***IMPORTANT DISCOVERY*** Spammed attacks greatly diminish in knockback!

[Chaosblade77]

Very nice. Now people can't spam fsmashes and Marths neutral B for a whole match anymore. Rather than becoming slightly ineffective they become totally ineffective.

My brother will hate this.

 

[PanzerOceania]

as long as we are talking about just the basic mechanics in the game, I know 99.9% of the time it won't really matter, but in levels like Delfino Plaza that have water that the characters have been seen swimming in: I have a few questions.

1. do characters simply float
2. If you try to attack while in the water, what happens? nothing? aerial attacks? what?
3. can you force your character to sink in any way?

just covering the bases.

also someone might want to right up the basics of crawling, what characters can do it, and practical applications of it.

 

[RyokoYaksa]

Um... wasn't it like that in every smash game?

Not if you read the last paragraph of my post, it wasn't.

 

[Yuna]

also someone might want to right up the basics of crawling, what characters can do it, and practical applications of it.

None. Zero. Zilch.

 

[PanzerOceania]

also how can we measure each characters ground traction, and how many different distinct kinds of terrain are there?

for example

the ice climbers final smash brings the giant ice mountain. Now I am assuming they can walk fairly easy on it while everyone else slips and slides right? This move then would be ineffective against another ice climbers player.

Furthermore on their stage that is covered in ice, would this give ice climber mainers an inherent advantage over other players on that specific level? we really need to map out character traction, unfortunately I do not yet have a copy of the game (not until US launch)

any thoughts?

 

[lengeta]

PEOPLE ARE TOO BUSY MAKING UP "ADVANCED TECHS" WITH ******** NAMES WHILE NOT TESTING BASIC GAME MECHANICS

/agree
I love watching people trying the same Melee approaches over and over again, failure after failure. It is sad to see everyone hugging the wall on recoveries only to hit a ceiling and falling to their death though, I feel bad for Luigi's recovery.

 

[Vigilant Gambit]

I never would've noticed if not for this thread. I'll experiment with this some time today.

 

[Yuna]

the ice climbers final smash brings the giant ice mountain. Now I am assuming they can walk fairly easy on it while everyone else slips and slides right? This move then would be ineffective against another ice climbers player.

Furthermore on their stage that is covered in ice, would this give ice climber mainers an inherent advantage over other players on that specific level? we really need to map out character traction, unfortunately I do not yet have a copy of the game (not until US launch) any thoughts?

How come you don't get damaged by your own Pokémon? Same logic here. An Ice Climber would be hit by the Ice Climber FS if he/she themselves was not the one who initiated it.

Ice Climbers cannot walk on the mountain as it's all a sloping hill. The Ice Climbers who initiated the FS will just not get damaged from touching it. I can only imagine the epic win of two sets of ICs initiating their FS at the same time, thus making it impossible for both parties to stay on the stage (and possibly lag the game to death).

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

What's more, the Ice Climber's final smash doesn't make you slip at all. If you touch the iceberg your character starts taking rapid annoying damage. It's like being hit by a fire flower, only cold and solid.

 

[PanzerOceania]

ok, well scratch that whole example, but there is still the study of traction yes? or are all characters and terrains equal? ( I KNOW some ice levels must produce some slide yes?)

 

[NESSBOUNDER]

ok, well scratch that whole example, but there is still the study of traction yes? or are all characters and terrains equal? ( I KNOW some ice levels must produce some slide yes?)

Luigi and ICs still have a bit of slide, but not as much as in Melee.

 

[RyokoYaksa]

None. Zero. Zilch.

Perhaps the answer Marth's SH aerial nonsense is crawling under him. I could very well be wrong in the case of Marth, but it's worth trying. It also helps to close the gap vs. projectile spam. Especially with Sheik, Snake, and possibly ZSS, who are all very low to the ground.

 

[InvincibleAgent]

I knew it! Sheik and Fox for bottom tier!

 

[kashikomarimashita]

The decreasing damage and knockback from spammed moves is true. It said so in last months Famitsu Magazine. I believe i posted this info elsewhere before.

 

[drengist]

Actually Ice Climbers had an advantage in certain terrains in Melee. They didn't slide so much on the UFO for example.

 

[Samus_2021]

...I can only imagine the epic win of two sets of ICs initiating their FS at the same time, thus making it impossible for both parties to stay on the stage (and possibly lag the game to death).

I may be mistaken, but is the Smash Ball considered an Item by which I mean you can increase/decrease its appearance in the Item Switch menu? Or is it just random/appears once per match where the only option is to turn it on/off? If the latter is true, then I can't see two characters having a Smash Ball at the same time.

 

[Yuna]

I may be mistaken, but is the Smash Ball considered an Item by which I mean you can increase/decrease its appearance in the Item Switch menu? Or is it just random/appears once per match where the only option is to turn it on/off? If the latter is true, then I can't see two characters having a Smash Ball at the same time.

I believe it appears once every 2-3 minutes or something. I don't know if a new one will appear if one is already on the stage/has already been caught (though not initiated) though.

