If Super Smash Bros. was true to canon: a tier list - Updated 9/12/18

aarchak

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Squirtle atletic? Only in Smash dude... Pichu already beats it with speed.

Still don't get how you rank Link behind Zelda and Sheik. How come Link got to play the Hero part then? Zelda can barely do stuff on her own.

Ike still is on par with the Laguz Royals, who are huge beast forms that are far more impressive than Corrin's Dragon form. Doesn't matter that Ike beat his enemies with help, Corrin also cannot solo the final boss in Fates. Kind of a double standard there.
FIrst, any character can kill the Laguz Royals so long as they have the stats, it's not something only Ike can do. Edward can do it too. Ike is just a normal human, he isn't even Branded. It's kind of hard to justify putting him in higher tiers when he has no superhuman traits canonically. The only thing special about him is his sword, which is only blessed to hurt those with the Mantle skill. Corrin is actually superhuman, being a dragon and all. On second reflection, though, he definitely isn't strong enough to be in A tier. I'm moving him down to just above the FE characters.

aarchak aarchak I don't want to sound like I'm calling you out, but could you please stick to top, high, mid, low, and bottom for the tier list?
Hey, no offense taken. I originally did my tiering system to keep everyone far apart, but I can easily switch it to a 5-part tier system. It's now put from S (top) to D (Bottom), with + and - providing extra differentiation.
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I also made a simpler version, without the + and -.
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Shyy_Guy595

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Why is Peach and Bowser Jr. low?

Jr. has some sick hax and mechs that are capable of traveling through space at likely FTL speeds and fighting the Mario Bros., which he and the mechs no doubt scale to, and I've already been over their feats.

Unless you're taking him by just himself, which, even them, he's survived a fairly large castle falling on him; has abilities that control the battlefield and can even manipulate time as well as buff and debuff others and heal; has the strength to lift his father and drag him around; can lift giant, iron canonballs with or without spikes; can tank his huge mechs blowing up in his face and sending him careening into space at ludicrously fast speeds; can tank his own weapons and mechs being used against him; and he has the ability to petrify others into stone.

Using his best version would probably be Galaxy if we allow mechs, otherwise, we can use Sunshine, Puzzles and Dragons, or the Party/Sports games that each make up a good amount of stuff that at least wouldn't have him that low.

Peach? Tanked that black hole collapse at the end of Galaxy 2, her own voice explosions as well as a castle explosion in the comics, could send Bowser to space with a slap, and can use her powers for a HUGE variety of things.

She should almost definitely NOT be below Zelda, who has very little feats simlar to Palutena to even fit these ratings people are giving them.

This isn't even mentioning Wario beating a guy and tanking the explosion of his self-destruct that dissipated the thick storm clouds above them which was calculated to yield exatons of TNT, enough to destroy a satellite like the Moon or get close enough to it.
 
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Question: Would Snake's stealth gear be off the table? I mean technically he has access to it but it always either breaks at the start of his mission or Otacon takes it away from him...

I'm asking because it is one of those items you get free access to after beating the game on a certain difficulty without getting spotted.
 
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I would put Dedede in the A Tier. He can hold his own against Kirby if we powerscale for the same reason K. Rool would with Donkey Kong when it comes to his moon punching feat. That should count for something.

I like King K. Rool way more but Dedede is easily way higher then him and Donkey Kong.

I still also think Wario should be higher. At least B.
 
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aarchak

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Question: Would Snake's stealth gear be off the table? I mean technically he has access to it but it always either breaks at the start of his mission or Otacon takes it away from him...

I'm asking because it is one of those items you get free access to after beating the game on a certain difficulty without getting spotted.
Honestly, he has feats ridiculous to put him up in the tiers without the stealth. Surviving the microwave room, for one.
 

Shyy_Guy595

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You know about that feat but yet also have Pikachu so lpw despite how prevalent it is in the anime and how it's stalemated a few legendaries?

