Kirby's Toy Box - Kirby Moveset/AT/Competitive Discussion

[|RK|]

Maybe it's because of wi-fi, but the Pikachu matchup seems reeeeaaaalllyyyy stupid with the shield changes.

 

[KenMeister]

Maybe it's because of wi-fi, but the Pikachu matchup seems reeeeaaaalllyyyy stupid with the shield changes.

Nah, you're right, he actually really is stupid, stupider than he already was thanks to the patch. You legit can't do anything about a Pika dsmashing/fairing your shield now it's soooo dumb. x.x

 

[Nickname87]

I think I found something pretty cool on lylat. when you up b on the edge of any platform and then move the stick over as soon as the screen shakes from kirby landing you can cancel the up end lag and the up b projectile still comes out. but you will be put into free fall so watch out

EDIT: After some testing i found that it only works if the stage is tilting (doesnt matter up or down) and this also works on dreamland if whispy is blowing

Edit again : also possible on town and city platforms as well as smashvile platform (but smash ville platform is really way too hard to do to be usefull)

 

[Phan7om]

Ok, I feel like im the only one who didnt know this... but Kirby's DK punch 10-wind inside(shoulder) hit will kill DK at 50% without rage. Read the airdodge after Uptilt and they're gone. Ive known about DKs shoulder hit since like the beginning, but when I tested it with Kirby a while ago (like the 2nd Wii U patch or so) I could never hit it so I assumed it didnt work for him. Guess I was wrong lol.

 

[WootSnorlax]

Ok, I feel like im the only one who didnt know this... but Kirby's DK punch 10-wind inside(shoulder) hit will kill DK at 50% without rage. Read the airdodge after Uptilt and they're gone. Ive known about DKs shoulder hit since like the beginning, but when I tested it with Kirby a while ago (like the 2nd Wii U patch or so) I could never hit it so I assumed it didnt work for him. Guess I was wrong lol.

So would it kind of be like Jigglypuff's rest hitbox? Maybe even harder? We're so tiny it'd be so hard to properly space it.

 

[Nickname87]

im not sure if this is already a thing but kirbys up air can lead into a footstool pretty well although it is really strict timing

(ignore everything after 0:09) possibly frame perfect on some characters? not tested with DI*

 

[Ansou]

Yeah, it's pretty much known. You should check out this thread where footstools are discussed.

 

[Steve.Stone]

So I good around with Kirby on for Glory sometimes, and I get ALOT of kills just from suiciding myself with inhale. (I kill my opponent then go to the edge of the stage, they try to attack me so I jump and inhale them.) I also seem to get kills with the hammer, immediately after I die I come back and side b them. Does this stuff actually work or is it just crappy For Glory people?

 

[KirbySquad101]

So I good around with Kirby on for Glory sometimes, and I get ALOT of kills just from suiciding myself with inhale. (I kill my opponent then go to the edge of the stage, they try to attack me so I jump and inhale them.) I also seem to get kills with the hammer, immediately after I die I come back and side b them. Does this stuff actually work or is it just crappy For Glory people?

I think it's probably just bad/unaware For Glory people, since suicide Inhale is actually pretty easy to mash out of, not to mention Inhale doesn't have much range to being with lol

I'm also not sure how you hit people with Hammer. I thought it started on Frame 26 or something? XD

 

[T Luthor]

So I good around with Kirby on for Glory sometimes, and I get ALOT of kills just from suiciding myself with inhale. (I kill my opponent then go to the edge of the stage, they try to attack me so I jump and inhale them.) I also seem to get kills with the hammer, immediately after I die I come back and side b them. Does this stuff actually work or is it just crappy For Glory people?

