Megaman Zero Mafia/Newbie 21! Game Over. Mafia Wins!

[#HBC | BadWolf]

I wouldn't lynch BW just because he seems sneaky each game. I'd prefer we get some real evidence.

@Ori - how so? What do you take from low activity and high activity?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29xJRc329eI

@everyone - is activity a factor in your reads?

Hell no.

Like I said, it's a really tough call. I'm not saying it would 100% be the best move, but Kary asked me, and I answered to the best of my ability. If I had to lynch someone right here right now, that's the move I'd make. Luckily, we have like 3 days before we're forced to make a move.

Lynch town -> get reads. Wtf.

You know what? Sure, lynch me. 'Cause Rake's push on me had so many great points about everything scummy. Lol go for it.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

What makes you think I think you're town?

 

[BSP]

PJB, what if BW flipped Watcher or BG though? Would losing one of those this early be worth more than having more info to look at Rake's push?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Vote: Badwolf

@Badwolf: You're over-reacting to the possibilty of you being lynched, Y/N?


I was going to come in and try whip you guys into shape, but it looks like I don't have to, which is great.

Semi IC advice, I don't know:
Inactive players tend to be harder to read, which gives scum an incentive to lurk, or post less content- so inactivity can be a scumtell

Getting an inactive player lynched can be easy, and leave less of a paper trail, so suggesting or pushing for an inactive lynch can also be a scumtell

Remember to look at people's posts and try and gauge what they intend, though!
There are arguably no hard and fast scumtells!

I have a rule of thumb about inactives i may share with you later

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Then he would claim before getting lynched. If he was lying, the real person would counterclaim, and we'd have a solid scum lynch. If nobody counterclaimed, then we'd have a confirmed townie, and we could move onto Rake/Orbo right then and there.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Yeah I am, but the whole thing I think is that Rake put out this ****ty case which I destroyed and I'm still being looked at. This doesn't make me happy.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

PJB, what if BW flipped Watcher or BG though? Would losing one of those this early be worth more than having more info to look at Rake's push?

Claiming:
If you are a townie with a power role, such as watcher or bodyguard in this case, and it looks like you are going to be lynched, you should typically 'claim' or announce what your role is. This makes you much more likely to be targeted by mafia, but will hopefully avoid you being lynched by town, and it is almost always worth making that trade.

@PJB: you'd technically have confirmed scum between two people given counterclaim. and forcing a power role to claim isn't ideal. but ehh

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Yeah I am, but the whole thing I think is that Rake put out this ****ty case which I destroyed and I'm still being looked at. This doesn't make me happy.

Fair enough. Who do you think might be scum and why?

 

[Ori_bro]

@Ori - how so? What do you take from low activity and high activity?

The more active a game is the more you can judge how people play. With lower activity people don't post a lot. So not much is done. With high activity, things tend to get going faster. People actually investigate into things more to confirm suspicions and the like.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

@everyone - is activity a factor in your reads?

yes

of particular interest are changes in levels of activity

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Fair enough. Who do you think might be scum and why?

I actually don't like Rake's slot. It's not because of the push on me but that he was one-mindedly tunneling. I'm not going to go anywhere with it but right now I'm really interested in how Orbo plays.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

wtf, were you actually watching Rake play? He didn't tunnel you, he was ALL OVER THE PLACE.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Well I've held off on this long enough. Badwolf's flail at the mere possibility of being looked at makes me think he definitely has something to hide. I don't think it's a town PR

Vote: Badwolf

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Be right there with a fork to eat your words. :D

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Why not ?

How is it different than I am treating your slot

1)

Why do you deflect by making the IF so noticeable ?
Why not simply say : Were i to be scum I would want an IC to buddy ?

2)

Why make such a big deal over having your computer on ?

Gheb wasn't even applying any pressure to you, he was just being advice dog about answering vs. not answering.
Why did you feel the need to say It seems like your over-reacting when someone even mentions your name.

3)

What makes my gameplay "spaz" ?
Also why are already attempting to discredit my scum read on you even if it is a RVS read ?

It would have been just as easy to say : No , Rake's push does not feel legitimate , but instead you take the time to call it me being "spaz". Again it seems a tad aggressive for this stage in the game.

4) What sort of red-flags would make you take more notice , is Kary line of loaded questions more of a red-flag or do you have a list of "this is what I should watch for " ?

I take it that means you have me as a null read, are there any slots yet you have a solid idea on ?

Why walk into it , were you taking the question as a joke ?

What had you frustrated, the fact that Kary and I have nailed your alignment ?



Why would a townie enjoy shooting themselves ?

I know you say later "for ****'s and giggles " and this suggest you didn't take the questions seriously , is this because you didn't think Kary meant them legitimately or because you read them as a standard RVS type questioning ?



