Social Lower Norfair

[CaptainAmerica]

Ridley and K. Rool are both slightly different situations. Yes, Rids has been seen more recently than K. Rool has, but I think the ballot results also matter. The Rool did unexpectedly well in the ballot, as shown by the fact that every fan poll put K. Rool in at least the top three, and the Mii costume suggests it was a consolation prize. I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if the DLC was planned before or shortly after starting the ballot, and the Mii costume was just there as a consolation prize for certain characters. We know though that this was going to be used as consideration for the new game. I think the ballot hurt Ridley a little bit, because a lot of people voted for who they wanted to see in DLC for Sm4sh, not necessarily overall. The fact that Rids was already in the game may have lost him some votes.

On the other hand, Rids has been seen in main series games a lot more recently than the Kroc in his respective series, but has been denied from Smash every time. However, Sakurai has been asked about Rids by name repeatedly. We can confidently say that Ridley will definitely be considered for this game, but not exactly what the results will be. Here’s hoping that this time things turn out differently.

EDIT: Wow, let me not type while walking through the city again - this was full of typos.

 

[Reila]

Saw some people discussing Sylux and how he's likely the main antagonist of MP4. While this is true, I dont think that hurts Ridley's chances for the base roster. If anything, I think Sylux is just a lock for DLC for Smash 5, while the Ridley being on the base roster is still on the table.

MP4 is likely 2019, and having a character in Smash to promote it just makes too much sense and Sylux would fit perfectly.

Sylux doesn't have a gender, btw.

 

[IronTed]

Sylux doesn't have a gender, btw.

True. Maybe Prime 4's plot twist is that Sylux is female, which would be interesting.

 

[StormC]

I just don't see Sylux as the type of character Sakurai would gravitate to. His role in the franchise is minor overall and the design is pretty generic for the most part. The lack of a face is pretty dehumanizing, even Samus has a visor to give her some character. You could easily mistake it for a robotic mook or something.

Sylux doesn't have a gender, btw.

fwiw, Tanabe uses male pronouns. Could be a translation quirk though. I know Sakurai used "it" for Ridley. Don't really know my gender pronouns well for Japanese.

 

[SmashKeks]

I just don't see Sylux as the type of character Sakurai would gravitate to. His role in the franchise is minor overall and the design is pretty generic for the most part. The lack of a face is pretty dehumanizing, even Samus has a visor to give her some character. You could easily mistake it for a robotic mook or something.



fwiw, Tanabe uses male pronouns. Could be a translation quirk though. I know Sakurai used "it" for Ridley. Don't really know my gender pronouns well for Japanese.

I guess it really depends on what Sylux can do. From what I can gather, we haven't really seen him fight or do anything notable that differentiates him from Samus yet. Still, MP4 is in development, and if he wanted to Sakurai could get into the back rooms of Metroid development to see concepts of Sylux. If he's a wholly unique bounty hunter from Samus with a different set of moves and abilities, I could see him making it. Possible DLC makes sense too; he could be used to promote MP4 the way Corrin was for FE:Fates.

 

[Reila]

.

I only really consider what is said in game. Though Sylux is most likely male or genderless, until the characters makes a proper appearance, they have no gender.

 

[Zeox]

Ok, so let's count all the characters from Metroid that could be added to Smash but never will because having Samus 2 times is already too much for Sakurai:

1. Ridley
2. Sylux
3. Dark Samus
4. ???

 

[Jibblypuff_]

Sylux doesn't have a gender, btw.

Stop, please. I'm like 98% he has a gender.

 

[Zeox]

Stop, please. I'm like 98% he has a gender.

In the metroid wiki it says he is male.

 

[Zem-raj]

I think it helps that with Ridley, I don't think he has been off the radar for Nintendo.

For the Metroid promotion on Miitomo in 2016, Ridley was selected alongside accessories from Samus, Zero Suit Samus, and the Baby Metroid. Ridley was a pet, and came with 5 variations:

It is worth noting that Kirby, a character who already has different colour variations (often used for multiplayer purposes), didn't get any variations in Miitomo (there was only one of him). You'd think that Ridley would be the one to only get one version of himself as a pet at a push, and that Kirby would be the one who got the variations. No one expected Ridley in this app. The two of the variation colours, cyan and black, are new - they aren't really based on anything as far as I can tell.

