Ike Vs meta knight advantage

[zealotscout]

mk is Out ranged , out powered and out of style ,Hurricane Ike is too much for MK to handle or any char for that matter.

 

[raph21]

Ike kills mk, no insult mk is good. but all mks ive fought(not much really only few) lost, but they were noobs so i dontk no really i dont kno a pro mk xD

 

[Alus]

a skilld ike can punish a even a good MK... but that doesent make him better

 

[DMG]

There is a grave misunderstanding somewhere if you think Ike can actually go even with MK...

6 : 4 MK, maybe 7 : 3 MK. There's nothing you can say about Ike that is gonna change that.

 

[Rockin]

In general, it's 6/4 in MK's favor. Maybe 5/5. Both characters have weaknesses that reflect the other opponent. Ike, being a heavyweight, constantly juggled character. Meta Knight, being a lightweight and light kill character. The matchup depends on several things. The stage and, most importantly, the player. I don't see either of these characters having a huge advantage. I mean, a n00b Ike will get ***** by a good Meta....but just the same, a n00b Meta Knight would get pwned by a good Ike.

While speed is Meta's best option, it doesn't mean much if you're not using it right. The same thing for Ike with his power.

Ike is gonna have to space himself well and read the meta knight carefully. His smash attacks has to be garanteed (save for his Dsmash, because it's about the quickest one of his smashes). Ike has a good approch by nairing, and when Meta rushes in, he can do the Jabs. A nicely timed Fair would do good as well. Meta Knight has to also watch carefully and not go too agressive blindly. Tornados and drills help, but not when it becomes too predictable.
When Ike's off the stage, he has about 70% or so of getting killed/gimped. His quick attack can be stopped just by going to it. His Up b is hard to punish because the sword is blocking the entry way of the ledge, so it's like a 'anti-edgeguard.' Still, Meta can find some ways to kill simply by Dsmash as soon as he grabs the ledge again.

If Meta's off the field, then depending what height he's at, Ike can screw him off as well with a nice eruption. Ike is probably the only characrer that can reduce Meta's 5 recovery options to 2 with just eruption. If Meta is below the stage, Ike can charge up his eruption...and if Meta tries to up B you, eruption. Gets on the ledge, eruption. Drill to you or Down Bs the ledge, eruption. His only two safest options are to either glide under the stage to the other side (which this option is negated if on Pokemon statium) or glide/up B overs you.

So you see, both characters can mess the other up. It just all depends on who's holding the controls.

 

[DMG]

Ike can't edgeguard MK with that much success, Eruption has some lag before he actually plunges his sword downwards, charging it makes it easier to avoid IMO because you know it's coming and Ike can't just change his mind and start moving again. You also gotta remember MK has 5 jumps, which should give him plenty of time to stall and find a safe way onto the stage.

 

[Rockin]

Ike can't edgeguard MK with that much success, Eruption has some lag before he actually plunges his sword downwards, charging it makes it easier to avoid IMO because you know it's coming and Ike can't just change his mind and start moving again. You also gotta remember MK has 5 jumps, which should give him plenty of time to stall and find a safe way onto the stage.

Eruption has little lag, but it also has super armor. I don't expect for him to use it whenever. Just when Meta is lower in the stage height. Meta could stall for the 5 jumps till the eruption wears off, but he has a 50-50 chance of making it back. If he's too far from the stage, he'll have to either Up B towards him or drill his way there, which both could possibly meet a quick eruption or some other move (i'm still betting on the eruption).

Like i said, going towards him or over him with five jumps is a bit risky. A fully charged eruption covers nearly most of his body (if not all).

I mained meta knight and I've played against a Ike who used the eruption like that. It's not as easy as it may seem.

 

[KC18]

ike's best bet for meta is to hope that the stage ur on has a low ceiling, so eruption is an easier kill. i know this isn't reliable, but aether can work as a edge guard to attempt to stop the shuttle loop, but that's kinda hard. using nair to counter the dash attack works, and may lead into back air sometimes. but ye, hard fight.

 

[Roager]

Ike vs MK isn't an awful matchup. Ike does better against him than most people in the cast. Especially when compared to other slows, like Bowser. Even some of the fast characters, like fox, have a pretty sh*tty matchup against him. But Ike doesn't have an advantage. Saying that he does is ********.

