Impossible Matchups

[illinialex24]

Are you really planning on spamming Pound just to try to outrange some sort of direct approach all day? Neither character is explicitly forced to approach.

No, you don't spam pound, althouhg you use it more than normal. You have to do many fake approaches but also keep yourself from getting dash u-smashed during that and then do fairs and pounds, as well as dash attacks. The thing is to stay outside of MArth's reach until he commits to anything.

 

[Zankoku]

What does Marth have to commit to that you don't?
He can fair outside of your range, IASA a lot of his ground stuff, and basically stop anything that isn't a Pound in the face or Rollout (which can be stopped by Counter). Marth can fake his own approaches with his aerial maneuverability, and staying out of Jiggs' reach is much easier than staying out of Marth's.

 

[Steel]

No, you don't spam pound, althouhg you use it more than normal. You have to do many fake approaches but also keep yourself from getting dash u-smashed during that and then do fairs and pounds, as well as dash attacks. The thing is to stay outside of MArth's reach until he commits to anything.

Fake approaches is all you have to debate with? Again you are getting into mind games and you can't discuss those in a match-up discussion.

"but also keep yourself from getting dash u-smashed.."

What? Do you really think that's an approach that marths will use?

"the thing is to stay outside of Marth's reach until he commits.."

Ok, what if Marth just stands there and waits for you?

 

[illinialex24]

Ok, first of all, its not as hard as many of you think to stay out of Marth's reach, and although its slightly harder than Jiggs, its not that bad. Next, if you airdodge and fake approaches, I have seen Marth's who try to u-smash, not commonly, but its the most punishment you will get so I explicitly warned of it. Also, rollout is pointless against Marth, but not because of counter. Counter can be gone through if you are going at full speed and then can kill Marth, no I am talking about his neutral B.

Okay, so you don't want mind games. Pound has better reach than fair, Jigglypuff can string u-airs over Marth and then avoid his D-air while stringing up uairs (really easy) for an F-smash, essentially killing him. Off-stage, Marth gets killed and has no chance if he is past a certain range.

If Marth tries to wait for you, you can use mindgames or no, but either way, you can still punish him. A good move is using a rising pound, so it avoids the grab and any punishment for it. Also, rollout without hitting as a mindgame (I know) works wonders. Also, it is so easy to edgehug Marth (I second him, I would know), and grabbing Marth really kills his game.

 

[Zankoku]

If Marth is not in reach of hitting with his fair yet in range of a Pound, he's not spacing properly. Pound has so much ending lag that if you land it on a shield it's guaranteed you'll be punished. WHAT KIND OF MARTH TRIES TO GET BACK TO THE GROUND WITH A DAIR?

 

[illinialex24]

Uhhh... a ****ty one that I played (I've played some great Marth's, but this one was bad). But its his move that gets priority if he's under Jigglypuff, and an air-dodge leaves you open. Next, you are forgetting about rising and falling pounds. The trick is that if you use them, you can DI away so you cannot be grabbed or anything but tilted, which is hard out of a shield. And if he is in range of a fair, you air dodge. That simple.

 

[HiddenBowser]

Ok, so the matchup is probably like 60-40 in marth's favor, but if both players are ****ing good, its basically an even matchup.

Also..Bowyer made a serious thread? And he isn't trolling?

Impressive.

lol, I'm putting that in my sig.

 

[Steel]

Again, I don't know what Marth's you are playing but they won't be just throwing out up smashes as you approach them.

Marth's probably won't use dairs while still on stage, it' s mostly for spike only. Fast falled fair is much more effective and marth can just air dodge out of those up airs (and then hit you with any aerial).

Also Marth can avoid an edge hug by just using a forward b stall, then use his up b and perhaps stage spike you.

Pounds are easily punished, if you think you can avoid the shield grab fine. Marth can just up-b out of shield and kill you rather early.

"And if he (i'm guessing you mean jiggs) is in range of a fair, you air dodge. That simple."

>_>

You are lacking any good arguments. It's obvious you haven't played any decent marths.

 

[illinialex24]

Yeah, I have. The dair was a bad example, and I know that fast-falled fairs are much better However, it still won't beat a Jiggs uair.. And if he b-'s up out of the shield, it depends on where you are. Its hard to be tipped there, and I definitely agree with Bowyer. With noobs its a strong advantage for MArth, but later it is much more even.

