Match Up Export: Wolf

[Goldenadept]

after playing a lvl9 cpu kirby with wolf i retract my previous statement

its easily 100:0 kirby

i mean, his air speed is too much, i couldnt keep up, and his up b is too good as a projectile.
funnily enough all his moves outranged mine and out prioritized mine,
i'm sorry kirby mains. your troll was right, we suck

 

[rsr2]

I hate playing against Kirby's. I can never do anything and then when they inhale me, I feel like giving up everytime. One of my friend's plays Kirby and I can never beat him and he 2-3 Stocks me everytime. It's ridiculous.

So I agree 100:0 for Kirbys due to them being just so good and OP against wolf. Especially at a tournament, when I sit down and there is a Kirby player, I just look at them and shake their hand and say GG before I even choose my character.

 

[C~Dog]

So where's the Wolf main who is good at this game?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

So where's the Wolf main who is good at this game?

It doesn't matter how good the Wolf player is or how bad the Kirby player is. Kirby completely ***** Wolf and there's no hope for Wolf to ever win this.

This is all serious btw I'm NOT trolling.

 

[C~Dog]

Sorry, let me rephrase: Where's the Wolf main who isn't a complete and utter ******?

C'mon, there has to be at least one.

 

[Ishiey]

smh.

The information on the first page is honestly pretty accurate, still. Have fun shieldgrabbing Wolf's safe attacks and approaching through fair and getting punished for every blocked aerial and catching up to Wolf and outranging our aerials and hitting us with a kill move.

Obviously Kirby has other stuff on us too, but you're really uneducated if you think this is more than 60:40 either way. Really.

And also, less trolling (from both ends btw, fun time is over Wolves ) and more MU discussion would probably be a good idea, but I don't mod you guys so w/e.

 

[Sage JoWii]

@CDog- Choice is in California and Kain is in Ohio or somewhere in that region. Go watch vids because they're both good ('cept I only interact w/ Kain since I'm Midwest).

@ Ishieymoro- Honestly I DO think it's a even MU or maybe possibly in Kirby favor. I say this only because I've seen the top level play of this MU; Y.b.M. vs Kain WFs @ an Indiana tourny. But if you compare the two through simple comparison of movesets, mobility, and camping ability, in theory, Wolf wins. I'm honestly open to any 'slight advantage' rating either favor until I can figure out what Y.b.M. does consistently again Wolf to win AND can translate that to this MU thread.

 

[Ishiey]

I've played Y.b.M. in friendlies at APEX. He's DEFINITELY a better player than me (Idk who has more matchup experience, and yes I acknowledge that they're friendlies lol but we played for a while) but the matches were all pretty close. Honestly, I think that as people start focusing more on running away and platform camping in this game, the matchup will shift more in Wolf's favor :/ But we'll wait and see how that turns out lol.

One thing that Y.b.M. did that was actually like, crap I wasn't expecting this (dunno why lol), was always DJ retreating bairs on my shield and never land with a bair. Landing with a bair is just asking for usmash OoS (which imo is pretty good vs Kirby), but even if you DJ it away Wolf can punish with fair/bair/uair OoS :x Grabs are good, focus on your grab game because imo Wolf gets great rewards out of abusing his shield in this matchup.

 

[Seagull Joe]

Wolf beats Kirby 55-45 or even matchup. I will MM any Kirby LOL.

Retreated fairs from Wolf are unpunishable. Wolf just massacres a Kirby that is in the air. Wolf can DI out of the fthrow string at 0. Swallow is NOT guaranteed to kill ever. Even if Wolf is in inhale offstage then he can still recover if he saved his 2nd jump. Wolf can just shine rather then airdodge when being juggled. Wolf outcamps Kirby. Nair>Dsmash is easy on Kirby. Side b is guaranteed outta air release.

 

[Deleted member]

Wolf beats Kirby 55-45 or even matchup. I will MM any Kirby LOL.

