List of things to buff Mewtwo

[meleebrawler]

It's just that I'm kind of mad that pretty much every character has one except for some. And, personally, I think it'd make Mewtwo easier to learn as well... which I don't want his high learning curve going away from him.

I was thinking it could perhaps semi-spike for real tech-chases if not a combo throw.

 

[Metalex]

420quickscoper Well i don't think a combo throw would Mewtwo's learning curve much easier but rather add more interesting options for him. Dthrow doesn't necessarily need to be a combo throw though, but i think it needs some kind of change since at the moment there's barely any uses for it except that you can get reads from it at low percents, and occasionaly throw the opponent on platforms.
meleebrawler That sounds like a very good idea, it would definitely make the throw have more interesting uses.

 

[420quickscoper]

I was thinking it could perhaps semi-spike for real tech-chases if not a combo throw.

Sounds like a wonderful idea :3

Personally, I want Mewtwo to have some of his attacks come out faster. His fsmash is a prime example of this. Sometimes I fsmash, I see the animation but it doesn't hit and my opponent hits me first.

 

[BarSoapSoup]

Is it silly of me to ask if Mewtwo's grab had a significantly larger range? He is a Psychic-type Pokemon. Ranged attacking ought to be a characteristic of him, even in a game like Smash Brothers. I am not saying we need something as big as Pac-Man or Samus's grab, but something that will definitely make Mewtwo's grab range a little higher level than Ganondorf's..

On another note, you can't grab someone after using confusion on them. If you wanna follow it up, you pretty much have to use D-Tilt, or D-Smash if you could even pull it off. The move in general needs better competitive purposes because rn the only reason I ever use it as much as I do is to ward off projectile spam.

 

[Furret24]

Is it silly of me to ask if Mewtwo's grab had a significantly larger range? He is a Psychic-type Pokemon. Ranged attacking ought to be a characteristic of him, even in a game like Smash Brothers. I am not saying we need something as big as Pac-Man or Samus's grab, but something that will definitely make Mewtwo's grab range a little higher level than Ganondorf's..

On another note, you can't grab someone after using confusion on them. If you wanna follow it up, you pretty much have to use D-Tilt, or D-Smash if you could even pull it off. The move in general needs better competitive purposes because rn the only reason I ever use it as much as I do is to ward off projectile spam.

Pac-Man's grab range is deceptively bad actually. It only goes 2/3 of the beam.

 

[Dark Phazon]

I know this is crazy of topic but please if anyone can answer this question please do im posting this here first because atleast its in a pokemon character thread.

Question: I sold my 3DS about a year back but before i did i transferred all my Pokes to PokeBank.

Im thinking of getting back into pokemon but pretty much depends on if i can get my pokes back...? Is it possible? Is so how?

 

[BarSoapSoup]

Pac-Man's grab range is deceptively bad actually. It only goes 2/3 of the beam.

Still, I feel a grab range buff could really help Mootoo

 

[meleebrawler]

Is it silly of me to ask if Mewtwo's grab had a significantly larger range? He is a Psychic-type Pokemon. Ranged attacking ought to be a characteristic of him, even in a game like Smash Brothers. I am not saying we need something as big as Pac-Man or Samus's grab, but something that will definitely make Mewtwo's grab range a little higher level than Ganondorf's..

On another note, you can't grab someone after using confusion on them. If you wanna follow it up, you pretty much have to use D-Tilt, or D-Smash if you could even pull it off. The move in general needs better competitive purposes because rn the only reason I ever use it as much as I do is to ward off projectile spam.

Confusion has plenty of use that isn't related to attacking, you know. It's just a defensive move first an foremost. As for the grab immunity afterwards, I'd imagine it's to prevent possible chaingrab shenanigans with grab release and jab.

 

[MagiusNecros]

I know this is crazy of topic but please if anyone can answer this question please do im posting this here first because atleast its in a pokemon character thread.

Question: I sold my 3DS about a year back but before i did i transferred all my Pokes to PokeBank.

Im thinking of getting back into pokemon but pretty much depends on if i can get my pokes back...? Is it possible? Is so how?

If you kept your subscription up you can link your new 3DS to your Wii U ID and should be able to transfer your Pokemon over to a new game that it is compatible with Poke bank. Otherwise you are out of luck.