 

[Zankoku]

wtf, tilts are hard out of shield? It's relatively easy, and if it's the best option, it'll be done.

 

[HiddenBowser]

Again, I don't know what Marth's you are playing but they won't be just throwing out up smashes as you approach them.

lol

Also Marth can avoid an edge hug by just using a forward b stall, then use his up b and perhaps stage spike you.

Just roll to the edge and push diagnol down right when he up b's, you'll edge hug him.

Pounds are easily punished, if you think you can avoid the shield grab fine. Marth can just up-b out of shield and kill you rather early.

Pounding someones shield is stupid, but a marth who throws out an up b at the wrong time gets rested and as long as you keep switching things up, you will always be guessing if you should or shouldn't up b out of shield.

"And if he (i'm guessing you mean jiggs) is in range of a fair, you air dodge. That simple."

When you're close enough to fair him, he's probably gonna be in some move lag, and also, airdodging **** like this generally gets you hit by a move right after your airdodge finishes.

I thought you were talking about when marth was in fair range. When jiggs is in fair range, you better be in your **** shield.

 

[illinialex24]

I mean that you can't do it straight out of a shield like a u-tilt (won't work), u-smash, jump, grab, or other (of tap jump is on, which I dont have on). This gives you a few frames afdvantage, and the attack on pound last enough so you should get away.

And bowyer, if you're in range for a fair, you have to air dodge even though they can punish you faterwards. It helps you avoid the double fair, which is really nice.

 

[HiddenBowser]

wtf, tilts are hard out of shield? It's relatively easy, and if it's the best option, it'll be done.

OMG, they so are hard, stop hatin' (LOL I JUST USED THE WORD HATIN')

Also, people should go see the dark knight cause like its fricken sweet.

Edit: I just realized that I'm defending the puff!!?! lol

 

[illinialex24]

OMG, they so are hard, stop hatin' (LOL I JUST USED THE WORD HATIN')

Also, people should go see the dark knight cause like its fricken sweet.

I'm not saying its hard to do, I'm saying it has more starup lag than normal because you have to get rid of the shield. And I heard it was great, Dark Knight.

 

[HiddenBowser]

I'm not saying its hard to do, I'm saying it has more starup lag than normal because you have to get rid of the shield. And I heard it was great, Dark Knight.

I lost what you were talking about. My post wasn't targeted at you, but more of a generally troll like post that doesn't really have any place in a serious argument!!! lol

 

[illinialex24]

I lost what you were talking about. My post wasn't targeted at you, but more of a generally troll like post that doesn't really have any place in a serious argument!!! lol

Oh, ok. I thought you were being completely sarcastic because your post was so ridiculous. my point was just say a f-tilt takes a bit longer than a shield grab or so because you have to get rid of your shield, it cant be started in a shield.

 

[Steel]

lol



Just roll to the edge and push diagnol down right when he up b's, you'll edge hug him.

I'm saying when people try to edge hug marth they predict when he'll up b, the forward b stall helps this because Marth's up b sweet spots the ledge in most cases. I doubt anyone can edge hug in those few frames.
---

Pounding someones shield is stupid, but a marth who throws out an up b at the wrong time gets rested and as long as you keep switching things up, you will always be guessing if you should or shouldn't up b out of shield.

Yes, pounding a shield is stupid and you will get punished. I just threw the up b out there, seeing as it's an option out of shield.
---

When you're close enough to fair him, he's probably gonna be in some move lag, and also, airdodging **** like this generally gets you hit by a move right after your airdodge finishes.

Fair enough.
---

I thought you were talking about when marth was in fair range. When jiggs is in fair range, you better be in your **** shield.

bad@multiquoting

 

[Zankoku]

I'm not saying its hard to do, I'm saying it has more starup lag than normal because you have to get rid of the shield. And I heard it was great, Dark Knight.

You have 4 frames of lag from unshielding. This is Brawl, not Melee.

 

[illinialex24]

Yeah, I know. I didn't know the exact frame aount, I'm just saying it takes longer and with a proper DI, if the person was shielding when you use pound, you can avoid both (rising and falling pounds allow for more DI input than a standard pound, or so has been my experience).

 

[HiddenBowser]

bad@multiquoting

lol, nice

(10 char)

 

[Emblem Lord]

This is ridiculous. If Marth camps Jiggz what can she do that won't put her in danger?

