Lucario's overall changes in Smash 4

[Zoa]

It could mean priority was altered in this game, or arrows and bananas now have a certain amount of health now.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

It could mean priority was altered in this game, or arrows and bananas now have a certain amount of health now.

I just hope that the aura boost can help it break that limit then.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Better jab combo and f-tilt seems better. Seems like Sakurai changed him to fit the shift in the metagame. Luc lost combos, but overall his neutral seems more solid.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Hey guys if Aura Sphere is lower doesn't that mean at certain %s we can hit people on the ledge?

Watching some vids... I suppose offstage Force Palm can be used as a gtfo move.

Anyone know if we can still land into a Force Palm grab like start a few frames right before landing?

http://youtu.be/OjonXccZ_1M?t=4m42s Did Lucario just... Turn around Force Palm?

Hmmm if Lucario ducks a little while dash attacking... That means we can duck under some projectiles/other attacks maybe...

 

[Sunnysunny]

Anyone know if we can still land into a Force Palm grab like start a few frames right before landing?

It's been confirmed we can, yeah. I was thinking, sense we can d-air out of SH-airdodge, we could probably mix that up with SH-airdodge forcepalm with a lot more consistency due to the fall speed.

Also we can most definitely hit peeps off the ledge at lower percents I think with aurasphere~

 

[hichez50]

Yes can, at least with side-b 2 . Ninjalink was testing it on stream. I think this pretty much keeps lucario's cross up game intact.

 

[Pentao]

Force Palm looks a lot faster now. Seems like it's as spammable as Lucario's old F-smash. I would wager it'd be a lot worse against faster opponents, but against mid-speed opponents, you could probably space it for a good poke or something. Retreating short hop force palms could be really annoying to chase down for some opponents with limited range options as well.

 

[hichez50]

Force Palm looks a lot faster now. Seems like it's as spammable as Lucario's old F-smash. I would wager it'd be a lot worse against faster opponents, but against mid-speed opponents, you could probably space it for a good poke or something. Retreating short hop force palms could be really annoying to chase down for some opponents with limited range options as well.

Speed wasn't the reason why f-smash was "spammable" it came out frame 20 somethig. It was used as a spacing tool and the angle kept people in check.

 

[Pentao]

I only mean that Force Palm is as spammable as old F-Smash because it comes out fast enough compared to old Force Palm, which was slow as balls and left you crazy vulnerable. Not trying to say old f-smash was fast.

 

[Rose alumna]

his hit boxes look a bit narrow and his smash attacks lag looks shorted. Also his up smash does not linger as it used to in brawl. well from my looks of it ... well tbh he looks faster all around
last edit : does any one know if his force palm chain gaibs still???

 

[Sunnysunny]

last edit : does any one know if his force palm chain gaibs still???

It doesn't from what i've heard. The knockback on it seems to always be too significant, even with no aura. Even if it did there's a new mechanic in smash 4 that makes it so chaingrabs in general no longer work. God, I can't wait til this game comes to the US so I can play with all the new moves though and see what juicy new tools he's got.

 

[Rose alumna]

It doesn't from what i've heard. The knockback on it seems to always be too significant, even with no aura. Even if it did there's a new mechanic in smash 4 that makes it so chaingrabs in general no longer work. God, I can't wait til this game comes to the US so I can play with all the new moves though and see what juicy new tools he's got.

yeah i forgot about vectoring ...

 

[SimonBarSinister]

It doesn't from what i've heard. The knockback on it seems to always be too significant, even with no aura. Even if it did there's a new mechanic in smash 4 that makes it so chaingrabs in general no longer work. God, I can't wait til this game comes to the US so I can play with all the new moves though and see what juicy new tools he's got.

As far as I remember, chain Force Palms were kind of situational back in SSBB, as only certain characters were vulnerable to it. Based on what I've seen so far, Force Palm seems like a viable killing move now, which should be interesting to see first hand.

 

[yessi]

As far as I remember, chain Force Palms were kind of situational back in SSBB, as only certain characters were vulnerable to it. Based on what I've seen so far, Force Palm seems like a viable killing move now, which should be interesting to see first hand.

Actually, force palm was a pretty good kill move in brawl. I think what you're referring to is the flame part of it...

 

[Sunnysunny]

As far as I remember, chain Force Palms were kind of situational back in SSBB, as only certain characters were vulnerable to it. Based on what I've seen so far, Force Palm seems like a viable killing move now, which should be interesting to see first hand.

The force palm chaingrab wasn't even real in brawl. At percents in which it functioned as a chaingrab you could mash out of it before the hit even came out, really easily. I couldn't stand when I saw people falling for that ****. But yeah. The kill power has most definitely been upped, as well as the overall utility of the move thanks to the flame increasing with aura. thank god.

 

[SimonBarSinister]

Actually, force palm was a pretty good kill move in brawl. I think what you're referring to is the flame part of it...

Well, the flame never really did that much, but yeah. The Force Palm could kill at high enough percents, but it was somewhat riskier than winding up with an Fsmash.

 

[Masonomace]

I'm still creaming over his slightly altered DT. I had Reikou test out the RDT option for me & it's much quicker than his Brawl version to the max.

Not only has the start-up become quicker, but his slide-box on-proc comes out much faster too. The horizontal distance is insayian it could probably cover so much more grounded area than it did in Brawl.
#I'mhappy

 

[Zoa]

The horizontal distance is insayian it could probably cover so much more grounded area than it did in Brawl.