What sort of vibes do you get from Karys line of questions and do Badwulf's answers seem legitimate to you ?

Why would you have to worry about this if you could make your township shine through ?

And it would be pure WIFOM to boot.




But it wasnt even about you being on, it was advice dog about answering vs not answering , there wasn't really a need for that reaction , do you see what I am saying ?



But i never went off on Ori 0_0




So town should be easy after all the scum roles right ?





So do you get anything out of RVS

Badwulf, before I answer that, I have a couple questions for you , after that I`ll tell you exactly what is up.

1st Question : Am I scum for tunneling you ?

If i swap my attention elsewhere, and you agree with that swap, would you back me up pressuring that slot ?

That makes it sound like there is a particular slot which has caught your eye besides mine, is that accurate ?

Also i`m interested in pressuring Gheb.

Gheb is an experienced player.
At yet he has chosen to go straight to the path of advice-dog early this game, and he has yet to comment on much beyond liking how BSP stood up to me and telling me to chill my tunneling.
The only other thing i can recall is his little back and forth with King of Brawl about lynches and such.

And while this isnt necessarily scummy, it raises the question of what Gheb is really doing and why he has yet to make a real comment (i.e taking a stance on either side of our back and forth ) , or more than what i have already stated, pressuring him may incline him to do so.

Pre-emptive UNVOTE

Last question: I give you a gun, who do you shoot and why ?

Better question is why do you think he isn't scum ?

Fixed that for you.

He was tunnelling.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Ok you just quoted 10 of Rake's posts. He literally has like 130 posts in this thread.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

EBWOP: 74* For some reason I thought I remembered seeing that he had about 128 posts. Must've been my imagination.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

That's still 1/7th of his posts.

 

[Dooms]

EBWOP: 74* For some reason I thought I remembered seeing that he had about 128 posts. Must've been my imagination.

You also have to consider that most of his other posts were responding to other people, and there were more than 10 posts that involved pressuring BadWolf.

I do agree with the fact that BadWolf was tunneled on by Rake. If you have a primary focus of attacking one person through out most of your posts and then ask a few questions on the side to other players, it's still considered tunneling. From Page 3 to 5 (40 ppp) he had tunneled BadWolf pretty hard. After that point, he stopped applying pressure to everyone pretty much and just answered questions/had discussions with people until his replacement. I thought he was all over the place, too. His thoughts were. However, most of his pressure went straight to BadWolf.

On the other hand, Rake DID get discussion going in other places. He pressured a few other people besides BW as well, but like I said, most of his pressure went to BadWolf. What he did isn't something I'd consider scummy. I just think he was really confused about BadWolf and wanted to get a strong read on him.

@Joker: Why is BadWolf scum for (in your point of view) being wrong? It's obvious that BadWolf feels like he was tunneled. (which he was, and Rake even admitted to it that he was tunneling BadWolf) Do you think he's lying about this?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

ok, so 7.4% of rake's posts are him pressuring you.

whereas roughly 90% (I'm not gonna do the math) of your posts are you responding to pressure that you're under just to stay alive. When Kary asked you who you thought we should be looking at, you responded with something to the effect of "Rake, except I don't actually think so." Then went back to defending yourself when you only have 2 votes on you. You maybe wanna help us find scum instead?

 

[Dooms]

Badwolf, top 3 scum picks please?

Would you consider lynching an inactive today?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

@Joker: Why is BadWolf scum for (in your point of view) being wrong? It's obvious that BadWolf feels like he was tunneled. (which he was, and Rake even admitted to it that he was tunneling BadWolf) Do you think he's lying about this?

I don't think he's scum for being "wrong". I think he's just behaving in an overly defensive, extremely jumpy manner. It doesn't sit well with me. He basically only posts anything when someone calls him scum, then goes back to hiding.

Rake tunneling Badwolf does not make Rake scum, it just means that he was pressuring one of the only players who had said or done something of interest to him. To be fair, there hasn't been a ton of other activity that Rake could have focused his attention on. He "Tunneled" Badwolf because Badwolf was actively responding to him.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

ok, so 7.4% of rake's posts are him pressuring you.

whereas roughly 90% (I'm not gonna do the math) of your posts are you responding to pressure that you're under just to stay alive. When Kary asked you who you thought we should be looking at, you responded with something to the effect of "Rake, except I don't actually think so." Then went back to defending yourself when you only have 2 votes on you. You maybe wanna help us find scum instead?

1/7 =/= 7%
Do math better.
1/7 = 14.2%
Good god. Do you want a spoon and knife as well?

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Badwolf, top 3 scum picks please?

Would you consider lynching an inactive today?

