Improve Your Moves!

[Dpete]

Looking through the pages of our beloved Kirby forums, I keep seeing numerous topics about "How do I use (certain move)" or "What combo's into (certain move)." In the spirit of organization, I thought it would be a good idea to compile all of our ideas into one topic, discussing proper usage of each move in Kirby's arsenal.

This thread is designed to analyze all of Kirby's moves, discussing when, where, how, and why to use a certain attack. Things to discuss about each move include KO potential, combo-ing, priority, etc. Feel free to post videos of good usage of moves, visuals are always nice when away from the game.

For basic info about each move, I would suggest taking a look at t!mmy's guide, located here: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=144039

I intend to discuss one move per week (every Wednesday), allowing us plenty of time to look at the possibilities for each and every move. Though lack of activity or need for more discussion will probably force me to be flexible . Please stay on topic and only discuss the move of the week. If you have a move you would like discussed further, send me a PM and I will consider it for the next week's discussion.

Enough jabbering, on to the good stuff...

Improve Your Moves!

• Week #1: Inhale (Neutral B) <pg.1 - pg.4>
• Week #2: Back Air <pg.4 - pg.6>
• Week #3: Forward Smash <pg.6>

 

[Dpete]

Improve Your Moves!

Week #1: Inhale (Neutral B)

The signature move of our fluffy hero seems to be a good starting place for our discussions.

Here's a good thread to get some background reading on the uses of Kirby's Inhale: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=153517

Some good starting discussions:

Combos into Inhale
Use of Super Armor/Heavy Frames
Use of Suction Power

Let's try to stay away from stolen powers and just discuss Kirby's default Neutral B.

 

[SpikeSpiegel19]

well u can use forward throw to upair to neutral B as a combo

I use the Inhale a lot as a counter due to its range and obvious SA frames Kirby can save himself with this move, not to mention it does 11-8 damage. I used Inhale to save myself from being donkey punched to oblivion that literally saved me losing first round

 

[2Grams]

If you get stuck with Snake's c4 and inhale him, the c4 disappears along with snake, then reapears when you spit snake back out. But it won't be stuck to you anymore.

 

[TwilightKirby]

I would like to point out that inhaling while in the air makes you fall slower... lol I don't remember what the situation was but my opponent did an attack and it missed because i had inhaled and then he got sucked in XD

But best use of inhale is if you know your opponent is about to use a move that you can outprioritize with inhale, to use it as a counter for that move. Lol I remember I SH inhaled an olimar 3 times in a row as he kept trying to use his aerials but kirbys inhale outprioritized it XD

 

[Tomato Kirby]

I thought we would get something like this. Actually, this move has some interesting trivia (super armor frames--which fraees, though?).

Anyway, I would like to remind everyone of the set-ups that lead into Inhale:
1. Running short-hop to Inhale
2. Ledge-hopped Inhale
3. Deadly Death Manuever (if they never fought a Kirby before)
4. Short-hopped air-dodge to Inhale?

 

[Brahma]

Tomato Kirby: What exactly is the deadly death manuever?

Kirby's B has two parts, the suction that pulls peopla in slightly, then the disjointed grab that extends from his body. Once they touch that grab hitbox they get swallowed, meaning that it interrupts any non-disjointed attack.

Also, as a grab, it does not restore double jumps. So if you catch someone after they use their air jump and they break out, they will only have their UpB left. I'm not sure if spit or copy restore double jumps though.

 

[SpikeSpiegel19]

I also like to use inhale when recovering b/c people start to give u more space when u get near the edge if they know u like to use Inahle when u get there. If u time it right u can use Inhale while falling to the edge and let go of B at the right time to grab the edge. This is a great way to get a potential stage KO or an easy ledge grab.

 

[1nconspikuous]

first off, dp, this is an _excellent_ idea for a thread. =) good lookin out. i wanted to do something like this but urs looks a lot more organized. =)

anyway, inhale gimps the approaches of a lot of chars, esp. ones that 'roll attack' (ie. sonic, jiggz, yoshi) or dash attack often. u can really force the opponent to play 'off' his/her game by limiting their options with the approach. if they can't adapt, u win. =)

 

[storm92]

Tomato Kirby: What exactly is the deadly death manuever?