And yes Jiggz has to approach unless she has the stock lead. If she camps, Marth will slowly advance until Jiggz runs out of stage and then she is on the edge which is a bad position to be in. She could ledge stall, but there are ways around that.

So Jiggz has to come to Marth and that's when there are problems. He has more range and priority overall and is stronger. Only pound will beat out his moves, but it can't be spammed. It has to be used sparringly. Jiggz will also die very early while Marth will not as long as he spaces well and doesn't do anything rash.

He can easily wall Jiggz and force her to approach and she WILL eat some hits before she gets inside and even if she does get past his camping she still has to contend with being jabbed back out or Dancing Blade.

How is this even?

The only reason it's not a blow-out is because Jiggz has good edgeguarding and good recovery.

 

[Demenise]

Jigglypuff only beats Marth in aerial manuverability, recovery, and floatiness. Basically, Jigglypuff is screwed on stage completely. The only way Jigglypuff will do well is with gimping, but because of the game's physics and the fact that Jiggly doesn't have a spike, Marth will be able to recover from just about everywhere. Marth definitely has an advantage in this match up. It's AT LEAST 30-70 in Marth's favor, but I'm pretty sure that it can even be 25-75 or even 20-80 in Marth's favor.

 

[HiddenBowser]

And yes Jiggz has to approach unless she has the stock lead. If she camps, Marth will slowly advance until Jiggz runs out of stage and then she is on the edge which is a bad position to be in. She could ledge stall, but there are ways around that.

How the **** is marth going to back jiggs to the edge. And why does jiggs have to approach marth? Jiggs could seriously sit there in the her shield and marth would have the following options:

1) sh a fair and retreat (if he didn't retreat he would get owned by a shield grab or sh aerial outta shield)
2) walk and ftilt/utilt (which i would power shield and then own you in the face afterwards)
3) run up and grab (which if i saw it coming I would hit marth ahead of time)

In either case, I see no backing up of the jiggs.

So Jiggz has to come to Marth and that's when there are problems. He has more range and priority overall and is stronger. Only pound will beat out his moves, but it can't be spammed. It has to be used sparringly. Jiggz will also die very early while Marth will not as long as he spaces well and doesn't do anything rash.

Shield is overpowered in this game and basically if I stay on the ground and use it to my advantage and since marth's aerials are somewhat laggy (I'm not talking about landing lag), it basically negates the whole aerial priority problem. Sure it limits my ways to approach but its not that big of a problem.

He can easily wall Jiggz and force her to approach and she WILL eat some hits before she gets inside and even if she does get past his camping she still has to contend with being jabbed back out or Dancing Blade.

In most cases, if I hit you once or twice, I'm not staying there, I'm going to get the **** away immediately afterwards.

How is this even?

I'd say 60-40 in marth's favor but, again, at a high level of play, 60-40 is practically even.

Also, how the **** do you plan on killing jiggs before like 120%? If I basically watch out for the moves that will kill me before that percent, you're going to have a terrible time landing them.

 

[HiddenBowser]

Jigglypuff only beats Marth in aerial manuverability.

are you sure about that? They totally nerfed jiggs manuverability

 

[Emblem Lord]

Start sitting in your shield and Marth's Shieldbreaker will follow shortly.

Jiggz gets her shield broken and she is gone.

Also I could just walk up to your shield and *gasp*...SPACE A D-TILT.

Now you have to react. You have to roll away. If you roll towards me then you get man handled. Same if you spot dodge. Jumping away might work but it's slower.

And if sitting in your shield is your best option in the match then it really is impossible for Jiggz since having an opponent sit in their shield makes things easy for Marth because he is really good at shield pressure.

70/30 at BEST. 75/25 at worst.

Marth is ranked 12th in aerial manuverability. Jiggz is around 2nd or 3rd.

 

[HiddenBowser]

Start sitting in your shield and Marth's Shieldbreaker will follow shortly.

Jiggz gets her shield broken and she is gone.

I've only seen shield breaker break shields in ******** situations where the person sitting in their shield could have seen it coming a ****ing mile away but instead decides to have down syndrome and sit there. Plus the lag is long enough to punish the move afterwards.

Also I could just walk up to your shield and *gasp*...SPACE A D-TILT.

