Mafia All Stars: In the end, it was Nothing Special

[Praxis]

Wait.


Zen, what was Tandora's alignment?

I realize what you're getting at and why it makes sense, but why are you giving him an out?

 

[Teran]

Well hey looks like we're on a roll.

BY kill was surprising, but town flip wasn't.

Also Zen should say something substantial imo, since he's in the spotlight now. -__-

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Very good to know mentos clear. I hope you have more to say toDay than before because your input can be really valuable, ESPECIALLY when you're clear.

Why are people voting Zen? Tandora herself has confirmed that there were no negative effects whatsoever. What kind of scum role would visit somebody but not do anything to that player? Hop off his wagon now. The only thing you'll achieve is that he might reveal things that are better left secret for now because of your pressure.

Vote Swords

Really think he should bee the play. The way he piggybacked Frozen and his weak distancing from BSL reek scum.

 

[Overswarm]

Very good to know mentos clear. I hope you have more to say toDay than before because your input can be really valuable, ESPECIALLY when you're clear.

Why are people voting Zen? Tandora herself has confirmed that there were no negative effects whatsoever. What kind of scum role would visit somebody but not do anything to that player? Hop off his wagon now. The only thing you'll achieve is that he might reveal things that are better left secret for now because of your pressure.

Vote Swords

Really think he should bee the play. The way he piggybacked Frozen and his weak distancing from BSL reek scum.

You honestly can't think of a mafia ability other than night kill that could occur? I can think of a bout a dozen off the top of my head.

That worries me, Gheb.

And Zen reaps what he sows. He visited Tandora, he did so against the plan, we ask him why.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

You honestly can't think of a mafia ability other than night kill that could occur?

Are you bad at reading?

 

[SwordsRbroken]

@gheb explain how i piggybacked frozenflame.

 

[Overswarm]

Are you bad at reading?

No.

Why are people voting Zen? Tandora herself has confirmed that there were no negative effects whatsoever. What kind of scum role would visit somebody but not do anything to that player?

No negative effects? That's why you think Zen is automatically town?

We don't know what Zen did. There are multiple roles that could have been used on her. Zen is claiming what he did today, and you're on the block if he gives a reasonable explanation.

 

[SwordsRbroken]

Gheb to me actually seems like he is trying to get the attention off of zen. Explain please.

 

[Nicholas1024]

Request replacement

Sorry guys, but due to personal reasons, I'm just not going to be able to keep up with the game.

 

[SwordsRbroken]

It's a fair assumption that scum killed Blue Yoshi, but it seems like an odd target. I thought BY was scum, and both J and I had made cases on him at various points. I kind of expected to see Macman die, honestly.

I don't know, there could be several possibilities, scum may not have sent in a
kill and a possible vig killed one and the possible SK killed the other, whatever.
I don't think it's safe to assume that only scum targeted BY, it's too WIFOMey to tell ATM.

Vig shouldn't be talked about anymore for now, back to the scumhunting.
I'm waiting on Zen's post about what he did
Gheb needs to post.

 

[Tandora]

Facts are in bold for this post.

1) Gaston is dead and no one was made a fool. Although his role does not specify about the fool making ability, it is still safe to assume he was the cause behind it. Praxis and LL were both made fools. I would assume this means both of them are cleared as town because scum would not have wanted to draw undue attention to themselves?

Granted, Praxis and LL are cleared in my book already, but if we can solidify them as town, that leaves fewer possibilities of who to lynch.

2) My mason attempt went through with no problems. This concludes Mentos is town. It can hurt The Plan depending on his role. If his role is better than mine, we may not want to send him as a recruit. If it is weaker, then we do. I cannot talk to him privately until Tonight, so either we decide now openly risking one of us, or secretly send one of us to keep mafia on its toes.

3) Zen targeted me. My role was not blocked, I wasn't killed, and obviously I wasn't bussed since Seph saw it happen and my planned recruit happened on schedule. Not liking that Zen didn't follow the plan if he is town, but I cannot think of any other scum roles that would have targetted me. I would prefer a role claim from Zen to clear him, but am actually willing to let it drop for now since I have bigger targets Today.