 

[Furret24]

Still, I feel a grab range buff could really help Mootoo

I'd rather have a functional grab first. Half the time I try to grab a short character (like Pikachu), it'll miss, even at point blank.

 

[Smashifer]

I'd rather have a functional grab first. Half the time I try to grab a short character (like Pikachu), it'll miss, even at point blank.

I can relate super hard to this, maining both Mewtwo and Wii Fit Trainer. I honestly don't care if d-throw becomes a combo throw or not, I just want to be able to grab someone without always having to do Jab1 first just to make sure I can get one off.
Also obligatory weight buffs pls

 

[Dark Phazon]

If you kept your subscription up you can link your new 3DS to your Wii U ID and should be able to transfer your Pokemon over to a new game that it is compatible with Poke bank. Otherwise you are out of luck.

Hmmmm.... is there anyway i check if my PokeBank is still valid/running?
I got a WiiU with the same ID i was using when i had my 3DS

 

[LoveGame]

Hey fam, haven't posted on SB in a whole minute, had some Mewtwo-related thoughts that I figured might go better in this thread than making my own about it.

So I'm primarily a Melee/PM guy, but wouldn't mind getting more into Smash 4. I haven't played in a whole minute (was more active last year tbh), but there it is still sitting on my shelf. For those who don't know me, I'm a vehement, dedicated Mewtwo main (especially in PM) and I reeeeally want to main him in 4.

However, I understand that he's considered among the absolute worst in terms of competitive play. I have messed around with him in friendlies and online since I got the free Mewtwo code thing back when it released, so I know his moveset decently, but it seems like Smash 4's balance is mocking me. Most of the top tier characters (Sheik, Rosalina, Zero Skill Samus ) are ones that I generally hate in and out of Smash and their playstyles do nothing for me. Sadly, my secondaries, as far as I understand, are also considered generally unviable ().

M2's playstyle tailors perfectly to how I play (and he's just generally my favorite character), but I fear I'm wasting time maining him if he's going to continue to be the worst character. I don't fully understand why they would choose him to be the "intentionally bad" character like Pichu in Melee. Should I just not play Smash 4? Should I wait around for a potential buff? Or is there something that can be done to advance his metagame to stand a chance against the higher tiers?

Just looking for opinions fam.

 

[Xzsmmc]

I don't fully understand why they would choose him to be the "intentionally bad" character like Pichu in Melee

Well, they really went for the Melee nostalgia for him, with his new actor imitating the old one, and having his old victory poses and such. Maybe they remembered he sucked in Melee, and decided to do the same here.

Or more likely, Sakurai and his team are ****ing stupid when it comes to balance.

 

[Smashifer]

Hey fam, haven't posted on SB in a whole minute, had some Mewtwo-related thoughts that I figured might go better in this thread than making my own about it.

So I'm primarily a Melee/PM guy, but wouldn't mind getting more into Smash 4. I haven't played in a whole minute (was more active last year tbh), but there it is still sitting on my shelf. For those who don't know me, I'm a vehement, dedicated Mewtwo main (especially in PM) and I reeeeally want to main him in 4.

However, I understand that he's considered among the absolute worst in terms of competitive play. I have messed around with him in friendlies and online since I got the free Mewtwo code thing back when it released, so I know his moveset decently, but it seems like Smash 4's balance is mocking me. Most of the top tier characters (Sheik, Rosalina, Zero Skill Samus ) are ones that I generally hate in and out of Smash and their playstyles do nothing for me. Sadly, my secondaries, as far as I understand, are also considered generally unviable ().

M2's playstyle tailors perfectly to how I play (and he's just generally my favorite character), but I fear I'm wasting time maining him if he's going to continue to be the worst character. I don't fully understand why they would choose him to be the "intentionally bad" character like Pichu in Melee. Should I just not play Smash 4? Should I wait around for a potential buff? Or is there something that can be done to advance his metagame to stand a chance against the higher tiers?

Just looking for opinions fam.

Well, the most obvious thing is to wait for the buff which I think is inevitable, even if it's a small one. Mewtwo, or any of the "bad" characters will end up getting buffs with enough of a cry to Sakurai, and I think Mewtwo is the best example for this, considering how much he butchered the psychic-cat thingy.

