Lucas, Roy, Ryu (1.0.8) Community Patch Notes

[FullMoon]

This is not really true but I just feel like sharing this

Poor Diddy.

 

[A_Kae]

I don't think anyone has posted this yet, so I will. Patch notes are out for 1.0.9. Check the notifications in smash 4 if you want to see. Guess what? They say almost nothing!

We have released patch 1.0.9

• Various fixes to improve gameplay

*Version 1.0.9 is required for online play.

So that's enlightening.

Edit: I know this isn't a balance patch and that replays aren't broken. I was just commenting on the poor patch notes.

 

[RAzul]

Any new info on this would be great as I saw the same. Testing and clarification would be great. I'm going to test my characters and the newcomers now.

 

[Deidara]

In case you guys didn't see the other few people who said it, this patch was not a balance patch. if it were, our replays would be broken, which they aren't. it's most likely just bug fixes.

 

[Schiffe]

Oh yeah, forgot to post here about this new patch. In a nutshell, there's nothing interesting about it. No balance, no leftover data, no nothing.

Just a coding change, that I have yet to get my hands on.

 

[Dr. Tuen]

sixriver records data using a 60fps capture card. Theirs is right, thinkaman's are just guesses.

Really? How does sixriver get hitbox duration then? That'd require TAS type stuff to be able to test hitbox start times on each potential frame. Or is his frame data a mix between 60fps recording and game data?

 

[[Deuce]]

So the data dump is only missing FAF/Autocancel frame data, which is being empirically tested and proven via video evidence am I correct? Just wanted to make sure.


Also, I'm confused as to the x, y, z numbers.. what do they mean? And is there a way to tell between hitbox 0 vs hitbox 1, etc?

 

[Vipermoon]

We have access (or at least they) to autocancel but FAF and other animation stuff is not accessible.

 

[WRECK-IT MUNDO]

Guys, Wario's Late Dash Attack doesn't hit opponents in mid air or on the ledge. It was a great troll kill for FG, but now it's gone.

 

[Schiffe]

Guys, Wario's Late Dash Attack doesn't hit opponents in mid air or on the ledge. It was a great troll kill for FG, but now it's gone.

Unless I am incorrect, this already used to happen in 1.0.7
The flag at the bottom of the image (targetRestriction=1) means this hitbox can only hit if the opponent is on the ground.

 

[Zapp Branniglenn]

I've got some pre-patch footage of DK's cargo throws that I was about to frame count the difference on in terms of endlag, but it seems they went and did that in the OP of this thread. It's really kind of an excellent move now.

 

[DblCrest]

There was actually a small change to magicant stage on the 3ds version. Flying man nolonger spawns and waits within the tower. He now jumps out and waits to the left of the tower instead until someone touches him. I's a minor change but interesting i guess. I do recall him always spawning within the tower and waiting in there on latest versions however.

 

[Nexelon]

I don't know if it's true but in June after the update released and three to four days after, Someone in a stream said that Mewtwo's Up Throw was nerfed that it would kill around 147% than 137%? has it been touched?

 

[Mr.Random]

I don't know if it's true but in June after the update released and three to four days after, Someone in a stream said that Mewtwo's Up Throw was nerfed that it would kill around 147% than 137%? has it been touched?

No.

 

[I-B]

Not sure if this is the place for this but I didn't see a 1.0.9 thread so

Is it possible that the AI has changed a bit in this latest update? I'm not saying it has but I feel like I'm doing much better against level 9s with characters I'm not exceptional with. Though if this is not the case then just ignore this.

 

[Furret24]

Not sure if this is the place for this but I didn't see a 1.0.9 thread so

Is it possible that the AI has changed a bit in this latest update? I'm not saying it has but I feel like I'm doing much better against level 9s with characters I'm not exceptional with. Though if this is not the case then just ignore this.

Against your wish of being ignored if you were wrong, i'm going to say you're likely just getting better.

 

[WeirdJoe27]

So what's the general consensus on Doc's upB? I've heard people suggest that the hitbox changed (got bigger), but a lot of people say that's just placebo. To this day, it's still up in the air. I noticed this "official" change log doesn't mention Doc at all. Just curious if anyone has actually been able to test it so we can put this debate to rest.

 

[A_Kae]

So what's the general consensus on Doc's upB? I've heard people suggest that the hitbox changed (got bigger), but a lot of people say that's just placebo. To this day, it's still up in the air. I noticed this "official" change log doesn't mention Doc at all. Just curious if anyone has actually been able to test it so we can put this debate to rest.