6-4, MK's favor. That's my opinion. Maybe 5.5-4.5, if the Ike plays really good defense.

 

[doom dragon 105]

In general, it's 6/4 in MK's favor. Maybe 5/5. Both characters have weaknesses that reflect the other opponent. Ike, being a heavyweight, constantly juggled character. Meta Knight, being a lightweight and light kill character. The matchup depends on several things. The stage and, most importantly, the player. I don't see either of these characters having a huge advantage. I mean, a n00b Ike will get ***** by a good Meta....but just the same, a n00b Meta Knight would get pwned by a good Ike.

While speed is Meta's best option, it doesn't mean much if you're not using it right. The same thing for Ike with his power.

Ike is gonna have to space himself well and read the meta knight carefully. His smash attacks has to be garanteed (save for his Dsmash, because it's about the quickest one of his smashes). Ike has a good approch by nairing, and when Meta rushes in, he can do the Jabs. A nicely timed Fair would do good as well. Meta Knight has to also watch carefully and not go too agressive blindly. Tornados and drills help, but not when it becomes too predictable.
When Ike's off the stage, he has about 70% or so of getting killed/gimped. His quick attack can be stopped just by going to it. His Up b is hard to punish because the sword is blocking the entry way of the ledge, so it's like a 'anti-edgeguard.' Still, Meta can find some ways to kill simply by Dsmash as soon as he grabs the ledge again.

If Meta's off the field, then depending what height he's at, Ike can screw him off as well with a nice eruption. Ike is probably the only characrer that can reduce Meta's 5 recovery options to 2 with just eruption. If Meta is below the stage, Ike can charge up his eruption...and if Meta tries to up B you, eruption. Gets on the ledge, eruption. Drill to you or Down Bs the ledge, eruption. His only two safest options are to either glide under the stage to the other side (which this option is negated if on Pokemon statium) or glide/up B overs you.

So you see, both characters can mess the other up. It just all depends on who's holding the controls.

I think a defensive Ike would be better for this match let MK come to you, yea at least 5/5, but I still think Ike>meta

 

[Snowstalker]

No. Just no.

 

[chaos_]

wow thats dumb u think power is everything or something. have u ever even faced a good mk ike will never counter mk

 

[Denzi]

This could be in reference to a nooby MK. Ike seems to crush those (more easily than other charachters I mean).

 

[chaos_]

This could be in reference to a nooby MK. Ike seems to crush those (more easily than other charachters I mean).

yeah all ike has to do on a noob ike is spam f-smash

 

[PCHU]

Be unpredictable and defensive, and you will win.
I came SO CLOSE to beating Metaknight, all that stopped me was the loss of a stock early on from a SD.
If I had that extra life, I could've gotten in a kill easy.
I mean, that was my first time using Ike gainst a good MK, so I would say that I did pretty well.
Had I been given another chance, I know I would've won.

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

This discussion is kind of over you know. No other Ike mains agreed on it being an advantage for Ike if you want to argue the match up go to one of the match up threads.

 

[cutter]

Yeah. MK has ZERO bad matchups and only one neutral matchup... the mirror match. :-/

 

[Kirk]

Yeah. MK has ZERO bad matchups and only one neutral matchup... the mirror match. :-/

Finally someone said it.

MK, as the current game stands, has no real bad matchups. Saying Ike goes neutral with MK is like saying Ike counters MK. That's just plain stupid.

Sorry...it had to be said.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

And I will reiterate.

*****, slap yourself.

 

[Dritz]

While I haven't played against any "great" Meta-Knights I would not say that this matchup is so impossible as most of the posts have stated, in fact I would say that the odds are slightly in Ike's favor maybe 6/4. And forget spamming the F-smash his B-arial is way more effective and while it has short range it is dazzlingly fast (for Ike) and has great horizontal knock-back with good priority. His range is also his saving grace when it comes to speed characters, good timing would negate a great deal of the speed moves especially if you can read the line ups.