Retreated fairs from Wolf are unpunishable. Wolf just massacres a Kirby that is in the air. Wolf can DI out of the fthrow string at 0. Swallow is NOT guaranteed to kill ever. Even if Wolf is in inhale offstage then he can still recover if he saved his 2nd jump. Wolf can just shine rather then airdodge when being juggled. Wolf outcamps Kirby. Nair>Dsmash is easy on Kirby. Side b is guaranteed outta air release.

I'd say it's Wolf's favor for sure in that case.

 

[Staz]

This thread is full of win, seriously wolf should just quit playing kirby, 100:0 matchup.We might have the tools, but kirbys swallow is ABsolutely broken and we cant evade getting hit by it, which means instant death. Even if we camp blaster kirby can just force an inhale and beat wolf so darn easy.

Also it seems kirby just grabs wolf and wins, theres nothing we can do.

this.

Kirby absolutely destroys Wolf.

everyone absolutely destroys wolf... its called shield grabbing

after playing a lvl9 cpu kirby with wolf i retract my previous statement

its easily 100:0 kirby

i mean, his air speed is too much, i couldnt keep up, and his up b is too good as a projectile.
funnily enough all his moves outranged mine and out prioritized mine,
i'm sorry kirby mains. your troll was right, we suck

wolf sucks guys.

Sorry, let me rephrase: Where's the Wolf main who isn't a complete and utter ******?

C'mon, there has to be at least one.

the ones the understand he cant beat kirby duh

smh.

The information on the first page is honestly pretty accurate, still. Have fun shieldgrabbing Wolf's safe attacks and approaching through fair and getting punished for every blocked aerial and catching up to Wolf and outranging our aerials and hitting us with a kill move.

Obviously Kirby has other stuff on us too, but you're really uneducated if you think this is more than 60:40 either way. Really.

And also, less trolling (from both ends btw, fun time is over Wolves ) and more MU discussion would probably be a good idea, but I don't mod you guys so w/e.

wolfs moves arent safe on shield lol ISSDI toward him on shield hit and grab that ****er kirbys grab range is just enough with the little distance gained

Wolf beats Kirby 55-45 or even matchup. I will MM any Kirby LOL.

Retreated fairs from Wolf are unpunishable. Wolf just massacres a Kirby that is in the air. Wolf can DI out of the fthrow string at 0. Swallow is NOT guaranteed to kill ever. Even if Wolf is in inhale offstage then he can still recover if he saved his 2nd jump. Wolf can just shine rather then airdodge when being juggled. Wolf outcamps Kirby. Nair>Dsmash is easy on Kirby. Side b is guaranteed outta air release.

he CANT even with his second jump this was proven AGES ago. why? because he only has 2 options. get footstooled for going toward the stage/not moving or be too far away to recover.

and since inhale is so easy to land he can eat him and out camp wolf

 

[Seagull Joe]

Clearly Kirby can grab Wolf from a spaced Bair. D3 can't but Kirby's grab is even bigger.

I can't even take this export seriously when people say utter stupidity.

 

[Staz]

he cant NORMALLY

HOWEVER.

if you ISSDI if wolfs bair touches your shield you get enough distance gained to grab successfully.

especially if its IPSSDI

 

[Deleted member]

Staz, PLEASE, for the love of God tell me you're not serious.

 

[MikeKirby]

Staz if you're so sure about what you're saying just put a video up of yourself utterly destroying a Wolf. -.-

 

[Goldenadept]

he cant NORMALLY

HOWEVER.

if you ISSDI if wolfs bair touches your shield you get enough distance gained to grab successfully.

especially if its IPSSDI

because every Kirby can do this perfectly ever single time wolf uses bair and has the reflexes to shield a frame 4 move with virtually no start up or cool down lag?
yeah, i'd like to see that happen.
grab gimmicks only helps for a little bit then kirby is fighting a horribly one sided battle just trying to get close to wolf.

