Social Kirby & The Amazing Cats

[kirbyfan66]

I think the big thing about customs that's getting people excited is that they're different. It's something we don't know about yet, and that gets us excited. At least, it does for me.

I do think Kirby does benefit from customs, but only because they give him some extra options. I don't know if they make him better, necessarily, but he gets some nifty stuff that helps him out. Having played in a custom tournament before, I can say that they don't make the game broken, but since customs are new and the metagame for customs is still evolving, adapting is a big part of it. Once we get used to customs and they become a norm of sorts, a lot of issues we have will likely be gone.

We just need time, is all. Five months or so is definitely enough time to at least get used to customs. Now that we know they're going to be at Evo, it's a perfect time to study up and find out how they work!

 

[Flameduck]

A couple of sentences to say:

Kirby does get some nice options through customs.

Hopefully someone can find some weird overpowered trick with Kirby's customs or just a nice ability.

If Kirby got custom copy abilities that would be really great for him in the custom metagame.

Also, Mii Fighters don't get equipment boost when customs are off.

 

[Unknownkid]

Take it from someone who actually HAS competed in custom tournaments; they are not helping balance AT ALL.

I will like start with this: I found this statement insulting because implies no one competed in a custom environment. Was the capitalize on "HAS" really necessary?

Anyways, yes I have and I won my first one. Of course, I have not face anything insane that I couldn't overcome (Jumping Rest or Light Weight). If anything becomes too broken, we can at least ban the move/combination itself (like Pikachu + G&W) until it is patched.

AND YES, THEY DO PATCH CUSTOM MOVES - Dragon Rush (Charzard Side B Custom) got nerfed.

 

[LimitCrown]

How often would custom moves be patched, though? It isn't like the custom moves were designed to be balanced as much as the default special moves.

 

[|RK|]

Um... I felt like I was morally obligated to say something when a guy switched to Zero Suit Samus against my Kirby. But I said nothing ;_;

Lol

 

[Unknownkid]

Exactly! But why was Dragon Rush nerf in 1.04. If custom moves were not designed to be balanced, why nerf this move.

I cannot really give you an answer but I know the debug team is watching the Smash Community scene. I mean we lost D.Pit Arrow Stall Glitch as Kirby of all things. How often do you believe that glitch has been used? Yoshi's "Watch My Monster GROW" is gone too and no effect in FG. The more we post glitchy and broken stuff the increase of them getting patched.

Except for Shulk's Power Counter. You just have to be more careful.

 

[LimitCrown]

Exactly! But why was Dragon Rush nerf in 1.04. If custom moves were not designed to be balanced, why nerf this move.

I cannot really give you an answer but I know the debug team is watching the Smash Community scene. I mean we lost D.Pit Arrow Stall Glitch as Kirby of all things. How often do you believe that glitch has been used? Yoshi's "Watch My Monster GROW" is gone too and no effect in FG. The more we post glitchy and broken stuff the increase of them getting patched.

Except for Shulk's Power Counter. You just have to be more careful.

If I recall correctly, Dragon Rush before it was nerfed dealt 15% damage instead of 11%. This meant that Dragon Rush could deal just as much damage as Flare Blitz's explosion without the drawback of taking recoil damage. Despite the move not dealing as much knockback, I think that was the reason that Dragon Rush was viewed to be much better than the default.

I'm sure that any glitches, even the ones caused by custom moves, will be fixed by the debug team. However, regarding the chances of custom moves being regularly balanced, I believe that the chances aren't very likely.

 

[WolfieXVII ❂]

Based @ Aunt Jemima I never got to play you :3

 

[Unknownkid]

Holy Crap! It is Triple R! He just own a Pit player in Loser Bracket. Get in here.
http://www.twitch.tv/clashtournaments

EDIT: Wow damn. So Triple R's next opponent hates being on stream during his match. So they played off stream and we got replace with 2 spoons full of Diddy vs Olimar (Boring). During the boring match, the crowd was chanting "Kirby, Kirby, Kirby". How often do you get to hear that? Sadly, Triple R is out. Here is the bracket - http://gr.challonge.com/sm4sh


Also, M2k is there too.

 

[kirbyfan66]

Off topic, but RAINBOW CURSE IS OUT! Who here has it?

I've been hearing very mixed things about it, but having played it (96% done at the moment), I really like it. I dunno if I like it more than Canvas Curse, but it's very close.

 

[Asdioh]

Wait what, you got it 96% done in only a day? What the heck!

 

[fromundaman]

Sorry, I am too busy to continue the discussion right now, so we'll just have to agree to disagree for now. I am confident EVO will change some minds though.

I will say these 2 things though:

1) My region is one of the only ones to have been consistently running custom tournaments since the game launched on 3DS, so yes, I do assume I will have seen more custom play than most of the people I am talking to.