But honestly, if you really like how M2 plays, then do so. That's what I do, at least. Same goes for any character you play. The way I see it, if you genuinely have fun with that character, it doesn't matter whether or not they "suck", because if you can get that character to shine, you might just turn some heads and let them see what your character can really do.

As of now, you could wait until Cloud's update get released and hope for a buff that makes him viable, or you could train to get
a better understanding of M2, his moves, combos, etc.

If this doesn't work, I apologize. I've only ever played Sm4sh, so I don't know the troubles of switching from one game's character to the other.

But hey, I hope I helped!

 

[meleebrawler]

Hey fam, haven't posted on SB in a whole minute, had some Mewtwo-related thoughts that I figured might go better in this thread than making my own about it.

So I'm primarily a Melee/PM guy, but wouldn't mind getting more into Smash 4. I haven't played in a whole minute (was more active last year tbh), but there it is still sitting on my shelf. For those who don't know me, I'm a vehement, dedicated Mewtwo main (especially in PM) and I reeeeally want to main him in 4.

However, I understand that he's considered among the absolute worst in terms of competitive play. I have messed around with him in friendlies and online since I got the free Mewtwo code thing back when it released, so I know his moveset decently, but it seems like Smash 4's balance is mocking me. Most of the top tier characters (Sheik, Rosalina, Zero Skill Samus ) are ones that I generally hate in and out of Smash and their playstyles do nothing for me. Sadly, my secondaries, as far as I understand, are also considered generally unviable ().

M2's playstyle tailors perfectly to how I play (and he's just generally my favorite character), but I fear I'm wasting time maining him if he's going to continue to be the worst character. I don't fully understand why they would choose him to be the "intentionally bad" character like Pichu in Melee. Should I just not play Smash 4? Should I wait around for a potential buff? Or is there something that can be done to advance his metagame to stand a chance against the higher tiers?

Just looking for opinions fam.

People who say that Mewtwo is bottom 3 or among the worst generally don't actually know a whole lot about Mewtwo except his weight issues. Even if he was (he's really just low tier if anything), being bottom tier in Smash 4 is nowhere near as bad as in Melee/Brawl/PM. You won't find many 70:30s or any 80:20s at all.

You CAN beat the top tiers with Mewtwo, it won't be easy but it's nowhere near the mountain that is Melee's top tiers. He certainly doesn't seem intentionally bad, just that they overcompensated a bit with the nerfs to counteract the buffs (stronger smashes, strongest projectile, fixed specials).

Also, a character's position on the tier list doesn't really matter as much if you use them as a secondary. Roy seems like a fine choice for combatting characters like Fox and Falcon who give Mewtwo the largest amount of trouble (which is strong rushdown).

There are plenty of threads around here to help you if you're serious about maining Mewtwo, things like the combos he can pull or the strategies he can use or how best to use his tools etc. Perhaps it would be wise to wait for the patch if only so that you don't waste time learning things that might no longer work, but just waiting for buffs is a dangerous attitude to have.

 

[BarSoapSoup]

Should I just not play Smash 4?

Don't stop playing a game just because Mewtwo is a lower tier character. He is not competitively viable now but it doesn't mean he couldn't be later on I main Bowser and secondary Mewtwo, so I definitely feel the burn of always struggling against higher tier characters.

 

[LoveGame]

Don't stop playing a game just because Mewtwo is a lower tier character. He is not competitively viable now but it doesn't mean he couldn't be later on I main Bowser and secondary Mewtwo, so I definitely feel the burn of always struggling against higher tier characters.

I mainly had that thought because I refuse to play the current top tiers. And don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those guys who will refuse to play someone BECAUSE they are top tier. I play Pika in 64, Marth in Melee, Mewtwo/Wolf in PM, and Snake if I ever do play Brawl. It just so happened that the top tier characters this time around were ones I heavily disliked both as characters and as playstyles.

Interesting viewpoints, guys. And yeah, one thing I always think about is that this is the first Smash where it's possible for the worse characters to be at least decent mid-tiers with patching and the like. I think with enough outcry (ex. that video someone posted showing off Mewtwo's specific flaws, this very thread) we could get them at least somewhat fixed, especially for a character that was so long anticipated and that some people had to pay extra for.