4) GLG and FF both were on the LL lynch for D1 and they stayed on pretty much the whole time. OS and Gheb were also heavy voters for that lynch. Especially considering LL's claim of bomb who would kill a random townie (as compared to whoever hammered him), scum had all the reason in the world to push and push hard for the LL lynch.

The following people are still on my possible scum list: X1-12, Zen, OS, Gheb, nich, and swords. I suggest we lynch OS or Gheb today, I can recruit Zen tonight, and the vig gets whoever didn't die between OS and Gheb. Assuming the plan works as it did last night, we will successfully eliminate three of the six remaining suspects. If we haven't found the scum by then, that leaves only three more for Tomorrow.

Mentos, I'd like to hear your thoughts on if you should be the representative for the recruit or me.

Unless I've missed something crucial, this should be game, set, and match.

 

[Praxis]

Keep which one of you that you send a secret.
Frozenflame being Gaston makes all kinds of sense to me. FF, OS and I were scummates in MXC mafia, and I looked him up and started a mini dgames meetup at Apex...then we had our little rivalry over who would die first this game.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

@Overswarm

If you're able to give me "a dozen" examples of scum-roles that can visit somebody without actually affecting that player I'm all ears. Either way I'm sure you will not find as many scum roles that fit these attributes as town aligned roles. I know what you're trying to get at but it's so much more likely that he's town than scum that I consider pressuring him a waste of time.

Gheb to me actually seems like he is trying to get the attention off of zen. Explain please.

Do you expect people to be that naive? Do you earnestly think anybody will buy that I "try to get attention off him" by blatantly defending him? Because effectively, I'm doing the exact opposite - I draw attention towards him by keeping him the center of our talk. If I wanted to draw attention away from him then I would've attacked you without mentioning anybody else.

And if you think that I'm stupid enough to actually try to draw attention from somebody who has pretty much a confirmed power role then I'm losing all hopes in your abilities. Because the whole basis of your "accusation" doesn't even add up.

There's a difference between "subtly trying to draw attention away" and openly defending somebody. I'm clearly doing the latter.

Facts are in bold for this post.

1) Gaston is dead and no one was made a fool. Although his role does not specify about the fool making ability, it is still safe to assume he was the cause behind it. Praxis and LL were both made fools. I would assume this means both of them are cleared as town because scum would not have wanted to draw undue attention to themselves?

Granted, Praxis and LL are cleared in my book already, but if we can solidify them as town, that leaves fewer possibilities of who to lynch.

Clearing somebody because he was made a fool by a mafioso is really simple-minded. This is Frozen we're talking about here. Not some average player. He's way beyond that level of simplicity. Treat it as null, please. Letting that affect your scum-hunting can backfire badly.

3) Zen targeted me. My role was not blocked, I wasn't killed, and obviously I wasn't bussed since Seph saw it happen and my planned recruit happened on schedule. Not liking that Zen didn't follow the plan if he is town, but I cannot think of any other scum roles that would have targetted me. I would prefer a role claim from Zen to clear him, but am actually willing to let it drop for now since I have bigger targets Today.

Quoted for ****ing truth.

The following people are still on my possible scum list: X1-12, Zen, OS, Gheb, nich, and swords. I suggest we lynch OS or Gheb today, I can recruit Zen tonight, and the vig gets whoever didn't die between OS and Gheb. Assuming the plan works as it did last night, we will successfully eliminate three of the six remaining suspects. If we haven't found the scum by then, that leaves only three more for Tomorrow.

Don't approve of recruiting Zen. You should recruit one of the two fools imo to eliminate WIFOM shenanigans ASAP. Zen is neither a play toDay nor can he give your mason anything he can't give you right now [assuming he's pro-town PR]. Praxis is good to know clear or mafia so I'd approve if you recruit him.

