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Make Your Move 25: Moveset Design Contest — Contest is Donezo! MYM 26 Starts March 17th!


Smash Journeyman
Aug 13, 2007
Quick Announcement! Deadline Extension!

Due to the massive number of entries to read, comment, and edit, we're extending the deadline for both the Reading / Editing Period and the Voting Period. The former period will now end on January 17th, 2023, and the latter will end on January 31st, 2023. Make sure you keep reading, drop some comments where you can, and finish up your edits!


Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
CHAOS CONTROL (Adramelech OldManHan OldManHan )

Too late in the night to really continue my Alex / Mao reads, screw it, Adramelech is short. Lets read it!

It's been stated overall, but Adramelech's mechanic needs some kind of mention of what happens if a non-timer match is played. The idea of manipulating the match's timer is a novel one for a set basis and sets Adramelech up as a powerful grinder who wants to delay the match to hit her power spike, I can dig it. It actually reminds me how me and, IIRC, UserShadow worked on a set for Enrico Pucci from JoJo and that he was going to be able to cause the timer to go faster as well, albeit that was just a coincidental flavor thing rather than a power-up mechanic. Though he WAS going to get more powerful with time, IIRC. Food for thought if me, US or other people go back to that well.

She's certainly slow! Too slow, probably, with only one move below 10 frames. While she obviously early on has a kind of defensive, spacing oriented turbo-charger character, consider that even molasses speed Ganondorf has four attacks under 10 frames (also four AT 10 frames) to try and help him be viable. And also that Ganondorf is still a very low tier character despite that. Personally, I would reduce Jab's starting lag to like Frame 6, lower the sourspot's damage a lot and slightly increase the ending lag (Frame 24-26 rather than 20?) to turn it into a low damage poke contrasting Forward Tilt with a high value sweetspot. If you're worried about the sweetspot being too strong at Frame 6 (which given the huge damage on it, would be reasonable) you can make the sweetspot's damage scale with her timer mechanic. If you're lasting that long in the match, the power-up is fine after all. I'd also say giving Adramelech a move or two that gets faster with the timer going down would be an excellent idea: One that comes to mind is a move that seems useless at the start of the match, but reduces starting / ending lag as the timer goes down until it becomes a combo starter and then a very, very powerful one! This would fit her being weak to quick rushdown (the move's useless early, after all) but strong late (kill confirms from it for comeback potential!).

"Adramelech slams her palm into the ground as the stage rumbles, spacetime fracturing along the surface as physical elements from other stages jut upwards in jagged spikes." This visual effect is cool af, not gonna lie.

I'm surprised Forward Aerial doesn't mention using it for edgeguarding! It feels like such a powerful projectile would be pretty good at it, especially if you set the explosion to go off at the ledge. You could also run off the ledge and turn around -> FAir against it to cover it with a lingering explosion. She is supposed to be good at edgeguards according to her playstyle segment, after all! It could be fun if Back Aerial had enhanced movement with the timer under half, being a larger burst forward for chasing the foe. You could also swap the two frames of shaved starting lag into two frames of shaved ending lag combined with that, which would make it a scarier chasing tool!

Adramelech's Forward Smash is pretty cool! I do wonder if the 1 frame of active hitbox is a bit too precise, but that does exist in Smash itself and it sounds like it fits the visual well. This set's got some pretty sick animations and flavor to it, a definite plus. In general the ending lag on all these smash attacks seems somewhat low to me, consider that as I understand it Adramelech's Up Smash would have 40 total frames (since the move itself mentions the 25 frame ascend as being during the ending lag) and is compared to Palutena's Up Smash of 63. And has about 9 less frames of ending lag to be specific there. At the same time, Up Smash's kill percent seems oddly late for the heavyweight power, so making it have more ending lag but making it's sweetspot kill at 80%~ might give it more of a valuable niche since Adramelech is surprisingly lacking in super early kills. I like Down Smash's additional effects and the Pikachu-esque crawl abilities.

Down Throw's damage potential seems obscene, but thinking about it, it IS decently situational and not THAT different from just a big combo throw in damage (except also being useful at high percents). I do still worry it might overcentralize her gameplan a little given the sheer damage potential vs. her other options, but it's...prooobably okay? I DO think that it should have too much knockback to have any follow-ups after, because then it starts to become a super high damage throw that also has additional combo potential. If you want a combo throw, I would reduce Forward Throw's base damage but given it knockback that allows a follow-up.

Neutral Special feels VERY close to Forward Aerial. I get that there are some differences but, personally, I would keep Neutral Special (and if you want modify it to a tap / hold for some more FAir-ish style) and turn Forward Aerial into another move, maybe something that she can use a bit quicker than other ones and either set stuff up, space a little, or at least add some dimensions to her game by giving her something she can throw out to defend herself some. If you're worried about too much of a spammy quick option for her gameplay, give it bad ending / landing lag so it is more of a risky "get off me" move. Even if you don't do that, I don't think Adramelech needs both Neutral Special and Forward Aerial with how she seems she plays and that FAir could be freed up for something. They even deal extremely close damage and knockback.

Bro Side Special's animation is FIRE. I do question this move a little. Now I'm no Monster Girl Quest lore expert, but just from the intro to the set and googling a moment, isn't Adramelech trying to stop Chaosization like an antibody? If so, it seems to me rather odd that she has an attack that seems primarily designed to increase Chaosization, with the damaging hitbox seeming like almost an afterthought. It actually feels like attaching this to Up Special might feel more...natural, I suppose? Or instead of just opening a damage over time zone, giving the rush a solid hitbox so it comes off like she's launching off an attack with the fabric of spacetime as an anchor and the Chaosization is less the "point" character-wise but rather a side effect. Or, like, a strong sweetspot hitbox where Adramelech is ripping apart space-time maybe? But there's a fair number of strong X hitboxes already so the rush hitbox might be better suited. Necrosis is a cool risk-reward buff and I wonder if some move-specific buffs outside of Down Throw would make sense.

I like Gravity! It feels like a flashy, big payoff move to Adramelech's Timer shenanigans, but in a way that is less "big dumb move" and so feels truly unique within her toolkit. It's a very powerful effect of course with the timer going down, but given the very high starting lag and the fact it IS still situational that's more than welcome. A strong finish to the set!

I'd say I enjoyed Adramelech overall, certainly more than the Yorigami Sisters, although she does strike me as somewhat underpowered right now. Despite being by far the slowest character in Smash for comparison, she does not have a single hitbox that kills below 100%, meaning that she has the kill power of more of a midweight, while she also doesn't really have any combos or anything. In that regard the closest comparison feels like Sephiroth, but Sephiroth has multiple powerful kill moves, is much faster to come out (5 moves frame 10 or faster) and whatnot. I wouldn't touch her ending lag (it could even stand to be higher in some cases), but I think she just needs 1-2 more quick moves to be viable given her lack of other strengths in some areas. I do know her lack of early kill moves is meant to be a weakness, but I think giving her 1 or 2 would be fine, and if you want you could make the early kill moves' knockback strength Timer Dependent so she can kill early percent-wise but not early game-wise to fit her fluff! The playstyle defines her as having "Oppressive Neutral" and "Quick and huge normals", but she's the slowest character in the game in terms of starting lag so I think her neutral is probably flawed if anything. I wish the set went into more detail about how you imagine, say, her edgeguarding and her disadvantage to work, and I think some moves are cool but don't fit into the playstyle as much (Down Aerial, for example). The set's flavor is on point and I do think it had a bunch of cool moves (Forward Smash, Dash Attack especially, I actually like Down Aerial despite it feeling a bit odd here, Down Tilt BUT I have something I'll get to on it). Oh, and to get to that Down Tilt, I would actually swap Down Tilt and Down Smash: Down Tilt's frame data and animation feel MUCH more like a Smash Attack than Down Smash, it actually deals more damage and knockback, and imagine a sick charging animation where spacetime cracks around her and stage bits slowly begin to emerge before they shatter outwards when the attack comes out!

Here and there, I think the timer effects could be more interesting on a per-move basis for some of them, and I actually wish the set leaned a bit harder into the more esoteric animations and power with the TImer (even at the cost of making her weaker initially).

Overall, I'd call her a success. This contest is tough so IDK if she'll stay on my votelist and of course edits could change things up, but I enjoyed her! Good work and I hope when I get to Ilias she'll match up.


Smash Journeyman
Aug 13, 2007
Magalor by UnknownFate UnknownFate

Ah, one of my top 5 favorite sinister eggs... there's a sentence for you.

I had to look up Sphere Doomer, that's an adorably evil design. That said, 25 seconds is a ridiculous amount of time to be stuck in a grab/wait for full payoff. If we're expected to get anywhere near that even with the foe trying to mash out, this is a painfully long stretch of helplessness even early into a stock that's going to result in a fully charged smash. If you assume that it's more like a Pikmin effect (latches on and periodically flinches/causes damage) and the victim can move/attack during it, that's still a long time.

Down Special should probably specify a range/what happens if the foe is under it directly (are they lifted into the air?). I think that and the chain-teleport Up Special might by favorite moves in the set, being a cool concept and a neat twist on the teleport Up Special genre, respctively. I feel Forward Smash is balanced enough that the shockwave it makes can happen without the random chance being factored in.

In general, the concepts of the attacks sound good to me, but I'd love to hear more about the applications of each, how the play into each other or off of Magalor's Down Special's pull, and so on.

Dungeons & Dragons by UnknownFate UnknownFate

Well here's an inspired choice! Technically three characters in one that you pick upon entering or respawning, each with their own twists in their mechanics, stats, Specials, and Smashes. I can say I haven't seen this sort of concept executed this way before, and it's pretty interesting all told.

Getting to the meat of the set, I agree 30 seconds is definitely too long to wait for spell slots, maybe 8 seconds? Enough to make them very valuable, but enough to reward hanging in there and allow you to recoup your spent resources/not condition players to horde them. On the subject of 30 seconds being long, I'd drop Mage Armor's duration to maybe 8 seconds as well, and nerf the knockback reduction- make it 0.85x instead of 0.7x? For something I'd buff, I'd give the Barbarian's Up Special a little jump in the air to ensure they can recover with it (I assume there's meant to be, but there's no mention of it)- otherwise that undercuts their survivability, which feels wrong for what's been consistently one of the tankiest classes in the series.

Aside from that, there's not a ton for me to add- the unique moves are neat, and I like the concept of using weapons from the game for inputs, but I feel like everything could be explored in more depth (especially the grab game). In particular, I'd like to hear the differences that come in application for the shared moves, since the different statistics and Specials/Smashes would recontextualize them in relation to whichever class you've chosen.
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Make Your Move: The New Generation (Alex Almand Almand )

From the sound of things, this has been a major contest for you Almand! Sleaze sounds like a set that's been universally praised, and Alex here has plenty of acclaim as well. You've taken the next step after the Ditto/Ty/Cooking Mama trio that felt like it put you on the map, and in so few sets it feels. Goliso, Bubby and WeirdChillFever were a strong group of newcomers from the MYM19-21 era (okay, so WCF joined earlier, but Kilton feels like WeirdChillFever Relaunch basically) that have blossomed into their own, and now the Tern/Almand combo has come into Make Your Move and put out straight fire. Combine it with the return of veterans and now the new FFC Crew who look eager to begin putting their mark on the contest and it's one of the healthiest situations MYM has had in...maybe even a decade?

Anyway. Alex! Meters! I made my own Alex back in the day and I like how we went into COMPLETELY opposite directions, where my Alex tried to avoid any fighting game mechanics after Balrog while Almand Alex is the exact opposite in bringing over as MUCH as possible from Street Fighter! The punch/kick, motion control scheme is very unique in Make Your Move (apparently Jacky Bryant uses it later which, well, parallel design wow!). I find it very cool, but I do wonder what this means for Alex actually using his Specials in FFAs where auto-turn won't work. Genuinely would consider some kind of psuedo-autoturn in FFAs so that Alex can actually use his motion inputs.

It feels weird Light Flash Chop talks about "why are you going for Specials in neutral" when a Frame 12 attack with a 36 frame FAF is pretty solid in Smash terms, absolutely an attack that would be worth throwing out in neutral, although the input might make it harder. I'd also say that while I get why the range tends to be short / half-Final Destination / full Final Destination, but a lot of the full Final Destination ranges feel kinda ridiculous. Not in terms of balance, really, but like...it feels like Alex sliding with Slash Elbow across all of FD is gonna look kinda ridiculous. Quick Draw doesn't go as far and gets away with it with a low crouch, very fast speed and also Ike doesn't actually attack until he reaches a foe so he's just running. Also it makes it very, very easy for Alex to send himself flying with any tool that sends him in the air, especially given most stages are sub-FD in size. Alex himself may have a lot of mobility options, but he's also a slow grappler, so I don't really vibe with how far they go. The set does at least seem balanced around it, using those FD distances as big blindspots for Alex to overcome and foe's to counterplay with, but I'm certainly worried for it. To be honest, I'd probably cut half-FD to 1/4th or 1/3rd FD and full-FD to half-FD. This is still pretty great mobility but would be less...Off? And probably more balanced. Air Stampede and Head Crush also feel really off this way, like Air Stampede goes really low vertically so Alex is basically going to be floating across the stage. Even if you don't go with my range suggestions I highly recommend lowering these ranges in some way. F-Throw could use some lowering too. Reverse Hyper Bomb is fine since the animation makes total sense to go far and it's a Super anyway so it gets some flashy cushion. It does seem like it might relegate Heavy versions almost exclusively to combos, but maybe that's the point? I do like the Air Stampede / Head Crush mixups, my set had the same thought with them, and Slash Elbow is neat too.

Not gonna lie, I really wasn't feeling Alex at first, because there's a LOT of mechanics that feel like they are trying to sledge against Smash's to work, and that the payoff was reading more like a list of moves than building a more complex combo game. But it starts to come alive once you leave the Specials and get into the other moves, largely because they then lean into explaining the deeper complexity to Alex's combos and how his neutral works. And once that starts to get going, his game really begins to open up, even just quickly starting off with stuff like Dash Attack A which has a terrible hitbox but is one of his most powerful links and can be combo'd into to avoid the terrible hitbox more easily and thus makes certain frame advantages especially valuable to him. It does sometimes feel like the nature of his Zero-Angle means that he funnels into similar combos repeatedly, although given this moveset has...what, 93 moves in it, some level of that would be expected regardless. But it does all circle around to things like Specials nicely, I really enjoy the way that the Standing Grab does a 50/50, his combo game is truly unique and not really like anything else in Smash (or, hell, MYM really), this set IS one of the most unique we had this contest I feel.

I feel like BAir B could hit both sides ala Mii Gunner Down Smash w/ two different hitboxes and be fun. I love these Supers a lot! They feel pretty rewarding and suddenly give Alex this potent risk-reward factor of choosing to hold EX Moves back in order to potentially get very strong stock enders that recontextualizes the EX Moves as a bit more risk-reward because you can hold back on them to try and get Super stock enders late, which also opens up more value to trying out alternative combo paths rather than just going for the obvious plays. The way Zero-Angle works was making me wonder if the moveset might lean a bit too heavily on just finding something ideal and doing it over and over again, since Alex doesn't deal with the same differences over time as other characters, so adding in an alternative reason to do things different definitely boosted this set in my eyes.

I've also been a bit down on the set to start, so I'll do a little bit of gushing here about the good parts, like the fact that I think that Alex's movement options from Air Stampede and Head Crush plus stuff like EX Slash Elbow's single hit of armor give him a really interesting approach game that combined with his grounded style and things like Zero-Angle make him incredibly unique. This set goes into incredible detail on just HOW everything works to the point that I didn't find myself questioning much and I couldn't really find things like infinite or serious combo loops which given how it works mechanically is impressive, plus it really lets you dive into HOW the combos work on a frame-by-frame level. I feel like I could study this document for a week and really understand the set. The way grabs and command grabs work does give me some real concerns about how much it, uh, works in Smash given the prospensity for things like platforms or slopes or brief gameplay stuff to change aerial states a little or whatever spaghetti, but I love how it works with standing grab 50/50s and the way the super fast grab gives him a very different melee style. The set feels for the most part well balanced, if probably on the strong side, which ALSO feels impressive given the sheer number of levers to be pulled here. I actually did look through the entire combo system at the bottom and then reread the chart some after reading which I think does a lot to help actually understand the depth behind Alex's combo game, so I recommend anyone reading Alex also do that. Like daaaaaaaaang dude this guy has some flashy combos on par with Primordial Darkness' flashiness in power! The Design Musings also give some valuable insight into the moveset's philosophy and style.

If I had to make one suggestion, I would transform just a few Zero Angle moves into more normal angle moves. It isn't like Street Fighter has no launchers and it feels like it would make sense to translate that somewhat into Smash's engine and allow Alex to recontextualize some of his moves to how the foe is launched, let him use things like platforms a bit more, and so on. This isn't an edit I'd push for as hard as the range edits (which honestly feel necessary), but it was something I thought throughout the set. This set's also one of the most beginner unfriendly sets I've ever seen since unlike 99% of them you can't even just rotate the stick and throw out attacks and do stuff, to the point it DOES feel like a downside to me but it's kind of inherent to the design and it has enough interesting to overcome it.

Since Alex has a truly ridiculous number of inputs (for good or ill), so I'm just going to list a bunch of attacks I like below and a small comment if I want / didn't comment it above:

Dash Attack A
Jab B (That's a really novel way to translate a "Low"! I might use this on my own at some point)
Up Tilt A
Forward Smash A
Forward Smash B
Up Smash A
Forward Aerial A
Down Aerial A
Down Aerial B
Standing Grab (Fun 50/50 play here)
Up Throw
Down Throw ("The victim has a funny animation, I love this throw." I relate to this)
Hyper Bomb
Hyper Power Bomb
Boomerang Raid
Stun-Gun Headbutt (Yes it's gimmicky bull**** but it's FUN)

Overall, Alex is a set that is RIDICULOUSLY difficult for me to evaluate, but for the most part seems really good and unique. I do think the ridiculous range on some moves which give some very off animations harm the set to me, if that's fixed it'll go up some on my rankings, and that a lot of the good does come with some odd downsides. But the complex and varied combo game, super unique mechanics for Smash and more give it a flair that isn't really matched by a lot of sets. Good work, I'll be very interested to get to Sleaze which by all accounts is even better!
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
ohnyo (Oono Tsukuyo Katapultar Katapultar )

Can we take a moment to appreciate how Tsukuyo here is adorable? Look at that run in the stats section. Cute! Also glad to see more super heavyweight cute girls here.

Tsukuyo instantly starts off with a rather unique shield mechanic that combines self-heals, self-shield heals and a fighting game-style cancel that's rather unique by forcing a shield. Jigglypuff-style shield breaks are rarely used in MYM sets, despite existing in Smash itself, and here also serves as pretty big drawback to a shield that otherwise feels very powerful. It's punchy to start off, that's for sure! I like the way Up Special balances it's Mr. Game & Watch Up Special (one of the most annoying moves in the game) roots by requiring a hit to not be extremely punishable and thus discouraging spamming, ending up feeling similar to Zelda's teleport in that way especially with how it can kill confirm. The idea of using Pac-Man's Fire Hydrant as a base for a replacement ninjutsu style attack also feels logical, and placing it on Up Special provides some kinda cool risk-reward I don't think we normally see on this type of blow. Modifying the traits of the shurikens on Down Special based on direction feels novel and like a good twist on Metal Blade, and I can already see how it'd work out well with sya...Up Special sending Tsukuyo high into the sky. I gotta say I actually love the "throw charge" mechanic on them as well, with some unique boomerang movement on display here. One thing I wonder, can Tsukuyo only throw her shurikens at 4 angles (up/down/left/right) compared to Mega Man then?

"Yes, the explosive shuriken is a shuriken bound to a stick of dynamite with sticky tape. " somebody protect this poor cinnamon bun

To be honest, with how the trading effect of the explosive shurikens seems kinda difficult, I question if Tsukuyo needs to lose all of her progress when being hit out of Down Special. Also the move says "If Tsukuyo does not trade within 45 frames of both fighters being free to act from their trade, the number will drop back to 0 and she’ll have to start all over." but also says "You may have noticed the “no trades for 3+ seconds” part of the table. If Tsukuyo does not hit or get hit for that long before she uses her Down Special, she’ll get a shuriken that deals no knockback, so it has even greater follow-up potential than a returning steel shuriken. Not trading for that long generally requires a good amount of space, typically after knocking an opponent away." So...does it look at the last 45 frames or the last 3+ seconds? I'd probably be in favor of the larger number here.

Neutral Special, overall solid, feels like a good move to glue together her playstyle and I must say I enjoy the Shield Cancel aspect of it and how that gives it some different uses. Nothing super wild, but pretty solid. Side Special definitely gives her heavyweight power she was lacking in the rest of the Specials, I like the way the super armor works and the way the damage-based armor can reduce knockback is unique, although I will say I think it would have been balanced anyway. The stats without charging at similar to Flying Slam, except it trades being MUCH slower (Flying Slam is Frame 6!) for super armor. Plenty balanced, in my opinion. Shuriken combos here are fun.

The fact that Tsukuyo learns how to dive better as she uses Dash Attack is cute and some good characterization. Dash Attack in general is a fun cross-up move, color me a fan. Shield Cancel sliding to solidly carry things around is fun! In general this attack ties together with her game in a lot of fun ways.

Randomly, Forward Tilt ends up making me think of another fighting game character in Elphelt Valentine from Guilty Gear, probably due to the gun, the rabbit theming, but also the moveset in some parts reminds me of that. I wonder if she's the kind of character you'd ever make? Kinda love Forward Tilt anyhow with its inwards combo edgeguard mixup kinda shtick, it actually reminds me of Morgan's Forward Tilt as well with the melee-range blindspot. Good Standards all around.

Forward Smash is fun in a lot of ways, but I particularly like the way she can body slam offstage and basically use herself as a Villager Forward Smash to riskily kill people offstage. I also generally appreciate this set isn't afraid to give her some HEFTY heavyweight attacks despite her tools, especially since it feels very balanced. I think it'd be easy to fall into a trap of not giving her hard hitting attacks and making her feel bizarrely weak and you avoided that.

"U-Smash is the rare move that uses up one stock of Tsukuyo’s Neutral Special, even if she cancels it. Without ammo, U-Smash loses its horizontal tipper hitboxes + some reach, only deals 0.94x as much knockback in general, loses the non-flinching bullet hitbox and looks quite silly as Tsukuyo appears to be failing her gun around aimlessly." You should edit Neutral Special saying it is the only move to use ammo to say something like "one of the only moves" then.

This is random but something I want to praise this set for, reading Up Smash, is NOT feeling the need to make it so Everything works on every move. I like the fact that shield-cancelling a tipper doesn't give Tsukuyo anything, for example. I think it's easy, when writing a moveset, that what a character can't do is as important as what they can do. Gaps in what is possible with a character's mechanics, moves that have uses in their set that don't affect their broader mechanics, attacks with weaknesses in the way they don't utilize a mechanic a lot of attacks have as a crutch...in addition to weaknesses for balance, how things like this are played around is part of the essence of a fun set. At least, that's what I think. Down Smash is also similar, not feeling a need to force in some shuriken idea and making the cancel fairly basic when it has a strong niche already. Forward Aerial is a great example, too: It's just a good move for Tsukuyo to use as a move without any interactive worry.

Down Smash is unexpected in a good way, being a combo starting Mewtwo Down Smash, I think this helps make sure Tsukuyo has enough "ninja" gameplay feel outside of "heavyweight" and "gun", so good work. I think the caltrops also avoid feeling too "gimmicky" because getting across that ninja style is important to Tsukuyo, so it feels like sprinkling in an aspect of her character rather than "move needs to be interesting". The caltrops also serve an interesting niche within Tsukuyo's playstyle.

Tsukuyo's aerials are all good and stand out for having some good effects without feeling as overly gimmicky as Miruca (although I do wonder about BAir's bury or higher momentum, buuuut the bury is a fun effect and it's not that wild. Wii Fit Trainer Jab exists. I can accept it for a neat effect), a lot of them feel like they serve important spots in her playstyle and help smooth her melee in to go with stuff like Forward Tilt or playing around shields. Up Aerial and Forward Aerial felt especially fun to me, but I want to give a shoutout to Down Aerial for being designed with giving Tsukuyo's juggling weakness in mind while ALSO still finding a good gameplay niche. Not easy to do effectively! While it's in the grab game I am also going to say I like that pummel is slow to emphasize that she can't just grab and pummel a lot to power-up her explosive shurikens, which when her grab is so powerful with shield canceling is important to keep it from being overly centralizing (unless, say, this was a set DESIGNED to be a grappler, in which case power could be taken from other options more).

I kinda love how the time bomb works back into the "comboing Tsukuyo can be scary" dynamic the explosive shurikens have, not only because it helps unite the undercurrent of the moveset's theme there but also because it presumably uses the same explosives as the shurikens so of course it'd have a similar gameplay effect! Tsukuyo's grab game needed to hit given the importance of shield canceling in her kit and it really does, Forward Throw really ties a lot together while also just being a simple and fun throw to toss the opponent around and space for stuff like Neutral Special or Forward Tilt for example. Down Throw at first I thought felt funky, but when the moveset brought up the idea of her stepping on the flames to take some self-damage but allow her to suddenly go super aggressive it clicked in my head, plus it makes a tense neutral standoff with her and the foe. Also a ninja intentionally lightning themselves on fire for an advantage makes me think Dr. McNinja.

To be honest, I'm rather lacking in specific, noteworthy complaints on Tsukuyo here. The characterization feels perfectly on point. The execution is clean and crisp, while at the same time having strong ideas to back it up. Shield canceling is fun and I like the way it gives Tsukuyo a "defensive-offensive" vibe, while her overall shield mechanics kind of make a neat ebb and flow to them, risking worse offense for heals or safety. Explosive shurikens work into her gameplan in multiple ways while the shuriken items have fun, varied paths that her standards or other attacks like Forward Tilt, Neutral Aerial, Grab and Up Aerial can take advantage of. It feels like it lacks excessive gimmicks, it is streamlined, despite being actually fairly chunky I blazed through it. It's the kind of set that got me pumped up as I went deeper into it like my favorites. Some favorite moves are all the Specials, Forward Tilt, Forward Aerial, Forward Smash, Down Smash, Up Smash, Back Throw, Down Aerial and Up Aerial. This set's essentially assured an SV spot from me and has a pretty good shot at my SV+, which given I had been excited hearing people talk about it and lightly checking it out myself earlier this contest is all I could hope for. Amazing work, Kat!

Best Toast (Asbestos bubbyboytoo bubbyboytoo )

Thank you for including a Pastebin to the alt notes, I would have been sad to not be able to see them. This character feels like a fun, maybe slightly outside the box choice for you as well. Exciting! Arknights only needs one more set to get a franchise spot. I hope it manages it!

"No one tells Asbestos what she can and can’t do, especially not when she’s wielding a big-ass door that could crush or fry them with equal ease." yeah, not messing with them, no siree

I agree with your thought that translating it into a more automatic skill activation fits her personality for Smash, so the differences definitely work out here. Up Special is fun. Who doesn't like a good shield surf? Link approves. It'd be fun if they let Link shield surf in Smash when it is Breath of the Wild Link, now that I think about it. The entire move is an all-original burst option that already feels like it'll add dimensions to her gameplan, so I'm all for it, Neutral Special is good as well. I like it's use as a neutral tool and it feels like a good grounding move for her. Side Special is fine, but both Side Special and Down Special being mechanic boosters on this character feels perhaps a bit off. Dash Attack feels like the standout move from a pretty solidly stout standard segment, with the trio of tilts all feeling good enough.

I really like Forward Smash as a neutral tool! It feels like it mixes together well with Neutral Special, with Neutral Special being a bit of a quicker reaction / the more common tool, while Forward Smash has more threatening range and power along with the charge-hold trickery to carve out a niche. One of my favorites here. All the Smash Attacks were good, though. I like Neutral Aerial using her tail! Getting all of that body useful for the set. Having that kind of backwards hitbox on Neutral Aerial also seems useful when foes will want to get behind her to avoid her shield and her Down Smash hits forward by default.

I think if there's one main general criticism I could level against this set is that given Asbestos' personality, the kind of rude or aggressive but smart and competent style, I wish the set let Asbestos get more aggressive. I think that the set would be improved if Asbestos had not just, per se, better moves but the moves allowed more of an aggressive style while she's in Thermal Power Mode. Down Tilt and Dash Attack do this, but I think it'd be fun if say...she had some more moves that went from "good, defensive spacer" to "aggressive, safe on shields spacer that leads to more aggression". This would give Asbestos a bit of variety and maybe make her feel more strongly characterized. The set perhaps plays it a little too safe in that regard. One area I did think suceeded here was the Forward/Back throw, so given the intention mentioned in the alt text good work there. I'd say the grab game in general felt better than standard for you, Down Throw was a neat mechanic booster. I like how it tied together a damage over time with it in a way that felt natural and called back to Down Special.

Overall, a solid if not super exciting set that I'm glad exists. I could see this one getting pushed some by the strength of the contest overall, but that'd be a shame since it is a nice set. Good job!

The Devil Wears a Suit and Tie (Nomad BridgesWithTurtles BridgesWithTurtles )

Okay, that mechanic is COOL. The penalty for using an incorrect weapon could be a bit hefty, I think it is only fair given the potential power of weapon chains. One thing that stuck out to me is this mechanic feels like it would be hard to casually replicate on other characters, which makes it appealing to me as feeling more "character specific": Sure, there's plenty of multi-arm characters, but how many have a logical and varied weapon loadout to utilize with it? And the gunslinger aesthetic ties together the attack chaining aspect to feel very natural, slick stuff especially given your long absence.

I feel like Nomad's Neutral Special pistols are more interesting in the context of his mechanic, because they're a great neutral tool BUT spamming them means that he will equip a lot of pistols (probably not good for melee or combos), and the nature of his mechanic means he can't just pull it out to camp at random if he's loaded up because he can't use a different weapon. It also helps keep them from being overpowered, because that is some GOOD frame data on a gun Neutral Special, so that all works together in a cool way. The rifle having a special spot in tentacle count and weaponry makes sense with it being his signature weapon and gives it an interesting slot in his gameplan. After all, as much of a powerful move it is (low starting lag for such power!), it can't be fired with all your limbs full until you get to it, making it both very predictable to the foe and limiting when he can throw it out. Plus it means he has to use a rifle attack before going back to his more normal fighting, complex, balanced.

I do think the way the bombs and rifle work, though, takes away a bit from the "cool" factor and depth of his mechanic. By making it so bombs only really work on Down Special and you can only have one rifle out, it does mean the pistol and swords are the only weapons that really fully utilize the mechanic. I think the bombs work well enough though, in part because the fact that it is on a timer / less permanent adds some more variability to his play than just loading up all his weapons. So I suppose it works too. It almost makes me wish Nomad had, like, oooone more weapon type but that wouldn't fit the character. I guess I'm arguing myself into thinking it's not a bad thing now. I do think all the bombs detonating just from any fire attack feels a bit too harsh of a downside to them: Imagine fighting Mario and his Neutral Special! Normally it's fine but with how Nomad arms himself, I'd make it just reduce the timer on the bombs by like 2 seconds and they explode if it goes to 0. The rifle can still instantly blow them up. Oh, and the bombs themselves are cool, very Duck Hunt Dog-ish but with versatility in how Nomad's kit works. I can dig it. Also, not sure about the tripping effect on Up Special, seems rather annoying.

All of Nomad's tilts, to me, feel a bit undertuned in damage. Jab and Dash Attack are fine, but I think you could add 1% to all of the tilts and it'd work out. The meat and potatoes of Nomad are all well and good, Forward Throw is one of those nice moves that organically works out with all of what's there, and the added effect adds some stuff to it. Down Smash seems in character, Down Aerial bringing back the pin effect is nice, Forward Aerial is "boring" but I think that Nomad did need a very standard move like this to function so this move is actually a plus to me, Neutral Special being able to flip uses between sabers and pistols feels novel and is a good way to help bridge between the two and make sure Nomad isn't TOO locked in. If I had another piece of advice to give that could really amp this set up, it is that while chaining within the same weapon is considered a lot, I think the two-step chains between weapons is underexplored and could have added a whole new dimension to the set if made more expansive.

But overall, it was good! I thought it was comparable to Asbestos, with a little more punchiness mechanically but maybe a bit more iffyness as well. If nothing else this set seems pretty underlooked for the quality, so I certainly think anyone with reads left should give it a pass, or maybe even a second if deciding some votelist spots. I was very excited for your return Turtles-Jay, I definitely remember being a fan back in those MYM14 days, so seeing this set gives me some Modern Jay Hope.

Where's Dark Galacta Knight? (Dark Meta Knight Juando Juando )

The biggest thing this set could use is damage percents. It's can be scary and difficult when you start out, but when it comes to actually evaluating the set an idea of how much damage each move does is critical. If you're not sure what to do, you can always go over to Ultimate Frame Data ( https://ultimateframedata.com/ ) and just look at moves you imagine as similar. Moves like Up Special are especially hard to understand without them, as the damage could easily be very light or very high from the description.

The clone is a decently fun baseline for a Special and I like the damage dealt mechanic to keep it from being overused, although I do think that when it is that hard to get out it should have more than 20 HP. Side Special / Neutral Special are perfectly servicable Specials with the right moves around them. Up Tilt being a strong reflector feels like it takes away from Neutral Special IMO, and also just seems pretty strong in general. Back Throw is quite the powerfull kill throw, comparable to Ness Back Throw, so you might wanna bump up the kill numbers 10-20%. As a note as well, Up Throw seems to typo its potential kill percent as 12% instead of 120%. Down Aerial is rather cool and I like the animation. Neutral Aerial's range seems very high, especially since Down Special lets him essentially double it. It and multiple moves don't have much of a note how much lag they have, either.

In an overall sense, I think Dark Meta Knight could use another launcher or two and a general expansion on his edgeguarding game. The Neutral Special kind of sets up the thought of edgeguarding being notable to him, but the moveset doesn't really seem to give him notable launchers or moves that would give him much of a varied gameplan when opponents are recovering. Back Aerial feels like the only noteworthy centerpiece, and is one of the moves I enjoyed in the set as well. Similarly, the clone is essentially never brought up after Down Special, so I would have enjoyed more of an idea how it works into how DMK plays. Especially considering that it feels like it'd be a bit of a moveset centerpiece. You do seem to have a good enough understanding of things like move purposes though, a good sign in a newcomer, and I'll be interested if you make more sets in MYM26.
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
The Legacy of K. Rool (Miracle Matter U UserShadow7989 )

Miracle Matter's gimmick is interesting and reminds me of Hammer Bro, albeit expanded upon in a much different fashion. It's also a noteworthy translation of Rool's old Miracle Matter idea, not focusing on limited movesets but instead a pros-and-cons nature of shifting between multiple mini-sets with a single normal form Neutral Special in between. I think this is a solid basis, but I do feel like right now Miracle Matter isn't fully engineered to take advantage of it, in part because the set feels rather underpowered. This set feels like it's a kind of "potent, all-rounder" that can shift into forms to take on a lot of situations but in turn has to suffer additional lags. But 6 frames is a lot to add onto attack start-up, and while the armor is powerful it's probably more of a downside. There's two ways you could go about fixing this up. The first would just be to reduce the lag shift to, say, 4 frames or so. Simple, clean, effective.

But TBH I think the set might be better served pushing the power of its other attacks, as its moves feel rather on the weak side anyway. Up Aerial's damage is low and ending lag is high, for example, and Back Aerial should really just combo out of Dash Attack (in fact given it combos into Neutral Aerial, which has 6 frames of shift lag, I question why it doesn't in the set right now), and in general Miracle Matter feels like it gets low reward for what it is going through with +6 frames of starting lag unless it uses one of three moves, especially since for most forms it is REALLY two moves because another is a throw which can only be used after going into Needle Matter. The way that works honestly kinda gimps some of the forms, so it feels a bit off. I feel like if Miracle Matter has to go through this, the rewards he has gets should be larger. Some moves I think could particularly be buffed are Cutter Matter Back Aerial, Ice Matter Down Tilt / Up Tilt (the fact that you'll normally need to go through heavyweight-style lag for this attacks makes me think they could do more damage), Up Throw (it feels rather weak for a time bomb), Forward Throw (since Miracle Matter lacks any combo throw, making this a combo throw at super low percents with really high scaling to become a KO throw like it is right now might be fun), and maybe a bit more form interplay. I feel like the items could have potentially been integrated more: Miracle Matter seems to lack any specific combo paths, spacing options or whatnot from the items. I think some of that could be used more. It also feels bizarre Cutter Matter lacks a projectile right now. One potential idea would be that holding an item reduces the frame data to transform into that form to, IDK, 2 frames but consumes the item? Could be interesting as a way to pull off plays otherwise not available. Maybe make Neutral Special more of a combo tool, which with its reflective properties allows it to also have increased use with them? Combo someone with NSpec and also reflect an item you threw earlier at them for example. I suppose it might be awkward if Miracle Matter is too item focused, though. Maybe

I would NOT buff Needle Matter, which is by far the most powerful of the forms (but also, IMO, quite fun) or Bomb Matter's NAir (which is a very strong move), although Bomb Matter's explosions should probably be larger than a Beastball. I also would not buff Down Aerial's armor, which is already strong. There also are points of the set I enjoy, the aforementioned Needle Matter/Bomb Matter (Needle Matter Forward Tilt/Forward Aerial is honestly so fun), the attack storage in Up Special, Forward Smash was one of the best attacks in the moveset and was very fun to perform (one idea Han and me had was to let Miracle Matter go offstage like a Villager F-Smash, presumably transforming out after a brief drop for edgeguard fun!), Side Special, Down Special, and if they weren't feeling so UP Down Tilt / Up Tilt.

Overall, I must admit Miracle Matter felt rather disjointed to me and kinda underpowered, but it has fun ideas and the balance issues are certainly fixable. Perhaps its biggest issue is how much multiple forms having a throw + 2 moves kinda screws those forms, making it harder to make full playstyles for them. I almost wish this set had aerial smashes or diagonal attacks or something to either give all forms four attacks or give those 2 + throw forms an extra attack. I do think this set got better as it went along: Needle, Bomb and Stone were my favorites in the set, especially Needle. A fun enough read.