Keep in mind I don't follow competitive Smash 4 even close to as much as I do Melee/PM, so all I don't know much beyond how incredibly boring it is to watch Sheik/Rosa/ZSS. If the "bad" MUs aren't as bad as Melee's for example, maybe I won't have as bad of a time?

 

[meleebrawler]

I mainly had that thought because I refuse to play the current top tiers. And don't get me wrong, I'm not one of those guys who will refuse to play someone BECAUSE they are top tier. I play Pika in 64, Marth in Melee, Mewtwo/Wolf in PM, and Snake if I ever do play Brawl. It just so happened that the top tier characters this time around were ones I heavily disliked both as characters and as playstyles.

Interesting viewpoints, guys. And yeah, one thing I always think about is that this is the first Smash where it's possible for the worse characters to be at least decent mid-tiers with patching and the like. I think with enough outcry (ex. that video someone posted showing off Mewtwo's specific flaws, this very thread) we could get them at least somewhat fixed, especially for a character that was so long anticipated and that some people had to pay extra for.

Keep in mind I don't follow competitive Smash 4 even close to as much as I do Melee/PM, so all I don't know much beyond how incredibly boring it is to watch Sheik/Rosa/ZSS. If the "bad" MUs aren't as bad as Melee's for example, maybe I won't have as bad of a time?

Indubitably. You'll see far less examples of Mewtwo getting waveshined or Marth fair walled into oblivion while he fails to retaliate or defend himself properly (that dang Melee tail). His defensive gameplan actually works now.

 

[RoyIsOurBoy_TTG]

Hey fam, haven't posted on SB in a whole minute, had some Mewtwo-related thoughts that I figured might go better in this thread than making my own about it.

So I'm primarily a Melee/PM guy, but wouldn't mind getting more into Smash 4. I haven't played in a whole minute (was more active last year tbh), but there it is still sitting on my shelf. For those who don't know me, I'm a vehement, dedicated Mewtwo main (especially in PM) and I reeeeally want to main him in 4.

However, I understand that he's considered among the absolute worst in terms of competitive play. I have messed around with him in friendlies and online since I got the free Mewtwo code thing back when it released, so I know his moveset decently, but it seems like Smash 4's balance is mocking me. Most of the top tier characters (Sheik, Rosalina, Zero Skill Samus ) are ones that I generally hate in and out of Smash and their playstyles do nothing for me. Sadly, my secondaries, as far as I understand, are also considered generally unviable ().

M2's playstyle tailors perfectly to how I play (and he's just generally my favorite character), but I fear I'm wasting time maining him if he's going to continue to be the worst character. I don't fully understand why they would choose him to be the "intentionally bad" character like Pichu in Melee. Should I just not play Smash 4? Should I wait around for a potential buff? Or is there something that can be done to advance his metagame to stand a chance against the higher tiers?

Just looking for opinions fam.

I don't care enough about Smash 4 to play a character that I don't like, which happens to be almost every character in the game. I play Mewtwo because I like Mewtwo, which is why I'm sticking with him in this game forever, even if I get nowhere. I'd rather get rekt using Mewtwo than get free wins using Shiek. But that's just me.

 

[godogod]

There's been a massive spike in Mewtwo buff topics on gamefaqs. I find that interesting.

 

[LRodC]

I was pessimistic about Mewtwo at one point, pointing out the flaws with him and praying for buffs just like a lot of people did. Hell, I made the damn video in the OP.

However, over time, I realized that was a toxic mindset to have and the sheer negativity was holding me back. I was too busy blaming the character for my mistakes instead of adapting and getting better. It was like "why use Mewtwo if you're going to be so pessimistic? Why not try and work around his mistakes if you enjoy playing as him"?

As meleebrawler said, waiting for buffs is a terrible mindset to have. They may not even happen and nothing is ever guaranteed. You work with the cards you have. If buffs come? Great, it's a gift. If they don't? It's not like you were expecting them in the first place.

 

[meleebrawler]

Here's some buff ideas that come from loads of experience instead of salty mishaps; I think his bair and uair could use a bit more base knockback, just to make them a bit safer at lower percents.

 

[AusGremlinBoy]

I think is side-b should have more hitstun personally.

 

[meleebrawler]

I think is side-b should have more hitstun personally.

Y'know it's still better than Melee where Mewtwo'd get hit for landing it no matter what. As it is having perfectly constant knockback would make it a little too good as a setup if it true comboed into anything.