Crappy for glory people

 

[Steve.Stone]

I think it's probably just bad/unaware For Glory people, since suicide Inhale is actually pretty easy to mash out of, not to mention Inhale doesn't have much range to being with lol

I'm also not sure how you hit people with Hammer. I thought it started on Frame 26 or something? XD

I'm not sure how I'm managing it either! Hilarious when it works. XD

 

[Komota]

Any thoughts on the usefulness of Dair's landing hit -> Stone (as soon as you land a Dair that connects, use stone?) I tested it out for a bit in training and it seems viable when the opponent is at higher percents (like if they're near the ledge and you hit them with the stone, it sends them at the awkward downward angle offstage) but obviously the recovery time is pretty bad if you miss. I haven't tested it on a multitude of characters, but Mario can perfect shield the stone in some cases, and Ness can actually air dodge right before landing to avoid damage as well. I understand that it's easily punishable if you screw up, but I feel like it could be an interesting option to keep in mind.

 

[KirbySquad101]

Any thoughts on the usefulness of Dair's landing hit -> Stone (as soon as you land a Dair that connects, use stone?) I tested it out for a bit in training and it seems viable when the opponent is at higher percents (like if they're near the ledge and you hit them with the stone, it sends them at the awkward downward angle offstage) but obviously the recovery time is pretty bad if you miss. I haven't tested it on a multitude of characters, but Mario can perfect shield the stone in some cases, and Ness can actually air dodge right before landing to avoid damage as well. I understand that it's easily punishable if you screw up, but I feel like it could be an interesting option to keep in mind.

From what I know, the chain is about as likely to happen as D-Air into D-Smash, given the minimal start-up differences (11 compared to 10). However, from what I know D-Air into D-Smash can be blocked (not sure if it's character dependent or not), so you do have to be cautious when using it.

I think the best applicable use for it is when you near the edge of the stage; there, Stone can push them off the stage at an unfavorable angle, where Kirby can attempt to edge guard them.

 

[Komota]

While it does have comparable startup frames, the hitbox is definitely smaller, so if you do plan to use it you have to try and land as close to them as you can, but make sure you're also on the proper side to send them in the direction you want. It's sort've needlessly technical in that regard, but eh.

 

[PonderBot]

This is my first time posting on the Kirby part of the boards. Hey :D

 

[BartholomewGifford]

Hi Kirby mains, I've started picking up Kirby as a secondary and had a few questions regarding him. (Sorry if this is the wrong place, couldn't find a more apt place to post)

Approach options: I've been approaching with FF Dair, Bair, and retreating Fair. Is there anything else (or should I stop doing any of these)? I've been struggling with getting in and any help would be appreciated haha.

Kill options: Does he have any kill confirms? It doesn't look like Dair *confirms* a kill into his smashes, but it does work sometimes. Is there a reason for this, is it random, or is it just my opponents messing up?

The neutral: What should I do here? His poor mobility and range makes me think he just has to wait for his opponent to mess up, is there anything else?

Who should I look for when trying to find sets? I saw Mike Kirby vs Larry Lurr which was a pretty nice set, are there any others?


Slightly more silly:

Are there any confirms into swallow (and is there a list of what characters where swallow is beneficial).

Are there any legitimate uses for Down-B and Side-B? I've seen Down-B used to punish laggy moves intended to catch Kirby's landing (I used it to punish Lucas's UpSmash for instance) and I know it can break shields, is it possible to do this effectively or is it not worth it? I'm assuming side-B is useless bar styling, but thought I might as well ask.

Is Up-B viable as a spacing tool? I've heard this a few times, but not too sure on it and wanted to ask the actual mains

 

[Agent Emerald]

Kirby Qs

Approach options:Kirby has trouble approaching (outside of customs, at least) but he's kinda slippery, so he an slip in on an opponent's slip ups from time to time. Easier with taller characters than smaller ones.

Kill options: Dair can "confirm" to Dsmash at kill percent, but Kirby can more easily dair offstage to footstool for a kill. Dtilt can confirm to Fsmash if the former causes a trip.

The neutral: You have to punish your opponent trying to get in on you. Like I said before, easier with taller characters than smaller ones.

IIRC sourspot uptilt can confirm into inhale at early percents. And here are some useful abilities in their respective matchups:

Down B is good for catching those try to reach for a kill off the top, and Side B is good for styling on someone with sub 60% kills and punishing Rest.