 

[cutter]

While I haven't played against any "great" Meta-Knights I would not say that this matchup is so impossible as most of the posts have stated, in fact I would say that the odds are slightly in Ike's favor maybe 6/4. And forget spamming the F-smash his B-arial is way more effective and while it has short range it is dazzlingly fast (for Ike) and has great horizontal knock-back with good priority. His range is also his saving grace when it comes to speed characters, good timing would negate a great deal of the speed moves especially if you can read the line ups.

Power means nothing if your foe constantly outspeeds you. MK has frame advantages over Ike all across the board.

MK has NO bad matchups. Zero. Zilch. Nada.

 

[xion07]

I'm an Ike mainer, and I even say Ike vs MK is a bad matchup. I'd say it would be 5/5 if the Ike spaces and plays good.

 

[Kirk]

I'm an Ike mainer, and I even say Ike vs MK is a bad matchup. I'd say it would be 5/5 if the Ike spaces and plays good.

And I'd say it would be 10/0 if MK stood still and Ike only used FSmash.

Wishful thinking sure is productive, isn't it?

 

[cutter]

I'm an Ike mainer, and I even say Ike vs MK is a bad matchup. I'd say it would be 5/5 if the Ike spaces and plays good.

5/5 is a neutral matchup. MK has no neutrals except for the mirror match.

 

[akkon888]

If Ike knows he is playing someone who statistically is better, he would naturally prepare for fighting Metaknight by facing 2 or 3 of them on 9. Metaknight would do the same. So if you are speaking theoretically, they have equal advantage. If realistically, the more experienced player would be the winner. This is why tiers are not a useful grouping system; one it biases new people into playing one character (Metaknight, Snake) and two, it is simply not accurate. The reason Metaknight is so-called high tier is that he is easier to master than Ike. If Ike was just as easy to master, they would be Tier equals. This is a common pattern. Snake is easier to use and is therefore high tier. Ganondorf is very hard to master and is a low tier. Link is incredibly hard to master and is low tier. Toon Link, not so much, which is why it's a mid-upper tier. Tier lists do not base on which attacks are better. They base on which character is easier to master and pick those as a high tier. If you read all of this correctly, you can see that a tier basis is not proper for this game. Any agree good for you. Any who don't give a darn good reason or keep your mouth shut.

 

[cutter]

If Ike knows he is playing someone who statistically is better, he would naturally prepare for fighting Metaknight by facing 2 or 3 of them on 9. Metaknight would do the same. So if you are speaking theoretically, they have equal advantage. If realistically, the more experienced player would be the winner. This is why tiers are not a useful grouping system; one it biases new people into playing one character (Metaknight, Snake) and two, it is simply not accurate. The reason Metaknight is so-called high tier is that he is easier to master than Ike. If Ike was just as easy to master, they would be Tier equals. This is a common pattern. Snake is easier to use and is therefore high tier. Ganondorf is very hard to master and is a low tier. Link is incredibly hard to master and is low tier. Toon Link, not so much, which is why it's a mid-upper tier. Tier lists do not base on which attacks are better. They base on which character is easier to master and pick those as a high tier. If you read all of this correctly, you can see that a tier basis is not proper for this game. Any agree good for you. Any who don't give a darn good reason or keep your mouth shut.

Wow.

I don't even feel like responding to that.

 

[PCHU]

That was a nice mini WOT.

I think he hit somewhere INCREDIBLY CLOSE to bullseye with tiers.
I never thought of them that way.

Well, how does MK have such an awesome recovery?
It's as easy to stop as anyone else's.
It's called TRYING.
His glide doesn't make him the 1337 master, ya know.
He can be hit out of it as anyone else can.
His approaches are easy to see as well.
It's just getting in YOUR attacks that's hard.

 

[goku21]

hmmm i don´t play smash for so long , i wanted metaknight as my main but now i think like i should ggo with another character... to bad pikachus up-b works so bad in onlinematches,

but i will train a bit a bit and then i want to play against good metaknights to see if there isn´t a good way to beat him.

 

[xion07]

lol @ Kirk.

That is true but I should have been more specific with the only MK that has beaten me. Sinz.
I would like to fight you sometime Kirk.

