Social Link checked the thread. Wow! This is a nice thread!

[Zelkam]

You know, I was afraid stuff like this was gonna happen. Let just hope that every AT doesn't get patched out of the game...

Also, the change to Link's tether really bums me out. It always irritated me that it fell to the ground in the smash games because it doesn't do that in the Zelda games. Not really a big deal, I know, but its still irritating.

 

[Wiley]

Just a stray Dark Lord stopping in to spell doom for you faerie loving green clad "heroes."

Perfection Tier


Link tier... etc. next page

 

[The Merc]

You know, I was afraid stuff like this was gonna happen. Let just hope that every AT doesn't get patched out of the game...

Also, the change to Link's tether really bums me out. It always irritated me that it fell to the ground in the smash games because it doesn't do that in the Zelda games. Not really a big deal, I know, but its still irritating.

Yeah I'm sort like that, but I understand why. If you look at early screenshots, you can see that Link's clawshot was meant to drop like in Brawl, but it seems that they might have to have change it because of limitation

But really, I don't mind whether it defines gravity or goes limp and drops, so long as Link and Toon Link have less end lag unlike Brawl where they stood there for 12 hours before they even start to retract them

 

[Lúcio]

You know, I was afraid stuff like this was gonna happen. Let just hope that every AT doesn't get patched out of the game...

Also, the change to Link's tether really bums me out. It always irritated me that it fell to the ground in the smash games because it doesn't do that in the Zelda games. Not really a big deal, I know, but its still irritating.

yeah that's the main thing i'm annoyed about - if it's a clawshot it simply shouldn't be falling to the ground.
i know it's a little minor and petty but if they're gonna change it from hookshot to clawshot in the newer iterations, they really should maintain the item qualities.

Just a stray Dark Lord stopping in to spell doom for you faerie loving green clad "heroes."


d o o m

lol, you wish

brb lemme just fetch my fierce deity mask...

 

[Wiley]

lol, you wish

brb lemme just fetch my fierce deity mask...

The victory isn't as sweet if the opposition doesn't have hope. Courage will be your downfall >:D
One day... Just waiting on you Miyamoto, The Legend of Ganon: Link Is Past-Due

side note on your deity mask: can't wait for that Majora's Mask remake... hope they keep it creepy. I felt the 3ds OOT was so well remade, it just lost a liittle bit of the edge. Particularly the "hands" enemy... holy hell that thing freaked me out on the 64,

Sorry, Ahem... I the Dark Lord, scared of some hands? Preposterous.

 

[Zelkam]

Just a stray Dark Lord stopping in to spell doom for you faerie loving green clad "heroes."


d o o m

I'm sorry, I didn't hear a word you said. I was too distracted by the master sword in your face. What was that?

 

[Wiley]

I'm sorry, I didn't hear a word you said. I was too distracted by the master sword in your face. What was that?

*Down taunts*
The only sword at my face is reflecting the most devilish looking badass I know.

Oh I see you brought your silly dagger.

 

[Deleted member]

Just a stray Dark Lord stopping in to spell doom for you faerie loving green clad "heroes."


d o o m

Jumping to conclusions so soon, eh? You make me laugh.

brb lemme just fetch my fierce deity mask...

Put on some shades while you're at it so you can defeat your enemies with style.

 

[The Merc]

*Down taunts*
The only sword at my face is reflecting the most devilish looking badass I know.

Oh I see you brought your silly dagger.

At least we can use our sword .

 

[DavemanCozy]

Damn, after watching those vids, I definitely see those bomb catches being worth something, and well now they're getting taken away. I never imagined nor thought to get that creative.

Pretty sure Z-air still has nearly no landing though. I still have my fingers crossed for this to get added back in patch. We'll see.

 

[Conda]

that's just dumb.
why would they change it at all if it has the same recovery speed?
the 3ds and wii u smash bros 4 is meant to be the same game (in terms of actualy gameplay), merely on different platforms.
what's the point changing something so insignificant like that?

also if link's grab animation is the clawshot, why would it hit the floor at all - isn't that item pretty taut in general?

The tether hitting the floor is physics-based. On slanted terrain it lands with real physics and such, and Link whips it back into the hookshot in a whip-like fashion. On the 3ds this isn't possible, so the tether simply 'sticks out and goes back in' as if it were stiff, as it doesn't have any realistic physics in its animation.

And this is ONLY for the grab. For zair, it's the same as before of course because that's just how it works - hookshot becomes stiff and it goes in like a stiff preztel stick. Even Samus's becomes a stiff beam.