Up B is not very good in general. The shockwave range is bad, long startup and cooldown, and doesn't ledge snap going up.

 

[Phan7om]

Who should I look for when trying to find sets? I saw Mike Kirby vs Larry Lurr which was a pretty nice set, are there any others?

I think its worth saying that you dont only have to watch sets of Kirby players, unless you'd say you need to know more about your character. A lot of players only seem to do this with their respective mains, and it could subconsciously change your playstyle to match theirs instead of playing like yourself. Its best to get a general idea of what you are looking for and apply it to your Kirby playstyle. It really helps with creativity in specific matchups, or even in general. For example, I might watch how top Pit/Dark Pit or MK players use their multi jumps.

You could even watch how specific players play certain characters if you know that player is good at something. For example I know Larry Lurr has very good pressure with Fox, what is he doing with Fox that I could realistically apply to my Kirby playstyle? I know Mr. R has great movement and plays pretty aggro in neutral with his Sheik, what is he doing that Kirby could? Or even Zero, hes the best for some reason what decisions are being made that makes him the best? etc. The Kirby meta only advances once previous rules are altered/broken.

 

[Agent Emerald]

You could even watch how specific players play certain characters if you know that player is good at something. For example I know Larry Lurr has very good pressure with Fox, what is he doing with Fox that I could realistically apply to my Kirby playstyle? I know Mr. R has great movement and plays pretty aggro in neutral with his Sheik, what is he doing that Kirby could? Or even Zero, hes the best for some reason what decisions are being made that makes him the best? etc. The Kirby meta only advances once previous rules are altered/broken.

That is not only great advice, but also very fitting for the Kirby boards to try and use other's tactics in a way to make it yours.

 

[Komota]

Up B is not very good in general. The shockwave range is bad, long startup and cooldown, and doesn't ledge snap going up.

That being said, I find that in certain situations using up B can be a relatively viable option. The sudden range increase can surprise some people (not the shockwave, but the cutter itself) and catch them off guard, because they were probably expecting a stubby kirby foot. It is risky, sure, but it's also something I think can be utilized well if used occasionally.

 

[PonderBot]

That being said, I find that in certain situations using up B can be a relatively viable option. The sudden range increase can surprise some people (not the shockwave, but the cutter itself) and catch them off guard, because they were probably expecting a stubby kirby foot. It is risky, sure, but it's also something I think can be utilized well if used occasionally.

I find it really useful against D3 since the really good players tend to space well enough to where I can't get in. The best one I ever fought made it so that if I even did manage to get in, they would suck me in and spit me out so it would just reset the situation so a well-timed cutter can be really helpful.

 

[T Luthor]

My kirby is on tilt and It made me wonder, what do you guys do when you're on tilt?

 

[DblCrest]

That's an easy one. You tumble of course ;D

 

[PonderBot]

My kirby is on tilt and It made me wonder, what do you guys do when you're on tilt?

Go to the lab. Mine is still technically on tilt but I've been recovering slowly over the course of the last few months so it's not all bad.

 

[T Luthor]

Go to the lab. Mine is still technically on tilt but I've been recovering slowly over the course of the last few months so it's not all bad.

Thanks

 

[T Luthor]

While the post is quiet and I get a chance to ask, can someone help me with the timing on kirbys extended Dash dance

 

[Ansou]

While the post is quiet and I get a chance to ask, can someone help me with the timing on kirbys extended Dash dance

There is not really a set timing for it, but it's basically harder to do the faster you want to do it. The dashdance part is much trickier for me than the foxtrot part. You basically have to press forward and and backwards very quickly for it to work for Kirby (when I tried with Roy it was way easier). Think of forward-backward as one input instead of two as you should do them after eachother as quickly as possible. Try using a metronome with like 160-170 BPM or something and do forward on one beat and forward-backward on the other beat and repeat.

Phan7om also made a video on this which could be useful to watch.