Ridley was selected for promoting Metroid in the Villains takeover US eShop promotion in 2014, not Mother Brain.

Ridley was selected for a space on both Nintendo Monopoly boards, not Mother Brain.

Ridley was also part of a promotion for Nintendo Badge Arcade:

Ridley was in Metroid Samus Returns, despite not being in Metroid II: Return of Samus:

Nintendo also hyped up his return and boss fight before release:

"Vengeance has a name" [Ridley roar]

He was also featured in videos leading up to Metroid Samus Returns' release:

(The latter video was hidden until after release)

For the Uniqlo 2017 competition, it was Ridley that was selected for the video as part of the promotion. More notably, Ridley (in his Meta form) was placed alongside Bowser, Ganondorf, and King Dedede:

(Play from 0:36)

Nintendo are also fully aware of people wanting Ridley playable in Super Smash Bros. They made a slight "joke" about it in Nintendo Badge Arcade:

Ridley was also used to promote the NES Mini, via its respective websites:

https://www.nintendo.com/nes-classic/

https://www.nintendo.co.uk/Misc-/Ni...ni-Nintendo-Entertainment-System-1124287.html

There are also third party companies that are also aware of Ridley and his popularity, who have nothing to do with Nintendo or even video games:

He was used as an icon in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns. The trait is named "Smash Brawler".

Homestar Runner also used Ridley (a silhouette of his sprite):

Neither Bowser or Ganondorf had this fun little thing.

We've also got this coming:

First 4 Figures will have to discuss with Nintendo if there are any changes needed, and about technical things, but they're hoping to have it up for pre-order this year.

 

[Morbi]

Ok, so let's count all the characters from Metroid that could be added to Smash but never will because having Samus 2 times is already too much for Sakurai:

1. Ridley
2. Sylux
3. Dark Samus
4. ???

To be fair, if two Samus was too hot for Sakurai, a third Samus would definitely be out of the question. So... It is basically just Ridley because Sylux was not important until recently... And even then, that still has yet to be determined. I thought that was why we were here.

 

[IronTed]

Zem-raj that's an incredible compiliation. Nintendo may have few villains, but Ridley is definitely a significant one. Hopefully he'll be in Prime 4 as well.

 

[SmashKeks]

Ok, so let's count all the characters from Metroid that could be added to Smash but never will because having Samus 2 times is already too much for Sakurai:

1. Ridley
2. Sylux
3. Dark Samus
4. ???

With each new Smash game moving farther away from his single appearance, making him increasingly less and less relevant, his chances are likely negligible at this point, but during Smash 4 when Metroid characters came up, every once in a while I'd see someone suggest Rundas for Smash. And yeah he'd be pretty cool. A running and gunning ice fighter sounds unique enough, so long as all his moves didn't freeze at high %s, that'd be ridiculous.

 

[Danpal65]

Guys, you are all forgetting that Little Birdie is the most likely new comer. That way Sakurai can please Ridley fans by including him as a Final Smash

That would honestly be awful and hilarious…

Aside from the other Hunters there really is not many other characters to include, unless they wanted to do a generic Federation Grunt or maybe Anthony from Other M. So in summation, Ridley is the only good choice aside from Sylux.

 

[AndreaAC]

xD I saw a comment about Ridley being in Dark Souls, so the first thing that came to mind is that he encounters Ornstein the Dragonslayer.

Just a doodle for fun :3

 

[KingBroly]

My feeling is that Nintendo doesn't understand Metroid, or its' popularity. Fans and third parties have more respect for the series than Nintendo does.

Ridley was in Miitomo because Sakamoto was in charge of Miitomo. It's not some mythical 'we respect Metroid' thing, either.

The series has no new ideas. Seriously. And I don't feel like anyone is trying to, either.

 

[Retroend]

I think it helps that with Ridley, I don't think he has been off the radar for Nintendo.

