Is wave-dashing supposed to be hard?

[The Philosophy]

I wanted to learn how to wavedash for a school tournament in 2 weeks so I decided to watch a few youtube videos.

I tried WD on my own and I'm having problems doing it consistently. It comes out every 3-4 attempts. Is there something else I have to learn first or a something to make it easier?

 

[Twinkles]

It's difficult enough that I wouldn't try to cram it in 2 weeks, it'll probably hurt your game more than help if you're trying to use it in game and you flub it a lot. WDing is about as simple as a video can make it. jump, airdodge into ground.

 

[Varist]

Practice the timing. WD is nothing but timing. I have never known a single person who could not do it almost instantly perfectly with any character after a month. It can be learned and perfected overnight.

 

[The Philosophy]

Practice the timing. WD is nothing but timing. I have never known a single person who could not do it almost instantly perfectly with any character after a month. It can be learned and perfected overnight.

Overnight? Sigh, looks like I'm going to be learning how to this for a couple days then. I saw a few videos where players do them so effortlessly.. It kind of awe me.

Is it harder to do with certain characters? I've been trying to do it with Link.

 

[darkatma]

It's just a muscle memory to be worked on.

I gave up on my first attempt to learn how to wavedash. I tried again after 6 months and was finally able to get it.

 

[oukd]

Some characters have wavedashes where the time between jumping and airdodging is really fast & tight (Fox) and others where it's long enough that it's awkward (Bowser). Link should be pretty easy to do it with but isn't the most useful thing you could be practicing with him...I suggest you try wavedashing with all characters to find a character you can wavedash easily with, if that's the main thing you're focusing on.

If you're getting ready for a school tournament + assuming the people you're playing aren't adept at melee...imo learn how to shffl with ganon and go to town.

 

[WumpaWolfy]

I found implementing wavedashing effectively took much longer for me to learn than wavedashing itself. If you're sticking with link then definitely practice SHFFLing instead. Lcancelling will speed up your attacks so much and make your dair that much more deadly. Links wavedash distance is rather small and not particularly helpful.

 

[Armada]

I remember when Aniolas told me about WD and we started to practice it.
I remember we picked Luigi in training mode and changed how fast the game goes into a lot slower.

Then it was way easier (at least for me) so when I feelt I had controll over the WD I changed the speed of the game into a bit faster and tried doing the same thing again a bit faster.

Then I was on normal speed and did the same thing and after that I could do it.
I don't know if it will help you but it maybe will. Cause if you slow the game down I think it will be easier for you because of at least two reasons

1: You can make it way slower and start getting comfortable with how a WD actually work. Doing all the inputs so fast can be hard at first
2: It should be (from what I remember) way easier to see what goes wrong if you play when the game is slower. When you see what goes wrong you will be able to change it.

 

[Wake]

I started with Luigi as well, then I just slowly tried to implement it in friendlies with people until it became smooth. I would also practice wavedashing back and forth because when I first learned it, I realized that I was consistent wavedashing from right to left, but not left to right.

 

[KTSM]

Certainly try it out with Luigi. His is very easy and you get good results, and it's pretty fun to just slide around, which might give more incentive to practice it more. That's how I learned WD'ing.

Since this is for the purpose of a soon to come tournament, I'd suggest learning more on how to keep your opponents away with projectiles and learning how to be defensive if you're intent on using Link, as I have doubts that a school tournament will provide very competent players.

Annoy them with your projectiles, and learn to use Up-B out of shield, that alone could destroy newer players you might go against.

 

[Jockmaster]

Wavedashing is just a rhythm that you eventually learn and do instinctually.

Chances are you wont be able to effectively do it in two weeks

 

[DerfMidWest]

Depends on the person.
My sister learned to WD (and use it out of run/shield) is 30 minutes (but gave up on the game a week later)

It took me over a month to get it completely down.

I agree with the others though, learn SHFFLing first.

 

[Tarv]

I'm curious about something. If the timing for WDing is slightly different for each character, why start with learning how to WD with Luigi? Wouldn't this throw off a players' timing if they're trying to learn a specific character? I mean I learned how to WD the same way; started with Luigi in training mode and then moved on to trying to WD with other characters. But now in retrospect I wonder why I just didn't start learning to WD with Marth (or Falco since he was my original main.)

