KGD - The Kewkky Thread! - Kirby's Wasteland: Dead Social

[falln]

i used dedede before i mained kirby!

and i switched to him for 1 game vs jeepy last year for game 3 because he timed me out game 2 with wario which was real lame.

Dedede's still probably my 2nd best character but I really try not to counterpick people in tournament

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Dedede sucks. He has all the same bad MUs as Kirby minus MUs he can chaingrab in, but an even worse MU vs MK than Kirby (MK is actually Dedede's worst MU, MK is worse for Dedede than ICs). I don't think Dedede's a reliable secondary for a Kirby main.

 

[falln]

i dont think dedede:mk is very bad, personally. I think it's only like -1 or some inbetween of -1 and -2

and dedede is incredibly fun to use. i enjoy playing stuff like dedede:mk and dedede:falco more than the matchups dedede wins pretty handily. id probably go back to maining him if kirbys little combos and fsmash werent so satisfying to land

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Coney says MK is Dedede's worst MU and he had to go Ness to beat me after my MK JV 2-stocked his Dedede game 1 last time we played (yes... I beat his Dedede but lost to his Ness... I DON'T KNOW THAT MATCH-UP! XD). If the MK knows the MU it's really bad. When I played Coney's Dedede last time, when I was nearing/in kill percent, I was spacing away all of his kill moves perfectly and actually lived until 250% until he killed me with a b-throw. For like 100% I was getting grabbed, but he couldn't kill off of them which is what mattered. Tbh, I really felt there wasn't much he could do as Dedede vs MK and after that game (which is why he beat me with Ness), I myself believe MK is Dedede's worst MU as well. Dedede can apply shield pressure to ICs with dair, go ham on Nana, get gimps, etc. ICs still **** Dedede, but Dedede has some advantageous things over ICs whereas he has non against MK (unless the MK doesn't know the MU, then he'll get hit by stuff he shouldn't).

I dunno what Dedede vs Falco is, I mean I know Falco wins but Coney's beaten Shugo before (Shugo's beaten him as well, but still). Feels like 65:35 Falco from what I see, but I don't play Dedede, so I don't know.

 

[falln]

yea i recognize all that

but disagree. d3 mains too emo to do what they do with other characters but as the big ol penguin

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Not sure what you mean by that... Was worded weird. XD

But you can't really blame Dedede players for thinking their character sucks (I think he sucks as well). MK, Olimar, Diddy, Falco, ICs, etc... All the top tiers can camp the craaaaaaaaaaaap out of Dedede (not sure if ICs camp Dedede, don't know that MU, but they CG him for one mis-spacing error, similar to how Kirby gets grabbed in that MU).

 

[Wumbo105]

Dedede is fun, no doubt. But his glaring weaknesses prevent him from overcoming that top-tier hellhole.

I do agree that he is a blast to use when you just don't give a hoot though.

 

[yoshi8984]

If I get D3 when I'm doing random FFAs with friends I just spam Side B. xD

 

[SupaSairentoZ7℠]

Lucario, Peach, and Kirby are pretty much the 3 characters I just stick with. Any others are just for fun.

 

[Luco]

Coney says MK is Dedede's worst MU and he had to go Ness to beat me after my MK JV 2-stocked his Dedede game 1 last time we played (yes... I beat his Dedede but lost to his Ness... I DON'T KNOW THAT MATCH-UP! XD). If the MK knows the MU it's really bad. When I played Coney's Dedede last time, when I was nearing/in kill percent, I was spacing away all of his kill moves perfectly and actually lived until 250% until he killed me with a b-throw. For like 100% I was getting grabbed, but he couldn't kill off of them which is what mattered. Tbh, I really felt there wasn't much he could do as Dedede vs MK and after that game (which is why he beat me with Ness), I myself believe MK is Dedede's worst MU as well. Dedede can apply shield pressure to ICs with dair, go ham on Nana, get gimps, etc. ICs still **** Dedede, but Dedede has some advantageous things over ICs whereas he has non against MK (unless the MK doesn't know the MU, then he'll get hit by stuff he shouldn't).

I dunno what Dedede vs Falco is, I mean I know Falco wins but Coney's beaten Shugo before (Shugo's beaten him as well, but still). Feels like 65:35 Falco from what I see, but I don't play Dedede, so I don't know.

All you need to know with ness is that his Fair is super spammy and has lots of priority.

Also if you'e past 150% then you're pretty much dead, due to the Bthrow but that isn't to say you can't do damage or even get a kill, it just means one grab and it's over, red rover.

And there's actually a lot more stuff, I assume you already know the above statements though actually. >.>

 

[SupaSairentoZ7℠]

Indeed. Fair is the only thing I hate about Ness.

 

[falln]

All you need to know with ness is that his Fair is super spammy and has lots of priority.

Also if you'e past 150% then you're pretty much dead, due to the Bthrow but that isn't to say you can't do damage or even get a kill, it just means one grab and it's over, red rover.