 

[Wiley]

At least we can use our sword .

This was a solid response ;] so I won't try to act defensive and say check our custom tipper neutral b move since it does counter what you said. I'd rather just give this one to you this time. Well played Hero boy.

 

[The Merc]

This was a solid response ;] so I won't try to act defensive and say check our custom tipper neutral b move since it does counter what you said. I'd rather just give this one to you this time. Well played Hero boy.

And that's why I am the hero X3. Though you do have a point and it nice that you gave me the victory, someone could say that at least Link can use his sword more often than Ganon and in a more proper way, but I guess that's be rendered mute. Again, that's nice for giving me the win. Thanks X3

 

[Balgorxz]

they probably don't even know about it, just make them keep their promise to keep both version the same on their twitter and they'll probably fix it since most of the gamebreaking bugs and infinites got removed after people started posting videos of these on several official nintendo media(twitter etc)

 

[Rizen]

Want to hear a story? Once upon a time there was a girl named Lana. She had a decent book of sorcery weapon but insisted on using trash tier weapons like the Deku Spear and summon gate to get her level 3 versions of those weapons in Adventure mode. Sadly for the other Hyrule warriors she needed the lv3 Summon gate for all weapons to be obtained. So she used the lv2 summon gate even though it was slow with bad DPS and left her vulnerable making getting an 'A' rank very hard. So Rizen gave up and watched Markiplier play 5 Nights at Freddy's 2. Lana eventually died of melanoma.
The end.

 

[The Merc]

Want to hear a story? Once upon a time there was a girl named Lana. She had a decent book of sorcery weapon but insisted on using trash tier weapons like the Deku Spear and summon gate to get her level 3 versions of those weapons in Adventure mode. Sadly for the other Hyrule warriors she needed the lv3 Summon gate for all weapons to be obtained. So she used the lv2 summon gate even though it was slow with bad DPS and left her vulnerable making getting an 'A' rank very hard. So Rizen gave up and watched Markiplier play 5 Nights at Freddy's 2. Lana eventually died of melanoma.
The end.

???????????

 

[Zane the pure]

I know right, ditch the summon gate and read a book lady! I really hope she's not a one shot character...

 

[Elessar]

Now, there's something I don't quite understand, so if anybody there has more inside knowledge on this pelase help me.

Apparently, the 3DS version was used as a beta of sorts, to test out the game and then change or fix for the Wii U release (with a patch ont hat day for the 3DS to keep the games the same, maybe): Now, my question is that, considering that they had only about 2 months between releases, is that enough time to see what is discovered, change/fix it, and the start mass producing the game for launch to meet demand? I mean, could it be that the game just happens to not have the toss cancel out of coincidence/bad luck rather than intentionally?

 

[Fox Is Openly Deceptive]

If you ask me, I think they made us do the testing for glitches. It was a simple matter of letting the community do what it does best; dissect for the purpose of finding broken stuff to gain a competitive edge, and then oh look, how nice, we've even presented it and gathered all the information in this thread http://smashboards.com/threads/in-n...ssues-missing-features-other-problems.370405/
But hey, that's just my own theory. We got duped. It's too convenient to think otherwise. And there's no reason to think that this won't happen in the future either. Oh so someone found some amazing glitch and posted it so everyone could see? But then it got patched out soon after the knowledge was out there? What are the odds of that?
I don't like this state of affairs one bit.

 

[Elessar]

My problem with how things seem to be working now, is that it again shows Sakurai's philosophy of forcing us to play HIS game, the way HE wants. I mean, he is shoving his tastes down our throats, and this is not how balancing a game works. Some glitches do not break the game, but add something else, and while it may be that true, it's not the balance you had in mind or you didn't balance the chars with that in mind, it still doesn't break the game, so why ix it? It makes the meta unnatural and it curbs its evolution.

I'm all for fixing glitches and patching games, but there has to be a line drawn, and where will tha tline be drawn? Will they actually balance the game, or just fix "glitches" and never touch the properties of the chars themselves? I mean, sure, take toss cancel away because it was a glitch, but hey, this char isn't doing that good in general and seems to be underpowered, will they boost him? We are all happy due to patches and broken things (like infinites) finally being fixed, but will they truly balance the game? Or just fix the things Sakurai doesn't like?