For the Metroid promotion on Miitomo in 2016, Ridley was selected alongside accessories from Samus, Zero Suit Samus, and the Baby Metroid. Ridley was a pet, and came with 5 variations:

It is worth noting that Kirby, a character who already has different colour variations (often used for multiplayer purposes), didn't get any variations in Miitomo (there was only one of him). You'd think that Ridley would be the one to only get one version of himself as a pet at a push, and that Kirby would be the one who got the variations. No one expected Ridley in this app. The two of the variation colours, cyan and black, are new - they aren't really based on anything as far as I can tell.

Ridley was selected for promoting Metroid in the Villains takeover US eShop promotion in 2014, not Mother Brain.

Ridley was selected for a space on both Nintendo Monopoly boards, not Mother Brain.

Ridley was also part of a promotion for Nintendo Badge Arcade:

Ridley was in Metroid Samus Returns, despite not being in Metroid II: Return of Samus:

Nintendo also hyped up his return and boss fight before release:

"Vengeance has a name" [Ridley roar]

He was also featured in videos leading up to Metroid Samus Returns' release:

(The latter video was hidden until after release)

For the Uniqlo 2017 competition, it was Ridley that was selected for the video as part of the promotion. More notably, Ridley (in his Meta form) was placed alongside Bowser, Ganondorf, and King Dedede:

(Play from 0:36)

Nintendo are also fully aware of people wanting Ridley playable in Super Smash Bros. They made a slight "joke" about it in Nintendo Badge Arcade:

Ridley was also used to promote the NES Mini, via its respective websites:

https://www.nintendo.com/nes-classic/

https://www.nintendo.co.uk/Misc-/Ni...ni-Nintendo-Entertainment-System-1124287.html

There are also third party companies that are also aware of Ridley and his popularity, who have nothing to do with Nintendo or even video games:

He was used as an icon in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns. The trait is named "Smash Brawler".

Homestar Runner also used Ridley (a silhouette of his sprite):

Neither Bowser or Ganondorf had this fun little thing.

We've also got this coming:

First 4 Figures will have to discuss with Nintendo if there are any changes needed, and about technical things, but they're hoping to have it up for pre-order this year.

sheesh a lot of stuff for ridley. hopefully sakurai is paying attention.

 

[StormC]

Probably already well worn territory, but I thought the comparison was interesting.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Here's an interesting thought I had: For those of you who watch tournaments/play competitive Smash, If Ridley made it into Smash, where on the tier list would you like to see him? Would it be good if he was an S tier fighter who everyone in top 30 had a pocket of, or would that make him oversaturated and boring? Would it be more hype if he were lower tier, so you can be excited when someone shows up and boldly puts a Ridley on the table? Would a nice middle ground between C-A tier be good, where he's not used everywhere, but is somewhat common because he's a solid choice who isn't just super good or bad with his kit?

If Ridley was a really good S tier character, would you feel kind of bad using him he was perceived to be/was mechanically easy to pick up and use? Or do you think he would be an S tier who is only really good once you really nail down his mechanics and how he works? Then again a steep learning curve might dissuade people from mass picking him up, thus making him place lower anyways.

Here's another question I had: So with the Smash Bros. E3 invitational tournament just announced, of course people are thinking back to the invitational Nintendo held in 2014 at E3 for Smash 4. In that tournament, 20 characters were available, with 6 newcomers playable at the event in Rosalina, Greninja, Little Mac, Villager, Wii Fir Trainer, and Megaman.

So, with that in mind, odds are this invitational will receive a similar treatment: a small sample of characters to play, with a few newcomers thrown in. Inklings is probably a very safer bet for repping the newcomers, and if I had to wager a guess, an Arms rep (probably Springman) would take up a second spot. Assuming four more spots remain, what do you think the chances are that Nintendo would rep Ridley as a playable character for the Invitational?

Tier-wise, I would prefer more of a middle-ground for Ridley. He's combo food due to his hitbox, but his recovery and aerial attacks/combos make him a high-risk high-payoff type.

Unless they have some big third party character planned to announce at E3 (surely there will be Smash news at E3), I could see the event as a good opportunity to revealing Ridley — Even more if Ridley is a relevant character in Metroid Prime 4, and he might as well be. It would be super cool if they could tie in a Ridley announcement to a Metroid Prime 4 trailer featuring the space dragon.