And there's actually a lot more stuff, I assume you already know the above statements though actually. >.>

change 150 to 120 and replace "due to the Bthrow" with "due to the bthrow fair uair bair dair ftilt"

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Coney was combo'ing me with his fair dude! I didn't know how to DI it! XD

And you get grabbed at 100%+, I think b-throw will kill from the center of the stage. 85-90% if it's at the ledge (I think).

Tbh, MK should have no reason to lose to Ness if he spaces. It was just unexpected when Coney switched to Ness and my mind wasn't mentally prepared for his Ness (the three people I thought would beat me that tourney were June, Coney and Korn. Korn didn't enter and I lost to June and Coney. Just not how I expected. June beat me with Falco/Diddy, he wasn't playing Lucario at all that day and I thought I'd lose to Coney's Dedede... Beat it but still lost to his Ness. XD). But yeah, I'm prepared for Coney's Dedede and Ness next time and think I can take him. We said we'd do Kirby vs Ness next time we play, but that was months ago, so I dunno if he still remembers. XD

 

[Luco]

Well there has been some speculation that the Ness vs. MK match-up is far more even than previously thought. I don't know entirely but i think it has something to do with the fact that MK can't just approach ness willy-nilly like he can with other characters, as ness has the retreating Fair and is just a wall of protection.

If the match-up is reduced to -1 instead of -2 Ness might get a rise in tier position due to favourable top tier match-ups.

Actually, scratch that. Marth....

And falln, you have a point. <3

 

[t!MmY]

I'm on the same side as Falln; Dedede doesn't do as badly as people say he does in the MK match-up. Yes it can be a challenging match-up, but I feel he has enough tools to deal with MK so that it's in the 'somewhere from -1 to -2' category as Falln put it. I'd say it's probably closer to -2, in my opinion.

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Only stage I think Dedede should give MK problems on is FD. If you know Dedede's hitboxes, you should be able to outspace him. FD is the stage that might give you problems due to Dedede living really long there and having a lot of space. I mean Coney himself says MK is Dedede's worst MU and he's currently the best Dedede, so I'll take his word for it.

 

[falln]

i personally like yoshi's island the most vs mk because the slant gives you free recovery with your up b if you do a really really low one.

coneys just a big ol negative nancy

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

Hmm, yeah I know that cause there's no falling animation but if I remember correctly Kirby's animation when the Final Cutter projectile comes out is still a 30-something frame animation of lag. Is that animation's lag less if he lands on the slant? Cause if not, MK can still powershield grab it or if he misses the powershield, then f-tilt. 30+ frames is definitely enough time to be punished.

 

[t!MmY]

MK is everybody's 'worst match-up'... so the saying goes. DKs rush in to fight Dedede, but they tremble in their proverbial boots when they have to face an MK.

(I think people should just be honest and say 'MK is my personal worst match-up')

 

[yoshi8984]

I haven't played any good MKs, my brother uses him, but he's not very good. XD

 

[falln]

Hmm, yeah I know that cause there's no falling animation but if I remember correctly Kirby's animation when the Final Cutter projectile comes out is still a 30-something frame animation of lag. Is that animation's lag less if he lands on the slant? Cause if not, MK can still powershield grab it or if he misses the powershield, then f-tilt. 30+ frames is definitely enough time to be punished.

lool that was for dedede cuz he pretty much goes from super armor -> landing animation so he gets his jumps back guaranteed.


**** that stage for kirby v mk tho i want to retain my ability to fly under the stage for recovery

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

MK is everybody's 'worst match-up'... so the saying goes. DKs rush in to fight Dedede, but they tremble in their proverbial boots when they have to face an MK.

(I think people should just be honest and say 'MK is my personal worst match-up')

My worst MU is Diddy. XD

I'm pretty bad at the MK ditto though, I prefer using Kirby vs MK than doing the ditto.

And I'm dumb Falln! >_<

If MK powershields it though, I'm sure if he still have enough frames to punish it since he won't be pushed back.

 

[falln]

mk can definitely punish it just fine. he just can't stop dedede from getting his jumps back which is what's important

 

[t!MmY]

I'm stoked because I won this week's Brawl tournament. Normally it wouldn't mean anything to me, except that I went all Kirby and beat t-0-m-m-y's* Meta Knight 3-1 in Winner's Finals, and 3-0 in Grand Finals. That's 6-1 against Meta Knight with Kirby... especially satisfying since he beat me in Meta Knight dittos the week prior. XD

He's probably just going to go ROB next time. >_>
But if I can take on his ROB I can take on anything he throws at me.

*name spelled-out to prevent name-searching and ensuing saltiness.

 

[Vinylic.]

Aw come on, there needs to be at least a tad bit of around here.

Other than that, Congrats. :D

 

[falln]

t0mmy tommy wat?

:]] grats tho

 

[Kawaii Poyo]

I'm stoked because I won this week's Brawl tournament. Normally it wouldn't mean anything to me, except that I went all Kirby and beat t-0-m-m-y's* Meta Knight 3-1 in Winner's Finals, and 3-0 in Grand Finals. That's 6-1 against Meta Knight with Kirby... especially satisfying since he beat me in Meta Knight dittos the week prior. XD

He's probably just going to go ROB next time. >_>
But if I can take on his ROB I can take on anything he throws at me.