If the changelog says there's no hitbox size change, there isn't one.

 

[WeirdJoe27]

If the changelog says there's no hitbox size change, there isn't one.

Good enough for me, and that's pretty much what I've been saying. Unfortunately, I still come across people that insist it's larger and definitely changed. Gotta love the almighty placebo.

 

[Schiffe]

Good enough for me, and that's pretty much what I've been saying. Unfortunately, I still come across people that insist it's larger and definitely changed. Gotta love the almighty placebo.

The data does not lie. You can tell them that if they insist it changed, then they bought a bootleg black market edition of Smash that we haven't Data Mined yet. Let me know if you find one!

But really. If it's not there, it didn't happen. Or it happened earlier.

 

[Blackrider213]

Edit: Ignore this post. Should have read some posts earlier in the thread.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Not sure if this is the place for this but I didn't see a 1.0.9 thread so

Is it possible that the AI has changed a bit in this latest update? I'm not saying it has but I feel like I'm doing much better against level 9s with characters I'm not exceptional with. Though if this is not the case then just ignore this.

If the AI was changed, 1.0.8 replays would not be functional in 1.0.9

 

[WRECK-IT MUNDO]

Unless I am incorrect, this already used to happen in 1.0.7
The flag at the bottom of the image (targetRestriction=1) means this hitbox can only hit if the opponent is on the ground.

If that's so then my replays should not work at that time.

 

[Melonfrog]

Did 1.09 make finding Mii gear and character custom moves easier to obtain? In Crazy Orders I was lucky to find one every attempt now I'm finding like 3/4 per attempt normally reaching round 15. Or am I being lucky?

 

[Schiffe]

If that's so then my replays should not work at that time.

The picture depicts 1.0.7 and 1.0.8

There are no known balance changes in 1.0.9.

 

[WRECK-IT MUNDO]

The picture depicts 1.0.7 and 1.0.8

There are no known balance changes in 1.0.9.

Whoops sorry I was kinda lost there for a moment XD! but yea I see it now, thanks for the pictures!

 

[Nexelon]

No.

Thanks.

 

[neohopeSTF]

If the AI was changed, 1.0.8 replays would not be functional in 1.0.9

not really? The AI changing wouldn't affect replays. That being said I don't think the AI was changed prolly placebo.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

not really? The AI changing wouldn't affect replays. That being said I don't think the AI was changed prolly placebo.

Yes it would, the inputs of AI aren't saved in replays. Instead the RNG seed is saved and the AI thus plays exactly the same in the saved match as they're coming across the same exact series of events (which is why when replays involving AI desync, they still play normally while human players start SDing and attacking the air, as the AI is actually controlling themselves in the replays). As such, if the AI was modified, replays with them would no longer work as their new parameters will cause them to react differently to the same set of events under the same RNG seed, thus breaking replays as they would no longer play exactly as they did in the recorded matches.

 

[KingHeavyYTP]

I'm glad Bowser is getting a buff

 

[Deleted member]

Really, gotta appreciate the Smash Community for being able to pull together these patch notes. Wish Nintendo was able to provide us with clear-cut information rather than leaving us to figure it out on our own, but I suppose that's par for the course.

Keep up the great work, guys!

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Just to clarify for Ike's changes, I can confirm all of the frame changes already listed. The start-up reductions reduced the total frames by the same amount in each instance (e.g. f-tilt start-up reduced by 3 frames, total frames also down by 3). Ike's d-air landing lag was reduced by 3 frames, from 26 -> 23. And for his side-b, the start-up reduction is only for minimum charge time, as the minimum charge time was reduced by 3 frames (17 -> 14). The start-up of the attack itself when you release from charge is the same speed. So Quick Draw is 16 frame start-up at minimum, Close Combat is 15 frame start-up at minimum, and Unyielding Blade is 18 frame start-up at minimum.

 

[Vipermoon]

Just to clarify for Ike's changes, I can confirm all of the frame changes already listed. The start-up reductions reduced the total frames by the same amount in each instance (e.g. f-tilt start-up reduced by 3 frames, total frames also down by 3). Ike's d-air landing lag was reduced by 3 frames, from 26 -> 23. And for his side-b, the start-up reduction is only for minimum charge time, as the minimum charge time was reduced by 3 frames (17 -> 14). The start-up of the attack itself when you release from charge is the same speed. So Quick Draw is 16 frame start-up at minimum, Close Combat is 15 frame start-up at minimum, and Unyielding Blade is 18 frame start-up at minimum.