We're talking about an electric mouse that can use iron tail to smack other 'mon that can pulverize boulders to dust silly.
 

aarchak

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You know about that feat but yet also have Pikachu so lpw despite how prevalent it is in the anime and how it's stalemated a few legendaries?

We're talking about an electric mouse that can use iron tail to smack other 'mon that can pulverize boulders to dust silly.
Well, I'm thinking game Pikachu, not anime Pikachu. Game Pikachu would struggle to even survive 2 turns against a legendary its level.
 
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Also, Arwings are pretty dangerous so the Star Fox guys should be higher. If they are even allowed to use their battle ships...
They're mainly in their arwings, and I figured that's their best incarnation. So they'd be up their. Arwings can reach Mach 4.2 in the atmosphere. Now, what does that mean? Well, typically we'd use 343 m/s for the speed of sound, but that's at sea level. Since it's clearly stated how fast Arwings can fly in the atmosphere, it'll be different. Wolfram | Alpha measures the speed of sound in the troposphere to be between 294.8 to 340.6 m/s. Using the low-end and multiplying it by 4.2, an arwing can fly 1,238.16 m/s, or Mach 3.6. Keep in mind this Mach number would be at a lower atmosphere where the temperature would be warmer.

Donkey Kong also freely walks in space in Jungle Beat.
Odd, considering that Donkey Kong can just bring himself back down, whereas out in space, he wouldn't be able to move in any direction other than the direction he launched himself.

He also tosses around a giant ape at least 10 times his size.

DK > Mario, very easily.
It's interesting that Donkey Kong can generate a thunderclap, using a shock wave to stop projectiles and harm his opponents. Not to mention his rapid punching. Anyway, the average mass of a male gorilla is 136 kg. If this boss was actually 10 times the size, but also had 10 times the mass, that boss would be ~1.37 metric tons. That's kind of not impressive in the realm of other strong characters. I think Mario might have an advantage here with him lifting Bowser and King Bom-Omb. Or, he might be similar in strength to Donkey Kong.

Donkey Kong punched the moon out of orbit at the end of DKCR, not only would he need the strength to do this, but the durability to survive the impact.
Because of Newton's third law. If this was included, some characters would have even better durability as well. Consider Samus, who can dash at supersonic speed with the speed booster, according to the manuals. Do you know how much force she'd experience just by stopping the way she does? And this could be given to Sonic as well. Let's consider Samus, though. Although her mass has probably been retconned, due to Metroid: Samus Returns, let's just assume her mass anyway. In Metroid: Samus Returns, both in and outside of the suit, Samus is the same height, which is different from the model rip of her in Metroid: Other M. Even without the suit, if Samus is still wearing those platform shoes, and if the low-end is an added 20 cm., then Samus' normal height would be 1.7 m. (~5'7"). Hamwi's method can help give the healthy size of a person based on his or her height.

45.35 kg. + 0.91 kg/cm. (170 cm. - 152.4 cm.)
45.35 kg. + 0.91 kg/cm. (17.6 cm.)
45.35 kg. + 16.02 kg.
61.37 kg.

If the suit is still 90 kg. (the picture shows the varia suit, not Samus herself), then Samus' total mass with the armor is 151.37 kg. Samus dashes at supersonic speed, which I found to be Mach 1.06 when she's on foot. Forget that, though. Let's say she shinesparks instead, which is Mach 2, or 686 m/s. Since Samus can shinespark without showing any acceleration, her momentum can be equal to her acceleration, which I'll just treat as 1 second. Samus would be generating ~36 MJ. That's not the problem, though. Even though Samus can hit certain walls and stop right then and there, let's assume she at least covers 0.61 cm. (2 ft.) just to stop. This means Samus would experience 5,838,862,009.83 N, or 5.84 GN. To put this into perspective, Samus would be experiencing 656,317.28 tons. She would be virtually unstoppable. This is often something overlooked by developers who aren't interested in physics.