This may seem harsh, but Sakurai has a horrible track record with Brawl, the game he purposedly sabotaged to try and kill the competitive scene (tripping much?). Honestly, I wouldn't put it past him.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Now I'm sure that they will take out toss cancel in the Next update: http://kotaku.com/new-super-smash-bros-3ds-patch-will-address-balance-is-1657240044
Sounds pretty positive since it will "address balance issues" (and make the game just like the WiiU version), but TC will be missed.

 

[MagmarFire]

*sigh* Sad pandas...

I mean, I'm used to being nerfed to hell and back, but dang, it stings more when your character actually seems viable beforehand. If I don't get a lagless bomb-in-hand Air Dodge -> Zair for compensation, I won't be happy. (Not that Link will necessarily suck after this or anything, but still, its absence will be felt for a time.)

I know right, ditch the summon gate and read a book lady! I really hope she's not a one shot character...

Lana for Smash 5 and/or Zelda U. :D

 

[Mocha]

Want to hear a story? Once upon a time there was a girl named Lana. She had a decent book of sorcery weapon but insisted on using trash tier weapons like the Deku Spear and summon gate to get her level 3 versions of those weapons in Adventure mode. Sadly for the other Hyrule warriors she needed the lv3 Summon gate for all weapons to be obtained. So she used the lv2 summon gate even though it was slow with bad DPS and left her vulnerable making getting an 'A' rank very hard. So Rizen gave up and watched Markiplier play 5 Nights at Freddy's 2. Lana eventually died of melanoma.
The end.

I hated unlocking all of the Summoning Gate upgrade missions, as well as Agitha's lv 3, Ganondorf's lv 3 (he has to fight Ganon, Gohma, and Dodongo all at the same time iirc, within time limit, and A rank), and Zelda's Windwaker missions, and more.

I personally don't like the Deku Spear too much either, and despite the Summoning Gate being kinda random, least it's fun sometimes. Least I can be amused with Lana constantly shouting "Say NO!" (or that's what it sounds like) when she's doing certain combos with the Deku Spear lol.

I actually broke the seal on Link's Master Sword finally. All that remains is about 16,000ish kills and it'll unlock the final thing, whatever it is.

 

[Elessar]

The patch notes also that those who download Ver. 1.0.4 will not be able to play local play with those running Ver. 1.0.3 and lower. What's more, those that download the patch won't be able to playback previously saved replays

Welp, time to start recording my replays...maybe...

 

[Wiley]

When I joined this thread I just wanted to join with a fun silly post, I didn't see what had just been said. Personally I wouldn't worry about losing our (I do mess around with Toon Link sometimes) bomb ATs. Quickdraw from brawl seemed to have been consciously removed and replaced with them. I don't believe that they were unnnaware of it. If ATs are removed because of the communities feedback and testing then Sakurai has opened pandora's box, don't worry. This will mean that they have opened the position for future updates and we as the community can use this moment as leverage to push for other game improvements. It would be a huge card we could play in the future, but if Nintendo turns this into a power struggle where they are only law, then they will lose a ton of fans.

This is not hate at all, but the Links would be pretty meh without their bomb ATs :/ I feel like the testers at Nintendo at least knew about them. :/ it's not like they were hard discoveries, considering they function pretty much the same way as brawl just flipped. Let's not worry too much just yet.

 

[Mocha]

I worry that these 'patches' they're doing or updates for game balance may cause more harm than good. While I'm glad they seem to be acknowledging the competitive community more, they are forcing us to play in such a way to meet up with their standards/changes.

Also, I really hope all these changes will be an initial thing, not something constant, or even every couple of months. Having to relearn your characters, or the ones you fight, due to certain techniques being patched, is going to get a bit frustrating, and we already have to adapt to custom moves in the first place.

Not trying to discourage diversity. If anything, these changes could potentially prevent diversity, since, depending on who they nerf, they'll likely feel even more limited in what they can do. I don't know... am I looking too much into it? Am I exaggerating?

 

[Drunken_Master]

It's not Nintendo I don't trust, it's Sakurai, who is head of this project. Eiji Aonuma for example has pushed in the past for glitches to be left in and even intentionally duplicated as part of the fun of the game.

Sakurai is not Eiji.

 

[Elessar]

The problem here is that Sakurai has a horrible track record when it comes to the competitive scene and what he wants of his games. He wants people to have fun HIS way, and he has already sabotajed Brawl. Granted, Namco is also in charge of the game and they are in charge of balancing and they DO have a ton of competitive xperience, but still, Sakurai has earned himself a lot of bad blood with the competitieve scene/players.