Smash Journeyman
Aug 13, 2007
Valkyrie Walkure by FrozenRoy FrozenRoy

I imagine I'd have a deeper appreciation for some of Walkure's design choices with Valkyrie's set fresh in mind, but I can offer an analysis of the set and how it stands as its own entry just fine, and the author's notes proved helpful as references for the design decisions you made. There's a few points where it explicitly strays from the template of the set it's an echo/luigified clone character of, both in presentation and application, and I find that they serve as some of the better parts of the set and well reasoned.

I'm a fan of course, with Forward Smash indeed being the stand-out move of the set, but I find Mobility Amplification's following jumps to be my favorite part of the whole set, allowing for some fun chases, combos, and even mix-ups. Divine Execution isn't as prevalent in the set, but its few appearances were memorable little bits of extra 'screw you' for the attacks that carry the added effects, a smaller thread that isn't as interwoven but doesn't demand much of the reader or player with its passive benefits being no less useful.

Despite being the mass-produced Valkyre and an intentional echo, Walkure does have some nice character touches to set them apart, from the intentional middle of the road stats to the added flashes of anger against specific foes in the grab game. The moves that are noted as alluding to the same concepts are differed in interesting ways and make for neat tricks all their own, Back Aerial and Up Throw being standouts. The standards are a stand out in terms of small neat tricks that are made into a stronger melee playstyle, and might be my favorite section despite my love for DSpec and FSmash as individual inputs, aerials not far behind.

Walkure doesn't have a super strong central gimmick, Mobility Amplification being cool aside, but that fits the mold and the set more than makes up for it with a strong playstyle and fleshed out melee, utilizing spear and shield in clever ways to make a mid-ranged fighter with lots of fun movement toys. Things like Up Smash's little star cone follow-up also show that the moves are individually interesting in their own ways, meaning the set never gets dull.

I was hoping to solidify my thoughts more on this set with a second read through and this comment, but I think what you see is what you get- a well-rounded entry with lots of neat little touches and some fun hooks that make for a polished entry whose personality takes a little observation to notice rather than having a big or strange hook it wears on its sleeve and centers around. The mass produced models are plenty original from where I'm sitting!

(Small nitpick in Mobility Amplification: "Walkure closes her eyes and tilts her eyes back" second eyes should be head, near the start of paragraph 1.)

Timekeeper Cookie by ProfPeanut ProfPeanut and FrozenRoy FrozenRoy

An excellent last hurrah from the both of you for the final stretch of this contest, if I do say so myself. I started off a little uncertain as the stranger tools available to Timekeeper Cookie are laid out plainly but concisely; the random nature of Possibilities with no means to fully control what you get seemed like it might be frustrating, but given the character and how the primary benefit of Possibilities are a potent bit of stage control that's hard to plan around for foes as a reward for keeping the rift open, it felt right.

I do still feel that the Possibilities might take a little too long to happen, even with the ability to speed up the process and extend the rifts' lifespans. I feel the latter is fine start at 12 seconds, while the former could afford to happen every 8 seconds without interference. That means if Timekeeper Cookie holds the charge of Forward or Down Smash for as long as the game allows, it'd be two Possibilities from that rift before it dispersed, and it'd allow for pillars that benefit from sticking around to get some mileage rather than immediately disappearing as the rift closes as they appear, as well as making the frail rifts a little more likely to have their payoff.

Aside from minor typo stuff that I'll get to at the end, though, that's the only complaint I can lodge about the whole set. I love how the standards, while simple, all have a role in how they interact with Cookie’s assorted mechanics. Jab and Dash Attack play into time threads, and how the latter plays into entropy charge by delaying the main hitbox. Forward Tilt revitalizes the surprise value of gear possibilities by randomly adjusting their trajectory. Up Tilt works nicely to place rifts in high spots while keeping to the ground. Down Tilt can set up for a combo with Refabricate.

The smashes don’t disappoint either, utilizing existing time rifts if one is in place next to Timekeeper Cookie for both a lag reduction and hitbox angling. Forward Smash abuses the time threads by increasing the final knockback based on the number of its multihits that landed, and remembers this number between multiple hits! Forward Smash may be my favorite move in the set for this interaction. Up Smash not only makes a platform or possible roof, but can be a deadly on-demand hitbox with a use of threads, too. Time blinks and threads mess with the time bomb after effect of Down Smash.

Rather than recap the whole set, I’ll simply say I was satisfied to see that the set carried this standard of quality throughout the aerials and throws as well (Down Aerial and Forward Throw are real treats!). Each move considers its role in the set’s melee well, on top of working in a unique role for how it interacts with time rifts, threads, et all. All this without mentioning the consistently neat applications of Entropic charge.

The mechanics are varied and interlaced in a way that’s both fun and simple to understand despite the timey wimey shenanigans, the set doing a great job of making the most of the theme without being convoluted or dipping into overly trodden ground. It's a unique time-manipulating set that feels like it'd be a blast to play, the playstyle even helpfully pointing out that whether you go for the galaxy brain planning or just make things up as you go along fighting normally, you'll get to have the full experience of all of Timekeeper Cookie's strange tricks. I guess if I had to stretch, the Time blinks don't get as much mention as the other mechanics in her set? That's not really bad, though.

Minor issues:

-Bronze cog is not noted as having stamina like the other cog Possibilities.

-Typo: Cap for Forward Tilt should be 25% by my math.

-Second paragraph on Down Aerial ends on an unfinished sentence. ("Hit a foe far enough to force them to recover"?)

Cursola by A AwfulBeast

Finishing the contest strong, Cursola's mechanic and specials are a hit for me right off the bat- a delayed hitbox that starts its countdown after certain damage thresholds is a clever mechanic and serves as a solid anchor point to base the playstyle on, and it's a fitting way to interpret Cursola's unique ability. I worry Down Special might make Cursola's edge trapping/ledge guarding game a little TOO good in the context of everything else if it locks the opponent out of their Up Special and knocks them away- I'd shorten the duration some and add a visual cue when trying to use the move and for when the lock ends- but otherwise they seem fine balance-wise.

I appreciate that the set has a few ways to slow foes and alternate KO options such as Forward/Back/Up Aerials, Up Throw, and Neutral Special, preventing Cursola's gameplay from getting too one-note. It's an easy trap to fall into, but the set sidesteps it nicely. That said, I would like to see some other ideas for landing Perish Body's effect- Dash Attack could have an initial burst of speed that slows down at the end to suddenly get the sluggish Cursola into range suddenly, for example. Up Smash could be used to cheat a bit by stretching Cursola's body (and thus the AoE of Perish Body) some, with the ability to angle the hitbox to either side on release to better its use for this and as an anti-air (though not as much angling as the Piranha Plant Down Special comparison point of course, and admittedly that might overlap some with Up Special). Up Aerial (on top of being an off the top KO option once foes are high/damaged enough) could have a multi-hit property that keeps the foe close for running down that last second of the clock.)

There's some moves that do the trick already- Down Aerial as-is serves as a fast and safe landing option that can suddenly force foes to fall back to get out of its path, with the drag down quality being ideal here. Maybe give it more shield stun on top of the shield damage to better lead into Perish Body? Forward Throw, Back Throw, and to a lesser extent (given the lengthy-sounding animation) Up Throw can stall out the clock and keep the foe close for the big finale, and Whirlpool is an excellent trap for it.

Aside from that, there's a couple of good tech chase starting options noted here- you could give Cursola a little more in-depth tech chase options, with Down Smash (being good against most tech/roll options aside from a get-up attack but at the cost that it would eat an attack if they do) and Neutral Special (good for cutting off an avenue of escape) being the only ones noted as such currently. This and perhaps shield pressure (Perish Body being nerfed against shields specifically to bait them out? Other shield damage/stun sources would be buffed to compensate, making shielding scary or even a catch-22 when opponents have to shield or die) might flesh out the melee some more. The ledge-trapping aspects are already good, adding another appreciated dimension to the set.

Beyond that, my complaints are nitpicks about a handful of moves. I love the idea of Jab, though I think there could afford to be a bit more info on the homing projectiles- how fast do they move, how tight can they turn, and how long do they last, mainly. I feel their turning should be bleh, their movement middling, but their duration decently long- enough that they're not a direct threat on their own but become persistent nuisances unless foes swat them out of the air. The way they work feels like it could be brought up in other moves just for their ability to potentially cut off certain escape routes the opponent would normally have available, such as them looping up and back after a foe that jumps over them and cuts off an air escape in response to Down Smash as an example.

Speaking of, Down Smash should probably have a clause that existing ectoplasm from a prior use vanishes frame 1 of using Down Smash again to prevent keeping up a field of the stuff indefinitely. Other than that complaint, I feel it (and Neutral Special) might be one of my favorite moves from the set, playing nicely into the mechanic. Up Tilt could afford to damage foes by hitting them with the point-blank side hitboxes and not just where the points intersect without it being too much.

For as much nitpicking as I did there, Cursola is a solid set that's fun to picture playing as, and a pleasant note to end the contest (and my comments) on. Nicely done!

Never ask me for anything again.
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Gilgamesh.set (Eldlich the Golden Lord GolisoPower GolisoPower )

Bizarrely as I go through the moveset, what comes to mind is "Warlordian Lexaeus". Lexaeus' old idea was having a huge power-up move that opponents would want to stop before it went off but had very long lag, so they had to approach him a lot through earth pillars and the like, which also helped play with his sluggish stats as it forced foes to come closer. Eldlich similarly feels like he has a "gathering power forces foes to approach" style, as opponents must keep his minions in check, try not to allow too much Golden Land to spread, and he has his flashy Side Special payoff if opponents slack at that. The way the Golden Statues work, complete with being able to be broken apart into damaging chunks, is also very reminisicient of those earthen pillars. But this time the threat is from minions and whatnot, thus the more Warlordian vibes. I can dig it. I do especially enjoy the Golden Statues breaking apart, and Side Special is a pretty fun move. I do wonder with how it is described if it could really have enough width between each one for Ganondorf to fit between? But it might. Also I thought the Eldlich was immortal like the entire Specials because the wording on his optional respawn point is a bit vague, you might want to explicitly say it doesn't prevent stock loss.

I assume Eldlich's Jab doesn't have all 3 hits combo? It'd be quite obscene otherwise. Gotta say this Dash Attack is cool! The damage can get obscene, but it feels conditional enough to not be overpowered, and lining up your minions as fuel for a gold-infused blast of destruction is very in character and dramatic. ngl, I was expecting Forward Tilt's Golden Land effect to teleport foes to him for combos. And then Cursed Eldland could reflect it around to grab foes from weird angles! Would need a cooldown of course, and probably only combo into his fastest attacks, but that could be neat. It might be weird fluff-wise, though, since the card effect is based just on Eldlich monsters. Probably acceptable, though. Kind of the vibe of "I own everything within my dominion".

"The force of the lift deals damage, and the player can hold the input to keep the throne up as an additional taunt as he smugly glares at his foe with sardonic and sadistic glee." Well that's pog.

Up Tilt's second effect is cool and using the taunt pose is nice but I must say that having it on a second hit on a pose only during Golden Land feels very WEIRD outside of the convienence of the animation. I also wonder if it might be a bit too powerful, given it is not always the easiest to avoid and Eldlich is reasonably adept at summoning minions. I might tone down the strength of the move's damage and knockback on Golden Land, although not too much (19.95% would be the midpoint between 13.3% and 26.6%. Kill at 95% or so?), and maybe put the current power level on the Cursed Eldland version. Forward Smash's kill power should almost certainly kill earlier, since 159% would actually be pretty late for a kill move when it seems intended to have decent power ("Side Smash by itself is a fairly strong kill move that’s great for poking at a distance thanks to its disjointed range") and the powered up version seems intended to be more strong heavyweight-y hitting. Cursed Eldland's kill percent is fine, though. Up Smash goes on about its slow frame data, but the presence of the counter frames does help rather significantly with that. Down Smash could stand to kill earlier with the conditionality of Golden Land/Cursed Eldland and it eating it up, too.

ayo you know the minion-platform-grab we all know and love

I generally agree with n88 that I'm not sure the set fully considers how potentially being left without a grab in a lot of scenarios for a slow, Ganondorf-style character. This doesn't necessarily make it unviable, but it does seem like the defense will struggle, and maybe more could be made of that as either part of his gameplan, or his weaknesses (as grab beats Up Smash armor too), like attacks that might be useful checks to grabs and stuff. Becomes a lot more vulnerable to defensive shield techniques. I don't know that this slow Ganondorf style minion summoner is going to want to remove his grab to make a platform just for Side Special on Final Destination, but the desync combo options are interesting. The set doesn't seem to much consider those combos in move design, though. It reminds me a lot of Vector's grab from MYM15, which was very popular. Also I like the idea Whitebeard's platform destruction would instantly kill this guy. I honestly don't have much to say about the actual throws, aside from the "coat the foe in gold for a pitfall throw" visual is a very good choice.

Not gonna lie, Neutral Aerial introducing a revival mechanic that existed all along but only came up on Neutral Aerial is WILD, and also I honestly am not sure I like the effect. Not because the revival is bad, I actually think it is neat, but the minions all leaving behind ghosts just to be interacted with Neutral Aerial specifically of all things feels...bizarrely game-y. I think it might have worked better if Eldlich had multiple "revival moves" throughout his set, maybe even with different added effects or just different ranges for different gameplay purposes, rather than all being funneled into the Neutral Aerial and stapled on with a glue gun.

"Now you may be thinking: “Golden Ladybug has no ATK Points whatsoever, why does it deal damage here”? Well, you gotta take liberties with these kinds of things, my friends, let’s admit it. " TBH my bigger question is why Eldlich doesn't just have a normal Forward Aerial and thus why Golden Ladybug is here in general. I also think Forward Aerial feels kind of forced in general. I was honestly expecting something like a big punch, but for a Samus Forward Aerial style move I think I might prefer Eldlich doing it himself with like magic sparks or something? To be honest, for this massive conquerer of continents he sometimes feels bizarrely weak in a personal sense, given most of his attacks function either with summons or magic. I dunno. At the same time, maybe this better fits the style the set is going for of an arrogant king, so his opponents are not even worth his time! That is also pretty good, but I do wonder if including some more physicality somewhere might have been able to also sell this, especially if they were power moves. I do think Eldlich is well characterized overall.

Down Aerial, compared to the previous two, feels substantially natural, has some strong extra uses outside of Forward Tilt due to the Golden Statues, and smoothly slots into the rest of the set in my opinion. Oh, hey, Back Aerial is a power move like I thought! To be honest, I would probably prefer this move without the Golden-Eyes Idol here. It feels like it is starting to really stretch for creatures to be in Eldlich's domain and the effects here while potentially interesting (although a dizzy is less useful in the air than on the ground) also feel a bit bizarre. I dunno. I'm not feeling it. Up Aerial is...fine, I don't think it quite slots in as casually as Down Aerial, but it works well enough. I do think the aerials are the weakest part of the set, and to be honest kinda surreal (though it being kind of wild is good too?), so that's a bit of a bummer.

Overall, I do agree that Eldlich (along with Meltryllis, a set I will say I preferred) is a notable step up for you. You've gone from having no votes from me last contest and a 5 star WV to having two solid 7 stars on my rankings at minimum (Veronica, after all, could potentially pop up. But I don't think I enjoyed Eldlich as much as other people did, and at times I found it a bit of a difficult read. I think I generally agree with n88's viewpoint on it: I had the most fun when it was having a bore of more baseline, wacky fun than some of the more outlandish stuff. The smashes were actually all effects I liked a lot: Forward Smash's simple buff nonetheless feels powerful and I think the fact it is stronger WITHOUT minions gives Eldlich a trump card + offers some alternative playstyles. It also is very effective characterization as it feels like Eldlich is unleashing his "true power" when he has no minions to back him up. Good stuff. Up Smash's coverage is crazy and Down Smash's gimmick is simple-yet-effective if undertuned. The standards at the start also have some build-up, I actually really like Down Tilt and Dash Attack and how they fit in, Forward Tilt is fun, Jab is kinda absurd but it works out. Where the set lost me was the aerials and throws, mostly the aerials, for two reasons:

1. I wasn't necessarily fond of some of the effects, Forward Aerial felt a bit random, and Neutral Aerial being the ONLY revival move rather than a more worked through mechanic was a bit odd. In general, I think outside of Down Aerial a lot of the effects and fluff felt like it was really reaching, and for my tastes I would have turned it down. I honestly think Forward Aerial's effect would feel more natural if it was, like, Eldlich making explosions of gold that can heal minions if he "strikes" them with it or something. Back Aerial feels like it existed purely to get Golden-Eyed Idol, a card with no relation to Eldlich, in the set rather than because it had a true purpose in the set.

2. I think the set kind of lost itself in really tying together the playstyle. The Specials, Standards and Smashes feel like they really set Eldlich up as a slight-all-arounder zoner, who has some good long-ranging moves like Forward Tilt and tricky traps with Up Tilt and Down Tilt, which then gives great power with Down Smash / Up Smash that can have incredible range and a trump card in Forward Smash for if they break down the setup. The aerials don't feel like they play into this at all, and to be honest I did suspect they might not...but more because given the grab platform and the Up Special, I was expecting the aerials might have a bit more of a combo bent to them to take advantage of those elements. But the aerials don't feel like they especially take advantage of it (Neutral Aerial explicitly is a combo ender, but where's the aerial combo starter here? Forward Aerial is explicitly not a combo starter either), which given the prior setup is disappointing, and I don't know that they especially play into what the set is doing before. The throws aren't bad, but they kinda feel like they just exist but with cool animations, although Down Throw does feel like it plays into the set + has a cool animation and I can't say I disagree with Up Throw either.

I also generally agree this set doesn't fully consider the ramifications of both grab and Down Tilt, two of Eldlich's fastest moves, being able to be unusuable for him on demand, especially given Up Smash is such a potent yet punishable defensive tool and how Neutral Aerial works. It certainly nerfs Eldlich's faster options and what he can do against pressure, so I could see Eldlich leaning heavier on the zoning during this, and having to avoid stuff like Up Smash baiting. The set also has the grab stick around for Eldlich to aggress foes into, but his options are limited there, I kinda wish there was an aerial hitbox with a bit of a low angle that could combo into the grab statue.

Basically: Eldlich starts off very strong, but for me lost a lot of steam at the end, creating an overall good but uneven product. It shows your continued evolution as an MYMer and bodes well for the next contest, as both Melt and Eldlich have cleared my opinion on a best Goliso set by a country mile. Good work, and see you in the next golden age!

Lost in the Shadows (Shadow Mario Arctic Tern Arctic Tern )

Shadow Mario reminds me a lot of Asbestos, in that both of them are movesets with fairly sedate Specials that get better as they go on. Traditionally sets I have rather enjoyed and Shadow Mario was no different. The Specials are solid, but they're all about the setup for later, and are very straightforward aside from the minions. But the melee of the set is some good fun, and I like the way that this set really represented "chasing down" Shadow Mario seeing as that's every Shadow Mario fight in Sunshine. Shadow Mario has just enough camping prowess to force foes to approach, then runaway tools that let him bound all over and strong backhitting moves like Back-Forward Tilt and Down Smash so that people actively approaching him while he runs away get some surprises. Since they feel like both kill and more damage oriented tools, via tech chases primarily. He has a fairly robust edgeguarding game with the Klambers and even Purple Bullet Bills.

The meat of the set is when it comes together though. Attacks like Down Smash, Jab, Forward Tilt and Up Tilt (I like both of their extra attack gimmicks), Dash Attack, Back Aerial, Down Aerial...I think I enjoyed pretty much every attack in the set past the Specials to some degree or another, weaving together a vivid playstyle that feels like it takes just enough from Mario to make it feel like a "dark counterpart" semi-clone while having both distinct animations and playstyle (Shadow Mario is much campier and, fittingly, trickier than Mario but much less safe). In that regard it also reminds me a lot of my own Mr. L set, although Shadow Mario is much less on the semi-clone tack and angle. It feels very different from previous Bowser Jr. (w/ Paintbrush) / Shadow Mario attempts and feels very naturally in-smash in that way.

I do agree with n88 that the minions feel somewhat lost here, although I think that most of them are self explanatory enough that keeping the more svelte descriptions rather than meticulously documenting stuff a bunch of people know isn't bad. Purple Bullet Bill and Klambers in particular don't need too much elaboration, although I do think maybe a bit of describing of his best edgeguards with Klamber out vs. not might be worthwhile. This is especially true because Shadow Mario can totally set up his Up Special and then go DEEP knowing he will have an auto-recover, so I think his edgeguard game is likely rather robust. Strollin' Stus seem the most underelaborated on and I think are a place Shadow Mario could have more depth. I think maybe making it so instead of dying to a jump they die to a footstool would be interesting and allow both Shadow Mario and the foe to use it to extend aerial plays. Maybe Dash Attack, if it hits a Strollin' Stu, could bounce off of it and have Shadow Mario do a good-for-combo-starting spin like popping out of the slide in Sunshine (presumably not killing the Stu?) for an additional movement option. Could have use when escaping as well with low ending lag. Down Aerial perhaps could squish Stus flat and have them do a goop explosion or turn the wave when it lands into goop, like when you squish a Stu flat in Sunshine (except in that game there's no hitbox). I dunno if there's more, but I think that the Stu could have more to it, and maybe the Hatopop as well. Down Aerial popping out a Hatopop as a hitbox and then re-burying itself could be fun, like when you ground pound hidden things in Sunshine, but TBH that might feel awkwardly interact-y for this straighforward set.

I also think that another move coating the foe in goop could be useful, maybe Up Smash since given the lag it isn't adding some new evergreen goop move or Forward Aerial if you'd prefer a less laggy one, and maybe just a few payoff moves to it as well. Like, maybe Forward Smash and its fiery goop could ignite the foe's goop for a stronger kill move if they got goop on them? I do think Forward Smash is too weak in kill power right now, given it has Frame 23 startup, it is correct not to give heavyweight power but I'd bring the sweetspot's kill power 20% lower or so (and the sourspot if you want). I worry about Neutral Aerial's power. While Shadow Mario's recovery actually being very risky reduces the power, Shadow Mario CAN go deep and a purely spiking sex kick aerial here feels spooky. I don't think it is overpowered per se, but it is something I was worried about.

Overall, Shadow Mario felt like a breath of fresh air coming off some more complex sets, and additionally well put together with a clear gameplan it executes well. While on the flipside it doesn't take full advantage of its concepts, the stuff on the table is enough it doesn't harm it much, making it quite the solid Jamcon set. I do think there's some balance notes here and there and I'd enjoy Forward Smash being buffed. I know Remilia is your big frontrunner but, tbh, between just Kula, Shadow Mario and Crewmate your first MYM is incredibly impressive. Good job, Tern!
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Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Amber by SaltySuicune SaltySuicune
This is the first of yours I've read (shameful I know, with as long as you've been hanging out now). There's some cool stuff here, though it's a bit under-developed.

The normals can be very under-sold at times, though that's mostly a matter of presentation. It's a minor point, but I'd particularly pick on the Up Smash here; "pretty much Up Tilt" isn't really the kind of description that pulls people in, you know? I can respect economy of language but at the same time, you're pitching your vision here! Don't let efficiency detract too much from playing up what's cool about an attack.

Are her jumps armored a bit like Yoshi's? If not she's probably pretty underpowered recovery-wise; in terms of her ability to cover distance she's actually doing just fine with two Yoshi jumps, I think, but any stray hit she takes can do a number on her since her jumps don't refresh. I also think it'd help her out a lot if she were able to jump -> glide -> jump again instead of glide putting her right into freefall, since that'd give her a lot of ability to stagger the timing on her jumps and mix up her recovery.

I do wish she had a projectile or two on her aerials to support the zoning playstyle and help defend herself a bit since she's stuck relying on those jumps for recovery. It'd also be nice if she could jump/glide out of aim mode or otherwise use her NSpec effectively from the air. I also think she'd benefit from a big KO projectile; the charged NSpec might be meant to be a big flashy power projectile option, but it's very soft right now. There's no knockback listed, but it says it takes three seconds to charge and it only deals 8%. Samus' NSpec charges in like... 2 seconds and deals 28% damage.

Forward Special is also really fun, dig the implementation that's here and I think this'd be a fun centerpiece move to build up a bit more; having a tool for stage control like this is an interesting way for her to create some pressure and pivot between her projectile game and melee game.

Down Special is a bit under-detailed to really work for me; sure, it breaks after taking a certain amount of damage, but what stops her from just throwing it back up again? I'm also not sure it fits the intended playstyle of Amber being a zoner, and I think the move as-implemented ends up being a pretty aggressive tool for a shield-themed move, especially if it prevents her being flinched (which is a bit ambiguous right now). If I can just armor through attacks I'm definitely using that Down Special to go for the big DSmash kill.

Just some food for thought! I know you've already got stuff cooking for MYM26, and I'm looking forward to seeing where you go from here.

Stray thoughts:
  • "you can even throw it off the stage to gimp other players if you want to be annoying." - I do.
  • Up Special is a cool attack, but the damage number on it seems a little juiced if all those projectiles can connect.
  • Dig the echo fighter and how they get a boost from coordinating their attacks in team matches!
  • Sickeningly cute character, unnerving.

Seth by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
Fun set with some surprising design decisions. Not bad mind you, but surprising: I was expecting Ridley to be sort of a point of reference here but instead Marth seems to be coming up a lot. Makes sense for your style I suppose, but dang if it didn’t catch me off-guard.

He’s definitely got signs of Jamcon rush. Some moves are also weighted oddly. He’s got flashy energy stuff that’s less potent than his “gargle dirty water” attack, and the head bonk is a not-so-special Special. The centerpiece way he can act out of Madness Nails is fun and well–leveraged though, and there’re are cool attacks throughout the set. Really like the funky petrification effect on Up Smash.

Hikaru by U UserShadow7989
Delightfully chaotic bullet hell thing with some wild attacks. I really enjoy the thought put into buffering and the sort of pseudo-RNG buff system. I’m not familiar with the source material (or the thing it’s parodying) at all, but it’s cool how this set really says a lot about it and conveys exactly what it is. I really expected more of the upgrades to be status effects or whatever but no, things just get wild. A lot of very silly, over-the-top effects that feel very fun to imagine.

Mephiles by That Guyy That Guyy
It’s funny to me, delving into the FFC stuff, how much parallel evolution there is between MYM and FFC. This definitely feels like it could have been right out of an older MYM, down to the Up Special apologizing for not being more out-there. People overthink Up Specials sometimes. It’s fine if he just does a jump.

There’re some missing details or balancing factors here and there, particularly in the core mechanics. He can cancel a hover into another hover and be largely invincible while crouching (Heavy! Nova!) and those things don’t seem to really have rails.

Very fun animations here - effects tend to be pretty straightforward and simple, but the effects have cool flavor and a lot of creativity. The counter teleport thing is interesting, but feels pretty hard to use given I probably don’t know exactly where I was five seconds ago and that’s a weird thing to try to remember and account for while also using a counter (which can be a tricky operation to begin with).

Chidori Michiru by Katapultar Katapultar
Passive item generation is an interesting mechanic - not sure I’ve ever seen that before? Interesting design space to play around in, I’m always a sucker for item stuff. The set does a good job playing around with that as it goes on; between that and the tension between ammo being used for mobility vs being used… as ammo, there’s some interesting resource management stuff in the set.

The set isn’t super effect-heavy but does have a few eyebrow-raising animations like the suction gun. Not a real criticism though, and there’s a lot of really fun flavor too. Love the way the grab game works and the theme around it.

King Koopa by T TortoiseNotTurtle
I like the notes on the animation design up top, it’s a fun way to set tone right out the gate, and I like the direction in terms of giving him a distinct flavor from other Koopa Kings. That said, I do think the set feels a little busy with the sheer number of props, and that works against him feeling like he has a cohesive identity at times. Also for every really on-brand fun attack (Dash Attack slaps) there’s something that feels a little odd (vertical launch pigeons are his number one killer?). NSpec is really interesting - maybe a bit harsh on projectile users but it’s a cool effect.

Asbestos by bubbyboytoo bubbyboytoo
Pretty conservative design here, but well-handled. Definitely one of those sets that are a bit hard for me to criticize mechanically because everything just kinda feels Solid and satisfying to envision. The central mechanic super-state is handled in a smart way where it comes with limited hard interactions and a lot of intuitive power-ups, with improved mobility or other harder effects coming in in a way that feels like it derives intuitively from animations.

Really love the animation design and the way the shield is given physical weight through her attacks. I was a bit surprised that a “barge forward with shield up” thing didn’t happen until… FThrow? I was really expecting it to be on FSmash. That’s not a criticism, I think it speaks to how solid the animation design is that something easy-to-reach-for like that can not be there for a lot of the set and not feel missing.

There’s a bit near the end of my notes (which are voice notes that I recorded and not written notes) where I just went “the f*** is Rhode Island” and in typing up this mini comment I had to go work out what that was about because I had no memory of it.

Tsukomo Sana by bubbyboytoo bubbyboytoo
I just have an RNG order I’ve been going off of and it decided on two bubby sets in a row, please address complaints directly to God or the universe or python’s random library or whatever. Again, this one is just… really solid? Sana gets weirder than Asbestos does, to good result; there’s a really smart restraint to it all. The bevy of constructs have sensible limitations, and there’s a smart awareness of Giant Sana’s vulnerabilities and how her big, glowing weak point creates risk and reward for the enemy.

It’s a great example of a set doing out-there stuff in the most grounded way it can, which is always fun to see. The doubled-up grab game is cool but I really enjoy that most of the mechanical differences just boil down to hitbox coverage and placements, and her attacks are well-designed to make those differences interesting: Forward Tilt is a particular stand-out move for me in terms of how it leverages size shift.

Great stuff.

Nomad by BridgesWithTurtles BridgesWithTurtles
Really fun set that gets good mileage out of a tidy word count. It’s got a clean melee core and does really fun stuff with its arms mechanic. The set does a good job knowing how far to take that idea (and where to not interact with it or even play against it) to keep things easily comprehensible but still have a lot of depth.

Kula Diamond by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
Fighting game adaptations can be a little hard to comment on when I’m not up on the source material, since they tend to be so rooted in their series’ home mechanics, but there’s still a lot to appreciate here and I came away really liking Kula. A lot of her moves are implemented in really fun ways - all the Specials are pretty great, really, but Snowman is definitely a highlight for me. A move like that has fun implications in Smash and the set does a good job working with that.

I also mentioned this on Discord but I don’t love normal Up Special Crow Bite being basically outmoded by the command input version. It makes her Up Special feel like it’s just a dead input in practice and that’s kind of a feel-bad for me. I think that sort of dynamic is fine for her Jab finisher, just kind of a bummer on a Special (but that’s a YMMV style thing and not a big issue with the set).

Adramelech by OldManHan OldManHan
I like how much fun this set is having with the visual and mechanical bombast of it all. The focus on running the timer down is a really strong hook for a character like this and is something I don’t think I’ve seen before, but it’s a lot of fun here. Set probably does need to do Something to acknowledge timer-less matches but I don’t think it’s a big deal to patch something in.

Maybe she just creates like a ‘cosmetic’ timer that doesn’t give her access to high-end stuff like her conditional insta-kill but will work for her more normal buffs. Presumably it also wouldn’t end the match (since forcing a timer would suck) when it ran out but just have some special ‘everything in the background is absolutely destroyed’ type visuals.

Anyway the set is a bit loosely constructed in places and very occasionally gets a little too silly (here’s looking at you, Entire Stage Down Tilt) but for the most part is smart about when to rein in the over-the-top aspects and keep the set reasonable. I do think introducing Down Special near the end isn’t super conducive to comprehension but it’s not a huge deal.

Raihan by That Guyy That Guyy
I really like the direction for a doubles-focused trainer: controlling a signature Pokemon and introducing others for specific moves is a fun way to show off a trainer’s team while still keeping things pretty tight. FSpec is a particularly cool way to leverage this with Torkoal lingering a bit and Duraludon being able to act around him. I wish there were a few more effects like that in the set.

I also wonder if the set wouldn’t be a bit disjoined to watch, in practice, with a lot of Pokemon popping in for like one move each, but that’s a YMMV point. I think the set could have a more cohesive identity if you had fewer Pokemon but each one had more presence: less Goodras and more Flygons.

The implementation of weather is interesting but I wish it could be created a little more consistently. “A random chance on Smashes” is kind of rough because you really don’t have much ability to plan around it.

Blue by GolisoPower GolisoPower
I’m still glad to see a couple of the Amogus sets deliver, but I didn’t quite vibe with this one. It’s a bit slapdash, with some combos and strategies outlined that feel confusing, impractical, or just non-functional. The set references 50/50s several times in a way I didn’t quite grok; the attacks in question don’t sound like they’re setting up 50/50s.

The meeting table is an interesting tool in how it’s used to control knockback and gives Blue a lot of ways to funnel the match in toward it; it’d be cool to see that concept revisited but this didn’t feel like the best showcase for the idea. Props for getting wild with blast zone manipulation too; the set doesn’t quite carry it off but I always like to see experimentation.

Bipples by tunz tunz
I don’t have a ton to say about this one but I doubt you were expecting a ton. I like the system for RNG on the juggling balls where you get to see what they all are and then get to choose how/when to use them.

Mr. Rime by SaltySuicune SaltySuicune
I like flavoring him around silent comedians and old cartoons; I felt like that could have been leaned into even harder but the set manages some fun animations around it. I’m also fond of the tummy honk smash. Pretty straightforward little set but it has its charms. Don’t want to get too caught up in critiquing this since you’ve already moved on to bigger and better.

Exdash Exiviq by bubbyboytoo bubbyboytoo
This is A Jamcon Set. It does capture the insanity of Vampire Survivors pretty well without becoming unplayable, which is a notable achievement. In practice I imagine it’d still be a little insane to look at, but that’s not unthematic. It doesn’t quite live up to your other works this contest for me (though I’ve yet to read Dark Blupi), but cool to see Vampire Survivors get something anyway, and I like how it taps into the energy of the source material even if the execution is a bit rushed.

Jo’on and Jo’off by OldManHan OldManHan
I like the general idea of what the set is going for but a lot of it feels pretty dry, and it doesn’t all come together super cleanly. Multiple moves just kinda writing themselves off as not practical or not fitting with the playstyle is a bit of a head-scratcher for me. There are some stand-out cool attacks; NSpec is really great in particular and I love all the different shenanigans it enables. This one is just alright for me overall though.

Ursaluna by SaltySuicune SaltySuicune
This is a pretty conventional heavyweight design. It's sensible enough and definitely feels like a big bear (with the occasional mud manipulation thing), but Amber is definitely a bit stronger for me. She had some more intriguing concepts while Ursaluna pretty much plays to type. I think two big 'rush forward and tackle' Specials is kind of a shame - they differentiate themselves a bit just by virtue of the stronger one being on a cooldown, but they almost feel like they could have been one move. Like a hold/tap or charge/uncharge difference.
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
DEJA VU (Wheelie bubbyboytoo bubbyboytoo )

Wheelie's baseline is fun and I like how Dash is such a good fit for a chaser playstyle. The multiple options out of it feel unique and I think it gives Wheelie some solid vibes. The Up Special smokescreen was interesting with how it worked into it, and the non-Specials are generally solid, while the animations are not varied I agree with n88 that like...it is a Wheelie, it is kinda limited by nature. Down Tilt and Dash Attack are fun, I like Forward Aerial and Up Aerial as well, very natural effects.

I do think Dash's armor being full on the whole attack feels too strong. I'd probably make it only full for an initial burst (1 BFP?), then reduce it to 12% or 15% armor, give opponents more of a chance to break through. Would bump Wheelie up a spot or two. I do also feel like the "ally riding Wheelie" mechanic is fun, but feels a bit inherently limited with the doubles aspect. I think Wheelie summoning something like a basic minion companion who can ride him and has limited attacks could have upped how much mileage (ahem) he got out of the mechanic. I also think Up Special may have had a good idea being that, like Link, it has a different and grounded Up Special instead. Would give Wheelie some better usage of the rather interesting smokescreen. Might have been fun if Wheelie could use Side Special DURING Dash, which would have him outrun it after firing it out. This would allow him a fun reversal: Normally using it is for approaching, but during Dash it becomes for safety as it trails behind for coverage!

Oh also "Inertial D" is one of the best punny names all contest, love to see it.


Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Cramorant by BridgesWithTurtles BridgesWithTurtles
The approach to RNG here is cool, but I do worry that there might be a few too many prey options. It’s fun to get a bevy of references in there but it does mean that just keeping track of your options takes up a fair amount of headspace, especially given that you want to use a lot of these differently. The change in odds with Pikachu coming out more late-game is a fun way to handle that too and I think it’s a more interesting approach to a super option than just having three different ones that each come up 5% of the time. The sparsity of prey generation and the way it’s tied to moves that are either highly punishable/committal or that Cramorant has to use carefully due to long cooldowns/stage control also works against the broad range of options/chances to come up empty I think.

I really like that his prey can usually be denied by foes who bat it away before he scoops it up, it makes for some cool interplay that pushes him to get grabby, imposing that signature gluttony on the Cramorant player. Fun in the context of sometimes having a rare catch to really fight over too (and the decision-making that goes with maybe passing prey up and attacking the opponent if they get too cocky about smacking your food away).

I like the effects of the big lingering water/wind features in the Specials and they combine in ways that feel fun, but I think the set could do a little more in the animations to sell those effects; Cramorant’s animations on these tend to be pretty lightweight (and DSpec doesn’t really have an animation at all). I guess that’s always kind of a difficulty with Pokemon and how the source material abstracts everything out, but I think ideaaaally there’d be a little more Cramorant-specific flavor somewhere in these moves that kinda sells it as “this is how Cramorant would make a whirlpool”. Though I guess “maybe there’s food in it” is at least something. Later moves in the set generally do a bit more of this kind of thing.

The pool creation on DSmash feels a little extra for my tastes; that move has pretty distinct mechanics already. The funky dodge and guaranteed catch already gives it a distinctive role you want to use it for and I worry that extra trap/stage control stuff layered on top is just kinda cluttering the real selling point of a cool attack. The DAir interaction is a neat pay-off but I do feel like DAir could have a different condition for doing that.

Cool set overall and I think the passive-counter mechanic I liked in Jacky Bryant is played with in a way that’s more fun here. Nice work!