Link is a sum of his allies, as he is typically just a normal-*** dude whose power is courage. He only gains legitimate power through the items and gifts from people along his journey, while Zelda is typically shown to have magical powers herself.

I can see the argument.
The best incarnation to date is Link from Breath of the Wild. His reaction time is at least 17.95 milliseconds when he's using flurry rush or even aiming his bow while falling. Link also has access to different types of armor, and he's got ancient arrows, which kill lynels in a single hit.

Rosalina is a reality warper / immortal / can reset universes and therefore timelines. She also can change her size / teleport etc. Definitely the strongest canon character as she can shield others from a Universal Crunch (look up Big Crunch theory space etc.) while being immune herself.
No one knows what exactly happens at the end of Super Mario Galaxy. It's because of Bowser's reactor that the Universe resets. Like I've said before, characters like Hylia and Palutena are actually referred to as goddesses, but Rosalina is not. Or, I haven't seen it. I don't think Rosalina is as great as people make her out to be.

First of all, Mario Party isn't canonical?
Does it have anything to do with the story and timeline?

To whom? Show me the quote or official spurce that states this? As far as I know, when asked about Mario canon and the consistencies, Miyamoto said to think of them like actors playing different roles, and bascially saying anything is canon as long as they specifically don't single it out.
That would explain the inconsistencies, at least. So, if the Mario cast are like actors playing different roles in each game, then choose the best incarnation of Mario, since actors who play different roles don't retain the same qualities or traits.

Secondly, you can make the creative liberty argument with EVERY character or series.
Sure. But some developers or creators do it more than others. The more realistic one goes, the less creative liberty one seems to have.

The point of the matter is that galaxies of a true-to-form size and planetary and celestial bodies DO exist in the Mario universe, and he clearly traverses past these as seen by Galaxy 2's World Map.
Given you've played these games (I've only played Super Mario Galaxy), you would know that celestial bodies that Mario traverses on aren't exactly like celestial bodies in our world.

The vortex Bowser created came from him growing Giant under his own power, and you see the vortex swallow whole planets as you fight him, with him tanking saud vortex and it disappearing magically when you beat him, implying he created it.
That's great, but you're not exactly quantifying anything here. It's odd that Bowser's growth would create said vortex. Schwarzschild radius works better the smaller an object gets. Let's say Bowser's mass is 10 metric tons when he's that large size. He'd have to have a radius of 14.85 yoctometers.

You're also not accounting for the other things I've said, and I thought this was supposed to be the characters at their best? Consistency matters not when you make that point evident in the original post, unless you want to admit to being biased here.
Yes, and by best, I mean choose an installment from the series where the character has the best feats. I'm not sure what I'm supposed to account for, since the problem with the Mario series is inconsistency. As for that biased bit, everyone is biased, even if they're just a little bit. You may notice that I'm a fan of the Metroid series, but I loathe Bayonetta and I don't see the appeal with Cloud. I also don't like Sonic very much, but I suspect he could defeat Samus.

Okay, so Chaos Emeralds can be used when they require a task to complete and earn the majority of the time? Well, that seems unfair when they're the most un-standard of all his power-ups amd items and grant him a boost he needs to usually defeat a boss after going through the world to find them on his journey.
If Chaos Emeralds are acquired by completing a difficulty, a rank, after the game is completed, or if it's given by a friend so that Sonic ends up succeeding where he might have failed, then no, he wouldn't have access to those. To illustrate it another way with the Metroid series, in Super Metroid, the Metroid absorbs Mother Brain's energy, restores Samus' health, and Samus acquires the hyper beam. She didn't have access to this before, but she acquired it because of the Metroid. Without the Metroid's interference, Samus would have been defeated. Another example is in Metroid Prime, where Samus can use the Phazon beam, but only if she steps into a pool of Phazon that is produced by the last boss. Without that pool of Phazon, Samus couldn't defeat the last boss.