Also, this has already been stated but it's worth mentioning again learn to Shffl. It's honestly more important than WDing in the long run in my opinion but both have their uses.

Good luck

 

[Twinkles]

It'll give you a good base for finding when the WD works, and then you can play around with the timing at your leisure instead of going at it willy nilly feeling unsure if your timing will even work or not.

 

[Wolfy!]

Took me months before I could wavedash consistently. It just takes practice and diligence in your inputs, making sure you're not inputting buttons out of order or doing it too slow or fast (I still have problems with this all the time). You just have to practice and get used to it. I first started practicing wavedashing with Samus and eventually I figured out the timing for every other character. Just find a character that you feel is comfortable to wavedash with first and then try out different characters to get a feel for the timing.

 

[KirbyKaze]

People use Luigi for the same reason people (should) use Fox's dair shine in training mode as an initial training tool.

You can very easily see visually when you're doing it correctly. And it's easy to see how the differences in stick direction, slightly off timing, etc. can make for him.

 

[Tarv]

Well, makes sense to me. Like I said, I did it the same way just never understood why.

 

[Avalancer]

Learn the timing, and it will be easy. For me it's now as easy as pressing a button. For most people the hardest part about wavedashing is using it in your matches without forcing it too much.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

It's very important to learn to wavedash properly when you begin. Meaning perfect or almost wd. I learned to wd in 90 degree angle years ago, now I play Fox and Im ****ed

 

[Renth]

A message of warning to a new player learning the basics:

The wavedash technique it's self will not be hard for you to master with some time in your bedroom, however.. Applying it is a whole different story. Learning how to slide back and fourth is one thing, learning how to implement it into your game play preferences take much longer. Especially when you don't fully understand the utility of the mechanic or how to control it properly. I suggest you learn L canceling first, no matter how you play the game or adapt to put it into your style. The L cancel doesn't take much thought and will ease you into learning the more challenging advanced techniques.

 

[MikeHaggarTHAKJB]

it is in the beginning.

 

[Beat!]

Learn how to l-cancel first instead (or at least prioritize it, if you wanna practice both), and then pick Falco at the tournament and approach with short hop lasers into dair-shine. Most (all?) casual players won't stand a chance.

 

[Massive]

In my experience the best path to effective wavedashing usually starts with a firm understanding of wavelanding and triangle jumping.

Wavedashing itself just a very fast triangle jump; you only need to increase the speed once you have the timing down.
Wavelanding helps you understand the mechanics behind wavedashing (as well as the timing/angles), and adds a very important additional option out of an airborne state.

 

[Biglard]

Is it harder to do with certain characters? I've been trying to do it with Link.

The timing is very different from a character to another. It depends on the lag between the input of the jump and the time the character actually leaves the ground, which can go from (iirc) 3 to 7 frames.

Therefore the timing will be faster with Fox/ICs/Sheik/Pikachu than with Link/Ganon/Bowser for instance.

I don't know if Link is your main or not, but I strongly advise you to practice wavedash with your main and not another character in the beginning. When you get the hang of it, it won't be a problem with any character. Except maybe Bowser haha...

 

[Jockmaster]

yeah that 9 frame jump really ****s me when wding with Bowser...for like the first two minutes I use him I airdodge too fast and just end up shorthopping

 

[KhaosOverdrive]

I've been practicing wavedashes seriously for like a month now that I finally got a physical copy of the game. Nailed the timing the easiest with Marth and Luigi, moving onto Falco/Fox was rather rough at first (tons of SD's trying to do WD to ledge) but now I seem to get it every 7 out of 10 or so.
As people say, muscle memory is really important, once you nail it just try to keep it fresh.

 

[choknater]

i still miss wavedashes every now and then

and i main ice climbers, and i end up full jumping...

it is the worst mistake to make, ever, cuz full jumping in the wrong spot is like, the worst thing to do with ic's LOL

 

[Atrain]

If WDing is the only thing you're learning, don't even try to use it in your tourney. You have no experience WDing in a real match, which is what is really necessary. You're going to do worse if you try to use it. Just because you can WD once in a while doesn't mean you know how to use it effectively. You're going to be focusing on WDing and get flustered. I'm glad you're trying to learn, but don't try using it in your tourney.