Stray thoughts:
  • I’m a very mid Pokemon guy so I’m seeing this dumb bird try to eat Pikachu for the first time here, really got a kick out of it.
  • “This can be used to tug opponents back toward Cramorant by catching foes who shield the initial hit but drop their shield too early” - it bounces off shields, so if they block the initial hit the wave should go back and not hit them with later hits, right?
  • “Mostly serves as a close-quarters boxing option and ground combo starter at low percents, though the latter utility trails off at mid percents due to its overall low hitstun.” - possible I’m missing something, but I don’t quite follow why the attack stops working as a combo-starter.
  • FAir is fun, I like the blowback effect.
  • The actual cormorant gifs and images are a cool choice, it’s fun to see that kind of real-world reference.
  • “To pummel, the Pokémon bites down on the foe in a futile attempt at eating them” - he should be able to just do it if they’re at sudden death percentages.


Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
"Introducing new and improved Kuzco's Poison!

That's right, it is the poison for Kuzco. The poison chosen especially to kill Kuzco. Kuzco's Poison."

"You know, Slavic, this guy's advertisement is pretty good."


"New, improved and more deadly than ever, Kuzco's Poison is your one stop shop for all your anti-Kuzco needs! Whether it's in the throne room, the dining room or general Kuzco pest control, Kuzco's Poison has you covered! Call now and for ten easy installments of 29.99 we'll include a FREE llama transformation potion!* Also try our other range of wide ranging transformation products! With one taste of our rabbitization potion, your mind will explode AND expand..."

"WRONG LEVER, Froy! Argh, why do we even HAVE a free with ads lever?!"

"Well, all these evil plots don't come cheap. With all the expenses from the poisons, the bags, research and development, not to even mention the catering..."

"Catering? Weren't YOU handling that?"

"I wouldn't leave us out to dry with so much catering! For this size, you need to hire the sous chefs, then there's all the space to rent, the seating arrangements and of course we'll need florals..."

"We don't need florals, we need to finish this moveset!"

"B-But we'll be the laughing stock of the contest without florals!"

"Kuzco's Poison is completely safe to use!** Call NOW, before supplies run out!

*Llama transformation antidote sold separately.

**Do not ingest Kuzco's Poison if you are not named Kuzco. Kuzco's Poison for non-Kuzcos has not been approved for medicinal use. Using Kuzco's Poison while not being Kuzco may cause itchiness, indigestion, dizziness, spontaneous combustion and headaches. Repeated use of Kuzco's Poison have been associated with an increased risk of heart disease. Do not take Kuzco's Poison while pregnant or if you are looking to become pregnant. Do not take Kuzco's Poison if you are transformed into a llama, rabbit, octopus, cow, kitten or panther. Not suitable for Kuzcos under Age 7. Consult your doctor before plotting your Kuzco assassination attempt for an optimal post-mortem cover-up. Kuzco's Poison is not liable for any mishandling or misuse of this product, including but not limited to: drink flavoring, spinach puff flavoring, mouthwash, fertilizer, or lever greasing. Consult your doctor if death from poisoning persists for longer than four hours.

***Kronk & Yzma are now a Slavic and FrozenRoy joint! You can find the set in the image at the top of this post or click here.


Smash Lord
Nov 24, 2008
The Make Your Move Rooligan Society
These two are pretty hype Disney villains: I was curious how you’d go about them and their seemingly limited powersets. I wasn’t expecting Yzma to hide out in the tent: that’s a unique take on the “tag team” genre, which lends itself nicely to Neutral Special’s mindgame potential by hiding what type of feline Yzma transforms into. Transforming Kronk too only sweetens the move, in a way I didn’t expect from watching clips from the film. I 100% approve of how the details on moves that are based on Yzma + Kronk’s transformation combination are presented in this set - the font being nice and small so it doesn’t feel intrusive to the reading experience.

And of course we have to transform the opponent into animals - fun visual stuff that we haven’t seen in a while, not since Wizard Bowser or at least what I remember. I imagine it would be tricky to program all the special animal-based fighter moves for each character, like Captain Falcon’s donkey kick version of Falcon Punch. The way that transformed opponents need to get the antidote directly from Kronk + Yzma to change back reminds me a lot of Dr. Facilier’s edited grab where frog foes need to kiss a frog of their opposite gender, only far less tacky and more practical gameplay-wise. It is very Disney-like to make your opponent work for their cure! It would have been easy to just make the transformation only time-based, but I really like how the transformation was implemented flavour-wise, while also not being intrusive gameplay-wise.

  • The way Up Special’s hitbox is described and how it pop foes up to your recovery height at mid-high percents reads nice and concisely.
  • Having the duo plummet at the end of their glider recovery is a cool, Disney-like cartoony touch.
  • Busts resembling the opponent’s current appearance visually is a fun touch. Was not expecting them to be transformation-based - very cool that they can play off of Side Special like that.
  • Love Kronk’s grabbing animation - I could easily imagine him doing that in the movie.
  • Ghostface reference in Yzma’s pummel: 10/10.
  • U-throw’s animation of Kronk lifting his opponent up to Yzma’s level is funny.
  • Crocodile clamping onto llama foes feels a bit tacky, but not anything I would deduct points for.
  • Jab’s animation is amazing.

I’ll admit, I had very high expectations for this set: being in the works for a while, bringing up that one of the throws was very long and seeing this set’s 19k wordcount. It all made me think that Kronk & Yzma were going to be an elaborate tag team set and frontrunner set on par with Kaiba. Most of the wordcount comes from different variations between Yzma and Kronk’s transformations: paired with enemy transformations, it didn’t feel as conceptually exciting to me as a number of your other sets, as the attack variations didn’t add a lot of “substance” for me. Some of the hitbox shifting to make your sweetspots easier like for F-tilt is nice, though, and U-air - my favourite move in the set - makes good use of Neutral Special’s mindgame applications that don’t recur much in the set. I think the set would have been stronger had these mindgames been embraced more, but the actual mindgame concept is cool and worth bearing in mind for the future.

There is the melee like Hat Kid, but just not really a big hook or your usual fare of recently-creative throws, bar perhaps the D-throw squirrel. In your defense, Kronk and Yzma don’t have a ton to work with power-wise, and I get the impression that you might have been struggling to finish this set but still wanted to finish them to get out those characters that you love - had that experience before.

In spite of those words, this set IS a genuinely great Slavic experience! You nailed the Disney animation and comedic experience, getting the duo's character down perfectly. It's very nice since we haven't had any real Disney Disney villain sets (not counting Pixar) since the age of Kupa or so. Perhaps Disney villain sets will make a comeback? I would welcome more Disney sets from Slavic if they were executed this well flavour-wise.


Smash Journeyman
Aug 17, 2011
Kronk and Yzma
Okay, first thing I want to mention is that this set is really funny. Its a nice mix of Emperor's New Groove's style of humor and Slavic/sometimes Froy's own that blends well, and makes the set easy and fun to read. For a 19k word set it kind of breezes by and I think that's commendable, especially considering what I think of the set as an overall package.

Which, unfortunately, isn't very high. The set does at least manage to do something I like with these kind of weapon swaps which is using multiple different weapon switches you can adjust to create interesting synergies. Kronk's transformation can modify the placement of Yzma's hitboxes or how they follow out of his own transformed attacks, and with 3 forms to juggle there's a decent bit of variety in how they can mix and match. I don't really mind that every potential combination between forms isn't given a ton of detail given there's 9 of them, its more interesting to cover the highlights in a situation like this... but I found the set didn't really have as many of those as I'd like. This is a pretty subjective thing, I'm aware, but I just didn't find the set had much in the way of move combinations that felt like "oh yeah that's a really cool reason to go for OctoKronk + Panther Yzma" or what have you. Jab is definitely the best move in that regard and I do like how it can adjust FSmash's projectilve coverage/potency. And while not necessarily the most in-depth means of taking advantage of the duo's mechanics, Uair is definitely a cool move with how you can use it as a setup to transform mid-combo. But I didn't feel there were many other examples of this in the set, it mostly just fell like it descended into weapon switching for weapon switching's sake, not giving a concrete incentive for all the shifting in form and kind of just incentivizing the player to pick their favorite transformation setup. Which is... fine but I feel like in the long term there's only be 1-2 combinations used per match given that, making the mechanic feel a bit more superfluous than I'd like. Maybe that's being overly harsh though.

What I think also is a strike against the set is that Yzma/Kronk have quite a few things going against them for what doesn't feel like a lot of reward. They have a fairly wonky grab game, Yzma takes extra damage, and oftentimes their hitboxes don't come out where you'd want them to, and in exchange you get some decent versatility and a couple of okay debuffs/projectiles, leading me to feel the duo is actually pretty underpowered. Maybe I'm underestimating the power of the stone heads or the extra kill potential from turning a foe into a rabbit, but it definitely feels weak. I'm also really just... not a fan of the grab game, honestly. The actual throw animations out of the cargo throw feel weirdly "off" and unimpactful, I think to convey that Kronk doesn't want to do this, but its a rare sight in this set for the animations to actually feel lackluster when they're actually one of the highlights for the rest of the set. I'm also really not a fan of a throw with the same effect as the potion projectile special, I just don't think its necessary and mostly just exists for a goofy animation(which I think would play out making a lot of characters look stupider than they actually are, albeit not to nearly the degree of this type of move in old MYMs). The squirrel throw has a great visual but this set... doesn't really feel like it gets anything special out of a time bomb throw so it kinda just felt like its fancy for the sake of it.

I've spent a lot of time ragging on the set, but its not like there's nothing of value here. The melee is, as usual for you two, designed with a decent bit of nuance in mind, and while the chaos of 9 different transformation combos makes it a bit hard for my brain to follow what links into what there's definitely some fun uses for individual moves in neutral/advantage that I like. It doesn't ever reach the point of "Oh yeah, its all coming together", but what can you do. And with the exception of a couple nitpicks with Back Cargo Throw and Up Cargo Throw standing out as weak and FThrow making foes look stupider than they need to at times, the animations were generally very strong, in-character, and were smart in exactly how much they leaned into accidental attacks. You kind of have to have a couple with a character like Kronk, but the set doesn't overcommit to them despite him being a big pacifistic oaf. Its also pretty smart how the set doesn't dramatically change character animations/abilities in these transformations, just letting them do their normal thing in a cartoonier form which just kind of fits with the cartoony style of The Emperor's New Groove. It might resonate better with people that aren't me as I tend to dislike weapon switch without a more explicit "payoff" than this set feels like it has, for that matter, but I definitely think both of you can do better than this. You already did this contest with another joint in Nino, really.

Arctic Tern

Smash Apprentice
Mar 12, 2022
KRONK & YZMA (Slavic/Froy)


Kronk and Yzma are a fittingly goofy set for a goofy set of Disney villains. The main gimmick is, expectedly, transforming the foe and the duo themselves with Yzma’s array of potions, allowing them to inflict contrasting debuffs on their foes and adjust their own moves in various ways. I do like the various ways they intersect, primarily on the aerials where it’s fairly clear that Froy popped in (though I should note that the last paragraph on FAir is incomplete). There is definitely a feeling of disjointedness as FA pointed out, but it wasn’t as big a sticking point for me as with him.

Nevertheless, the set does the best it can to work with the given concept, and it does work quite well! All of the move variations have distinct use cases, and there is a definite playstyle beyond set alterations, one involving juggling and tech chasing; the latter fitting for a sneaky schemer like Yzma. And of course, the animations and characterization are very good for the most part, with a juuuust right number of accidental attacks for Kronk, a character who is not evil despite working for a villain, and Yzma herself being expectedly over the top.

Overall, while definitely not a frontrunner, Kronk and Yzma are still an enjoyable experience that I would 100% be down for playing in an actual Smash game - it’s just that the concept isn’t that cool for MYM standards. On a related note, this has gotten me to consider the potential of other Disney villains…

See more comments and ratings on my personal page!


Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Onion Knight by FrozenRoy FrozenRoy
I dig the wheel-style selection of magic attacks that are slow to refresh - gives a very JRPG protagonist feel, with a big-but-limited toolkit. Making them sort of a pseudo-stance change that modifies other attacks also plays into that in a cool way. I’m not sure it’s all worked super fluidly in a way that would scan well; FTilt and DAir are the things that give me pause there, since they have different mechanisms from everything else (FTilt being able to get multiple buffs and DAir being sort of a red herring aesthetic effect). Also the Ice effects seem a bit grab-baggy at times where the other elements draw on their themes in a way that feels more consistent and easy to grok.

The attacks that switch back and forth (DSpec and Dash Attack) are also neat - I think I buy it a bit more on Dash Attack, mainly due to Counter being in the mix on DSpec. It’s a really cool version of a counter, but Counters are already moves that demand quick thinking (this one more-so than others) and it feels like a big ask on headspace to have the move swapping to something else.

Still a cool set overall, but I didn’t vibe with it as hard as the real top shelf Froy stuff, even setting aside my misgivings on the particulars of the Big Idea stuff. I do really like the core Mystic Fencer mechanic. The magic <-> melee canceling is a fun way to play up both themes for a magic-y sword guy.

Stray thoughts:
  • “Mystic Fencer canceling into Counter isn't usually too useful, but if the attack you hit is susceptible to combo breakers it can really catch people offguard!” - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNkrUOGrsgI
  • I’m tired of these mystic fencing snakes on this Monday to Friday plane.
  • There’s a bit in DAir that says its crystal effect is “like” FTilt/FAir, but I suspect it means “unlike”.
  • DThrow is a really cool pay-off on the shurikens.

Midori Gang by Katapultar Katapultar
This is a really fun set! I think this one is under the radar a bit because you had such a great contest. I like the choice to keep the ‘core’ mechanics and most of the attacks pretty simple, given the way the Specials play off separating members from the pack and potentially having different inputs anchored to different places on the stage.

It’s very Hugo-esque but in a way that doesn’t get too out of hand. I do think some of the finer points of the controls are a little murky, particularly vis a vis the aerials (though I might have just missed it). I wasn’t sure how certain inputs would be interpreted if, say, you have Midori (owner of FTilt) on the stage and Ama (owner of FAir) in the air and do a Forward + Attack input. Or heck, what if they’re the other way around?

Anyway, the potentially-backfiring traps as centerpieces is a great bit of low-rent villainy, and that flavor stays strong throughout the set. The animations are very screwball, but definitely on brand based on the clips you’ve shared, and the characters shine through really strongly. MYM has a fondness for these sorts of pincer attack knocking-the-foe-back-and-forth type things, so it's a tough crowd to stand out in, but Midori does. Nice work!

Stray thoughts:
  • “Dodai will puff her cheeks and spit out a Pokeball-sized rock, presumably loaded into her stomach before the fight started.” - a subtle but effective way to paint someone as a real dummo.
  • “Duh, the opponent can’t hear you while they’re blocking!” - KermitNod.gif
  • With the DSmash knocback angle adjusting based on Midori’s position, it could be handy if the arrows were re-oriented appropriately to indicate the knockback direction… might make the effect a little more discoverable.
  • The DSmash anti-shield effect is a biiit funky, but not too bad.
  • Aha, the last-minute insane grab game. You love to see it. Ama and Dodai both have particularly bonkers Up Throws that I really dug.

Alex by Almand Almand
The approach to translating Street Fighter mechanics here is staggeringly weird and wild in its specificity and thoroughness and raw number crunching. It’s all a bit fear/awe-inspiring. The way the mechanics just keep layering onto each other before the set proper even gets started just paints such a crazy picture and tells you what you’re in for right out the gate in a way that I don’t think I’ve seen any other set do. It’s a bit demented and very brilliant.

I’m not sure how much I’d actually like to play Alex; the way the Street Fighters work in Smash has always been unappealing to me I think in part because I’ve always loved the ease of control in Smash. Having this weird, technical beast where you need to learn command inputs and you have tap/hold versions of a lot of attacks never felt like it was in the spirit of the thing to me. This is supposed to be the gateway drug of fighting games!

On the other hand, when Smash has nearly 100 characters in it, is it really such a bad thing for there to be some of the hard stuff mixed in? And I myself tend to be very big on writing super states and extra inputs and attacks that come in multiple versions, so is it really fair for me to wall off command inputs as some unreasonable point of complexity?

Probably not, but heck, I still don’t like ‘em intruding on my beautiful little party fighter. I don’t like the sense that the Street Fighters aren’t playing quite the same game as everyone else. And Alex is really packing that feeling in spades. He’s the Smash Street Fighters up to 11. He’s not just carrying over control scheme things, he’s straight up imposing SF knockdowns and rules for blocking Lows on Smash fighters! Alex is like some kind of eldritch entity from the Street Fighter world clawing its way into Smash and warping reality around itself.

All that said, this set rules and is great at what it’s doing. It's maybe not my school of design but that's not actually a criticism, and it absolutely kicks ass to see someone who loves Street Fighter and does jibe with this kind of approach to Smash adaptation just dive headfirst into it. Like I mentioned up top, the thing really goes nuts right from the beginning and it’s a joy to read. It’s not just a straight port, the set feels very savvy about what mechanics it brings in, how those things work in Smash, what the consequences are, and how it compounds with all the other stuff Alex is bringing in with him.

And uh, I guess I haven’t really talked that much about the attacks? It’s kind of a weird set for me in that by the time you hit the first Special you pretty much know what the set is. (This is true even setting aside the big tables, which are a bit intimidating and I didn’t do much more than skim). That said, it wouldn’t really mean much if the attacks weren’t well-constructed enough to deliver on the thoroughly-established premise. Fortunately the attacks are exactly what the mechanics tee you up to expect. This set always has its eye on the ball and knows exactly the kind of weird combo-grappler Alex is and how to play off that in interesting ways that make him feel like a real menace. The thing’s really kind of a master class on just being aware of attacks’ niches and when small nuances between attacks can make all the difference in the world.

I’d vibe with the direction a bit more if he were doing less SF stuff, but I think the set would be poorer for it, and definitely less thought-provoking. I admit I prefer Sleaze, but Sleaze is a favorite, and Alex is the kind of passion project that’s clearly paid off.

Stray thoughts:
  • This set unironically drops the line "as we’ve discussed many times over the course of this set" in the first Special.
  • Slash Elbow raises the question of “What direction is back?” in reference to its command input but ultimately it does still rely on the back direction for a quarter circle back input, no? It is still probably a little easier to pull off than a charge back though.
  • “V-Trigger Cancel from EX Flash Chop” is a phrase with a nice rhythm to it. Assuming you pronounce “EX” like “ex” and not “E. X.” I guess.
  • Slash Elbow says “Any version of Flash Chop (just know that Heavy can’t connect into its followup, since it’s a command grab”, which confused me a bit until I got to the Power Drop section.
  • “This move functions as Alex’s Recovery” - on a z-motion? I’m doomed.
  • Really can’t stress enough how crazy this set’s version of Lows is. They work, but it’s kinda wild.
  • Despite the super technical nature of the whole affair, you’ve got a good writing style for keeping it light, there are some good laugh lines in there.
  • “You can potentially just loop F-Throw over and over.” - I didn’t catch it if this was spelled out, but it seems like Alex isn’t subject to the usual timer limitation on grabbing someone after they’re released?
  • “A pretty weirdly-named one, I don’t really get it.” - he does end up going back to where he started the attack I guess.
  • I do wish I were a little more up on SF so I could appreciate some more of the nuance behind the adaptation choices here. I have SFV but haven’t really futzed around with it much, really need to give it more of a shot.
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Smash Journeyman
Aug 13, 2007
Reading/Editing Period is Closed! ...Sort of. Voting Period Begins!

As people whittle down their reading list, we come into the home stretch, and will be doing something unconventional that we did back in 23. Firstly, Voting Period will run from now until the end of February. This extension is to help those who began reading late due to real life issues and those who have been going at a steady pace but weren't quite on pace to finish.

Secondly, for the unconventional part- Edits will be allowed throughout the Voting Period. Note that it's still ideal to finalize your sets as soon as possible- if you make an edit during the 11th hour when nobody has time to read it, it won't do you much good, but for those who have final adjustments to make as the last rounds of comments come rolling in, the opportunity is still there- albeit shrinking rapidly. Best of luck to you all!
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
"Two or one, it makes no difference. Another dog, another bullet. And I have so, so many to spare!"

O. Dio

UserShadow really wasn't horsing around with O. Dio, his entry for Jamcon #4. Armed with his trusty gatling gun, O. Dio was a set I found highly impressive. Said gatling gun is a big reason why: A truly busted move when he can use it, it serves as a focal point of fear and terror for the foe to deal with, a screenwide strike that truly gets across the FEEL of firing a big freakin' gatling gun with how the multihit carrying works. It feels immensely satisfying and different from other "big hitter attacks" like, say, Primordial Darkness in how it is used, reminding me more of Lexaeus from ages past since as much as the gatling gun's might is the key is the fact it scares foes so much. O. Dio, after all, is your classic big heavyweight with slower frame data who will have to overcome those pesky quickdraw heroes with some mindgames. This offers good synergy with his Crazy Bunch minions, since their delaying antics not only allow O. Dio to line up a crisp gatling gun shot but play into his gameplan outside of it of a bit of a poking, heavyweight combo fellow with flashy finishers.

The set overall has a very good understanding of what the set is doing and, importantly, what the set is NOT doing and the weaknesses of it. Gifting O. Dio with a lacking game for covering his back to emulate how Live A Live's system encourages back-hitting enemies is a nice and flavorful translation, but it feels particularly good here rather than other LAL incarnations because of how O. Dio's greatest weapon is such a straight-hitting strike that punishes foes in front of him. You definitely get the impression opponents will have to be nimble to get around O. Dio both defensively to avoid his greatest strength and offensively to hit one of his clear weaknesses. Back Aerial also feels acutely aware of where its presence will be felt in the set given this, and avoids going into unnecessary guff because of it. This is another area where the Crazy Bunch feel helpful, as their stage control can compensate for O. Dio's weaknesses with positioning. Moves like Up Tilt also weave into this well, as along with attacks like Up Aerial give O. Dio a focus on anti-airing with his upwards attacks to account for how opponents will most likely try to get behind him and serve as a soft counter to that strategy, while in turn it limits his advantage upside because his chasers with Up Special tend to be more specific rather than juggling. His zoning moves are cleverly designed around this as well, such as Forward Tilt's power-spacing with foes in front of him best countered by jumping in, with some multi-purpose as a combo ender that gets foes offstage where the gatling gun can seriously pressure how foes recover. Add in attacks like Dash Attack (which can double as either a non-gatling gun kill confirm or a Captain Falcon Up Tilt style spike), Neutral Aerial (a great tool for a fastfalling heavy to use as an approach or at ledge, which hurts the safety part of his NAir), Forward Aerial (works very well into his neutral with F-Tilt/NAir/U-Tilt and as a tool for those deadly off-stage gatling gun situations as well) and Down Tilt (anti-shield when his pokes eat away at it, a 2-frame if people go low to avoid his scary options vs. high recoveries) and you start to see how the attacks all fit together into one greater picture of neutral, advantage, disadvantage and more. O. Dio is a very clever set, something it knows it has to be given the straightforward nature of the set.

"I'll never sleep... I'll never die..."

Which brings me to another point I want to make. After reading Shadow Mario, me and ForwardArrow got into an interesting little discussion on JamCon sets, and the thought came to mind that O. Dio (along with Shadow Mario, a set I also feel has been a little overly ignored) truly feels like a "platonic ideal" of a JamCon set, or perhaps less over-the-toply that they feel like exactly the kind of sets that JamCons had in mind to get made. The scope is moderate, not too short or very wide, and explored well through effective yet not overly complex attacks in a way that makes for one of the easiest reads of the contest. The scope and ideas are nonetheless fresh, and feel well affixed to a character who would have a strong core idea to build around in a JamCon fashion. It knows exactly what it wants to be and it hits those notes strongly. That's not to say it is a set stronger than the toppest of JamCons, but I do think it stands out as a shining example of how JamCons were "intended" to be and how that level can produce wonderful movesets.

I would be remiss if I didn't also mention the animations. Having actually played the Wild West chapter of Live A Live recently but having read O. Dio before that, he really pops out of the page in a way that feels perfectly in line with how he is presented n the game. Jab is one of my favorite in the set, the cracking knuckles and flexing muscles feeling down and dirty, the facial expression on his smashes and how it leans into using the cigar as a light for his molotov on Forward Smash, and I especially love the way that his lackeys are in traditional 16-bit style visual and audio cues. Not only does it feel very akin to fellow Smash gunslinger Duck Hunt Dog (in fact, the entire Down Special feels DHD-y in a good way), but I think it gives the set a feel of O. Dio being the big bad boss who gets a much more detailed, intense and larger portrait, while his lackeys are confined to smaller roles. The moveset also feels like it, stylistically, opposes the sets we got for The Sundown Kid (who also relies on straight ahead gunplay, but in terms of speed rather than power) and Mad Dog (the way his crew works vs. the way Mad Dog's traps work feel somewhat opposed, or for example the way O. Dio uses the burning fire). O. Dio isn't exactly a complex character, but this moveset certainly paints a picture of who he is. A picture of blood, and lead, and DEATH!

In conclusion, don't say neigh when it comes to O. Dio. The set might seem a bit simple at first glance, but dig a little deeper (perhaps with a Shovel trap?) and think about the overall picture and you'll find a clever moveset that fits together straightforward, interlocking pieces well from top to bottom with little more than grit, fits, and of course a freakin' gatling gun!
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Smash Rookie
May 22, 2021
I like Mao. He seems like a real treat to play as, he feels like an absolute goober and the mechanics seem fun, the magi-change attacks specially, they are a really cool mechanic to have even if they would result in a type of character I don’t tend to favor. I specially dig the few magichange moves where you suck foes into the book, that was fun, so were the prinny cameos (Mostly because they are the only thing I know about Disgaea tho). I loved the final smashes too, they’re just around my alley, being just edgy enough, and so is Mao’s character design. The presentation was stellar too, and it made it so much easier for my monkey brain to understand what was going on.

On a side note, I like that you took the time to detail all the extras for this moveset, you guys really do go above and beyond whenever you do this kind of thing, and I'm so excited to join in on the MyM extras part of the fun at some point.


Smash Journeyman
Aug 13, 2007
Kronk & Yzma by Slavic Slavic and FrozenRoy FrozenRoy

And made it under the cut! Which means yet another comment. And a note that the moveset list lists them as "Yzma & Kronk" which is a little weird. What we have here is a very flavorful twist on the weapon/form change style of moveset, Yzma, Kronk, and their unwitting foe changing shape to fit the match-up in the duo's favor as the fight rages on. While there's some really neat tricks certain combinations have with different moves, I do wish there was a little more in terms of 'oh wow' moments where the exact aspects of a move in conjunction with certain combinations really pay off.

That's not a huge ding against the set for me, though- listing every combination's effect on every move would get exhausting after all, and I feel you would be more focused on a given pair of Yzma/Kronk forms depending on the match-up rather than constantly switching around given the time it takes and the duo's generally slow moveset. It's a valid approach, even if from a written moveset standpoint it makes it harder to visuallize the two at their peak for how different it could look against any given opponent.

Still, I'm going to agree that the set is a little on the underpowered side- the two have some of the standard heavyweight weaknesses with on-average mediocre frame data, poor air mobility and jumps, and some of its heavy-hitting options involving exposing Yzma (to attack, remain calm) where you can be struck for 1.5x the normal damage of an attack. I'd give the duo a little better frame data here and there (especially on its bread and butter- apologies for the implication Kronk- neutral inputs), up their air and jump stats a teensy bit, and knock that damage multiplier down to 1.3x. They CAN get pretty potent with some proper potion application tailored to their opponent's failings, but even then they're not really dominating any matches.

That's not to say I disliked the set by any stretch. All the comedic horsepower of the duo is on display here, and there's some exceptionally fun and creative tricks of note like Up Special, Down Special, Down Throw, and especially Up Smash that emphasize their cartoonish nature. The actual mechanical bits of their standards and aerials felt finely polished, and the Yzma attacks in particular felt super satisfying to land. All that and a humorous writing style that shows a love of the source material.

To end off on a pair of nitpicks- regarding Down Throw, what angle/direction is Bucky's knockback aimed in, and regarding Forward Aerial, it ends on an incomplete thought regarding Cow and Octo Kronk- "There’s a sliiiiight decrease in power around the whole "
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Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Kanade by Katapultar Katapultar
I was really surprised by the scope of the RNG specials here - I’d heard he had some random Specials going on but I’d assumed they were cycling per-match or per-stock, not every few seconds. It’s a bold choice and a really strong opening gambit for the set.

It does sound like kind of a departure from the source material (on the really basic level of trying to implement things as 1-1 as possible anyway), since you say it only cycles once a day, which sounds more like a 1-episode or 1-adventure type thing? But resetting your tools constantly does create these opportunities for… “bam, I instantly put together the right way to use these weird tools” moments where players have to adapt to their toolkit on the fly. It’s a cool adaptation choice. (Note: That was my initial read on it - later on it was spelled out more explicitly that that was what you were going for so A+)

Despite that, I think this one starts straying a little too complex for my tastes pretty quickly. Fireball is a perfectly manageable move, but even just reading through the rest of his NSpec options, I’m starting to question how often optimal (or even competent) Kanade play is happening. The “what is Kanade capable of right now?” layer of the match is a lot for both players to keep up with before you get to the “what should I do about that?” layer. Regularly, in the middle of trying to do anything, you have to be checking the HUD to figure out what Kanade can Kana-do. Approaching him intelligently is kind of a guessing game if you’re doing it at the wrong time and the wrong time is “every three seconds”.

I think simpler moves and/or a longer timer between cycles could have sold me a lot better on the set’s functionality. Or maybe just treating the RNG as a sort of super-state he entered temporarily? As-is I think he’d be kinda wild to see in a FFA, in the same way that Hero is (but even more-so): just constantly throwing out wild magic bs and forcing everyone to keep up. But I think he’s pushing the envelope pretty hard in terms of difficulty of good play. Everything about the way he works is demanding a lot of headspace from both players. Which I get is part of the point (pushing him to have to figure out his own set and adapt on the fly), contributing to why I’m so conflicted on this one: I like what it’s going for, I just think doing it constantly is too big an ask on everyone involved.

I do appreciate the decisions made to take the edge off that difficulty: keeping DSpec mostly consistent and USpec totally consistent is sharp, and even the SSpec options being tuned to complement your NSpec is a good choice.

Another cool thing (though it’s also part of the reason I think he eats so much headspace) is that every Special here feels like it’s given a lot of oomph and that is kinda great to read. He doesn’t just have Book Laser, he has Chargeable Book Laser Minefield. He has Three-Variant Icicle and of course One Tornado Into Two Tornadoes (Charge For One Tornado Reprise). All a mere 60% percent of one Special input. And despite my complexity complaints I think most of the individual Specials (Water Pillar gave me pause) are good about adding their complexity in ways that isn’t immediately challenging to work with. It’s really only in aggregate that things start to look like a lot.

It’s cool to see a set build up this amount of crazy interactions - some of the harder ones are especially fun. They probably don’t help on the complexity front, but I was thinking it’d be a fun context for hard interactions after reading the mechanic, so it was fun to see them crop up a little bit in places.

The set kinda reminds me of Eldlich - the execution and style are different but I feel like I’m in a similar place on both. Kanade’s doing a lot of cool stuff; there’re a lot of mechanics in here I’d like to see pulled out and played with in a place where they can shine more, which is kinda ridiculous and commendable in a set like this that could have been functional with much simpler moves. But it all feels like a bit much to me, and I have a hard time totally vibing with the end product as a result.

Stray thoughts:
  • Love Paralyze Laser, reminds me of the murakomos from BlazBlue. Fun, crazy projectile move.
  • I get why it’s here given the set’s mechanics, but Freezing Aura doesn’t feel super Side Special-y.
  • Shield Special is an interesting wrinkle and a minor ‘stabilizing’ effect. The way it’s flavored and animated is very cool.
  • Flare Accel mentions being the only move the clone won’t use, but I believe it also doesn’t use Gravity Pull.
  • The standards really don’t slow down from the specials. Seems like they might at first, but once Up Tilt drops, things start looking pretty wild again.
  • The Smashes are really cool! I love big crazy pay-off attacks like this, and the animations do a lot to sell them.
    • The zaniness of the down-angled FSmash is something. This set has 8500 inputs and will still put something that could be the centerpiece of a different moveset as a conditional version of an attack.
    • It probably shouldn’t crack me up as much as it does, but the contrast between Forward-Down being a totally different move and Forward-Up just being a normal angled variant is very funny to me.
  • A lot of control complexity in the aerials. Neat ideas though.
  • I like the wrinkle of being able to delay FThrow to stall for cycle time, that’s a subtle-but-cool thing.
  • Truly insane Final Smash(es), incredible.

Valkyrie Walkure by FrozenRoy FrozenRoy
I’ve always been an echo apologist (well I used to be a clone apologist, dang modern lingo) so it’s cool to see an ambitious echo fighter like this. Mobility Amplification is fun as a new centerpiece to replace the echo-swapping; it’s interesting to see a high-mobility aerial character that has to work just a little bit for all their aerial tricks. MA doesn’t seem to really consider a visual indicator, but it’d benefit from some kind of something; since it impacts your recovery (and ability to challenge recoveries) it is good to know if you’re running out of time. The fact that it refreshes on stacking helps with ease of tracking a bit, but still.

It’s been a while since Valkyrie (let’s not think about just how long it’s been) so I was flipping back and forth and skimming the original to catch some of the little commonalities. I think reusing bits of the animation descriptions feels like fair game - it’s a couple sentences here and there in a pretty largely body of work and it feels at home with how a moveset might include text from a skill or what-have-you in the source material (if admittedly a bit more functional).

There’re a lot of attacks with custom input stuff here (which is a neat aesthetic choice, plays up the attacks as general purpose vs specialized, feels like a good touch); got a charge tilt and a directable dash attack and whatever the heck FSmash is.

Personally I’m not hot on the way the knockback angle thing in FSmash works. There’s for sure an appeal to being able to choose where you put the foe (there’s a reason DK FThrow is an instant classic) but it seems clunky to control, and doesn’t feel like it’s introducing a meaningful restriction (as compared to just being able to pick an angle with the analog) since she can cover most angles anyway. Obviously it’s alright for sets to have some degree of “you gotta read the manual” but I feel like the set has that here without really benefiting from it.

There is that the current version rewards knowledge of Walkure’s kit in order to get what you want, I suppose. I’d buy it a lot more if the attack you chose were actually animated maybe? Like if she just did the attack you picked as a follow-up but it didn’t deal damage (and instead dealt the FSmash-strength knockback) and was basically a fancy kill animation. Attack’s already practically a grab, couldn’t hurt to put some sauce on the animation. Then it still rewards knowing Walkure’s set but you can tell what’s happening (and depending on how you sell it you could make it look cooler). Also this is a pretty minor note despite me spending two paragraphs on it, whoops.

The set does a really good job homaging Valkyrie and reworking the original set’s animations around the stray handful of more explicitly changed attacks; definitely feels like a different package with cool concepts of her own. Fun stuff.

Stray thoughts:
  • Valkyrie Walkyrie.
  • I wonder how viable it’d be to start a match by just jumping off stage for space and using Mobility Amplification three times in the air and counting on your aerial prowess to recover.
    • I am a good planner and great at this game.
  • I don’t always really like gifs in a set. Nice to break up text a little, but having something animated in a set sometimes draws the eye in a way I don’t always find helpful when I’m trying to contextualize in my head what it means for a set to have an option like blah-blah-blah. More of an issue with really short/fast gifs, generally.
    • More to the point of the gif question in the dev notes, dealer’s choice IMO. The whole thing is heavily referential of the OG Valkyrie and it’s not gonna lose that if different presentation choices are made. If anything I think it’d be interesting to see an echo set like this where the author had very different ideas about presentation.
  • “the Heavy Nova if you will” - if I don’t, who will? This is a fun spin on Nova, plays off the context of MA in a cool way.
  • I dig the projectile DAir, definitely the kind of bs I’d use a lot.
  • I guess I let it pass without comment the first time around because the set seemed aware of it, but screw it: this grab animation is funny on basically every character. Powerful in the screenshot meta.
  • “If the Walkure grab Sigurd or Siegfried” - hope these two are having a good time hanging out in the Extras-Only Void with Ragna and Tsubaki.
  • Amplified Down Throw also a very fun move.
  • Walkure gennnnnerally feels closest to weird middle child Ortlinde, which I think is on-theme?

Isabella by Slavic Slavic
This is a quick little read and a fun set. It’s definitely Jamconny - some things lack connective tissue and there are a couple promised hard interactions that never materialize. (There’s a “promised neverland” joke somewhere in that sentence, pretend I wrote it.) The set succeeds at selling the character, though. She feels very appropriately slice-of-life-character-from-hell: lots of prop-heavy stuff punctuated by the odd bit of brutality. Could have maaaybe used a touch of the latter in the aerials.

The core concepts here are nifty. Radar as a mobility buff that only works when you’re already close to the foe has some interesting implications on a trap-heavy character like this. It lends some power to her ability to run away and set up traps, but she’s got competent-enough melee that it also gives her room to try to stay on top of the foe and apply pressure, when she’s already got the stage set. It’s interesting that a couple of her traps really only come out with radar. Gives her a very distinct feel that she has to engage and disengage in order to manage her set-up on a pretty tight timer.

The conditional insta-kill trap and its calendar summoning mechanic are also fun and evocative; this is clearly kind of a tricky character to adapt, but this feels like a great direction that gives her a genuinely scary centerpiece trap to try to feed foes into. The set feels like it strikes a good balance at giving her some other ways to kill while still keeping the Death Truck very central.

Stray thoughts:
  • “obviously Isabella can’t have two Krone’s out and about” - I dunno, I never saw this show, coulda just had two and fooled me.
  • This calendar is accurate to October 2045.
  • “Yes, this looks silly, but what isn’t silly is the stock the foe just lost as they’re sent off as a demon delicacy.” - this is also where Kapp’n’s bus goes.
  • “this move isn’t designed to kill the foe, it’s designed to clean sheets.” - this did actually remind me I needed to throw my sheets in the wash, good set.
  • “Given it being made of feathers, it just makes sense for this to be one of Isabella’s most versatile aerials.” - KermitNod.gif

Saul Goodman by Rychu Rychu & BKupa666 BKupa666
This is kind of a funky one. The huge list of different charges and effects that build up at the beginning of the set is staggering at first. After reading through the set a bit and mulling it over, I was able to roll with it a bit by deciding the specifics didn’t actually matter that much. In practice, if I want money: get some props or summons out, get the camera rolling, Play Normal, maybe keep one or two favorite tricks in mind. Money will happen. He’s basically a character with a super meter that just funnels his meter gain through a couple key moves (use Down Special to tee up Charges and land Neutral Special to actually apply Charges and get that sweet sweet meter gain).