 

[red stone]

yay brawl is not that noob friendly. since many noobs out there spam the same moves, they will have to learn to do more to compete with the best. i'm happier now

 

[F00LY]

Does dying and coming back to life reset the diminished damage/knockback, or does it carry over throughout the duration of the entire match regardless of what stock number you're on?

 

[Gudo]

@OP:

Does this apply to just A attacks or special moves as well, do you know?

e.g. does it affect arrow spamming Pits, or will it only punish you for spamming the same A move over and over again?

 

[Yuna]

An important question is if the game treats Zelda's Bair and Fair as the same move or if you can spam the one for damage and the other for KO:ing. I'll test it tomorrow.

 

[ecstatic]

Nice find! Does this decomfirm AMC, though?

Vid of air momentum cancel: http://www.brawlcentral.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=76&p=96848

Just wait for awhile, the vid shoes a Fox infinite for a bit.

 

[S2]

Looking at an early post about the possibility of this being useful for combos (because of the reduced knockback)....

would it also reduce the hitstun as the knockback gets lower?

Oh well, on another note it'll stop projectile spammers from being as annoying. I felt that in Melee this aspect never had much of an impact, Falco could laser spam you for hours and it still did enough damage to be threatening. I see Pit and I can't help but think his arrows are going to be a spam fest.

 

[SamuraiPanda]

I also realized something else as I keep watching these videos... This could easily explain why the game lasts until 150%+. In Melee, we could Melee spam our KO attacks until it actually kills them. But in Brawl when people do that, they end up not being able to kill them anymore because of the drastically reduced knockback. This could make the game MUCH faster, and bring the tournaments back up to 4 stock once people learn to save their KO attacks until damage is racked up. Wow. Then throw in the possiblity of comboing better by purposefully doing this on weaker attacks. Assuming this is true... Ryoko, you may have discovered the most important aspect of Brawl so far. To the extent that it'll change how Brawl itself is played.

Why isn't this topic like 20 pages already? We need some people with Brawl to run tests and see if this is real, and if so, how drastic the knockback reduction is.

 

[F@lc0-san]

I also realized something else as I keep watching these videos... This could easily explain why the game lasts until 150%+. In Melee, we could Melee spam our KO attacks until it actually kills them. But in Brawl when people do that, they end up not being able to kill them anymore because of the drastically reduced knockback. This could make the game MUCH faster, and bring the tournaments back up to 4 stock once people learn to save their KO attacks until damage is racked up. Wow. Then throw in the possiblity of comboing better by purposefully doing this on weaker attacks. Assuming this is true... Ryoko, you may have discovered the most important aspect of Brawl so far. To the extent that it'll change how Brawl itself is played.

Why isn't this topic like 20 pages already? We need some people with Brawl to run tests and see if this is real, and if so, how drastic the knockback reduction is.

Too busy crying about no L-canceling and Wave Dashing I guess.l

 

[err]

maybe we need tournies to run at 3 stock games till we get better

 

[sv3]

Too busy crying about no L-canceling and Wave Dashing I guess.l

Unfortunately I guess the ones that want to try this out further don't have Brawl yet.

Everyone who does have Brawl seems to want to post their own soapbox speech about how Brawl is terrible.

 

[TheDuplexDuo]

Too busy crying about no L-canceling and Wave Dashing I guess.l

Indeed. This is an AMAZING discovery! This thread is BUMP worthy, others MUST see this. This is the most radical change from Melee! Some Video comfirmation would be most appreciated!

OFF TOPIC : Did you know it's Pancake day today?​

 

[xxhyosukexx]

oh noes,this means I will be forced to do moves other than falcons all powerful knee.

 

[Chexr]

This is awesome news for jigglypuffs wall of pain.

 

[F@lc0-san]

Actually, this goes well with some aerials being uber laggy, maybe Sakurai intended these powerfull but slow moves to be KILL moves, not rack up damage by using the same move over and over again while L-canceling the Lag.

 

[h1roshi]

very interestng, is this the missing link. is this the added depth that we've been looking for...peace

-hiro

 

[Lunaretic]

I'm really starting to see why some characters like Ike and Zelda are KOing at such insanely low percents compared to others, with a field of viable KO moves, they seem to always have at least one KO move at full charge, and at least one weak enough to combo decently.

 

[Jellybelly]

See, it didn't take long for brawls mechanics to be discovered.

Variety really is the spice of life...or brawl.

 

[Sl1th]

Great find, I hope this is true because it will make the game much more competitive and deep.

 

[Uchiha.Sanosuke]

So is this the first big game-changing discovery we've made?

I'm really hoping that it's this discovery that finally separates Melee from Brawl and distinguishes SSBB as an entirely new game.

It's exciting, isn't it?

 

[Big Burn]

this is very interesting indeed...

 

[Seanson]

This was in melee. It is called "stale moves" if you didn't know.

 

[Rogueleader89]

I can't believe that all these brawl owners have been so busy looking for advanced technics and playing their favorite characters over and over again that they missed such a simple gameplay mechanic that has a great impact on the gameplay.

Glad to hear that this is in the game, can't wait to see how it affects competitive play.

 

[Lunaretic]

This was in melee. It is called "stale moves" if you didn't know.

This was already covered, it is in melee, but only the dmg %'s and not to the degree we seem to be seeing in brawl.