Now you have to react. You have to roll away. If you roll towards me then you get man handled. Same if you spot dodge. Jumping away might work but it's slower.

Only a ******* would roll into you and spot dodge is also generally a ******** option. Why wouldn't I just sh over your dtilt and poke you with a fair?

And if sitting in your shield is your best option in the match then it really is impossible for Jiggz since having an opponent sit in their shield makes things easy for Marth because he is really good at shield pressure.

By the term "sitting in my shield", I mean "standing there and shielding or powershielding if you are going to hit me"

70/30 at BEST. 75/25 at worst.

30-70 jiggs favor at best, 60-40 at what it actually is, or 59.3-40.7 at worst.

Marth is ranked 12th in aerial manuverability. Jiggz is around 2nd or 3rd.

Oh... ok.

 

[Greenstreet]

wow thats kinda cool. yer jiggly is alot better in this game.. but stuff like that makes me wonder..

 

[Emblem Lord]

A don't think Jiggz is fast enough to punish a fully spaced Shieldbreaker.

Also if you just want stand around and be defensive I'll just poke you. Marth's d-tilt is safe even when powershielded. He just has to space at the tip..which any good Marth does anyway.

You will just be poked at all day until you decide to do something and that something w/e it is will most likely be stuffed by a jab or f-tilt.

Also the only way you will SH fair when I d-tilt is if you simply expect it. It's not something you can react too. And if You start doing that then I can f-tilt. You think a good Marth will do 3 D-tilts in a row while you SH over them? They do one. And wait. And react. That's the beauty of the move. Marth doesn't have to commit to it.

The main point is that Marth is in control of the fight and Jiggz has much less room for error.

Beating Ankoku's sorry Marth means nothing.

<3 Ankoku

 

[HiddenBowser]

A don't think Jiggz is fast enough to punish a fully spaced Shieldbreaker.

Also if you just want stand around and be defensive I'll just poke you. Marth's d-tilt is safe even when powershielded. He just has to space at the tip..which any good Marth does anyway.

You will just be poked at all day until you decide to do something and that something w/e it is will most likely be stuffed by a jab or f-tilt.

Also the only way you will SH fair when I d-tilt is if you simply expect it. It's not something you can react too. And if You start doing that then I can f-tilt. You think a good Marth will do 3 D-tilts in a row while you SH over them? They do one. And wait. And react. That's the beauty of the move. Marth doesn't have to commit to it.

The main point is that Marth is in control of the fight and Jiggz has much less room for error.

Beating Ankoku's sorry Marth means nothing.

<3 Ankoku

Now you're saying that jiggs players don't know how to switch things up and react to things differently.

The point is that this ****ing game called brawl is basically a giant game of rock paper scissors. For every option of approach or camping that marth has, jiggs has both an answer and a way to get owned. It seriously just comes down to who can get into the other persons head enough times and force them to do things so that they want them to do in order to get enough poke damage and kill them.

Basically if I'm approaching all the time, it comes down to I run at you, you either attack, shield, or grab and I can either run and shield, grab, or attack. My shield beats your attack but loses to your grab and goes even with your shield. My grab beats your shield but loses to your attack and goes even with your grab. My attack beats your grab but loses to your shield and looses slightly to your attack, but it still doesn't make attacking any less important. My attack slightly losing to your attack is the only reason why marth has a slightly better match up but it isn't enough to say its one sided. It does after all just limit my general approach ever so slightly. Going all out with attacks could afterall, still beat the **** outta your sorry ***.

So basically it comes down to who is better at the game of rock paper scissors. Which, without mindgames, is a 50-50 shot at winning, and since my attack isn't quite as good as yours, I would say its 60-40 in marths favor.

Also, marth really isn't that great in brawl.

 

[Emblem Lord]

You are just pulling things out of your *** honestly.

You mean to tell me you don't have any solid game plan or poke traps or anything that you fall back on in Brawl? It's ludicrous to think that anyone just throws out random moves at any time in hopes of countering a characters approach method.

Your shield does not beat my attack. You shield and I'm still in control sir. Hence the term, shield pressure.

Marth isn't that great in Brawl?

Really? Is that why he is usually ranked no less then 5th on a tier list made by anyone with decent knowledge of the game? Is that why he is placing well in tournies? Is that why he has really good match-ups overall.

You know who isn't that great? Jiggz.