Oh, Renth said it well:

A message of warning to a new player learning the basics:

The wavedash technique it's self will not be hard for you to master with some time in your bedroom, however.. Applying it is a whole different story. Learning how to slide back and fourth is one thing, learning how to implement it into your game play preferences take much longer. Especially when you don't fully understand the utility of the mechanic or how to control it properly.

 

[Varist]

It's very important to learn to wavedash properly when you begin. Meaning perfect or almost wd. I learned to wd in 90 degree angle years ago, now I play Fox and Im ****ed

i laughed so hard

 

[cannedbread]

when you airdodge, are you only limited to the 8 directions (not counting neutral) on the control stick, or can you get more precise in betweeny angles?

 

[Xyzz]

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=13908836&postcount=21

This should answer all your questions you might have regarding angles in melee
(tl;dr version for the super lazy: yes, you can air dodge in a finer resolution than 45 degrees)

 

[Twinkles]

Play enough good Fox players, you eventually learn about dat "Fox main recovery angle" lol

 

[The Philosophy]

Thanks for all the replies, everyone

I guess I'll practice WDing as I go and focus more on L-cancelling.

 

[fatman667]

Wavedashing isn't that hard once you get used to the timing, but it will take time to master.

 

[♡ⓛⓞⓥⓔ♡]

Every once in a while I find it ridiculous when some are explaining how you only need to practice some technique for like 30 minutes and after that you are supposed to be able to do it consistently. I find statements like that hard to believe because I see people messing up stuff all the time. I've played for several years and I frequently mess up l cancels which I find is one of the most difficult things in this game. Not to mention shffl which I **** up lot more often. I can wavedash ok but even my wavedashes are short. I suggest you to master l cancel and then shffl. Forget about wavedash for a while and focus on mastering control over your character.

 

[Xyzz]

Most people miss L cancels once in a while (unless they're Johnny :D), and I suppose we've all seen tournament sets end with the infamous Azen Dash

I also take a lot longer to learn new techniques than half a hour of focused practice. Especially to the point where I am confident enough to use them in actual tournament sets (ok, I do really focus on stuff I almost never mess up there, consistency > all...) I suppose after maybe four or five sessions of 10-15 minutes (my attention span rarely lasts even that long actually), I'm maaaybe good to use sth in friendlies (if it's reasonably easy... Like Sheik needle turnaround (only needed to make myself keep holding the b button, since I already learned to do reverse shl))...
then it's time to try to get to think of it as a "single command" rather than a "button combination" feeling (e.g. "do a full length wave dash" instead of "hit x, controlstick left/right, airdodge after precisely 5 frames").
Then it's time to actually start recognizing the spots where to use the technique (which usually is a lot harder, unless it's something stupid like L cancel).

 

[1337h4xx0r]

Some people learn how to wavedash faster than others. I gave up the first time I tried learning. On the other hand, I have a friend who literally starting wavedashing consistently in about 30 seconds, which is just ridiculous.

 

[JKJ]

Wavedashing is definitely important for spacing and mindgames, and also for comboing, but as Link your best friends are your Shffl's, L-cancels, projectile tricks, hookshot recoveries, and up-b'sout of shield. Wavedashing is definitely the next step, but for a school tournament (Where most kids will be casual players who think they're good) I'd say learning to l-cancel, effectively use projectiles, and up-b out of shield and you'll be fine.

Love the newbies! Keep the scene alive!

 

[Jayk]

I think I may be able to give some useful advice here as a player who was in your (OP's) position recently.

I learned how to do the techinical y-> l and down around January, but it took me until about July to really find it useful. Much more than just "doing it" its about using it effectively. If you're at the level where you can't even do it, I think you will find it much more helpful to do other stuff first.

L Cancelling (and Float Cancelling but thats only for Peach) and tech rolls were all much mroe helpful to me than wavedash

 

[Bones0]

I've been practicing wavedashes seriously for like a month now that I finally got a physical copy of the game. Nailed the timing the easiest with Marth and Luigi, moving onto Falco/Fox was rather rough at first (tons of SD's trying to do WD to ledge) but now I seem to get it every 7 out of 10 or so.
As people say, muscle memory is really important, once you nail it just try to keep it fresh.

Fox has a 3 frame jump, Marth has a 4 frame jump, and Falco has a 5 frame jump, so if you find Falco's harder than Marth's, you're tricking yourself. lol