A girl can dream.

It is of my belief that Ridley isn't that big of a character (no pun intended) for an E3 announcement, if they have any third party newcomers for Smash Switch. If not, I can't imagine any first party character that would be as interesting. Some drab Fire Emblem character? Nah. Ridley is the one big antagonist who isn't in the game yet as a playable character. We got Bowser, Ganon, there is Mewtwo who is not a villain, but people love to paint it that way, Dedede (also not a villain, but let's count him). So that leaves Metroid... and Kid Icarus, but let's face it, we will probably get another KI rep in Smash Switch. I'd like Medusa, but Hades is more popular, so... Well, he is a funny character, I can dig it.

So that leaves Metroid and Ridley is the one. The one. Not only he appears in most Metroid games, he is the arch-nemesis of the main character, he looks cool as hell. He is iconic. And on top of that, he is now a meme thanks to Ridley supporters being disappointed over and over again, to the point the developers went as far as make fun of the supporters.

So, assuming for a moment Sakurai let go of his bias and actually added Ridley to the roster (unlikely, he probably added three Fire Emblem lords instead), unless they have some big third party character to announce (something like a Dark Souls or I don't know, Resident Evil character... Jill pls), I can't imagine a bigger character to reveal at an E3 Nintendo Direct other than Ridley.

I would be as happy as I was when Mega Man and Villager were announced, that is for sure.

Again, a girl can dream.

For Ridley's gameplay, I think a mix of Hisako's gameplay (Killer Instinct) with bits of Ridley's unique capabilities such as flying would make for something interesting.

"Hisako is normally a very slow character, possessing a walk speed even slower than Aganos', but she has powerful strikes and her strategy focuses on counterattacks. She has a fast forward dash perfect for rushing the opponent and can jump off of the walls of the stage for mix-ups"

Hmm... Maybe.

I guess I could see that with Hisako. Perhaps most of all though, like how Gargos laughs at the whole wingspan argument, tho I realize Killer Instinct is a completely different beast from Smash with all the unhinged playstyles and characters that come in all shapes and sizes. Still, a playable Ridley could take some notes from Gargos too. Not the annoying minion summons, although Ridley summoning a couple space pirates would be amusing, but the aerial attacks and movement approach options I mean. Perhaps the skin-hardening ability Ridley's had too, but less cheap than Gargos' stone-skin ability. IDK, just randomly brainstorming at this point...

I think it helps that with Ridley, I don't think he has been off the radar for Nintendo.

For the Metroid promotion on Miitomo in 2016, Ridley was selected alongside accessories from Samus, Zero Suit Samus, and the Baby Metroid. Ridley was a pet, and came with 5 variations:

It is worth noting that Kirby, a character who already has different colour variations (often used for multiplayer purposes), didn't get any variations in Miitomo (there was only one of him). You'd think that Ridley would be the one to only get one version of himself as a pet at a push, and that Kirby would be the one who got the variations. No one expected Ridley in this app. The two of the variation colours, cyan and black, are new - they aren't really based on anything as far as I can tell.

Ridley was selected for promoting Metroid in the Villains takeover US eShop promotion in 2014, not Mother Brain.

Ridley was selected for a space on both Nintendo Monopoly boards, not Mother Brain.

Ridley was also part of a promotion for Nintendo Badge Arcade:

Ridley was in Metroid Samus Returns, despite not being in Metroid II: Return of Samus:

Nintendo also hyped up his return and boss fight before release:

"Vengeance has a name" [Ridley roar]

He was also featured in videos leading up to Metroid Samus Returns' release:

(The latter video was hidden until after release)

For the Uniqlo 2017 competition, it was Ridley that was selected for the video as part of the promotion. More notably, Ridley (in his Meta form) was placed alongside Bowser, Ganondorf, and King Dedede:

(Play from 0:36)

Nintendo are also fully aware of people wanting Ridley playable in Super Smash Bros. They made a slight "joke" about it in Nintendo Badge Arcade:

Ridley was also used to promote the NES Mini, via its respective websites:

https://www.nintendo.com/nes-classic/

https://www.nintendo.co.uk/Misc-/Ni...ni-Nintendo-Entertainment-System-1124287.html

There are also third party companies that are also aware of Ridley and his popularity, who have nothing to do with Nintendo or even video games:

He was used as an icon in Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns. The trait is named "Smash Brawler".