Also, to those people clamoring for Mewtwo... since when has he done anything beyond maybe being able to bust a planet at best? His speed isn't any better either, as he's pretty damn slow for the higher tiers on the lost in terms of quantifiable feats and not pokémon stats that don't translate.
I may lower him.

Mewtwo slow? If we take Pokedex entries, and realise Mewtwo is one of the fastest Pokemon around, he's pretty impressive. If not, he still has Me First. A move that hits his enemies with 1.5 x it's power. So that's pretty hax. He makes up for a lot of his appearnt weaknesses with all the ammount of moves Mewtwo can learn. It's pretty insane.

And what force would operate faster than Mewtwo can think? Curious about that one.
I'm not sure how you'd translate what Mewtwo can do in-game to a somewhat realistic setting.

This site isn't VsBattlesWiki. I'm also not a fan of that site and its inflated numbers. That also didn't show me anything like a tier list.

Question: Would Snake's stealth gear be off the table? I mean technically he has access to it but it always either breaks at the start of his mission or Otacon takes it away from him...

I'm asking because it is one of those items you get free access to after beating the game on a certain difficulty without getting spotted.
Snake's stealth gear would be something he'd have access to, provided the best incarnation offers him such gear. If an item you acquire is granted after being the game on a certain difficulty, then that gear isn't allowed.

"Best versions"

Someone's looking biased.
I'm not sure why that's biased. I could go for current incarnations, but not series has continued after one game, such as Mother 2 and Mother 3.
 
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12cheeper

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Someone linked me here and I thought I'd take a crack at this.

Rosa's mostly where she is because of Lumas,Robin is assuming his strongest incarnation(that is,when he gets possessed by Grima in at least 2 timelines),Sonics only where he is because of Super Sonic otherwise he'd be way lower,and had a bit of an issue with the Falchion users since Falchion is kind of wierd as far as holy weapons go.Others I just wanted to be somewhat conservative about.
Also don't really get why Ganon is so much higher than Link in these lists.Zelda is especially wierd since pre-BOTW Zelda didn't do jack combatwise sans Hilda existing.
 
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I still say Dedede should be A Tier at least. He maybe not as powerful or strong as Kirby but he's still able to hold his own. That says something.

Dedede realistically could defeat someone like Ganondorf with relative ease.
 
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Frizz

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I'm thinking we should update this a bit to include Isabelle. She'd most likely place near Villager.

Aside from including Isabelle, these tier lists are still and always up for debate, so I'd like to see some further discussion.
 

scoobymcsnack

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I think I'll take a crack at this, as I've loved reading about and debating this stuff for a while. As I understand, the rules basically mean base character only. So no Super Sonic or Invincible Mario, or anything like. But I will assume characters still have their equipment (I.E. Samus has all her suit upgrades, or Simon and Richter have their items.)
Also for reference, I'm using this site for my research as I like their style of ranking characters. But I'm also using the same tiers everyone else is mostly using, so I'll do my best to translate correcty if needed.
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aarchak

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Nice, but I feel you're being inconsistent about the "Normal/Human (Uses a weapon for power)" tier: The characters in there are definitely more than just an average human: the Ice Climbers climb mountains, and that takes incredible amounts of endurance and athleticism, Chrom is incredibly strong and so is Lucina (strong enough to apparently blow human-sized holes in castle walls), Shulk even without the Monado is pretty athletic (plus, with how it works, it's more than just a weapon that gives him power). Plus, if they are normal without their weapon, why is Samus so high? Her suit is what's giving her all her power.
 

Crystanium

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While debating about who is the most powerful can be fun, there are too many assumptions to be made. I think it'd come down to factual statements not littered by literary devices or ambiguous phrasings. Pixel scaling, as it has been called, isn't a reliable method, and game play cannot guarantee accurate information.
 