Actually she is horrendous.

But both of these facts are irrelevant to the match-up.

Marth has the range, the speed, the power and the options.

70/30.

And ALL fighting games are about mindgames in the end. But mindgames are intangible. You can't see them or touch them research them. Getting into a players head is all pyschological and your success or failure rate will dpend on your experience and how good your opponent is at seeing through mindgames or not. There is no place for this kind of talk in match-up discussion.

Match-up discussion is comparing the tools of one character to another and seeing who comes out on top.

Guess what?

Marth has superior tools.

If you want to get in theoretics then if a player could read all his opponents perfectly then yes they could beat anyone with any character with perfect mindgames.

Too bad no such person exist.

That's where match-up discussion comes in.

Anyway, It's clear to me that your argument is crushed and your last post was just nonsense and anyone can see that.

I'm done here.

 

[Zankoku]

If you want to play RPS Marth vs Jiggs, Marth has to win fewer RPS clashes. His options are less punishable, stronger, and Jiggs is much, much, lighter.

 

[HiddenBowser]

Anyway, It's clear to me that your argument is crushed and your last post was just nonsense and anyone can see that.

Sure, there are game plans involved in brawl but you're a moron if you can't see that this game is seriously just about looking at your options, weighing the possible outcomes, and then ultimately playing one large game of rock paper scissors using that information until one character has enough percent to be killed.

If you want to play RPS Marth vs Jiggs, Marth has to win fewer RPS clashes. His options are less punishable, stronger, and Jiggs is much, much, lighter.

I don't know what RPS means.

 

[HiddenBowser]

You know who isn't that great? Jiggz.

No ****, have you seen any of my other posts, lol. But that doesn't change the fact that marth isn't that great either.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Top 5 sounds great to me.

Maybe I'm just being silly.

And all fighting games are elaborate games of rock paper scissors.

Brawl gives you less options overall and the defensive options are stronger then offensive options, but the basics of fighting games like poking, playing safe, controlling space etc, still apply in brawl.

Marth does these things better then Jiggz. And that's the bottom line.

 

[Zankoku]

Sure, there are game plans involved in brawl but you're a moron if you can't see that this game is seriously just about looking at your options, weighing the possible outcomes, and then ultimately playing one large game of rock paper scissors using that information until one character has enough percent to be killed.



I don't know what RPS means.

See, I can answer your question without having to say a thing.

 

[HiddenBowser]

See, I can answer your question without having to say a thing.

lol, shut up.

Top 5 sounds great to me.

Maybe I'm just being silly.

And all fighting games are elaborate games of rock paper scissors.

Brawl gives you less options overall and the defensive options are stronger then offensive options, but the basics of fighting games like poking, playing safe, controlling space etc, still apply in brawl.

Marth does these things better then Jiggz. And that's the bottom line.

I guess I am overlooking some things a little bit, so I guess on paper Marth wins you win this argument.

But he still isn't hard enough to be put up on the front page... or is he? hmm. maybe I'll get rid of ness and put marth??? hmm. but then again, I've never had a problem with marth in tournament play. lol, i love talking to myself

Edit: 65-35 match up

 

[illinialex24]

Bowyer, I agree that Jigglypuff isn't that great but she appears worse than she is (something we disagree about). The fact is that approaching with a d-tilt is possibly the stupidest argument I have ever heard because is it so easy to punish, and the same thing with an obvious shieldbreaker (slightly less stupid but up there). Both leave Marth vulnerable, and much less so than a f-tilt approach. And once again, who says Jigglypuff has to make the approach. With the amazing shields in brawl, its really up for grabs. And finally, whoever posted saying that if "Marth is in range of Jigglypuff's pound but Jigglypuff isn't in range of his fair, then he isn't spacing correctly" obviously isn't considering the opponent. It's like saying if I am in range of Olimar's moves but he is not in range of my fair (choose his B-up, U-smash, or f-smash, all of which essentially kill a Jigglypuff approach without massive air-doding, which is highly punishable) is obviously playing too weak opponents. I'm finally starting to see the wisdom in Bowyer's posts and he is right about all the impossible matchups except for DDD. Emblem, if d-tilt was your argument, then thats pathetic and you should lose the "Lord" in your name. I second Marth and I know even a well spaced d-tilt or shieldbreaker leaves you vulnerable (even more so than pounding a shield).