Disapprove of lynching OS / me toDay. Swords needs to die and I don't see how me or OS are better plays than X1 and Nich [who loses further credibility after BY's town flip]. Lynch Swords and Vig shoots X1 or Nich imo.
Would love to clear up / talk out issues with OS and / or Macman to have a powerful addition to the mason for late game, especially if we learn about Praxis' alignment via the mason. Would make work a lot easier especially if Macman comes back and starts talking.

I'll go into the swords / Frozen connection later today. Would rather talk about that than a likely town PR.

 

[SwordsRbroken]

@Zen where are you at?

 

[Overswarm]

Still want Zen to claim.

Zen went against the plan. He doesn't get off the hook.

Those as part of the plan still aren't entirely clear, and need to be directed as such.

This is an open knowledge game. There needs to be no revulsion to claiming your power role; we already have a handful that have claimed and two scum that are dead.

I repeat: This is an open knowledge game.

This doesn't mean a mass claim. This means if you deviate from town's collective plan, you claim or die. If you do something suspicious, you claim or die.

The more knowledge we have, the better.

Chances are there is an independent. We know there is at least one more scum, potentially two. Getting a huge lead and outing several of our power roles and then backing down and not using our advantage is the worst potential outcome. Anyone against it is helping scum, especially any independent players.

We don't have to hide things at this point in the game. Scum has several high profile players to attack in this game in addition to claimed powers. Additional claims at this point by any and all players that have unexplained actions will only help town.

If Zen doesn't claim, we either lynch him or he goes off scott free and we have no clue what he does. If he's town, scum knows he's a power role and can kill him anyway. We aren't protecting him. Even if he's cop, which is my presumption, we already HAVE a cop in Tandora.

2. Gheb_01
4. Overswarm
5. X1-12
7. Sephiroths Masamune
8. Macman
9. mentosman8
10. Nicholas1024
11. Lionel Luthor
13. Praxis
15. SwordsRbroken
17. Zεη
18. Tandora replaces Ryker

Play smart. This is no longer a traditional mafia game as the numbers have changed in our favor.

 

[Overswarm]

As for the lynch today?

Someone quiet.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

Wow Seph did you not learn anything from yesterDay wtf dude.

-_-

I would rather have it known than not at this point in the game. And as OS said, there are a number of actions you could have done to Tandora that aren't town aligned. I want to stay on the safe side and if something goes wrong with Tandora we would all know about it.

Right now, I feel that Zen should come clean with his role if he's a cop. That way if he has results on other people who arent dead yet, he could clear them instantly. I feel if theres a cop at all and he has results on a few people he should clear them now in the off chance he gets Night killed.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

Ninja'd by OS.

@OS: I would like to go for a Nich's slot, X1, or a Swords lynch today if were doing what you suggest.

 

[Praxis]

There are plenty of scum-related reasons Zen might have used a night action; OS seems to be implying that Zen is a cop. There are plenty of other explanations; a bus driver that targeted Zen, or Zen being a scum/indie poisoner. Zen has to claim, and if he's town he should have known better.

 

[X1-12]

@SephMasa: Do you think I play scum by not posting that much, or by just voting all over the place?

I struggle to believe scum killed BY - This is just speculation but N1 I thought Scamp was likely Vigged, Same with BY. If we assume this then two questions, what stopped the scum kill, and who killed FF? Indy? I strongly doubt the same Vig would kill Scamp followed by FF, so what Doc protect? Redirect? Still then what killed FF? SK that didn't kill N1? Some kind of indy/town redirector could cause that. I want some opinions on this. people who have been around for a while know all the games, chip in please.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

@SephMasa: Do you think I play scum by not posting that much, or by just voting all over the place?

*sigh* Talk about the other game in the other game thread. The reason I want you lynched in here is different. (As in your playing scummy in here by not posting too much, and playing a different scum in there by exaggerated voting habits.)

If it makes you feel any better, I would like the others lyched before you.