2) People claiming customs are needed to fight Diddy are being very over-dramatic. Every game has a best character, and while he *might* be the absolute best in the game (Definitely the 'easiest' top tier character right now), but he is NOT dominating. In fact according to results, he and Shiek are pretty much on the same level and both of them only have about 10% of top 8 placements.
Here's an article with result analysis put into an easy to read fashion:
http://www.goldper10.com/article/886-the-state-of-sm4sh-every-king-deserves-a-queen.html

 

[Asdioh]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNinZv7pcJY
Where are the Kirby versions of these hype mini combo videos guys?? Or is Kirby just not as hype as Falcon?


@ fromundaman do you think customs being on at evo will increase the amount of "degenerative" play? I guess that word used in Smash context means that there will be lots of camping and games dragging out because people will be unable to deal with certain customs. Since you said you're busy you don't have to give a long answer, just a general feeling on if that would be the case. I can see arguments being made for that, and it would suck if it did happen. For example, even if you enjoyed the Pacman vs Rosalina matches at the end of Apex, the fact remains that all 3 games went to 6 minutes, so it was pretty miserable. I wonder if that kind of thing would happen more often.

The other "worst case" scenario (from the players' perspective, not so much the spectators) are that some customs are so broken that stocks will end ultra fast! I don't really see that happening if players play smart though.

Oh well, I'm pretty excited for it, whether I end up playing there or not. (probably not, distance is a thing)

 

[Unknownkid]

Sorry, I am too busy to continue the discussion right now, so we'll just have to agree to disagree for now. I am confident EVO will change some minds though.

I will say these 2 things though:

1) My region is one of the only ones to have been consistently running custom tournaments since the game launched on 3DS, so yes, I do assume I will have seen more custom play than most of the people I am talking to.

2) People claiming customs are needed to fight Diddy are being very over-dramatic. Every game has a best character, and while he *might* be the absolute best in the game (Definitely the 'easiest' top tier character right now), but he is NOT dominating. In fact according to results, he and Shiek are pretty much on the same level and both of them only have about 10% of top 8 placements.
Here's an article with result analysis put into an easy to read fashion:
http://www.goldper10.com/article/886-the-state-of-sm4sh-every-king-deserves-a-queen.html

Fair enough. Even though, the place I join in and watch stream have custom tournaments all the time - I will admit I am not as hand-on experienced as you with them. I and many others do not believe that too broken.

Yesterday, I visit the Project: Smash TO roundtable stream. The topic was Customs since they will be implement in EVO. Thinkamen, KirbyKid, Oracle, Amazing Ampharos and other were there. Thinkamen was generous enough to stay in the chat and reveal some counters to some the customs. Like Counter Tree, Kong Cyclone (apparently Leaping Inhale counter this hard - it hilarious) and Rosalina's Shooting Star move. He believe Super Speed/Light Weight is more broken.

I guess we have to wait and see. But at least you have the edge over anyone else when it comes to EVO. It will be interesting to see you take top position with your knowledge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNinZv7pcJY
Where are the Kirby versions of these hype mini combo videos guys?? Or is Kirby just not as hype as Falcon?

How about you edit some of MikeKirby, Triple R or your videos? Wait... didn't you make the "Kirby save Christmas" video? That video was hype even though it was on For Glory.

 

[fromundaman]

As I said before, I will not be attending EVO as I do not enjoy custom moves at all and that trip is far to expensive a trip to make for something I dislike.

That said it will be interesting to see how this affects the future of the the game.

If nothing else though, this is motivating me to travel and compete before EVO while tournaments are not using customs. Should that become tournament standard after EVO , well... I guess it's a good thing that MKX is just over the horizon...



EDIT:

Didn't see your post earlier Asdioh.

IDK if you can really say customs will draw out the game more, as just like now, it will depend on the character. A villager with customs will likely make the game extremely long, while a Shulk could make it extremely short. Honestly though based on what I've seen so far with several exceptions it doesn't really change the length of matches too much, though against a lot of characters matches become more passive/evasive as a lot of moves kill much earlier.

That said the only reason I personally enjoyed Abandago vs Dabuz was because Abandago managed to make a 9-1 MU look 5-5. Seriously the only reason those matches went to time is because Dabuz didn't know the MU well enough to dominate, but figured out just enough to shut down Pacman's game plan.

 

[DarkBlueSpark]

I feel like custom moves does open up some new options for Kirby, though I'm not sure if I'd really use them as I don't use Kirby's specials a whole lot anyways besides Up B. I may mess around with Inhale and Final Cutter customs though, who knows, maybe I'll end up liking one of them.
Anyone want to make/join a Kirby Skype Group?