Mogisthelioma

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While debating about who is the most powerful can be fun, there are too many assumptions to be made. I think it'd come down to factual statements not littered by literary devices or ambiguous phrasings. Pixel scaling, as it has been called, isn't a reliable method, and game play cannot guarantee accurate information.
Well, we do know that in Planet Robobot Kirby was described as possessing "infinite power," which pretty much solidifies his top tier position.
 

Crystanium

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Well, we do know that in Planet Robobot Kirby was described as possessing "infinite power," which pretty much solidifies his top tier position.
Which appears in the context of copying abilities. By itself, this doesn't say if it's actual or potential, quantitative or qualitative. It's a good example of vague phrasing.
 

Improdigal

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Pretty sure the plant is pretty low tier in the canon strength department. Ken should simply be on Ryu's level wherever you guys put him. Incineroar is probably not much more powerful than greninja or Lucario so placing them should be easy.

Well, we do know that in Planet Robobot Kirby was described as possessing "infinite power," which pretty much solidifies his top tier position.
Well that statement shouldn't be what you use to say Kirby is top tier. Just talk about all the crap that he's fought and survived before and there's not much to refute the fact that Kirby is a top tier Nintendo character
 

Izanagi97

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Anyone think that "God Slayer" is a dodgy way to rank power considering that the power of a God tends to vary depending on which universe we are talking about
 
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Anyone think that "God Slayer" is a dodgy way to rank power considering that the power of a God tends to vary depending on which universe we are talking about
It's all ambiguous nonsense anyway. Most people can't even agree on a methodology, and if you're the owner of the message board or the thread, you're the one determining how things work. From my experience, most methods fail. Pixel scaling may be useful with actual photos, but not in computer-generated media or art.

Do you see those numbers for time or distance in video games? Those don't actually mean anything. I've tested it in Breath of the Wild. Developers most likely mean something else, as in the case of Retro Studios regarding the mass of the planets in the Observatory in Metroid Prime. Your best bet might be taking unambiguous, univocal words or terms from lore, in-universe descriptions, interviews, &c.
 
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Izanagi97

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Developers most likely mean something else, as in the case of Retro Studios regarding the mass of the planets in the Observatory in Metroid Prime.
Yeah, I have a feeling that for those planet measurements they probably intended to use Gigatons rather than Teratons for those planets, never mind the fact that those are units of explosive force rather than mass.
 

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You're seriously underselling Chrom by a lot. In chapter six of Awakening, it's revealed he broke open a hole in Ylisstol's castle wall while training with the rest of the Shepherds. For reference, here's the castle in question:
image.png
Given how tall and how thick and reinforced those walls are, and the fact that at that point in the story, Chrom had no access to legendary weapons (as Falchion is still in its Sealed state), Chrom would need to have superhuman strength to cleave that wall with just the strength of his own body.

And that's early game Chrom, without any weapons. Later in the story, one fight (chapter eighteen) had Chrom's forces fight within an active volcano, close enough to the lava that it's starting to burn away the land they're fighting on. Granted, any character you bring in can feasibly survive this, but Chrom is the only mandatory unit for this chapter, so it was written with him in mind. Lack of vulnerability to convection is common in Fire Emblem in general and not just for Awakening, but it alone should prevent Chrom from being as low as you're putting him.

And all of this is still before Chrom unseals Falchion with Naga's Awakening Ritual. Once that happens, Chrom is not only as strong as he'd ever been, if not stronger, but he now has the legendary Exalted Falchion as well, which is much more powerful than its Sealed form.

And that's ignoring the ridiculous verticality of his jumps both in-game and during cutscenes, as well, once again showcasing his raw strength.

Basically as a tl;dr, Chrom has no business being anything lower than superhuman, IMO.
 
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You're seriously underselling Chrom by a lot. In chapter six of Awakening, it's revealed he broke open a hole in Ylisstol's castle wall while training with the rest of the Shepherds. For reference, here's the castle in question:
Given how tall and how thick and reinforced those walls are, and the fact that at that point in the story, Chrom had no access to legendary weapons (as Falchion is still in its Sealed state), Chrom would need to have superhuman strength to cleave that wall with just the strength of his own body.