 

[T Luthor]

There is not really a set timing for it, but it's basically harder to do the faster you want to do it. The dashdance part is much trickier for me than the foxtrot part. You basically have to press forward and and backwards very quickly for it to work for Kirby (when I tried with Roy it was way easier). Think of forward-backward as one input instead of two as you should do them after eachother as quickly as possible. Try using a metronome with like 160-170 BPM or something and do forward on one beat and forward-backward on the other beat and repeat.

Phan7om also made a video on this which could be useful to watch.

Appreciate the Advice, will check out the vid and hopefully be able to dash dance properly in no time :]

 

[TheJackalope]

What do you guys think about Smash 4 Kirby's neutral game? I've been using his up-special in neutral as a mix-up and getting decent results, but I'm curious as to what my fellow Kirby mains think.

 

[KenMeister]

What do you guys think about Smash 4 Kirby's neutral game? I've been using his up-special in neutral as a mix-up and getting decent results, but I'm curious as to what my fellow Kirby mains think.

I'd be careful with upB in neutral because it's techable on reaction and leaves you open for punishment before you recover from the animation.

 

[T Luthor]

What do you guys think about Smash 4 Kirby's neutral game? I've been using his up-special in neutral as a mix-up and getting decent results, but I'm curious as to what my fellow Kirby mains think.

If you use Up-b against good players there's a chance that you're gonna have a bad time

 

[quickbeam2]

up b isn't at all safe on shield either

 

[PonderBot]

I only use it in specific matchups where it's hard to get in and of course, only as a mixup but it's not really a great idea since it's really punishable.

 

[Komota]

So, are there any characters or percents where Dair landing hit -> Dsmash is true? It seems to work on ness/lucas without fail, but on basically everyone else they can either shield or jump, depending on fallspeed/weight. But at higher percents, would Dair -> Dsmash work, I wonder?

 

[PonderBot]

So, are there any characters or percents where Dair landing hit -> Dsmash is true? It seems to work on ness/lucas without fail, but on basically everyone else they can either shield or jump, depending on fallspeed/weight. But at higher percents, would Dair -> Dsmash work, I wonder?

I don't think it works on fast fallers since they can drop and immediately go to shield after the dair but from what I have seen it is true on Mario at least.

 

[Silvia]

Is Kirby really that hard of a character to utilize? I use him but I still dont understand how to use his moves correctly.

 

[PonderBot]

Is Kirby really that hard of a character to utilize? I use him but I still dont understand how to use his moves correctly.

You have to put in a lot of work since his major flaws are some of the worst that a character can have. No approach options often making for a bad neutral (though his crouch helps a lot), hard to kill with, light, etc. Regarding his moves, it might just be that you haven't gotten used to his moves yet but a lot of them do require strange timing since you have to keep all of the stuff I mentioned earlier in mind otherwise bad matchups get significantly worse and even or slightly favorable matchups can turn against you. To clarify though, I don't think he's hard as in he's technical, I just feel like playing at a higher level with him requires that you keep more things in mind than usual.

 

[JimmyTheCaterpillar]

Hey Kirby mains!

As much as we hate you, the boards are discussing th Kirby vs Dedede MU and would appreciate your input!


Here's our link: http://smashboards.com/threads/read-op-community-match-up-discussion-put-on-hold.395045/page-13

Also, don't let the thread title confuse you, there's been some going-on at the boards. The discussions are indeed on.

Thanks everyone!

 

[PonderBot]

Hey Kirby mains!

As much as we hate you, the boards are discussing th Kirby vs Dedede MU and would appreciate your input!


Here's our link: http://smashboards.com/threads/read-op-community-match-up-discussion-put-on-hold.395045/page-13

Also, don't let the thread title confuse you, there's been some going-on at the boards. The discussions are indeed on.

Thanks everyone!

Haha will do and don't worry, we love D3. You guys are delicious ;P

 

[T Luthor]

Predicion: Kirby beats cloud, Hard match up with Corrin, mostly in Corrin's favour, And Don't think we need to talk about Bayonetta