 

[Altair357]

I feel like custom moves does open up some new options for Kirby, though I'm not sure if I'd really use them as I don't use Kirby's specials a whole lot anyways besides Up B. I may mess around with Inhale and Final Cutter customs though, who knows, maybe I'll end up liking one of them.
Anyone want to make/join a Kirby Skype Group?

I think the reason you don't use Kirby's specials much is exactly that: they aren't very good! Customs change that. You should definitely try them out.

 

[ChocolateMagnums]

I have been taking a liking to how Kirby plays out in Doubles, is there any gameplay out there with Smash 4 in Doubles? Me and my friend Starhover have run a Kirby/Shulk (The Monado Boyz) at a recent local tournament and had some good results. lol

 

[MikeKirby]

Doubles? I have been teaming up with Jtails recently for a while and it's been a lot of fun!

https://youtube.com/watch?v=fLf-Kpl-Bqc

I would have loved to team with a Shulk and seeing the craziness that would possibly happen but never did.

Do you have any videos?? :o

 

[ChocolateMagnums]

Doubles? I have been teaming up with Jtails recently for a while and it's been a lot of fun!

I would have loved to team with a Shulk and seeing the craziness that would possibly happen but never did.

Do you have any videos?? :o

We may record whenever we start up our Youtube channel. :o
I'm still very new to learning the ropes of competitive. Y'all have helped a bunch!
It's crazy, because I watch both of y'alls gameplay for my different mains. lmao

 

[Asdioh]

Gova has some doubles matches in the video thread!

Spoiler

I'm still just playing monster hunter nonstop

 

[Unknownkid]

Spoiler

I'm still just playing monster hunter nonstop

I can't blame you, brother. I can't you. This game is so much fun.

 

[MikeKirby]

[...] if Luigi down throws Kirby, he can get an almost guaranteed combo into Luigi Cyclone and K.O. Kirby off the top.

The KO percent is rage dependent but if you get caught in the Luigi Cyclone while up hi, DI down to pop out. At the very least this will force Luigi to drop his cyclone lower and maximize your living potential. Personally though, I hate fighting Luigi with a passion in this game. His down throw followups feel so brainless and he has disjoints on a lot of his moves. >.>

 

[gameplayzero]

We may record whenever we start up our Youtube channel. :o
I'm still very new to learning the ropes of competitive. Y'all have helped a bunch!
It's crazy, because I watch both of y'alls gameplay for my different mains. lmao

do you actually swallow shulk and use the monado? I'm seeing very few kirbies who team with shulk do that or ones that fight against him. I understand why though (I was the same way for awhile). I have a partner who mains shulk too so I practice on my spare time learning the ins-and-outs of monado kirby's power before we do doubles on Nintendodojo.

 

[ChocolateMagnums]

do you actually swallow shulk and use the monado? I'm seeing very few kirbies who team with shulk do that or ones that fight against him. I understand why though (I was the same way for awhile). I have a partner who mains shulk too so I practice on my spare time learning the ins-and-outs of monado kirby's power before we do doubles on Nintendodojo.

Depends on spawn point to minimize damage, but yes. I usually find myself in the right position to swallow shulk and use monados, and the Kirby follow ups in buster are insane. Monado Kirby is a force to be reckoned with, because it buffs his approach, recovery, damage, follow up, and kill potential. We figure we can take the 10% disadvantage in exchange for the buffs due to how many team combos are opened up opening speed/buster, or double buster. Also, they control the air like legends, so if you get out of neutral, you're golden. ;D Many cool set ups that can catch people by surprise. Again, me and Starhover will probably get to recording whenever he recovers from a recent injury.

 

[MikeKirby]

Hey guys, check this out!

http://www.dailydot.com/esports/melee-mew2king-kirby

 

[ChocolateMagnums]

Man, TripleR representing. I wanted to Kirby chant through my cpu screen watching that. I have gotta keep my eye out for more of his stuff. :o To do that with Kirby in Melee is just too freaking awesome. His ledge trumps in Smash 4 have made me realize how much more I have to learn. xD

 

[gameplayzero]

Depends on spawn point to minimize damage, but yes. I usually find myself in the right position to swallow shulk and use monados, and the Kirby follow ups in buster are insane. Monado Kirby is a force to be reckoned with, because it buffs his approach, recovery, damage, follow up, and kill potential. We figure we can take the 10% disadvantage in exchange for the buffs due to how many team combos are opened up opening speed/buster, or double buster. Also, they control the air like legends, so if you get out of neutral, you're golden. ;D Many cool set ups that can catch people by surprise. Again, me and Starhover will probably get to recording whenever he recovers from a recent injury.

I love buster kirby so much. Its a god send. While i usually let my partner get most of the kills, I just try and rack up damage, support him, and try to keep everything in order. I'd love to see how you use him though. Hopefully your partner gets better .

 

[WolfieXVII ❂]

What are some throw combos for Kirby?