Kirby's B has two parts, the suction that pulls peopla in slightly, then the disjointed grab that extends from his body. Once they touch that grab hitbox they get swallowed, meaning that it interrupts any non-disjointed attack.

Also, as a grab, it does not restore double jumps. So if you catch someone after they use their air jump and they break out, they will only have their UpB left. I'm not sure if spit or copy restore double jumps though.

The deadly death maneuver is this: here

Doesn't work all that well in Brawl, and it's an extremely basic Kirbycide.

 

[TwilightKirby]

Tomato Kirby: What exactly is the deadly death manuever?

Kirby's B has two parts, the suction that pulls peopla in slightly, then the disjointed grab that extends from his body. Once they touch that grab hitbox they get swallowed, meaning that it interrupts any non-disjointed attack.

Also, as a grab, it does not restore double jumps. So if you catch someone after they use their air jump and they break out, they will only have their UpB left. I'm not sure if spit or copy restore double jumps though.

For this reason inhaling yoshi out of his double jump is death. Even if your on stage you just have to step off and be barely below the edge when he breaks out since he can't gain any vertical recovery without his second jump. Poor yoshi with no upb =/ lol

 

[Delta Z]

I remember a thread like this on the Ike board.

2. Ledge-hopped Inhale

Ledge hop->Inhale->Starspike?

3. Deadly Death Manuever (if they never fought a Kirby before)

Only on guys that don't have long-range projectiles.

 

[CaliburChamp]

Use Inhale on characters that have super armor frames on their recovery. Like Snake and DDD. And maybe Ike... not sure if Aether out reaches inhale though.

 

[Percon]

Inhale is great. The aforementioned Kirbycides are a great way to lower your opponent's morale.

Spit is usually a what I do (if I'm not in a position to Kirbycide), as few powers are worth giving up the ability to kirbycide. (as a side note, the powers I actually do care for are Wario's, Bowser's, MK's and CF's)

Watch when using swallow... Lucario can Dair you right as he gets out of it. Again, spit is usually the better choice. 10-ish damage isn't too bad.

Like Wario's bite, Kirby's aerial grab can be used as a mix-up when attacking shields from the air. It's slower, though, so be wary when doing so.

 

[TwilightKirby]

Inhale is great. The aforementioned Kirbycides are a great way to
Like Wario's bite, Kirby's aerial grab can be used as a mix-up when attacking shields from the air. It's slower, though, so be wary when doing so.

totally agree with you but just make sure you are within the "instant inhale" range (the point when people would tumble into kirbys mouth) if they are just at the range that pulls them towards you then the shield blocks that. And if they are smart/know how to deal with kirbys inhale they will roll away. So you pretty much have to be really close to them, and unfortunately if they end up behind you, they have a very good chance to punish you.

It is a really good mix up but make sure to experiment and learn the range on it etc. in friendlies before using it competitively. (basically its harder to use for grabbing out of shields than wario's bite lol)

 

[Neb]

This is an awesome thread, good idea, Dr. Peterson.
._.b

 

[LordZero]

This move is indeed great for a surprise; however it is easily punished. when opponents get into the grab range, the ones with counter can use it and smack Kirby clean away, it also has the problem of being extremely laggy and leaves you open even for some of the slower attacks in the game.

Now for the good. This move is amazing in matches with more then one enemy, the star shot comes out fast and easily punishes enemies who think you are vulnerable. The Kirbycide is also a good way to finish a match quickly and Kirby is one of the few chars who can live if he does go kamikaze. I'm not sure what moves this one out prioritizes but there seems to be quite a few (and what seems like every single Sonic move).

copying powers is somewhat of a gamble; on one hand you now have a new attack at your disposal that could help you win, on the other hand you lose the Kirbycide and in some cases Kirby cannot use his new power to the same pottential as those he copies (MK, Lucario, DK, CF, Ganon) personally I would copy projectiles that can compete with the same attack your opponent has (Samus, Falco, Bowser, Charizard, Ivysaur) especially when Kirby can actually use it better then the original.

This move is one of the better surprise attacks in the game, but is also one of the biggest gambles; so I would say use it when you know you it cannot miss and don't spam it (unless you are so far in the lead it doesn't matter) because you will get punished.