And that's early game Chrom, without any weapons. Later in the story, one fight (chapter eighteen) had Chrom's forces fight within an active volcano, close enough to the lava that it's starting to burn away the land they're fighting on. Granted, any character you bring in can feasibly survive this, but Chrom is the only mandatory unit for this chapter, so it was written with him in mind. Lack of vulnerability to convection is common in Fire Emblem in general and not just for Awakening, but it alone should prevent Chrom from being as low as you're putting him.

And all of this is still before Chrom unseals Falchion with Naga's Awakening Ritual. Once that happens, Chrom is not only as strong as he'd ever been, if not stronger, but he now has the legendary Exalted Falchion as well, which is much more powerful than its Sealed form.

And that's ignoring the ridiculous verticality of his jumps both in-game and during cutscenes, as well, once again showcasing his raw strength.

Basically as a tl;dr, Chrom has no business being anything lower than superhuman, IMO.
Thanks for the update! I made that tier list a while ago anyway. I'm gonna make a new one this weekend. Since I know only so much about the feats of the FE main cast, where would you place our current FE fighters?
 
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Yeah, I have a feeling that for those planet measurements they probably intended to use Gigatons rather than Teratons for those planets, never mind the fact that those are units of explosive force rather than mass.
Actually, teratons is fine. It was the word "trillion" that was the problem. Zebes' mass of 4.8 trillion teratons, when written as 4.8 billion teratons, along with its diameter, gives Zebes a surface gravity much closer to that of Earth's so that if there was such a planet in real life, any human wouldn't notice the difference of the surface gravity. Billion teratons is the same as sextillion metric tons (Earth's mass being 5.9 sextillion metric tons) at least if you use the metric system, which appears what Retro used, given their use of kilometers, meters, and centigrade.
 
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Thanks for the update! I made that tier list a while ago anyway. I'm gonna make a new one this weekend. Since I know only so much about the feats of the FE main cast, where would you place our current FE fighters?
The issue with many of them is the fact that there's not a whole lot of direct references to their strength oftentimes, as Fire Emblem, ignoring things like dragons and magic, stays fairly grounded somewhat.

Marth canonically isn't very strong, but he's got some actually insane endurance. He made it through Anri's Way with his troops, fighting off dragons and mercenary groups while going through scorching deserts, violent lava flows, and bitter cold tundras, all at an elevation that would put normal people into fainting spells before long. And while he's not the strongest as a warrior, he has canonically taken down foes much stronger than he is. One such person he took down was Camus, who might actually be one of the strongest characters in the entire series, to the point of him once acting as a one man army.

Roy is probably the weakest, physically, of the Fire Emblem characters in Smash. He's only fifteen and is a far better student and tactician than he is a fighter.

I'm less familiar with the Tellius games, but many praise Ike for his strength. Someone else can probably go into more specific detail.

Lucina is, in many ways, Chrom's equal in combat, having the same fighting style right down to the ridiculous verticality. However, while she may be as strong as Chrom, she doesn't have the wall breaking feat he has, so to be safe she should be a bit lower than he is.

Robin is tough to quantify because of magic. He's physically fit, but his mind and magic outweigh his muscle. Smash implies his magic must be spoken to be cast, but this isn't the case in the core series. As for magic, he can canonically use fire, thunder, and wind anima magic, and if you include DLC stuff he also technically has access to tomes like Excalibur, Valflame, Mjölnir, and the Book of Naga, though these are dubiously canon at best. Still, between his tactical prowess and his skill over offensive magic, he's likely pretty high up on the list.

Corrin is even tougher to quantify. Like, I'm honestly unsure of how to rate Corrin here.
 