*name spelled-out to prevent name-searching and ensuing saltiness.

Dang, good ****. :D

I hope you know the R.O.B. MU better than Chu considering t0mmy is your brother. Stingers beat Chu, give Chu advice on that MU, we know Chu should be beating him!

And you should be beating t0mmy's R.O.B. should he decide to use R.O.B. against you too. ;D

 

[Kewkky]

I thought namesearching was broken or something?

Either way t!mmy, that sounds awesome. Was he pissed? Did you have spectators? Do tell.

 

[Kmatt]

When he says, "this week's Brawl tournament", is he referring to a local weekly, or is there an official circuit now or something? I'm still kind of out of the loop.

 

[t!MmY]

Well the story is that a new (and radically awesome!) gaming hub opened up in my town by the name of 'Shoryuken League'. The owners are big fighting game enthusiasts and started running weekly tournament nights every Wednesday. Since they know t0mmy and I love Smash Bros they included it into the list of events.

t0mmy won the first two tournaments, he went ROB the first week and won - the story with that though is I had actually won 3-0 in Winners but the brackets were lost and they made us replay the entire set and I ended up losing in both Winners and Grand Finals after that. :\

The second week we did Meta Knight dittos in Winners and he beat me either 3-0 or 3-1. In Grand Finals we agreed to do Random Character battles. We went fairly even but then he randomed Meta Knight and I randomed Mario, ftl. XD

On the third week I just decided to go all Kirby and for some reason t0mmy went all Meta Knight, but I ended up winning 3-1 in Winners. I was just really spot-on with my punishes and I think t0mmy is just way more familiar with ROB vs Kirby than with Meta Knight vs Kirby... as odd as that seems. I thought for sure he'd go ROB in Grand Finals in order to win the tournament, but he must have decided to stick with Meta Knight for the practice.

If we had a hacked Wii I would have definitely saved the replays. The reads I got were really good and my timing and spacing were impressive. I tried to pull Chu's Giant Swing trick to catch random Shuttle Loops, but t0mmy didn't just throw them out wildly like Mew2King and all I ended up doing was getting Delayed Lag. :\

I hope you know the R.O.B. MU better than Chu considering t0mmy is your brother. Stingers beat Chu, give Chu advice on that MU, we know Chu should be beating him!

I am exceptional at the ROB match-up and am confident in my performance against anyone's ROB with my Kirby with the exception of t0mmy's and that's only because ROB has the advantage in the match-up.

Advice for the match-up is difficult to give because it's actually a game of exceptional spacing and catching your opponent off-guard. The only reason it's in ROB's favor is because he has longer/safer range with his tilts, nice ranged attacks with Laser/Gyro, and an impressive off-stage game. The only way I can give advice in this match-up is with specific answers to specific questions.

Either way t!mmy, that sounds awesome. Was he pissed? Did you have spectators? Do tell.

Since it was a small local tourney there was only one other guy watching, but t0mmy was definitely salty. I can tell when he's salty because he talks a lot in a specific tone of voice. I can't tell you want he said because I don't pay attention anymore. XD

 

[Labernash]

lololololol good stuff T1mmy.

Has anyone else punished Shuttle Loop with down-b? I did it on accident last tourney and started doing it on purpose. Up-throw to Shuttle loop? I Stone ontop of the SL. Quite silly, actually

 

[SupaSairentoZ7℠]

I go for Bair before he can do the glide attack.

 

[Vinylic.]

Falln, if you're going to whobo, good luck out there.

 

[Luco]

A couple things:

1. Personally, Dedede is one of the few characters I just can't use. He's at the bottom of my 'how well I can use tier list'.

2. As a Lucas main, Dair can stop a shuttle loop. Dunno what options kirby has to outprioritize it though so can't say with kirbs.

3. As a random tangent, anyone remember the kirby cartoon? I keep remembering when they said "Suck it up, kirby!" and my mind keeps changing it to "Suck it up, princess!" XD

 

[t!MmY]

This was the final game of the tournament.
Screenshotted. :3

 

[Luco]

Tommy? Why does that sound familiar?

Ahh nevermind.

Good work timmy!

 

[Luckay4Lyphe]

Which of Kirby's smashes has the most knockback? I know fsmash is prominent, but I wanted to know if the other ones might be stronger since they are slower.

 

[Vinylic.]

That would be usmash.

Kappy answered my wonders. I had a feeling that all smash attacks would have the same knockback.

 

[Kappy]

Both Usmash and Dsmash have good knockback, and are faster than Fsmash. LOL. Usmash is like an Fsmash going up, and Dsmash has two separate hitboxes - the one on Kirby's head is like a Usmash but a little weaker, and the tip of the feet are a weird horizontal hitbox that is weaker than Fsmash, but both are fairly strong and Usmash as a move catches people off-guard.

Hope that helps you, Luckay! LOL/

 

[Luckay4Lyphe]

Grounded hammer is the strongest though right