I do wonder if glossing over the details here would have been a better move than front-loading the set so hard. Kinda like how Jun separated the magichange stuff out of Mao. I think rattling off everything with this kind of specificity tees up the expectation that it’s all Important when really it’s all kinda stuff you can deal with in the abstract when you’re just trying to get your bearings with how Saul plays. It’s good to have the specifics, don’t get me wrong. I just don’t think it’s an early priority for introducing readers to the set.

This is a weird thing to say about a set where the Neutral Special ends halfway in, but the Neutral Special feels weirdly under-served here. Specifically, the actual… “just hit guys” part of it. That’s a huge bottleneck in his set. It’s not that hard a move to land, but he does need to do it from time to time to access any of the pay-offs in his set, and that need is gonna really define his play. It’s strange to me that this… really barely comes up? I caught a reference to it in Jab but that’s about it. The set’s much more focused on how all the high-end pay-offs can interact with each other and how you can get Lenny to stand on a luxury car for enormous profit, and I feel like it loses sight of fundamentals at times. The other thing that doesn’t really work for me about Neutral Special is the tapped version and the held version living on the same input. It’s just… very mechanically dense and de-emphasizes tapped NSpec in a way that feels bad to me. YMMV, but I wouldn’t like it if holding NSpec made Captain Falcon do a Monado either.

In general, the set feels very invested in giving the player as much control as it can, and I’m not sure it’s all really necessary. The way the camera is implemented feels… kinda busy? Don’t get me wrong, there’s an appeal to having to make short-term plans and set yourself up so that you know when and where your pay-offs are happening, but there’s some weird clunk to having this two-tiered version. If anything I think this move is the one that’d make sense to combine with the signature Better Call Saul shout, since it’s the other half of the bottleneck in his set and there’s a narrative flow between the moves.

This philosophy also creeps into the business contacts - every one of them being toggleable between synced and desynced (piling another function onto NSpec) feels pretty extra? The luxury of having six different summonable mooks is that they can be specialized. The set also feels like it gets really preoccupied with Lenny and Kuby; I get it, they’re very much the sort of thing that makes MYM’s brain tick, but they feel like they should be wacky optional complements in Saul’s toolkit and they’re getting focused over central ideas. The set ends up in a surprisingly sandboxy place at the end of the day.

This comment has drifted into pretty negative territory, I think, which isn’t totally fair. There’s a lot of cool stuff here. The set has a good sense of style and humor to it; that’s true at the presentation level but also at the mechanical level. A lot of attacks here are fun and cool and weird, and I think he’d be a blast to see in action. The set juggles a lot of crazy ideas (there's a lot in this comment I haven't really touched on, set's kinda nuts) and even if I don't think it quite nails focusing the right stuff, it's impressive that it all gels as well as it does.

Stray thoughts:
  • Somehow the University of New Mexico Film Students Special feels more surreal than the Talking Toilet Tilt.
  • When characters get a charge applied on film, an icon should pop up over them WarioWare style (w/e the icons look like if you look at them with Shield Special). Maybe grayed out or with a line through it or something if it’s not lucrative enough to displace existing charges. Maybe include the cash value too.
  • Getting the crowd to turn on his victim and boo them is great, love that.
  • “The angry letters take the form of a beam, about as thick as Samus’ Zero Laser and extending two-thirds of Battlefield in reach for its three-second duration.” - this feels like an attack Mega Man would get from killing a really crappy robot master.
  • The way the billboards are introduced is a little confusing - the ‘billboard’ part of the ‘billboard’ is just sort of missing at first and the move also doesn’t establish a cap on his recovery distance until a bit late, so it’s a little hard to track.
  • Jab is really fun! Great marriage of flavor and usage.
  • Coffee illegal?
  • It’s just by the whims of RNG that I read Kanade, Isabella and then this, but I think Saul does weirdly feel like some kind of unholy fusion of those two sets.
  • “a midair pitfall state” - RobertRedfordNod.gif
Last edited:


Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Bare On More Do (Baron Mordo n88 n88 )

This was adapted from a Discord comment on the set.

Some quick thoughts: Dormammu is a fun boss and I do like this set's idea of a Boss Summoning Set, it reminds me of Don Thousand in ways albeit reversed. I see how F-Tilt / F-Smash work well enough as attacks and what FAir is doing non-damaging with Dormammu (which is a bit Strange but...acceptable), but I do feel like in general Mordo maybe goes a bit too far with trickery attacks that are a bit awkward to use in combat, to the point he might feel a bit funky to play. The set plays off of Dormammu well, but to be honest what I would love is if Dormammu played off Mordo more, if that makes sense. I feel like Mordo having moves that directly work well with Dormammu's attacks where he is setting up Dormammu would give a unique flavor to him as a summoner type, and could have interesting applications. Dash Attack, F-Smash felt particularly fun. I think it could be fun if the duplicate becomes more "real" and can deal (reduced?) damage if he is in his Empowered stance.

Given his Darkness Meter is a direct tie to Dormammu, I wonder if it could be fun if he used some Dormammu-esque power when empowering some attacks while Dormammu is allied to him or yet to be summoned? I dunno.

Overall, nice enough set, feels very comparable to Herminia to me, but it does feel like the gameplay without Dormammu is just a touch lacking, and a touch more could be done when Dormammu does arrive. I'd say it feels sub-Herminia for sure, though. One major issue I have with the set is that it feels too difficult for Baron Mordo to attack above him with how his Up Smash and Up Aerial work, which especially since he does have some other funky directions means he might not be that enjoyable to play. Solid enough for a Jamcon anyway.


When you have to shoot, shoot! Don't talk. (Mad Dog U UserShadow7989 )

"While not so heavily outnumbered in Smash, he knows the score and isn't exactly eager to square up against the likes of Ganondorf or Ridley with just his gun and his fists." And don't get me started on Jigglypuff!

Mad Dog is, overall, a pretty fun set. I agree with the premise that Mad Dog is more suited to use the traps than Sundown Kid because of him making them, and I also like how it actually makes a bit of an in character trio with Mad Dog, Sundown Kid and O. Dio from this contest: Mad Dog, as the one who loses to Sundown repeatedly despite being skilled, is weaker in a straight gunfight but makes up for it with traps. Sundown has the long range and can control the stage, and Mad Dog, well, and O. Dio is raw power but also the one most reliant on others (his gang) to make up for his deficiencies as befitting a flunky-summoning boss. I don't think you three coordinated it like that, but it worked out well I'd say.

The actual traps themselves are pretty good, the Bottled Fire was a favorite of mine among them, and I think four traps ended up being juuuust the right amount. Each trap feels distinct from the other (aerial/stage control, anti-movement/trip, KO confirm/pitfall and pure power) and non-excessive, so that's a nice and clean design. Sidewinder is a cool attack, I like using the reticle not just to aim the direction but also to essentially "choose" the move's sweetspot. It also helps keep the move balanced, giving the foe warning of the potent sweetspot and reducing the ranged kill power on average. Rode the Lightning gives Mad Dog an opposing projectile as well, short ranged and all about damage rather than the potentially sweet kills. The moveset keeps up the quality after this move: Forward Smash, Up Smash (a clever re-use of the Bottled Fire theme), Forward Tilt (the way it has uses but DOESN'T just work into every aspect of his game is quality restraint), Dash Attack (helps give Mad Dog some tools that aren't just campy), Neutral Aerial (an attack that sounds OP at first glance but ends up balanced) and Back Aerial are some attacks that stand out to me. I also think this set has some great animations, I loved the classic western duel feel on Forward Smash or the Jab's really punchy description. Leaving aside the grit and grind of the set, it is very easy to imagine it VISUALLY in Smash Brothers.

I suppose if I had one notable complaint, the grab game didn't quite feel like it lived up to the rest of the set. I did rather enjoy Forward Throw, and I wouldn't say the grab game is BAD either, but it doesn't stand out the way that the rest of the set does. I would suppose there's also some points where it does feel like it could come together a bit more, but it is mostly straightforward in a way where that feels fine. I suppose his edgeguards might be a bit strong? I'm not sure Down Tilt would 2-frame from a logic standpoint of how 2-frames work, but the hitbox can be coded that way so w/e. Overall, Mad Dog feels like a pretty strong 7 that's well rounded and quite in character, lacking any major flaws and mostly just ending on a bit of a mediocre note relative to the rest of the set. Great work, especially for a Jamcon!

The Emblem of Kart (Saint Elimine WeirdChillFever WeirdChillFever )

I actually think the Affinity element mechanics are pretty cool, at least conceptually, and the stat increasing items she blessed us Double Dash owners with (ignore I did not own Fire Emblem) make for a cool basis. I do kinda wish the items were like the Fire Emblem stat boosters in that they were just all permanent (per stock), which would add a layer of customizability to Elimine's stats. The heal could be replaced by increasing weight (which is like increasing HP, it is maximum damage you can take after all!) for this for example. So Elimine could end up built a lot of different ways depending on the whims of RNGesus. Additionally, it would give the stat items a uniqueness compared to the Affinity stat modifers, where they give permanent effects but are more limited to RNG unlike the choosable or cycle-based buffs. I'd say one of my biggest issues with this set is the buffs do feel too similar. I don't really mind them all being stat boosters, but the Affinities all feel pretty close to each other and double up frequently, while it DOES lead to the fun of stacking boosts I think over the course of eight buffs it wears a bit thin. I do like how Holy Ground also has some foe debuffs. Maybe it would have been fun if combinations unlocked specific boons, like some bonuses on specific attacks, that would be nice. I do like Holy Ground being cycle dependant and that giving them a different vibe. But maybe that's against Catholic doctrine IDFK. I could see it being fun to add some visual effects on various attacks from the Affinity but that's more of a side thing.

Up Special's Lift formula is actually really cool. I like the method of tying recovery and buff/debuff together. I do like the idea of Elimine using the Legendary Weapons from FE6/7, befitting her nature as one of them there heroes, I wonder if one way Affinity could have been expanded was to somewhat tie them in with the Affinities. For example, Athos' Affinity in-game is Anima, Bramimond's is Dark, for something like Eliwood's you can use his Anima affinity too, whatever, anyway maybe if you have that buff on it gives a special effect to attacks of the same Affinity. Get that Fire Emblem synergy feel in there, you know? Elimine's gacha focus is interesting and given how she exists in terms of playability very in-character, but I do feel like her throws could be compressed into 1-2 gacha-based throws and give some room for other stuff. Elimine's Down Aerial is very fun and I did also enjoy Neutral Aerial (especially combined with Dash Attack), but a good number of Elimine's attacks do feel kinda...there. I feel like the buff-based nature of Elimine being so extreme put more pressure on the non-Specials to pull weight, when the non-Specials largely were Fine but not too impressive. Down Smash's Holy Ground interaction feels kinda weak.

I'd also say while this set was very fun to read due to the humor, it did also feel like it hurt the set a little in sheer density. A lot of time is taken up with the humor and sometimes that suffocates the actual moveset portion of the set, at least to me. I do think Elimine had a lot of fun ideas (it almost made me imagine what would happen if it got remixed or really edited up lol), but it didn't quite stick the landing. Was glad to read it anyway.

Giganotojokerlightyearstormsaurbius (Giganotosaurus Slavic Slavic )

"In the crucible of Smash Bros., Giganotosaurus is quite large, just about the perfect midpoint between Ridley and Shin Godzilla of yestercontest." I, too, am between the size of Earth and Jupiter.

Before I get into this set, befitting for the point I am about to make, I want to say the following: This set was hurt by the interconnectivity of the world around us, the nature of movesets as shared through an instant message service, and our desire of sharable meme culture. Half of the humor of Giganotosaurus comes from the ridiculousness of escalation. It starts with Giganotosaurus, then goes up to Geostorm, and then later we're getting Buzz Lightyear and family. One of the entire jokes, as intended through its neo-critique of movie crossovers, is how much it can one-up itself in silliness with what it piles onto this ****. The shock value is part of the entire humor.

Naturally since we're all connected into Discord, everybody read the set, started laughing at the memes and being shared which despite spoilering everyone clicked anyway, Giganotosaurus jokes ran rampant, and where does that leave the poor clown dinosaur? After all, now the shock of escalation is dulled. What is left is the expectation. Sigh, there's Buzz Lightyear, like we all knew he would be. Is it funny to see Buzz Lightyear if we know he is there? Maybe that's the true of silly crossover and cameos that get ruined in trailers and posters? Were we ****ing spoiled by the Giganotosaurus Moveset Poster? I demand an Honest Trailers for Giganotosaurus. It feels like a set people may have found funnier if they didn't have the weight of expectations attached to it.

Anyway, ha ha funni dinosaur

"Giganotosaurus is famed for being a dinosaur, allegedly one larger than Tyrannosaurus rex, but that claim is a bit dubious. What is not dubious is the fact that Giganotosaurus in fact has a mouth, one with teeth, and is more than capable of biting hapless victims." Well I can't argue with that. The shockwave with its different hitboxes based on wave range and locusts feel like an interesting enough base, and I feel like item play isn't something you've necessarily explored a ton (let alone food items), although it feels...awkward with Giganotosaurus can't use held items (and yet it can hold onto a ladder tsk tsk).

"Jurassic World: Dominion had a lot of exciting new creatures thrown into the mix and almost none of them were used well" Will this moveset be emulating that as part of its film critique?

I actually think Dash Attack is fairly cool too. Dash Attacks with those kind of odd, disjointed hitboxes to catch defensive options are fun, and while I get the feeling Giga is...Not the place to try it, I do think attaching it to a minion summon was novel in a way that has potential for future sets. I do think the idea of these "pop out" minions is interesting and in the right set you could do something, but here it makes Giganotosaurus feel bizarrely weak and also most of them don't feel like they fit together as much. Dutch Boy's ideas are probably the most interesting in the set, creating unique "enviroments" based on the weather via Dutch Boy's use plus the giant satelite from a kaiju actually feels somewhat fitting ala Shin Godzilla's military use in that set. Buzz Lightyear is poorly utilized here for a few reasons, but the idea of a Luma companion who can desync from you Ice Climber style to handle inputs has future potential. I wonder if it would have been better on a character who had aerial smashes so they aren't 100% reliant on Buzz in the air, or for Buzz to handle aerial smashes while Giga had their own aerials. Obviously by the time we've gotten to Morbius things have gone totally off the rails, bizarrely feeling like some kind of wild anti-modern version of Vector's grab to me, I do think the fact he can reverse the Cooked Meat / Raw Meat dichotomy is conceptually interesting, but like yeah a lot of these moves are kinda just interactions without a lot of rhyme or reason.

I do overall think Giganotosaurus is, at least, a FUN experience. It definitely did go on too long, but I do think part of that comes from the type of being told here vs. the length of a Funni Set to begin with, and that the jokes lost some punch by being spoiled before read by people discussing it (a commentary on Disney's over-fear of spoilers leading them to make bad plot choices?). I'm glad she exists. Just like the Joker.

K9999 (Akira Tadokoro GolisoPower GolisoPower )

The charge gauge is pretty cool, I think. The idea of moving in order to create a chargable meter is a long lasting one in Make Your Move, dating back all the way to Rool's Jolteon (and probably further back), but that is for a good reason. Moving is such a critical part of the game that messing with it for a meter has inherent tension and fun to it, and in this case it helps give a gameplay style of Akira as active with his dashing to pop out strong attacks. I agree with n88 on general principle that the moveset feels like it would do best with some attacks unaffected by the meter in order to produce setup or other such moves, adding some strategy to the moveset overall and making it a bit more user-friendly to actually get some of these super moves off. Another option would be to keep it as-is but have the tension of having to use it up be part of the set, putting more of a crux on the Akira player's decision making, but I think the moveset would require more of an overhaul and stronger designs to do that, but something like a rush attack that sets up combos and thus can be used to help get the last Charge meter but set up a follow-up attack would work well with this style. I feel like charga via movement should still work in the air, at half speed if you're worried about camping.

Neutral Special's damage feels...very low for the usage it has, it is listed as being a "disruptor" style move but I am going to submit a Frame 30 startup attack that needs to be charged to get more range is very poor at disrupting just about any attack due to being so slow. This is one of the attacks that feels like it should probably just have some of the Charge effect on the base version and then pump it up with charge. I would put the sleep on the base attack (weaker, maybe?) and then go from there, Jigglypuff's Sing is Frame 27 for a fairly strong sleep effect that can combo into Rest so I don't think this would be overpowered. Right now, it feels like a rather weak move in all honesty. Especially compared to a move afterwards that proceeds to have a Mario cape projectile (very powerful) at base. I'm not sure the auto turn works against recoveries the way you want? Ryu/Ken/Kazuya/etc can still jump and Side Special in the other direction when autoturning, so this shouldn't be doing anything to opponent's horizontal recoveries. Which is probably a good thing because it would potentially be pretty obnoxious if it did. Teleport is a fun move, the Charge Teleport would definitely benefit from having melee you can lead into it as a combo. The self-heal on Shield Special is finely balanced.

Jab as a hitgrab is interesting as an idea, I like the idea of variability in how many hits, but I think there could be more done along with removing the Charge variant. For example, give Akira a Jab 1 that ends with light knockback into his weaker, faster moves with a combo, Jab 2 is the current prone with less damage, and Jab 3 is a basic spacer for his longer range game, and you get more depth out of it without the meter's need. Dash Attack feels like a rather Froy-ian move and a move that would be improved with, say, non-charge melee that makes foes want to shield more, although the fact the foe will want to be defensive when you have Charge adds inherent value there regardless. Down Tilt 100% feels like an attack that should just have a sweetspot, having your entire charge get used up to turn it into a trip feels not very flashy compared to the entire set.

"As an added note, whenever Akira charges a Side Smash, the charge noise is what happens when he charges a psychic attack in the original Live A Live." Oh that's a nice detail.

"The paralyzation can also help with following up with a good Dash attack as well, allowing Akira to severely limit your foe’s movement options and perhaps even get some good shield damage in as well!"

...While they're paralyzed?

"A combo to work with Up Smash is [Charge Up Smash -> N-air -> D-tilt x5 -> Side Smash -> Charge Up Special -> D-air Spike]" Not only does this combo seem ridiculously unlikely to work to begin with (Down Tilt chains into itself five times?), it requires you to somehow build charge twice on a meter that cannot possibly be short enough to do so, especially since you are not actually moving during the Down Tilt. I can't see how this isn't just nonsense. Up Tilt / Up Smash being mirrors to each other is neat enough. Down Smash is actually pretty fun and I like how it works into giving him a bit of a neutral game with Side Special as well. Charge F-Throw feels like it could be stronger given the rarity of it, I would just make it a flat 10% damage addition (10% when spearing the foe, 10% when exploding) myself. The condition is specific enough that a 3% bonus and the delayed hit could be a bit stronger, I wager. Back Throw also only does 1.6% more damage than Forward Throw while F-Throw has a lot greater reward, so it does feel a bit odd. Maybe Back Throw could have a bonus to meter generation to give it more of a niche.

"In fact, [Charge F-throw 1 -> Jab -> U-throw -> Charge F-throw 2] can be considered one of the most simple late-percent kill confirms Akira can do"

So, does his jab just combo into grab then? F-Throw's speed also seems a bit slow for this to be a kill confirm combo. Neutral Aerial feels like a smaller scale buff that feels appropriate for the cost, since that range boost is plenty nice and it means grabbing a combo anyway. Down Aerial buff is...a BIT random. Back Aerial's debuff is a BIT weird right now. Poor Incineroar is moving at 0.18 movement speed for 10 seconds. In fact, his walk speed goes into the negatives, ignoring the game would stop at 0 there. Might want to make it % based or reduce the flat rate here.

Overall, Akira definitely has the feel of a Jamcon set you were kinda feeling out. There's some ideas here, but they're rather disparate and underdeveloped, and the cohesive whole in your stronger sets such as Melt isn't quite present here. I do agree with n88 that a fair amount of time the Live A Live references aren't presented in a way particularly legible to people not in the know (I did beat the Near Future chapter before reading this, and it has been my favorite so far!), I felt like O. Dio was a great counter example. I feel like there could have been a bit more snappiness to Akira's friendly-punk nature within the set, whereas right now it kinda feels like a standard Goliso set sometimes. There's some balance issues and some non-working combos as well. It isn't the worst thing I've read this contest, but rather obviously flawed.

MYM Set You Get Carded For (Alcohol Witch Daniella Arctic Tern Arctic Tern )

"One of the older residents of Otravâ, Daniella was born during one of the town’s darker periods; a worldwide prohibition on all alcohol." oh no the 1920s

The effects of getting drunk are pretty interesting. It basically lets Daniella exchange starting lag for ending lag at a somewhat discounted rate, making the best way to fight Daniella more bait-and-punishy and letting her go toe-to-toe with the faster characters, and also interestingly making her probably a bit better at a slightly less aggressive strategy herself. 7 Frames is admittedly a LOT of frames to lower, although it does at least have a lower bounds to help it out. The push-and-pull of her increased damage but decreased defense helps make sure it isn't too turtle-y though and gives a pretty inherently compelling basis for the moveset. Down Special gives me some serious vibes of Jefferson DeGrey by Muno way back in MYM20, which given the comparison to Slayer's Dandy Step (which I, personally, assumed Jefferson DeGrey's Counter-Point Step was based on) makes sense. It does feel like there should probably be some brief intangibility or something on the move somewhere, maybe even just a touch on Frames 3-5 or something, to give it a bit more true defensive utility. If you're too worried about it replacing dodge rolls with that (I think the sheer shortness of the intangibility wouldn't make it an issue), then you could make it a Drunken sway or something that adds dodge when Drunk. The Specials overall feel fairly solid, it gives her the feel of a fighting game character interestingly enough to me aside from all the booze.

The Smash mechanic is interest. It reminds me of Naomi in a way, although the attack storage does feel rather different, it nonetheless feels fitting given both are liquid-based witches within the same franchise. Forward Smash itself is cool, I like how the use of midair barrels gives it a very different vibe from the base version (such as combo extension) without actually altering the attack much, although it is a bit worrying against recovering foes balance-wise I think. I see we've got a certified ForwardArrow classic here with the Palutena Up Smash, too. I do question how much the base hitbox plays into her playstyle and its range on edgeguards despite the vertical knockback IS a bit worrying, but the wall usage seems like it will play into her set well enough and the tall anti-air has potential uses. Down Smash is a fine enough ol' time bomb.

Jab being +6 on shield feels insane, especially since being Drunk would mean it is still +1 (tho they don't combo into each other so w/e), that's quite the strong aggressive tool and depending on her grab's frame data / range might make defending it at all more of a 50/50 (or combo) than a pressure tool because of the time it takes to perform an out of shield option or jump. This isn't inherently overpowered, but with how rare that kind of frame data is I do think it seems randomly strong for her. Dash Attack makes me think of Terry's Forward Special, funny enough. I actually rather like Dash Attack, as it weaves together various elements of her moveset (approach tool, opposing stop-and-start to Down Special, common approach tool being anti-airable to help justify moves like Up Special, how it works with wine puddles) in a simple and clean package. Daniella's standards are overall fun, but so many of them moving her and the number of moves that seem unaffected by half of the Drunk changes does make them feel a bit iffy to me. I mean I loved Wriggle so I'm not opposed to some serious movement on a lot of attacks, but I do wonder if she might be a bit unwieldly, and for some of the approach moves she doesn't seem to have all too good ground options after approaching which leaves her aerials to do a lot of heavy lifting.

Forward Aerial has been nerfed, but I do still somewhat worry about the gimping potential on her with a Frame 3 semi-spike with the amount of ways she can cover the ledge. The ending lag is high and the semi-spike isn't too strong so maybe it isn't too bad, could still see it being a pain vs. a lot of characters, I wonder if it should work somewhat like a Sakurai Angle in that it changes based on grounded vs. aerial foes to keep the combo starting landing bits but not be a semi-spike in the air?

"Due to this, she can use this move in anticipation of a spot dodge, cross them up, then respond with any one of her Mirage options. There’s no real option to deal with shields from this position, though" One of her options out of Mirage is a grab, isn't it? I have to say in general I found the aerials a bit...disappointing, not only do they feel a bit like they mirror the standards rather heavily, but it felt like the standards were really asking for some specific stuff (like combo continuers or stuff to take more advantage of Daniella getting in, especially considering how drunkenness works) and instead ended up with some generalist or more situational stuff. For a character whose focus seems sharp at the start, the standards and aerials feel more blurry and I don't think they take full advantage of the set's core ideas. Considering both Up Tilt and Up Smash already had a bunch of anti-air potential, it feels like Up Aerial going more for some extra meat in Daniella's combo game might have been more appropriate for example. I suppose her anti-air is meant to be a bit situational, but there's probably some way to work around it, it is one of those things where the current version isn't BAD but I don't know how well it fits into the style. Back Aerial feels like the move most aware of its spot in the set from the aerials, with Forward Aerial also there, I think Down Aerial being more of an upwards combo strike also might have worked better than the current version. Sorry, it just didn't work out for me overall.

Forward Throw is fairly neat, I do like how it is used to give Daniella some consistent setup when Drunk. Up Throw seems like it adds a new dimension to her puddles and overall boozeplay, so that's nice. The grab game as a whole is nice, but it IS all setup basically and I felt like the meat and potatoes of the set that actually built off the base weren't your best. I do think the set is overall fun, and I liked her characterization, but it did feel like it lost me in the middle segments, and it just never came together in the way something like Kula Diamond did. It did feel like a set I would definitely vote in most contests, but looking at the state of my rankings / votelist right now I'm not so sure how it'll go. I'm still glad it exists, so good work!


1. Mad Dog
2. Alcohol Witch Daniella
3. Herminia
4. Baron Mordo
5. Saint Elimine
6. Akira Tadokoro
7. Giganotosaurus
8. Apothecary Gary

With that, my Jamcon vote goes to Mad Dog by UserShadow7989!


Smash Lord
Nov 24, 2008
The Make Your Move Rooligan Society
Now that FrozenRoy has finished commenting the Jamcon 5 entries, I can finally close the Jamcon!

The King of Sorrow: 4.5 points (voter bonus, Arctic Tern, UserShadow, n88, GolisoPower)
Alcohol Witch Daniella: 1.5 points (voter bonus, Katapultar)
Mad Dog: 1.5 points (voter bonus, FrozenRoy)

Baron Mordo: 0.5 points (voter bonus)
Akira Tadakoro: 0.5 points (voter bonus)
Apothecary Gary

We had 9 entries this time around: Mad Dog and Daniella were rock-solid in execution while Mordo and Herminia were innovative, but the crown went to The King of Sorrow by FrozenRoy this time around, making this Froy's 3rd Jamcon win alongside Gareth and Nino. Congratulations! Froy gets to pick the theme for MYM26's first Jamcon.


Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Stone Ocean Remix (Jodie Reynolds U UserShadow7989 )

Jodie feels too long for me to want to comment everything exhaustively, doubly so when I'm getting to it late and on a time crunch, so enjoy this Note-Based Commentary:

- Jodie's design be STYLIN'.

- While long, the opening to Jodie really shows off a lot of character, and she feels very vibrant. Importantly, I think she feels naturally fitted to the JoJo setting, which as a JoJo OC is both hard to do and important. It makes me want to make my own JoJo OC, although the only idea I've gotten isn't one I've fleshed out enough to feel comfortable with.

- The spare meter being rainbow colored like the scarf is very good. (NOTE: I realized later due to the Edit Notes I was apparently the one to suggest this to begin with.)

- I like Stance Side Special's lag being proportional to distance traveled. Feels like a good limiter and punishment to Jodie overpursuing.

- The programmable, desyncable Stand in Stance Side Special is very cool. The way it has access to all the garments' attacks but limited by being a cycle adds interest to it. Is the garment loss when it dies permanent? I assume not but I may have missed if the set says so, there's a LOT here. If it is permanent, its HP seems rather low.

- Down Special's animation is COOL. The use of it as a keyed attack counter is a good way to add extra dimensions to how Keyed garments can be used, and also I like the use of counter damage as Revenge numbering. Feels logical and measurable in Smash itself for balance.

- Funny enough, my brain has been considering an idea kinda like Stance Down Special but not quite the same. (NOTE: Judging from the Credit Notes I might literally be thinking of me talking about Jodie thoughts with you lmao) One was for Fate/Stay Night's Sasaki Kojiro, but I've got some other ideas brewing up too. Though it does seem to mean garments are permanently destroyed so like, yeah, the minion's a bit weak if she only gets 6 garments per stock. This also made me go back and reread the mechanic and make me realize you said "a limited resource" so that's on me anyway.

- This set including fanmade JoJo narration is amazing. I also love the way the returning hitbox on Stance Up Special works. This kinda stuff on constructs has traditionally held a high appeal to me, and the way it works with garments set attacks was true this time too.

- 15 Paragraph Jab...

- This moveset reminds me a lot of Pegasus, except with more of a physical JoJo feel rather than the trap-like, mastermind card game player feel.

- In general, I think that the set could have cut down wording by avoiding explicitly mentioning some areas the attacks AREN'T useful, or at least cutting them down. Forward Tilt feels like an example: Forward Tilt's usage is limited and overall not something likely to matter to Jodie in the grand scheme of things, so you could easily reduce it to something like "Finally, as a counter... Forward Tilt is not your best pick. The knockback is too weak to kill, and it won't open up combos, so try using other moves instead!" AND just append it to the previous paragraph to not only save margins of word counts (note that this paragraph is only 84 words, so) but also have less paragraphs without creating Walls of Text which might not reduce word count but might make it an easier read? I dunno. I'm just thinking of ways to help with this in the future. I definitely will try to avoid including things that seem "useless" in my sets or only touch on it briefly sometimes, anyway.

I always feel weird offering suggestions like this because I'm afraid that people will take this as some kind of "do this in every set" thing, when that really isn't what I meant. It is more about looking at the set and figuring out what you need to do for that one, I suppose.

- Down Tilt having a hitbox under it on platforms when it is a leg sweep is a bit weird but w/e. Up Tilt feels maybe a bit odd within the set, although I do like the animation and effect. Helps break up the litany of punches. Dash Attack's temporary duplicate reminds me a LOT of Reisen in the Touhou fighters.

- I think I might prefer Neutral Aerial if it had less extra effects, but I do see how stuff like the hitbox shifting works together with the special landing cancel to open tactical options, and I DO like the landing cancel with the Garments. But it does seem like what it adds is relatively situational to a set FULL of options to the point it is overstuffed. I wouldn't remove it (people overall enjoy it from what I can tell), but like, yeah. It feels like the functionality would be largely unchanged if it just had a normal landing lag cancel except some niche circumstances.

- Forward Aerial is really cool! I like the landing continuation and I feel the way it is used as a counter move is a very clever way to get usage out of a projectile normal. I also like the way the rapidfire works in general. I do somewhat worry it could be a bit oppressive when it comes against recovering foes given Jodie's stage control options.

- Not gonna lie while not a bad move Back Aerial really felt like it just dragged on and on.

- Up Aerial is fun, I like the slow descent and the way it mixes up with an aggressive Down Tilt Stand. I do question how necessary the armor is, feels like maybe a bit overstuffed at least to me, although it has some neat gameplay effects. I suspect most people do not agree with me.

- Jodie's pummel is powerful in the screenshot meta.

- My reaction when I saw Jodie had a Cargo Throw but before I saw it didn't have a bunch of unique throws can best be summed up as https://tenor.com/view/walter-white-falling-fast-gif-18043850

- "The knockback will never kill at a reasonable percentage with this angle, even Little Mac having ample opportunity to recover if Jodie tries this at pre-KO percents" Such things exist on Little Mac?

- Forward Smash is COOL. I felt like Jodie needed some kind of big payoff for keeping a high reserve, especially given how much she wants to spend it, and Jodie delivers on it with Forward Smash as the big finisher for the set, not to mention the second hit's versatility and various usages with the other hitboxes in the set. This really felt like THE input most justified going into every option Jodie has, and I'm glad for it here.

- "So, we know the physical points of this move, what's the metaphorical point?" This got a good laugh out of me.

- Down Smash also seems pretty cool to me, although perhaps the ability to move it to all of her garments is a BIT powerful, although by the same token she DOES have a lot of downsides from doing so, so it does balance out some there. I like her having a basic, quick get off me Down Smash and the secondary hit feels like it serves a unique and cool niche. I also love the flavor of this move, as it feels 100% like something a JoJo character would do with their powers for some clever fight, same with Forward Aerial on that note. Honestly, it would have been fun if there was a bit of Lucky Louise flavoring here where you mentioned this as a reference to some fight from her JoJo story, but such is life.

- Up Smash does feel very similar to Down Smash, although with enough differences to feel like it isn't aping itself. I'd say Down Smash feels a bit more conceptually interesting, but Up Smash's ability not only to create bullet hell but also to provide unique combo starting or extension opportunity in theory. In general, the Smashes end on a high note for the set and as one of its best sections.

- I have to say I REALLY appreciate the playstyle segment at the end here! They've fallen out of favor with time, but this kind of set is exactly the kind that could use one as a helpful refresher of what came in the previous 40,000 words (jesus christ) and as a crystalization of the sets core ethos that might get lost in the explanation. The simple little segment at the end here did genuinely help give me a bit of an idea of how Jodie plays.

- Overall, Jodie is a set with some very strong core concepts (while not exactly the same, is this the best Mr. Potato Head set in history?), and a good amount of strong, creative moves. The Smash attacks feel like a highlight, with Down Special being another personal favorite, but stuff like Up Aerial, Forward Aerial and some stuff like Dash Attack is fun. I also think this set has some of the best characterization in the entire contest. Despite being a JoJo OC she feels right at home, the animations have that distinctive flair and some especially fun ones (Forward Smash, Down Special, Up Tilt, Dash Attack, Down Smash, Forward Aerial, and Neutral Aerial are all some that come to mind) that give a big feeling of Jodie's character. The Final Smash also does a great job of this. And all the Poses! Good stuff. It did also feel impressive how this set thought up a lot of possible scenarions and thought of contengencies or ways to avoid flaws, which is not easy to do at all.

I do think this set has some notable downsides, though. The sheer amount of options, including not only Setting Garments with nearly any move but the ways they can then be invested, feels like it is truly pushing the limits of what can be expected from a set being played. She feels maybe a bit too beginner unfriendly in some respects and I question if a LOT of this stuff would go unused even by high level play, not to mention it does give me some balance concerns that she could be a bit too strong with the right setups (especially involving edgeguards). I'd also say the melee at times felt like it could have been a bit more tightly woven (ahem), although the playstyle section helped give me a better idea of how it all fit together. Up Tilt despite being cool feels a bit weird in the set, Down Aerial I wasn't big on, and I wondered if Up Throw's Glove was too random (the way it was used helped sell me on it, but essentially tossing in a new minion in a set with this much on Up Throw is...a Lot). It definitely feels like along with Alex, another of our super large sets, it is one of those sets I'm not quite as certain on (at one point I was considering putting it in 8 star for example) and might revisit in my head before the end, you know? It was still really good, but I get those little nagging feelings. Great work, joining a strong 9 star segment for the time being, and having a great shot to retain a spot on my SV list (although with Remilia, Shroob AND Sleaze unread there IS a lot of competition going). I know you really wanted to go all out on this set given Jodie's previous set and I feel like you absolutely succeeded.

- The Credit Notes was pretty fun, BTW.

French Ninja Noises (Ninon Joubert Katapultar Katapultar )

This character is such a memelord, what the hell. Ninon's mechanic is pretty cool, basically partially "storing" starting lag either to cut down on the time it takes to perform the move OR to empower the move, seems like a strong setup for a versatile set. Neutral Special is fun, but I do kinda wish the last paragraph was excised from it or modified in some way, because as-is I feel like it is more likely to be hurt by the double hand-sign starting lag than helped by the increased range. Maybe she only does it automatically when the opponent is sent further than 5 grids by the attack she connected with? I don't get how Side Special jumps to 77 frames with hand sign lag. I do like that attack and the mindgames Ninon can do with either storing the hand sign or not. The counter feels a bit funky in a good way, I like how it offers some different benefits from just Big Damage Counter and still plays into her gameplan well. Up Special being the longest of the Specials was certainly unexpected, but the kunai/teleport mixups were legit, and they feel like they fit right in really.

"It doesn’t deal a lot of damage to shields, but this particular hit is +5 on block! " Please stop making random moves plus on block. It isn't something you can't ever use, but it is usually restricted to more specifically anti-shield moves in Smash and is itself rare. Some sets certainly make it into more of a Thing (See: Alex), so please don't take this as a "NEVER do this" thing, but I've noticed an upturn in sets just treating plus on block like it is a part of normal Smash when it is much rarer in Smash than normal fighting games. Just treat it with a little care. (Also reminder that safe on shield =/= plus on block: Most attacks in Smash that are safe on shield ARE negative on block, but either not negative enough to be punishable, with enough range to be unpunishable, lots of shield push, you get the idea)

Leaving that aside Neutral Aerial is a nice combo-y move that works well into her mechanic, Forward Aerial's mixture of an Ike-style Forward Aerial with more of a multihit NAir style is kinda cool and I do like how jamming them together gives some unique strengths/weaknesses. Back Aerial's backwards movement + inwards knockback feels like it gives it a cool combo push-and-pull that allows stuff like tricky side switches (fitting with Neutral Special and her ninja nature), with the decay on the movement helping reduce how much it can be spammed in a combo. Up Aerial is good, a bit spooky but not in an OP way. The crouch cancel on Down Aerial blindsided me and while I do wonder if it is a bit random, I don't really mind those kinda cancels per se and I think it has enough of an effect. It does sometimes feel like Ninon's attacks are "normal attack + surprise random mechanic stapled onto the end" though.

Not gonna lie after reading Jodie this is the happiest I've ever been to see a one paragraph Jab. The standards all feel solidly into her playstyle, but I definitely think it is a missed opportunity not to include 1-2 moves with hand signs in the standards at least, not really sure what it would go over but I feel like the interplay of choosing how to divide up your hand sign starting lag is part of the set's appeal, so having it somewhere would be a good idea. Maybe a third hit of Jab you can store the hand sign of and then use as a surprise one hit jab? Perhaps keeping Forward Tilt's hitbox style but with some kind of hand sign move? Might be awkward. I like Dash Attack, Down Tilt and Up Tilt a good deal anyway. Down Tilt having its own crouch abilities feels like it helps make Down Aerial feel less random, too.