Homestar Runner also used Ridley (a silhouette of his sprite):

Neither Bowser or Ganondorf had this fun little thing.

We've also got this coming:

First 4 Figures will have to discuss with Nintendo if there are any changes needed, and about technical things, but they're hoping to have it up for pre-order this year.

Well put. Things like the meme status or the self-defeatist culture that many have conditioned themselves to live with (after getting the raw end of the deal from Smash speculation a number of times I guess) can often make it easy to forget how great Ridley has actually had it in recent times. I think he has a promising future ahead regardless of Smash, and now that I'll be getting some income again on account of my recent job, can see myself getting the F4F thing even more now than I did before. lol

My feeling is that Nintendo doesn't understand Metroid, or its' popularity. Fans and third parties have more respect for the series than Nintendo does.

Ridley was in Miitomo because Sakamoto was in charge of Miitomo. It's not some mythical 'we respect Metroid' thing, either.

The series has no new ideas. Seriously. And I don't feel like anyone is trying to, either.

There may be some truth to this sadly, though for now people are just glad that Metroid's back, with an entry that isn't another space turd, even if it's a remake. MP4, will have to see on...

Probably already well worn territory, but I thought the comparison was interesting.

Well worn territory? Oh you have no idea... Usually came down to Bowser's sizes fluctuating due to magic while Ridley's been consistently the same for the most part, iirc.

 

[Cosmic77]

My feeling is that Nintendo doesn't understand Metroid, or its' popularity. Fans and third parties have more respect for the series than Nintendo does.

Ridley was in Miitomo because Sakamoto was in charge of Miitomo. It's not some mythical 'we respect Metroid' thing, either.

The series has no new ideas. Seriously. And I don't feel like anyone is trying to, either.

I think Nintendo understands Metroid's popularity overseas to an extent. There wasn't really a reason to reveal Prime 4 at last year's E3, yet they teased it anyway. Obviously they wouldn't have shown the game off this early if they didn't think it had the potential to get more people to pay attention to the Switch in its first year. Clearly it worked, as Prime 4 reactions were some of the most popular YouTube videos watched during E3.

Nintendo acknowledges Metroid as one of their older, more iconic IPs, and although they really want to see it succeed, they aren't quite sure how to accomplish that without risking losing a profit. It's sort of like how you would feel if someone gave you a 100 dollar bill and told you to find a way to double it. You have this extremely valuable thing in your hands, but you don't know what steps you should take to make it worth even more.

 

[IronTed]

My feeling is that Nintendo doesn't understand Metroid, or its' popularity. Fans and third parties have more respect for the series than Nintendo does.

Ridley was in Miitomo because Sakamoto was in charge of Miitomo. It's not some mythical 'we respect Metroid' thing, either.

The series has no new ideas. Seriously. And I don't feel like anyone is trying to, either.

It's more apathy than anything. And I doubt Nintendo uses the htperbolized Internet echo chamber when making these decisions anyway.

But did you not play Samus Returns? It did have new ideas, and there is still definitely interest in the IP.

 

[KingBroly]

It's more apathy than anything. And I doubt Nintendo uses the htperbolized Internet echo chamber when making these decisions anyway.

But did you not play Samus Returns? It did have new ideas, and there is still definitely interest in the IP.

I did play it. But Nintendo didn't make it. And because of that, the problem of new ideas coming from Nintendo are only going to get worse. I can't tell you how many "new" ideas that were in there that were simply pulled from other games doing it first.

 

[Morbi]

I think Nintendo understands Metroid's popularity overseas to an extent. There wasn't really a reason to reveal Prime 4 at last year's E3, yet they teased it anyway. Obviously they wouldn't have shown the game off this early if they didn't think it had the potential to get more people to pay attention to the Switch in its first year. Clearly it worked, as Prime 4 reactions were some of the most popular YouTube videos watched during E3.