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Izanagi97

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Alright, here's my new tier list: https://www.smashtierlist.com/3131a82d805f59edb90ba32c4aac4b6382e77237bea8ddb987450eae9031533f/

I should probably note that Meta Knight is marked as unknown strength since things like his Final Smashes and his overall mysteriousness in the Kirby games still leave us with only so much information about him, but he's a world ender at least (probably a galaxy breaker or godlike at his most powerful).
I seriously doubt Diddy could be ranked in "Sub-Human" since while not as strong as Donkey Kong, he's still pretty strong (just not "Punch the damn moon hard enough to knock it out of orbit and on to the island" strong) on top of being faster of the two.

Young Link and Toon Link (albeit, only slightly) are also a little too low on the list since both have two games worth of experience (OoT and MM for the former, WW and PH for the latter) and the latter has fought and defeated Ganondorf (as well as survive a beating from him)
 
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I seriously doubt Diddy could be ranked in "Sub-Human" since while not as strong as Donkey Kong, he's still pretty strong (just not "Punch the damn moon hard enough to knock it out of orbit and on to the island" strong) on top of being faster of the two.

Young Link and Toon Link (albeit, only slightly) are also a little too low on the list since both have two games worth of experience (OoT and MM for the former, WW and PH for the latter) and the latter has fought and defeated Ganondorf (as well as survive a beating from him)
To add on to what you said, even if Diddy didn't have any feats, have you ever SEEN a real life chimpanzee? There's a reason most humans, trained or not, don't **** with them.

Also on a separate note, Wario piledrives dinosaurs for fun, is consistently demonstrated as physical stronger than the Marios and has ridiculous durability. How the hell is he in just in the athletic tier and below characters like mother ****ing Jigglypuff and even Pichu? He should at least be in city levelers (though I'd place him even higher). Also, Yoshi above Mario and Luigi? Young Link as the weakest Link even though the Fierce Deity mask is a thing?

There's a lot of really bizarre placings here, honestly. Not trying to be harsh, Mogisthelioma, but I don't understand at least half of them.
 
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OnyanRings

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:ultkirby: > :ultrosalina: > All

Rosalina can reset the universe but Kirby can escape the reset with his warp star. (Like he did with Galeem in WoL).

(At least in my opnion, i never completed Xenoblade so i don't know how strong Shulk is.)
 
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Even if Diddy didn't have any feats, have you ever SEEN a real life chimpanzee? There's a reason most humans, trained or not, don't **** with them.

Also, Wario piledrives dinosaurs for fun, is consistently demonstrated as physical stronger than the Marios and has ridiculous durability. How the hell is he in just in the athletic tier and below characters like mother ****ing Jigglypuff and even Pichu? He should at least be in city levelers (though I'd place him even higher). Also, Yoshi above Mario and Luigi? Young Link as the weakest Link even though the Fierce Deity mask is a thing?

There's a lot of really bizarre placings here, honestly. Not trying to be harsh, Mogisthelioma, but I don't understand at least half of them.
(I made that tier list super late last night so yeah I ended up forgetting about some things).

I updated Diddy Kong's position to Athletic.
Wario is superhuman, forgot about some of the things he does.
Toon Link and Young Link are also superhuman.
Mario Bros. Are continent destroyers (benefit of the doubt. I didn't consider some of their power-ups to count as much, but even if they used one of each they could still do some serious damage).
Bayo was upgraded to Godlike since she can literally send Angels to Hell
Meta Knight was upgraded to Galaxy Breaker since I'm assuming he's at least that powerful.
Bowser Jr. Was nerfed to city leveler since I felt like I was overrating him. Even with all of his devices I don't think he'd be capable of destroying large amounts of land before being stopped.

Anything else I missed?
 

Zinith

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Mario Bros. Are continent destroyers (benefit of the doubt. I didn't consider some of their power-ups to count as much, but even if they used one of each they could still do some serious damage).
If power-ups count, then could some of Yoshi's (the watermelons, the fruits in Galaxy) raise him up? :yoshi:
 
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