 

[Arturito_Burrito]

If Ike knows he is playing someone who statistically is better, he would naturally prepare for fighting Metaknight by facing 2 or 3 of them on 9. Metaknight would do the same. So if you are speaking theoretically, they have equal advantage. If realistically, the more experienced player would be the winner. This is why tiers are not a useful grouping system; one it biases new people into playing one character (Metaknight, Snake) and two, it is simply not accurate. The reason Metaknight is so-called high tier is that he is easier to master than Ike. If Ike was just as easy to master, they would be Tier equals. This is a common pattern. Snake is easier to use and is therefore high tier. Ganondorf is very hard to master and is a low tier. Link is incredibly hard to master and is low tier. Toon Link, not so much, which is why it's a mid-upper tier. Tier lists do not base on which attacks are better. They base on which character is easier to master and pick those as a high tier. If you read all of this correctly, you can see that a tier basis is not proper for this game. Any agree good for you. Any who don't give a darn good reason or keep your mouth shut.

Holy crap that is just stupid. I just read the 1st sentence but if the rest follows up on it then you should get put in a asylum.

 

[akkon888]

Arturito, the first sentence is its own sentence. If you want me to rephrase, I'll say this: If Ike knows he is playing a Metaknight, he would obviously do a better job if he trained with a good Metaknight player before the real fight, so he can adapt and punish his weaknesses. The level 9 factor was just an analogy to training, I'd go wifi or to a friend's house any day of the week, but some people hate their wifi and their friends, so in that case this would be one of the few options.

 

[cutter]

Playing against level 9 computers all the time is a TERRIBLE thing to do if you want to get better. That pretty much invalidates your whole argument.

 

[akkon888]

Playing against level 9 computers all the time is a TERRIBLE thing to do if you want to get better. That pretty much invalidates your whole argument.

Did I say you had to play level 9's? If you HAVE NO OTHER OPTION the only thing you can do is play 9's. Of course many people have Wifi or friends, THEN BY ALL MEANS PLAY WITH THEM. Playing with 9's is a last resort, and I would never prefer it to other people. I also just explained that it was merely an analogy to express training. Bad analogy, oh well. The point is that you must train to find weaknesses to get better.

 

[HeroMystic]

If you wanna "train" and you have to go against CPU's, then you shouldn't be playing against level 9's, period. Level 9's have inhuman abilities, reads button input, and dodges way too much. No human will ever play similiar to a level 9 because they're impossible to mindgame.

Hell, level 3's are better than level 9's.

 

[Dritz]

Did I say you had to play level 9's? If you HAVE NO OTHER OPTION the only thing you can do is play 9's. Of course many people have Wifi or friends, THEN BY ALL MEANS PLAY WITH THEM. Playing with 9's is a last resort, and I would never prefer it to other people. I also just explained that it was merely an analogy to express training. Bad analogy, oh well. The point is that you must train to find weaknesses to get better.

Playing against the three nines would work out similarly to: if an infinite number of monkeys had an infinite amount of time they would eventually recreate the collected works of Shakespeare. Yes it would be long and tedious but the sheer volume of attacks coming in would at least help you build up your dodging skills at the very least.

 

[Rapid_Assassin]

Don't play against lv. 9's. They'll make you worse.

 

[akkon888]

If you wanna "train" and you have to go against CPU's, then you shouldn't be playing against level 9's, period. Level 9's have inhuman abilities, reads button input, and dodges way too much. No human will ever play similiar to a level 9 because they're impossible to mindgame.

Hell, level 3's are better than level 9's.

You will not kill it. Level 3's provide a lack of learning. You can really kill level 3's in your sleep, and you won't find a weakness in a weakling. That is also why I do not train like that. I, like you, want to focus on mind game and weakness of the character. Yes, level 9's are not the best. It dosen't even matter. I can kill level 8's, and I'm not a guy who spends all of his time playing the game. Level 9 was just an analogy for training, just train however you wish. Why does it seem that I have to keep repeating my words, that's the third time. And yes, fighting level 9's will help you dodge.

 

[cutter]

Level 9s have completely inhuman reaction time and they constantly repeat the same patterns that are easily exploited. They are FAR from playing an actual human.

 

[HeroMystic]

Level 9 was just an analogy for training

It's a bad one. Choose your words more carefully, because if someone else saw that post and took it literally, then we'd be seeing another crappy Ike player.

 

[Alus]

lol wut people are still posting in this thread?