EDIT: Also, looks like the recharge time on all of Robin's stuff was altered? According to Kurogane's frame data:

Levin Sword recharges in 600 frames

Thunder in 720 frames

Fire in 720 frames

Wind in 420 frames

Nosferatu in 2400 frames

Yet according to my frame counting for 1.08, I got:

Levin Sword recharges in 567 frames

Thunder in 604 frames

Fire in 638 frames

Wind in 467 frames

Nosferatu in 2340 frames

Just to be clear, Ike Ftilt is now 12 start-up and 41 total instead of 15 and 44. Which means total is only less because of the start-up change.

And wow I wonder when this happened and how no Robin mains noticed? That is a huge buff. (EDIT: THIS ONE CONFIRMED FALSE. IGNORE)

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Actually, scratch that. Ike's f-tilt is 13 frame start-up now, not 12.

The hitbox on Ike's f-tilt doesn't appear until AFTER his sword swings around. Previously when his sword was directly in front of him it had a hitbox on it. Now it doesn't at that point, and the hitbox instead appears when his sword is to his side and the sword trail is in front of him.

Total frame count is still down by 3 though.

 

[Vipermoon]

I see! So they brought the animation 3 frames forward but took the hitboxes out of one frame. So a 3 minus 1 situation.

But wait... @ LordWilliam1234 the attack used to be already frame 15-16. There's no way they would make this only last 1 frame. Maybe if Link was closer he would get hit by frame 12? Did you already play around with it to be sure?

 

[LordWilliam1234]

Yeah, at first I thought it was because I somehow missed the initial hitbox. But I tested from a bunch of different distances (at the tip, at the center, at the base) and it never hits when Ike's sword is in front of him. Only when it's already swung past him.

You can see it for yourself if you hit training mode and put it at 1/4 speed.

It's not a z-axis thing either as this also occurs on flat zone.

 

[Vipermoon]

Okay thanks just making sure. It's hard to believe it's now a 1 frame thing. Exactly like MK's Fsmash now. Either that or they added a pointless frame 14 hitbox that no one would be able to hit anything with.

 

[KuroganeHammer]

Just to clarify for Ike's changes, I can confirm all of the frame changes already listed. The start-up reductions reduced the total frames by the same amount in each instance (e.g. f-tilt start-up reduced by 3 frames, total frames also down by 3). Ike's d-air landing lag was reduced by 3 frames, from 26 -> 23. And for his side-b, the start-up reduction is only for minimum charge time, as the minimum charge time was reduced by 3 frames (17 -> 14). The start-up of the attack itself when you release from charge is the same speed. So Quick Draw is 16 frame start-up at minimum, Close Combat is 15 frame start-up at minimum, and Unyielding Blade is 18 frame start-up at minimum.

EDIT: Also, looks like the recharge time on all of Robin's stuff was altered? According to Kurogane's frame data:

Levin Sword recharges in 600 frames

Thunder in 720 frames

Fire in 720 frames

Wind in 420 frames

Nosferatu in 2400 frames

Yet according to my frame counting for 1.08, I got:

Levin Sword recharges in 567 frames

Thunder in 604 frames

Fire in 638 frames

Wind in 467 frames

Nosferatu in 2340 frames

The recharge starts from the frame you use the move, not the frame he throws the book. Try it yourself by constantly buffering Side B. You never throw the book but you'll be able to use it again. Nothing has changed.

Actually, scratch that. Ike's f-tilt is 13 frame start-up now, not 12.

The hitbox on Ike's f-tilt doesn't appear until AFTER his sword swings around. Previously when his sword was directly in front of him it had a hitbox on it. Now it doesn't at that point, and the hitbox instead appears when his sword is to his side and the sword trail is in front of him.

Total frame count is still down by 3 though.

http://kuroganehammer.com/Smash4/Ike uses accurate 1.0.8 data

 

[Vipermoon]

The recharge starts from the frame you use the move, not the frame he throws the book. Try it yourself by constantly buffering Side B. You never throw the book but you'll be able to use it again. Nothing has changed.


http://kuroganehammer.com/Smash4/Ike uses accurate 1.0.8 data

How did you know it had a frame 14 hitbox (since I'm guessing it can't hit anyone since it'd be the 3rd dimension)? The 1.0.8 "data dump"?

 

[LordWilliam1234]

That makes sense. Also explains why I was getting different recharge values for the customs.

Edited my frame data and my post accordingly.