Forward Smash is a move where it being + on shield doesn't bother me as much since it is clearly meant to be a strong neutral tool that doesn't lose to shield, it is worth noting how plus it is against shield will scale with charge due to the shieldstun scaling with damage. Forward Smash overall feels like a REALLY cool move, although I do think the follow-up seems kind of intense with both the shield damage it does AND being +7 on shield AND the safety in throwing this out, it is true it is reactable but that is a pretty close window for how powerful it is. I suppose the first fan hit doesn't combo into the second fan hit, which does reduce the power of the combination. Consider my eyebrow raised, but not on fire. Up Smash is, certainly a powerful and unique move, I like the less knockback = more hitstun deal (although having it on Up Smash with its self-hitting nature feels maybe counter-intuitive?). Ninon's Back Throw is a very fun mixup throw!

Ninon's overall a pretty solid, fun little set. I do think there are parts that could be expanded upon, largely the hand signs feel maybe a bit underutilized especially in some of the non-Neutral Special mixups (maybe some more frame trap setups with aerials or landings for examples?), and I did feel a bit iffy about some balance, but the concept is Neat and the bulk of the moves are solid (if not as innovative as your best). A more than worthy entry on a Jamcon and one that seems like it'll have a good chance to find a spot on my votelist.

Oda Iou (Ode Iou U UserShadow7989 )

Some sets peak in the Specials, Ode Iou is the opposite: I feel he is a set that gets better as it goes on. The poisonous peril presented at the start of the set is a treat, tying the poison to the match timer rather than on-hit gives it unique uses for Ode Iou that really reward him for some proper timing, and I also love the poison field not only for healing but giving him a unique anti-combo tool for a heavyweight. The entire set has a refreshing air to it, giving us more of a "tricky" heavyweight who uses subterfuge and deception to make up for some lacking power statistics for his weight, while keeping the "heavyweight" feel he wants with stuff like the armored jumps, meaty range and animations. The set feels very aware of his playstyle as almost a heavyweight Min Min-esque zoner (but not as obnoxious), and crafts a very smart playstyle as a part of it. It also gives Ode Iou a distinct characterization that feels perfectly in line with his place in the game!

Lots of moves I liked here. Up Aerial is a very unique juggle tool, Back Throw was cool with both its angling and animation (even if I maybe did enjoy it more when I thought it had 🔫), Down Aerial, Down Tilt (I was happy this couldn't shield poke), Jab, Forward Smash, Forward Aerial, Neutral Aerial...yeah, there's a lot to like here! The Poison Heal cancel moves felt juuust right to me, feeling like twists on attacks with notable "fail state" animations like Dedede Up Special / Dash Attack so that they felt naturally (and emphasizing how Ode Iou is more of a trickster who hides behind others than an in your face HMA), and not getting spammed too much so that they became a centerpiece (which would be weird).

If I had to mention some downsides...Up Throw felt like a bit of an odd one, almost like an alternative pummel, I did briefly wonder if poison was too easy to apply when we got to Down Tilt but wisely the set chilled mostly afterwards so no big deal, the body shape of Ode Iou here DOES sometimes lead to some difficult-to-parse animations but that is more due to the body type than due to your writing. I suppose the poison could have potentially had some extra uses. The range is sometimes scary, mostly when edgeguarding, even if I don't think the set is unbalanced or anything by it (it feels appropriately scary). Honestly, the set felt strong most of the way through, and I'd have to say your Live A Live Jamcons were a huge success for me this contest. O. Dio, Ode Iou AND Mad Dog were all some crisp and clean sets, with O. Dio being a true standout. Good work, dude!

In Suzuran We Trust (Kuda Izuna Katapultar Katapultar )

Well, this was a freaking good set that comes out hard hitting with its concepts! Bayo's Bullet Arts aren't a very explored design sphere and this moveset combining it with an item creating mechanic (via # of hits) that has its own rules on how strong it can become and some sickass knockback manipulation. Combining it with a NEGATIVE mechanic in how her combos stale (I wonder if this was inspired by Almand's Hugo?) actually ends up brilliant, not only reducing the power of any Izuna's kill confirms (which gives her some more room to go crazy) but also giving her a salient focus on frame traps to go with her heavy combo game. You add this with some killer Specials like a fun, bomb creating command dash with a bit of a unique smokescreen or her bombass Counter that gives her offense/defense mixups to go with her frame traps and even her Up Special's use into her combo game!

I felt like Izuna then kept up that level of quality. The standards and aerials are woven very well, giving a good picture of a combo fiend whose mechanic means she might want to intentionally "drop" a combo to go for a read or frame trap or have to accept lower damage, which again becomes extra interesting since the damage % affects her shuriken's strength. Up Aerial feels like the key to this, due to its status as a powerful and flashy kill move above Izuna that can't really be combo'd into and would lose its main use even if it could be. This gives Izuna a great place to try and funnel opponents into either burning their air dodge (so she can Up Aerial them on read) or force them to take some hard damage from other aerials. Back Aerial's movement and the way the back/forward attacks can be modal feels particularly interesting when Izuna already wants to force the foe to take mixups and adds in a horizontal mixup to the Up Aerial's vertical mixup. I liked Forward Smash a lot with how well its different second hits feel suited to the situations Izuna naturally created, and the follow-up stuff on Forward Tilt and especially Forward Throw felt impressive as well. I want to also hold a shotout to Izuna's Neutral Special having a feel like a variant of Breegull Blaster, but feeling both better and less annoying. Even small moves like Up Tilt feel built in mind with the other moves in the set in a way that blends them together how you'd want. Down Aerial, that's another nice one in the context of moves like Forward Aerial and the shurikens for example.

The set is well characterized, the animations are vibrant and Izuna's adorably earnest nature shines through in plenty of moments, with the playstyle itself keeping up her energy and ninja-y nature (and I'd say also doesn't feel like a "master ninja" or anything, which is appropriate). Even little touches like Izuna's animation after an Up Special teleport show some great care put into her, the kind of care a Sakurai set would want to have.

As for some flaws...I do think sometimes it gets into some groundbounce combos or shuriken true combos where I'm not sure they would actually work that way, I don't think it hurts the set too much (since it still has a lot even if they don't) but some of them felt like either they should bounce the foe higher or would be a bit too slow. Lots of other ones still worked, though. I actually would have preferred if the bury did affect buried foes to at least some degree, maybe at half power? It does feel like a bit of a shortcut on getting kills with her right now, plus I think given it is a stronger bury making it so it is a stronger bury (easier to hit power moves early / start up some crazy pitfall combos) that has a slight damage debuff on it is maybe more creative and intriguing while fitting in with the set's tone. Side Special damaging Izuna seems weird, in part because the teleport makes it seem like she just avoided the damage and how it is the only real self-damage in the set. I do get the point of why it is there and enjoy how it can trigger the shuriken, but it did stick out slightly. Jab 1 feels a bit overpowered right now: The amount of damage on that rapid jab, even at starting percents, feels crazy on a move that will connect from a Frame 1 Jab (for comparison, Zero Suit Samus' Frame 1 Jab does 6% damage without any follow-up chances, Little Mac does about 8%-10% I believe). I'd bring down the best DI down 10% or so and the bad DI as well. Also, I don't understand why inwards DI would allow the foe to escape further? As you can see, a bunch of these are not exactly dealbreakers, but more a lot of more minor things that added up. I'd also say Tsukuyo generally felt a bit more consistently cool...but given Izuna's rankings, not exactly a huge difference. Honestly, it feels like you've had a killer contest, and one that could stand to be talked about more. Excited to read Wakamo and Michiru!

Shroob Does What Nintendon't (Elder Princess Shroob BKupa666 BKupa666 )

"Even in death, the royal Shroob attempts one last Hail Mary, force-feeding Bowser her mushroomized corpse to possess him, avenge her sister and foreshadow the ubiquity of vore in AlphaDream's sequel. mmmMMMMmmm!" Chef Kawasaki's Moveset Seal of Approval here!

Shroob gets right to the point with a pretty killer opening, a different take on Pikmin mechanics that bring on some classic Minion Abuse on top of it. It basically makes me think of Olimar but his Pikmin work like Diddy Kong's Up Special, which aside from bringing up some hilarious mental images of Pikmin flying on jetpacks is a combination I can't remember seeing before in MYM. Allowing enemies to pinball them back to start but NOT once Shroob gets to launch them explosively avoids the sometimes potent Gordo Issue and gives Shroob a bit of a fittingly uneven (against the foe) playstyle to her. This is before even getting to her ability to actually command them! All of the commands are pretty cool, although I must say I am partial to the Leaf Shield-esque one (it feels like some great melee fun) and the laser attacks, although I must say it feels like the shield and the platforms would make a lot more sense if their inputs were swapped. Down Special is also a very cool move, I particularly enjoy the way that it logs moves + gets them used means that Shroob has to really consider the situation at hand and not just mindlessly save some moves (especially since powerful single hits get WRECKED by the 0.66x debuff, which I almost think might be too much of a debuff). It is also good that this isn't casual to perform, since that might become a bit overwhelming in combination with the Unidentified Fungal Objects up there.

Side Special, too, is quite fun! I was kinda getting worried for a bit about how it might play nice with the saucers, seeing as keeping it out there all the time feels like a bit of anti-synergy with them and also means a lot of coverage between them, time ghosts and the doggo itself, but I feel like the little "frisbee" grab with the Shroob Chomp rather elegantly works around this. The mental imagine of Shroob here walking her dogs while on a flying saucer like some kind of demented segway is also way too hilarious, and also feels like it has gameplay value. Up Special is...pretty funky, but I think I like it? I do wonder if the patches healing the saucers and Shroob Chomps would be somewhat annoying in practice, moreso the Shroob Chomp because since it is very easy to force back and not all that bad to call out I both think the foe won't mind the healing and Elder Princess Shroob won't mind throwing it back out while HP manipulation is rather important to the saucers and so fits there, buuuuut it does also help serve to actually hold Shroob's camping balance in check if she has her full setup so that's good? One thing I would like to see changed is to increase the stun threshold % on the patches, as 5% feels a bit low to me right now. That's one second with a minimum patch, so even something like IDK a Marth Jab 1 gets you pretty far there (2/5ths of the way) before even including attacks to keep the foe on the ground, the time to actually get on top of it, and in general it feels like it would make fighting Shroob on the patch a bit frustrating. Yes the opponent can just shorthop all the time, but I think at least a little more counterplay? My first thought is 8%, but that might be a bit extreme I suppose, even 6%-7% adds 12-24 more frames for the foe and helps out. Oh, and I rather like the Sonic Spring style recovery making a mushroom patch. It feels very naturally flowing. I do wonder if it would actually become the main way for her to make them, though.

So, when do we get a set for the random LPer from Elder Princess Shroob's GIFs?

Dash Attack is cool! I really like the two timings method to it and it feels like a natural use of the saucers, and combining it with the ghosts to either use them as a psuedo-Phantom or an approaching tool or just anti-shield. I do wonder if adding in the jump option was a bit much in terms of the versatility here, but it isn't a big deal when the move overall feels so nice. Down Tilt is also a fun one. Up Tilt feels rather underwhelming, I really question how often Shroob actually cares about the healing when she has to deal 15% to begin with, at least to the point she's Up Tilting and then Shield Specialing to shuffle around the saucers. I think it is more likely that she just summons more saucers and works from there. You cooould use it to disguise the saucer's HP, but I mean you have to hit a 2-frame sweetspot to even get this effect off, I dunno. Also, the enhanced Shroobification on this does feed into my point the Shroobification should be slightly harder.

Shroob's F-Smash charging technique is fun for flavor, but it does feel a bit first time unfriendly / odd to get used to. Given it will still work fine if you don't charge it I don't think I mind too much here, though. Plus it is only on one move. Does feel a touch odd, though. Forward Smash itself is a fun move, an appropriately hefty bruiser move that Shroob can use as an impromptu dodge with some extra saucer uses. I think here we see WHY the limits on the ghost mechanic are a good idea, since they let something like Forward Smash play around in a stronger space without the worry of throwing it out as a full strength kill move.

"Elder Princess Shroob's dress scrunches in somewhat as she crouches, almost resembling Peach charging her Super Mario Bros. 2 super jump." This is some good animation choice right here.

Down Smash feels STRONG, particularly in a context the set shockingly underplays: Edgeguards. Not only does it give you a Ridley/K. Rool Down Smash style attack, which are really good ledge tools to begin with, but on top of that it is sending out shockwaves that cover recovering low great, AND you can record it onto a Time Ghost (which as I understand will send out the shockwaves) and have it perform that to combo out of it for casual spikes / stage spikes if they do go low, or even just do Ghost Down Smash -> Shroob Down Smash for some supreme ledge coverage. Sure, the hitbox is a bit small, but charging can help solve that and proper positioning can still cover a bunch of ledge options. This also is discounting any form of saucer coverage.

As for Up Smash? Finally, space boulder...definitely one of the more fun options with a time ghost, given the very long linger and specific anti-aerial properties. I do think the saucer variant does perhaps feel a bit odd (partially just because it changes the use quite a bit between saucer / non-saucer), I do see the point of the Snake style Up Smash but it feels maybe a bit unwieldly for this call-out anti-air to be changed so much with a saucer. Especially since saucers seem like a good shot to challenge aerial opponents. It feels like the Saucer Up Smash would be most fun when combined with the time ghosts, but the mechanics of the set don't allow them to intermingle much. Something I feel a bit unsure on, anyway.

Got thrown for a loop when Shroob's NAirs suddenly kept calling her Shroob minions "crafts". Neutral Aerial itself is...interesting. It does, to me, feel a bit odd that this whole-ass interaction projectile is stapled onto a secondary Neutral Aerial hit, especially since it is actually an attack from her fight by comparison. It makes me wonder if the chomp should have been culled, although it does have a noteworthy playstyle purpose. Then again, maybe Shroob having a projectile NAir could be an intentional weakness? I don't think the move is overly interactive (although the caterpillar chain is a bit out of nowhere), as much as it has one interaction with the saucer broken up in how it is explained. The saucer interaction itself seems neat, it basically just adds a multihit to the saucers that either her or the foe can use to their advantage. I wonder if downsizing the move in some parts would have made it a bit less controversial? I'm fine with it, anyway. I quite enjoy Forward Aerial being another Peach animation reference, the set definitely is on point with a lot of the feel and flavor of Shroob here. Forward Aerial might be a basic Big Punch, but I do like how it plays into her potential on stuff like saucer riding. I will say I'm a bit seriously worried about the edgeguarding potential here, though. Isn't time ghost Forward Aerial -> Shroob Forward Aerial, like, an extremely powerful frame trap / gimp setup? This is on top of a projectile NAir, saucer flying, and the K. Rool Down Smash that also covers ledge, or even falling explosive saucers or Saucer Up Smash at ledge. It isn't like automatic or unbeatable (I mean K. Rool has multiple projectiles, a Down Smash, a Counter, two spikes and the suck 'n' cuck but isn't unbeatable at ledge), but it does sound rather potent when she has a lot of potential coverage. Plus she has the downside of being Big Slow Heavy, which is itself a strong flaw.

Back Aerial is a fun move. I like giving it a bit of a unique "downside" for quick backwards coverage in that it has saucer interactions that while useful limit its usage as the faster archetype of move. Saucers as potential downside has been played with throughout the set, but outside of the actual saucer mechanics themselves this was probably my favorite so far. Up Aerial is also pretty good, I especially like how the drag down effect finds new life when attached to a time ghost. Forward Throw / Back Throw's direction reverse is a bit more iffy to me than Forward Smash, in part because Forward Smash is basically just a unique way to charge (so unless you want to charge the smash it does nothing), while Forward Throw / Back Throw are actively swapping the direction the average person would expect. The fact that Shroob still has totally functional forward / back throws just with reversed directions...helps? I don't really know if Elder Princess Shroob is chaotic enough to go for this (she's no Hakos Baelz for sure), and it doesn't feel like it actually contributes to the throws themselves? Like, Back Throw pitfalls, which doesn't even send them forwards to begin with. Down Throw can send forwards at least, but I must say this feels like some odd choices anyway. Down Throw seems like it'd be cool to toss foes into your fungus patches! Final Smash is very flavorful.

On an overall sense, Elder Princess Shroob is a set with a lot I really like, but definitely a not-insignifcant amount of things that bugged me. The core of the set is very good: The saucers, with their bashable Pikmin selves, are a very strong core, and the time ghost is a fun psuedo-double with interesting programmability, stuff like her saucer platforms or the Leaf Shield variant give a lot of utility to her, there's some standout attacks to the set like Up Aerial, Dash Attack, Back Aerial, Up Smash (leaving aside me being uncertain on the second hit), Forward Smash, it didn't really come up in the set much (I think in part because it is largely self-explanatory and would bloat the already high word count) but Side Special is fun, and despite my balance concerns as an attack Down Smash is pretty cool. I also must say I disagree with the feeling that Shroob was unreadable or a super heavy interaction set, it felt more like a set with one notable interactable / set piece (the saucers) and stuff built around it. I DO see why people would not enjoy it, but I don't think it would be those reasons. I would also be remiss if I didn't point out this set is brimming with characterization, both from Elder Princess Shroob's destructive personality to things like heavyweight riffs off of Peach's attacks that feel entirely fitting for the character. I think this helped elevate it upwards for me.

There's a lot that gives me pause, though. The balance issues are one of them: Shroob's edgeguarding is incredibly powerful, although this isn't a dealbreaker per se given how many heavyweights have strong edgeguards but aren't overpowered, Shroob's does still seem particularly strong though. The Up Special patches right now feel a bit overtuned and could use a bit of an adjustment (this would be very easy to do). Some stuff like the randomly mirrored Forward Throw / Back Throw rub me the wrong way (I won't say it is impossible to use this, but I didn't feel like it was as natural or easy as Forward Smash), little nagging parts on some moves like Up Smash, it definitely gave me a bit of pause when putting it pretty high, although it helps she doesn't feel blatantly (:hma:) overpowered as much as "I am Concerned". Not a surprise it is a frontrunner overall. Can't wait to read Cranky Kong!

Jack Levin (Jacky Bryant BridgesWithTurtles BridgesWithTurtles )

Jacky certainly didn't disappoint, though. Kinda funny how Jacky and Alex had some similar mechanics, AND Mai/Yui is right there! Jacky's got quite the interesting little setup here, taking advantage of stage walls to help out his stagger mechanic and having a chaining mechanic attached to his punch/kick input usage. It definitely gives Jacky a fighting game feel and feels like maybe one of the MYM sets we have closest in game feel to Ryu/Ken in Smash itself. A lot of Jacky's game flows out of his Stance Shift and cancels, which gives Jacky some fun options both to cross foes up and side switch them but also to make his combos into intense mixups with a fast psuedo-spot dodge. I'd say most of Jacky's Specials feel quite good, like Face Crusher's side swiping command grab that gets more use out of using it from a run or off a platform which feels like a novel concept. Neutral Special is a pretty great spin on Mii Brawler's Exploding Side Kick (feels more comparable than Falcon Punch) and I think its use as a flashy kill move OR a potent stagger is a good modal combination.

The melee is mostly strong too. I think Jacky has a rather fleshed out and mostly complex melee game to him, with the standards feeling like they go into a web of combo options with different starts, extenders and enders, it did perhaps get a bit stale by the end but I think it was strong overall. I was a bit worried about the strength of his combo strings, like if he could keep them going for too long, but I think it mostly turned out fine. The smashes are also pretty good, the aerials are clearly going for a "weak in the air" approach but I think he has enough going he doesn't get Little Mac'd, and he has some fun gimmicks like on Neutral Aerial. Grab game is...fine. I like the speedy throw option, but I wonder if more could have been done with the DI mixup angle given that, I do like it with Back Aerial and at the least the throws all feel appropriate and Smash styled. Up Smash felt rather weak in kill moves for what it is meant for (and I wonder if NSpec should kill like 10%~ earlier too), I think it'd fit better if it killed at 115% or so. Jacky's flavor is fun, the freaking YEAH! chance percents on each move were hilarious and also felt like. Actually thought out? Jacky might be a simple character but his energy and style shines through in the set, which given Virtua Fighter is a bit of a technical / visual showcase is impressive. It's overall a set I think I rather liked, even if it maybe fell off some after the Specials/Standards with a bit of balance issues and the like. I did appreciate that despite sixteen tilts it had a svelte word count and was straight to the point.

tldr Alex for people not on meth.
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
"Please don't troll me online for this interruption, OK?"


Did anyone expect Nate's return would go like this? Certainly a prominent MYMer before his long hiatus, Nate's last contests before he left were not only old but not his best: MYM11/12 produced 4 placements in 19 sets for example, while Ultron/Spider-Man were successful but controversial sets at the time (albeit ones I liked). I think most people would have expected a longer adjustment period to modern MYM. Instead, we got ourselves a Kupa-esque (or even stronger?) return instantly! Breaking in with the modest but neat Broken Vessel and then smashing into the Jamcon with the widely popular Venom Strange, Nate went ahead and produced this excellent set for Goro Akechi on only his third go!

Akechi doesn't have the instant "hook" to him some of the most popular sets in the contest do, but that doesn't mean his Valkyrie-esque Persona mechanic that takes it in a totally different way from the in-Smash Joker. He's basically a buddy you can set up for a variety of attacks, ranging from support tools like Hamaon/Mudoon to the flashy and potent kill finisher Megaton Raid! Or you could keep him around instead of being a second fighter out and about to retain access to his Persona Smashes, which play well into his normal Smashes and give Akechi some adaptable play patterns. I quite like the "setup oriented" moves in the set, such as Samarecarm and the aforementioned Hamaon/Mudoon, for complimenting Akechi's elegant yet aggressive playstyle in their own ways. It can be letting him go deep offstage for extremely risky edgeguards, or he can have Robin setting up a shield popper to make opponents wary of their defensive tools, whatever the case he won't be caught unaware!

One thing I love about this set is the powerful, yet often times subtle characterization present within it. Take, for example, the way optional follow-up attacks work in Akechi. Most sets will do exactly what Link does, where a second A press brings out the second part of the attack. Akechi instead has the later attacks the default, with A instead being used to stop early, the same way that for Akechi the "restraint" part of him is the mask while the more "violent" part is the true self. Stuff like Akechi's, ahem, Protagonist Mode fit into this as well, and even the way his graceful sword swings work. I had actually forgotten before going back for this ad that Nate mentions in the set that he specifically looked to Marth's swords in order to give Akechi a "princely" feel and was thinking of how well done Akechi's melee is on a visual level, so it truly tells you the level of detail that went into making this set from Nate! The writing and tone of the set is also highly consistent, and Nate thinking of Smash terminology that might or might not fit the set's vibes is one piece of that as seen on Back Aerial. I highly recommend reading the annotated version of the moveset, as there's some interesting thoughts throughout the whole thing.

I'd say Akechi is a set that gets better as you read it (and, for me, after giving it some time to stew in my head as well): The Smashes, for example, are an incredibly strong middle segment between his Forward Smash and how it works well into his Debilitate debuff in a natural way, not to mention the rushing strike working into his prone "knockdown" theme (itself a translation of the knock down weakness system in Persona games) and the swag ledge options, which can then be layered with Robin's Forward Smash which can in turn be launched at different timings in relation to Akechi's hit for more or less risk/reward, or his Down Smash which gives him a toolsy prone-hitgrab that can poke through the stage in a Sephiroth style both for stylish 2-frame kills or even through soft, thin platforms for temporary stage control! The more toolsy Akechi hitbox is reversed with Robin's risky, yet powerful and threatening option that itself works well into how Akechi's is setup oriented. Something I enjoy about this set is that it goes against the grain of what you'd expect from the set, such as avoiding easy Jab Lock combos (by making his jab not jab lock and instead more of a risky dash attack play) and instead going for some different strategies off of those. Attacks like Forward Tilt are just cool and give Akechi a reads-based swordie playstyle, perfect for the heir to the Detective Prince.

Perhaps the best thing I can say about Akechi though is that I find it doesn't have much in the way of flaws. Maybe a balance issue or two, sure, but there weren't really any attacks I actively disliked. It is always a pleasant feeling when everything comes together and while Akechi didn't quite the highs of Tsukuyo, the way it wraps itself up in a bow definitely made it one of my favorites this contest. If it didn't land for you the first time around, consider giving it a second look: There's a lot of subtle material in this set that I think helped really boost it up that extra bit, and it is just very well put together. A great comeback set, Nate!


Smash Journeyman
Aug 17, 2011

Elder Princess Shroob
Okay, if you're looking at me and going "is there any point to advertising this set", you raise a fair point. This is arguably the big frontrunner of the entire contest in terms of how its talked about, and honestly heaping more praise on the set is maybe just kind of offputting? I get that. But I still want to talk about it and why it "clicked" with me so hard as to get my SV+ in what I think is pretty unquestionably the best contest we've ever had.

Its not because I think Shroob is a flawless set. No set ever is, but I can think of things I want to nitpick. I wonder if some of the decisions to make her feel "alien" with switching up forward/backward controls in a couple places are good design in practice. I'm left with a some questions about how I feel about the mushroom patches in terms of making the set less fun to play against, and I think the set places a bit too much emphasis on healing your flying saucers when they're relatively fragile and you get active benefits for dropping them to 0 health. Its never the kind of thing that'd be a dealbreaker for me, far from it, but its the sort of thing that I imagine causes people to split hairs and pick a set that's got flaws that don't bother them as much, or basically doesn't have any that they can see.

But laying that out on the table, when you read Neutral Special, you can tell its the sort of thing Kupa deliberated on for the years that he did. They're powerful, extending Shroob's range immensely as she smacks them around and they provide potent hard interactions with her Smashes and some aerials/tilts, and they get even better if you can blow them up on opponents. They're flawed, in that opponents can hit them back at Shroob to extend their own combos and absolutely ruin her day. Their alternate modes are fun and versatile, but visually clear in their functions and always come with a tradeoff over letting them just follow you around. It strikes that excellent balance of just being fun to bully your own subordinates around like the cruel tyrant you are and just get fun, punchy hitboxes, while also allowing for you to go truly galaxy brain with your Nair or with the udicrous potential it has once you factor in the Time Hole secondary mechanic letting you double up your hitboxes(albeit in a limited capacity). And while your control will always be better, those moments where the foe gets to get in on the fun make it a rewarding matchup for both parties. Its kind of... everything I want in a mechanic, really.

And on some level, its all pretty approachable. Shroob can certainly lay some things out on the stage for MYM-y setups, she has a time hole mechanic that's a bit tricky to get down, and her options are pretty varied/versatile and have a good number of hard interactions. I wouldn't say its not complex, but ultimately, you're not going for some 10,000 year setup pile-up. There isn't some elaborate new control scheme you have to master to play her. She's asking more of the player than your average heavy and giving more in return, but not to a degree that ever feels unreasonable. Even with a lot of sets I love, that's just a really hard balance to get right. It helps that when its introducing these interactions, its almost always for a good reason. What I said about healing the saucers aside, when Shroob does her hard interactions with the saucers you get something that feels potent and cool, and there's a very strong visual feel to the set too. I know its a silly thing to bring up, but something about how the mushroom you drop to bounce off like a Sonic spring just dissolves into a mushroom patch on the ground when your grounded Up Special just makes one of those patches outright feels very "right". And I can kinda see how this might feel the same with FSmash, where you push the control stick back and then Shroob's weight snaps forward from her tether, sounding weird on paper but ultimately still feeling good in practice.

Is Shroob the best set in the contest at that? Probably not. You can get some wildly visceral and satisfying feeling KO action out of a set like Hakumen or Nino, or some deeply well-designed and solid animations in Sleaze or Jodie, not to mention some real simple and snappy fun sets like Akechi or Remilia. But its just the combination and balance of it all, as Kupa delivers some truly delicious raw mechanics for players to chew on while making sure its something people would get immediate satisfaction from and have every incentive to dig deeper into the mechanics. And, for me as a reader, I think it also just serves as an intensely rewarding experience to just go through and read too. I don't feel like with any individual move I'm losing track of what its for, as the time hole and flying saucer implications tend to be obvious and satisfying. Or just an "oh I would never have thought of that" kinda thing, because as long as the set is it very rarely feels like its not bringing up things it doesn't need to.

I think for a comparison point, I guess, I'll compare it to Walter White from last contest, a set I've heard a lot of people say is better than Shroob and I disagree on. I want to make it clear, I'm not throwing shade at Walter White. Its a fantastic, innovative as hell set that took on a legendarily difficult character and made a set a wide array of people with different tastes loved. But to emphasize how good Shroob's balance is, I feel like over in Walt, if you really get your economy going hard enough you can just pile a million objects on a car and absolutely destroy your opponent, and the end setups all feel... a bit detached from his process of getting them, in a sense. Shroob? You'll get those bursts of feeling absolutely invincible and indestructible, but they're just that, bursts, they don't stick around because of the temporary nature of her flashes of power. And whereas Walter White's endgame feels a bit separate from how he gets there by necessity, Shroob's weaving all her mechanics together, but in a way that never feels like the player is going to wind up getting decision paralysis as they play her, its natural outflows of your actions that still let you style hard on an unsuspecting opponent. I love me some good, goofy over the top setups and I think in practice Walt's very rarely going to just get the god setup and steamroll everyone, but I think Shroob's approach is just better in light of the kind of game Smash is, and that little bit more in line with how it all plays. And I feel like if asked to compare it to many other sets, I feel they'd either come short in a similar way to Walter White, or in approachability of their mechanics, or they just don't give the kind of reward for good play Shroob has.

Shroob's a set that never loses sight of its core archetype as a bruiser heavyweight. Shroob still delivers immense depth anyway, and not at the cost of making the player or reader unable to appreciate it all by being hard to process. Shroob is exactly the kind of set I come to MYM for in the potentially ludicrous skill ceiling and "wacky stuff Sakurai would never quite go for" sense, and it does that without tripping over itself in the subtle and/or blatantly obvious ways MYM sets always do. Shroob's not perfect, but its flaws are so minor against the raw fun it offers on several levels that I still find myself thinking its the best set in MYM's best contest.

And if that was a totally unnecessary argument to make, so be it. I just want to talk about why I like the set so much, because maybe the set being proclaimed as "obviously great" so much made it easy to lose sight of why people like me say that.


Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Who is This Sassy Vampire Child? (Remilia Scarlet Arctic Tern Arctic Tern )

French Vampire Noises

This was one of the sets in the contest I was most excited to read, to no surprise. Touhou is entirely my franchise jam, my own Remilia set is the highest placing Touhou set of all time (for now?), and I said back in the day of MYM14 that Remilia could easily have 3+ wildly different sets that would still be in character. It made me very curious about your interpretation! Especially since mine is so old.

I am very glad this set's intro gives focus to both Remilia's serious and comedic elements, leading with the serious bits and then going into her more comical ones is a great expression of her character from the games. I do have to say right off the bat I am concerned about the viability of a character with twelve frames of jumpsquat. Powerful as her aerials might be, it means merely getting into the air is closing in on reactable, Kazuya's 7 frames is already pretty sluggish and one of his notable weaknesses, so nearly adding another full Kazuya of jumpsquat seems potentially TOO punishing. Then again Kazuya's apparently a top tier so who knows? It definitely instantly raised my eyebrow, anyway. This DOES also get counterbalanced by her very powerful teleporting jump mechanic (which certainly reminds me of my old Remilia set!), which offers Remilia potent edgeguards due to how deep she can go, an air dodge + movement tool to toy with people in the air and more. The follow-up jump (which as I've mentioned inspired Valkyrie Walkure) is also a pretty cool option, reminding me of the dash-charge attacks (I forgot their actual name) from Dragonball FighterZ. The 10-frame cut is obviously incredibly powerful as well. Her not having access to them when hit does feel rather...odd, though. I suppose it is a balance limitation, but not one I'm sure is necessary. At the least, I don't really get why it nerfs her air speed so hard.

"Heart Break’s slower speed makes it unable to be used as a camping tool."

"Heart Break travels at the speed of a Fox laser, covering the entirety of Battlefield in the process."

These two statements on Neutral Special seem rather...at odds with each other. Fox laser is pretty fast. Maybe you meant a Falco laser? Oh, typing this out, I realize you probably mean starting lag, which given it takes a second of charge yeah that makes sense. I enjoy the way her Neutral Special charge works, it reminds me of Nino in the sense that Remilia has to sacrifice a neutral tool in order to get more rewarding options. I do wonder if Spear the Gungnir slightly oversells how easy it is to avoid (it's faster than something like a K. Rool crown or Link boomerang AND insta-breaks shields while being large. And super fast.), but it still isn't casual to land in neutral so w/e. Overall, it is quite a fun move! Her Side Special is also impressive, definitely the kind of move I enjoy, and it is a creative use of her chains beyond the "obvious" tethers or what have you. It feels like being able to make a custom path for Remilia to travel on would lead to some serious fun potential. It feels nicely in character too, a kind of powerful "I got you now!" moment.

Down Special is when things get really MYM-y! The baseline, slow moving projectile to mix in with her forks-I mean spears for her base projectile neutral game, but going past that we get dripping blood puddles that Remilia gets to use for long term stage control! I like both of the two options from the first two Specials, with the spear options on the Neutral Special feeling especially neutral (if a bit risky due to setup cost). That's a strong core so far! The Up Special blood puddle effect is the most subtle of the Up Specials, but in a way it is my favorite? Given Remilia's out of shield options are VERY bad (essentially only Up Special and Up Smash w/o either going through 12 frames of jumpsquat or dropping shield), the fact Up Special is her best out of shield option is important, and powering it up to be scarier both forces foes to give it a second thought AND makes them more likely to try to bait it out (since Remilia wants to hit with the powered up Up Special), creating a nifty cold war mindgame here. 2 Units is...pretty small, though. She should probably have a higher recovery.

Getting onto F-Smash, one vibe I instantly enjoy from this set is that it feels like it takes from Remilia being someone who tends to carelessly throw around her power rather than a bunch of finesse. Not just Forward Smash being "swing really hard" but, for example, the blood puddle effect boils down to "drag them into me swinging at them really hard", which feels fitting. Up Smash is fun, although I wonder if her ALSO having a bad out of shield Up Smash is starting to be a bit much, I can't say I was expecting the effect on these that I did (although the blood puddle effect then leans into more of what I expected). Down Smash is fun, I will say I think it should kill earlier than 170% (150% or 140%?) given everything. It also can be a LOT of stage control, but that isn't easy to achieve so I wager it is fine, and she's pretty weak defensively.

Air smashes! Very fitting for Remilia and another amusing similarity to my old set. Aerial Forward Smash is quite the scary projectile, mostly in edgeguarding attempts (I wonder if she would ever just run off a platform to fire this off faster than her terrible jumpsquat?), but doesn't feel overpowered to me at least at a glance. Aerial Up Smash has an animation that gives "we must protect this sassy child" vibes but I have nothing else to say about it really. Would be REALLY good at the ledge, but you can always go high. Down Smash definitely adds to the "Remi kinda just carelessly throws around her power" vibes in a good way, nice endlag animation there, meaty move with some prominent downsides and it feels like Remilia having a strong move to crash down from the air helps with her aerial teleport mixups / landing strategy.

Neutral Aerial is fun. I do appreciate that Remilia at least has one super fast aerial that could be...kiiiiiiiiiind of an out of shield option (it'd still take until FRAME 15!), and aside from that it does play an important role in Remi's air to ground game. I do kinda wish you could teleport between the hits, could be funky synergy and wouldn't feel overpowered to me. I suppose that WOULD kill the "they don't connect" little bit, though. So it works out in the end. Forward Aerial feels like it really takes advantage of her unique mechanics to give her a strong-yet-risky wall of pain that couldn't just be casually done otherwise, almost feeling like if someone turned Flare Blitz into a wall of pain aerial, and I must say I am pretty happy with it. Back Aerial seems like a solid kill-reward move, I actually wonder if it could be a bit stronger given 27 frames is a LOT for an aerial, but being a bit cautious with Remilia makes sense. Up Aerial feels like her strongest aerial, really, due to the UAir -> Uspec chains Mario style, but her non-Smash aerials have felt maybe a bit underpowered so her having a stronger option is fine with me. Down Aerial with the Mega Man-style spike definitely adds to the Remilia aerial experience, but I will say that in general I worry Remilia doesn't have enough...not necessarily "generalist" aerials, but ones that aren't flawed or overly specific? For such a character meant to be so powerful in the air, it feels like you only really need to worry about NAir or maybe UAir a lot of the time without it being reactable, doubly so given the moveset so heavily nerfs her in the air unless she goes through the very hefty jumpsquat in which every move except NAir is hella reactable (and NAir is barely reactable). To be honest, it kinda feels like being in the air is a weakness for Remilia in a good number of scenarios, which is a bit odd. It IS really good in advantage, yes, but the neutral is pretty iffy (disadvantage is obviously very bad but it is more meant to be). Very strong during edgeguards, though? I also might just be too harsh on it, but...yeah you get my point moving on.

The standards do help this I think, since Remilia's grounded gameplay seems well built for neutral. Forward Tilt feels like a particular highlight here, since I think the different hits all feel appropriately applied for playstyle usage and it does help glue together some elements she needed like a safe-on-shield / shield pressure normal. Note that due to the 11 frames it takes to drop shield, Up Tilt as one of Remilia's fastest out of shield options is Frame 16. This isn't unheard of in the game (Sephiroth's 3 fastest options OoS are Frames 12, 16 and 16) but it is somewhat concerning. The juggling aspect of the move is very well done. Down Tilt is pretty fun, although I kind of wish the blood puddle interaction wasn't a mediocre kill move that she doesn't need much of. I would personally make it do a lot of damage (IE the 14% it does now) but instead be a not-too-powerful combo starter, maybe with high hitstun, that allows her to transition into like a Neutral Aerial because she really doesn't have anything all too good in her Standards like that unless I missed something.

Her grab is fun! I like the dash grab effect here. Forward Throw is cool! I really like the use of blood puddles here, although the ledge interaction seems quite strong right now, but I dunno if it'd be "broken" so whatever. Does seem like the main thing Remi wants to fish for at the ledge though. Back Throw is a hearty twist on the classic time bomb, attaching it to a minion that gets to chase down the foe to simultaneously give it counterplay and also allow Remilia to "time" the bomb via distance rather than actual time. It is quite cool, kind of a Mechakoopa infused flavor. It also gives her a tool that actually covers for her jumpsquat, which is nice. And dude Up Throw is ALSO cool, I like how using the Meta Knight piledriver makes it a "grounded jump" and therefor works into being her combo throw early with aerials AND scales into a kill throw. Not only does it give it versatility, but it also means Remilia has to choose between staling one of her powerful kill options OR getting that early combo damage in. And theeere's the classic chain tether! Also just wanna say Remilia's taunts are truly perfect and that the tea party win screen is AMAZING, Barghest popping off right now.