 

[Praxis]

I struggle to believe scum killed BY - This is just speculation but N1 I thought Scamp was likely Vigged, Same with BY. If we assume this then two questions, what stopped the scum kill, and who killed FF? Indy? I strongly doubt the same Vig would kill Scamp followed by FF, so what Doc protect? Redirect? Still then what killed FF? SK that didn't kill N1? Some kind of indy/town redirector could cause that. I want some opinions on this. people who have been around for a while know all the games, chip in please.

So who did scum kill? Did doctor get a protect off, or did mafia's kill get redirected/reflected in to themselves?

I prefer to assume scum killed BY and vig/SK killed Frozenflame, than to assume we have two non-scum killers and scum got roleblocked or hit a doc protect, by Occam's Razor if nothing else.

 

[Tandora]

Clearing somebody because he was made a fool by a mafioso is really simple-minded. This is Frozen we're talking about here. Not some average player. He's way beyond that level of simplicity. Treat it as null, please. Letting that affect your scum-hunting can backfire badly.

It's not my main line of reasoning why those two are cleared as town. It's that little extra edge on why we should think they're town.

Don't approve of recruiting Zen. You should recruit one of the two fools imo to eliminate WIFOM shenanigans ASAP. Zen is neither a play toDay nor can he give your mason anything he can't give you right now [assuming he's pro-town PR]. Praxis is good to know clear or mafia so I'd approve if you recruit him.

I will recruit neither Praxis or LL today. I refuse to believe either are mafia and it makes a recruit useless. YesterDay it was stated I should go for more quiet players since they have less information to draw off. Zen makes more sense as a recruit if we're leaving him alive. I've posted my list of suspects and will only recruit from them.

Disapprove of lynching OS / me toDay. Swords needs to die and I don't see how me or OS are better plays than X1 and Nich [who loses further credibility after BY's town flip]. Lynch Swords and Vig shoots X1 or Nich imo.
Would love to clear up / talk out issues with OS and / or Macman to have a powerful addition to the mason for late game, especially if we learn about Praxis' alignment via the mason. Would make work a lot easier especially if Macman comes back and starts talking.

I'll go into the swords / Frozen connection later today. Would rather talk about that than a likely town PR.

Wait, iirc, you were just berating OS in this very same post on how sloppy his play has been but you don't think he's the play? Is it because you think he's town or because you just want to stay alive?

Mafia has already proven they won't play our little game of manipulation. I think the fact they choose BY is to let town know this. If you look at BY's last several posts, none of them are helpful to pinpointing scum.

 

[X1-12]

*sigh* Talk about the other game in the other game thread. The reason I want you lynched in here is different. (As in your playing scummy in here by not posting too much, and playing a different scum in there by exaggerated voting habits.)

If it makes you feel any better, I would like the others lyched before you.

I don't beleive I mentioned any other games, and why do you talk about it as if its about 'making me feel better?' Its an interesting choice of words to say the least.

So who did scum kill? Did doctor get a protect off, or did mafia's kill get redirected/reflected in to themselves?

I prefer to assume scum killed BY and vig/SK killed Frozenflame, than to assume we have two non-scum killers and scum got roleblocked or hit a doc protect, by Occam's Razor if nothing else.

I did say it was pure speculation, I'm not assuming anything, instead suggesting we don't make assumptions so quickly and consider other possibilities

 

[~ Gheb ~]

I will recruit neither Praxis or LL today. I refuse to believe either are mafia and it makes a recruit useless. YesterDay it was stated I should go for more quiet players since they have less information to draw off. Zen makes more sense as a recruit if we're leaving him alive. I've posted my list of suspects and will only recruit from them.

It's your choice. I think it's not the best course of action but do whatever you think is best.

The bold part made me raise my eyebrow though. Care to explain? Surely you don't think recruiting a townie into a mason is useless, correct? What exactly do you mean?

Wait, iirc, you were just berating OS in this very same post on how sloppy his play has been but you don't think he's the play? Is it because you think he's town or because you just want to stay alive?

Because I think he's not scum? Sloppy play isn't scummy play - I don't see why you'd think it makes him a suspect of mine just because I think he's barking up the wrong tree in regards to Zen. Especially since Zen's one of your top-picks for recruitment anyway I think it's not optimal to focus on him but it's far from a scumtell; at least for Overswarm, that is.