And I'm on 56K connection (dial-up) on vacation so I'm not going to be on as much.

And I would be much more willing to accept an approach such as a f-tilt, because it leaves you less vulnerable for attack.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Marth's d-tilt comes out on frame 7. It has IASA frames. Know what those are? Interruptible As Soon As. This means that when this attack reaches a specific part in the animation Marth can cancel it into any action he pleases. This part being when he draws his arm back which happens almost immediately after the sword poke.

This means he isn't vulnerable when he does the move because if he is afraid of something he can DO WHATEVER THE **** HE WANTS BY CANCELLING THE LAG!!!!

You shield all day with Jiggz and Marth gets pokes all day, meaning he controls the match.

Pounding a shield is one of the most unsafe things you can do and Marth's f-tilt is less safe then his d-tilt. You second Marth eh?

Please don't. It's an insult to the Marth community and to the legendary prince himself. You don't know **** about him and TBH it's better if you don't if you can't even understand why he rocks Jiggz.

Did I mention how you don't know anything about Marth?

Just checking.

 

[Steel]

Bowyer, I agree that Jigglypuff isn't that great but she appears worse than she is (something we disagree about). The fact is that approaching with a d-tilt is possibly the stupidest argument I have ever heard because is it so easy to punish, and the same thing with an obvious shieldbreaker (slightly less stupid but up there). Both leave Marth vulnerable, and much less so than a f-tilt approach. And once again, who says Jigglypuff has to make the approach. With the amazing shields in brawl, its really up for grabs. And finally, whoever posted saying that if "Marth is in range of Jigglypuff's pound but Jigglypuff isn't in range of his fair, then he isn't spacing correctly" obviously isn't considering the opponent. It's like saying if I am in range of Olimar's moves but he is not in range of my fair (choose his B-up, U-smash, or f-smash, all of which essentially kill a Jigglypuff approach without massive air-doding, which is highly punishable) is obviously playing too weak opponents. I'm finally starting to see the wisdom in Bowyer's posts and he is right about all the impossible matchups except for DDD. Emblem, if d-tilt was your argument, then thats pathetic and you should lose the "Lord" in your name. I second Marth and I know even a well spaced d-tilt or shieldbreaker leaves you vulnerable (even more so than pounding a shield).

And I'm on 56K connection (dial-up) on vacation so I'm not going to be on as much.

And I would be much more willing to accept an approach such as a f-tilt, because it leaves you less vulnerable for attack.

I lol'd when I read this. Dtilt less safe than pounding a shield? hahah

 

[illinialex24]

Marth's d-tilt comes out on frame 7. It has IASA frames. Know what those are? Interruptible As Soon As. This means that when this attack reaches a specific part in the animation Marth can cancel it into any action he pleases. This part being when he draws his arm back which happens almost immediately after the sword poke.

This means he isn't vulnerable when he does the move because if he is afraid of something he can DO WHATEVER THE **** HE WANTS BY CANCELLING THE LAG!!!!

You shield all day with Jiggz and Marth gets pokes all day, meaning he controls the match.

Pounding a shield is one of the most unsafe things you can do and Marth's f-tilt is less safe then his d-tilt. You second Marth eh?

Please don't. It's an insult to the Marth community and to the legendary prince himself. You don't know **** about him and TBH it's better if you don't if you can't even understand why he rocks Jiggz.

Did I mention how you don't know anything about Marth?

Just checking.

I'm not saying your not a better player than me (you probably are), but I am saying that the matchup is much closer than you think. Yes I know what an IASA frame is and why WOULD I SHIELD ALL DAY AGAINST A MARTH! He has shieldbreaker, I'm not ********. And why would you try to use a ground attack on an aerial character, even if you can cancel it, Jigglypuff would just fair Marth. Pounding a shield isn't great (I didn't know Marth had IASA frames on his d-tilt, so I guess d-tilting is safer than f-tilting), but it has a better DI ability than a shieldbreaker and so you can be decently away by the time he tries to attack you. And I do know a fair amount of stuff with Marth, just not the nerd stuff that you know, about how many frames it takes before I can cancel the move, just roughly how long it takes before I can attack again. My marth isn't great, (he's worse on Wifi compared to another Marth, because I use his mini-WoP pretty far), but I do know how to play a Marth and what strategy he will use. Get a life.