Nintendo acknowledges Metroid as one of their older, more iconic IPs, and although they really want to see it succeed, they aren't quite sure how to accomplish that without risking losing a profit. It's sort of like how you would feel if someone gave you a 100 dollar bill and told you to find a way to double it. You have this extremely valuable thing in your hands, but you don't know what steps you should take to make it worth even more.

To be fair, recognizing popularity and discerning WHY are two independent thoughts. And I honestly have to agree with him, I doubt Nintendo understands why. The same could be said for Star Fox, really, and seeing what happened there relative to what happened to Metroid, it scares me a bit.

All I know is a good start, at making money, would be to have the developers who produced arguably the best trilogy in gaming make the fourth. So... We are already off to a bad start. Unless you count Federation Forces as the start, which, by the way, in general definitely shows that they have no idea what to do with the franchise. I have heard it was moderately good; however, with the decisions they went with, it was dead on arrival, obviously.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

To be fair, when was the last time a Metroid was made by Nintendo’s in-house dev team(s)? MercurySteam was one of the best things that could’ve happened to the series under the circumstances. Perfect recovery after what we got from Team Ninja...

Namco I’m fine with on MP4 assuming the rumor’s true. It’s Tanabe at the helm whether you had them or Retro either way, so it’s whatever. Also, the current team of Retro =/= the Retro from the early 2000’s.

 

[Morbi]

To be fair, when was the last time a Metroid was made by Nintendo’s in-house Nintendo dev team(s)? MercurySteam was one of the best things that could’ve happened to the series under the circumstances. Perfect recovery after what we got from Team Ninja...

Namco I’m fine with on MP4 assuming the rumor’s true. It’s Tanabe at the helm whether you had them or Retro either way, so it’s whatever. Also, the current team of Retro =/= the Retro from the early 2000’s.

Fair enough; however, I really do not have faith in Namco regardless and this "newer" Retro did relatively well with Tropical Freeze. I suppose I would need to see what they were allocated to instead. If it is something lame, I guess Nintendo did not have faith in them, if not, it would more or less confirm my fears.

 

[KingBroly]

To be fair, when was the last time a Metroid was made by Nintendo’s in-house dev team(s)? MercurySteam was one of the best things that could’ve happened to the series under the circumstances. Perfect recovery after what we got from Team Ninja...

Namco I’m fine with on MP4 assuming the rumor’s true. It’s Tanabe at the helm whether you had them or Retro either way, so it’s whatever. Also, the current team of Retro =/= the Retro from the early 2000’s.

eh...I dunno about that one. Samus Returns was eh for me, and I'm not happy about screwing with canon AGAIN with what it does just to fit one guy's whims who can't keep it straight. Even though Ridley is better than Roidley.

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Fair enough.

And to be honest I’ve kinda stopped caring as much as to what Retro’s gonna do next, when you keep people waiting this long... Would prefer it be their 3rd DKC though, thus having a trilogy.

Namco’s generally done more good for me than bad, so I could give them the benefit of a doubt at least with MP4.

 

[IronTed]

I did play it. But Nintendo didn't make it. And because of that, the problem of new ideas coming from Nintendo are only going to get worse. I can't tell you how many "new" ideas that were in there that were simply pulled from other games doing it first.

There were new ideas, whether or not you like them is besides the point. By that logic the original Metroid itself just copied what previous games did, nothing new there.

And is Metroid Prime not good now, considering it wasn't internally developed? We can disagree on Samus Returns, I can respect not liking it, but being internally developed doesn't automatically make something better.

Edit: Sorry, I conflated words. Disregard my former sentence I removed

 

[Morbi]

There were new ideas, whether or not you like them is besides the point. By that logic the original Metroid itself just copied what previous games did, nothing new there.

And is Metroid Prime not good now, considering it wasn't internally developed? We can disagree on Samus Returns, I can respect not liking it, but being internally developed doesn't automatically make something better.

Edit: Sorry, I conflated words. Disregard my former sentence I removed

Not necessarily, a game is an amalgam of ideas. No one idea is completely original (at least not any more); however, his point was what little Samus Returns offered... And I assume you are talking about the melee counter or maybe the weird free-fire, is not enough relative to the series as a whole. I definitely agree.