Overall, Remilia is an excellently characterized, highly creative set with some really cool moves that I feel is rather underpowered right now. It's really my only major complain, with other ones being rather minor. It does a great job showing Remilia as a powerful-yet-childish character throwing around raw power, it has fun tricky-wicky moves like Dash Attack or Back Throw, clever melee attacks like Neutral Aerial, Forward Tilt and Up Throw, a clear playstyle goal, even cool extras! Twists on walls of pain, stage control interactions that feel woven in, all that good stuff. But I seriously wonder how much some of it actually works and feel like between Remilia's difficult getting airborne / the reactability of the foe (essentially her fastest aerial is close to reactable if used ASAP after a jump, something like FAir is Ganondorf F-Smash lag), poor disadvantage, extremely light weight, out of shield difficulty, and on top of that some slower setup plus how stuff like Down Aerial can lead to a bit of awkwardness means I think I'm concerned about her balance. She's already high, but if you wanna try to put her higher my suggestions would be...oh, note, I am NOT going to suggest changing the jumpsquat frames. It feels like the set wants to be balanced around that and if a hyper-Kazuya set (I'd say Remilia is the most Kazuya Mishima set this contest!) can work is a fun question. So, suggestions:

1. Keeping the non-teleport use without initiating a jump is fine, but the air speed nerf feels rather ridiculous and also one of the only points of the set that feels at odds with the character. Why would Remilia be that much slower just because she got tapped off the edge or whatever? I can accept not using the teleport (IDK she got shook up or something), but I would either remove the air speed nerf or make it so she's only at worst mid-speed.

2. Back Aerial feels rather underpowered. I would personally make it kill 10%-20% earlier. FA suggested maybe some across-the-board buffs and I'd be fine with that too, maybe making it a bit faster to start up. It feels pretty weak right now.

3. Blood-puddle Dash Attack being changed into a move with the same damage but more of a combo starting role would help give Remilia an actual ground-to-air transition move that is somewhat reliable. Especially if it can do it at any percent. In general, I wish Remilia had another launcher in some way.

4. Improving Remilia's out of shield game juuust a little would be nice. Part of me wants to suggest only a 9-10 frame jumpsquat if she jumps after shieldstun (the same way shieldgrabs change frame data after getting hit) so that she can do more Sephiroth/Kazuya level out of shield than what she has right now, but that is perhaps too artificial? Maybe instead Up Smash could have a touch of forward coverage, so at least bad spacing can be punished? Something right in front of her as she throws the knives up or something.

5. Maybe decrease Forward Aerial's starting lag by like 1-2 frames? I know this sounds very silly to suggest such a minor change but I want to both make sure she cannot wall of pain too effectively with it, and also not have it be laggier than a Sephiroth back aerial when she has 12 frame jumpsquat. As another minor change, I would make Down Smash kill at 150%-140% or so rather than 170%.

A lot of these aren't the biggest changes (in part because some of it is either something Remilia is trying to fundamentally work with, or it'd require a bit larger changes), but I do think they would help smooth Remilia's power a bit closer to not OVERLY underpowered (after all a character being "a bit weak" is different from "so underpowered it becomes a design issue"). And the set is still quite high for me either way. Frankly, this is VERY impressive for your first contest and only your 10th set, no matter how much lurking you did. Excellent work, man!

Valentine and Hirasawa (Mai and Yui Katapultar Katapultar )

- I like them being super slow lightweights, feels like a unique niche.

- We've seen the A/B button split to different things on a few characters this contest, most prominently Alex. I wonder if this is because Min Min's control scheme had a similar radical change? In a way, Mai and Yui brings to mind like a twist on a mini-Hugo, with both needing to be KO'd and having character-to-button attack assignments. Keeping it to two does make it a lot more sane than a Hugo, though. I do think it is interesting and it reminds me of how I want to make an IC-style character where one is controlled with the control stick and the other with the C-Stick.

- I remember you wondering if I'd care about the lack of Specials, but honestly if a set is doing something unique like this I think it is a sacrifice that can be worth making. It did make me curious what input section you'd start out on. I wonder if you had any specific reason for starting where you did?

- "To prevent stunlocks, non-Smash solo attacks against shields only deal a few frames of shield stun, enough for the foe to react to the other girl’s option or punish their attacker. This is not applied if both girls attack simultaneously or one of the girls has been KO’ed. " I wonder if it'd be better for the other girl to just not apply shield stun if a shield is already in stun or exited stun, IDK, 15-20 frames ago? It would help prevent infinites but keep them from being so gimped against shields. Then again, maybe that was the point.

- "Mai and Yui are treated as having a weight of 150 when they throw an item, meaning their items hit harder than you’d expect!" classic Kat item throws in effect here.

- BTW these segment headers are swag and remind me of my Nue Houjuu set.

- Dash Attack feels scary in a good way. I like the duo set nature of how they can mess with a bury, and while that is a bit "hmmm" to look at balance-wise they don't seem like the typo who is going to abuse some horrifying Sheik + Ice Climbers set type to do one hit kills. I also rather like the fact it is a move using one girl as a psuedo-projectile and another to cover them.

- Beeg damage Forward Tilt. I feel like the sharp knockback on the airborne throw would almost certainly kill earlier than 100% as described. I like the concept of being able to vary who throws what hammer and use that for some mixups that force foes to play safer against this slower move.

- Of COURSE the hammer can be grabbed as an item.

- Up Tilt's counter aspect and allowing it to have one of the two "cover" for the other feels like a nice, clever little expansion on the classic Lexaeus Forward Tilt style of move. Also latter use makes a case for why to not use my hitstun idea in this set specifically. I feel like I don't have anything specific to say about Down Tilt but enjoy it.

- "Neutral Air - Air Tremor" Whitebeard's Daughters? He would definitely protect them in a Story Mode!

- Right when I began reading the move after writing that, my random playlist began playing Indestructible by Disturbed and that combined with their cute girlness made me laugh. (Maple really DO be Indestructible, too...)

- They obviously needed a recovery with their stats and Neutral Aerial is a fun one. I like the play patterns it establishes, especially since it is such a great shorthop move that nonetheless requires a risky prior use before they get access to it. I do wonder if your partner being blown back that far might be more harmful than helpful on the margins, although it does give the move a "downside" to play around rather than spam as well.

- I do like how Up Aerial being laggy helps keep them from just laddering the foe off the top easily. I don't get how Down Aerial covers each other's back, but the sheer ridiculousness of the hitbox is fun. I suppose part of me wonders if it is in theory a bit too easy to hit but I doubt it is easier to hit than, like, fully charged Shield Breaker so that be fine. And they mostly seem like characters with a lot of inherent flaws too, so.

- Forward Aerial is definitely a nice 'n' wild one, I do like the return of the F-Tilt's counter hitbox and how it encourages the foe's defensive play patterns. In general, giving them a good horizontal air game while lacking in up OR down coverage was an interesting way to help show off a lot of power with flaws. The throwing could be a bit powerful as an edgeguard but it does carry a LOT of risk on a character who is kinda scared of going offstage (thus limiting them to doing this from ledge) so yeah that works.

- Back Aerial sending them flying backwards with like, a Wario lean back does seem a bit weird for them. I think maybe a bit of a more forceful animation would help sell that.

- A set with this control scheme but a Pyra/Mythra style semi-clone where the attacks aren't as exactly 1-to-1 with each other would be really interesting.

- "While the player can have one girl charge a smash attack and still control the other, they are limited in the latter as they must continue to hold the control stick forward while charging F-Smash. " If you set C-Stick to Smash, you could probably hold that instead too. Also, shouldn't just holding the button work? As that's the normal control IIRC. I do feel like this character's ideal controller setup is a bit of a funky one, in a positive way.

- The shockwave itself is fun, I know I mentioned Shroob's as more of an issue but being attached to a King Dedede F-Smash with 77 frames of lag is a bit different than being on one of the better edgeguarding smashes in the game having it up to doubled. I think the little shorthop cancel is also interesting, and helps give a little versatility to their laggy kit.

- Given the ability to hit it back and the Volleyball nature of it, it'd be fun if the Up Smash could be angled to also be thrown towards wherever the other partner is. Would reward desyncs interestingly.

- "and if a solo girl goes for any hit of D-Smash that’s not the late lingering hit she will just straight-up get punished. " seems flatout incorrect when they can cancel it into shield. I suppose most characters can probably just get shieldgrabbed. I do like the move setting them up as a living trap basically. The nigh non-existent end lag for going through the whole thing also opens some interesting avenues.

- The defense down debuff feels very cool in how it debuffs for the OTHER sister and encourages both tag team play and trying to do some solo -> team combo stuff.

- "Like, high enough to clear the top blast zone. NewWorld Online’s mods have hard-coded this throw to prevent it from killing, but it is now guaranteed to stall for a fully-charged Smash attack(s) thanks to some generously high hitstun." Real shades of MYM14's Rain in this one, and the flavor justification is very funny.

- I certainly wasn't expecting their Down Throw to be the wildest move in the set. It's an interesting one! I like the way the shockwave interruptions give them different advantage options, and they could time it to get a lot of extra damage. I do wonder if the set could have gone into if they have new combo options on a giant foe.

- Overall, Mai and Yui are a pretty fun set. They come out hitting with a pretty interesting concept, and then they build a fairly sound foundation around it with some straightforward, hard hitting blows from the two. They do, honestly, feel rather undertuned with both how easy they are to kill AND the amount of overall lag on them, without enough tools overall to play off of it. I do like how it feels like you get a nice sense of their character through the set. Most of the set's overall quality is a worksman-like quality, it never quite blew me away or anything but lots of stuff that made me think "neat" or wasn't bad. I'd enjoy seeing another set from you exploring this control scheme, if one comes to mind! Really, the only reason this doesn't scrape by to a decent RV spot is that my 7 star is already getting eaten into for RVs, otherwise this would be in that clear RV/WV+ range for me. Feel happy with it!
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Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Sam & Max by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
I was up and down on this one as I was reading. More “down and up”, really, I feel like the set kinda lost me and brought me back around. Broadly I think “Ice Climbers but they have separate sets and you can desync them” is just… not inherently appealing to me in the same way it is to some other folks around here. Galaxy brain solitaire ping pong stuff is… y’know, fine. It’s fine!

The controls here get a little iffy in complexity - it’s fine while they’re together if it’s not 100% universal which one does an attack for tap vs hold, but it’s a lot to track when they’re separated. In general I wasn’t sure if the separation stuff feeding into a tech chase/edgeguard game was really serving the characters or if it was just sort of a MYMy mechanical indulgence: always a hard call to make when reading something from unfamiliar source material, so I just have to trust you on it.

I think part of the reason it caught me so off-guard is that I tend to associate that sort of super technical/high-complexity stuff (as well as the set’s aims in edge–guarding, tech-chasing focus) with characters sort of focused around like… control and domination, thematically. It felt a little askew on these guys, though after a bit I was able to rationalize it as just… Sam & Max coming into a match and being so big and bombastic and taking up so much space that other fighters are just crowded out, which felt maybe a bit more on point to their shtick thematically. Maybe?

Down Special was another thing in the set that hit a little weird for me and got me started on kind of a weird note. Fizzball slaps and is a highlight of the set. The rest of the options... do feel like the set’s junk drawer so the move is a thematic success in that sense. It’s weird to see the disparity in how much weight and play the set gives these different options. And lacking some more central intrigue or mechanical premise to it, the move really does just feel like a pile of attacks stuffed into one move.

So I was not 100% vibing with it early on, but there were enough strong attacks throughout that I ended up in a better place on it. I particularly enjoyed the grab game. Pretty clean aside from the central conceit of them each having separate grabs, and aesthetically I was happy to see an element of slapstick here - I’d really felt that was missing from the set just prior to this.

The Aerials have some cool design choices too, particularly on Max’s end. The usages out of SSpec are a fun way to call back to the beginning of the set and give that move some proper pay-off, and NAir is particularly wacky and fun. I was surprised by DAir a bit - it’s cool, but Max’s ability to stall-then-fall across the blast zone and back to Sam is a pretty game-changing tool for him, in terms of off-stage safety. Would have been fun to see this kind of resync tool played with a bit more in the set.

Stray thoughts:
  • I don’t like that Sam wears clothes and Max doesn’t.
  • “The problem with Max’s moves, aside from being weak, is that they scale well” - cursed with success.
  • “The second Max disappears off the blast zone” - I really read this wrong at first and was wondering where the second Max came from.
  • “this is Max’s best defense against foes attempting to punish him with an OoS option” - ah yes, one of those defensive gun moves to protect yourself from an encroaching shield.
  • “the size of a fully-charged Samus Charge Shot” - that’s bigger than Max is normally, isn’t it? The set has an onion that also feels like it’s underestimating Charge Shot a bit.
  • Fizzball is really fun - dig the positional shenanigans and it’s a cool galaxy brain pay-off to the set-up stuff in their kit.
  • “The early hit of Dash Attack is one of Max’s few outright kill moves by himself, useful by itself on a character who doesn’t have a lot of kill moves.” - all his Smashes kill faster than this.
  • “If Sam is Together with Max, he will close his eyes “ - fun animation, but I don’t think they have access to this together? He could still just do it when they’re separate, if he’s free.
  • “occasionally screaming the attack name as he does so” - Down Aaaaiiiiiiiiir
    • Did I make this joke while Slavic was reading the set in vc? Yes. Am I doubling down now? Also yes.

Ninon Jobert by Katapultar Katapultar
This set wasn’t really on my radar (honestly I think I kinda forgot this one due to the quantity of ninja girl sets) but I ended up enjoying it quite a bit. NSpec is a cool centerpiece move. Took me a couple reads to get it but I was pretty tired so I’m not blaming that on the set. I do think it’s a little unintuitive control-wise to be able to cancel out of it by walking? That seems kinda easy to do on accident when you’re just trying to go for a tilt.

I think some moves (particularly the aerials but also the smashes to an extent) do have that tendency to go for a “but wait, there’s more!” twist that I kinda expect from you but it all feels organic enough here, it’s mooostly just like… extra hits or such that give a second usage with funky timing. Something like DAir crouch cancel is a bit more unexpected but I think it meshes really well with how the set treats crouching for NSpec.

Definitely agree with Froy on the strength of the core concept around the hand signs, and would love to see this concept returned to on a non-jamcon set.

Stray thoughts:
  • French ninja noises” is an all-time great subtitle.
  • “eat without moving your hands” - who could forget the ancient ninja art of bobbing for apples?
  • USpec not super intuitive as a recovery, but it does have interesting mechanics. Wonder if it could be improved by just switching the tap/hold behavior?
  • I like FAir and its weird kill move into drag down nature
  • Love to see a UAir that sends downward.
  • Does early Down Tilt -> Primed Neutral Special really work? Seems like the start-up of NSpec is kinda unnecessary when she’s that close. My only real hang-up with Down Tilt, cool input otherwise, I like the way she can delay her NSpec movements.
  • Batting your own shuriken sounds sick but even with the shuriken being Ganondorf-dash-speed, it seems difficult with a frame 27 attack?
  • Up Smash is sick, love the self-hit into combos. The follow-up doesn’t do it for me to the same extent but the bomb uppercut is really cool.
  • Down Throw has kind of a lot going on as a mechanic booster and might be a biiiit too much of an end-around on the mechanic for me? Feels kinda strong relative to rewards she gets off other throws.
  • This contest has a lot of jump-right-at-the-guy-you-hit stuff going on.

O. Dio by U UserShadow7989
This is one I really don’t have a lot to say about. It’s just a good, clean set without a ton of mechanical extravagance. Sure, you’ve got some minions but that’s… really the wildest thing going on? Everything feels like it feeds into or plays off of the horrifying Gatling Gun centerpiece really well; true both at the mechanical level but also in how the set works its visual design. The animations give a lot of weight to just what an absurd weapon O. Dio is packing. It also has the sense to give him other tools without ever threatening NSpec’s place in the kit, which is a tough balancing act around a move that impractical. Great stuff.

Stray thoughts:
  • I like the limitations on the mooks snowballing.
  • Aesthetics on the minions are also on-point, I like them just being lil sprites.
  • “in which case the horse fades away with another whinny, rather than turning into convenient throwing items” - boooooooo
  • The description of FSmash did confuse me slightly, mainly at the point the cloud was first referenced, I don’t think I was visualizing that quite yet.
  • “It's worth noting that O. Dio's Throws are the final hurrah for interactions with his Crazy Bunch henchmen” - tbf, they are also the final hurrah for inputs in the set.

Sam Fisher by Rychu Rychu
Really fun set that gets great mileage out of a slim wordcount - presented in a stylish way of course - and knows when to not belabor a point. To pull out a bit from the grabgame: “it's likely that Fisher will have planted traps or dragged his targets into an area containing them, minimizing their escape possibilities.” I think a lot of sets (some I’ve written probably) would have gone in for a lengthy explanation of this but the set didn’t need to, and didn’t do it. A lesson we should probably all learn before Triple War & Peacing ourselves again.

It makes sense that this moveset takes so much inspiration from Snake; he’s a good reference point for this kind of thing but also just a really satisfying set to play. Sam here obviously goes a little harder on stealth mechanics, which is really hard to do in a fighter, and it’s to the set’s credit that it succeeds so hard at the gamefeel here.

There are things in the mix I don’t completely love: the Shield Special switch feels a little out of place to me (not that I have a better suggestion) and the mark/execution mechanic is… fine? The set does use it to good effect in terms of making Sam’s multi-hits scary, but it just feels a little… I dunno, Marks feels a little too much like something he always wants ‘on’, between getting around his smoke debuffs and enabling Executions. I think the idea is cool but I don’t know if the particulars feel 100% there for me (not that I have a better suggestion, as my catchphrase goes).

Anyway, those are pretty small things at the end of the day and there’s a lot more I was having fun with over the course of the set. He definitely hits kind of a sweetspot where he’s got some funkiness and unique mechanics but in a way where all of it is mostly like something we’ve already seen in Smash and it really does give him kind of a demented DLC newcomer feel, and gives him a lot of room for good fundamentals on top of his crazy stealth kit.

Stray thoughts:
  • This moveset sent me down a wiki rabbit hole to this:

  • Limited ammo is interesting.
  • Fun to see an interpretation of sniping, I feel like that doesn’t come up much.
  • The rappel mechanics are wacky, love it.
  • Fun to see a return of z-plane shenanigans but in a set that isn’t uh… insane.
  • I like the decision to treat his crouch as a stance and some of the subtle differences it introduces
  • I feel bad for the guy in the Up Tilt gif.
  • The FAir split is incredible, such action movie bs, 10/10. He should probably have a timer on how long he can do that just-in-case.
  • FAir definitely feels like a NAir that can’t be a NAir because of his input scheme, but not really a criticism.
  • “Fisher’s proficiency in melee combat is derived almost entirely in taking targets down quickly.” - I bet he sucks at meditative self-improvement though.
  • UAir that sends down, let’s go.
  • Smashes have some fun pay-offs, I really love the trigger mechanism on the grenades.

Timekeeper Cookie by ProfPeanut ProfPeanut & FrozenRoy FrozenRoy
Aha, a crazy one. The end product here is definitely left feeling a little disjointed just by the nature of the beast. Kinda reminds me of when a TV show gets renewed for a second season but there are shake-ups in the writer’s room and the show gets refocused and maybe some stories and characters just disappear. I liked Jeff Winger’s teacher girlfriend, dammit.

The early parts of the set have some cool concepts but they’re a little under-developed or under-detailed in places. I also wonder if the ability to cut time threads shouldn’t be limited to attacks with her Embroider. I didn’t notice her projectiles (or her big splashy smash attacks) considering the possibility of hitting each other’s time threads and setting each other off anyway, so maybe that’s how it’s intended to work anyway? You might be able to get some janky set-ups otherwise.

The set has a lot of funky ideas but makes most all of them feel workable by putting short timers on stuff to stop it from ever getting too out of control. I do wish the later parts of the set did more to pay off certain ideas from the beginning. Once Froy drops in, the set tends to focus in on the things that are more under Cookie’s control: rifts and threads. I get the decision, but it leaves the more RNG or hard-to-work-around things feeling a little adrift as the set builds to its deranged grab game finale. The Smashes have some fun high-end pay-offs on her set-up, but I do feel like the set loses that ‘riding a wave of chaos’ vibe that it had going early on.

Stray thoughts:
  • I like the detail of the clock-based language for coveying angles on SSpec (and appreciated it when it came back around later in the set).
  • “converting the object’s ownership back to its original owner if it was swapped” - this sentence gets tossed out before it’s really explained what SSpec does - I’d switch the order of the paragraphs in this move to explain what threads do before the rules on their time limits anyway.
  • Is there a range on how far away she can Refabricate?
  • Really love USpec, clever move. I get that it’s a little tough to play off of, but kind of a shame it didn’t come back around more.
  • Dash Attack also a standout for me despite being one of the simpler attacks.
  • Down Smash felt hard to visualize.
  • Ah, the Insane Grab Game Closer™. Love to see it.
  • Very funny to me that Cookie’s unthreaded (code for “sane”) UThrow is stronger than any UThrow in Ultimate.
  • “which isn’t a safe place for improperly-dressed characters to be in at all” - it’s about time someone took DK to task for his idea of formalwear

Remilia Scarlet by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
Very pleased with this one - like Sam & Max, it’s easy to tell this one is a passion project, but I think this one does a much better job retaining the strengths of your shorter works. I thought Sam & Max maybe got carried away in its ideas a little bit and over-invested in depth via complex control, but Remilia feels right at home next to your stronger jamcon stuff. She’s just a bit longer and more ambitious.

It’s… another stumper in that genre of sets where I kinda just dig it, leaving me without a lot of comment material. The mechanics here are clean and well-thought-out. You get the odd attack with a funky extra tidbit or control mechanism (USmash and DSmash both do it a little bit), but it’s at a good level where it feels like she just has a couple funky attacks and not like attacks are trying to go the extra mile to force weird effects; the set doesn’t shy away from Just Doing A Normal Attack when it needs to. The blood effects are cool, but again, not spread throughout the whole set, just present on a few key moves.

Remilia has a few lil motifs and mechanics it’s juggling and it does a good job balancing them against each other and weighing them evenly. And, y’know, it does a good job managing its central hook of ‘slow jump’. It’s funny that the set does manage to get a lot of mileage out of something like that, and it’s a fun wrinkle on such an aerialist character; very clever sort of balancing measure in that it also lends a lot of weight to her ground game and avoids the problem sets like this sometimes have where the character just wants to immediately get in the air (or on the ground, as the case may be).

Stray thoughts:
  • “Upon being hit, a freeze frame will occur showcasing the foe being impaled by the spear, much like with Ridley’s Skewer sweetspot.” - the term for this is Special Zoom.
  • The heck is Don Maku.
  • “weaponized blood; a fitting power for a vampire to have” - idk man, I have not been in a lot of fights (I estimate the number at 0) but I don’t reckon I’d be chucking whatever’s in my pantry at people.
  • “as a recovery, it’s fairly limited. It certainly covers a decent distance,” - 2 Units actually is not much, local punching bag Little Mac’s recovery gets him like 5 Units of height or so (though sheer height isn’t really his issue).
    • Froy beat me to pointing this out and it’s gone now but I’m leaving this point in. I work hard (ish) on these comments, very inconsiderate of Froy to… also post comments, I guess?
  • FSmash gif is deeply funny.
    • Dang, her yelling like she’s Captain Falcon is also funny, this attack just keeps getting better.
    • It turns out to be a cool attack too, nice.
  • “their handles visibly stained with blood” - ah yes, the handle: the deadliest part of the knife.
  • “stated in lorebooks to also be blood” - I expect the lorebooks will eventually reveal that the font color in this moveset was also blood.
  • “allows her to bombard foes with repeated FSmashes from her teleports” - intro to the Air Smashes said she could only get one air smash per airtrip? Unless that meant like… only one input but she can use it repeatedly.
  • Aerials art has a very muppety energy.
    • This girl has no nose.
  • Eating ⅔ of a shield off FTilt 1 -> FTilt 2 seems like a bit much? Granted it’s not easy to just spam FTilt, but it’s not slow either.
  • “dealing 6.66% damage” - 🤘
  • “If it is in character for said member to eat people, however, they will also join the party.” - Venom Strange does not join the party and just does his normal victory pose that I didn’t write, but Venom Deadpool also shows up and joins the party.

Goddess Ilias by OldManHan OldManHan
Man, what a weird and powerful note to walk into a room on. Legendary moveset by context alone.

That said, I had a hard time getting into it as I was reading. Jab is this big crazy note to start off on, but every attack being a big show-stopper KO has diminishing returns writing-wise and mechanically. There are also a few weird attacks that impede the set having a sense of identity at like a visual design level. True tentacle form that only appears for one attack and it’s… Nair? I guess with a cameo on Fair. UAir/UTilt also kinda whiff in terms of selling her as a powerful character (purely visually, I'm not saying the attacks are weak) which is strange since I would expect her to be like… heavily associated with ‘Up’.

Anyway, I’m being overly nitpicky and you shouldn’t weigh those criticisms heavily, but that’s the headspace I was in as I was reading. Ilias did bring me around a bit as it went on. There are some cool tricks in the aerials and once the set hits Smashes it altogether stops having head-scratcher inputs, and quite a few I really like. Up Throw is a stand-out if simple: cool KO trick that gives her a little end-around on heavies, so it has a cool niche in her kit (which is frankly difficult for a pure kill move in this set). NSpec is also a lot of fun, I don’t think I’ve seen an attack quite like this and the very free-form hitbox creation is wild and cool.

I think I'm landing in a... "this is Fine but I don't especially vibe with it" place on this one, preferred Adramelech of the two.

Stray thoughts:
  • DTilt hitting the whole stage is silly, extremely annoying in any format besides 1v1 w/o items. Not that it’s great there either.
  • Maybe I’m missing something but I feel like DTilt puts SSpec out of its job as a ranged poke. Maybe there’s meant to be more to SSpec? It says “Uncharged” in the name but I don’t see evidence of a charged version. Or maybe the charge was edited out.
  • “Colliding into her or attacking her will cause her to fly offscreen, allowing Ilias to re-summon her quicker than she would otherwise.” - Can Ilias smack her away herself?

The Sundown Kid by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
I don’t have a ton to say about Sundown: pretty clean little jamcon thing. I like him, but it’s a tough contest out there.

I’m not sure the set actually plays up the gunfighter vibes all that well? Then again, I haven’t played LAL so what do I know. But making his gun attacks his bread-and-butter instead of his big threat does feel not-very-cowboy of you. DSpec taps into the kind of gunfighter quick-draw vibe I’m talking about wonderfully, wish it had been a slightly bigger deal in the set.

I’ve learned from various movesets that the traps are a big deal in LAL but I’m not entirely sure I like them in the ‘big kill move’ niche where I'd expect Gun (though I do appreciate the design choices that let them still work as traps, cutting off escapes and leaving lingering effects).

Stray thoughts:
  • No Joker meme on NSpec, how restrained.
  • Shovel.
  • I like to see consecutiveness mentioned on Jab, doesn’t come up as much as you’d think.

Nephenee by U UserShadow7989 & FrozenRoy FrozenRoy
Javelins are a fun tool. I dig the way the attack plays with positioning and planning, and also feels like an unorthodox take on the ol’ Fire Emblem double attack mechanics, if you squint. It makes NSpec a pretty simple move that has a lot of fun use cases for setting up mindgames. Wrath is also fun as a centerpiece; pretty simple in practice but there’s definitely something satisfying to getting bigger and easier power-hits on your last legs. Very good interpretation of Wrath’s effect.

It does feel like the set is a little longer than it needs to be, at times? Not egregiously so, but it’s a very simple set that ends up doing an “and now the sweetspot… and now the Wrath hitbox” thing on the regular and that pads out its wordcount a bit. I wonder if some of that could have been alleviated with different organizational choices. Maybe something like what Valkyrie did or Herminia did.

The length is occasionally compounded with mindgamey stuff that got a little into the weeds for me. From DSmash: “This also allows opponents to rush towards Nephenee to bait this out, then drift away for safety if they skirt the edges of her impressive range.” It’s pitched as an unreactably fast attack. That means the opponent has to… be somewhere out of range of DSmash and free to act, anticipate that Nephenee will DSmash anyway in this situation, and do a little fake-out movement to trick Nephenee into canceling the DSmash that she hasn’t used yet? Not impossible I guess, and I dunno, maybe I’m just picking on it because we’ve been talking about wordcount lately. Definitely felt like an attack that could have summed up the cancel strategies more broadly and still sold the idea effectively though.

I’m bikeshedding here, though (as is my wont). Good concept, solid melee around it, some fun animations.

Stray thoughts:
  • Is that how Sephiroth’s counter works? Wild. Anyway, the take here is fun, counter that messes up shields is very Swiss Army Knife in an interesting way. Start of the attack does mention a shield bash that doesn’t come up in the rest of the move description?
  • “knockback that kills 10% earlier than Wolf Flash!” - how specifically vague.
  • “One thing Nephenee nepheneeds” - thank you, I was thinking about this the whole time I was reading.
  • The Sephiroth stage-pin on FAir is an interesting choice. Something I would have expected from like… Fire Emblem Engage but feels kinda Extra on an old-school FE character? (I have not actually played Old FE though so what do I know)
  • “I’d say they don’t respect the weapon triangle, but Nephenee’s getting a bit unorthodox with her lance here” - obviously when she spins the lance like this, the blade turns into one wide blur, and a handle with a wide blade at the end is just an axe. The sanctity of the weapon triangle is intact.
  • “higher than any throws in smash proper, though MYM 25 has seen a few stronger than that” - this only became more true as time went on
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Warlord Character Fifty Years Later (Cranky Kong BKupa666 BKupa666 and Smash Daddy Smash Daddy )

Dudes, this intro RULES. In fact, this set just OOZES character instantly! The cane pogo is arguably well-trodden territory in Make Your Move, but it isn't something I feel we've seen in a while and it feels truly unique here. The way the momentum shifts based on how you pogo along feels natural and I can automatically see a lot of uses for it, for example just using Legal stages Cranky could do some serious mindgames hopping from one platform to another and baiting the foe on if he'll land normally or pogo again. It has some pretty instant appeal and seems like a strong centerpiece. Given his Disney love, I wonder if Kupa would ever make a set for DuckTales The Game's Scrooge? The Down Special image for Cranky from AmyRoser having the Rare eyes on the potions is fun to imagine. I wonder if any of these people would ever have interest in MYM or if they're more just artists rather than interested in game design. I never thought about it, but the Monado menu DOES corrospond to the DK64 character select screen rather well. I wonder if holding B to keep the menu up and tapping B for the Power Move would be a more intuitive control scheme? Feels closer to what stuff in Smash does. Or maybe releasing B while on the potion in used?

"Here’s a potion with a hastily-thrown-together name that befits the cartoon in which it debuted!" Would it even BE the Donkey Kong Country Cartoon if it wasn't jank?

Despite how simple "stat buff you can optionally end with a Super Move" is, I don't think it is something a lot of sets have attempted off the top of my head. Usually, you see more super states or the like. The first buff and Super Move here seem straightforward, but I mean going for Smash Monado is hype (even if part of that DOES come from the risk not present here) so that's pretty fair. The Simian Spring in general has fun synergy with the cane pogo, adding a different dimension to the standard aerial stat changes with his own unique twists. God though I swear that Power Move is a reference to a Donkey Kong thing, couldn't Diddy do a jump like that in DK64? I like how it gives him a weird "combo PK Thunder" kinda move, that's cool. Wasn't expecting this moveset to have one of the more Warlordian buffs this contest with Cranky's shockwaves! It does have some nice, inherent (if potentially annoying) synergy with the cane pogo there. Then again, this IS pretty time limited, so it probably isn't all too annoying.

"That's not all Wrinkly wrote, however. Cranky will build up a fiery aura on his cane as he descends, growing in power as he drops precipitously over up to three seconds. Each second will add an additional 4% damage to his resulting pogo, creating a new max of 24% damage for foes that absolutely refuse to see sense and escape. " look no man it's fine i can time the Roy counter i can-

Kinda interesting how we got multiple sets in the somewhat rare sizeshifter genre (Sana, Cranky and my own Paul Bunyan) this contest, who are all very different and had their own twists and turns on the interpretation! To be honest, though, I think this set underestimates how powerful the Super Mushroom effect is. A basic combo like Down Tilt -> Up Aerial on Falco can get kills at 40%, a Roy F-Smash kills heavies at like 37%, and the higher hitstun usually means the combos still work too. It is true that he is higher combo food (and I don't know if it applies the same full defense buffs of a Super Mushroom, although the weight increase is basically exactly the same. If so, Cranky doesn't have to worry as much about combos due to knockback/hitstun reduction), but I don't know that it is to enough of a degree it really replaces the sheer power on display from Cranky here. Especially since given Cranky can hold onto it and only activate it on a read or even in a combo, which mitigates the hurtbox risk inherent there since it is in Cranky's back pocket until then. This is also without getting into the fact it can be activated for a big speed boost. I feel like the damage potential here needs to be nerfed or something to stop Cranky from killing casually with most moves or comboing for like 50% from two because that's what the Super Mushroom level strength does-IS THAT A BOULDER?!

Even aside from that intentionally funny cutaway, that made me laugh pretty hard because I had chosen this comment title beforehand. As cool as the boulder is, I can't imagine Cranky using it much because Hunky Chunky has so much damage potential and might not even have much downside. It does have some use for getting out of being giant if you really need to but yeah, I feel like this move seems centralizingly powerful without some kind of nerf. By comparison I rather like the Banana Juice, which feels like it needs to be used more tactically to get the most advantage of it and it has the most counterplay. I also like how the amount you get to use it will depend on the duration of the invincibility on the moves, so there's different advantages to using shorter or longer lasting attacks. It also feels like it has a VERY useful Power Move, which certainly adds more layers to how you wanna use it.

Not gonna lie it was refreshing after that MONSTER of a Down Special to have a simple, effective, well characterized l'il projectile/psuedo-trap on Neutral Special. It feels like it flows pretty naturally into his cane pogo shenanigans, which is a positive for me, and it does open up some non-pogo paths for Cranky to do neutral. It is kind of amusing to me that the barrels kinda work like more traditional boulders, while Cranky also has actual boulders, the barrels themselves carry some interesting uses with the cane pogo bouncing off of them (when I first saw the boulder I thought it would be there) and I do like the TNT Barrels' different uses. Placing the dentures on the barrels (MYM sentences, am I right fellas?) does feel a bit off to me, maybe because the double tap on a move you already charge and hold with very different effects, unless the charge is held another way? Plus the fluff maybe feels a little silly. Cranky might agree that you don't need all that extra newfangled interaction to have a great move! The interaction with them already out / hitting them after feels much more natural. I do like the Ridley backfire hitbox.

I like the way that Dash Attack basically uses the mechanics from Donkey Kong Country, it feels Sakurai-esque. Forward Tilt is pretty cool, although it does particularly feel like a strong blow while under Hunky Cranky. The down hit almost certainly kills quite early with Hunky Chunky (A giant Ike F-Tilt kills at 71% on Mario in the center of FD when it normally kills at 123%, so Chunky having a stronger kill % + the slightly stronger Mushroom buff means it probably kills in the 60s or less) AND as long as all three hits land (which I assume the first two combo into each other, leaving only the third) it is an instant shield break (45.6% shield damage before the +10% bonus from the last hit is ended w/ 50 being shield HP). This is all a confirm from essentially a Lucina Forward Tilt. And you could just not activate Hunky Chunky until you use Forward Tilt. And the giant range increase means the foe rolling to avoid it is spooky for them. I won't bring up Hunky Chunky balance problems repeatedly through this set now (unless I feel it is particularly noteworthy) but please turn the numbers down. Especially since he can change up to use downwards Forward Tilt on the second hit and require near-frame perfect reactions to shield it (which still does 44.2% shield damage!). The attack itself is rather clever by itself, though.

F-Smash will also instantly break shields under Hunky Chunky. I like the trickery of the late charge and quick hitbox after. Down Smash feels like it offers a lot to Cranky, being essentially a stronger Lucina Forward Smash (1% more damage, kills about 20% sooner) that is implied to be quicker to end at the cost of 2 more frames of starting lag, with additional potential higher damage hitboxes, a Captain Falcon style Up Tilt spike and perhaps most importantly multiple options to power it up and make it become a really scary tool. I wonder if it would be better to slightly lessen the kill power to more of Lucina level while keeping the current later numbers the same to emphasize the higher power options more? Also why does the last, most powerful hit have a charge range when it only happens at full charge? Up Smash seems solid enough, I enjoy the post-attack jump.

Aerials honestly start off pretty crispy with Forward Aerial. It feels like it really slots into the moveset well and helps transition his aerial prowess into grounded power. With how much the set has focused on aerial shenanigans while only talking a lot about Neutral Aerial, I feel like his other aerials are in general very important. Back Aerial's attack name is freakin' LEGIT dude lmao. Back Aerial fills a solid niche in the set.

“Drift backward while attacking in midair? I haven’t stopped drifting since I picked up these confounded controllers! ‘Joy-Cons,’ pah…nothing about those overpriced hunks of junk sparks joy. Should’ve been called ‘Cranky-Cons,’ if you ask me!” I can absolutely see a joke about them being called Cranky-Cons in a Switch DK game.

Up Aerial's big in-air / landing frame difference feels good for Cranky, since Cranky feels like he wants to be platform-oriented in his juggling to begin with thanks to the cane pogo, and the helicopter to help control Cranky's air speed feels helpful as well. To be honest as I read through these, I feel like these should have been earlier in the set, maybe even right after Specials. Cranky feels like a bit of an aerial specialist due to his cane pogo shenanigans and it would have allowed Cranky's air game to be better discussed through some standards / smashes to give a clearer picture (perhaps over some potion uses that sometimes feel a bit redundantly stated?), obviously that's more something to think of before making the moveset / not so much advice for Cranky as much as something to consider in the future depending on the character you're making. I wasn't really sure about giving Cranky a stall than fall Down Aerial, but in the context of mixing up landings and the fact that it seems like a lower lag stall than fall like Mr. Game & Watch (how fitting for the characters! Hopefully he doesn't play like him-) makes it fit in, and then the mention of Banana Juice usage here made me consider how good of an option that would be too so it all wraps up nicely. Aerials are probably one of my favorite sections, honestly.