Lucario is the Goku Pokemon after all.

 

[Sirgabite]

over all im really excited for this generation of lucario, over all power buffs and aura scales with the rage effect, this means that at higher % (like 100%) lucario is gonna be extreamly deadly

 

[Masonomace]

over all im really excited for this generation of lucario, over all power buffs and aura scales with the rage effect, this means that at higher % (like 100%) lucario is gonna be extreamly deadly

I'm a day late but welcome to Smashboards, happy 2nd post.

But yeah, the bonus 15% knockback from RageBoost% added to his already good AuraBoost%, a fresh un-charged FSmash from Lucario at 150% could probably KO a at 70 - 80%.

 

[Sirgabite]

I'm a day late but welcome to Smashboards, happy 2nd post.

But yeah, the bonus 15% knockback from RageBoost% added to his already good AuraBoost%, a fresh un-charged FSmash from Lucario at 150% could probably KO a at 70 - 80%.

just so you know, zero on stream killed a at 70%with a grabbed force palm when he himself was at 140%

 

[Masonomace]

just so you know, zero on stream killed a at 70%with a grabbed force palm when he himself was at 140%

I stand corrected, would die at 55% from uncharged FSmash or FP grab. Thank you for the enlightenment.

 

[Sirgabite]

I stand corrected, would die at 55% from uncharged FSmash or FP grab. Thank you for the enlightenment.

no problem

 

[Solid Barrel]

Is his Dair still a good way to stopping your own momentum? Particularly after taking some knock back

 

[Masonomace]

Is his Dair still a good way to stopping your own momentum? Particularly after taking some knock back

His Dair still cancels momentum, just not as much as Brawl Lucario's did. It was reduced, also Welcome to Smashboards.

 

[Sirgabite]

aura sphere can destroy every single non final smash projectile in the game EXCEPT can thoral dins fire beam and fully charged canonball just so you know this may not be true, but almost every single projectile in the game, lucario can use aura sphere at max charge to cancel almost every projectile that is non FS i am still trying to find footage of more projectiles that aura sphere cant cancel

 

[Masonomace]

aura sphere can destroy every single non final smash projectile in the game EXCEPT can thoral dins fire beam and fully charged canonball just so you know this may not be true, but almost every single projectile in the game, lucario can use aura sphere at max charge to cancel almost every projectile that is non FS i am still trying to find footage of more projectiles that aura sphere cant cancel

The items that are throw-able as projectiles at different speeds in different directions can also alter the priority they have when thrown against 's AS whether it's BAS, an in-between CAS, or a FCAS. Projectile properties that have transcendent priority like ROB's laser beam do ignore other projectiles like 's AS too.

With the general nerf to projectiles, I'm excited to see what changed exactly about AS's priority.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Anyone figure out how much some projectile needs to do before it is outprioritizes another? In Brawl it had to do 8% more. Since our base fully charged Aura Sphere does 11% when we are at 0%... It will be difficult to outprioritize anything without us being damaged.

If there is someone willing to at least find the middle and top % for Aura which were 75% and 170% in Brawl respectively I can at least number crunch and get a rough estimate instead of guessing...

 

[Zoa]

Smash 4 launches tonight. Anyone down to help me figure out the aura cap percentages and aura scaling? I'm going to begin doing it tonight at launch after downloading it.

 

[King Funk]

Smash 4 launches tonight. Anyone down to help me figure out the aura cap percentages and aura scaling? I'm going to begin doing it tonight at launch after downloading it.

I might be interested in helping but having not mained Lucario in Brawl I'm not sure I'm qualified for that. =p

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Smash 4 launches tonight. Anyone down to help me figure out the aura cap percentages and aura scaling? I'm going to begin doing it tonight at launch after downloading it.

One of the first things I will be doing.

Also every version of force palm is godlike.

 

[Zoa]

One of the first things I will be doing.

Also every version of force palm is godlike.

Cool. Do you have/know any methods to find out the decimal number for moves? I'm at a loss for that much.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Cool. Do you have/know any methods to find out the decimal number for moves? I'm at a loss for that much.

I do not for the 3DS.

Best I can do is trial and error.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Cool. Do you have/know any methods to find out the decimal number for moves? I'm at a loss for that much.

Use a move 10 times. Divide by 10.

 

[RT]

Check ALL the moves, even dash attack and bthrow.

I would contribute, but I feel like getting actual sleep. Even then, I have a few other things that will need testing...

 

[Zoa]

Use a move 10 times. Divide by 10.

Thanks, MythTrainerInfinity.

Edit: Can this be applied in training as well, or must I do it in FFA/1v1?

 

[Sunnysunny]

THE TIME FOR US TO RISE IS NEARLY UPON US

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Thanks, MythTrainerInfinity.

Edit: Can this be applied in training as well, or must I do it in FFA/1v1?

I'd probably do it in training. If you do notice something getting weaker, just kill Lucario to reset the stale moves counter I guess.

So are you guys taking this over for me? Because I wanted to test every individual percent increase in each move.

 

[Zoa]

I'd probably do it in training. If you do notice something getting weaker, just kill Lucario to reset the stale moves counter I guess.

So are you guys taking this over for me? Because I wanted to test every individual percent increase in each move.

Any help of yours is welcome. I have work tomorrow, so I'm only testing each move in 10% increments until I hit the aura cap for each one. Thorough testing, such as decimal percentages, will be after I wake up.

 

[Zoa]

Ugh. The night to have debit card issues. I'll figure this out after I wake up.