 

[SuperSceptile15]

They should definitely buff Mewtwo so that embarrassing things like this can't happen.

EDIT: Never mind. This probably happens with other characters as well.

 

[meleebrawler]

They should definitely buff Mewtwo so that embarrassing things like this can't happen.

And how do you know Mewtwo is to blame for this? Can you reliably reproduce it? Does it work with other moves/characters as well? Can you even explain it?

 

[SuperSceptile15]

It's sad how Mewtwo is the worst out of all the DLC characters so far. He could definitely use more buffs like improvements to his weight and down special.

 

[RoyIsOurBoy_TTG]

They should definitely buff Mewtwo so that embarrassing things like this can't happen.

Shulk 2 broken pls nerf

 

[Kamtheman56]

The reason Shulk is able to avoid the Shadow Ball is because during his down taunt "This is the Monado's power!" he bends down lowering his hurtbox an I also believe he dips into the Z-Axis but that could be wrong.

 

[420quickscoper]

The reason Shulk is able to avoid the Shadow Ball is because during his down taunt "This is the Monado's power!" he bends down lowering his hurtbox an I also believe he dips into the Z-Axis but that could be wrong.

That's probably it.

 

[godogod]

Admin on smashbros-miiverse twitter asked what we think about Mewtwo..

https://twitter.com/SmashMiiverse/status/668477343544025088

Care to chime in guys? Maybe Sakurai will notice. I asked for buffs for weight, hitbox, and shadowball charged(limited to 140 characters). Or favorite my tweet.

edit: whoops I think this is fanmade twitter site.

 

[meleebrawler]

It's sad how Mewtwo is the worst out of all the DLC characters so far. He could definitely use more buffs like improvements to his weight and down special.

It's not really sad. SOMEBODY has to be the worst after all, it's inevitable.

Personally I like to think of Disable as a practical version of Falcon/Warlock Punch: tricky to land, but not impossibly difficult or ridiculously punishable.

 

[LRodC]

You have no idea how many people forget about Disable's existence. I've sealed plenty of stocks with it when people didn't see it coming.

 

[Karsticles]

It's not really sad. SOMEBODY has to be the worst after all, it's inevitable.

Personally I like to think of Disable as a practical version of Falcon/Warlock Punch: tricky to land, but not impossibly difficult or ridiculously punishable.

No, someone doesn't have to be the worst. In most balanced fighting games, there is no agreed-upon worst character, but there are still tiers.

 

[Smashifer]

No, someone doesn't have to be the worst. In most balanced fighting games, there is no agreed-upon worst character, but there are still tiers.

In that sense, there would be no "worst" just the character who's the least best in the cast, if that makes sense.

 

[godogod]

IMO, Mewtwo really should get a hitbox behind his downsmash like Lucas to hit foes behind him. Doesn't have to be as powerful as the front part, but I think he really needs it.

 

[GanonPawnch]

IMO, Mewtwo really should get a hitbox behind his downsmash like Lucas to hit foes behind him. Doesn't have to be as powerful as the front part, but I think he really needs it.

It needs more vertical range if anything. Go into training mode and down tilt mario at 0%, then immediately down smash, it doesn't connect. If you slow it down to 1/4 speed Mario is literally in the purple explosion... it has like no vertical range, at all.

 

[RoyIsOurBoy_TTG]

IMO, Mewtwo really should get a hitbox behind his downsmash like Lucas to hit foes behind him. Doesn't have to be as powerful as the front part, but I think he really needs it.

If you are asking for completely new hitboxes to be added to certain moves, then you are being incredibly unrealistic.

 

[godogod]

I'm suggesting. I'm not saying it would happen, but it should happen. Also, characters have gotten hitboxes removed, decreased and increased in size, so its not impossible for a character to get another hitbox. I guess having more vertical hitboxes would help too.. Or up tilt needs to be effective against rollers.

I do have another thought also.
if Mewtwo got his melee weight back(from 72 to 85) or even average like lucario(95-100), how much would that help his survivability? Does a meer 10 points in weight(from 72 to 82) makes him survive for 10% ore/longer his current weight? What exactly is the formula?

Has anyone ever made a chart of some sorts to gauge when characters can get KO'd by a Mario in FD in a certain percentage by an up/sidesmash?