 

[Dpete]

Also, as a grab, it does not restore double jumps. So if you catch someone after they use their air jump and they break out, they will only have their UpB left. I'm not sure if spit or copy restore double jumps though.

Anybody know about spit/copy restoring double jumps?

So it seems using Inhale during your recovery game can mix things up a bit to keep your opponent on their toes. When you are off the stage, Inhaling an approaching edge-guarder sets up well for a Kirbycide or Stagespike. When you are edge guarding, Inhaling can be used to capture your opponent while they are coming back to the stage, followed by spitting them farther away or going for a Kirbycide.

On stage, Inhale is a great supplement to your defensive game, hindering the approach of many characters.

Perhaps we should discuss priority Inhale has over recovery methods/aerials and approaches, as it seems this is where Inhale can be the most useful. Also, something I am unsure of is the line between Inhaling someone safely (out-prioritizing their attack) and Inahling someone yet taking damage (super armor). Anyone know much about this or want to run some tests on it?

 

[SpikeSpiegel19]

Spitting nor copying will restore double jumps, even if Kirby touches the ground the opponent doesn't get there double jumps back i love Inhale no Homo

 

[Deg222]

I wish I could comment about this move, but I really don't use this move all that much as you guys can tell in my videos. Maybe it's because I play online quite a lot so it's harder to pull off there? I end up just aerial camping the whole friggin time because people just love to camp with their projectiles.

Well from what I do know if you can pull off a star spike, it's an easy kill (stage spikes are so satisfying).

 

[lilthunder91013]

yea i'm not a big user of the inhale either. I do use it for certain characters(sometimes fox, cf, falco and ness )and kirbyciding

 

[Dpete]

Well, that's the point of this thread, to be able to use every move in Kirby's arsenal to some extent. If you use it effectively once, your opponent will have to consider avoiding it, possibly leaving them open to other more common attacks. If they don't avoid it, use it again.

 

[pnoid]

why dont we start taking combos off youtube and from players online and post them up in some organized fashion?

 

[lilthunder91013]

sounds like a good idea but that is not the point of this thread

 

[Qzzy]

If they struggle out before the suicide happens what happens to your own recovery? Will they most likely reach the stage before you? Really want to know.

Also, whenever I manage suck up MK, i usually just take his power. Would it be better if i didn't? Yeah, it's a smaller tornado, but star spiking Meta seems like it would be impossible with his recovery. I tried suiciding against him once, but he broke free and it didn't work out too well for me. Though that happened on Yoshi's island, so maybe I would have had a better chance a lower stage?


I've used Star Shot on a team battle recently. It was interesting.

I teamed up with a random guy, so we didn't have any real plan, but i liked what was happening, but i don't think he did. Star shot seemed pretty weak, but was quick and looked like it had decent priority. The opponents didn't let me spit them far, so that sucked. Using my teammate though felt like we were getting stage control again, with him temporarily safe and me shooting a big and fast projectile. I really wish we could have practiced with it before the tourney match. v_v

Also, this move has super armor? Oh my god, i got to check some guide to figure out when. I could have been getting so many more inhales if i knew this sooner. Raspberries!

 

[SpikeSpiegel19]

Kirbyicide is not a good option in my opinion, its been made into a 50/50 shot for Kirby, i suggest taking ur opponent down to just b4 they disappear and then spit them out and try and gimp them from their

 

[Deg222]

Yeah, the super armor takes place only while Kirby is in the action of actually swallowing them. For example if you sit their inhaling and Captain Falcon uses his Falcon kick, the Falcon kick will hit you, but you won't flinch and he'll get swallowed. The super armor frames basically work like a grab really. Don't rely on it to work often though.

 

[Sakki]

has anyone done any experimentation on what moves out prioritize/range Kirby's Inhale? If not, you guys think it'd be worthwhile to compile a list?

 

[Reioumu]

Watch what I do against Korn's snake at 1:27 on this video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ZDPaFTrxQ

Using inhale to kill snake at under 50%. Of course this is only plausible if they're near the edge. The only neutral which you would have a hard time doing this on is Yoshi's, and it's really helpful.

As Gonzo said, you can do an early Gonzo combo into inhale for some nice powers or extra damage.

