it would've gone the same path as Brawl, but much, much sooner. I've seen far to many people say it has "fixed all of Brawl's problems," but never once have a seen any of them bother to elaborate.
Ever since Smash 4 came out, we haven't been the "Smash community" anymore, just like what happened with Brawl. In the last couple of years, when Melee and PM were the 2 main games for Smash by far, we were a community. The games coexisted, and as one grew, the other grew. Sure, there were some tensions between fans of the two games, but nothing serious. On the other hand, Smash 4 is clearly hurting the growth of PM, and even Melee fans are lashing out at it.
I'm glad CEO is giving a reason for their decision, and it's certainly understandable given that Smash 4 is the new game. However, exactly how long is it going to stay 'new?' This isn't a one time thing. Smash 4 is hurting the community because Nintendo couldn't stick by their word. They've already decided to stop doing balance patches in a metagame that you don't need to a research team to help you realize one character is dominating the rest of the cast.

Sorry for my admittedly biased rant. I could go back and make it seem neutral, but I simply don't want to. I'm legitimately upset, and I'd like that to be known. I'm already fighting the urge to explain each and every thing I dislike about Smash 4 as a competitive game. All bias aside though, it's hard to argue against the statement that the "Smash community" is no longer one community, and that Smash 4 has dealt a serious blow to it rather than helping it.

This is why I think Nintendo is kind of a dirty company in general. They love playing it safe and know that their fans will pretty much at this point buy whatever they make or say. So when Nintedno was finally about do something goes against it plain jane business model. Everyone lost their ****. We were hype while the casuals got piss. We were dancing in the streets.

Anyway my point I wanna make is that you're not biased sir. You just don't want to see another community divide. I don't want to see that either. And i know I'm going to get eaten alive for saying this, but I felt Smash 4 shouldn't have gotten patched to begin with. We should have just rocked with it you know. The patch has done more harm than good. A FG developer making 100 patches doesn't mean they support the game. Acknowledging a community like this, and making timely changes to the system. Not just fixing someone you get bodied by.

 

[yawns56k]

I understand being upset P:M won't be at yet another major national I agree it's a painful situation for people hoping to participate but some of y'all act like y'all can't still play P:M

 

[Flawed]

Where's brawl? Oh wait, you mean you guys realized that game is terrible now that a new game came out?

 

[KirbyandSonicrock14]

Where's brawl? Oh wait, you mean you guys realized that game is terrible now that a new game came out?

Yeah I heard from the local IL guys here that prereg for Brawl is pretty bad. I knew Brawl was just being played because of name value, and not wanting the serious side of the game die. It's like how soul Calibur 3 was when it was a competitive game. It was bad, but diehard SC players played it since SC2 was in the books and an SC4 was uncertain at the time.

 

[WinterShorts]

Where's brawl? Oh wait, you mean you guys realized that game is terrible now that a new game came out?

Well it's still being shown at apex 2015 so that's gotta mean something, right?

 

[GHNeko]

It's like you guys intentionally respond to obvious b8 for reasons that are unfathomable.

If a post is obvious b8, don't respond it it because you give them a reason to post even more b8, and then the quality of the thread is dragged down even further.

 

[PootisKonga]

Project M is a mod

Your point is...?

 

[Tino]

I don't get why some of y'all are feeling sour about Project M being dropped from the event, considering it's not even a real Smash Bros. game. I'll never understand the Smash fanbase these days.

 

[PootisKonga]

I don't get why some of y'all are feeling sour about Project M being dropped from the event, considering it's not even a real Smash Bros. game. I'll never understand the Smash fanbase these days.

It's a mod created by the community for the community. Nintendo turning a blind eye and having those they sponsor drop PM ultimately allows it to continue to grow without all of the legal repercussions it could have if they officially recognized it.

So no, it's just as real a Smash game as the others. Nintendo recognizes that and its potential enough to leave it alone.

Plus they said themselves that managing three Smash games would be too much, so of course they'll be dropping something that is admittedly expendable at the time being to play the shiny new game that could garner more Nintendo support.