 

[Overswarm]

Love you too, Gheb.

 

[Tandora]

The bold part made me raise my eyebrow though. Care to explain? Surely you don't think recruiting a townie into a mason is useless, correct? What exactly do you mean?

If I was under normal mason play, I would agree. However, since we've been using me as a scum detector, going after people I feel are town is not helpful. I am going for people who fall in the ???? category for me. I want to clear out the people who I don't have a good read for.

 

[SwordsRbroken]

Waiting on that big post of yours gheb, so far you've posted again after you promised to make your "case" on me.

@OS i'd probably be happy with a gheb/zen lynch. Gheb because he's promised his case on me earlier toDay, and he hasn't delivered it yet. He's posted again, and it wasn't the case. Zen because his defense against Seph's night information was BS.

 

[Overswarm]

If I was under normal mason play, I would agree. However, since we've been using me as a scum detector, going after people I feel are town is not helpful. I am going for people who fall in the ???? category for me. I want to clear out the people who I don't have a good read for.

Yeah, no. Go after people we HAVE a read for, but is more on the lynching block.

We can lynch the quiet people or make them talk. We can't do anything but lynch people we've already heard talk.

Waiting on that big post of yours gheb, so far you've posted again after you promised to make your "case" on me.

@OS i'd probably be happy with a gheb/zen lynch. Gheb because he's promised his case on me earlier toDay, and he hasn't delivered it yet. He's posted again, and it wasn't the case. Zen because his defense against Seph's night information was BS.

What the hell are you talking about.

 

[Xivii]

I just read your #740 Tandora. I stopped paying attention to what you guys were saying about who to recruit and all that after a while because it seemed belaboring. I didn't see the don't target you part so my bad. And it shouldn't matter anyways... if you were dead or weren't able to recruit yeah.

I don't understand why OS is pushing so hard for me to claim. Swords I do understand, because he is scum.

@Zen where are you at?

You do realize I need to sleep? Your so obvious.

and gheb has the right idea Vote: Swords

and Praxis should be recruited or lynched if Swords isn't.

 

[Overswarm]

I just read your #740 Tandora. I stopped paying attention to what you guys were saying about who to recruit and all that after a while because it seemed belaboring. I didn't see the don't target you part so my bad. And it shouldn't matter anyways... if you were dead or weren't able to recruit yeah.

I don't understand why OS is pushing so hard for me to claim. Swords I do understand, because he is scum.

Cool story bro, you're the lynch for toDay.

Claim.

Skimming the most prevalent part of the entire day that was posted in multiple formats by [/i]multiple players[/i] and then breaking one of the more important rules = bad idea.

You have no excuse, and you have no proof that you were merely lazy.

Claim, or my vote stays on you until you die.

 

[Xivii]

Than you're an idiot.

 

[X1-12]

Zen you are aware you have several votes on you yes?

 

[Praxis]

I second my recruitment.

Zen, what?

You missed the bazillion reiterations of the plan and how no one should target with night actions, then chalk it up to skimming and think it's scummy to be pushing you for a claim?

And using bad grammar and calling people names isn't going to get you out of it.

You violated the plan. Claim or die.

 

[Overswarm]

Than you're an idiot.

Then*


FTFY

 

[Praxis]

And using bad grammar and calling people names isn't going to get you out of it.

Then*


FTFY

Too slow.

 

[Praxis]

Also, EBWOP: That no one should target Tandora with night actions.

 

[SwordsRbroken]

Zen needs to claim or die. unvote if i had one, vote: zen

 

[Xivii]

I read most of the plan. I didn't need to read people's restating and agreeing with it over and over. I just read what was important and what I had time for. But w/e I'm doc.

 

[Sephiroths Masamune]

Nice ATE there Swords. And with a parrot none the less. When we get Zen to claim I say Swords should die immediately after.

@X1: Try not to twist my words when you ask a question.