-Rei

 

[Qzzy]

Oh, it's that kind of super armor. Lame.


SpikeSpiege, by 50/50 do you mean...

a 50/50 chance of us dying along with them/avoiding death like melee

or simply a 50/50 chance of actually being able to reach the bottom and completing the suicide?

If it's a fifty percent chance of simply dying with them as well it's still good if you're in the lead and have high percent.

Or do you mean something else entirely by the 50/50?

As for the star spiking, is it possible to try to gimp anyone after you spit them out? I figure you dropping that low kind of forces you to use most of your jumps for recovery. And don't they get a really high upward boost from being released from the star? I can't imagine kirby being quick enough to be able to chase them. ****, i wish i had people to practice with right now.

 

[Reioumu]

Oh, it's that kind of super armor. Lame.


SpikeSpiege, by 50/50 do you mean...

a 50/50 chance of us dying along with them/avoiding death like melee

or simply a 50/50 chance of actually being able to reach the bottom and completing the suicide?

If it's a fifty percent chance of simply dying with them as well it's still good if you're in the lead and have high percent.

Or do you mean something else entirely by the 50/50?

As for the star spiking, is it possible to try to gimp anyone after you spit them out? I figure you dropping that low kind of forces you to use most of your jumps for recovery. And don't they get a really high upward boost from being released from the star? I can't imagine kirby being quick enough to be able to chase them. ****, i wish i had people to practice with right now.

Actually, I think star spiking is just best for adding %, keeping your opponent off the edge, and it's also used for move diminishing so your edgeguarding options, such as B-air become stronger.

 

[quadz08]

ok I'm fairly new to kirby. what exactly is star spiking and stage spiking?

 

[Dpete]

ok I'm fairly new to kirby. what exactly is star spiking and stage spiking?

They are the same thing IIRC. Inhale, spit your opponent under the stage, then attack them as they try to get back, usually with a B-air. A lot of times they will be knocked into the bottom of the stage, then ricochet down to their doom.

 

[Maraphy]

Thank you for linking my thread

*Stays on topic* I think Kirbycides are awesome, and it's Kirby's best way to fight the characters he's got major disadvantages against XD

 

[ES Lite]

Kirbycides is the best, i'm happy that they still included in Brawl. Run off inhale would be pretty good i guess.

 

[Sarijy]

Lets not forget that inhale can let you swallow items: Link and Tlink's bombs, Diddy's Banana's, Wario's bike *Bad idea*, and Zamus's armor.
Swallowing is pretty useful, it removes Zamus's powerful armor from the game, especially when she throws it at you in the first few seconds.
Inhale can be useful in team matches to help your teammate recover, when you swallow them it sends them up to the stage

 

[lilthunder91013]

Lets not forget that inhale can let you swallow items: Link and Tlink's bombs, Diddy's Banana's, Wario's bike *Bad idea*, and Zamus's armor.
Swallowing is pretty useful, it removes Zamus's powerful armor from the game, especially when she throws it at you in the first few seconds.

i cant believe i never thought of the fact that kirby could sallow especially since my friend mains diddy

Inhale can be useful in team matches to help your teammate recover, when you swallow them it sends them up to the stage

unfortunately a think this only works with team damage on cuz i dont think u can swallow ur teammate w/o it

 

[Qzzy]

unfortunately a think this only works with team damage on cuz i dont think u can swallow ur teammate w/o it

The current standard for most tournaments is to have team attack on. ^_^

 

[Reioumu]

Lets not forget that inhale can let you swallow items: Link and Tlink's bombs, Diddy's Banana's, Wario's bike *Bad idea*, and Zamus's armor.
Swallowing is pretty useful, it removes Zamus's powerful armor from the game, especially when she throws it at you in the first few seconds.
Inhale can be useful in team matches to help your teammate recover, when you swallow them it sends them up to the stage

Too bad it's not practical to do it in the middle of combat really :/... Takes so **** long to swallow (that's what she said)
-Rei

 

[Colbert]

Swallowing stuff like Diddy's bananas doesn't tend to be that useful because he will always be looking for a followup after the banana toss. Kirby's swallowing animation is just as bad, probably worse, than the tripping animation.

With Zamus' armor, however, it's extremely useful.