wolf beats kirby in the air
wolf beats kirby on the ground.
wolfs fair beat out your "saving grace" tactic which is inhale and has the range of marths fair.
i'm not saying this is the MU in a nutshell but according to a certain person here it is

looks like staz is either a troll or an idiot to me :/
i always liked kirby mains, its a shame they let him post on MU's
kirby is a good character with strong options and this MU is close to even if not slightly in wolfs favor but stupid posters like staz really hurt your credibility

 

[Sage JoWii]

@ Goldenadept- How dare you. Obviously we didn't invite him and have been saying he's one rogue, foolish opinion.

@Staz- Vids/ pics or you're a theorycraftin' troll.

 

[Goldenadept]

i didnt say that you invited him and if it seemed that way then i'm sorry, i was expressing my concern on the fact that even though he's a troll with no knowledge of the MU or either character in general you still let him post in here.
i still have a high opinion of all the intelligent kirby mains here that posted useful info, including yourself.
sorry if i came off as ignorant or otherwise mean

 

[Ishiey]

... must... resist... urge... to completely... own... horrible troll... X____x

@ Kirby mains excluding Staz: Any suggestions on which stages are good for each side in this MU? IMO the best starter for Wolf would be battlefield, but that's just me.

 

[Sage JoWii]

I prefer taking Wolf to YI or BF.

I CP to Frigate and/or Japes if legal.

 

[Ishiey]

Interesting... what makes Japes a good CPs for Kirby? I'd CP Kirby to Japes as Wolf tbh @_@ Campy Wolf on Japes is not okay, seriously. Not okay at all. X___x

 

[Staz]

Staz, PLEASE, for the love of God tell me you're not serious.

I am

because every Kirby can do this perfectly ever single time wolf uses bair and has the reflexes to shield a frame 4 move with virtually no start up or cool down lag?

the fastest possible a human can react to something is .10 seconds... or 3 frames. so yes every kirby can.

... must... resist... urge... to completely... own... horrible troll... X____x

@ Kirby mains excluding Staz: Any suggestions on which stages are good for each side in this MU? IMO the best starter for Wolf would be battlefield, but that's just me.

if im horrible.... why umad then?

Interesting... what makes Japes a good CPs for Kirby? I'd CP Kirby to Japes as Wolf tbh @_@ Campy Wolf on Japes is not okay, seriously. Not okay at all. X___x

because inhale>water=death

 

[Sage JoWii]

For once Staz understands that the gimmick is extremely viable on JJ. Also, Kirby kills off the side and while so does Wolf, I feel Kirby has the tools to deal w/ Wolf on this stage. Though, I am rethinking this stance. I'd say Frigate is Kirby's best option for CP.

 

[Ishiey]

I'm not mad lol, just... resisting the urge. You see, I have this problem >___> But that's irrelevant.

@ Japes discussion: Does swallowcide instantly kill off of the right side of the map? Because Wolf will be camping the right side. Always. Kirby lacks the aerial speed/mobility (both vertical and horizontal) to safely approach when Wolf is on a side platform, and once you get close Wolf can just fair through Kirby and camp you from the center platform for a while until you give chase, at which point he runs back to the side platform. As I said before, when you're really intent on running away... not fun :/

Also, any thoughts on Delfino? I actually like this stage against Kirby, don't know why though.

 

[Staz]

For once Staz understands that the gimmick is extremely viable on JJ. Also, Kirby kills off the side and while so does Wolf, I feel Kirby has the tools to deal w/ Wolf on this stage. Though, I am rethinking this stance. I'd say Frigate is Kirby's best option for CP.

why wolf would be good on japes is a mystery he cant side b camp like fox or falco

and kirby lives ALOT longer here because of the extremely high cieling

touch the water once and its pretty much over for wolfs stock and if you do get out before you die... its really really easy to drill kick wolf out of water

 

[Sage JoWii]

The Kirbicide does NOT kill from the right platform unfortunately. Understandable that Wolf camping the right side will downplay this in a match but it's still relevant in the case that Wolf gets knocked over to the left side. Knowing Wolf wants to get back to the right side means punishing will be slightly easier.