 

[KingBroly]

There were new ideas, whether or not you like them is besides the point. By that logic the original Metroid itself just copied what previous games did, nothing new there.

And is Metroid Prime not good now, considering it wasn't internally developed? We can disagree on Samus Returns, I can respect not liking it, but being internally developed doesn't automatically make something better.

Edit: Sorry, I conflated words. Disregard my former sentence I removed

Metroid Prime is good, but the problem you're seeing with Metroid from Nintendo is a lack of cohesive creative thought driving it internally. While MercurySteam might have new ideas, you're only going to get them if you go back to them. Same with Retro. Because you don't have an internal team driving it behind the scenes, new ideas come and go and are lost due to that lack of structure.

 

[IronTed]

Metroid Prime is good, but the problem you're seeing with Metroid from Nintendo is a lack of cohesive creative thought driving it internally. While MercurySteam might have new ideas, you're only going to get them if you go back to them. Same with Retro. Because you don't have an internal team driving it behind the scenes, new ideas come and go and are lost due to that lack of structure.

Ahh, I see what you mean, and I cannot disagree. Without a long term team, cohesion is very difficult.

It really is a shame R&D1 no longer exists.

Morbi I mean, new doesn't mean reinventing the wheel, I assumed it was meant in the context of Metroid games specifically. Small as free aiming and melee countering are, those are still bigger combat changes than anything Fusion or Zero Mission gave us (to be fair the latter was a remake). At this point 2D Metroid is defined, and we'll never see games as consequential as RoS or Super again.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

An unpopular opinion I'm sure, but I'm happy Retro aren't developing Prime 4, and I actually feared that they would as I thought the Prime trilogy got progressively worse. Prime 1 was a masterpiece, Prime 2 was great despite its flaws, and Prime 3 was just bang average. I felt that the series began to lose touch with its fundamentals once Retro had made a name for themselves and the reins were loosened, most of their own innovations didn't really come off (ammo, dark world, hyper mode, gunship), and Prime 3 was a game that was beginning to move the series into a more linear and story driven approach, which even then didn't really work. Not to discredit Retro's developers at the time, they did a fantastic job at transitioning the series into 3D in a very bold way (first person adventure), but I also think that a lot of their success is owed to the fundamentals that Metroid and Super Metroid originally laid down, they refined the formular so well for the first game, but once they began moving away from it the quality of the games suffered. This of course this begs the question of how much of this criticism can also be applied to Tanabe, which I'm sure some of it can, but at the very least he's going to be able to tackle Prime 4 from a fresh angle.

I don't think Metroid should be experimented heavily with atm as it's in a very delicate situation. I thought Samus Returns played its cards right in that regard, and by the sounds of it Prime 4 is going to go back to Prime 1's style instead of building on Prime 3, which is exactly the right thing to do imo. If the series can finally root itself into a safe position again, then we can begin talking about how it should evolve, but until then one mistake could send it into yet another hiatus. There are a few Nintendo franchises I think that could use new ideas, or even a sweeping overhaul, and I'm very happy they've done it with Mario and Zelda, but right now Metroid isn't one of them.

As for Namco, I trust them just fine, and I hope that with this being their first take on a Metroid game there'll be a lot of passion and excitement around the project, I think that's one of the most important factors in great games coming to life.

 

[Reila]

Prime 3 was the best one.

That said, I am glad Retro isn't working on Metroid, because that means they can work on something else, instead of Metroid for the fourth time.

 

[Morbi]

An unpopular opinion I'm sure, but I'm happy Retro aren't developing Prime 4, and I actually feared that they would as I thought the Prime trilogy got progressively worse. Prime 1 was a masterpiece, Prime 2 was great despite its flaws, and Prime 3 was just bang average. I felt that the series began to lose touch with its fundamentals once Retro had made a name for themselves and the reins were loosened, most of their own innovations didn't really come off (ammo, dark world, hyper mode, gunship), and Prime 3 was a game that was beginning to move the series into a more linear and story driven approach, which even then didn't really work. Not to discredit Retro's developers at the time, they did a fantastic job at transitioning the series into 3D in a very bold way (first person adventure), but I also think that a lot of their success is owed to the fundamentals that Metroid and Super Metroid originally laid down, they refined the formular so well for the first game, but once they began moving away from it the quality of the games suffered. This of course this begs the question of how much of this criticism can also be applied to Tanabe, which I'm sure some of it can, but at the very least he's going to be able to tackle Prime 4 from a fresh angle.