My problem is, that it fels like an unwarranted nerf. Maybe it was an unintended glitch and as such it has to be removed. But I can't help but feel cheated and nerfed.

 

[Mocha]

I think the title of this thread accurately describes what Link is going through.

 

[Wiley]

Not trying to discourage diversity. If anything, these changes could potentially prevent diversity, since, depending on who they nerf, they'll likely feel even more limited in what they can do. I don't know... am I looking too much into it? Am I exaggerating?

I wouldn't say you're exaggerating, there is a richness to the meta when characters that couldn't shine find a place to with masterful techniques... the ones that have been discovered so far in this version of the game have been a huge part of the fun I've had. Taking that away will of course be pretty sad. I just found out the Wario air momentum glitch was taken out in the Wii U. This was easily done and added a lot to his early/mid game recovery but I as an opponent and a very rare user of him, will strongly miss it. I'm now dreading more information... I just hope they have the courtesy of giving us patch notes.

It seems the box is open, and I was defending the man. Let's just hope they listen in the future.

 

[Mocha]

I wouldn't say you're exaggerating, there is a richness to the meta when characters that couldn't shine find a place to with masterful techniques... the ones that have been discovered so far in this version of the game have been a huge part of the fun I've had. Taking that away will of course be pretty sad. I just found out the Wario air momentum glitch was taken out in the Wii U. This was easily done and added a lot to his early/mid game recovery but I as an opponent and a very rare user of him, will strongly miss it. I'm now dreading more information... I just hope they have the courtesy of giving us patch notes.

It seems the box is open, and I was defending the man. Let's just hope they listen in the future.

The worst part about this is that none of these glitches appear game-breaking (unless I've missed something). No one bothered fixing chaingrabs and infinites in Brawl (not complaining per say, just saying), so why should this be any different? All this will do is create bitterness among fans of -insert character here- that got nerfed, or an important part of their playstyle taken away from them.

 

[Elessar]

Stupid double post.

Nvm me...

I said nevermind..

shoo, go away...

jeez...

 

[Elessar]

The box is definitively open. I just hope that they do provide patch note, but detailed ones, rather than the vague crap they've given in the past.

Also...I don't trust Sakurai, but I trust Namco, so let's hope that Sakurai listens to them when it comes to balacing and implementing patches. Hopefully, this will turn out for the best and TC won't be missed since we will have been buffed in some other area, or something like that. Let's hope that this are good news, not ill omens.

The worst part about this is that none of these glitches appear game-breaking (unless I've missed something). No one bothered fixing chaingrabs and infinites in Brawl (not complaining per say, just saying), so why should this be any different? All this will do is create bitterness among fans of -insert character here- that got nerfed, or an important part of their playstyle taken away from them.

Well, but it could be argued that they are glitches and as such, not intended gameplay mechanics that could throw the original balance the devs had in mind completely off, and as such, eliminating it is a precautionary move, hoping to keep their original balance intact until a meta based on their rules develops.

 

[Wiley]

And above all... Patch notes.

What a joke it would be to have spent all this time learning, to be left in the dark again like play things. It's not fair to not have it down on paper somewhere that you screwed up your vision and it was on us to find out how, IF you're going to change it. Secrets have been a huge part of the fun of smash through discovery, but this changes the whole dynamic entirely. Data is gold for the community and it's been the job of the community so far to access and receive it, Nintendo better start making this a two way type of communication now, or I see a big chunk out the door.

 

[Onomanic]

Give it to me straight doc, how bad are the nerfs looking?

 

[FSK]

Give it to me straight doc, how bad are the nerfs looking?

Lets just say I'm maining sheik now.

 

[Ryu_Ken]

Lets just say I'm maining sheik now.

Just to let you know, I've never gotten rekt by a Shiek. Yet.

You want us to play it your way, Sakurai? FINE! We'll make Link work, we'll capitalize on his strengths and ATs, and the meta will develop. We Will Make Link B+ tier!

 

[Rizen]

When did Link players become emos? That's more for a different character (inside joke). What this means is we'll have to do what we should be always doing- using good spacing! And Link has gotten good spacing buffs. Do work people!

 

[FSK]

@ Ryu_Ken

That is because you haven't played me yet




(j/k I suck with sheik ;-; )

 

[Ryu_Ken]

If it makes any1 feel better, I've created a tier list where Link is at the top and only these characters are used (since they are the
most common in my FG matches) Note: this obviously isn't 100% accurate.

Link Tier

Teeth Clenching


/




Pretty Cool
/




Ok








Link Automatically Wins