I plan on rereading. Although I don't have very many reads right now, I will have more tomorrow and will out them accordingly.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

ok, so i derped that math, but since it's out of 74 posts, it's 13.5%

You just gonna discredit me through my failed math, or you wanna hunt for scum?

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

No I'm discrediting you because you are clearly wanting to paint me scum for a still ****ty push by Rake.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Will talk tomorrow. Bed now.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Rake's actual push has little to nothing to do with it. Your reaction to it, and your reaction to me have me far far more intrigued.

 

[Dooms]

Thank you Bad Wolf.

I want a read on Joker.

Joker, you're reaching. A lot! I honestly want you dead for it. Re-think your 262 before I tell you how wrong you are and how dead I really want you to be right now.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Uhh, ok? You can want me dead all you want, doesn't make me wrong. Maybe it's a bad way to get a read, but it's kind of all I have to go on. I don't think it's reaching that much, Badwolf seems to have a lot of time to play when he's defending himself, but when he's gotta give reads on other players, he needs to wait until tomorrow to do a reread.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

I don't think he's scum for being "wrong". I think he's just behaving in an overly defensive, extremely jumpy manner. It doesn't sit well with me. He basically only posts anything when someone calls him scum, then goes back to hiding.

Rake tunneling Badwolf does not make Rake scum, it just means that he was pressuring one of the only players who had said or done something of interest to him. To be fair, there hasn't been a ton of other activity that Rake could have focused his attention on. He "Tunneled" Badwolf because Badwolf was actively responding to him.

"Let's kill the active ones!" lol no.

Uhh, ok? You can want me dead all you want, doesn't make me wrong. Maybe it's a bad way to get a read, but it's kind of all I have to go on. I don't think it's reaching that much, Badwolf seems to have a lot of time to play when he's defending himself, but when he's gotta give reads on other players, he needs to wait until tomorrow to do a reread.

If it makes you feel any better I'm getting a scummier read on you with every post. :D

Allons-y~

 

[Dooms]

Why are you getting a scummier read on him with every post, BadWolf?

:|.

@Joker: Do you think you're right then? Are you considering real life with the "He basically only posts anything when someone calls him scum, then goes back to hiding." line? I'll just start there.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

@Masque: I don't think RL has much to do with him not posting reads, because he has a ton of time to jump in and say "Hey guys, Rake's case on me was BS, I'm town! Srsly!!" by responding to every little thing.

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Oh he's just able to make the worst assumptions I've seen in a while. The fact that he thinks that Rake went after me because I was active is a lot of bull****. Him also defending Rake's case agianst me is throwing up red flags.

 

[#HBC | Joker]

I never once said that I agreed with Rake's case on you, stop putting words in my mouth

The fact that you have 33 posts in here, and no reads, is suspicious, no? You honestly need to go back and reread the thread, even though you've been following along all this time, and have responded to every little accusation against yourself?

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Why is it suspicious to you? The fact that I haven't read people is a problem?

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Wtf, yes of course it is!

You claim to be active, which you have been, yet you're not reading people.

Reading people = figuring out who is scum and who is town

Figuring out who is scum and who is town = how Town wins the game

Ya know who doesn't need to read people? The scum.

 

[Dooms]

I never once said that I agreed with Rake's case on you, stop putting words in my mouth

The fact that you have 33 posts in here, and no reads, is suspicious, no? You honestly need to go back and reread the thread, even though you've been following along all this time, and have responded to every little accusation against yourself?

You defended his case on BadWolf. Truth or false?

Considering BadWolf's activity in game, did you really expect him to re-read at this point? His last burst of activity was on August the 4th around noon EST, which was when he was still being tunneled and openly admitted that he didn't have reads due to having to defend himself so much (which is reasonable). His next burst of activity started on this page actually. Tonight. What are you expecting from this slot that "only posts when people are calling him scum and then disappears until later".

Why are you pushing something like this instead of something that you can gain information from? Do you really expect to get anything besides aggravation (null tell) from BadWolf?

 

[#HBC | BadWolf]

Wtf, yes of course it is!

You claim to be active, which you have been, yet you're not reading people.

Reading people = figuring out who is scum and who is town

Figuring out who is scum and who is town = how Town wins the game

Ya know who doesn't need to read people? The scum.

I've never claimed to be active....

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Depends what you mean by "defended rake's case"

If you wanna know if I think it was a good case, no. I don't think it was a convincing case. The evidence presented in Rake's case does not lead me to believe Badwolf is scum.

If you wanna know if I think he was justified in trying to build some kind of case to move the game forward, then yes. He said he got reads out of Badwolf as a result of it. I think that's probably true. Seeing how people react under pressure is a legitimate way to try and get reads.