My thoughts on Delfino:

If you ask Chu, it's one of Kirbys BEST CPs. I personally think Ps1 is but I would argue that Delfino is top 3. Against Wolf? I wouldn't go to Ps1 too much. Kirby can shark Wolf, use the platforms to approach, and can FC spike in the water. Unfortunately on the walkoff areas I feel Wolf has an easier time getting kills through tech chase, has easier time on water areas w/ a great spike and does at worst, okay on the main stage (aerial).

Not a CP I'd recommend.

 

[Staz]

The Kirbicide does NOT kill from the right platform unfortunately. Understandable that Wolf camping the right side will downplay this in a match but it's still relevant in the case that Wolf gets knocked over to the left side. Knowing Wolf wants to get back to the right side means punishing will be slightly easier.

My thoughts on Delfino:

If you ask Chu, it's one of Kirbys BEST CPs. I personally think Ps1 is but I would argue that Delfino is top 3. Against Wolf? I wouldn't go to Ps1 too much. Kirby can shark Wolf, use the platforms to approach, and can FC spike in the water. Unfortunately on the walkoff areas I feel Wolf has an easier time getting kills through tech chase, has easier time on water areas w/ a great spike and does at worst, okay on the main stage (aerial).

Not a CP I'd recommend.

wolf touching water does though.

kirbys best wolf cp is FD.

why? fd ledges+wolf = 0 chance of recovery

 

[Goldenadept]

I am



the fastest possible a human can react to something is .10 seconds... or 3 frames. so yes every kirby can.

we're talking within the realm of possibility here, not theory craft where every kirby has the absolute fastest reflexes possible, cause in that case the wolf would be just as well off and would escape any inhales.
i understand your need to try and act coy/troll (read: idiotic) but you're only hurting your cause here

once again wolfs strength of great mobility really helps him out on japes, even without side B tricks, kirby is woefully slow as far as movement speed goes and wolf would have a really easy time getting around him and camping.
dair would really hurt wolf should you ever land it and kirby's fsmash seems like it'd beast on JJ.
on the other side of the coin wolf has dsmash which is horizontal and kirby is light, so its really even as to who gets the most benefits there.

i dont like delfino too much on delfino cause i just dont do good on that stage :/

i'm still not seeing why kirby would be rely'ing on inhale like a crutch, its easy to mash out of at lower %'s and like seagull said, wolf will still be able to recover so long as he uses his 2nd jump intelligently.
at higher %'s the wolf will be more wary of inhale and will never let you get in close enough to land it, you'll eat a laser every time.

 

[Staz]

I'm not mad lol, just... resisting the urge. You see, I have this problem >___> But that's irrelevant.

@ Japes discussion: Does swallowcide instantly kill off of the right side of the map? Because Wolf will be camping the right side. Always. Kirby lacks the aerial speed/mobility (both vertical and horizontal) to safely approach when Wolf is on a side platform, and once you get close Wolf can just fair through Kirby and camp you from the center platform for a while until you give chase, at which point he runs back to the side platform. As I said before, when you're really intent on running away... not fun :/

Also, any thoughts on Delfino? I actually like this stage against Kirby, don't know why though.

what ? like sodium build up?

also i forgot but kirby can just shark wolf ALL DAY on japes... no need to deal with projectiles... and if wolf comes down there with him he is dead. kirby doesnt have to approach from the side or above he can jus hit you with the disjoint of uair.

let him get up 1% and he gonna camp down there all day cuz water resets your jumps and kirby has 5.

 

[Sage JoWii]

@ Golden- I'm most known for Kirbicides on the Kirby boards and wherever I am in my region, and even I'm saying that inhale isn't that important in this MU. It's great if you're playing a Wolf that camps and likes to hide in his shield a bit too much because it's a good mixup when approaching. It's good if you land it when a stock ahead. But it's simply not critical in this MU. (Or even that important at all except to get Wolf''s power.)