"FORWARD THROW - THE ICONIC CARGO THROW" UserShadow would be proud.

It DOES make sense for the OG to have a cargo, anyway. I do appreciate the set doesn't feel like it overexplains the cargo throws given the set's size (although I think most sets don't do that nowadays), and they all seem useful enough. Cranky has a fair amount of position-based moves to cargo around with. I like Down Throw using a little potion negativity into the mix and in a clean way too. Up Throw feels like a real nice setup into his air game and just nicely slots into the set. The grab game is just generally good for the most part but not in a way I have much to actively say. Final Smash is very good lol

I want to say as I go into my overall summation that one thing 100% on point in this set is the characterization, presentation and style. It isn't even JUST the well done, funny quotes, but also the well done images from your guest contributors, the well done references within the set that feel very Sakurai-esque such as the cane pogo and Dash Attack, the taunts, matchups (which yes I did read), and more. It feels reeeally nice on the character angle. For the set itself, I would say it was mostly pretty good, although with a large caveat that I feel like Hunky Chunky is preeetty overpowered right now. The three frames of ending lag don't feel like enough to make stuff like his F-Tilt becoming a near shieldtouch-of-death or D-Smash probably killing at like 50% or something with Lucina F-Smash frame data or a lot of stuff that feels too strong with the combination of a massive damage increase AND range increase. I would bring the damage increase down some (1.4x? Maybe 1.5x?), and consider either moving the ending lag debuff to the starting lag or make it like...+2 starting +2 ending rather than +3 ending. Aside from making Cranky feel too strong, I also think that it makes the set less interesting because I suspect it is so strong it centralizes a lot of what Cranky would realistically do in a match and crowd out his other also interesting options. I could be convinced otherwise without editing but right now it is a large weight on Cranky's neck.

As for other issues...the Smash attacks felt a bit eh for the most part, Down Smash is a pretty fun way to catch out rolls/dodges but with how good the base version is I suspect it just gets used to slam people at base most of the time, and Up Smash's jump bit was good but the actual attack didn't feel all too integrated, I do think it takes until the aerials for the best meat and potatoes of Cranky to come into play and that some higher end sets in this same style (Valkyrie, Akechi, maybe O. Dio?) had a more consistently high collection of strong nitty-gritty moves to me. It also feels like some of the Power Moves are a bit forgotten about, particularly the Banana Juice Power Move. Perhaps Up Special with its jump cancels could have done more risky stuff? Gah, look at me complaining like I'm Cranky himself or something! This set still had a bunch of stuff I liked: Pretty much all the aerials, the Neutral Aerial is very good, I really liked the Monado-style buffs on Cranky that feel like they stay true to Cranky's bizarre alchemy kick, the grab game was overall solid, Down Smash and Up Smash still have their good points (and Down Smash playing vs. defensive options DOES seem fun), the barrels and teeth feel like good gameplay supplementals, there's still a lot to like here and Cranky is gonna score well once the balance is inevitably fixed up. I'm glad to see a cool, modern day Cranky Kong set, and that even in the depths of his RL stuff Smady was able to get out a set! Kupa and Smady seem like a natural joint set combo, so maybe we'll see it again in the future too. Overly long comment, over and out! (Seriously, back in MY day you'd be lucky if a MOVE was as long as this comment, let alone the actual comment! And that's if they even commented the sets, you little whippersnapper, why sometimes MasterWarlord would...)

Calamity Waifu (Kosaka Wakamo Katapultar Katapultar )

"When the General Student Council President - effectively the ruler of all of Kivotos - goes missing before the game’s events" Such a powerful statement. Also yes Wakamo's theme is a banger.

This was originally a Discord comment but got big enough for a thread comment so. She was very fun! I think that most of the aerials are a highlight that really shows what I feel are Kat's big strengths. The Forward Aerial with its double knee style hitbox is very fun (although I think maybe the first sweetspot should kill more at 130% or if that feels too early 140%), Up Aerial is VERY aware of its spot in Kosaka's overall gameplan and makes what is essentially a one paragraph move feel at home, Down Aerial on the other hand is more funky with its "pounce mode", Back Aerial is another move that slots very well into the playstyle and the fact it is a sex kick where the sex kick properties apply to the KNOCKBACK and not in any way the damage is very unique and I don't know if I can recall a move doing that (at least off the top of my head writing this comment), the only one that is a bit off is Neutral Aerial (mostly because I do not know if it actually works the way Kat wants).

The time bomb basis, a twist on the damage-based formula in all of the Blue Archive sets except maybe Michiru (I do like seeing how you repurposed a general basis for many different effects in the same franchise!), is a strong one. The set doesn't always focus on it but with how it works that is a positive as it shows when it would REALLY matter. Forward Smash is a baller power move (although the trap seems very unlikely to be used much), Dash Attack was a personal favorite (feels like a twist on Wolf's) for the playstyle awareness it shows + it seems very satisfying + it is pretty good for that kinda early sweetspot Dash Attack. The throws are all quite cool, although I found the first three to be the strongest, Forward Throw really recontextualizes how the Helmets function in the set for example and the idea of using them as points for Wakamo to rebound bullets off of. Also, I like how using it with a Stage 5 CFD just instantly obliterates them on the spot. This set in general had a lot of cool moves. BTW, definitely the right call to NOT put the missile follow-up on Up Smash. It sounds like it would have been some unnecessary bloat. Also I find it amusing that between Izuna and Wakamo, we have multiple ways to hold a gun to Pikachu's head.

For some downsides...Side Special's control scheme felt a bit difficult to work with, mostly with how the minion summoning works when the Van has some overlapping input placement. I have to wonder if there's a bit of a cleaner way to do it. I also think it might be a bit too difficult to keep the Rocket Launcher Helmets from firing sometimes, but that is much more nitpicky. Down Special is a fun counter, but it feels rather weak right now, and it doesn't do TOO much to pump up the set (although TBH the fact it is largely a background buff behind the set and NOT a mechanic booster is appreciated). I would consider making it so enemy attacks that Wakamo tanks do count a small amount of the damage she tanked to the knockback/hitstun formula, maybe 30% (AKA 0.3x, the amount of damage she takes) because otherwise she both takes damage until most counters AND gets less of a benefit unless she also has a time bomb ready when her counter damage can also miss. So yeah a bit undertuned. I think Forward Tilt and the other cherry blossom moves could have benefitted from having an alternative, easier-to-activate condition, like maybe the projectile ones going off if Wakamo hit a foe still in hitstun from a melee attack of hers (an insult to injury if you will), although Up Throw does solve this for F-Tilt specifically. Down Smash having Wakamo pull out a GIANT shotgun and then never shoot it feels weird (although this is another more minor complaint and even if unchanged doesn't really hurt my opinion of the set), maybe something like a Samus Down Tilt style explosive hitbox at the end.

Finishing on a high note, I do really love this set's attack naming, which all feels like it fits Wakamo, the characterization feels on point, I feel like her being a kinda slow attack zoner (but not a heavy) who actually punishes overly shielding her projectiles gives her a cool niche. This one's a strong one and while I am still debating if I might move her around a little, this is a great job regardless Kat. Really feels like your Blue Archive sets hit it out this contest and I hope they get the respect they deserve in the end!
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Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Cranky Kong by BKupa666 BKupa666 and Smash Daddy Smash Daddy
Very fun set. Outside of some of the particulars of the potions (and maybe the denture barrels), the set feels very straight-laced in a way; it’s maybe not exactly in-Smash in its execution, but it doesn’t hew far, and it’s got a lot of stuff that’s very satisfying to visualize. It makes for smooth reading once you’re past the DSpec. Cool to see a passion project like this for a character that definitely deserves one.

Stray thoughts:
  • “Who said today’s army of witches were the only ones allowed to brew up a few surprises in their movesets?” - I really blanked on this being a Witchverse reference at first and was just… baffled about this army of witches.
  • This set has a very consistent voice throughout, really impressive for a joint.
  • “It makes some logical sense” - not a lot, though.
  • I agree with Froy that hitting a barrel already out feels a little more organic than being able to stick dentures on during start-up.
  • “Cranky himself hams it up in spastic fashion with a different chair pose during each individual rush — these include breaking the fourth wall to glare at the screen, reading a newspaper (the Big Ape Times, or perhaps the Kongo Post), clutching his tufts of hair in anger and outright sleeping.” - this is great.
  • Dash Attack is fun, I like the choices here. Didn’t Dixie also keep the DKC mechanics a bit? (editor’s note: yes)
  • “almost like a smaller DORIYAH!” - GORILLAH!
  • Very minor number inconsistency on 25/26 endlag frames in BAir.
  • The difference in the way Hunky Chunky and Banana Juice work when initiated mid-move vs while free feels like a bit to wrap your head around in a set with this many tools, but I do appreciate how the set gets mileage out of those mid-move activations with stuff like FTilt.
  • I like the juice on the upward knockback angles of FThrow and how it’s comparatively easy to juice the possibility of vertical KOs/combos. Feels very on-brand to incentivize carrying the foe to the top of the stage.
  • The most painful part of this FS is that it reminds players 75m exists.
    • 75m would be greatly improved if they replaced Donkey Kong with Cranky Kong and he was just chewing players out for not being able to play on the stage the whole time.

Wolf Witch Veronica by GolisoPower GolisoPower
I remember FA saying something about this set to the tune of (forgive me for paraphrasing) “you could pick out 23 inputs and make a very strong set out of this”. I’d agree with that take - there’s cool stuff here, but there’s also just… a lot of stuff here. The set doesn’t keep focused particularly well. It may be a symptom of the writing zig-zagging across three different movesets at once instead of just sitting down with them one at a time. Enormous respect for pulling this off though, I know how hard it is to knock out a project like this and I’m damn impressed it got done at all.

Stray thoughts:
  • The buffs for absorbing a Gealach feel a bit too juicy at the top end. Like the concept though. Set doesn’t really address buffing your damage and then switching to wolf form? Might disrupt combos a bit but still, it’s amping damage a lot on a character that’s built around Ice Climber type tricks.
  • The Lycanthrope concept is fun here, I do like the sort of… Moveset A/Moveset B/Fusion thing as a way to introduce some pay-offs (mechanical and thematic) on the set’s concepts. The Lycanthrope Specials were the highlight of the set for me.
  • The numbers on Human Side Spec raised an eyebrow. The range is pretty low for a projectile, is the closest thing I can see to a bad quality. “Projectile that goes through shields” is a big deal even before you consider that this one has a good hit attached to it. Seems like a nasty neutral and edgeguarding tool more than a combo set-up.
  • I don’t like the choice to create so much tap/hold variant behavior in attacks when a player already has three different forms to manage.
  • Vacuum USpec is interesting - I imagine she’d have the Ganondorf problem of sometimes getting her recovery messed up because she hit someone.
  • Veronica’s transformation is pretty fast (~a half second), but it sounds like the standards are treating it as something she can do mid-combo? If she can go Human FTilt -> Transform -> Wolf USpec or Wolf Jab -> Transform -> Human FTilt (both referenced in the set), then I think a lot of her tools confirm into basically anything she wants (even not accounting for the Ice Climber wolves).
  • “trailing behind Dedede’s Dash attack’s kill percentage by 2% and being 7 frames faster, in turn.” - Dedede is admittedly not a good fighter, but this is a great trade for Veronica.
  • Some of the wolf animations are very weird. Dash Attack being a tail strike and FSmash being a… leap forward “spine first” attack are not feel-goods on big forward-directed attacks.
  • The Gealach Smashes feel pretty disconnected from their inputs or even the concept of Smash attacks. They’re oddly placed in the set, and I’m not sure they’re a necessary pay-off on the Gealachs when you already have two really good pay-offs on those baked in (plus a third in Lycanthrope form). It’s a lot to throw these into a set that already comes with a high cognitive load.
  • The way the set is structured (all movesets mixed together) makes it a little hard to track what’s going on, on top of making some input sections rough. It’s a lot to read fifteen aerials back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back to back.
  • It’s very funny to me when this set just references attacks by form and ends up calling out Human Grab or whatever. Always get a chuckle out of that. Just a normal Human Grab.
  • “Finally, you can put Ganondorf behind bars” 👏
Kuda Izuna by Katapultar Katapultar
A lot of cool stuff mechanically here - the set allows for a lot of really slick plays with the shuriken in a way that just feels really satisfying to envision, and gets great mileage out of its core concepts. I think the only thing holding it back for me is that there are certain mechanics that feel a little contrived; nothing too central, but things like NSpec being a projectile or disjoint depending on ground/air or USpec flipping stale moves (which I’m not sure the set gets better mileage out of than just… sticking a strength modifier on her attacks) can be head-scratcher moments in the middle of otherwise really cool moves (an USpec being a little weak as a recovery but putting you into a superstate for the rest of the airtrip is such a cool idea, I love that). Still a great set overall, that stuff is at the level of like, making it it not-an-easy-SV for me, not making me dislike the set.

Stray thoughts:
  • Oh, the way the damage and knockback on shurikens works is wild. Dig it.
  • Beating up your own decoy is a little unintuitive but maybe it’s like a… sandbag training theme? She is calling them Training Clones in the image.
  • ‘Bomb Slip’ move name on SSpec + this gif = Izuna is a terrorist.
  • Using respawn invincibility to tank self-damaging moves is great.
  • “Decoy into fox bomb to set foes up for a potential Side Special, or if the fox bomb was the 6th hit to fill your meter use the produced shuriken to combo off of it and potentially finish the job! “ - incredible, love it.
  • “Staling will make Dash Attack KO later though, so it’s not effective out of a tech chase off of a previous Dash Attack unless Up Special’s buffs were in play.” - she can only get one buffed grounded attack off her Up Special buff, right?
  • I guess it’s limited by ammo, but Pretty Good that her FSmash has so much shield safety since she can use the first hit as a check and go for the down follow-up when prudent.
  • I like the consistency of being able to angle the forward inputs/forward input follow-ups.
  • I feel like the ultimate Kat character would be Billy Mays. Justification for a broad range of items, and the “one more trick” style of move squares with the “but wait, there’s more!” sales pitch.

/v/-tan by Daehypeels Daehypeels
Really like this one - sells itself well as a character that maybe isn’t the most potent in every respect, but is absolutely horrifying nonetheless. Clever nuances to the attacks and some really satisfying visuals. I enjoy the kind of fighting-game-character texture of it; reminds me a bit of Sleaze, another moveset this contest I enjoyed a lot. It’s not doing anything that conceptually wild, maybe (Cancer Crown aside I suppose), but everything it does it goes hard on. Nothing sells a moveset’s “choose violence” options quite like Han being in the comments like “WTF this is strong”.

Stray thoughts:
  • “Has access to a meterless reversal” - not sure if I’ve seen this phrase in a Smash context but I’m here for it.
  • “grab the opponent by the head” - misread this as “by the hand” at first, unexpectedly wholesome.
  • Up Tilt is funky. Neat.
  • “I feel like doing the Smash Atttacks earlier than Jab and the Tilts is just plain wrong in my format” - embrace chaos, put a smash in the middle of the standards.
  • “While cancerous, the leg sweep ignores shields” - oh no, it’s Alex Street Fighter.
  • Fun design in the Smashes - hard commitments, big dang attacks.
  • Going a little unorthodox on the dash attack is fun, really dig that move.
  • “It’s borderline like classic Warioman mobility.” - excellent, bring back the real Warioman.
  • “FAF is Frame 1035” - this is the silliest number I have seen in a moveset in quite some time, I love it, thank you.
  • “/v/-tan can cancel any clank animation he enters, including regular ones, with the held version of Neutral B.” - neat.
  • Wild, an eleventh-hour mechanic in the Up Special.

Oono Tsukuyo by Katapultar Katapultar
Dang, I really should have read these gun ninja earlier - been going off an RNG reading order for a while now and they got shuffled to the bottom of the deck by random chance. Absolutely loved this set. I think Izuna had some things that hit a little weird for me (though it’s… largely edited out at this point, making my life harder) but on Tsukuyo everything felt a lot more organic on top of just… hitting everything I like in a set really hard. The strangest thing it’s doing is the shuriken trajectories but even that feels alright to me; kinda reminds me of how a Drive would work in BlazBlue. It’s all so weird and wild and it leverages Smash mechanics in interesting ways. Attacks feel fun and satisfying, and it does a really good job paying off I think everything it introduces? Was really just super into this the whole way, absolutely a SV for me and you’re making my votelist difficult.

Stray thoughts:
  • “This allows Tsukuyo to survive hits that would normally break a shield, like Marth’s Shield Breaker.” - A fully charged Shieldbreaker does so much unnecessary shield damage that Marth could actually still break her full shield off a fully-charged Shield Breaker! (Not that the way the set phrases this is wrong or needs to mention that Marth could still pull it off in the right situation, just a Fun Fact)
  • “She can be jumped over or rolled around, but she cannot be pushed or crossed-up. This solidity is disabled while Tsukuyo is in shield stun, so it can’t be used to block movement-based attacks.” - I could be off-base here but I think it’s already impossible for fighters to just move through other fighters while they’re shielding, without using a movement-based attack that’s disabling jostling? I think you could treat this as just making her immune to jostling (or having some stupid high number for jostle strength).
  • “an instant star KO!” - hell yes, this is the funniest mechanic in Smash and more sets should do it.
  • I feel like taking a big flashy super skill type thing and largely associating it to her shield instead of a more active thing is a really cool, bold choice. Like sure there’re the shield cancels but still.
  • “Inwards knockback from the default-angle is a rare instance where the solid properties of Tsukuyo’s shield come in handy” - sick.
  • Something about the tree is deeply funny to me.
  • Aha, fire patch on the DThrow. Really coming to associate you with these.

Kosaka Wakamo by Katapultar Katapultar
This falls into that ‘generally Solid but kinda hard to criticize’ area for me. The NSpec delayed blast is a fun centerpiece but the set doesn’t quite hit the highs of the other Blue Archivists in execution - it’s a relatively restrained set by comparison in some ways, I think. It doesn’t feel like that should be true, when this is the set that has minions and Bullet Bill FSmash, but somehow it just doesn’t tickle my brain in the same way that Tree Costume does. Still all-around solid design with a few stand-out cool attacks though, so nothing to really complain about.

Stray thoughts:
  • The riff on Rebel’s Guard is fun - that’s a cool mechanic in Smash we could use more of. (I just like funky counters though)
  • The Smashes are a pretty wild ride, with Bullet Bill, an understated one, and then Shotgun Bludgeon.
  • I like the use of the cherry blossom effect to denote attacks that especially benefit from the blast hitstun.
  • FAir is cool, dig that kind of aerial with a precise sweetspot.
  • I like FThrow’s pay-off on having a lot of mooks out. In general the minion abuse is handled in a fun way here, but this is a very slap-sticky way of doing it that I dig.
Last edited:


Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Witchcraft Steve (Witchcrafter Madame Verre Arctic Tern Arctic Tern )

Note that I just took notes while I was reading and decided it was enough to post as a comment, so these weren't really pressed into a comment ready form.

- The way Verre can save Neutral Special's level of Polish for either combo or kill presure when she otherwise might struggle more is clever. Good Sheik needle here.

- Kinda unreal how everyone got the "Use Yoshi's double jump mechanic" brainrot in the same contest.

- Makes sense that the LIGHT attribute glass maker can reflect her light beams through glass.

- Mirror Force feels like a perfect card use here, VRains writer popping the **** off rn

- Down Smash being thought of not just in terms of how she plays but in how she would be picked up by newcomers definitely shows some nice, deeper game design thoughts and shows why you've come into MYM as a powerhouse.

- The way Jab 3 can choose between combo ender or combo extending trap is neat. It also forces Verre to sacrifice the safety of her Jab to place down, which feels appropriate.

- The fact Madame Verre is a Sheik style character and yet we have not seen a single combo tool and instead have seen a bunch of moves that say they are atypical of her playstyle could probably be avoided with some better organization.. I don't usually discuss input placement much, but this set makes me think the Standards would do better if we saw some of her more Sheik-y combo options after Jab (or maybe before but I like after Jab) rather than Dash Attack to make it feel less like an informed attribute early on. I know some people have asked about this kinda thing / talked about it, so.

- Down Tilt's little variable range is fun. I feel like it has particularly nice synergy with Neutral Special, and kind of gives the foe an "ideal range" to try and play in where they're not point blank but not far enough for the far Down Tilt to hit them when Verre has a good Neutral Special ready. It also gives Verre a casual, very natural way to play with her walls. Reminds me of Tutankoopa. Probably my favorite Standard although I also liked Forward Tilt because I feel like it is a fun twist on a Sheik F-Tilt that plays into Verre's mechanics well.

- I think it's kinda funny if Forward Aerial was just named Glass Slippers and nobody knew it was a reference they would all just nod their head (which also makes me think it is fine). With how hard it is to hit, I do think it could be buffed to be slightly more powerful.

- In general this set seems to be good about layering Verre's strengths and weaknesses, for example her back weakness and how while Back Aerial helps solve that with some useful multihit options it also isn't quite ideal because of her inherent stats and thus serves as a bit of a swiss army knife that helps give two strengths but isn't perfectly suited for both so that there's still weaknesses. Back Aerial is an easy move to dismiss as a basic, 2-paragraph long attack but it existing as it does actually adds some meaningful texture to the set in a good game design way.

- Up Aerial seems unlikely to combo on early hits unless landed. This IS the kind of move I was hoping to see in the set, because with how Verre mixes up her combos due to her Polish mechanic her wanting to drop a foe and instead do a 50/50 frame trap or mixup makes sense, and because it is a high value reward. I do think the later hit could stand to be a bit more powerful to emphasize that (and I wonder if either it or Forward Aerial could have been designed with that more in mind).

- "5 frames after the move is input, her throne makes a rapid descent, falling down at Ryu’s normal fall speed." that is one SLOW stall than fall

- "The restriction is mainly so she can’t go far offstage and endlessly DAir, jump, DAir, jump, and repeat to stall the match out once she gets a stock lead." Since Verre doesn't refresh her second jump on her platforms would this even be a Thing anyway?

- Grab lasting 19 frames feels pretty dang strong, although not so strong as to be broken. It does mean that Verre's grab can outlast spot dodges, which is something powerful that would play into her combo mixup game. Having both bad range AND lag makes me think it is definitely not a balance issue though.

- Forward Throw's animation feels very fitting for our Smug Magician Girl here.

- Back Throw's glass gets...rusty?

- It giving Verre an additional reason to mess with her mechanic in a very different way is cool though.

- Up Throw creating an item feels wild in the context of Verre's more direct and down to earth overall set, but the logic is sound and I think it plays into her moveset in a very satisfactory manner.

- The extras on Verre definitely give a lot of personality to her, really selling her characterization in an impressive way for a card. The guitar riff is an excellent choice for Yugioh victory theme, by the way. The "Grape Juice" victory screen was amazing lol

- Verre felt REALLY good overall and it feels insane Tern is a newcomer tbh. A great exploration of the lesser seen Sheik style combo character in an MYM context, being more of a glass (ahem) cannon due to her recovery in addition to having less accessible kill power and a bit more setup, but in return she gets some potentially wilder kill options (Side Special being especially fun), some fun more niche tools like the Steve-esque Up Special, and a fun and very clever stale move mechanic that encourages her to use her more creative combo options directly (which given most combo characters like this have a LOT of combo paths has inherent interest to me). The moveset overall feels solid and I'd say I don't really have any notable complaints with it. I would say the biggest thing that could have pushed it to the next level is having a deeper game when Verre tries to frame trap or 50/50 the foe: Her mechanic inherently wants her to consider "dropping" combos and going for riskier 50/50 or frame traps and while Verre does have some good reward options for that (Forward Smash, Up Aerial) I felt like giving her a more scary and crisp one (or an extra grounded option in general) would add that missing piece to boost it more in the Crewmate range. I do also think that compared to your stronger sets like Crewmate or Remilia (and some other sets near it such as, IDK, Alex, Jodie and Miruca) that Verre takes less risks and is generally a bit less innovative. Still great work and also you having three sets this high on your first contest scares me for where you might go past this contest lmao

The Big Sleaze (Sleaze Almand Almand )

- ngl I thought Sleaze would be a lightweight. I feel like making him a heavyweight bizarrely adds to the otherworldly feel.

- Pockets are...weird. Given that Sleaze, to me, seems like he has a bit of an eldritch feel to him this is fitting. I get the base of what they do without reading forward but, like, everything else is like a freaking ABSTRACT to start out and I'd be lying if I said it didn't bother me a little. There HAS to be a better way to explain this thing.

- So pockets can become items as well? That's cool. It reminds me of, of all things, DarkMega.EXE's Dark Chips except not attached to a bunch of very stupid moves. These actually seem like some very cool uses as well, they're not too easy to activate which is good since they're powerful. Honestly, they make me think of like...customizable fake Smash Balls that a character can make which is wild.

- This moveset has a totally messed up method of showing its inputs, going Down Tilt -> Side Special -> Up Tilt to start. To be honest, I enjoy it, and I think the fact that you don't feel beholden to MYMian preconceptions of what constitutes a moveset organization or style is a strength. You're a very unique fellow!

- The fact this set can in theory reach 6x damage is very funny, as utterly impractical as it is.

- "This one is called Pathways; think of them like Portals, because that’s what they are." Nods

- Pathways are portals with a twist. I rather like the placement method that makes it feel like a traditional fighting game, and it seems like it instantly has some gratifying interactivity with Sleaze such as the wave Pockets, with the way fighters in hitstun move through them feeling like it gives Sleaze a unique play around them even compared to other portal sets. The way that characters can't just move through it also gives it a different feel than some traditional portal sets (as example, Quilby).

- "Translational"? Learn something new every day, I guess.

- If I had a nickel for every moveset I read today that had a Sheik needle style move as a Special basis...

- I feel like Side Special's interactivity with shields gives them a unique niche among these style of effects (and I do love me a good time bomb), as the opponent has to decide if shielding the hit they could potentially shake off is worth allowing a trap they CAN'T shake off but CAN pressure Sleaze into due to it also hitting him. The move feels evocative of Sephiroth's Side Special with the thin hitbox and how the explosion feels like it works + higher difficulty the more needles you land, although Sleaze's body type and angles also make me think of Dio Brando in Heritage for the Future.

- Certified Hol Horse Moment: https://i.imgur.com/9hsqwnH.png (This actually is a real nice visualization though, good work)

- "But if not, he simply holds that pose for a moment, then clenches his hands into fists and rolling his neck while he takes his sweet time going back to his idle." Kinda love this animation. The Side Special itself feels like a cool callout attack with a clever use of Focus Attack armor that works into how Pocket works and even aside from that one animation sick flavor that kind of sells off the slightly "off", nightmare-y/eldritch vibe I'm still getting from Sleaze. Another thought is he almost feels like an Enderman as a businessman. The non-armored Side Special version DOES seem quite scary but it does also seem quite hard to get a sufficiently large pocket for it to become cheese.

- Up Special's air dodge mechanic is...a bit wild, but seems acceptable enough. The entire thing is basically putting them in a premade, choice 50/50 (or as you put it here, 33/33/33) situation with a twist. It definitely feels VERY fighting game, but in a good way. It almost gives me the vibe of Sleaze being some kind of secret bonus boss who can be unlocked in an older fighter, only accessible under specific conditions and, like, otherwise appearing in the background blink and you miss it style.

- I appreciate how tapped Dash Attack doesn't feel the need to add more to the basic utility move it already is.

- I'm also glad Sleaze has some moves like Forward Tilt that are simple, yet effective moves in his gameplan that use the Pocket in simple, yet effective ways. Just having a zippy fast angled hit is very primo for doing Pathway setups outside of galaxy brain plays.

- I joked that "A very simple move in concept; imagine a mix between Hero’s Up Smash and Sephiroth’s Up Tilt, except without a sword." made me imagine him thrusting up with the length of Sephiroth's Up Tilt but with his arm and then the hitbox hit the top battlefield platform so I guess I was right. Tracks with his stats image too. Also, speedfy.

- Held Up Tilt made me go "ooooooh" when I saw the division, check the math to make sure it was right and nod my head in an excited way. And I feel it adds another dimension to Sacrifice since this move gets to be "better" with it, adding a reward option to Sacrifice's impressive risk. It does still perhaps feel too strong for how safe the move is, but Sleaze's frame data overall so far IS on the bad side and he requires awkward setup to make the most of it. The full 3-hit combo also feels like the big point where this set shows what it is about and how the more strong Pocketless melee has to play with the more setup oriented Pocketed gameplay and make Sleaze really think about just what he wants.

- Okay Sleaze's Forward Smash seems simple but I can think of few sets that actually did this and the effect is cool, the reverse charging also is fitting to it. Also, the names being "Sales Pitch" and "Shown the Door" are great lol

- Held F-Smash choosing between an ultra-strong but ultra-slow attack or an ultra-range but ultra-slow / risky projectile depending on Pocket use feels intuitive and powerful. The way the set plays with hitstun does make the set continue to have a like, otherworldly businessman theme.

- "Bringing his arms out from behind his back, Sleaze holds them at chest-level, fingers splayed, before leaning back slightly and shooting his arms outward and upward. Almost like a child asking for an even more gargantuanly-tall being to pick him up." terrifyingly large baby

- The A + B Down Smash is definitely one of the most minmaxed moves in the set, allowing Sleaze either MASSIVE damage and a strong debuff, or horribly, horribly punishing him. Part of me does wonder if it is TOO much on hit (mostly in the sense of casual matches), but then again most moves like this just eviscerate the foe at super early percents which is better than a debuff (given it is, you know, a KO) so it isn't necessarily worse than getting hit by Dedede F-Smash in those. I would consider reducing the X-Slash damage by a bit anyway, but this is a small balance thing.

- Given everything this set can do, Tapped NAir just being a straightforward combo/late KO aerial with a bit of evasion that doesn't feel the need to explain 50 ways it fits into the playstyle is nice and refreshing. With the range held NAir presumably has from the animation, I wonder if it should come out more Frame 12 or so, or be a slightly weaker spike.

- Tapped Forward Aerial feels on the strong side.

- "I can’t find a good gif for this one… So I’ll just use Hugo; it’s a clap, this is a clap." Even when Hugo isn't a set this contest, Hugo arrives all the same.

- "Held Bair: Half-Kayex Squared" sure (also this move is pretty swag money, although I could see the Pocket interaction feeling a bit cheap)

- Tapped Up Aerial without any upwards hitbox is a bit weird, but it does still fit the input (he GOES up), Held Up Aerial hits above and attacks like the Held Back Aerial have psuedo-Up Aerial properties, so I don't really dislike it the same way I might in other circumstances. It also helps sell the tapped Up Aerial weaknesses.

- Held Down Aerial is up there with A + B Down Smash for minmaxed moves here, feels like something you'd see on a crazy Jigglypuff style fighter.

- "This move is a trapping tool! Do you ever find opponents just won’t jump into your sick AoE setups, or you’re having trouble using Pathways?" I should have called Saul!

- Sleaze really does just punt the hell out of the foe on his Forward Throw! I do like the way it largely exists as either a spacing tool or just to try and force some of the sick setups, which considering the sacrifices he has to make for Pockets having something direct to play off of them is ideal.

- "Afterwards, he holds the opponent at arm’s length and casually swings them in a half-circle, wiping his nose with his other hand as he nonchalantly drops the enemy behind him." This set has so many little animation flourishes. Back Throw itself feels like it uses Sleaze's long arm boi body type and setups to take what could be a very standard throw and make it into something that truly helps weave itself into Sleaze's playstyle, a bit of a more rewarding, combo oriented tool to Forward Throw's more direct, yet less followup-y self.

- The fact that a bunch of the Pathway gameplay paths (ahem) in Sleaze felt like they used the Pocket makes it feel like the throws tie the mechanic together by giving them a stronger usage against the foe outside of Pockets. I'm impressed how these throws aren't delving into any kind of crazy effects yet feel so integrated into the gameplan and non-generic. Up Throw could in theory be used for some annoying stage spikes but I feel the amount of telegraphed setup required makes it a non-issue basically.

- Sleaze's close Final Smash is like the most raw Final Smash in the entire contest. I love it.

- In general Sleaze's characterization feels EXCELLENT, especially for an OC basically made out of a weird dream, the character feels incredibly coherent and Weird and with a ton of care put into animation, personality, the whole nine yards. This guy really does feel like some kind of obscure, fighting game bonus boss that just would not be fully explained, with like a G-Man element to it in style. Doing all of this with the level of minimal backstory presented feels truly impressive and the fact it never felt like it "broke" character was huge.

- Speaking of excellent, Sleaze is a VERY good set. The initial confusion when reading was the worst it got, and I do think that could be improved to some degree by having some (not all) attacks mention what an "average" Pocket might cause it to deal (since this gives the reader a bit of a lead-in on how much it is, which they can then generally apply to other moves) would help people not be sludged out by the mechanic. I also do think that the Up/Down Taunt usage is a bit sus, I'm not opposed to it but it DOES really feel like you just ran out of inputs, and given how many attacks the controls I have I do have to wonder if there was a better way to implement it.

But aside from that and some balance quibbles, Sleaze is excellent from head to toe. The melee is deep and compelling, not afraid to let short moves shine but also diving deep into attacks and their uses when it has to, the core sacrificial concept and inherent tug of war between Sleaze's Pocket and Pocketless options is highly appealing and feels very well balanced both in game terms (IE not overpowered) and in the sense of both having distinct strengths, weaknesses and issues. Sleaze himself feels like he has acute strengths and weaknesses, ones that play out in a unique way, all without really pushing too hard outside of what happens in Smash. The characterization is superb (complete with some excellent extras), it has great individual moves as well (personal favorites: Down Special, Side Special, Forward Smash, Up Special, Up Tilt, and more are in this set. Maybe Side Special could have been talked about a bit more, but one other thing this set does is that it is very aware of when to go off and when to cut extraneous details / what are IMPORTANT details overall which I realize is a strength of yours. Really, the only reason Sleaze is long is due to the large number of inputs, not excessive writing. It feels like a set that it is hard to argue with and definitely one of the topmost sets in MYM26.

Haine a Rest? (Witchcrafter Haine U UserShadow7989 )

- Haine is pretty bulliable then, huh.

- I found Haine's Neutral Special a bit confusing, but nothing too bad, and also when I asked UserShadow I had the information exactly right so it still communicated effectively enough.

- Haine's Down Special makes me think Lisa Lisa. Another unique counter to add to this contest's strong amount of them.

- Up Special basically turning the game into a platformer is fun.

- Down Smash riding threads feels like it could honestly get in the way of the Hothead-y effect, but it is still positive so.

- Characterization feels highly on point, with Haine having a paper tiger mix of confidence and "oh nyo D:" to her. Absolutely an "I'm a genius! OH NO!" girl right here.

- Sometimes, I wonder if some of the melee you write is trying too hard to be balanced, if that makes sense? Or maybe organizationally changed up? Something I noticed in some of your sets is that it can be rare for a move to just feel like it is "good" for the character sometimes, and I think sometimes it can be because your standard move format tends to dump all the downsides of the move near the end at times. I don't really entirely know how to put it, but sometimes characters just kind of have a Good Move on them that while it has weaknesses doesn't have some sharp downside (something like, IDK, Lucina Forward Tilt comes to mind), and I think some of yours sets might miss that or maybe just not always have as much emphasis on it. I don't know if anyone else even agrees with this but my mind got to thinking about it while I read Haine. (And it came to mind Jodie feels like one of the sets that DOESN'T have as many moves end like that, which makes me wonder if that was helpful for people) (Extra Note: This is another one of those comments I worry if I will say and people take too much and start excising it too much, you know? It's more of a lighter thing I thought about, rather than "stop doing this". Especially since it didn't end up being a Thing at all in, say, the aerials.)

- Dash Attack makes me think of a Zelda Up Special as a Dash Attack, pretty neat. I like the teleport cancel. (Also this is a move that I feel DOESN'T have any issues listed above)

- Haine's NAir is very cool 👀 Down Aerial is also pretty rad. These are probably my favorite two moves in the set.

- In general, Haine's aerials feel more integrated into her core concepts, more fleshed out and better executed.

- Down Throw is smart. Up Throw is a cool "beam go up, beam go down" throw. It feels like something I'd find in Ilias. Back Throw's failstate feels too punishing for the benefit, I'd probably let Haine get a little bit more off of it.

- To be honest, Haine is just a good set I don't think I have any particular insight into. It's solid. It doesn't really have many notable flaws. But it also doesn't feel like much stands out to me, either. The melee is mostly solid and she has some fun aerials, I'd say the most consistently good thing was some pretty good characterization. Concept reminds me of Rose Lalonde, although I don't know if the set took full advantage of it (even ignoring interactions and speaking just melee). Enjoyable, but you had stronger sets this contest IMO. I would normally say she is a solid RV but this contest is nutty so she's actually my 2nd lowest WV+ right now.

2 Man Hugo (The Baseball Boys Slavic Slavic )

- Baseball Boys combining the intro and the stats is interesting, novel.

- What font did you use for the headers? It's very Yoshi's Island.

- "The other option happens by dodging, shielding, or jumping out of the attack, or otherwise doing nothing. In this case, the captured projectile is condensed down into a convenient baseball shaped size and kept on Green Glove for later. The new ball even features a design reminiscent of the captured projectile!" I like the little fluff of this move (sorry for almost exclusively talking about flavor elements lmao)

- Okay, so Side Special is pretty legit. The idea of either letting it rip instantly for more power OR for storing it for later to allow it to take on Fastball's properties is a pretty cool one, or you could try to have your cake and eat it too by compressing it into baseball form and THEN reflecting it!

- I like the Watermelon lob being based on Slugger's location. smh, Icemlon not freezing for those PK Freeze kills.

- The entire Mesopotamian politics rant continues to be incredibly unhinged in the best way possible, I can't say it is the most unhinged thing this contest (Felicia and Alex both exist) but it is HILARIOUS.

- Down Special is rather cool, giving the Baseball Boys some basic yet interesting projectile hell between the omnidirectional Fastball and the up 'n' down Shot Put Down Special, but I particularly like being able to Shot Put your stored projectiles here.