I don't think Metroid should be experimented heavily with atm as it's in a very delicate situation. I thought Samus Returns played its cards right in that regard, and by the sounds of it Prime 4 is going to go back to Prime 1's style instead of building on Prime 3, which is exactly the right thing to do imo. If the series can finally root itself into a safe position again, then we can begin talking about how it should evolve, but until then one mistake could send it into yet another hiatus. There are a few Nintendo franchises I think that could use new ideas, or even a sweeping overhaul, and I'm very happy they've done it with Mario and Zelda, but right now Metroid isn't one of them.

As for Namco, I trust them just fine, and I hope that with them being presented with a Metroid game for the first time there'll be a lot of passion and excitement around the project.

I am in the same boat. I enjoyed Prime the best, followed by Echoes, and Corruption as my least favorite. That being said, for me, the difference was fairly negligible as I still loved Corruption. And for my sister, it was the opposite, really, she preferred them as time went on and Corruption is her favorite with Prime being her least favorite.

Nah, I do not agree at all in that regard. The fundamentals meant very little in the transition to 3D. They had their work cut out for them, in my opinion.

It is just like in movies, if it is good, the director gets all the credit. If it is bad, the director takes the biggest fall. That being said, most vision related content, such as the direction to go more story orientated, was obviously influenced by his call, more than anything. Whether that is good or bad, obviously depends on who you talk to.

That is the question. Do I want them to play it safe with Metroid Prime 4, or do I want some innovation? Hard to decide, honestly. I more or less agree with your position. But at the same time, will it be enough? Will that stand in today's market?

 

[Ridley_Prime]

Prime 2 was the black sheep of the trilogy for me (for people it’s usually either that or Prime 3), but I agree with the overall message of the above post(s) regardless.

 

[IronTed]

Echoes will forever be my favorite of the trilogy, despite it's flaws. I would be very glad if Prime 4 were to be similar, even if that's very unlikely.

 

[Morbi]

Echoes will forever be my favorite of the trilogy, despite it's flaws. I would be very glad if Prime 4 were to be similar, even if that's very unlikely.

It might be if they try and find an overarching sort of gimmick. I do not want to use the word gimmick, but if they can find a mechanic that diversifies game-play significantly, it could play more like Echoes than Prime.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

Echoes had the best boss battles, I'll give it that, even without a Ridley fight. The sheer scale of battles like Amorbis and Quadraxis was great, and then there also were Chykka, Emperor Ing, and the multiple Dark Samus encounters. The Spider Guardian though, **** that.

 

[DefinitelyNotSascha]

Metroid is in dire need of reps in Smash, and Ridley is the only one that's really suitable. And he wasn't even that big in Super Metroid and the opening of Melee. And besides, what other Metroid-characters could you take?

Mother Brain? Okay, you could make her move around in a glass and have her shoot lasers but itw would still be a bit weird. I still like the idea of it though.

Dark Samus? Yeah, she well known enough, but does she have enough unique moves to set her apart from regular Samus?

Kraid? Now that one is certainly way too large.

Sylux or Rundas? Are there seriously people who think that these two are even remotely iconic enough?

 

[Dalek_Kolt]

I just signed back into Smashboards for the first time in four years. Nice to see that this character thread is as popular as ever (though the numbers and views being comparable to Daisy of all characters is eyebrow-raising)
...
What the hey, before the game gets released and I slink back into the shadows, I'll back this metaphorical horse, though I'm not planning on being as conspiracy theorist-levels of analytical as I was in the Smash 4 days.

I guess I should actually talk about Ridley himself? I want him to play like he did in Samus Returns but with a nerfed fireball attack, limited infinite flight, and smaller size. Give him the Marx treatment.