 

[Ishiey]

@ JoWiiCIDE: Agreed, and I see about Delfino :o That makes sense.

@ Troll: You clearly don't know much about Japes :3 Trust me. Unless you're MK or have a massively disjointed uair (which, iirc, Kirby doesn't have a very disjointed uair), it's a bad idea to try sharking on the side platforms (except if Kirby spaces perfectly since uair has great range, idk can't say I've played a good Kirby on Japes). Also, no my problem isn't sodium buildup, but I have a lot of sodium in my diet and it's something I try to watch out for.

Honestly, I don't see very many ways that Kirby can land an inhale besides Wolf getting greedy near the ledge. Any particularly useful ways that you guys manage to land inhale on Wolf besides that?

EDIT: Super ninja'd lol

 

[Goldenadept]

i think someone said its garunteed out of one of their grabs at lower %'s but at lower %'s its not really gonna come in handy.

i'm not sure but i think wolfs dair would beat out a kirby sharking underneath of JJ, i know kirby's uair is disjointed but wolfs dair will reach below the stage and hit him, i've hit other characters that way at least. it comes down to timing i guess

 

[Staz]

we're talking within the realm of possibility here, not theory craft where every kirby has the absolute fastest reflexes possible, cause in that case the wolf would be just as well off and would escape any inhales.
i understand your need to try and act coy/troll (read: idiotic) but you're only hurting your cause here

once again wolfs strength of great mobility really helps him out on japes, even without side B tricks, kirby is woefully slow as far as movement speed goes and wolf would have a really easy time getting around him and camping.
dair would really hurt wolf should you ever land it and kirby's fsmash seems like it'd beast on JJ.
on the other side of the coin wolf has dsmash which is horizontal and kirby is light, so its really even as to who gets the most benefits there.

i dont like delfino too much on delfino cause i just dont do good on that stage :/

i'm still not seeing why kirby would be rely'ing on inhale like a crutch, its easy to mash out of at lower %'s and like seagull said, wolf will still be able to recover so long as he uses his 2nd jump intelligently.
at higher %'s the wolf will be more wary of inhale and will never let you get in close enough to land it, you'll eat a laser every time.

wolfs laser is slow. he'll just get grabbed every time.

@ Golden- I'm most known for Kirbicides on the Kirby boards and wherever I am in my region, and even I'm saying that inhale isn't that important in this MU. It's great if you're playing a Wolf that camps and likes to hide in his shield a bit too much because it's a good mixup when approaching. It's good if you land it when a stock ahead. But it's simply not critical in this MU. (Or even that important at all except to get Wolf''s power.)

its critical.

it makes it 100-0 because wolf is easy to land inhale on.

@ JoWiiCIDE: Agreed, and I see about Delfino :o That makes sense.

@ Troll: You clearly don't know much about Japes :3 Trust me. Unless you're MK or have a massively disjointed uair (which, iirc, Kirby doesn't have a very disjointed uair), it's a bad idea to try sharking on the side platforms (except if Kirby spaces perfectly since uair has great range, idk can't say I've played a good Kirby on Japes). Also, no my problem isn't sodium buildup, but I have a lot of sodium in my diet and it's something I try to watch out for.

Honestly, I don't see very many ways that Kirby can land an inhale besides Wolf getting greedy near the ledge. Any particularly useful ways that you guys manage to land inhale on Wolf besides that?