- Baseball Boys recovery is funkadelic and I like that. It feels highly unique and makes perfect sense with their characters, fun Yoshi's Island reference, feels very different from a normal Belay or the like. It also feels like it gives the Baseball Boys a recovery weakness in the same way as Yoshi, which is also fitting.

- Up Smash is a nice addition to their projectile power (that does make the gimping pretty scary by now), I like how it goes medium -> weak -> strong to both make the duo work for it and I got called away from my computer and forgot the second part so that's it that's what you get.

- Forward Smash is very inventive for what it is working with! I wonder if it would have been fun if it had a Ness style sweetspot? I like the Slugger + Needlenose combination serving as a bit of a Slugger-based variation of SSpec.

- "Call your boss and tell them you’ll be late, we’ve got back to back Slugger moves!" The only thing I'm late to is reading these sets!

- "Instead, Green Glove will leap forward out of his dash and enter a belly dive, as if desperately reaching to tap the hope plate." Since Green Glove is a fielder or pitcher you would think it would instead be like diving to catch a baseball rather than-

- Bunt giving Slugger a way to reflect a projectile into a slower, more approach / trap oriented is actually something I don't really remember seeing in a set. I like how his really quick reflection option reduces the damage and kill power as well. So far I'd say the reflectors carve out their own niches fairly well.

- I do wonder if Up Tilt is a bit too much of a shortcut to Side Special, but I mean Villager grab Pockets so.

- Neutral Aerial saying it is the last reflector in the set unless you decide otherwise and then the very next move being a reflector is peak comedy. Also Down Special -> Forward Aerial feels like a natural move combo so I'm glad the set went kinda ham on it.

- Up Aerial does feel kinda odd in the set.

- "Slugger points his bat forward in the air for a brief moment, similar to other baseball legends like Babe Ruth and Ness’s Side Taunt." This implies Ness' Side Taunt (or perhaps the legendary Saude Tint) is its own character. This made me laugh.

- Honestly feels like the third hit of BAir could kill slightly earlier and be fine since it seems rather difficult to hit. Also daaang the defensive options for these guys aren't the best in general but poor Slugger has it ROUGH, definitely feels like "solo Slugger" is a challenge (rightfully).

- Grab is...well, interesting for the animation (the poof is from Yoshi's Island IIRC albeit not for teleporting Baseball Boy grabs), and hello magic white glove.

- Forward Throw is the throw that felt like it had to be on the set, executed fairly well.

- My heart rate ****ing spiked when I thought Up Throw was about to introduce like a full item capsule RNG or something.

- "FAir can technically reflect these, sure, but there’s seriously no point to this in 99.99% of instances due to both speed and the fact the ground is almost always going to be right there." Plus they only do 3% to begin with.

- It might be because it is starting to get late for me, but Back Throw feels rather needlessly convoluted for what it is trying to do. I don't really like it overall, I think.

- "Behold, the ultimate in projectile power! (Author’s note: forget to remove the reference in every projectile attack saying it's the last projectile, statistically this one has to be the last one)." Naturally, the Final Smash is a projectile.

- "as Green Glove pulls out a comically large projectile which audiences already know as the Chomp Rock!" Almost as well known as a Baguji.


- This does not actually function like a Cargo Throw whatsoever.

- Final Smash is actually really cool flavor.

- Overall, Baseball Boys are quite the fun set for most of it, an Ice Climbers duo that feel like they are strongly unique in a contest that was awash in those. Their projectile game feels robust and while Slugger does have a lot of reflectors, they for the most part fulfill their own purposes and most of them feel like they don't even invalidate projectiles as much as some reflectors in-game do (although I could see NAir doing some cheap reflector stuff, especially if Slugger just shorthops it over and over hoping to catch a projectile). The melee feels pretty solid and I appreciate how the moveset feels svelte without losing cohesion or important info. I do think the set's grab game is pretty weak. Back Throw feels overly convoluted for "throw two baseballs at them", Down Throw says it is a Cargo Throw but isn't and mostly seems to be a weird grab-stun state like a K. Rool Down Throw but eh. Up Throw was pretty fun and Forward Throw was solid, but it was definitely the least impressive part of the set. There's a few other quibbles that knock it below sets like O. Dio and Sam Fisher that felt more consistent throughout, but Baseball Boys still present cool ideas with largely good execution to success in my eyes. Sorry it took this long for me to read a set aside from Giganotosaurus from you lmao
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Barnacled Boss
Aug 12, 2008
Toxic Tower

With just a few days left for everyone to get votes in, here's a tip of my hat to the moveset that, when compared to all the others at the top of my personal list this contest, seems to have flown lowest under the radar. As several others have echoed, it can't be overstated just how magic a carpet ride Arctic Tern Arctic Tern took us in MYM25; it's crazy for me to look back on my complimentary Blastoise comment in hindsight, knowing he'd go on to produce even more standout works in Remilia, Crewmate and Sam & Max in his inaugural contest(!). Madame Verre has earned her part in that conversation by virtue of her thought-provoking design. She's your archetypal "combo character that can't KO," but with a constant carrot dangling over her — the more unique attacks she lands in sequence, different from those in her stale moves queue, the stronger each attack will become through her Polish buff.

It's not especially complicated on paper, but in practice Polish requires fascinatingly deliberate play as far as what buff levels she shoots for, and when. Verre potentially can reach some pretty high extremes if she manages to connect with nine distinct moves in a row, but repeatedly going that route is likely to telegraph her intent to opponents. Rather, Verre will find herself working toward multiple disparate buff levels at different points over the course of a match. There are times she'll find herself foregoing higher benefit levels for a time, for the tradeoff of better chaining certain attacks (F-Tilt, U-Tilt) into themselves, or inverting her typical approach by repeating moves to strengthen the likes of pummel or B-Throw. Other times, Verre will drop bread-and-butter follow-ups in combo or tech chase contexts so as to preserve a varied attack chain just long enough to sufficiently buff her finisher of choice (an F-Smash, say, or Zelda-esque F-Air). Interwoven in are smart attacks like Neutral Special, which can store Verre's Polish-induced power level at whatever point she charges it, or jab, which leaves behind a lingering hitbox that functions separate from jab itself, such that she gets more mileage out of the input without running afoul of a unique move string. Verre's incentives mean she mostly bucks conventional combo flowcharts and KO set-ups in lieu of something far more dynamic, and never too rigid, as with commitment, Down Special lets her wipe Polish clean and give it another go if she so chooses.

Beyond Polish, Verre's beams and platforms lend exciting new wrinkles to her gameplay. The former grows stronger the more it reflects off the customizable latter, plus a number of other tools at Verre's disposal, in Down Special, D-Tilt and N-Air. The end result becomes a lingering beacon of chaos that Verre can guide around with good versatility, corralling her opponents' movement and baiting defensive reactions, such that she can more easily land specific attacks of her choosing. Much like Polish in principle, there's a sky-high ceiling for the potential power Verre can instill in her beams, up to a jet of light KOing as low as 20%. That, in turn, meshes nicely with her regular buff-seeking gameplay, as Verre becomes able to carry out rather intimidating shield pressure navigating around a bouncing beam after landing several unique moves in a row. Couple that with effective mobility options around the platforms — a Yoshi-esque double jump and ability to D-Air onto or through them at different points — and Verre is well equipped to use them in setting up combos or securing earlier KOs near the screentop. Everything falls into place near perfectly, positioning Verre as the sort of set to leave a MYM mind playing through the creative scenarios one could achieve with her in an actual Smash game, long after an initial read is completed.


Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Crewmate by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern
A couple things gave me pause on this one near the start of the set. I don’t love the control complexity around commanding allies in vents - as the set goes on it does make some fun decisions about how to get mileage out of the vent attacks, though. The vent attacks do end up feeling a liiiittle redundant at times, but it’s still fun as a mode where you get less active Ally shenanigans in exchange for better stage control.

Security is also underwhelming for me on a few fronts. There’s an appeal to the idea of trying to incentivize the odd hold-out as Solo Crewmate but it feels kinda linear when to use it, past maybe going for it at the start of the match, since you’ve got some substantial cooldowns between being able to get the Ally back out. The camera also… punishes the foe for just attacking Crewmate instead of it in a pretty linear/direct way? I dunno, there’s some merit to the idea of rewarding Crewmate for just trying to juke around and box in close quarters and micro-space like a dork. That does feel very Amogus-y. But I feel like a lot of the time it’s just kind of a “here’s a construct you need to swat down” move. And it’s also just… a complete do-nothing input when your mechanical centerpiece is on the stage.

Even when it pays off, the damage boost is Strong but not Exciting. There’s not even an indication to the player that anything happened or any attempt to sell the effect as cool. We’re all guilty of this mistake at times, living in our hypothetical world, but it seems like mechanical twiddling that doesn’t give weight to player experience. The UX side of thing is easier to patch up than the general gamefeel of it, natch, but I think it’s kinda lacking in both those ways.

Sorry to harp on that so much: I feel like I always end up writing essays about things that bug me because I want to make sure I’m articulating the point clearly and then it makes me look like some kind of psycho whose main opinion on a set is “that one input is weird”. I guess the solution is to write longer comments and be sure to talk about more positive things but damn if I don’t struggle with drumming up Specific nice things to say sometimes, on sets that are just kinda all-around solid and have a good sense about how to build melee. Like this one does! You’ve got a pretty consistent, level-headed approach to these things across your 800 sets this contest.

Once the set gets going past the Specials I think it comes up with some fun ways to layer Ally/Player stuff, and I particularly enjoy the design decisions in the Smashes and how those play off having a clone of yourself running around. And it shouldn’t be overlooked that Crewmate does ultimately come up with a playstyle that feels right for Amongus and goes at it full-tilt. Enormous props on that. I have a profound respect for intense effort spent on questionable things and this is a moveset better than Amongus deserves; a worthwhile pay-off on our little movement.

Stray thoughts:
  • “The Player does this variant by tapping the Special button, while the Ally does it by holding it.” - in the words of the great sages Flight of the Conchords: “Why exactly? What, why?”
  • Just the FSmash I was expecting.
  • “The Crewmate spawns in their hands” - in public? Disgusting.
  • “Forward Aerial - Card Swipe” - I think this is the one place where head-to-head, Blue just has the better take on what this move should be. Unless you’re saying you normally get the card thing in one take, which I personally find sus.
  • Ahhh, last second double grab game.

Dark Blupi by bubbyboytoo bubbyboytoo

Stray thoughts:
  • I like that 1v1 is the edge case in NSpec rather than the move failing to consider FFAs.
  • Alarming that it sounds like DB’s skateboard is the one screaming in SSpec.
  • I was hoping “sedncs” was a typo from the original set, but alas.
  • “No frame data” - reject modernity, embrace tradition
  • “Batman-esque morals” - I was gonna question this, but the only crime I could remember from the bio (scrolling up is for dorks) was CHILD SOLDIER, which Batman does pretty much do, so fair enough.
  • “Deals 1 ~ 1.4% damage per half-second on barefoot foes, ones with any kind of shoes or other protection are completely unaffected.” - how does Shoe count?

Magdalena Reiner by Slavic Slavic
Reinier’s got a very tool-focused feel here. Lock-on effect, ammo types, shield, fuel. Layering on the heat and the auto-pilot and she’s got a fair few mechanics that shake up her options at any given moment. I think it gives her a very distinct feel that tracks really well for the vibe you’re after, and it reflects her stylistic influences really well on top of feeling well-suited for a (hypothetical) RPG protagonist.

Each individual move feels well-designed, with some stand-out cool animations. Tossing out NSpec followed up by FSmash just feels good. The set’s also got a good awareness of which mechanics make sense to play off of where (and mercifully does not try to weave every move into all or even most mechanics), but I think it doesn’t quite manage to bring together all her mode-switches as convincingly as it could. I think it also hurts her a bit that a lot of her normals are spacers but her ranged tools end up feeling pretty limited. FSmash isn’t really enough of a power option to centralize around, USmash is inherently kinda niche just from the hitbox, and NSpec is a committal state-change/stage control thing that you can’t use casually.

Stray thoughts:
  • The shield reappearance hitbox is a cool little flourish.
  • Not sure she should really have to commit to an ammo type, I think it’d be fine if she could just get away with changing on the fly.
  • “Alternatively, press no further inputs to keep the standard earth aether supply” - I wonder if this would be smoother if instead of requiring an extra input, the first input was just angleable for different ammo types (maybe with like a little arc HUD thing underneath her when you use it so there’s kind of a visual hint what’s up)? It feels a little weird that the ‘default’ is the dodge. Could put stick back to neutral or hit A or something for just-the-dodge if that’s really critical functionality.
  • Trivia tidbits are a cool choice for sprinkling some flavor in without making the intro a novel. Very loading-screen of you.
  • Really cool design sense in the animations.
  • “While certainly not the strongest move in the game” - just once I wanna see somebody say “this is the strongest move in the game”.
  • “In fact, outside of an increase in hitstun before launching the foe, the damage and power of this move are identical to the default version (11-15.4% damage, kill around 145%).” - RIP funny PK Freeze kills.
  • “Reinier is exclusively shooting for the moon on this one. “ - about time someone put the moon in its place.
  • I like DSmash shooting through platforms, very fun implementation choice.
  • I feel like there should be an “out of fuel” version of the attacks that use fuel? I dunno, the mechanics section pitches it like fuel just provides bonuses, but it kinda sounds in those moves like you just Cannot if you run outta fuel.
    • Oh wack, this comes up in DAir. I’m leaving the note here, I was confused and I have rights.
  • I like the choice for her melee moves to often be stronger without the shield, adds a fun tension to how you use it.
  • BAir a little weak in a set with a lot of good animations. The cape attacks feel very Arkham Batman generally but the animation isn’t quite strong enough to sell it here.
  • No minigun?

Mai and Yui by Katapultar Katapultar
I don’t have a lot to say about this one, but it’s a fun, quick read. It feels very savvy about designing attacks with the duo mechanics in mind; having a few extra little tricks when together (like the duo Up Tilt) helps offset the disadvantage of not having Specials and layering attacks never feels strategically flat, which would be an easy thing to mess up.

Stray thoughts:
  • Love the reward for catching a reflected hammer on FTilt.
  • Cracked up at the Up Smash gif.
  • The set explains itself well, but there were still a few times where I was confused by how something comboed and then had to remember Ah Right There Are Two.
  • “After hammering away for at least 15 frames, this move can be cancelled by shielding!” - Tsukuyo foreshadowing
  • The grabgame has some interesting ideas but the pummel throw does deviate a bit from the elegance of the rest of the set.
    • That said I do appreciate a last-second insane grab game.
  • Up Throw would be very funny in sudden death (not a problem since they could just use one of their kill throw options out of Side Throw in sudden death anyway).
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
Tomato, Tomatoh, Kan-aid, Ka-na-de (Kanade Katapultar Katapultar )

- "A regular player would have fought against the weak Lv5 Kanade, but Maple was innocent and unconventional and neither of them saw any point in fighting each other. Instead, they built a sand castle and played several matches of Othello, all of which Maple lost." Dude's chill I like him. I remember playing Othello a lot on one of my first computers, an old Mac when my only other computer was a school computer. This is my old man way of saying I like Othello.

- "You do not get to withstand much punishment when you only have a Vitality stat of 10 - tanking hits is Maple’s job." Relatable.

- Kanade's core concept is actually very cool, especially with the time increased to 5 seconds (which is much more reliable even if it is arguably a bit short still, but it is workable), the additional Quality of Life features make it more viable I'd say. I also like how Spell Stash works, although I almost wonder if removing the stored spell from the cycle (and thus allowing Kanade to manipulate future RNG slightly) would have been another fun way to handle it. But then this lets Kanade do double up shenanigans, so it is more of a style thing.

- I also particularly like Spell Stash's out of shield option with Neutral Special.

- The way this set is formatted reminds me a LOT of set ideas I've had in mind with Custom Specials, such as Slay the Spire characters. It also reminds me a lot of Nino, but with an RNG base rather than a level-up base. (I bet Kanade and Nino would get along well)

- What happens if Kanade's NSpec changes while he is charging Fireball? I assume it just continues charging and he can fire it like normal.

- I think it is worth noting that projectiles dealing nerfed shield damage is not a universal Smash effect, but instead is just a modifier placed on most projectiles in the game. It is still worth pointing out but is relevant so mechanics don't start thinking that is the case.

- It is my general opinion Kanade's mechanic probably works best with simpler Specials, since the opponent has to track what their Specials even are every five seconds, whereas perhaps the most complex stuff is actually best served in the Smashes, at least in a set where basically every Special swaps. In that regard Neutral Special is very fun, although I did find Tornado kinda eh. The rest are all pretty sick though, really.

- So Freezing Aura is instantly WILD although in a way that feels easy enough to intuit. I am very glad the set does not go on for like fifty pages since it is easy to understand and the set has +12 inputs compared to normal. I do quite like the move, but it also does not feel like a Side Special at all.

- "Kanade casually points his finger upwards to create a miniature black hole 5, 3 or 1.2 grids above him (depending on control stick angle) on frame 6" Kanade doing this casually adds a true, good level of hilarity to it.

- "Remember how I said that Ice Pillar has a 1.5 second cooldown? That’s because the projectile continues to remain active in the top blast zone." ????????

- "Kanade cannot fastfall along water pillars until he lands after placing them - preventing him from using them to recover horizontally too easily. " Considering this Special is on a 5 second time at best to use it and that it is relatively linear (since Kanade has to place it then fastfall into it and it can't change direction after that), I see no reason to limit him like this.

- Phantom World is much more restrained than I expected. This does not upset me.

- "Kanade could conceal a hitbox delayed with Freezing Aura, or cast Phantom World! while concealed - making his clone invisible while the smoke is active!" Could even do an ol' Reisen trick and make a duplicate, then make it visible when Kanade is invisible still, or vice versa for mindgameeeees!

- Black Smoke's held variant seems maybe a touch tacked on, but nothing to the extent I'd complain about it all too much. I do think Side Special sometimes doesn't feel much like a Side Special in general, but the fact they're all support abilities does help with this (nothing incongruous like, say, hitting Side Special and leaping into the air).

- All of the Down Specials being counters is a good idea, counters are already very read based and hard to land so not having to think about if you have your Counter is a good idea. I remember Nate discussing it in Onion Knight and while it felt more managable there (binary on/off with melee or magic), with five Specials it would have been highly confusing here.

- Time Stop really do be ZA WARUDO, TOKI WA TOMARE! (It even gets stronger over time)

- Dark Bowser Counter Dark Bowser Counter

- Down Specials mostly seem good, although maybe the Cage / Portals are a touch awkward, I do like the portals overall though and the Cage is fairly unique.

- I do wonder if it is a bit odd for Kanade, who is described as "relaxed and easy going", to have a playstyle that feels like it would be very frantic and active with the Akashic Records Specials. The way they work does lend Kanade to be more setup and projectile heavy, which fits, but still perhaps. Then aaaagain, you could also think of it as the player having to solve the "puzzle" of the Specials quickly, which seems like pretty good characterization on the flipside. So it depends on how you look at it, really.

- Up Special is some cool movement tech! I like being able to decide what speed you want.

- "Holding A will have Kanade summon tiny blades of wind in a Rapid Jab on frame 7, over the same area as regular Jab. The first hit must connect to hold out the Jab, otherwise it will end after one hit. Trapped opponents can safely receive up to 14% before they DI out, and the Jab ends with no knockback and a 4 frame advantage for Kanade that can use to combo into tapped Jab. " I assume the usual rapid jab pushback keeps this from being an infinite? Because otherwise that seems a bit Hm.

- Dash Attack doesn't feel like it would realistically be unsafe on block when it has a lingering second hitbox that comes out so fast and low ending lag (the set mentions this on the projectile, and the only way safety on shield would be a Thing there is after Dash Attack use). The attack in general feels maybe a bit too good, although I'm not sure how I would suggest to tone it down.

- Down Tilt reminds me a LOT of moveset concepts I had for Stein from Soul Eater, which I should really make sometime.

- "The second limitation: the shadow-binding effect is only applied if D-tilt was on the first 5 slots of Kanade’s stale que, or was staled more than once in his entire que." This seems like a major typo on Down Tilt, since the way the move works seems to suggest the opposite. If it does work this way then, uh, please change it because Down Tilt's effect only working on such a specific stale move queue when Kanade has no other stale move stuff really going on feels really wonky.

- Up Tilt not giving Kanade upwards coverage is weird, but it does knock the opponent upwards for some upward combo play and it seems intentional for Kanade to have that weakness so...hm. The actual hitbox and effects are good, so I'll accept some of the experimentation with inputting here.

- I do quite like this set's organization. The color usage is pristine.

- Everyone seemed to feel Forward Smash was super crazy but, like...yeah, the power is intense, but it doesn't seem that insane as a move to me? Very easy to understand, mostly intuitive design, the Down Angle is where almost all the insanity is really. I like it, basically make a big moving wall, you can hit it to disable it briefly but it gets stronger after like a counter. Throw a Neutral Special at it and you get an orb with its power but the NSpec's qualities, which feels very Baseball Boy-esque. I suppose it could be a bit strong overall but that IS quite laggy and the sweetspot requires not camping too hard so.

- Up Smash feels pretty freaking strong for the lag. 17 frames is not at all bad on a Smash...although I suppose looking at it, Frame 17 on an UP SMASH is actually longer than I thought, got that King Dedede Up Smash level starting lag. Though it ALSO lingers for 14 frames and only has 10 frames of ending lag (when counting the linger) and does more damage, when Dedede has has 43 frames of ending lag. I like the idea of this move having super low ending lag, but I would consider bumping the starting lag to Frame 19 or so (and thus the FAF equivalently, not leaving it at 41) so that the move's slowness is just a bit more pronounced. Alternately, though, you may instead opt to increase the ending lag slightly. Meta Knight, a disgustingly safe Smash, has 17 frames of ending lag, so you could bring the ending lag to Frame 14 to 17 or so instead. I think it is your call on if you'd rather emphasize the starting or ending lag here.

- "Kanade’s flawed but effective melee attacks give him a strong emphasis on reading his opponent’s next move, something he’s good at doing in mental games like Othello." I like this characterization.

- Kanade's NAir is pretty wild for a NAir. So much on a backup hit!

- I feel like the wild creativity of the aerials would feel better if they had a unified vision. I suppose FAir/BAir both mirror each other in ways, but they do still work differently, while the NAir/UAir both use a tap/hold and DAir is...positionally dependent. Maybe something like three of them using tap/hold and then FAir/BAir using double tap inputs would have worked better? I think I'm also just generally unsure of their design, Up Aerial particularly doesn't feel like an attack Kanade particularly wants and I think held Up Aerial giving you a hitbox that begins below you and warps you to an hit opponent's spot feels weird. A warp swapping Special or aerial isn't a bad idea, but when you get to having a HELD one that also starts in an opposite manner I start to wonder if the elements should have been trimmed to be EITHER "warp" or "Up Aerial with funky path". I don't know, maybe it is just me but the move felt pretty unnatural on this character. Also like dang Kanade's Up Tilt doesn't hit above him, his Up Aerial starts below him and his Up Smash is a callout move so he has TROUBLE on up inputs. I feel like there's probably a way for this attack to work, and part of me is kinda gritting my teeth because "teleport that begins below Kanade" is kinda cool but it just doesn't feel right. Maybe it should have just been Down Aerial to feel more natural.

- Down Aerial actually kinda super cool though so uh oops.

- The aerials did generally just...not speak to me much, though. I'm going to actually put out my hot take and say Kanade is NOT a wild or crazy set until the aerials. A lot of the Specials are either simple attacks or pretty simple to understand / direct, the standards aren't too crazy, and the Smashes have stuff like crazy strength / range on Forward Smash or a bunch of projectile creation on Up Smash but mostly serve as the kind of attacks you might expect. The aerials suddenly start mixing in different controls schemes and, like, Neutral Aerial for example is cool but having it on a secondary option of Neutral Aerial with various stipulations feels weird in the context of Kanade. Back Aerial and Forward Aerial is cool, although I think Forward Aerial might have been more fun amping up the close range hitbox and making the second hitbox a riskier second hit or something because I think the ultra close range hitbox is the more interesting part of the set than the line attack (I suspect this is not a common opinion). Up Aerial...the warp is cool but it just feels off to me, sorry if I am struggling to pinpoint it well. Down Aerial is just plain cool though. And ZAir is nice too. I think for some of them they just kind of end up feeling...disconnected from the set somehow. I wonder if making the aerials feel more like, sorry if this is kinda abstract, if making them feel more like a "puzzle" would have made them more fitting? I dunno.

- Honestly though reading Slavic's comment on the set and them mentioning it as more of a disjointed Explosive Flame + Lightning Kick makes me like it more. I do still wish the close range hitbox was stronger for added emphasis and because having a highly strong yet very closed ranged hitbox like that on Kanade feels like it opens up avenues of play Kanade does not have right now.

- Also it feels, to me, like the aerials were popular so maybe I'm in the wrong?

- I, too, enjoy grab just being Big Arm.

- The way Forward Throw interacts with Akashic Records is highly appealing to me.

- I like that Kanade can apply a DEF Down buff the same way Mai/Yui can. It gives a fun sens of continuity between the two BOFURI sets.

- The Heal effect feels like it might be too close to the strength of the counter to me? My first thought was to halve the staling refreshes but, well, that barely does anything despite being the primary "hm" so I should probably just shelve this complaint honestly.

- With how the throws feel like they're hitting better for me, I wonder if part of the problem I have with the aerials is less the effects and more that they feel like they are TRYING to be creative while the rest of the set feels more naturally creative? Back Throw's interactions with the Freezing Aura feel very fun.

- I just want to say reading this set made me think something with the properties of Kanade's UAir Warp Bomb but with the mechanics of Link's bomb would be a cool set base.

- Up Throw actually made an Air Bury cool.

- Final Smashes are epic.

- Yay, alt costumes!

- Impressive Down Taunt, I like imagining how the different combos would look. Stop time, make a bunch of lasers, then crush them into a black hole! (On a taunt, of course)

- Kanade is one of the hardest sets this contest to rank for me, and I think that's a good thing. Much as I enjoy clean execution in movesets, it would also be utterly boring if every set was like that, and Kanade is certainly a set not short on ideas and plain ol' MYM-y FUN. I'm also going to buck the trends of my esteemed colleagues Slavic and Nate and say that I honestly didn't think most of Kanade felt that wild. Outside of a few moves (the water geyser and cage prominently), the Specials are mostly pretty straightforward and easy to understand, and while there are some odd decisions in the Standards and Down-Angled Forward Smash does basically feel like a Special they mostly feel like pretty good, not altogether insane moves. The grab game as well feels like it isn't doing all that much TOO crazy, at the least compared to some higher end MYM sets that are also liked. And while I do think Kanade is challenging to play, I'd argue other sets (including some being quite well liked) feel harder or even much harder to play such as Saul Goodman, Jodie Reynolds and Alex.

But something about the aerials bothers me. I think it feels like the design ethos on the aerials is much different from the rest of the set, making for a bit of a disconnect, plus I thought Kanade's Up Special was cool and ultimately the aerials didn't really feel like they delivered on the promise that it provided. I don't really feel fully confident in my analysis of them, maybe because multiple ones did seem fun (DAir, FAir, ZAir for example, and BAir/NAir feel like...close), but something about them felt like they stuck out like a sore thumb compared to the rest of the set. Kanade does also feel like he is on the strong side, and there's other little bits here and there.

Kanade's core concept does feel like a winner though (I was thinking post-Specials this definitely had the potential to hit a 9), and I did like plenty of the moves, so it definitely isn't a set I disliked. I think I'll have to chew on it a bit because I feel like I might want to move it higher/lower after I rank it but I can't agonize toooo long this second since I got other reads to do. I do want to again shout out this set feels like it has some fun Katapultar characterization that shows off the BOFURI love and that I think that helps elevate it, and it was definitely an enjoyable read. Your entire contest has been good, really! I've still got a Michiru and a Light to go, too...
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Smash Lord
Oct 10, 2008
Miracle Matter by U UserShadow7989
I think sometimes this set drifts into… not really pitching the mechanic like “the stuff you can do staying in this form is really good!” so much as “changing is awkward” so it can feel like kind of a straight negative mechanic at times. I didn’t really have a sense of it being stronger than a normal fighter or able to particularly leverage sticking in one form so he ends up kinda feeling like Weak All-Rounder instead of Strong All-Rounder With Mechanical Limitations.

I think the fact that some forms just don’t have a lot of tools reinforces that. In the first few, only Ice Matter really feels like it makes staying in-form an option? Probably helps that he’s got three distinct inputs that aren’t locked behind grab. And if you have to change all the time and don’t really have the luxury of staying in one form, it’s kinda just a set with extra lag (and admittedly some armor for people with very careful timing).

The Burn Matter attacks end up feeling a little redundant, which is a shame when he’s one of the forms that’s not saddled with a throw. Could have been cool if Burn Matter just had Up Special and the functionality of the Smashes was more baked into that move. Feels like it’s kinda halfway that already with Smashes bleeding into USpec and being usable out of it, and it coulda freed up the Smash inputs to go elsewhere. Would have broken up the ‘even number of inputs’ thing, but USpec is a marquee input that guarantees a form sees action when you’re on the backfoot anyway.

Anyway, I don’t think this is a bad set (especially grading on that jamcon curve) but it doesn’t quite feel like it pays off the core conceit; could have used a little more oomph to offset the drawbacks of the mechanic, be it… more effective tools for staying in one form or just overall stronger tools or something. It does pick up steam in that direction in the back half, too, with the last few Matters having more interesting tools and ways to play around the mechanic than the earlier ones.

Stray thoughts:
  • “giving them added range compared to the ‘arms’ from Up Special” - it sounds like they have the same range of 3 Units in all cases?
  • Could have used a reference pic at the start of each section, I don’t know this thing and found myself periodically scrolling back up.
  • I think generally the “duration cut in half after transformation” thing feels like an unnecessary limitation (or something that could have been softened), but I do dig the way it works on Up Throw (and that attack generally).
  • This set has really strong design sense about what each form should be and succeeds at giving each of them a distinct feel.
  • Needle Matter might be a biiit short on options to really be the neutral guy with… basically one Air OK attack and grab, but it’s a cool attack and that counts for something.

Joey Operetta by U UserShadow7989

Stray thoughts:
  • “a freaking Gundam in miniature” - finally, Heavy Nova.
  • Philosophical zombies have always felt like they encourage kinda gross trains of thought to me, so this gross character is kind of validating in a way.
  • “which does indeed mean the man has the ability to taunt in mid-air” - everyone should have this, outrageous that it’s 2023 and I still can’t taunt as I fall to my death.
  • “Kirby gets Joey's hair and suit” - I would have sworn up and down that this guy wore a fedora but apparently this is not in the set and I imagined it. Too late to disrupt this headcanon now.
  • I appreciate the willingness to go pretty limited with the Murderdolls (and with Lv1s in particular). The extensions of the mechanic don’t feel particularly in-Smash (not that that’s a criticism), but the core idea feels a bit like Ice Climbers and a bit like Olimar (but with the mooks-out-front twist) in a way that gives it a bit of grounding.
  • Weapon creation stuff is a bit out-there but doesn’t feel bad to manage. Two-press firing on the bazooka is a fun mechanic and layers onto Joey’s stuff in a cool way, fun idea. I think with his lack of attacks in the Specials it does get a bit tricky to use but that’s alright, strong effect.
  • “Joey's Murderdolls (except Lv 1s) are now the spitting image of Joey” - booooo, let the Lv1s cosplay too.
  • For serious, not sure how I feel about DSpec? Playing around with the order is neat but I feel like I was vibing with the idea of him just having an arrangement to work around more. It does suit the set’s sort of madcap Olimar sensibilities though, and ultimately leaning into customization/management isn’t A Problem it’s just Not My Style, so I guess this is more of a fun little ramble than a bullet point with an actual point.
  • Up Special is a good take on a smoke cloud thing (always tricky).
  • FSmash conjuring the image of a bunch of murderdolls just wildly firing weapons is a cool pay-off on the weapon stuff.
  • Jab is very fun, dig the design choice for it to be a very easy casual attack, and the tradeoffs to balance that.
  • Also a good choice to keep the tilts pretty clean and just trade on the weirdness of the line of characters for pop.
  • MYM25 characters that can shoryuken is a heck of a club. Off the top of my head:
    • Deadpool
    • /v/-tan
    • Joey Operetta
  • Fun use of the speed-based distance on dash attack to get weird tricks out of it.
  • The post-Specials direction has won me over on some of the control stuff in the Specials; there’s a restraint here and willingness to just let the dolls carry the intrigue that makes it click for me (maybe I’m just wary when I see MYMers going hard on letting you control the First Set Piece because I’m steeling myself for the Second Set Piece to show up).
  • FAir is very Relius Clover. Hate that clown. Good move though.
  • I think if this set neglects one area of Joey’s playstyle it’s buying himself the time and space he needs to set up - I appreciate the lower wordcount though, and it’s not that hard to imagine that stuff.

Blastoise by Arctic Tern Arctic Tern

Stray thoughts:
  • Somehow I never read this and it just got shuffled to near the bottom of the ol’ RNG pile.
  • Funny that you’re doing puddle stuff here (in a different way) given Remi. Feels like this set sets the tone for your work more broadly, but I enjoy the little connections.
    • Wonder if I should have edited this sentence to go for a third consecutive ‘set’.
    • If only megaten favored a slightly different translation you’d have a Set set instead of a Seth set.
  • A little weird to me that the middle tier of NSpec can’t be angled like the others, but a fun move overall.
  • “will be referred to as being Flashed” - mhm.
  • “and Blastoise can increase the amount he rises by mashing.” - wait what, Bowser can do that? Back in my day Bowser got whatever height he got and you were grateful for it.
  • The Bowser love really shows through here, I dig it.
  • “he is punished with… really just being a heavyweight.” - sad but true.
  • “Opponents who reside in the bubble” - fortunate that they can avoid the status effect by just not filling out the right paperwork.
  • Very solid thing throughout, I see why this made a splash. Not competitive with some of your later (or like, not even that much later) works for me but still a heck of a debut.
  • Dang BThrow is yoked.

Slippy Toad by BridgesWithTurtles BridgesWithTurtles

Stray thoughts:
  • The grabby minions sound potentially kind of annoying, but I otherwise dig what the Specials are doing.
  • I like the ‘hidden’ jetpack-drop option on USpec.
  • “which has Slippy take 5 frames to pull out a screwdriver” - I respect that Slippy fights by prison rules
  • UTilt seems pretty nasty if he can hit a shield with it, but maybe it doesn’t have the reach. Multi-hit like that on a standard would be a fun tool in the context of his shield debuff though.
  • I feel like the other day I was saying “haha sniper rifle you never see that” and now I’ve read like four sets that have one.
    • Was not expecting Slippy to join their ranks, but I guess I don’t actually know a lot about StarFox past what you pick up from Smash.
  • The potential for Slippy’s set-up to backfire and take itself out is a fun bit of theme. I kinda wish the set had more places that encouraged weird/risky set-ups.
  • “Slippy winces and clenches his teeth” - does he have teeth?
  • DThrow is really fun - cool riff on the ol’ time bomb throw.
  • Dang, disrespected even in the Final Smash.
  • Always dig an echo fighter.
  • Pretty light, easy read. The character comes through well and there’re fun attacks throughout. It’s not a home run for me, but you’re for sure on base somewhere.

Ode Iou by U UserShadow7989

Stray thoughts:
  • Parens inside parens? A descent into madness.
  • Weird commonality with Alolan Marowak in being a jamcon set with a signature fspec projectile.
  • Going off the match timer for his periodic hits is clever! Very simple twist on the way these things usually work, and it sets up interesting choices.
  • The Up Spec ‘endlag’ trick is neat. Plays into the attack animation well too, feels like a very organic place for the effect.
  • “There, the animation simply had his sprite rotate as he drifted forward toward the space he attacked” - should have kept that animation exactly.
  • Descriptions get a little muddy in places and can make the set feel longer than it is. Some of the usages in Down Tilt as an example. Probably just a product of jamcon rush - Froy mentioned recently that your style seems a little looser and lighter in later sets this contest and I’d agree with that.
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Smash Lord
Apr 26, 2007
Las Vegas, Nevada
Switch FC
FU (No More Heroes) (/v/-tan Daehypeels Daehypeels )

Things I like about the set: It has a very clear and concise playstyle, there's a lot of fairly solid individual moves (Up Tilt/Up Smash mindgames were fun, Up Aerial and Forward Aerial are solid, F-Tilt has some hiccups but a good core, Down Tilt is a nice l'il fella, I really like what Down Aerial is doing but it could use some balancing), the characterization is pretty on point for the character such as they are, doesn't have a shortage of flashy or fun ideas, Down Special was a cool Flame Choke variant, liked F-Smash too. The Cancer Crown mechanic is fairly interesting (if perhaps a touch specific), I think most of the buffs /v/-tan gets are perfectly fine with how difficult it is to get to + the drawbacks.

Things I am mixed on or don't like: Dash Attack isn't something I enjoy. Attacks without some kind of hitbox on something like Dash Attack are kinda awkward and I feel like grounded Side Special having the Superjump means it feels a bit too redundant (plus Side Special is cooler). I would either give it a hitbox in some way or replace it. IMO, /v/-tan is actually a bit lacking in good combo extenders / maximizing some of his damage from non-big hits for such an aggressive character, this could be a good place to put it. Throws could use more differentiation, for the most part 3 out of 4 end up feeling like kill moves that are within 20% or so of each other. Cancer Up Special feels too strong as an edgeguard if the foe is forced to recover low, perhaps due to needing to air dodge a Neutral Special. A few portions where the set is a bit unclear on what it can or cannot do which makes the game feel of the moves muddier. I had a few worries about Cancer Side Special (you don't HAVE to approach from afar from it, so you could use it as just on demand Super Armor and treat the punch like a smash attack for example with a grab mixup attached), but considering how it is locked behind the Crown and stuff like Focus Attack it is actually probably fine. Cancer Neutral Special seems pretty strong against edgeguards.

General issue I have is that sometimes it does feel like at least in base form /v/-tan should get slightly more from some of his aggression strings. Sometimes it feels a bit like /v/-tan has a lot to get the foe into disadvantage, but maybe slightly too little practical to take big advantage of it?

Editing Dash Attack (if you wanted to do that real quick) would probably be enough to move it up a spot by itself, anyway. The other thing bringing it down a good chunk is the throws, basically.
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