 

[ChocolateMagnums]

I love buster kirby so much. Its a god send. While i usually let my partner get most of the kills, I just try and rack up damage, support him, and try to keep everything in order. I'd love to see how you use him though. Hopefully your partner gets better .

It truly is. And Kirby is a great support. But don't neglect the Smash monado b-air.
I need a capture card of my own. My partner has one though. :o He will hopefully have a speedier recovery whenever they get a cast on his leg. The ice wasn't kind to him the other day on our way to the store. X.x

 

[MikeKirby]

Edit: Woops wrong thread... brain fart

Uhhhh... oh man on the spot... Soooo... uhh... whooo's hype for Splatoon?

Aand, I linked Deven wrong, too. So much win.

 

[Deven3000]

Posted in the wrong thread, please delete this post

 

[Unknownkid]

Lol I look forward toward it.

 

[Deven3000]

Whoops, mess up, delete this post please

 

[fromundaman]

I have been taking a liking to how Kirby plays out in Doubles, is there any gameplay out there with Smash 4 in Doubles? Me and my friend Starhover have run a Kirby/Shulk (The Monado Boyz) at a recent local tournament and had some good results. lol

A little late to see this, but here's a playlist with a bunch of friendly matches of Eevee! and I (Kirby/Pacman team) playing some of the smashers at our local arcade.

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMdwNx6LkCU3Fj9OUpFFNrx6K45s0xIDg

 

[Unknownkid]

What are some throw combos for Kirby?

I apologize for no one answering this. It was kind of hard to see, mind you. Hmm yes, you can do:
Fthrow -> Fair (Strongly DI dependent)
Fthrow -> Fair -> Grab Reset (Strong DI Dependent but mostly doable on Heavier Characters)
Bthrow -> Bair (Character Dependent)
Bthrow-> Uair ->Utilt (Specific Character Dependent like DDD)
That's about it I think. More information here:
http://smashboards.com/threads/ssb4-kirbys-epic-guide-ver-2-1.367840/
http://smashboards.com/threads/kirby-b-throw-to-bair-percentages.385118/

 

[kirbyfan66]

Off topic, but it took me about 5 days to 100% Rainbow Curse. 99% in about two days, the Challenge Mode gave me a hard time but it's done.

Back on topic, then... Uh, yeah, those throw combos are the big ones. If you have a moving platform like on Smashville, then Down Throw can set up into something, but it's so difficult to set up that I doubt it's worth it.

 

[t!MmY]

Hey guys, check this out!
http://www.dailydot.com/esports/melee-mew2king-kirby

Woohoo! Go Triple R, show 'em that Kirby isn't worse than Pichu!

I think the big thing about customs that's getting people excited is that they're different

This is so true. Most of what I see about customs is about how Character X will be 'better' and how the game will be balanced because who knows?! I would like to hear more level-headed talk about Customs instead.

Having played in a custom tournament before, I can say that they don't make the game broken, but since customs are new and the metagame for customs is still evolving, adapting is a big part of it. Once we get used to customs and they become a norm of sorts, a lot of issues we have will likely be gone.

This is what I like to hear. One reason given why Custom Fighters should be OFF is because 'it's too soon', but I don't really think that's a strong reason. How soon is too soon? I think in order to understand how Custom Fighters work they should be used concurrently to any other viable mode of play. That is to say, they should be used now.

People seem to be against Custom Fighters because they're unfamiliar with how they work, or they are comfortable having it set to OFF and do not want to venture further. (Exception goes to people like fromundaman who clearly state they already have prior experience with Custom Fighters and give details why they do not prefer Custom Fighters ON).

It could be argued that it's 'too soon' for big nationals (EVO) setting Custom Fighters to ON, but that is mostly in the hands of those running said events. Yes the players can say 'yay/nay' to Custom Fighters but ultimately the decision is not made democratically (nor should it be). I mean, just look at EVO 2008 with Brawl. :\

 

[Nickname87]

Off topic, but it took me about 5 days to 100% Rainbow Curse. 99% in about two days, the Challenge Mode gave me a hard time but it's done.

Back on topic, then... Uh, yeah, those throw combos are the big ones. If you have a moving platform like on Smashville, then Down Throw can set up into something, but it's so difficult to set up that I doubt it's worth it.

i 100% the game 2 times just cause i could

 

[ChocolateMagnums]

A little late to see this, but here's a playlist with a bunch of friendly matches of Eevee! and I (Kirby/Pacman team) playing some of the smashers at our local arcade.

This is awesome! I never thought of even using pac-man's power like that, and I had no idea how powerful hammer/hydrant combos are. Killing diddy at around 95 without charge? It just makes me love Kirby in doubles even more. xD I must continue practicing. (I still can't post links because I mainly post on this forum once in a while. )