EDIT: Super ninja'd lol

KIRBYS UAIR DISJOINT IS HUUUUUUUUUUUGE. so much so that it breaks nado even when inside nado.

also forward throw>inhale works until like 40ish...

and kirbys always one jump away from being in the water on japes..... always.

i think someone said its garunteed out of one of their grabs at lower %'s but at lower %'s its not really gonna come in handy.

i'm not sure but i think wolfs dair would beat out a kirby sharking underneath of JJ, i know kirby's uair is disjointed but wolfs dair will reach below the stage and hit him, i've hit other characters that way at least. it comes down to timing i guess

kirbys uair is about as disjointed as mk's dair lol his feet dont have to touch the stage to hit wolf. which is the only way dair would land.

its that big the whole aerial.





Just tested this.

kirbys inhale forces an air release on contact with water.... so he can in fact kill wolf off the right side with kirbycide

EDIT: WHOA NVM

kirbys inhale for some reason gets higher knockback at higher percents when he jumps in water... i set wolfs damage to 999 and jumped in and he instantly died like so fast that he was invisible

one more thing.

becuase kirby can get out of the water just ALIL faster than wolf he is HIGHLY likely to footstool him after getting in the water

 

[Ishiey]

I was under the impression that Kirby's feet weren't disjointed tbh (I know about uair's massive range, but none of Kirby's other foot attacks are disjointed from what I've experienced). Someone besides the troll back this up?

 

[Goldenadept]

well JJ is banned in almost all tournies so there isnt much use in discussing this anyways right? xD we're getting sidetracked lol.

two of my friends play kirby against my wolf all the time and i only get inhaled if i mess up my spacing/ get impatient and stop playing cautious.
i'd LOVE to see a kirby catch wolf while he was being campy and running away.
its already been determined that the kirby has virtually no chance of inhaling a smart wolf and an even slimmer chance to inhale a wolf by the edge, even IF he did, the wolf can still recover and render that tactic useless.
trolly mc trollerton is just beating a dead horse now.

what stages are bad/not so good for kirby? with his multiple jumps and reletively decent recovery i dont see many stages being too awful for him

 

[Staz]

well JJ is banned in almost all tournies so there isnt much use in discussing this anyways right? xD we're getting sidetracked lol.

two of my friends play kirby against my wolf all the time and i only get inhaled if i mess up my spacing/ get impatient and stop playing cautious.
i'd LOVE to see a kirby catch wolf while he was being campy and running away.
its already been determined that the kirby has virtually no chance of inhaling a smart wolf and an even slimmer chance to inhale a wolf by the edge, even IF he did, the wolf can still recover and render that tactic useless.
trolly mc trollerton is just beating a dead horse now.

what stages are bad/not so good for kirby? with his multiple jumps and reletively decent recovery i dont see many stages being too awful for him

"two of my friends" lol your input is invalid.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiyTxKqafJs

kirbys hitboxes are alot bigger than they seem...

uair is WAY too disjointed for wolfs dair to hit through japes.

 

[Goldenadept]

the validity of that arguement was only strengthened by the fact that you couldnt argue against the fact that two kirby mains have trouble landing inhales against a wolf who plays super campy.
i'm willing to bet that both of them are better at the kirby/wolf MU than you are so their opinions greatly outweigh yours as well.
trolling out of spite is fine by me, but trolling out of ignorance is just silly, and thats that.

like i said, i dont know how far wolfs dair would reach and its highly possible that it wouldnt be worth trying out but since JJ is banned and no one will ever play on that stage the whole arguement is worthless.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

lol @ people calling Staz a troll when he's OBVIOUSLY correct.

 

[Sage JoWii]

Inhale isn't rare to land on Wolf but it's not something Kirbies will aim for.

Also, I honestly don't know whether Kirby's feet are disjoint but imo they probably aren't.

Kirby has NO bad stages. He does well on every stage.

Kirby's best CPs:
Ps1
Delfino
JJ
RC
BF
Frigate
Halberd
Picto

 

[Kewkky]

Ignore Staz. He's one point from being banned. If he trolls again after this post, or censor dodges, or does/says anything worth an infraction, report his message. I am tired of looking at his posts, and I wish I could infract every single one of them, but just to be fair, I'm leaving him unbanned for now.